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OK, this would sound noobish but I'm interested to know how other people keep the mnemonic phrase generated by the wallet. I do have the wallets secured with a pw and backed up (still not enough to warrant a hardware wallet) but I also have the passphrases handwritten in paper (someone said be wary of printers) and stashed somewhere but I'm wondering if there's a better way to keep them.

I don't know any cryptography but I'm thinking of shuffling the words rather than writing them down in order. Like a 12x12 grid where I'd spread them out in certain patterns and then finished with filler words. Since it's no longer as straight-forward should anyone get their hands on it, I think it would finally be safer to keep digital copies of it. Any suggestions?

To safely secured my personal data like mnemonic phrase, login username and password, 2fa secret code, I always created a google docs. And i compressed it through winrar with a strong password and saved to my usd flash drive. Thats how i safely secured my personal data. I hope it will help you Sir.

You could make your own sort of "encryption algorithm" just so if ever someone gets a glimpse over your seed, they wouldn't be able to steal your coins. Like, probably instead of writing your seed straight on, probably take a look at the word list and list the words above or under your seed words instead. This example is definitely not a good way to do it, but I hope you get the idea.

This is definitely a bad bad way of doing it.

Ledger Nano 24 word phrase written on paper, laminated, stored in a safe in a secret closet in my house.

some people keep 11 of the 12(23 of the 24 dpending on which format of seed you use) as digital.. and the last word remains in your head/offline as the final access password

they also set up a completely different 12th(24th) word(as a surrogate) with just a few satoshi's on that seed phrase incase ever physically aproached by someone with a hammer or gun demanding the whole 12(24) words... you simply give the 11(23) normal words. plus the surrogate 12th(24th) word to get them to leave you alone saying its all you have... knowing it would only cost you a few lost sats to be left alone

then you can use the 11(23) words plus the main 12th(24th) word later to get to your real hoard

Since other posters already suggested good ideas, I'd like to share one sort of "unorthodox" way of storing your mnemonic phrases.

Memorize it. Yes, you heard that right. A 12-word recovery seed is a lot easier to memorize that most people thought(though memorizing 24-word seed is still possible, just significantly harder). But I understand that this is definitely not for everyone.

Thanks for the information Sir. I thought with that method i safely secured my data. So i need an extra careful with my personal data. From now on i will make my own encryption algorithm. Thanks for the i idea Sir. I will keep that in mind always.

This is very wrong because you can easily forget it

I always put it to my email. I save it in my drafts and applying some secret code to the phrase just like adding some letters on it so that if ever my email was hack. They will not use it since it was wrong and it is very hard to determine what is the character that it makes wrong. Trust me, No one can use it but just remember what and where do you put the additional character.

I keep my manamonic phrases by printing on paper and laminate it. All information about it is also mentioned on the page.

Hence the reason why I said "this is definitely not for everyone".

Piece of paper in a safety deposit box.

You shuffling them? Really, I mean that could just make it worst if you dont remember the order later on and somewhere you will have to put the passphrase in line to capture it later on. I dont really think all these majors are necessary to make it more complicated in the first place. Just printing it and keeping it in your house safe somewhere can do the job mate! The printing or writing it down the old way is always golden one. Believe me it can stay untouched in your closet forever until storm doesn't fly away with your house. To be frank people just make it look like very sophisticated and it is not in the first place. Putting it on different storage's (digital one) can have risk of getting hacked, synched, destroyed etc. Better write it!

That's exactly what I thought of first but considering I don't know of a good way to do that, it'd probably very easy for them to find out. Which is why I think I'll end up with something more visual like the pattern key I use on my phone.


As someone who routinely forget passwords for sites and ending up having to have a reset request sent, this is definitely not for me.  :(


OK I'm noob when it comes to the tech side and I've only used Electrum and just go with standard setting and the seed it generates. Are you referring to the optional seed extension or are you talking about making a dummy wallet using the same seed as the main wallet save for the last word so that it would be easy for to memorize?

You can save your mnemonic phrases in document text and keep it protect by a program like WinSesame

I've always been a big supporter of memorizing the code and storing it on paper in several secure and safe locations.

I've also been following the idea of storing it via chip implant. The future?

You should write a paper or store it in a safe place if you are afraid of theft. However, do not forget to put a password that you use regularly to avoid having to do it again.

First of all, don't use Windows since it has the worst security.
Antonopoulos recommend to just use the easiest (and actually has the lowest failure rate), that is simply write it on paper and keep it in somewhere safe.
Don't be overly smart he said.

Other than that, use offline linux OS to keep the soft copy if you want.

In my opinion, this is a very dangerous way of storing the information which is necessary to access your electronic wallets. Google documents are easy to crack: due to the cloud, they are synchronized on all devices where your account is open, so accessing this information becomes much easier. I adhere to the "old school" option - I store information about passwords, secret phrases and keys "on paper" - in several notebooks, which I have access only.

i certainly prefer hard copies over digital ones. it is so much safer to have it written on a paper or even better etched on a metal or even wood rather than digitally which can be stolen or damaged.

this is a valid concern but also someone has to be looking for it in that temp memory to find it.
imagine you see this written on a wall in the street:
it looks like random data and you may just pass it but in fact it is a private key and it may contain 1000 bitcoin!

so your malware, thief or whatever has to know you printed a private key, look for it in your printer's memory, dump that memory and find the private key and steal your coins.

