Bitcoin Forum

Update: Since I have settled with TradeFortress for 199.383 bitcoins, I no longer have any standing in a case against him. If someone wants to take over, then please let me know and I'll point people in your direction.


With TradeFortress' alarming lack of transparency and direction, coupled with his highly suspicious actions surrounding the alleged hack on October 23rd, I've decided that I want to start legal proceedings against him.

At this time, it seems that a class action lawsuit would be most appropriate, but I am open to the idea of pressing criminal charges.

If anyone in this forum knows of a good lawyer that could handle this case competently and at a competitive price, please let me know. If you have any other relevant information or advice, kindly post it below.

I though TF is going to payback everyone the principle for coinlenders?

Nobody knows.
information regarding how much/when/if CL depositors will get btc back is nonexistent at this point.

/following

Have you checked your Signature lately...WHY ARE YOU STILL PUSHING INPUTS???

I have about 4.97 bitcoins in Coinlenders, a bit more than that if you count all the digits, but that's roughly the amount.  Can you give an estimate on how much the lawsuit would cost per person?  Given the current price of a bitcoin, I'd be willing to spend a couple hundred US dollars on the lawsuit, but if I'd have to pay much more than that, it'd get to be a large enough percentage that I'm inclined to just write it off as a dumb investment and expect not to see the money again.

I have all signatures disabled, so wasn't something I even thought about. Fixed.

Below is an email from an attorney in Sydney who I found through on online search so I cannot personally vouch for him or his law firm although his resume looks respectible.


Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:36:54 +1100
Subject: RE: Action Required:
 

Dear [dwdoc]:
 
Thank you for your email.
 
Having regard to the cost of pursuing a claim for USD 100,000 or so in this jurisdiction (which, frankly, would be out of all proportion to the amount in dispute as commercial litigation is very expensive here), I think that it would be much better to explore the possibility of bringing a class action together with other complainants from the bitcoin community.  Although there are differences, class actions work in Australia in a way which is broadly similar to how they work in the USA.
 
I should also mention that lawyers in this jurisdiction are prohibited by law from acting on a contingency fee basis (i.e. to enter into a costs agreement whereby the amount payable to the law practice was calculated by reference to the amount of any award or settlement that may be recovered in any proceedings to which the agreement related).
 
However, some firms in this jurisdiction (ours not being one) are content to act on a “no win, no fee” basis.
 
Class actions here are often financed by litigation funders, which will pay all of the costs of the action but will expect a “success fee” which is typically between 25% and 45% of what is recovered.  The leading Australian litigation funder is IMF:
 
http://www.imf.com.au/
 
We know the senior personnel at IMF (including their Chairman and Managing Director) very well and we could facilitate an introduction if you were able to assemble sufficient other complainants to get a class action together.  In that regard, one would normally need at least 7 plaintiffs in order to commence a class action but IMF operates at the big end of the market and is generally interested only in claims worth $5 million or more.  There may, however, be other litigation funders who would be interested.
 
Regards,


EDIT: Attorney has asked me to remove public display of his contact information at this early stage until level of interest is determined. PM me for details if desired.




Thoughts? Alternatives?

If this lawsuit is an option for you then please alert gaston909 or post here. He is keeping track of CL balances due.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=86471

332.2162344:CL

I am interested  
Thank you!

EDIT:
Just read trough the site of imf. They do work in asia as well.
It won't cost if there is no success.
They will get 25-45% success fee of the recovered amount.
If they freeze the assets that do belong to him and maybe the btc adresses which we can figure out are his.
Don't know how much they know about working on btc though.
if WE ALL WORK TOGETHER we are at about 5m aud.

I think that sounds better than waiting for TF to maybe talk again one day.. and it wont cost if there is no refund

8.7 Balance and I'd be interested...if they take an amount from the winning that'd be alright I'd get 4 BTC back instead of 1.1 or whatever TF would give, though I would settle if he'll ever contact me back >.> I'm in a bad spot now for that BTC which I wasn't in earlier

AWESOME lol Can't wait to see this down the road.

I'm in!

I'm in aswell; 75.98128219 still in CL

Watching.

https://i.imgur.com/AOJ59oo.jpg

I´m interested in going ahead if that´s the way to recover as much as possible. My total balance on CL is 226.17055261 (1 BTC is frozen on a CD).

Unfortunately I´ve no money now to pay in advance if neccesary (in fact I´ll have to get a loan in the next weeks to maintain my job). Nevertheless if is possible to start without having to pay in advance, I´ll be pleased to provide as much information as needed for the legal action. I´m Spanish, would be neccessary to me to eventually travel to Australia?

Thanks.

Should those with a single BTC at CL even bother with this?

Yes everyone counts. The more there are in, the more power we have. And since it doesn't cost anything until there is a refund it should not be a problem for anyone to join.
The haircut would be much better than the one TF was offering btw.
..so ..yes! :)

299.03625778 BTC  in CL

IMF are very good at what they do and are a listed entity on the ASX (Australian stock exchange)

Im unsure if they would be willing to take on this case, as the inherent issue with BTC is the anonymity of accounts, therefore IMF may not deem this class action as worthwhile and the likelihood of a result low.  

