Bitcoin Forum

Greetings:

I was wondering if current owners of the Antminer S1's would be willing to share their progress as far as getting back the BTC invested (completely ignoring all other costs for now such as electricity, PSU, etc.).

Before I start, I was aware that there was a risk of not getting my full BTC spent but was willing to risk it thinking that if I get close enough (lose as much as a whole BTC) it would still be worth it for the experience of mining and possibly I could mine other Sha-256 coins or sell the hardware for whatever I can get for it.

First Ant:        3.15BTC  -- sushi GB5    Arrived Jan 3, 2014
2nd Ant:         1.90BTC  -- Bitmain website  Arrived Jan 23, 2014

Total BTC cost:                                5.05BTC

Mining result as of Feb 5, 2014:     2.315BTC

Remaining BTC to full ROI:            2.735BTC


A couple of things to note:

• 1.  I'm doing better than Jan 3 status -- Ant S1 (Qty=1),  3.15BTC cost,  est. daily earnings .068BTC versus now -- Ant S1 (Qty=2), 2.735BTC cost, est. daily earnings .0777BTC
• 2.  I'm doing better than the next announced price/shipment of Ant S1 -- Feb 8 ship date, Ant S1 (Qty=2), 2.90BTC cost  versus -- now, Ant S1 (Qty=2), 2.735BTC cost

Attached image below doesn't include the first 2 days result as I was hopping mining pools trying to find a good one which yielded .12BTC  and  also  15 hours of Unobtanium coin mining yielding .045BTC worth of Uno's

https://i.imgur.com/8c72AAY.png

I haven't kept a sheet of my S1's. Mostly because I sell them (way) before they make their money back.
However, most ROI calculations I made came out around 60-90 days per miner. This amount kept being the result of all recent pricedrops and diff increases. I think that's what makes Bitmain a great supplier. Fast hardware, available hardware, and realistic prices which drop every few weeks to reflect the situation (=difficulty)

Also, if you don't calculate power costs, any miner will make it's investment back, it's just a matter of how patient you are. If you do calculate power costs, a miner will keep earning money until the moment the power costs are higher than the earnings. This last situation highly depends on BTC value of course.
Oh and of course it matters if you OC your ant. If you do, your power usage will go up but the extra speed will make you more money than it will cost you in power.

Thank you for the feedback.  It looks like your estimate of 60-90 days is about right.  I'm 30 days into it now (from the 1st purchase).  I don't think I'll be adding a 3rd Ant, but it can get tempting if price hits 1BTC.  I do have a limit on the electrical circuit as I live in an apt and I don't know what else is on this particular circuit.  I could possibly add another Ant, but that is it!   :D

Yeah S1's for 1BTC would be cool, also psychologically (spelling?) it would be a great deal. I think we'll see another pricedrop first before it hits 1BTC though, maybe something like 1.2

Super post dude!
Thanks.
When the facts speak goods keep silent!!!!
Thank you
The only thing that matters is when you got the miners and what you have paid for them OC and other stuff is irrelevant here!
In general it turns out that no matter how low the price looks like we are struggling for ROI. Some folks did not liked my posts in other ants threads and call me a troll because of them. I am wandering if anyone of them will DARE to comment?

And hows the ROI on your Hex8A1?

http://btcinvest.net/en/bitcoin-mining-profit-calculator.php?diff=2621404453&dcosts=500&diff_mincrease=25&blpbtc=25&dhsmhs=260000&diff_mincreasedecrease=3&btcusd=826.90&dpowcon=30&btcusd_mincrease=1&pcost=0.25&calcweeks=32&dleadtime=0&action=calc

You can read the numbers right?

i would say so/so but the main difference between my board and ants is that:

1. ant has own chips which do cost cents in quantities. And belive me he made a lot of them.
2. ants have premined well for the last mounts at lest four mounts profit

My hexA has 8 chips 100 USD each again because Chinese brothers want 100xmargin from their initial investment ;D
My hexA is from first run, which means that most of dev costs are calculated in the price i've paid. At the end both ants and technobit do deserve profit for their hard work (no irony), do not they?