My technique is that I print 2 copies of them and store them in two different places which I am the only one who knows. A digital copy is not so safe anymore because of the presence of the hackers and malwares. Also, I recommend you to buy a ledger because it will really help you keep your assets secure in one place.

Go old times.
Paper would still be best. USB's can get corrupted anytime and also your computer with just a simple virus.
While with paper you can just keep it at your house or in your wallet, physical wallet.

If ever it was stolen I dont think pickpockets will know what the hell is that. Codes like that are meant to have copies too. So you can have two or three written in some paper.

I don't really agree. I think the safest way to store your mnemonic phrase is not with a digital copy, but offline. I store it on a piece of paper, written by myself (not printed) and hidden in my house. How can someone still it? I should suffer a robbery from someone who knows what he is looking for and where to find it, a little difficult I would say... Instead, everything that's in your computer can be hacked.

I think there was a similar thread here yesterday. I'm keeping my phrases written on 2 pieces of paper. One of them is among my notes but it's hard to notice. Somebody would have to know what to look for to find it. The other is inside one of my books on the shelf. If somebody starts stealing my books it's going to be the end of the world anyway :D

Yes, save data on digital file are more secured. My self making secures data on my computer like this:
1. Save the mnemonic phrases on .txt file
2. Pack the file into file .rar with strong password set
3. Install Bit-Locker
4. Put that file '2' to Bit-Locker encryption '3' , set Bit-locker with password
5. Write the rar and bitlocker password on paper or some notes

"Yes, save data on digital file are more secured". Definitely NOT more secure. It actually is A LOT lot more dangerous.

By the time you were just saving the mnemonic phrases on the .txt file, if you had malware on your computer, they've already stolen your seed.

Also, that makes zero sense. Why would you risk saving your mnemonic phrases digitally if you were just going to save your password on paper in the end anyway? Why not just write your phrases on paper straight away instead of writing your zip/rar file's password?

I choose two ways to save! Memory always forgets, so I choose ji.

The first way I took my pen and notebook and copied my mnemonic!

The second one is my screenshot mnemonic, and then print it out and save it!

Oh yes, thanks for reminding me about etching. I was actually interested on trying out pyrography using just a cheap lens, the seed might probably be the first one I'll burn into these plywood I have.


I suppose the malware can simply track whether you have wallet software installed and only then it would check the printer memory? I was reading an article yesterday. Apparently even the pass phrase is not save anymore since they can just take a screenshot of the screen.

very interesting topic . i will convert mnemonic phrases to arabic numerals . each word as a group . each letter as a unit . such as :" good day"  it is "[7, 15,15,4][4,1,25]" the numbers are the order of letters in the alphabet . you can also assign a specific number to each letter .

for safety, personally i save all important data in to flashdisk and im double save it to my computer. i use notepad to mnemonic phrase and for google authenticator im double too, save it to my phone and my computer too. cause i think this is a better way to save my private data

Better keep it on a flash drive or memory card that no one could steal. The main thing do not use the online services like evernote and so on. There is always a chance that they will be hacked and stealing your data

Written in paper, hidden among many other papers. Even if someone knew that I have them there, it would take him long to find them. I have two copies in two different houses.

yeah well if you have a keylogger they can simply notice and record every action you take such as keys you press on your keyboard, what you see on your screen, clicks of your mouse,... this is actually why air-gapped machines are used for generating your private keys and notion of cold storage exists https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Cold_storage

I use the old and traditional way by writing down private keys and seed words on papers. I keep 2 copies, one in the drawer of my home and the other in my parent house. Currently, my portfolio don’t worth millions. If one day, my holdings are worth millions of dollars, I will keep one copy in several safes in banks.

But how you will identify it if you are about to retrieve the wallet? You have to put some hint of doing this. This came to my mind but I'm very easy to forget and my memory doesn't works well now.

Keeping to a laptop that isn't in use anymore and you are the only one that can access that laptop will make it secure. Keeping some back up with a flash drive that's dedicated to be a storage of your private keys only.

Yes I've heard about that. Didn't had that option though coz I only have one laptop so I can't have any dedicated computer that won't connect to internet.


The "story" part gave me an idea. Maybe it can be encrypted into a poem that can be then memorized. Would be longer but seems easier to memorize than a random sequence of words. Thanks for the suggestion.

I always keep my mnemonic phrases in the usb flash drive)And it is always with me in any case))

Wooah I remember someone suggested and created this type of encryption to his private key. Making a story with the use of your private keys will give confusion if someone accidentally sees your PK's. Thanks for reminding me about this type of sequence and the story thing.  This is familiar to me and it's a good way to protect it that way, you don't have to memorize it you only need some hints on what are the most important words.

Mnemonic is an unencrypted private key. If it's discover by unauthorized parties, then they can have complete access to it. The following are the key points to remember.

1. Back up mnemonic immediately, when you create a wallet in imToken
2. Copy mnemonic on a piece of paper, don't use screenshots.
3. Ensure the mnemonic is correct, you can check out by Myetherwallet.
4. Keep your mnemonic safe when you save it.

Anyone who discovers the phrase can steal the bitcoins, so it must be kept safe like cash. Never type it on a website.

Since I only have one wallet and one mnemonic phrase, hence I have crammed up that line in my mind. I do not trust physical or virtual memory and hence memorizing it was the best option I had. I feel there isn't anything which is as secure as this is. But, if I hadn't memorized, I would have probably stored it on google drive.