Also, IMF usually deal in class actions where by there is sufficient capital to return (normally against a company with listed shares or the like)

That being said, as a backup or two pronged approach, you could enter into an arrangement with a debt collection agency in Australia as well.

As this is a debt collection type situation, most will work on a no return/ no fee approach.

Have actually spoken to a debt collection agency on your behalf just to see their feelings on the matter at hand.

They are happy to work on a no win/no fee basis and would initially find out if TF has assets/shares, anything of substance by doing some background checks.

At least this way you will have some idea what you are dealing with and is/does he have any assets!

If this is a way you may wish to pursue, please feel free to let me know and I will put you in touch with the guy I have spoken to.

He said initially he would require a) List of who is a creditor, amount owed, contact details etc. and b) document of what is known about TF, whereabouts, age, contact numbers, blockchain numbers used etc.


PS: Have not had any response from TF regarding purchase of CL, so we have decided to bring our own product to market over the coming weeks.

Here if you need any help, cheers.



 

Hey I have 80.3 btc In coin lenders
No reply from tf since the generic emails

327 CL
Get him into jail!

10 in CL here

I'd be interested in this - does physical location matter?

I'm in also ^^

How will this work tho
Do the lawyers have to do an investigation and find out who he actually is

/ have the police been informed about this case yet

6.0 BTC.  I'm in.

29.12 in Coinlenders.

I would be interested in joining depending on the level of commitment required. Happy to provide any information required though.

In that case count me in! I have screenshot images of my CL balance a few days before full maturity.
TF managed to cease its increase and gave me a haircut. Luckily I took those screenshots so I have proof of the amount of BTC that I have frozen there.

my CL balance is 75.23241838 BTC
get me in.
I have a friend who has lots of connections in Aust.
That is if TF is from there.

Count me in too.

count me in. CL balance 12.18 plus 0.1 still in inputs.io with no feedback from TF.

Assuming we recover, say, 60% of funds (after paying debt collector/legal fees/whatever) then do we all get 60% of our deposit back regardless of its value (i.e. those with 1 BTC get 0.6 and those with 100 get 60)?
Who will be responsible for distributing the assets?  If it's some 'random' person off these forums then we're all just asking to get scammed again. If it's the lawyer/debt agency then that's a bit better.

If I can be satisfied about my reservations then I'm in.  I 'have' just under 9 BTC in CL.

count me in...

Presumably it is a professional distributing the assets and they will provide a document detailing this and everything else about the case to those concerned. (Don't think we should confuse them with TF type people)

As for how much you will get, it depends how good they are I guess although by all accounts this person is pretty dam good.

Right now, it is looking like you will get 0 from TF, he stopped replying and vanished. How long are you prepared to wait. I think this option should be seriously considered - at this stage we just need to know who is interested.

i am intrest ,72.5 in cl

I'm interested.

531.87697838:CL

Ok count me in.

8.98132612 BTC

He is not answering so I am in as well : 30.85 BTC

I have 10.68 Btc left in CL.  Since it is looking like I will get nothing from TF, I am willing to join in.

Interested. 8.22918908 BTC in CL.

I'm interested in joining any class action/ lawsuit.

Is anyone actively doing anything to further this?

I'm interested.

So we know TF lives in Australia? What information do we have about who he is?

I am interested as well.
I have 311.66244771 BTC in CoinLenders.
I expect that total property of TradeFortress doesn't cover all BTC he owes. But what if it won't cover even the costs?

I believed that he only missmanaged our money ... but after not receiving any answer to the email I sent him ... I start having doubts.
We should probably try to trace our deposits to see if there is some TF's stash.

Hmm, I don't know, he might have some personal assets... And we could certainly ruin his life, and get what we can while we're at it.

I'm in for 4.87btc in CoinLenders.

Here's a link to a person whom claims to have some dox.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=327178.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=327178.0)

I'm in as well.

I have about 3.4 BTC in CL. I've e-mailed TF and gotten no response.

One note that I'd like to add to those that have settled with TF. You may have settled and agreed to the legalese that he provided. However, if that agreement was based on something he knows to be false, he may very well still be liable. That would be something worth asking an attorney in Australia on.

CrytpoUser01

Just looking at the number of interested parties at this point to see if it is feasible.

The higher the price of bitcoin, the less people are needed.

Thanks, that dox seems good, it is consistent with everything we know.

Legal means nothing until it is tested in court.  Everyone should go after him especially those with large balances who settled under duress.

I have only 2.08 BTC at coinlenders, but if the costs are proportional to the amount which is outstanding per person in case of success and if there are at least no costs in excess of the money/BTC gained, I would be happy to join the class action!

Don't thank me. Thank the person who had the smarts to collect that info.

+1

In. I have 7.01 in my CL balance as well as a pending ~0.73 BTC that was deposited but never showed up (and then a day later the hack message appeared, so obviously we had some time that inputs/CL was not operating correctly before he even warned us)

I would be interested (about 10BTC balance), but is it ok to be from Europe, since it's an Australian case?

I'm in!