I am leaving conclusions to you ;D

The price is wrong in your calculator they cost. $2000 not $500

http://technobit.eu/index.php?id_product=61&controller=product&id_lang=1
1499 € = 2000$

Plus something else is messed up in that calculator there is no way you can make 0.5BTC per day on 260ghs you need 2.6THS to reach that sort of return today

This is more realistic:
http://btcinvest.net/bitcoin-mining-profit-calculator-v1.php?diff=2621404453&dcosts=2000&diff_mincrease=20&blpbtc=25&dhsmhs=26000&btcusd_mincrease=0&btcusd=826.90&dpowcon=300&dleadtime=0&pcost=0.25&calcweeks=32&action=calc

The rest of your arguments are irrelevant as the same points apply to both manufacturers.

It is not per day it is per diff jump estimation. And yes USD is wrong for sure. The roi for me is BTC roi only. I am not the flat/BTC or if type roi
Like a resume: I have almost equal chances to reach roj like Ants customers (if i ever reach it). The point is if you got my comments not the calculator figures itself. And if you understand why i am not happy of the ants price no matter how good it looks like.
But when we want a new toy we have to buy it for somewhere. Everyone is free to decide from where and how much to pay

Guys, you're hijacking the OP's thread as the focus is now on the HEX8A1 and not the S1's

I am stopping...please excuse me... i have just reply to the questions asked Sorry

OP if on 400GH/s you are only doing  BTC.077 you might consider switching pools
Im @ 240GH/s and hit  BTC.052-.053 per day on Ghash.io  + that's not including the NMC + IXC + DVC that are mined also with the BTC

My GUESS with 2 Ants you should be somewhere around BTC.087-.09 a day depending on luck?

i'm on 0.08+ with two ants from yesterday diff . until this was 0.1 per day . i'm using load balance with low variance

When the Ant was 1.9BTC for 180-200GH it was comparable to Hex8A1 260GH @ €1500 based on $/GH I remember doing the math before I purchased the Hex8A1. When the Ant dropped to 1.45BTC it became the better deal, not done the math on the new €1250 Hex8A1 price though.

I was hoping the Hex8A1 would be 1GH/1W, that's the main reason I chose it over the Ant, but it doesn't look like it's going to be any more power efficient than the Ant miner. Not at 260GH anyway. With hindsight the Ant was a better deal because it would arrive faster. :(

Only HashFast and KnC have come close to 1GH/1W at 28nm! Bitmine and CoinTerra chips seem to be way out on GH/W.

I bought units at various price points.

1.2TH, total paid: ~19BTC

Total mined: ~12BTC  

That's with a few days of downtime.

Rough estimates have the S1 farm paid off within the next month...  So probably two months.

Good point!  I'm not getting .0777, that's just the estimate and I was comparing to the estimate from Jan 3 to be apples to apples.

I'm eyeballing it and it "feels" like I'm getting over .1BTC  Eligius also does NMC merged mining at 105%, but no other coins.  I can do an average of the last 3 days, but there was a change in diff so it would skew my calc.

When I was doing my research the first 2 days, ghash was 1 of the 2 pools I tried and it didn't match the returns on Eligius.  A lot of payouts, but smaller than overall.  jmo...

Cool!  It matches what I'm seeing.  One thing I didn't compare is if I'm "better" than the 1 time frame that I didn't list which is if I bought both units on the 2nd timeline and arrived Jan 23.  My guess is about the same.  I'm happy that I'm better than 2 timelines clearly visible.

1 ant delivered on 6. Dec paid 4.5 btc. Mined till now 4.35 btc.

Woo Hoo!  Thank you.  Very encouraging information!

It is possible to get full ROI on bitcoin mining with the right device and BTC cost!

Absolutely it is.  Key point #1: Stay far far away from pre-orders.

+1

2 Ants purchased around the middle of Jan 2014...

Total Price: 4.9BTC
Total Earned: 2.6BTC

Looking good :)

I almost brake even btc wise. In usd terms not so much. At time of the purchase btc was 1100$. However i hold btc and wont sell them at lower.
Iam sutisfied though.

The S1 is by far the best device you can buy right now and have delivered in a few days. Everything else is either 4+ months delivery date from now... OR 4+ months PAST expected delivery date

I am ball-parking here, but most of my antminer's are well on track for profit.