You miss our little discussion. Before telling us on what we should you at least read on what we are talking about the encryption thing and by the way of hiding PK's through making a "story" type which is composed of those words. Maybe you just misquote our conversion mate but we are on bitcoin discussion and MEW is an altcoin so you better put that piece of advice on the Altcoin Discussion if someone asks on how he can keep his mnemonic phrases on MEW.

Here's a total paranoid way of storing it. It was (and probably still is) used a lot for message coding by intelligence services of many countries, so old, but still effective.
Take a book. Any book you like.
Find all the words your mnemonic phrase contains.
Mark their location using page-paragraph-word number combination, ie 120826 would mean page 12, paragraph 8, word 26.
As a result you will have a series of 6 digit numbers which you are free to store on your Google drive, email to yourself or paint on your roof :) Without knowing what the key book is no one will be able to decipher it.

Yeah, I'm thinking along the lines of a number sequence you can easily remember (special dates, etc) and using that as key to extract the words form the sentence. Am starting to read up on cryptography now. Interesting stuff.


That's quite cool. I think the good thing about is is that you can use any book, there's less danger of you losing it since many books are available online, you can just download them if you lost your physical copy and then just do a pen-and-paper solving.

You mentioning books reminded me of a technique I saw in a Kdrama. To decipher the number sequence, basically the content of the book is written on a grid. The number are actually pairs showing the coordinates in the grid so they'd spell out the words. I suppose the hard part is keeping the sequence. Most people are not that good a remembering strings of numbers.

I think this is over the top. I've never seen a book printed on a grid, so I presume you'd have to do that yourself, too. Why bother? Keep things simple.

Good luck about that mate and give us your little update if you are done with it.

He has to do it alone and it's DIY security.


Things that are simple can easily caught up if there is someone that's trying to breach your keys out.

Especially when that someone is using a simple baseball bat to get them from you LOL.
Jokes aside though, the method I have described above is about as simple as it may get and very secure.

from wikipedia:
most people write down phrases on paper but they can be stored in many other ways such as memorizing, engraving on metal, writing in the margins of a book, chiseling into a stone tablet or any other creative and inventive way.

For storing on paper writing with pencil is much better than pen[4]. Paper should be acid-free or archival paper, and stored in the dark avoiding extremes of heat and moisture

Some people get the idea to split up their phrases. Storing 6 words in one location and the other 6 words in another location. This is a bad idea and should not be done, because if one set of 6 words is discovered then it becomes easier to bruteforce the rest of the phrase. Storing bitcoins in multiple locations like this should be done via multisignature wallets instead.

Another bad idea is to add random decoy words that are somehow meaningful to you, and later remove them to be left only with the 12 word phrase. The phrase words come from a known dictionary (see next section), so anybody can use that dictionary to weed out the decoy words.

It could be a good idea to write some words of explanation on the same paper as the mnemonic phrase.

I think think this was one of the best ideas so far. Distributed and fault tolerant.

This may sound like a idiot-proof concept, but is in reality relatively vulnerable.
If someone gains access to your google drive (or to your roof  ::)) and knows the system you have used to substitute your words, it just takes a few minutes to hours to test all books which might have been used.
Anyone in your locality who might be able to guess what you are into, is able to check the words from a few thousand books similar to what you are interested in.

While this might work out if you hide all possible information (Substitution, book used, etc.. ), Security by obscurity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_through_obscurity) is a bad approach.

You don't have to use your favourite book, you only need to remember which book you used. I think this is less vulnerable than any digital methods used at the moment.

Has anybody here think of jumbling the position of certain phrases as a good idea? If you are thinking of keeping your seed in your closet or drawer then this might be a good idea even if someone obtained your seed they won't be able to access your wallet as it is all jumbled up.

For example:
You will write and switch the 12th word and the 1st word's position
You will write and switch the 6th word in the the 3rd word's position

Or for your own liking you can switch the words between the words you want to switch, the tricky part here is on how you will remember their positions. Because even I myself won't trust remembering their positions mentally, writing their positions somewhere might also work, you can even right their positions online as long as you keep the whole seed to yourself.

this one,along with the google doc storage are the worst IMHO
both run the risk of losing access too easily
I have a very good memory,yet I stumble upon sites or accounts I created several years ago and passes for which I was supposed to rememeber
many I do,but there were a couple of frustrating episodes where I could not no matter how I tried
besides you can be injured (god forbid),suffer from a temporary amnesia etc.
you would not want your savings to be gone forever in this case

Not just a baseball bat but also a gun?
https://themerkle.com/bitcoin-seeking-gangsters-hold-cryptocurrency-trader-at-gunpoint-in-his-own-home/
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/01/28/britains-first-bitcoin-heist-trader-forced-gunpoint-transfer/

Its really a worrying thing but only to those people who holds up huge amounts into their own stashes. Therefore we should really remain silent on what we possess. Dont expose or do create awareness publicly because once criminal minds will able to know then your life is at risk.You might able to avoid online hackers but you would really be prone into physical harm. On my side i do store up my mnemonic phrases on a notepad and then save it on a USB into 3 copies or files. Then store it up into places which someone in the house didnt know where i do placed it.

you can show your kid how it is working and even teach him how to use Nano or Trezor (doubt a 7-year old would grasp it all,tbh)
but I would rather keep my coins in a paper wallet in a secure place
then trust everything even to the safest of the hardware wallet
especially after I have explained to my underage kid how it is working and that it contains alot of money :)

If you have a couple of Raspberry Pi's that you never go online with store it there. Preferably on more than one device so if one device fails you have a backup

Yes keeping silent and remaining to be a low key holder will suit everyone to protect yourself from such incidents like the links that I posted.

