Bitcoin Forum

I've been researching coins deeply and this coin offers so darn much! Why is it falling on the top 100 list? Why isn't it on the top 10? Can someone explain this to me?

why this coin have to offer to stay in top 100? there ar emany coins out there that probably better than this, and to me this one you mentioned look liek another shit coin, now investors are focusing on lbry, zcash, ethereum which are the strong one, don't bother with the other they won't get any pump

I think you must be confusing bitbay with something else. This coin offers more than 99% of coins out there. Have you researched it fully or are you just confused?

This dev is one of the very best out there. I would say you can put him up there with VB, GM, CZ and other top top tier designers/developers.

Showing me another coin that is giving you more bang for your buck. That is a genuine challenge.

Everything has its time)

I think it is a decent coin to speculate in. The marketplace definitely needs a face lift though, it looks like it was conceived in the 90s.  :D

Furthermore, any entity, whether it be a centralized or decentralized solution, trying to create a popular (read: decently profitable) Ebay-like market is fighting an uphill battle. There is a reason why EBay has crushed its adversaries. It is the same reason why Bitcoin has... the network effect.

If there isn't a large userbase of both buyers and sellers, a cheaper marketplace is unlikely to ever gain enough traction to compete. It doesn't matter if fees are cheaper if you cannot find the products you are looking for because there are not enough sellers, or buyers for a product you are selling because there are not enough buyers.

Crypto projects have little to no advertising budgets, nor any reasonable way to effectively fund said budgets. It seems unlikely that one will compete with EBay in our lifetimes.

Bitbay does however have other features that may prove to be valuable, as far as trading and speculating go. You must keep in mind speculators and traders can be irrational, so I see there being profits in Bitbay at its current valuation.

because the dev is a serial scammer. this dev have ton of coins. the two coins come to mind created or maintain by this guy are blackcoin and crave. search for David Zimbeck on google.

even the coin can do anything in this world as promised, though it can barely doing anything at this point. you can't fix serial scammer like him. market or ebay style not working yet and it never will.

scammy dev and scammy launch. stay away

obviously you have not researched this at all... and are spreading false information. Bring evidence or you should be banned. That post by barabus is a pile of junk many believe he is bob anyway.

Scam accusations of this nature are serious. You need corroborating evidence.

Dzimbeck could have left bitbay when bob,lin and steven left with their hundreds of btc that were meant for the furtherment of bitbay.

He stayed and has coded for 3 yrs and is still there coding.

How is that a scam and who did he scam??

The others bob lin stephen ..took the bulk of the btc and tons of bitbay and have been dumping it on the bay community and him for 3 years.

I don't know how you can conclude he scammed anyone. Please come and explain yourself. That post you find by barabus that you are referring too says nothing other than he didn't like david still being part of blackcoin and not committing fully to bitbay. I agree on that point he should cut blackcoin free and focus only on bay now. Blackcoini has had enough for FREE. Such a scammer coding for free I agree lol. But to call him a scammer really should be a banning offense if you have no evidence to corroborate this.

If he had not stuck around there would be no bitbay and us bay ICO investors would have lost our entire investment. I'm a bitbay ico investor and I was scammed by those that left the project with the btc and free bitbay. David zimbeck has done all he can to recoup our investment over 3 years and bitbay is going to be a LOT More than just a decentralised marketplace. The scope for what will be possible when this software is complete is way beyond some ebay type environment. That is merely one possible use case.

To say it does not work is another lie. The market place works fine. Of course it will be improved and improved it is still at the very start.

Ebay is a pile of shit you can't sell fuck all on there. Try and sell some crypto for paypal and see what happens to your account and the costs incurred. Try to make an international purchase and watch all the charges mount up until it is hardly worth buyng the item. A decentralised marketplace where you can sell what you want when you want for practically free? yeah sounds terrible.

Add to that the rolling peg and all the other myriad of features like decentralised voting etc and this will be one of the best projects to come.

Bring here the person or persons scammed by dzimbeck and I will agree with you until then you should retract your statement.

so you saying you can sell a computer on bitbay now? please post any item and post photo here as not everyone able to use bitbay market. what you saying is david is looking for new bagholders so people like you could get out, i doubt it's going to work. i compare bithalo, blackcoin, bitbay and crave all idea and graphics seem to be done by one person. you can't just squeeze one idea into many coins and make all special.

BitBay started as a scam, but I think this isn't the case now. Never followed it closely, since it came clear, which "people" are behind it, because I'm like this - If I smell/see scam, then I don't bother checking it twice. And I don't care if it can make me rich or buy me 10s of hookers. But dzimbeck (or whatever his nickname is) looks like a genuine guy and maybe BAY got some well deserved attention. Don't think its cheap though - if you divide it to Bitcoin's supply, then the price would be ~$0,25/coin, which isn't bad/cheap. But yes, it has a lot of space to grow...   

You can sell anything on there right now yes. Have you even loaded up the market place?

No what I am saying is that you are calling someone a scammer when he has scammed no person at all.

You are sound very confused.

Yes bithalo, blackcoin and bay are the same developer. It's based on halo right?

I have no idea about crave. I never looked at it.

What you doubt means nothing. Your doubts are based on what exactly?

The market place will work great when it is done but it is just a feature really. Bitbay will offer the market place and the same or better features than 99% of alts here?

He can code pretty much any feature he wants. I suggest you research more. If bay wants anon he will code anon, if bay wants any other feature that other alts have you can be sure he can design and code it.

So again show me the person he has scammed or retract your statement.

You have not shown one shred of evidence to or brought forth one person who has been scammed by this dev so you need to retract your statement of face a possible ban. You don't even have any corroborating circumstantial material you have NOTHING. The guy could have left once all the btc and bay was taken by the others and nobody would have wondered why? do you want to code for 3 years for nothing? bare in mind the person is a serious coder/designer and could have a huge salary job right?