8.10636761 @ CL.

same for me, but i think any ressources, knowledge, info will help, no matter where from.

i would even be willing to pay (loose more...) if there is even a remote chance of "justice". i fear we dont see our coins back, but it would help the community if we can show that we stand together to fight scams and keep going to build a web of trust.

maybe we can make some people think and not trust webwallets/btc-investments by default.

maybe we make the people doing financial services think about that peoples lifes may depend on it and take proper security measures if they try to implement such a service.

maybe we can scare some potential scammers enough before they make themselfes as unhappy as TF might be now.

for me every effort to go in this direction is well worth it.

also: with the lots of money involved i would be happy to see TF alive a year from now - maybe a lawsuit is not the most he should be afraid of right now...

for me it is not longer important if all this is a scam or a hack, i think we as a community need to prevent others from living through the same.

If pirateat40 was caught eventually, what makes TF so confident that he won't be?
TF you will pay. Even if it's with imprisonment.

Justice will catch up to him, in whatever form.

It does not matter which country you reside in. We just need numbers. If the big investors are all interested then we would hit the target.

Definitely agree with this.

Posting this because its relevant.

TradeFortress still has 697+BTC - proof:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=346236

I'm In as well.

Let's get him.

3.6 BTC on CL and I have not settled nor have I recieve a response from TF on settlement.
Thanks

I'm in too. 7.29BTC in CL.

419.51475852 BTC

I thought the SEC pissed on him?

Do you agree with pre-joining the lawsuit? Is important for us to know who wants to colaborate to see if the proccess is viable!

Thanks!

I'm interested.

So what is the total up to?

count me in, 180.2545789 in CL. TF is not responding to my mails.

Eric Corlew has scammed tons of BTC with bASIC-MINING and nothing's happening to him, same thing with amazinggrando, etc. The SEC made an example of pirateat40 to flex their muscles and set up a precedent so they can regulate bitcoin exchanges (read: force them to shut down as they compete with billionaire-backed high barrier to entry exchanges).

If you use Bitcoin, you are a hypocrite if want the state to later help you. My two cents. The moment you send BTC to someone, consider it lost. This is what Bitcoin is.

I'm interested. TF owes me about 5BTC.

If the top 5 depositors who are yet to respond are all in. We are pretty much there, they have big enough investments to make the difference.

We already know most bitcoin businesses are a scam.  I wonder how many others are going to be implicated once TF gets the rubber hose.

Truth is, you're the one living in the past. Now that bitcoin has real value, it has real consequences, bad people, and worse governments in the mix.  Don't believe it?  Ask the Dread Buttpirate Roberts. 

Received 100 BTC the other day, I think its safe to say he has plenty.


In just-dice chat right now:

15:08:37 (167186) <takleberry2> is trade fortress still refunding
15:09:01 (280731) <gandalf the gay> yeah i gave him 100 btc the other day
15:09:13 (280731) <gandalf the gay> he gave me my ripple back
15:09:49 (167186) <takleberry2> you gave him 100btc?
15:09:52 (280731) <gandalf the gay> yes
15:10:03 (167186) <takleberry2> im still waiting on 13
15:10:16 (280731) <gandalf the gay> 13 btc?
15:10:19 (167186) <takleberry2> yea
15:10:30 (280731) <gandalf the gay> yeah he ain't refunding
15:10:47 (167186) <takleberry2> thought as much
15:10:52 (167186) <takleberry2> not replies to email
15:10:59 (280731) <gandalf the gay> ya

So this guy just decided to give TF 100BTC? What Ripple did he get back?

I'm in, 113btc in CL.

I have had just over 2 BTC in CL. I'm interested in a "keep me posted" sense, in case this actually works.

Did you settle or get it out?

Neither. Sorry, didn't realize how that could be misinterpreted. I guess in a sense that 2BTC is still in my CL account.

Ahh, I see, you were just saying that you didn't believe it would be seen again :P

86.93779676 BTC, not settled or received a refund. I will register a preliminary interest in taking part in legal action depending on the terms etc... assuming TradeFortress does not issue a refund in the meantime.

If anyone's thinking this lawsuit is a waste of time, that TF doesn't have any bitcoins any more, I highly encourage you to check out the latest bit of the CoinLenders Script thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=283756.msg3715910#msg3715910

True!

TF has funds, is deliberately avoiding us and is not going to pay us unless justice catches him.

That´s why we have to go ahead with the lawsuit.

So would this be extended to inputs.io as well, or just CL? If only CL, why?

I will explain the situation with Inputs.io and BTCInvest to the attorney and see if it would be advantageous to combine all into one lawsuit. Currently am waiting to see if IMF will fund the lawsuit.

Good, Dwdoc. Keep us informed. I personally appreciate your efforts.

The only IMF I'm aware is the International Monteary Fund.  Is that the one you're referring to, or something else entirely?  I'd be surprised if they'd fund the lawsuit, but I suppose it's worth a shot. 

Also, I want to echo what bradyon said.  Thanks for all the work you're putting into this.

http://www.imf.com.au/home

9BTC at CL, I'm in

Oh, IMF is the law firm.  That makes much more sense.

IMF is the litigation funder.  In AU, attorneys cannot take cases on contingency.  The litigation funder will pay the attorney fees for the case in exchange for a percentage of the judgement should we prevail.

I'm interested. I have 12 BTC in Coinlenders.