This is why crypto's are anonymous because it helps us to hide on how much we are holding and that makes you remain low key by not letting someone know it.

Don't be too boastful with your holdings -- this kind off topic, I'll leave.

My opinion about how do I keep my mnemonic phrases due to save my personality data for example : password, login username and mnemonic phrases I have made in document google and all my data I save in it so If I want to open or login  this data I use secret  code so all my data is safety.

Seedshift - Encrypt/decrypt your BIP-39 seed words with a date shift cipher: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3416202

It was effective long before us and still is very effective. Where would you be searching for those books, on the internet? Are you aware that various paper editions have different font and different paging? In other words, good luck with the search :)

Mostly websites recommend you to write your mnemonic phrases or backups but I don't think is a safety habit. For years, what I do is to copy and paste it in microsoft word document. I password protect it  and then send it to my own email that is secured with a google 2fa and my phone number. In such a case, I walk with my backup wherever I go, and it will take miracle for anyone to get break into.

There are a lot of ways to securely store your mnemonic phrase, including digitally, password-protecting it, etc., but what I'd like to know is: how do you store it securely so that even if something happens to you (you die, you're in a coma, brain damage...), your family or loved ones can still access your wallet? Do you think of that at all, do/did you educate them about it, put measures in place, or is it if you go, your money goes with you?

Password-protecting files in the cloud with multiple passwords and services in between (email...), 2FA, etc. is fine, but how do your wife or children access it if you're gone?

I do it in a quite creative way. I'm writing some kind of a rap lyrics, where first word of every row is the word from my mnemonic phrase. Of course you can't write all mnemonic phrases in this way, but still there are some that I repeat in my head over and over again just because I love how it sounds.

Example:
Fashion, baby look around –
Building over with much sound
Start of ending. Nevermind.
Planet. Spacecraft. Wish of mankind.
And so on...

The 12-word grid is a great solution. I use the same as in the application for unlocking mobile phone - the exact same scheme. Easy to remember and quite safe.

Generally a paper backup isalways the best and safest option especially if u have significant funds on the wallet. u could make a second wallet  with a smaller amount of money on it for trading and keep the memonic for it on a encrypted USB

I would suggest using cryptosteel/billfodl/steely device to store the seed if you have significant amount of crypto.

I write it on paper or save it on aes-crypted usb with complex password.

Maybe, you must doing tattoo with that on your hand, for example?)) ;)

I keep in secure place away from home also not easy access.

That would be too cumbersome for you to comprehend. I understand the insecurity thought attached to being careful. Easy way out is create like a 4layer folder (You know like a folder inside a folder which is inside another folder and all inside a folder and save ur screenshot of the picture and also text note. Naming them accordingly.

I keep it in my notebook :) and put it in a cabinet with lock :)

Guys many people should keep a part of the mnemonic in 2 or 3 different places, this is a bad strategy that has a great chance of causing the loss of your funds, DO NOT DO THAT (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mnemonic_phrase#Storing_Mnemonic_Phrases_for_the_Long_Term) because if a set of 6 words is discovered, it becomes easier to bruteforce the rest of the sentence.

This is an issue only if you have a 12-word seed, if you have 24, it'll take thousands of years to bruteforce 12 of them. Even if you have a 12-word seed, if you encrypt (https://github.com/mifunetoshiro/Seedshift) it, it shouldn't be a problem.

Seeds are as simple like keeping the fund on one place mate. We all people keep the private key secured right. Same like that you can keep the mnemonic phrases also in a safe place mate.
I usually go with the cloud storage like OneDrive or GoogleDrive. I did not loose any fund so far on MEW or bitcoin wallets.
Usually seeds are been asking on metamask, electrum and some desktop wallets.

ledger nano and mnemonic phrases (24 caracters) into a secret box at home

I think something so important and sensitive should never be stored in digital form,especially not in e-mail even if it is protected with strong password and 2FA.There is a at least 3 risk in such storage :


- E-mail service can go down anytime.
- 2FA can be cracked/bypassed.
- Password can be hack by malware/keylogger.

This is not something that happens to anyone and every day,but should certainly be taken into consideration.For me best way to store seed it to carve words in some durable material (water&fire resistant) and hide them in a safe place.It is necessary to avoid places that will thieves first search,so you should turn on the imagination, in the end everyone is responsible for its assets.

I have two handwritten ones, both hidden in extremely secure places. You should never have a printed one or any digital "shadow" of them.

i remember this phrases only, nothing special.
I starting to remember it only without any writing, when my friend lose his bag with notebook and phone.

Some people cant really resist on saying it out regarding into their own bitcoin holdings which will mold up bad intentions if someone will able to know. Just keep low and be sensible on the things you do as long you do keep yourself away from danger.We should mind basic stuffs and do all sort of things that will increase  security if your holdings.

We're the same somehow, I also write my usernames and passwords of my crypto-related accounts in a piece of paper and put it inside my wallet. That wallet is not the wallet I daily used because I'm scared that I will lose it so I just place it in my personal drawer. When it comes to my mnemonic phrases, I just copy and paste it in a word document then store it here in my smartphone. Though sounds careless, I'm still confident that they are safe because I do not permit anyone to touch my personal stuffs especially that wallet and phone. Besides, my drawer has a padlock and my phone is full of locks so  I'm not worried at all. :) 

read my post Here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3168390.0) that I did, I approached strategies on how to protect their mnemonic codes, it is in Portuguese but if they want me to translate it into the English language I can do it later. I hope you can understand.