I don't know why you are even saying this because looking at your post history I see you claiming at one point you bought 0.01% of bitbay and were a bitbay holder?

You have become confused some how or mislead into believing david is a scammer when he has done nothing wrong. He has to me only got one problem and that is trying to be loyal to blackcoin when he need not be and give them too much for free. Other than that what are you gonig on about? he should just focus 100% on bay I am with you on that one point only. The rest about him being a scammer is a lie.

How many free coins is zimbeck still sitting on that he got from buying his own ico with fake btc supplied by bter? Sounds like a good investment?

So don't place anything or order from bitbay?
Are they still a scam?

I just realised you're a dash scam supporter... LOL

That's a good place to start even trying to lecture on anything scammy

Even though what you are claiming has been shown to be nonsense over and over again with the vast bulk of real btc being taken by bob for marketing apparently and lin ,dai and the vast bulk of bay too.

What's your point again?

Keep in mind that if he left after all the others bailed with their btc he would had nothing and the rest of the ico holders would have zero too if there was no dev.

so the others took 100's of btc and millions of bay for doing nothing. then dumped bay down to nothing... he could have left since the long term btc fund was gone and there was no team for him to manage a promised and bay was worthless...who could have blamed him at that stage?

he sticks around for 3 years coding and hes a scammer because he didn't dump his bay and start a new ICO when he may as well have done that?

then you support the most proven scam coin on this board??

Utter bollocks! He  voluntarily built blackhalo for free for blackcoin but was never official in their team. Also David has no connections with Crave at all. You have just made that up to try and discredit him.

I honk u have a split personality!? One day you love bitbay then next u hate it and u also admit to never actually downloaded the market to see it for yourself?

If u don't want to be apart of the most advanced crypto project then stop coming back to comment.

Great investment. Slowly making its way back up. Check the slack and bitbay thread. David always responds. The original scammers already proven to be Qtum developers.

Bitbay will be worth a lot more very soon.

the first about bitbay price not high because total suply bitbay coin is very much
second bitbay user community is not big , so can very dificult is suply big demand low can incraese price very high

images say a thousand words! can you post what your favourite altcoin has created please
http://i63.tinypic.com/2i8bosy.png

Excuse me?? Would you mind saying that to my face? I've coded a 50,000 line monster client in Halo and Bitbay. Google me, and see an accusation from mossad scumbag Bobsurplus who goes from dev to dev to screw them. Get a life.

And what is this bullshit about Crave and Blackcoin?? I didn't create either of those coins. Rat4 made Blackcoin I only made BlackHalo. I don't even know what the hell Crave is. You are stupid

I hold 10%. Everyone knows about the free coins because I told them about how Dai faked the volume with BTER. Something i didnt know until ico started funding which by then it was too late. If it wasn't for me nobody would have known that. I reported it to the news and on Reddit. Also I've never sold a coin, you can track those addresses becuase I used them to vote recently. It disgusts me that people just talk bullshit about others behind their backs. I'm the most transparent dev out here. You have a problem take it directly to me.

Bitbay has decentralized markets and unbreakable contracts and is far more advanced than anything else out there.

Sounds like you are a decent guy and have chosen the high road and done the right thing. I applaud you. Maybe you should rebrand or something. I'm just stating what a lot of people that know of Bitbay or research bitbay are going to see all the negative things that it started with. A rebrand might really be a good idea. Get away from the stigma. New beginnings. good luck.

We have thought about it and call me masochistic but I think success is the best revenge and succeeding after these guys tried to trash my name and investors is twice as sweet. I'm going to finish decentralized pegging and then assess the situation again. If the investors want a rebrand at that point then we can do so. For now, the price is above the ICO price and that was a huge challenge and success. Even with Bob and BTER dumping we rose above it. With tech alone. And after pegging I'm not sure how they will stop us.

That's a nice story. Glad you were able to make it out. That is an accomplishment for sure. I was one of your first customers that got burnt pretty bad. You rose from the ashes and are still here. good job

you're Elon Musk of crypto dad

A lot of these market coins are just like classified ad looking blocky type and just looks skid row and there are no real ads. People are posting hi mom and the sort.  I think if one of these market coins will make it, it will need to be more like a virtual mall. Use btc or bitbay only for currency. Even a skymall type site. get more and more vendors added to it. Needs to look Commercial or at least as good as Amazon.  my .02

Chinese market can not transfer

Sorry to hear that. Then you are aware that I actually exposed it. And I'm sorry that I trusted those fools... it happens. How was I supposed to know that all 4 founders would disappear?! (or abuse my rep while they laugh about it)

I probably should have predicted it, but they kept me really distracted with the AMA and "Proof of Dev" and getting a wallet with new UI. They were pretty sneaky... they had prepared FUD just to smash my name all planned in advanced.

So hopefully you held!!

If not, well tough luck. Some people did sell because of panic and rightfully so as it was one of the craziest projects in 2014.

However... I'm going to tell you something because I've seen it first hand. MOST OF THE PROJECTS YOU SEE... including Bitcoin. Fake their volume, fake their ICOs, buy their own ICOs (this includes Ethereum), have government ties or are run by ruthless sociopaths and pumpers and basically misappropriate funds (definitely ETH, They were spending 300k a month on themselves)

Most of the projects you see were premines (like DRK).

It takes time to learn this... but corruption finds its way into all projects. The difference in BitBay is I spoke out about it. And I'm still coding it despite what they did.

My software does exactly what was promised! And thats what counts. Decentralized markets work, as promised... the first of its kind.

The coin should be in the top 10... it has unbreakable contracts, decentralized markets etc etc... no other coin has anything like this. We even have decentralized voting etc.

I keep hearing this buzzword used to promote Bitbay and it kind of irks me. Not to take anything away from Bitbay, but aren't all "smart contract" platforms "unbreakable contracts"?

If my reasoning is correct, then Bitbay is simply swimming in a sea of many cryptocurrencies that have "unbreakable contracts". Or do I misunderstand?