This bears repeating.  You need to find both a law firm willing to take the case and a litigation funder if you want to avoid upfront fees.  Litigation funders are understandably choosy about what cases they fund and they're not going to fund an action against someone who has no capacity to pay or who is likely to become insolvent before the litigation process is completed (class actions typically take years), either voluntarily or due to claims by creditors outside the class action (in this particular instance, I'd be concerned about the possibility of fines by ASIC if financial services regulations were breached and any debts which might be due to the ATO).

Class actions are a specialised area and in the end it's the litigation funders you need to convince.

IMF only funds commercial cases where the claim exceeds $5 million (I'm actually part of their class action against Australian banks).

While it's possible that there are lawyers who'd like to become the go-to people for Bitcoin related stuff, I'm not sure this is a particularly attractive case for them.  Class actions are expensive and time consuming and if you want to "make a name" for yourself you need to be able to win large awards which can actually be enforced.  A "victory" in this case could well be pyrrhic because it's not clear that TF would have any capacity to pay by the time the case was settled (especially if evidence of criminal wrong-doing emerges).

If you were a lawyer looking to make your name in the Bitcoin world, it would probably be in the area of fighting financial services regulations being applied in ways which send "legitimate" Bitcoin enterprises broke rather than trying to sue for the recovery of funds from shady businesses and individuals who have lost or stolen user funds.

If there is anything that can be done about a scam it should be done.
Therefor I'm interested. My balance at CL is 42.78068979.

I'm in. My CL Balance is 13.79260958 BTC

They are gone and have no responded to anyone thus far.

Now the evidence combined with tf silence is pointing to an outright scam of funds criminal proceedings are far more realistic, regardless of the nature.

Anyone from Australia invested here?

Looking at the interest on here and the interest I have recieved via PM and the price of a single bitcoin...

We have exceeded the target.

I am still waiting to hear back from some of the significant depositors as well. sent you an update doc.

Interested.

Interested  CL 3.0032 coins

Also interested, around 1 BTC on Coinlenders.
Tradefortress hasn't responded to me. No settlement.

Fuck it, I'm in. TF doesn't seem to even remotely try to resolve the issue and with the current BTC price legal action starts to get worthwhile even for smaller deposits.

CL balance ~2.27 BTC, I also got a couple BTCInvest shares.

I get into it with TF every post we see of eachothers. TF needs to man up and fix problems, I mean when a whole thread is devoted to polling wether or not someone is a scammer and 50% of the people who voted claim hes a scammer...... looks, acts and walks like  a duck

You may be right.  The latest advice from the attorney is to try and get law enforcement involved either prior to or along side a civil action.

If the only real issue here is price, I'd say all we have to do is wait.  The 4100 "hacked" bitcoins are already worth $3.5 million.  The price of bitcoin would have to go up about $269 for this stash to be worth more than $5 million.  If this were a normal stock, I'd say eh, that'll be a while.  But the price of bitcoin has gone up about $170 or so just in the last couple days.

But I think you've got a good point with the rest of what you're saying.  That said, I don't really expect the attorneys to do this case for free.  I remember dwdoc said they do this for 25% - 45%.  I wish that could be clarified a bit, 45% is a rather large chunk out of the stash, but I'd personally happily fork over 25% to the attorneys to be able to have the other 75% back.

Don't get me wrong, I'd much prefer the full 100% back.  But these days, it's looking like a choice between 55% or 75%.  The 45% cut really seems way too high to me, but I think 25% is fairly reasonable.  They'd be making plenty of money here, since that's $1.25 million at ten minutes ago's prices ($971).

This all assumes I can fund my share of the case out of the bitcoins that would be recovered.  If I have to fund them out of pocket, I don't really think it'd be worth the hassle, at least for me.  Might be for others who have more money in Coinlenders, however.

But the price is volatile. We can't guarantee that the price will remain 5million for very long.

You need to think about what outcome you want.  There's little doubt that TF has broken financial services laws and likely taxation laws as well, but generally speaking the penalties for such offences are financial so pursuing that avenue isn't going to help people recover their funds.  

If he's in NSW (which current information suggests), you can start with NSW Fair Trading but that won't go anywhere unless they can contact him - it will, however, document stuff and that could be important down the track.

As far as law enforcement goes, it comes down to whether there's sufficient evidence to prove that a crime (as defined by the Crimes Act) occurred and who would have jurisdiction.  Law enforcement can force Telstra to disgorge information related to the IP (which may or may not prove useful).  Generally speaking, if the crime occurred in NSW then they would have jurisdiction but it can get a bit complicated when federal laws may have also been broken and when events pertaining to the crime may have occurred offshore.  

I'd ask any solicitor you consult the best way to proceed if you intend getting law enforcement to investigate (international investigations always start with reporting stuff to our state police, who then contact the appropriate international law enforcement agencies).  The fact that TF spoke to the SMH about his incident could be helpful as it's publicly locked him into a particular version of events.  Obviously, you need to tell law enforcement that you believe he's lying and that he actually stole the BTC himself or arranged for someone else to do so and that his failure to report the theft supports your suspicion.

You're probably not going to want to hear this, but if you cannot prove fraud or other criminal activity, then there aren't likely to be much in the way of meaningful consequences.  Personal bankruptcy isn't a big particularly deal here, especially if you're young, and it's the most likely outcome of taking civil action against TF (if fraud can be proven, the debt can't be discharged in bankruptcy).  Obviously, a criminal conviction for fraud or theft would have longer term consequences for TF but it wouldn't necessarily help people get their funds back.  I guess a lot depends on whether you're interested in causing him grief in general or only in trying to recover your funds.