This sounds more than just careless.
Storing your mnemonic seed on your mobile phone (unencrypted  ??? ) is a bad idea.
Mobile phone manufacturer often skip security patches while displaying everything would be up-to-date. [1]

You are running a relatively huge risk of getting your seed compromised.

A digital storage is never a good idea for such sensitive information (doesn't matter whether encrypted or not).
The only form of digital storage which seems to be 'ok' is to have a backup encrypted on a device which is not connected to the internet (USB only used for this purpose, Offline PC, ...).


Storing your seed printed/written on a piece of paper in your wallet at home would probably be way more secure.



[1] https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/apr/13/android-phone-makers-skip-security-updates-users-smartphone-software-google (https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/apr/13/android-phone-makers-skip-security-updates-users-smartphone-software-google)

There is a way to encrypt the mnemonic code at the time of creating the wallet, if it is called BIP39 encryption consists of adding a password on top of your mnemonic, as if it were an additional word, a second authentication factor, I use this method and do not need worry about hiding my mnemonic, because even if someone has access, it's encrypted, it works like encrypting a paperwallet with BIP38.

See it: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mnemonic_phrase#Two-Factor_Mnemonic_Phrases

BIP39 does not define any encryption. The additional word (passphrase) is not used to encrypt your mnemonic seed.
The additional word is used to derive a different (pseudorandom) seed (which is then used to derive HD wallets) from your mnemonic seed.

If someone gets access to your mnemonic seed, he will see all words. Nothing is encrypted.
But this mnemonic seed will generate a different seed (which is then used to generate HD wallet) than the same mnemonic seed with the additional word.

This is two-factor-authentication because you need to (1) have something (the mnemonic seed) and (2) know something (the additional word (=passphrase)).
This way you can add plausible deniability to your wallet. Use the mnemonic seed without a passphrase for a low-value wallet and use one with a passphrase for your 'big' holdings.
You will be able to disclose your seed/wallet to authorities/gangster/etc. without them being able to know you have a second (hidden) wallet tied to that seed.


You can read more about the additional word (passphrase) usage of BIP39 on github: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki#from-mnemonic-to-seed (https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki#from-mnemonic-to-seed)

I am using an archive width a random name: The key hunter couldn't to find it through a search on documents.

thanks Bob, I know nothing is encrypted in the sentence, just an additional word that derives another HD wallet, if anyone see my mnemonic phrase, they will not know if it have BIP39 password or additional word, actually I made a topic about it and a tutorial on  how to protect your mnemonic with password BIP39 at a glance here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3213889.msg33402394#msg33402394), but the wallets Coinomi, electrum, mycelium and samourai allow you to add BIP39 password in your mnemonic. I think this is the best way to protect your backup wallet with your founds.

As someone who has just for fun memorized card decks and just to prove he could do it memorized four decks, I strongly advise against this.

Yes this is a method which is usable for a person with a trained memory. But for people who do not even know what that means, it is an extremely bad idea.

Very briefly, may I explain why each of these is a bad idea?

Cryptographic security is not a new topic and anything you think up has like been thought up decades ago and critiqued.

Actually the 12x12 grid is a variation of an old technique.

Why not just read about and use industry standard methods?

Actually there's a bit more to it than that.

Not "any book you like" but "any book you can get an exact page for page, word by word" copy of anytime in the future.

For example the first edition of Heinlien , The Moon is a Harsh Mistress."

First editions are really good for this purpose. For a famous book these are not going to be cheap, a couple hundred USD or so.

There are 18,000 ways your method can and has been hacked.

Just one example.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZdTP8erZE0

I just wrote it once in my diary and use it when in need:)

First, try billfodl. It's a better way if you want to keep your seeds and keys secured - https://billfodl.com/pages/compare-to-cryptosteel

Second way, and the most cheaper one that I personally follow is, you can buy some small (memory) sized memory cards and keep your private keys secured in them as well, you can put each of your cards at different places so that you can have alternatives that if one card goes corrupt, you can use the other ones.

You can store them in a personal notebook or a notebook software written by yourself. I think it's quite safe. And you should mess up the information according to your own rules.

Mnemonic phrase you say? Not private key right. As for me I write it down and keep in secure and strategic places within my home.  I don't keep in my phone nor system. The best way is to write it down... Hope it helps.

Save,
before saving we must complete the enconding first, then it can be stored for a certain time, at this stage there is storage of some notes, impressions that have been received from previous experience.

it is ironic but one copy of my hard wallet mnemonics are stored in bank storage
other copies in fire proof safe
never copy paste, never use word or any other digital document for those.
I always right them down on paper, then do a reset and check in action if everything works and only after then I store them.
For 2fa QR codes I use offline pc and printer and hideez key

Store two sets of the first 50% of the phrase and 2 sets of the last 50% of the phrase in four places. Places like your parents house, inside your roof, safety deposit boxes or a close friends house are good to consider. 

You dont have to trust the person that much because they wont have the complete phrase.