The marketplace is a damn cool contract though, I will give you that!

Well i'm not 100% sure it is exactly the same thing because dde is not used in other smart contract engines as far as i know.. but if it is then why let it irk you? it's another term for smart contract, and it was the FIRST smart /unbreakable contract engine in crypto as far as I know. If they want to call it unbreakable contract then that's up to them since they invented it first.

My point is that it is a little misleading, making it seem as if other smart contracts are somehow breakable.

Well I'm not trying to argue with you but it goes like this...

1. bitbay creates something they call unbreakable contracts FIRST
2. other crypto projects call their versions smart contracts

I don't think bitbay continuing to use their original term is wrong or that they are doing it to claim/suggest/mislead others are breakable.

Also smart contract or whatever seems to cover a variation of arrangements. Ethereums smart contracts are a lot more complex/powerful and also a lot more perhaps experimental and open to as yet unknown bugs or have points of weakness. Having said that ethereum is an amazing project too. It's scope is gigantic. 

I just think you are focusing and worrying about terminology too much. If they want to call it that and they created it first that is up to them. Why must they change it to fit in with others that came later.

If you want to refer to their system as a smart contract or you want to refer to others methods as unbreakable contracts I don't think that anyone will worry about it.

I guess this is why. Even the red alert price being a low thing on a discussion usually gets so much attention in case of a bigger volume coin got only couple of people interested.

For example my friend (I just checked, but he is a bitcoin holder) never heard of bitpay before and that could be a great reason why the price is low, not enough marketing. They should up the ante with the marketing budget and the price would go higher if you ask me.

I think you are right 100%. However ask him again if he heard of bitBay. He still probably has not.

Did they even launch that shop they was talking about ages ago?

decentralised market place? is that what you mean?

Yes. It was launched as the first decentralized marketplace ever. And it works. But there is still more to do. Specially in regards to make it more user friendly. We have the tenplates for custom contracts and buy/sell coins. More templates are in the pipeline.

There are much better coins than bitbay, their concept is nothing new and decentralized marketplace is common to all coins which even the market section of this forum is decentralized itself :)
I use to have Bitbay but dumped them because I realize its not moving after 5 months of keeping it.

Okay, sure, I am open minded and always looking for a great new opportunity perhaps I am too enthusiastic about bitbay and it is just not justified.... point me to these MUCH better coins that you have found already that currently offer more for less. I have been waiting for these projects for quite some time but I have obviously missed them.

Tell me what they offer extra and how much cheaper they are.

Can put  them in order  for me so I can just start buying the best ones first.

I need a direct comparison sheet to bitbay - what they offer above and beyond bitbay. I mean the marketplace is actually brilliant but I don't even consider it the most important part of bitbays project.

I hear a lot of people saying it has moved too slowly, but whether it has or not ( i have no idea what work was involved and a realistic expectation for such work to be delivered ) it still seems to have  MANY more features than most projects well above their placement on cmc.

The developer seems capable of doing just about anything you could ask to be designed. I wonder how many devs can do much more than clone other clones of btc/ltc?

Anyway I await with my btc ready to grab up these much better value projects.

Don't list them without a comparison describing how exactly they are much better though because you need to convince me with facts not just dreams and fantasies. I want to see what they have coded out and have functioning right now, not what they are dreaming of creating by 2050.

I can say only one thing. Yes it does seem to take ages for things to happen but somehow they are still miles ahead of most other projects and cost way less. Things like this are not created in a few weeks or months it seems sadly. 5 months in crypto is nothing unless you are talking about clones that offer nothing new or useful and are here today and gone tomorrow.

The contracts are not breakable because it uses DOUBLE DEPOSIT ESCROW. This is not at all the same as other platforms. This is the only software in the world(other than my other software BitHalo) that makes contracts where both parties deposit in a joint account with mutually assured destruction.

Also, I was doing smart contracts as an actual prototype in software before Ethereum was even an idea.

An explanation is found here:
http://cryptorials.io/glossary/double-deposit-escrow/

And really found on all the various discussions, interviews rants and articles that I'm involved in.

This forum isn't decentralized! It's on the clearnet and owned by Theymos who works for a senate office. This website is a server and governments can shut down any server.

BitBay is decentralized, it will work in Iraq it will work in Zaire it will work in China. There is no country which can firewall or block it and its serverless. I think you should actually first understand what "decentralized" means.

Tor=decentralized
Bittorrent=decentralized
Bitcoin=decentralized

YouTube and Facebook NOT DECENTRALIZED

Also BitBay is the ONLY decentralized serverless markets in the world other than OpenBazaar and Syscoin. Syscoins markets however are blockchain based and thus prone to extreme bloat and OpenBazaar uses centralized arbiters and not double deposit escrow and really is open to collusion attacks.

To say the coin wasn't moving is wrong. I've been working on it 2 years straight and update the software every couple months. Not sure where you've been.

I do have some good views about this coin among other and when i backread most people say that it has a scammer developer and a scam coin and wong get any pump in the future?how can be so sure about this matter? Even if it falls into top 100 its still promising to keep this coin compared to pump and dump scheme coins.

I'm not a scam developer. Look at the software I made with your own eyes. The person who called me a scammer (bobsurplus) stole from the project adding insult to injury. I've worked my ass off on this project and am really tired of these lazy comments

finally we are seeing some notice in the value of this coin

What should this Bitbay coin be used for? Which advantages does it have?

http://bitbay.market/walloffeatures/

Think of it as an amazing opportunity to buy some cheap coins. If you really believe in the potential of a coin, better to invest substantially in it. The market will come around to its fair value, sooner or later.

Alright, this thread has sold me. Just picked up a small position in BIT.

Not kidding about the "small" part. It's 1.1% of my crypto portfolio. But I'll be paying close attention now.

In what way exactly is this one supposedly the "first" marketplace? I seem to remember perusing the NXT one long before this one existed. Or is it by sticking "decentralized' in front of it and that they feel they can then make that claim.