That's not the issue.  The big issue is that you'd need a litigation funder for a group action and they typically fund commercial cases, not actions against individuals who likely don't have the capacity to pay an award and who can just declare bankruptcy (or fuck off overseas and not return) at any time.  


It's based on things like the strength of the case, the expenses in mounting it (these would be significant as they'd need considerable expert testimony), the likelihood of a judgement being easily enforced (when you're up against a huge corporation, you KNOW they have the capacity to pay), etc.  Only specialised lawyers are capable of assessing each of those factors.

$1.5 million is a shockingly low pay day for lawyers in a class action, although it's doubtful the case would run for any length of time as TF likely doesn't have the funds to mount a defence.  I think one of your biggest problems is going to be convincing lawyers/litigation funders that they're ever going to see any money - what can they actually seize in order to get their 25 or 40%?

Agreed, you make a lot of good points here.  It sounds like unless we can get someone to fund this lawsuit, it's probably not likely to happen. 

Following balance

gog1:9.80594344

I refused his settlement proposal as I would get only 10% back and consider I deposit those coin post hack, I find that unacceptable.  Does accepting coins post hack be classified as a fraud or not.

Great news, just send you an email.

1.05Btc in CL , still no reply from 3 e-mails.

CL:71.59228854      in

I'm in.

Hopefully we'll be mass PMd?

I'm also in Australia and was going to report this as a crime (with TF being the accused, not the 'other' hacker) to my state police, however after the post above I will wait a couple of days.
If nothing happens I'm going to report my own stolen funds as a crime and see what I can do to put some heat on TF and see if any BTC 'magically' appears.

I'll keep the forum posted anyway.

As TF refused my more than generous settlement offers, decided to stop logging in here, stopped responding to the majority of people, stopped any refunds what so ever despite holding balances of approx 10,000 BTC from coinlenders and a general lack of common sense.

I have reported this to the UK authorities. I was clear on my reasons for reporting it as suspected fraud and would of course much prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt... but there comes a point...

Well you know all this.

Bit sad it has come to all this. You should of just sent an email out like you said you would and offered some transparency TF.

You have had over a month. Time to get coinchat back up and "play" in chatrooms. 10,000 is a serious amount of money and you should have treated this situation more seriously.

Dam my 8grand btc investment would be worth 80k ATM
All the nice things I would have right now
I bet TF has the xbox one. Dam I don't. I bet tf has a Xbox one.. And will get the ps4 tomorrow I'm still playing black ops 2 on my 360... Dam.

We used to talk about Bitcoin at home, we forgot that my 6-year-old daughter could have understood many things.
She knew bitcoin, and bitcoins will help her go to college.
Not long ago she asked me angrily: "Did you lost my college fee?"
Today she told me: "Dont click on the page, you'll lose Bitcoin."

So it is not "a xbox one", for many families, this is their children's school fees, their pensions, their future.

Last night I filed a report to australian federal police expressing my concerns about the dimensions of the incident, TF´s identity, the honesty of TF´s businesses and about the losses for me and other users if finally this is a ponzi scheme (thanks to the ones who helped me doing so).

I used the online form available at

https://forms.afp.gov.au/online_forms/report_a_crime

I also plan to report it to spanish police as soon as I get my home country.

If anybody wants to know what did I write in the form in order to get some suggestions, please PM me.

I strongly recommend you to try to report all this to your local police and or australian federal police.


Right, John. Many big plans are linked to those bitcoins. Some of us hopefully will be able to start again but this is going to be a severe milestone in our lifes... at many aspects

Agree you bradyon.
There are lots of chinese victims.
We are gathering and considering a legal action.

Well, Jonh, I don't want to be a dick or anything, but it's quite known that you shouldn't invest in something, if you can't afford to lose it. A college fund is something you cannot afford to lose.

+1


Well said. The small about of bitcoin I have/had in CL was for mine and my wife's future. Gone in an instant. Makes me sick. I thought I was coming to accept they're gone, but no, all I feel is anger all day, everyday, and especially the way BTC is rising to astronomical levels. Words can't describe how sick I am. I'm sure many/all of you feel the same way.  And on top of that, my wife is ill, can't do much of anything, going to doctors all the time. Could really use some of my lost BTC. And that's the honest to goodness truth.

I, like many of you, have tried to email TF several times, got a couple responses on Nov 7th:

TF said:
"Yes, there's coins left for coinlenders but also assets."

Then when asked about seeing BTC dwindle away from the 1Glados address, he said:
"Yes, GLados is the address used first."

Since then nothing.

I appreciate all the efforts of  Dumbfruit, JohnHarmer, gaston909, and everybody else I didn't mention who's taking serious action. Really hope something good will come of it in the form of at least recovering some of the lost BTC. Although, I can't help but to have my doubts.

Happy Thanksgiving everybody

Oh wow you can report a crime online now...

Keep us updated on how it goes

I think they have to call you if it happened to you
So record what they say

Maybe the more people who do this the more serious it will get..