There are better approaches than this one.
With your approach if you split your seed into part A and B, store them at 4 different places and 2 now get lost you have a 50/50 chance that you can't recover your seed anymore.
In this case it would depend which of these 2 parts (A or B) got lost. If both A-parts get lost, you are out of luck and have 2 redundant part B left.

It is better to use shamir's secret sharing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shamir%27s_Secret_Sharing). You can split your seed into any kind of combination needed (e.g. 2 of 4, 3 of 5, ... ).


You can take a look at https://iancoleman.io/shamir/ (https://iancoleman.io/shamir/) to check shamirs secret sharing. Try it out yourself. With 2 out of 4 you just need ANY 2 out of these 4 to reconstruct the seed. Not 2 specific ones (like in your example).

But make sure to download the site and run it offline if you are going to use it.

The Mnemonic phrase is a private key that is not encrypted. If someone did get ahold of your Mnemonic phrase, it is equivalent to taking control of your wallet.

The mnemonic phrase is just a depiction of a (big random) number. This big random number (seed) is used to derive private keys.
The mnemonic phrase is being used because it is less error-prone when backing up (12 - 24 words) than a 256 bit long decimal/hex value.
It basically just is a big number which is being encoded into words using a special 'sheme'. See more here: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki (https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki).

That's not a recommended way to store your mnemonic - if the above code changes/gets removed, you're fucked. Not until this becomes a BIP anyway. TREZOR are working on it: https://github.com/satoshilabs/slips/blob/master/slip-0039.md

Shamirs secret sharing is not some 'script' created by a 3rd person which can be changed.
It is an algorithm. It has been created by Adi Shamir (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shamir%27s_Secret_Sharing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shamir%27s_Secret_Sharing)).
The code used on the website is open source: https://github.com/iancoleman/shamir39 (https://github.com/iancoleman/shamir39).




This doesn't change anything.
Trezor is simply going to implement this algorithm.

It doesn't matter who is (or: is not) going to implement it. You can always use this algorithm on your own.

This algorithm does exist since 1979.

I thought it was an implementation similar to https://github.com/oed/seedsplit that converts the shards into actual mnemonic words. This is what TREZOR are working on. I would not recommend storing e.g.: as your seed words at all.

has anyone had the idea of simply jotting down your mnemonic with a pen with invisible ink?

see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaSJxMOB7j8

 ::)
i keep it in my brain

There are many different ways
Since other posters already suggested good ideas, I'd like to share one sort of "unorthodox" way of storing your mnemonic phrases.

A lot of great ideas have been popped up to this. Most of them lighted up new ideas in my mind.
But here is my way to do it.

There is no need to know cryptography to hide or secure anything. You should come up with the idea which is developed by you and only yourself.
Let's say you have 24 words which are generated by your Nano S. First, you can find 24 different places for your 24 different words to hide. Of course, those places should not locate anywhere near each other, or should not be the same one.

Finding a pattern which is going to reveal the mnemonic phrases one by one as in order will be the second job you should handle.
This way, you only need to learn a pattern which will help you to solve the puzzle.

P.S: In case of any problem, you should have plan B too :)

This one may be useful thing mate, partially you have promoted your youtube videos link here right. We can find the mnemonic phrase saving assistance while you are logging into the wallet itself mate. I advice you to check that and do what ever wallet you use.

If you use the hardware wallet or desktop wallet you can just save that fund on personal flash drive or somewhere mate.
That is enough to keep your wallet safe. Nothing else needed.

I am aware of this, I do not use this method, it was just something I wanted to point out, this video and this channel is not mine.

The only hard thing here is to keep the mnemonic safe.

What I do is encrypt the mnemonic phrase with bip39 (similar to the method of encrypting paperwallets with bip38) it works kind as 2 authentication factors to protect my funds.

See: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mnemonic_phrase#Two-Factor_Mnemonic_Phrases
       https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3213889.msg33402394#msg33402394 (how to encrypt your backup phrases with BIP39 encryption).

I'm afraid your way is not good in case you forgot the rules set by yourself
I am completely satisfied with this way, I can share with you my way is:
1. I write on paper and store with my most important documents, all stored in a safe
2, Printed and stored in the cabinet
no one can steal yours

Mnemonic phrase is as important as your life because if you loose it you loose your Cryptocurrency, so i have my on my computer and also did a paper print out

A good way is also to save the mnemonic in keepass, because when you copy your mnemonic saved in keepass, it stays for a few seconds in the clipboard, which in turn, has to reduce this limit to 5 seconds. The ideal would be to do this at the moment of creating your wallet, if it displays the backup phrase, go to keepass and put a strong password as long as you do not forget and can do as many backups as you want without exposing the mnemonic. 

And what if your Brain's memory is lost  in an accident or something? That would mean no chance of ever recovering your phrase. 
Writing them down somewhere remain the safest.

In fact, people who rely solely on their memory - are very at risk. Human memory is a very unreliable source of information storage. If something happens to you then your heirs will be left without money. It is necessary to duplicate your passwords and your mnemonic phrase somewhere else.

I save it in some places, like external hard drive, notepad on PC and In safe main email.
That way everything is under control. because I've never experienced the loss of my bitcoin because I lost the data when the pc error and re-install

Do you save your recovery phrase on the pc as in notepad and cloud?  Did you at least add a password? because the backup was saved the way the wallet provided you, then it is decrypted and if you saved on a pc with internet access is very easy to steal, it is recommended to save this sentence offline on a paper as in a diary and preferably with the recovery phrase encrypted with bip39

If you have good amount of BTC on it, best why is to remember it or write it in the way only you can know what is it or how to recompose it.