BAY has a functioning decentralized marketplace. With decentralized being the important part, if not the most important part. The whole crypto started to bring more decentralization, to make bartering trustless for the users.

I know that people really love to believe their favorite coin or whatever is decentralized, but in the case of this one, it's currently "centralized" in the developer himself. The moment he stops (is hit by a bus or something else happens), just like all others where the dev left, it will die. Him also having at least 10% (no one can be believed in this space and he could have far more than that), well that's a hell of a lot and cause for concern. It used to be that any coin that had a premine etc. of that sort of amount was immediately classified as a scam/garbage etc and avoided. Now of course people just accept it all as normal and make up all sorts of things to justify it.

His stating that this coin cannot be stopped by any country etc is just laughable and the fact that he's put that out there just has to make someone start to question more. Tor traffic can be detected and blocked. Bittorrent traffic can be detected and blocked. Sure, it wouldn't be cost effective to try and stop absolutely everyone, but you stop the majority and anything relying on it is dead. Seriously. I mean all you have to do is read the freaking wikipedia page about Tor. Just because no one really gives a shit about all this stuff right now doesn't mean it can't/won't happen down the road.

Another issue I have with this coin is that the marketplace is subject to the deal/licensing of Halo. Have all the specific details on that been made public? Would think that should be right in the OP of the coin as it's pretty important. Without it though, the marketplace no longer exists which makes it a risk.

At the end of the day though, this coin is no different than 99% of the others out there. It hasn't solved any real fundamental problems, offers a bunch of "stuff" that makes it seem like it has some sort of value and it serves no other purpose than a way for people to make a bunch of money for as long as it lasts. So as long as that's all you're interested in, then by all means, this one is as good as any other.

The first part of your argument applies to all walks of life, it is more about how decentralized it can go. If he does dissapear, things will continue to function.

As long as people run their nodes, it will be up. As for your main point, sure, anythings possible i guess

He MADE HALO.

I would say it is different as it offers an actual working product. Each coin goes by its own path and we can only guess how it all ends up. But BAY has shown incredible resilience and is bringing in new stuff to teh table all the time. And what do you mean by offering people a way to make a lot of money ? I do not thin that is a part of BAY. But it does offer people to use a double deposit escrow when people wish to sell something on the marketplace and make money that way.

If you dont like the coin, feel free to not invest in it. That is your choice.

So? What are the contractural specifics of that? What happens to that in the case of his death? Does he even have a will? Or is it just a matter of believing in his good will with zero thought to the future of your investments? Why do so many treat the money they put into this as a hobby as opposed to serious business.

I mean that it's nothing more than something to be traded on exchanges for profit.

I like it as nothing more than a means to make some money trading it on the exchanges as it solves no problems of crytocurrencies and has little chance of a long term (I mean a decade or two sort of thing) future.

You have made some valid points but it boils down to this at the end of the day when talking about valuation..... show me a project that offers more for less. It has a functioning unbreakable smart contracts market that is getting more and more versatile every update, it has a functioning governance feature (one major issue solved) it has a rolling peg being developed (will solve spiking and troughs ie stability) the scaling of it is also very interesting and a novel approach so that on chain is not bloated and growing to a huge size ( 2 more interesting things being solved). I like the cold staking feature a lot too.

Some of your points are actually valid and a concern but these are also being worked on too. The fact halo is not a bitbay exclusive to me is a concern but halo is owned by the devloper himself so in time if bitbay becomes worth 100M + then I would hope he could remedy this if he still owns 10% of the bitbay minting. Halo is but one part of bitbay though and to me not the most important part the pegging system and all the other features in the market place are equally as important. The fact halo is not exclusive i do not like but then what about all other open source projects they can be copy and pasted at will with no consulting the developers so to me this adds value to bitbay also in that yes he can license halo to another project if he wants in theory but why would he that will destroy his value in bitbay so this is a better situation that where anyone can copy and paste the technology without paying  a license fee. Bay paid 100BTC fee for halo so that is already licensed to bitbay for good.

If you can find me a project that offers me more than bitbay for less I will be all over it.

I am not closed mined so feel free to get me a comparison chart knocked up for bitbay vs X project (that is not just a bunch of dreams and fantasies and that has these features now)

all these dreams and talk ICO's are not to be included. I want real working functioning tech.

Ethereum is perhaps the only project but that is magnitudes more expensive.

LTC is bringing some real word improvements over BTC so i have that already.

Block - yes that is going to be very very useful when it actually comes out fully functional so have that already.

Maid seems to have big plans but again how long will we wait how well will it work in practice how well will it be adopted....same for the decentralised super computer projects that are popping up all over this arena now.

I'm looking for something new something that gives me more than what these have and has to give it to me at a price that looks like a deal not already priced in and too expensive.

Please research bay in depth, then if you find something else to rival bay for the same or less please point me in the right direction.

I do not however make light of the valid concerns you have made but at this point the risk vs reward is a good ratio to me so I have no second thoughts at this point of hold and still accumulating more. When pegging is completed and all other spending features are completed fully and this is all polished I will still be accumulating up until a top 10 position for this project. I can envision it eventually becoming a base market for exchanges in the future too.

Not sure if you've understood my point of view about the "coin". As long as you're going to buy/sell for some "short term" profit, then it's fine. If your plan is to hold for a nice 5x, 10x pump, then yes, that's probably also achievable. But if you think it's some sort of long term investment, then I'd say you need to look at the entire sphere of crypto currencies and realize that there is no track record that anyone can point to which makes that sort of investment anything more than a "dream". i.e. hobby vs business decision.

I'm not going to talk about various concerns regarding pegging as I just view it as a sure fire way to fail long term. People should be viewing it as a risky experiment and be ready to cash out quickly as that's what it's going to be, an experiment. I don't really pay much attention to coins with that sort of thing but didn't some other coin attempt it and fail?