And all the records will be kept on file...be good for the suit ect

I known.
But ppl had trusted CL and TF so much.
They felt lucky that they found CL.
They thought depositing in CL is most right decision.
They thought their bitcoin is 100% safe.

Well, I can understand why you did it. I think I would have done the same with my own money if I wasn't for the fact that I want to keep my BTC in my own hands. Anyway, I wish you good luck and I hope you can get something or all of it back.

Sorry for that.
Hope your wife get better soon.

And there is a news:
TF said to a china newspaper he will refund 40%-75% to victims with his 1540 btc.
It was publiced in 11/26.
I think it is his another one of his lies.
You can choose told her or not...
here is link:
http://news.ifeng.com/shendu/ndzk/detail_2013_11/26/31574319_0.shtml

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...不过TradeFortress表示，他打算用自己积攒的比特币和没有被盗的比特币来偿还用户的损失。“我现在总共有1540枚比特币，虽然没办法全额赔偿用户损失，但每个人将得到40%到75%不等的赔偿。...
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... But TF said, he will use CL and Inputs's remain and his own to refund. "I have 1540 btc total. ppl could get a refund from 40% to 75%. " ...

Could you translate that article and post it for the English people :p

Also I thought tf lived in Australia
Why do I think this... :s

Reading whole article is unnessary for us.
Most of infomation are known by most ppl.
Except this:

不过TradeFortress表示，他打算用自己积攒的比特币和没有被盗的比特币来偿还用户的损失。“我现在总共有1540枚比特币，虽然没办法全额赔偿用户损失，但每个人将得到40%到75%不等的赔偿。

translate =>

But TF said, he will use CL and Inputs's remain and his own to refund. "I have 1540 btc total. ppl could get a refund from 40% to 75%.

He lives in Sydney, Australia but is originally from Beijing, China

Oh I just translated that article on google it seems old maybe that's what he said at the start when it first got "hacked"?

Oh and thanks mt.dox

Oh and johnhammer dam man I just saw how much you had in CL.

Sorry if m Xbox one dreams upset you

I did have better plans for my investment.. My girlfriend thought I was crazy putting my money into btc I told her it was better then shares and it will be worth lots one day..

I didn't lose as much as a lot if you guys, and I don't know if I can be much help. But I've decided I'm willing to pursue this. I've spent enough time waiting.

Wow, good find! Certainly hope this is true. I can live with a 75% refund.

If he only has 1540 btc no one will be getting 75% refund...

Or maybe the lucky few who email him at the right time...

I think this is very unlikely now. Since this happened I've had faith of at least getting something back. The fact TF hasn't been seen for days says a lot.

Please.... This is a joke the guy is gone and won't be back until his loot runs dry.

A few people have talked to him recently. Progress has been made, TradeFortress finally filed a police report.

Many people settled with him already for a 75%+ loss. That should leave more BTC for those who are patient.

It'd be nice if we got our coins back before or on Bitcoin Friday tomorrow!

Goodluck ace.. that's all I can say.

I admit I shouldn't have trusted TF or CL, I really thought I had done my research... but now it seems as if I found only what I was meant to. As if by design.

No xbox for me, but escalating costs relating to my health. BTC was my shot to pay for the insane expenses of medical woes. I could never have done it with my bank. I was only mm away from achieving it. But that chance has been stolen away.

I feel for anyone and everyone who saw this bringing them a truly brighter future and not just play money.

Im sure there are people very badly affected.

Yeah I saw that, have we seen confirmation?

It would be nice if him to come on here and let us know that Gris still trying to sort things out though.

If you're reading this TF at least let us know your safe and well.  ;D

Can I suggest that those who have coins in coinlenders may want to take screenshots or find other proof of their investments, just in case the site goes dark?

Screenshots do not prove much. They are easy to fake.
#They could be combined with http://www.proofofexistence.com/ but that site hasn't adjusted its fees to the rising bitcoin price and is very expensive now.
And even this would solve only a part of the problem.

I still have a little little hope left, tradefortress will settle this without us going trough legal steps because the sites are still up and show user balances.

About 9 coins at CL, I'm in.

I'm in, 592 BTC, all deposited after the hacking, from Oct.30 to Nov. 3. I don't believe he has spent the money.

I've already taken a screenshot just in case, but you're absolutely right that it's easy to fake.  I could save an HTML file of that page, but if anything, that'd be easier to fake than the screenshot itself.  It's about all I can do though.

I am interested. I tried to send a PM to gaston909 but keep getting the error message "The last posting from your IP was less than 360 seconds ago. Please try again later.", even though I haven't posted anything today.

The website counts a login as a post.

He said the same thing in the Sydney Morning Herald interview but it doesn't really mean much.

http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/security-it/australian-bitcoin-bank-hacked-1m-stolen-20131108-hv2iv.html

An Australian Federal Police spokesman was quoted in the ABC interview.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-08/bitcoin-site-hacked-founder-says/5078148

noted!

Yes, you are right.
some reporter in china just translated a old news, then published it in 11/26.
Sorry for wasting everybody's time.

That makes sense, thanks. I wasn't aware of this.

Is there a place we're aggregating everything we've heard from TradeFortress up until now?

I thought we were being pretty patient, but his one-on-one communication with people is really, really annoying.  Just write something on the Coinlenders page.