Worst possible idea.  Any search warrant could allow cops/FBI to raid your safety deposit box.  It's just putting it on a pedestal for the cops.

I copy out my mnemonics, phrases and passwords into a document safely stored in my flash, giving  a very strong password and face recognition, and written in a document placed at some part of my house, which no one except me that has access to the place. Might not be the safest, but okay by me.

I do screenshots and write it on the paper and keep in the safe place but i used emails to stored

I might be dumb, but i keep my mnemonic phrases in the notepad (physical one).
However i'm considering to use cloud for this.
Why not ?
As long as you keep your credentials and password safe, you completely ok with it.

Mnemonic phrases are a pain to be kept. Sometimes when they are needed, they must be input the same way that it was given to you. For me, I personally screen capture where the mnemonic phrase can be seen and copy paste it into a blank notepad. I also keep the file in folders where i can access because Mnemonic phrases can be used to access personal information and other wallets.

Currently I just store them on pieces of paper, but I plan to encrypt them either with one-time pad or with some obfuscation algorithm. I also have memorized all my current seeds and repeat them a few times per day, so in case of some hazard (like when there was a fire near my house a few months ago) I would be able to restore my seeds from my memory. But this is only my second plan, since memory is so unreliable.

written in random order on paper wallet, keep order code backed up encrypted just incase my brain fails me one day

Maybe use a Song with some numbers could help to remember It...

Interesting ideas.

I think the best way would be to store them in an offline password safe and store the file on different offline devices, also on different places.

People doing this are insane. You should consider all email providers as NSAware, the hosts themselves probably can ready any email they want. If I had to choose one I would at least use something decent like Protonmail which supposedly it's all encrypted and they can't access your mail. Also log in through a Linux live DVD to guarantee your OS host isn't compromised, and do not store the entire seed. I haven't done the math but I would at least try to remember the last 4 words, or two first and two last, and that is already a compromise.

i use to keep away from internet

Using digital methods to backup is a good choice. Of course, you must have this digital technology.

https://github.com/mifunetoshiro/bip39_obfuscator

remember it

put it divided in iron cards, give it to close ppl, one person alone knows order by color of cards and he owns no card

yes, memorize is not a good way, maybe u memorize it now, but if u do not use it, maybe a month later u forget it.
I often split it in two parts, one parts save in difirrent USB drive storages and the other parts wirte in papers and save in discrets place only i and my family know.

If you save mnemonic in keepass with your configured password and play in a container file of veracrypt I think it would be as safe as saving the wallet.dat file. Of course as long as u do it on a desktop that you know is safe. because leaving the mnemonic in a place that you think is safe written on a paper might find this mnemonic and steal your funds.

i don't have my mnemonic phrases on my pc. I have only on paper, in 2 copies.
I have hided them in two different point of my house.

I don't know if it is safe enought..

only two copies? no, and encrypt this, try to know about bip39 encryption you do not even need to change your recovery phrase

GitHub: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki
bitcoinwiki: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mnemonic_phrase#Two-Factor_Mnemonic_Phrases

As per i Concern the best way to to keep your passphrases

1 - write in a paper and give it to your family member to keep safe

2-  keep it on pen drive with a pass and don't forget to tell password to your family

Your method is very safe. I applied your method to accounts on all exchanges that I frequently use. Sure the hacker will never be able to hack into my account

I regularly record all the things such as account name, password, security question and private key on google driver. It is also extremely safe and secure

my theory is very simple, i kept my seed mnemonic phrases in a note where all my account details are their so that tommorrow if suddenly anything happen to me my family should be in easy to find my all saving details so that how much effort i have put should not go wasted. Even i have uploaded all my details in a email id which i only use it for this purpose and it is also protected with 2fa. This is my basic setup to secure my all secret details

Good old paper. 3 copies, handwritten and cross checked. 3 seperate locations off site.

Encrypted files on multiple micro sd cards scattered around the globe. No doubt a few will fail but some will survive. I plan to renew them on a rolling basis. Where I'm at there's no such thing as deposit boxes to stick paper in, not that they'd have the insurance or terms I'd be happy with.

 mnemonic phrases of mine are been  kept like this i write down my names and paswords and i used to put in a flash and save at my friends house and even not to forget that i copied one formeand one at her house but missunderstand that she should be one of the best and trusted.

I think that the way in which memory is used is a technique that requires the brain's ability to connect words, ideas and delusions. Meanwhile, according to Eric Jeansen mnemonic is a method to help remember the large amount of information that involves three elements, namely: coding, maintenance, and remembering the return.

Usually the devices I use that uses mnemo phrases they come with a sheet where you can write it down. If not just a  piece of paper. Somtimes, the simpler the better

I do keep my mnemonic phrases. Meanwhile, I don't see this as a worse or bad idea since youre paying your tax and your government didn't ban crypto currency you have nothing to hide. Besides, this was the exact advice giving to me by one of the respected Legendary member of this forum back in year 2016 when i started the crypto currency business.

I wrote a separate notebook and stored it carefully. It's a manual job but I think it's good for myself and my fortune. If it is a file, I always use a computer without internet.

This is an important point that you have raised in the forum. You may write down on your paper and keep the paper safely in a deposit box. You may try using ‘mindmaps’ for easy recollection as well as for your privacy & safety. You may map in your words the way you find it most convenient for recollection using mindmaps.