LTC has always been and should always remain the silver to bitcoins gold so it's always a decent one to hold if you want to hold I suppose. But the buying should have happened awhile back now.

Block as in blocknet? Don't trust them in any way so would never do more than trade for short term profit.

Etherium. Any of these coins that seem like they want to get in bed with the current financial system (Etherium, Ripple etc), I would never do more than take short term profits from.

Maid. I keep hearing it mentioned recently but haven't got around to checking it out yet.

Basically, there is nothing worth "holding". Coins fall into 3 categories for me. 1, avoid at all costs as it's most likely a scam (which means I basically avoid all ICOs and anything with a large premine etc). If they survive after the launch, then they might move to the next category. Trade for profit. Short term profit taking and that's it. The last category is reserved for those that I think "could" have a future but since nothing is worth sticking money in and praying you guessed right, I do accumulation trading.

Having said all that, there is only one thing in this sea of crap that I stumbled across that could be interesting as it's very different and it's use could be massive. However, the tech is unproven and I'm still trying to figure out it's pros and cons etc. I'm also trying to figure out whether the team behind it is "solid" and if they have any real vision and a solid plan for leveraging the full potential. I've looked at probably hundreds of coins over time and this is the only one that has really piqued my interest.

Which, brings up something else that should be asked about this coin.. or in fact, any coin you're going to look at.

1. What exactly is it as I can't tell. Seems to be trying to be a few things. In things like the movie industry, you have to make a 1 or 2 sentence "pitch" for your idea. I've used that in a variety of industries and it works. So what would that be for BitBay.

2. Who are the target users of the "product"?

3. What is being done to grow that user base?

4. Who are it's competitors and what is being done to compete and grow it's market share?

That's some really basic stuff that has to be answered for any sort of product. Here's what's really interesting about asking questions like that. More often than not, most can't answer the questions and/or you'll hear people say that it's too early for that and they'll do it later. Never happens. Speaking from experience, actually taking a piece of tech and being able to market it effectively is a whole other skill set and the vast majority fail at it. Think about all the coins that really shouldn't be "big" but came out of the gate marketing like crazy and basically pushed themselves into the top on marketing alone. How many perfectly fine coins have come out but died as there was zero effort to promote it. In the past I've gone to some coins and talked about the importance of working on adoption and got people saying it's not time or not important yet. Fast forward a couple years and, if they're still alive, they still haven't done anything and it's stagnant.

I'm not really asking or expecting anyone to answer these questions for BitBay. I've put it out there as more for something people should think about when they're looking at other things to put their money into.

I think you are on the right lines actually but I do not think you have studied bitbay in depth. The reason i say this is.

1. Everything you say which is correct in part will write off every alt coin except perhaps LTC. So yes if you really want to stick to your process for long term investing then there is nothing alts can offer you that I am privy to at this time. I would invite you to reveal to me now or through PM this other project of interest you mention. I would like the opportunity to make a comparison to my other investments so that I may perhaps take a stake in something that sounds so interesting.

2. the questions that you pose for bitbay can be leveled at any alt and again 99.99% of them will have a less legitimate and satisfying response than what bitbay can honestly offer you.  I could answer those questions for you and from those answers you and anyone could deduce that bitbay therefore is superior to any other alt indeed not only in and below its current MC valuation but magnitudes higher also. The actual use case for bitbay are literally so numerous that only ethereum can rival it from those that are not just selling dreams and have tech there now that people can use. I would rather though people investigate bitbay deeply themselves and reach their own answers. The target and use case for the completed bitbay project is the strongest i have seen and is so vast you could spend years identifying them. But in broad strokes just about anyone that wishes to trade or barter or bet just about anything in a trustless manner ...with 3rd party scripts or apps running on top of it bitbay will provide so many services that the mind boggles. This covers such a vast array of possibilities but yes there is more work to do so i won't sell dreams. The thing is the tech is there it is real you can use it now the fine tuning and tweaks and app integration is outstanding so is the peg but the design he has already and obviously he can code out his designs.

I still do not say anyone should put all eggs into one basket of course. Bitbay is my fav alt but I am not even a top 50 holder of this project. I like to have several projects of interest because as you say they all have points of failure. Having said that i still ask anyone to bring forth a project that already provides so much for so little. 10M market cap is as you say good for another 10x if not far greater soon. We will wait and see of course where we are in 2yrs time. This however is not a project easy to pump and dump there are lots of holders and the largest the dev who is 100% believer and will introduce the peg so he cant even dump even if he wanted to. I mean if you have even spoken with him one on one and asked him some questions or listened to what he wants to achieve you will start to realise that this is not your average copy and paste developer. I would not usualy give much hope to a one person designer coder project because their peers of equal ability have a good chance of grouping together and out doing them. In this case however there are always exceptional people and in the field of conceptual design sometimes one great mind is superior to an army of lesser minds. Quite often when i read about people of exceptional ability they are better working alone and even if forced into a team environment the great breakthroughs and major work is still often as a direct result of their mind not the cumulative result of being part of a team. Other very good designers and coders complained to me when i have bugged them with my questions.. that actually working with other coders and designers is often a nighmare due to ego, differences in ability and just a general interface issue between them. In most cases though I agree a team is better than an individual if the tasks are easy to separate and agree on.


Either way if you still study bitbay deeply and make fair comparison to every other alt and say it is not cheap nor a long term hold then I will not argue with you because I will not be able to change your mind. Your reasoning will just be different from my own and only the future will decide which of us made the correct choice. Everyone should make up their own minds then you will over time learn where you went right and where you went wrong. Then you can start to correlate these things and develop a good system for picking out the good and the bad.

Hey so I see you saying a lot of things that you seriously make up as you go. Do you enjoy arguing with people or do you have a genuine interest in making the world better?