I'm in -  419.51475852 - unless I manage to settle with TF, and seeing as there's been no reply in 2 weeks...

It seems the penny has finally dropped.

I have had a large % of depositors coming forward recently, who have realised TF is sitting on many 1000 coins, offering no refunds and absolutely minimal communication. (No Log ins to bitcointalk as well, very odd behaviour for TF)

People will not accept that some people got 100%, and most people got 0%.

Hang in there folks.

I'm still in. 226.17055261 BTC in coinlenders (interest included).

The total interest amount should be around 3 BTC but I'm not sure about that. I tried to contact TF many times telling him that I'd like to get about 7000 EUR worth in BTC and the remaining amount could sit there for maybe more than 6 months... No answer.

I hope we hear something else from him soon. I also suspect we have been victims of some kind of fraud, nevertheless the facts that coinlenders.com is still running and that TF finally reported the hack to the police, make me feel like there is still some hope for us to recover some significant % of our deposits. Some of coinlenders assets may have get a significant reduction, but in the last days asicminer shares increased a bit their value as far as I know.

I hope the police could get TF and he collaborates honestly with them.

At any case, the lawsuit is still an interesting option in my opinion.

This is being a life-changing experience for many of us, let's hope for the best possible solution.

Thanks again for all you guys, Gaston909, Dwdoc, Johnharmer, Mtdox... for your help and collaboration. If I get something of my deposits back, I'll try to show you my gratefulness.

+1

I too will try to show my gratefulness if I'm able to get my BTC back. Thanks again guys, all your efforts are much appreciated.

Any Update?

~1.08 BTC stored at CoinLenders with no responses to emails

10.5 BTC stuck at inputs.io
Count me in.

Is this lawsuit actually still happening?  I read several pages ago in the thread that Australian litigation funders aren't likely to fund this given the circumstances of what happened.  So unless someone finds another law firm willing to take it on either pro bono or contingency (which apparently Australian firms don't do), it doesn't sound the suit's going to happen unless someone wealthy decides to go ahead and fund it. 

I think the general consensus was that we needed a criminal charges to go through before a civil suit.

Some of us informed about the situation to the law enforcement. As I understand, all this process could take quite long to get clear and informing the police, letting them know what we know, will help all us along. Including Tradefortress if he´s honest. For the moment I don´t know if such a young boy is able to do such a big scam. I keep the hope that maybe he has good intentions but somebody else around him could have cheated him. If that´s the case maybe at some point police could catch him and partially solve some of this fiasco.

By the way, TF came to the forums recently. Did anybody receive any further communication from him?

48h in the btc world seem like a whole weekend. ::)

If TF|吴泽岳 didn't stole the 4000 bitcoins.
Then the thief might be a man he trusted.
He could be his classmate, friend, one of his family members who can use his mobile phone.

There is no a "hacker", just a thief.
Maybe two thieves, bcz TF|吴泽岳 had stolen 1000+ bitcoins which deposited by innocent ppl after 10/23.

Just one scammer..

I remember in early October I tried to draw out all my coins and they didn't show up In my inputs account, I waited all day because I remember him saying larger deposits take longer.. Still no coins.. So emailed TF and he had to manually transfer it.. This makes me question the hot pocket because if there was a large amount in there they should of come out automatically..
So maybe there really was another account what held all our coins seeing as our numbers don't match up with the stolen coins..

 

A few of us have contacted Australian Law Enforcement and have been told we need to be an Australian citizen to report a crime there and that we should file a report in our native country.

I have reported this to the Western Australian Police.  I'm not going to post any details yet as I'm waiting for things to develop.
I'll keep you guys informed of any important developments though.

If anyone has reported a crime to their locals authorities (including within Australia) could you PM me the reference numbers and I'll pass them on to the police.

Nice!

EPIC

Thank you!

so that is the real chinese name for TF|吴泽岳

Thank you!

Count me in as well, I have lost BTCs in both Inputs.io and CL.

I will not stop until we find TF

Winning a judgement, and collecting on a judgement are very different things.
The chances of getting a payment when they don't have it is not very good, if all the wealth this guy has is now gone, you aren't going to get anything with a lawsuit other than a loss on the books for you to claim against taxes and a lot of suffering for everyone.

On the other hand, if TF is a thief and took the coins, then you may get them this way.  I just don't think that is the case here.  I think he was just overconfident and now is in over his head.

Disclosure: I have 1.08... on CL

Now we know TF is 吴泽岳.
His brother is 吴乐水 who lives in BeiJing.
In china, We gathered some victims who had been stolen 1400+ bitcoins by TF.
We are ready to report TF and his brother to BeiJing police.
If TF or one of his alias is in china, we will find them.

We need some victims outside china join us, so BeiJing police might make it prime care.
If you live in BeiJing now, there is nothing better!

PM me if you are interested.

I've received a few reference numbers by PM, thanks guys.
All numbers received have been reported to the Western Australian Police.

I am starting to think that Chinese mobsters moving in is the biggest threat to both TF and the remaining coins right now :-/

I spoke with a senior investigator from the SEC yesterday and they will have jurisdiction because CD's may be considered securities and hence fall under their jurisdiction.