Antminer #1: 4.75BTC batch - returned approximately 4.3BTC and then sold for roughly 160% the cost of ordering a new one in the 1.9BTC batch (minus ~0.5BTC) for lost mining time) = ~4.8 BTC total plus funded antminer #6 that has been mining for about 10 days
Antminer #2: 4.25BTC batch - returned approximately 4.0BTC and then sold for roughly 160% the cost of ordering a new one in the 1.9BTC batch (minus ~0.5BTC) for lost mining time) = ~4.4 BTC total plus funded antminer #7 that has been mining for about 10 days
Antminers #3&4 : bought in the 3.15BTC batch IIRC, returned a significant portion and then sold the same way as those above to buy Antminers #8&9

Antminer #5 : bought at 2.2BTC and well on track to return a profit - I would ballpark that it has mined almost 1BTC already
Antminers #6+7 : bought at 1.9BTC, arrived ~24th and have mined at least 0.5BTC each
Antminers #8+9 : bought at 1.9BTC, arrived ~27th and have mined at least 0.33BTC each
Antminers #10+11 : bought at 1.9BTC, arrived ~28th and have mined at least 0.3BTC each

Basically the first 2 antminer purchases almost entirely funded 6/7 of my current antminers I have in place, and also ~$1500 cash to balance out my investments


In my mind, the current 1.45BTC batch may be a little bit too pricy if it does not ship until the 8th and arrive the ~12th. ordering now guarantees an added 3-5 days before they ship the *presumably sizable* list of orders placed during CNY, and that may not be enough time to break much if any profit from the systems.

A 1.1BTC unit that ships on the 20th would be a good deal IMO

my sucksess story  :-\:
1st paid December 12, shipped December 17, started mining at sushi hosting location on December 24 -- 4.25btc (runs default ~178ghs)
2nd paid December 26, shipped December 30, started mining at my home on January 10 (NY holidays suck) -- 3.15btc (runs OCed ~204ghs)
2nd paid January 10, shipped January 14, started mining at my home on February 3 (Customs suck) -- 2.4btc (runs OCed ~194ghs)
Total: 9.8btc

mined: 3.45btc at Eligius, 0,3btc at btcguild. Total 3.75

My sentiments exactly.  I'm holding off until the aftermath of CNY has subsided.

~3 BTC mined so far

ROI'd 3 times and paid nex college semester
by selling these on the bay before every price drop
then bought new ones and repeat. had 8 Ants so far

I'm so scared to sell them on ebay as they might put a claim after 20 or 30 days that it's not as described or it's defective.

Even up to 7 days, they might claim it's defective and they mined for free on those 7 days.  But you don't have any problems so maybe I should give it a try.  I don't even mind selling for

Awesome method you have and seem to be the best for getting the most returns (profits).

Best buy ever.

dont know how its in the states, but here in germany you dont give warranty on used items as private seller

Nice.  I can put on the listing that there's no warranty/refunds but it's difficult sometimes especially if the buyer has fraudulent intentions and will try to take advantage of buyer protection from ebay or PayPal.  Thank you for the idea, though and it really helps in having the best chances for getting full ROI from the Ant's.

Pretty awesome calculations on this thread and are in-line with my experience wrt Antminer S1's.

If I ever see a need to respond to one of the myths that are being perpetually spread such as:

• 1.  Bitcoin miners can't/don't do math
• 2.  There is no chance of getting roi on bitcoin mining
• 3.  There is no hardware out there that can get roi because difficulty is too high

I can just point to this thread....  I probably should have posted this topic on the Mining Speculation section, but you guys providing the data are here, though  :)

I do agree that 1.45BTC with an estimated date of arrival of at best 2/12/2014 would be much too high for me.  My cost-basis for existing 2 Ant's on that date will be around .9BTC.

here if someone claims "not received" you just need to provide shipping proof to win the case
but dunno how its is with "received different item", or even if thats possible, never had this though

Why do you even need point naysayers to this thread? Let them believe what they will. If they are too chicken shit to mine, the better for us.

For myself the proof is in the pudding, and I am not too keen on sharing it with skeptics.

You're right!  Thanks for setting me straight.  It will be like doing research for them and making it easier for them.  The demand for Antminer S1 does help us, when we need to resell our equipment.  I don't mind selling for cheap to give the next buyer a chance to roi...  In a few weeks, I might do that.