To say "this coin doesn't bring new things to the table" to me is one of the most absurd things you could possibly say (no offense). I have busted my ass, blood sweat and tears to work on BitHalo and was then hired and propagandized on BitBay just to bring the world double deposit escrow, unbreakable contracts.
The problem with society that I have repeated like a broken record, and will continue until the worlds ears bleed, is that third parties are the problem... middle men are the problem. This software, which has taken me about 3+ years to develop ALONE (I would fucking love you to show me another project who has a dev to claim this) was all done to bring unbreakable contracts to the world to people like you.

Double deposit escrow is arguably more disruptive than Bitcoin. The theory being that both parties invest a deposit into a joint account and thus there is an enforcement layer and a deterrent if you will that forces the assailant to face his victim and lose funds if he deceives the counter party. The theory is to bring honest people above deceptive ones in society. When I first thought about this, I was so excited I taught myself Python from scratch and built this shit. So to tell me and others who see the value in it that this doesn't bring something to the table is utter bullshit.

Unbreakable double deposit contracts are the ONLY way to do peer to peer trustless cash deals since arbiters cannot possibly know or enforce international cash deals. This means a peer to peer cash gateway in BitBay and BitHalo respectively. That is so signifigant its mind blowing. Also, the contracts and markets being anonymous cannot be shut down even if I "die" so to speak. The source code is open and someone can pick up the torch where I left off.

Unbreakable contracts SOLVE the problem with unreliable international outsourcers that pad their hours and lie about credentials because the employee and employer put up a deposit and thus would both lose if the employee tries to lie about their hours. This in the long run saves the employer endless amounts of money because they will force employees to do the impossible: THEIR JOB. I've used it myself and it works. Yes I drink the kool aid.

Unbreakable contracts SOLVE the "empty box" and shipping fraud scam. I even had a friend who lost 100k+ in supplies in a shipping theft and when suing the party spent his life in court unhappy because nothing came out of it even when he won they didn't pay. This system solves it because empty boxes and other tricks are enforced by the deposits so it REMOVES THE PROFIT INCENTIVE FOR THEFT.

Unbreakable contracts allow TRUSTLESS BARTER and farm co-ops and thus is the ONLY peaceful contract that would work in an anarchy. Its the ONLY contract in history NOT BACKED BY GUNS. Behind every lawyer is a gun!

Up to 50% of Bitcoin at least has been stolen due to escrow theft (mt gox, sheep market, silk road, cryptsy, bitfinex, mintpal etc etc etc). If any of those platforms had double deposit the theft would never have happened (most were inside jobs of course). Bringing me to Open Bazaar and BitSquare which 2 of 3 escrow can easily be stolen by escrow agent colluding as buyer/seller and being anonymous posing no risk. That 3rd party?? GONE.

And don't even get me started on the "wall of features" in BitBay. Anti-Keylogger, Steganography and pay to email, BitHalo itself being the worlds first multisignature software before Armory. The security is so pumped up that it would be a joke to try and hack these accounts with your keys hidden in images and the automated 2 step spending joint account features to let a user sign a TX using two computers!!

This coin isn't different?? Screw that, show me one coin that has a piece of software with contracting user interface. NXT contracts were totally arbitrated and breakable and the markets had no enforcement layer and wasn't decentralized. These markets are because they are serverless and based in Bitmessage, they are not bloatware or blockchain based. And furthermore even Ethereum doesn't have a UI for offer/counteroffer contracts and even if they could do double deposit they have no interface for it. This interface has taken a chunk out of my life to make for people like you! To help consumers have better lives.

And me having 10% was know, all the addresses posted on reddit, I already had my name mocked by government trolls and had to deal with this cesspool called "bitcointalk" run by Theymos who works for a senate office. I was lucky to have a community in my corner who supported me. I didn't even give myself that 10% it was given to me by the founders who left with the funds. At this point, its a vested interest and I don't even sell any Bitbay ask the hundreds of community members who talk to me daily on slack. I've been working 3+ years WITHOUT FUNDING. And a shout out to all the other devs in crypto who go unnoticed for your hard work while investors bitch. I feel your pain! The devs who work like dogs without funding. I'm one of the few, I think there are a couple others. Granted, I hold crypto and made money from simply holding coins. But I can't trade and code. Try it yourself tell me how it goes.

And while we are on the subject of premines... say hello to Bitcoin!! You don't have a problem with Craig Wright, the NSA, and FBI members who ran silk road and all the govt thefts and hacks to steal so many Bitcoins not to mention it being popular on Tor made by the Navy and "Sathosi" having billions in coins or the WinkleVoss Twins who could crash the market in an instant if they wanted. Or how about people collectively selling?? I will argue Bitcoin has no better distribution. I don't even hold the most coins, there are a couple investors who bought up a big chunk in Bitbay too.

If you don't like people holding a big amount of supply I would avoid the USD since the federal reserve is allowed to DOUBLE SPEND printing infinite amounts of money and giving themselves funds for free in electronic accounts with their criminal friends at Swiss bank who used to have like 70% of the worlds secret money supply or how about the military who embezzles trillions of dollars and conveniently keeps their names off Forbes?!

Or you don't like premines how about DRK which is now DASH which had a signifigant premine almost 100% by the devs. And then there was Ethereum who has probably a premine as bad as DRK which somehow magically sold itself out for 40 million despite NOT HAVING A PRODUCT. And then they just so fortunately get deals with Microsoft and huge banks. Then all their ETH ICOs has Gavins name on them, they fund in minutes without hardly any marketing where its pretty clear the devs buy their own ICOs. And then there is the DAO where they obviously gave themselves kickbacks since it raised 100 mil, had a bug they audited and exploited and probably a few insiders shorted.

Look at wall street. Companies where the stock only sellls a few percent of its supply and the board of directors almost always holds more than 51% of preferred shares and those trade trillions of dollars.

So honestly your points are not true. You just haven't done the research. You aren't me, you don't know the investors and why they are so excited about double deposit.