Further, you may employ some serious memory techniques to benefit you. Modern memory techniques like Dominic System or PAO system can be employed. You may try studying these techniques and apply them. In tandem with these systems there is also a system called ‘Major’ that has to be seriously studied. The incorporation of an image in the practice of these systems should not be forgotten. There are no hard and fast rules to follow. It is just as per your convenience that you react to an event.

You may also try building a story or writing down a song for the ease of memory. You may in fact recollect quickly in such a scenario. The story or song should be precise and regular practice will help quick recollection. Storing the mnemonic phrases within the computer or in the internet is certainly not advisable. Though there are people who store many important information online, it is essential to remember that every such storage becomes risky in the long run. It is important to plan and stick to one of the ways that you find better for memory and recollection.

One of the things i have done is to write the phrases into paper. I keep the paper to my wallet and also a copy to my vault. How about you guys?

You can use a text from your favorite book or poetry phrase as a "mnemonic" to create bitcoin wallet. That way you don't have to write it and hide it . Just remember that book or whatever is your favorite text.

I keep my phrases in my facebook account i send it tl ny self so even i lost my phone i still got those passwords. One more is on microsoft word type the. Save as a file keep on my flashdrive. Until now its safe with care. Hoping to not loss any of my accounts. And avoid being hacked

Because I'm pretty sure entire books, lyrics and other popular text would also probably form part of future brute-force methods, I'd suggest you also apply some simple randomisation of sequence if you choose this method, or mix up the languages for custom mnemonic phrase. Probably quite natural for my Southeast Asian context where people are at least bilingual.

The temptation to use popular favourite texts or poetry is too great to risk I think.

Some above suggested encrypted archived files. Can be further obfuscated by renaming any files to .bat or similar file types people wouldn't look for.

do you own these cards or did you get friends to store them for you?

Shifting the words around is pointless because bip39 mnemonics have a checksum in them so it's a simple matter of rearranging the words until you arrive at a permutation that passes the checksum test.

Those who are looking for a second factor to their seed backup should use the passphrase feature of bip39 or electrum. The wiki explains it https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mnemonic_phrase#Two-Factor_Mnemonic_Phrases . Note this is not encrypting the seed. Instead it's adding salt to the hashing function which is used to convert the seed to the master private key: https://github.com/trezor/python-mnemonic/blob/master/mnemonic/mnemonic.py#L185

mmm i don't know man, do you trust facebook so much?
generally i don't think that put mnemonic phrases online is a good idea :(

I came up with a song for a local artist (friend of mine) and it became a hit here.. My mnemonic phrase is an alternative version of the chorus with some important numbers added in specific places. A few words are changed for a bit more raunchy meaning and only I know it like that. It's quite difficult to forget when friends of mine are always singing the melody when we have a few drinks together. ;)

Only offline storage, on a sheet of paper or Cryptosteel mnemonic wallet, in safe place.

Just a few questions to all people who just remember their mnemonic phrases:

• What do you do if you want to change your wallet? Do you just relearn a new phrase?
• And aren't you afraid that you forget it when you don't use your wallet for a long time?
• Why do you don't want to use a password safe for this?

I prefer the offline storage method in a password safe.

A handwritten phrase will have great risks to get lost than a digital copy of it. You can save it to your mail or on your drive as a text file. You can save it at 2 to 3 different platforms which will help you in recovering it in many ways.

Thank you for your advice.
I will use your practicing methods to preserve my assets.
I think in the future I'm to know more than in now.

Remember to only play with these phrases on an Air Gapped computer.

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maybe my way is equal to others To secure my personal data such as mnemonic phrases, login username and password, 2fa secret code, I always create google documents. And I compressed it through winrar with a strong password and saved it to my usd flash drive. That's how I securely secure my personal data. I hope this will help you

I would like to trusth mnemonic phrases because it's really convenient to be able to keep your entire Bitcoin wealth in your head by memorizing 12 words, but im still too paranoid to move my cold storage into an Electrum wallet, even after taking all reasonable security measures like doing it in an airgapped computer and so on.

My main worry is key derivation. Someone with the right info could cause wreck you due possible derivation of the seed. Anyone knows what are the exploitable attacks and dangers of mnemonic phrases vs just keeping your good ol wallet.dat in an airgapped computer?

I no longer use wallets that have backup mnemonic phrases but I think it is very easy to use this type of backup to be able to store your personal password in your wallet and to be able to access it anywhere in the world as you like just by remembering a 12/24 word sentence you have no risk in trusting the personal password of your wallet because you knowing the derivation path and your seed you will easily have access to your wallet because the seed is the entropy in human readable form for easy memorization is much easier to memorize an order of words (binary representation) than the seed in hexadecimal format.

But I prefer to save in the wallet.dat than the bitcoin core wallet because it seems more convenient.

I'm thinking about buying myself Cryptosteel. This is the original indestructible backup tool for optimal offline storage of cryptocurrency wallet recovery seeds (24 words), private keys and passwords.

i use a sentence i like , easy to remember ... you can not have more easier

I think a lot of you are forgetting something very important. What will you do if you hit your head or die? Have you written clear instructions on what this random garble of words is so that your surviving relatives have some sort of clue how to access your bitcoin? It's not enough to just store you seed phrase, you also need to leave instructions on where it is stored and let people know about how much it is worth. I know if I got hit by a bus tomorrow, a bunch of people would be able to follow my instructions and get that bitcoin out.