TF may have screwed me out of some coins, but he will pay big time for his arrogance and hubris. I hope he enjoys jail.

His identity is now known. He can run, but he cant hide.

*waves*  Fellow American here.  Would it be helpful for someone else to contact the SEC about this? 

Yes, but only if you had CD's. They have limited jurisdiction unless securities are involved. They also share info with other LE folks.

Contact this person
Moustakis, Philip <MOUSTAKISP@sec.gov>

I did, unfortunately.  Tried to take my money out back when TF threw up the "this is a demo, none of it is real" wording, but unfortunately I had already renewed my CD by that point and he was going to charge me 5% of my principal to take my money out.  Which felt a bit ridiculous given that he was changing the rules part way through the term of the CD.  In retrospect, I should have argued more forcefully at that point, but it might not have done any good if I had anyway.

I have contacted him as well 1-2 weeks ago and filed an official complaint on the SEC website. Please do let us know if you hear something back, thanks.

TF is ridiculous and there is more shit on him then Biff Tannen.

Have you guys given up on this already?

NO

Things go slow but we have not surrendered.

What's been going on so far?

I am still in for 10.68 Btc and am with whoever is proceeding with hearings.

No it's in the hands of the police now.  There isn't much else to do but wait from my end.
I am following things up now and again to make sure we're not forgotten but nothing worth updating has happened yet.
These things take time... :/

Thanks, batman, not crabman. Yes, this lack of updates is being difficult for many of us. Nevertheless, do you guys think is possible or reasonable to state a deadline (30, 60 days?) to continue actions?

I have no experience in dealing with these kind of stuff.

I have no idea how long these things usually take, so I'll leave it up to those more experienced :)

I also have a reference number from the WA Police.  If anyone wants it send me a PM.

It's good to know that there is some action taking place at least.

Wondering, how much did TF lost, before he implemented the ID Proof Check.
(the show your face with the id requirement).

Bought/Stolen ID's was used for making bitcoin loans.

I don't think that's relevant, there are legitimate losses and defaults, but most believe that the whole CL thing is just a scam.

newsflash it is a scam.. Do not protect the scammers when it's been proven

The lawsuit is a scam?  What is the proof of this?

Wait. What!?  ???

No directed at the lawsuit that I'm all about .

No more news?  So I guess you can say he got away with it.

Did they give you any kind of timeframe ? Where you able to provide his real identity (I remember some people claiming it was known) ?

I've been trying to email my contact at the WA Police for the last couple of days but haven't received a response.  I forwarded the email to their general email address a while ago so hopefully should get something back tomorrow morning when the office re-opens (it's 6:40 pm here now).
I haven't forgotten about it or been doing nothing, it's just that not much happens over the holiday break for a few weeks plus these things take time as I've said.
I will continue to update with any developments but don't expect them too often.

I've received a response.  The WA Police are waiting on some information on a couple of accounts they believe TF uses.
If it is confirmed TF resides in NSW then the NSW Police will take over the investigation.

Does anyone have any further information on TF's identity such as mobile number, DOB, home address, anything?

It is also possible that BTC may not be seen as a legitimate currency that can be stolen in the eyes of the law, obviously if that happens then we're all screwed :)

Things other than currency may be stolen. In the UK, for example, cars may be stolen, but they are not considered currency.

Judges in The Netherlands decided (at least twice) that virtual items still hold value and thus can be punished the same way as stealing a "real" item. So just sue him in The Netherlands or somehow use those decisions against him.

Great work! and thanks for keeping us updated, lets take him down.

Thanks for the updates. Hadn't seen anything in a while and was wondering if things were still happening.

I've received a couple of PMs.  All information has been forwarded on.

I think when BTC hits 10k USD this particular BTC theft story is going to be one to watch!

I wouldnt say that.

SoL is 5 years in the US for fraud.
http://www.justice.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room/usam/title9/crm00968.htm

But unless you get a collar while they have the money, it doesn't much matter.
If they have BTC, also, not easy to recover any loss.

FYI guys I've still been following up on this.  The police are still waiting for responses from their inquiries (not uncommon apparently, especially when dealing with PayPal) and are relying on interstate and international resources as they don't believe TF resides in this country.
I've been told it's a low priority case and to 'remain patient'.  I'll be contacted if there's any development and will pass the info on.

I hope he doesn't get away with this and is locked up hes probs spending is time on a beach with some sort of alchol and women grining in what a success is scam was.

We have to bring him to justice!

Let's not give up ladies and gentlemen! :/

How could we do it?

Anything going on here with this?

I'm pursuing this through the police.  I'll post updates in the thread below but it's a slow process.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=283756.msg6262872#msg6262872

People are still looking for TF, I bet he is in China now.

didn't he showed up in the forum?

Is this lawsuit actually still happening?  I read several pages ago in the thread that Australian litigation funders aren't likely to fund this given the circumstances of what happened.

Yes he's been logging on here. I personally had ~17BTC in coinlenders and desperate to get some back...

TF has not replied to my email as I want a settlement.
Did anyone get his email the past few weeks?

Anyone has anything to add to this?

TF has been replying, unfavourably, and intermittently, to the emails I have been sending him. The last was received about 3 days ago from his glados account.

I've said it before and I'll say it gain. FUCK TF!  >:(

+1