And lastly without going too much into it, you mentioned the peg has been tried before in other coins? Not true. You just don't understand how I'm doing the peg. Its done by freezing and unfreezing supply evenly for ALL users its not opt in and gives various liquidity speeds for the money since the frozen funds are slowed with an option to transfer in a one month time lock. This is the ONLY way to do a decentralized peg. Its not a hard peg but we could make it that way, its more like a "crawling peg" in economics.

All the other coins that did pegs failed because those were CENTRALIZED. Nubits uses custodial accounts who front run the market and absurd interest rates offered for parking and then burn so you don't hold ownership over previous liquidity. NuBits peg failed before. Tether is of course centralized and already broken below a dollar and run by same parent company as Bitfinex?? Yeah we know where thats going. And lastly BitUSD and market pegged assets of BitShares are the closest to being valid however they rely on trading tricks and experience low liquidity and are subject to black swans and the whole set of pegs can crash if BitUSD crashes.

Ours doesn't have any of those flaws, is as simple as it sounds, control of supply by freezing and unfreezing. Yet quite complex to code and I wrote a 20 page whitepaper.

The code itself is 50,000 lines of completely original code. So you were saying what does this bring to the space? What doesn't it bring?

Actions speak louder than words, my software works and actually does something. And people even have started to use it! See it in action for yourself:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrXUZRGd1hE

And sorry if I come off as emotionally invested, I am... can't help it. I really want double deposit escrow to be known and used in this space. SDC tried to copy it but they failed and abandoned the brand. I'm hoping more people will attempt it but I know its hard because of how much work this was.

If you don't believe me, try and code it from scratch yourself and I think you will change your tone.

Great post David.  Viper won't show his face again

Actually no. I just don't see anything really worth directly responding to. I'm referring to big picture things the coin doesn't solve and he's talking about "features". He believes that centralizing the coin in himself and thus putting everyone's money at risk is fine and I don't. Being emotionally invested is fine, as long as you're being responsible as well and I'm not seeing it. I do note however that over here he talks about how great pegging in the coin will be while in the official thread he admits at least one flaw and how it could result in a hard fork. At this point continuing any discussion isn't worth anyones time. There are true believers and there are not and not much will change that.

The fact that this is all you got from reading that shows how poor of a listener you are. Nobodies money is at stake. Double deposit doesn't have third parties. I can't shut down the markets even if I wanted to. The cat is out of the bag. And speaking of people's money. All the investors profited.

Lastly the pegging has no flaws. It's just going to remove the need for a market maker and replace him with technology. It's the only way in the world to do decentralized pegs, doesn't rely on trading tricks. If you had more humility or was a better listener you might actually learn how the protocol works. It's very clean and pure and simple. I doubt we would ever need to fork because money always moves. If we ever had to it would be to improve it. Bitcoin sucks because they are not improving protocol and fearful of forking. It's a joke forking is great it means you are constantly maintaining and improving protocol. We have decentralized voting and recently voted on a fork so it's absurd that you think the coin is all about Zimbeck. It will exist without me. It was designed to work in an anarchy.

And lastly, if a piece of software isn't a sum of its features then I'm not sure what it is.

You talk about us having features as of its a bad thing. Almost hilarious you came to shill and complained about me having features. Sad but funny.

I drive a car because of its utility, I use computers for their utility. Bitbay has more utility than almost every other coin which is vapor marketing nonsense. Unless you want to argue in the favor of Dogecoin?

Didn't think so, adios. Aparrently the only thing not worth responding to is you. Come back and talk to us again when you grow up and gain some humility. When that time comes we will be happy to answer your questions.

Shill? Exactly what was I shilling? I was having a conversation with someone else about BitBay AND coins in general, and you showed up. Instead of answering the valid concerns listed, you went off on a massive rant about yourself and some coin features as if you were butt hurt. That's why I view it as not worth responding to.

I'm not even going to address the "humility" thing as it's ludicrous when looking at your posts or even the ANN for Bitbay. You seem to want to get into some sort of who's dick is bigger contest. I will just throw this out there though, that I've been coding and putting out products for over 30 years now, almost half of which "self employed". So I'll be long dead before you catch up in terms of accomplishments and amount of code written lol.

Note that I've never gone into your thread. In fact I've avoided doing so as I didn't want to get into this sort of thing as people just start to chalk it up as FUD etc and it brings out all the trolls. But, you seem to want to go there and so I've been going back through all the initial scam stuff about this coin to refresh my memory of events and have seen a variety of things you avoided answering back then. You seem to have a history of avoiding answering things in fact.  I even completely missed something interesting the first go around. If you want to waste your time answering some questions I can bring up from all of that, then we can certainly go there. But I'm pretty sure you have more important things to do and it wouldn't change much in terms of all your true believers.

Pegging


That was a couple days ago to the investors. Over here you're saying something different. I do like how you're at least honest in saying you don't have a clue if it will work or not and that it's an experiment.

Come on. Show let's all some class here. Why threaten to bring up all the stuff from the start. There are several threads about it examining it at length I have been through it will a fine comb myself several times.

Let's not all start letting this get personal.

Let's rather discuss the software. It all boils down to this. Is there anything out there that offers more for less ? The answer is actually no there is not. Not that I have located here... there are a couple of small projects that are promising a lot but as yet have not come anywhere close to coding it out.

If you choose to invest in another alt over bitbay right now today then list it here and we can revisit in a years time and compare results. Then we will fairly see who was correct. There is no point arguing over the future nobody can see there with 100% accuracy.

I don't think you're a shill and have voiced some valid concerns however in a risk reward calculation I have factored in I still believe there is not better opportunity right now than bitbay. There are others that are good too but that is my top pick for now. If you have another project that you have compared and find to be an even better chance please tell me about it on PM or here.

Ok. You know what... You and I were having a decent conversation about this stuff and I was valuing our interaction when DZ came in. Since I actually value your opinion on the matter, I'll extract myself from this thread completely. Good luck to everyone.

Not only did I answer your so called "concerns" but I expanded on each one in great detail. However even if you aren't a shill you are a pretty negative person so you do the job the government pays people to do for free! You should look in the mirror and carefully read over your comments and think of weather or not they need improvement. A fair amount of introspection can change your life. This thread is about BitBay of course I can respond to comments about the software I created! You can't be serious

hahahah you think me or any of the investors give a shit about accusations from Bobsurplus and his government mossad friends?? What a joke. Sure bring up the past! I'm an easy target. I was the one that exposed everything and posted my addresses, told the news about it, spent hours on the phone with Ian Demartino showing him my chat logs. I never avoided answering questions. I exposed the project the moment I had enough proof of Bob/Gekko/Dai and Lin were planning to steal from it. AMA. I'm one of the most honest people you will meet.

As for you quoting me from an earlier post, I'm well aware you were referring to that comment before. And you clearly are taking things OUT OF CONTEXT.

I'm not psychic, there is volatility in ALL coins including Bitcoin. Bitcoin goes up and down 10% a day so it doesn't qualify as a currency.

Bitbay is seeking to solve that problem. And you glazed over my point about why forking is a good thing to constantly improve protocol.

So lets talk about the 2 things I mentioned in that post. The 1st about it getting pumped too high on deflation is solved by simply allowing the coin to inflate above 100% or giving a variable interest.

The 2nd concern of a stalemate or someone having too much vote power is easily solved by moving to a purely algorithmic system not based on voting.
So the problems I pointed out have easy solutions. Its just the first iteration of the software will be a sort of experiment on the art form of supply control. Its an art and a science and I want the users to be able to vote in the first iteration because they can partake in the economy.

As for me calling you a shill, yes you certainly sound like one. I've been propagandized by a government agency in the past so I definitely don't take kindly to people who start ignoring the positive things we bring to your attention and only highlight negatives.

You saying "and then DZ came"... hahaha my name was mentioned multiple times as well as the project I spent 3 years coding. So yes I responded when I see people talking behind my back and you said things about the project that are totally untrue and have nothing to do with the tech.

But perhaps the TRUTH is revealed?! You spent your life in the software industry yet you can't make something like BitHalo/BitBay. Apply your talent and work for us. You probably made money, apply yourself to making the world a better place perhaps? You realize I made BitHalo/BitBay self-taught and working alone. Perhaps that bothers you? Maybe you are a little jealous?

Don't take anything personally. I said when you want to have a mature conversation about the technology we can do that.

A product IS THE SUM OF ITS FEATURES. So yes, I talk about features. Nothing compares to this software, and you know it.

But seriously you can bring up the past, call me names or point out things you "think i did wrong" as if you have some bargaining chip over me?? Please I think you confused me for someone who cares about my image (HINT: I DONT). Hahaha... if you are going to judge a person based on obvious propaganda then there is no saving you.

To bring things back on topic the massive list of features is here:
https://www.davtonia.com/bitbay/images/features.jpg



And this is the software in action!
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLILfNPSQCo6yjFiwXY6-C-ikIDs6v2nHU (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLILfNPSQCo6yjFiwXY6-C-ikIDs6v2nHU)

It performs unbreakable contracts using 2 party trustless escrow with no middlemen. It can do:
peer to peer cash deals that cant be broken
trustless barter and farm co-ops
unbreakable employment contracts
smart contracts

It was the worlds first decentralized markets:
https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/this-decentralized-bitcoin-market-is-for-legal-stuff-only

Look at the date to confirm.

BitHalo was the worlds first smart contracting platform years before Ethereum and I'm the dev of BitHalo.

And there is just a lot more to it!

So to answer the question of this thread the reason why the price is low as a few people pointed out was a group of guys stole from our ICO and tried to harm my rep, so for 2 years I kept coding without funding while they sold all their coins. And finally they ran out of coins and our price recovered to 3 times above the ico price! (Now Its about 2-2.5 times)

And things will continue to improve. I don't market the software much as I'm busy coding so another thing is, most of the hard marketing work is done by our community and slack team. As we need more employees. So those are some of the things. It's a matter of time before we get those resources and with or without it, I'm going to finish the remaining features you see in that jpeg.

In the meantime, download the software prove to yourself it works, actions speak louder than words and ignore propaganda. "Prove all things". The news fears double deposit escrow. However that is a very good thing indeed. A middle man doesn't want to support software that makes him obsolete.

I definitely encourage anyone with questions about BAY to join our Slack, over 600 members strong now!

http://bitbay.market/wp-login.php?action=slack-invitation

The community is growing and we are working very hard, expanding the team, and only just recently a few more features were added to the wallet. Hoping to really raise brand awareness this year.

BitBay is so underrated, the developer I can tell from his posts is a very good guy, I haven't invested in it but this is so underrated atm it is unbelievable. I just haven't invested because I don't know if the public will ever catch on lol.

People are less aware of bitbay or may be less trustworthy, so less investors are glancing at the project from bitbay so the price is very low. A little analysis that I can review bitbay hopefully rising the price.

Bitbay is just an excellent project. One of the best technically, no doubt.

Over time, forget about the history of which the developer is not responsible, the fabulous development going on, and marketing that will start .. investors will discover this safe value, and the immense potential of this technology. .

Yes the price does not yet reflect the value of BITBAY ..

But that will change!

It doesn't really offer anything innovative in my opinion, nearly all the features are things you can find elsewhere. The time of currencies that only offer currency related things are going to be a thing of the past, what it needs is a real life service that brings real value to the coin because there are already hundreds of currency type coins with equally good features.

Lol did you just misread post 65?

in fact too much hard work is needed there. i think majority of people still do not know about it. i think they need to have good knowledge about it and therefore more and more advertisement is needed there, and only then we can get the expected result for this project.

any info from bitbay trading group?i'm buy in 0,00000776 and now lower prize.Whether to rise?