I got scammed by an Ebay buyer that same way.
As soon as he got the item, he messaged me that it does not look "new" and that he's thinking of filing a case with Ebay for a refund, but is not decided yet.
At that moment I knew he is planning to use it, keep the BTC mined and return it at some point.
Anyway, I immediately replied that I accept and will refund him.
I did not hear from him for 5 days, until all of a sudden he filed a case for "item not as described" , now he says one blade is not working, on top of this.
He again demanded refund, but since I'm short of funds now, this time I proposed a replacement and mailed him a prepaid Fedex label.
He was stalling with stupid excuses for a few days, until finally he shipped it back.
I am yet to receive the miner and I'm really hoping it can be repaired.

So, to all selling miners on Ebay - beware !!!

When you think of it,  it's the perfect scam.
Buy any ASIC , use it, profit , then just before the 45 days mark, open a case.
Paypal will take your side and force the seller to refund, because of the "buyer protection".
There is no "seller protection", btw.
I cancelled all my auctions on Ebay since, took a loss for the fees of course.
But I'm never selling a bitcoin miner on Ebay, if anything.

Very sorry to hear of your bad ebay experience.  Thank you for sharing and warning US ebay sellers.

I've been keeping tracking of mine by using a separate address for each batch on Eligius. These stats include paid and unpaid shares up to 6pm GMT Feb 07. They do not include shelved shares (approx 3%) that could be paid out in the future, or NMC paid out (which pays about half the electricity cost).

First Order: 2.2BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.4BTC), placed Jan 11th. Earned 0.92195611BTC, remaining 1.27804389BTC
Second Order: 2.0BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.2BTC), placed Jan 15th. Earned 0.734062416BTC, remaining 1.265937584BTC
Third Order: 1.9BTC, placed Jan 19th. Earned 0.591175885BTC, remaining 1.308824115BTC

Additional costs are $20/unit for power supplies, $10/unit for brokerage/tax, $15/unit for power distribution (networked PDU and 30A 240V outlet/breaker), and let's say $5/unit for networking gear.

As I said, about 1/2 the power costs are covered by the merged mined NMC, but that could quickly change.
I am still estimating them all reaching break even by the end of March.

I'm running 3 Antminers.  They are averaging anywhere between .12 to .15 per day.  I would have to look at the dates to see when i received them, but they have purchased a 4th one.  On the 3 machines, I've spent 7.5btc.  I've mined a total of 2.3btc.  Should be pay for it's self in 2 1/2 months.  I have them spread out over 2 pools.

here in germany we have seller protection
but it seems to protect only against chargeback fraud and not-received claims

paypal mostly takes buyer position even if its unjust. and the seller pays fees for that. shit system

I thought I'd update this, since according to the other threads residents of Canada are receiving their late Jan - early Feb orders at 1.45BTC today and it's a nice comparison of ordering earlier vs waiting to order after the 1.45 price drop. It's measured to about 9pm GMT on Feb 12th.

First Order: 2.2BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.4BTC), placed Jan 11th. Earned 1.09321419BTC, remaining 1.10678581BTC
Second Order: 2.0BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.2BTC), placed Jan 15th. Earned 0.906989094BTC, remaining 1.093010906BTC
Third Order: 1.9BTC, placed Jan 19th. Earned 0.76658842BTC, remaining 1.13341158BTC

Note that luck at Eligius has been pretty poor since I started, and I'm at ~95-96% PPS with about 0.05BTC in shelved shares per unit that may or may not be paid out.
Even with the poor luck, the earlier purchases have less to pay off than the 1.45 from units ordered after the 28th and shipped Feb 8th-10th.

Help me if I'm doing it wrong, but at current low BTC price it will take over one year with a slightly overclocked Antminer to get back the BTC I have to pay to get one.

I live in Germany. I have the option to buy one for 1499 Euros at Amazon or 1699 Euro (ebay) or equivalent in BTC if I want one in the next few days and don't want to pay and wait extra for customs.

At 500 Euros per BTC at Bitcoin.de (optimistic to actually get 500 right now) the miner would cost roughly 3 Bitcoins. When I run mining calculations at btcinvest.net and take a conservative view, use 420 Watts of power overclocked, expect a 20% jump each diff adjustment, take 5% price increase of BTC/USD per jump it will take til summer to ROI in USD value and over a year to ROI in BTC. I'm much better off buying more bitcoins at a bargain for 500 Euros, am I not?

Of course you are!
I have written a lot in his tread especially about roi but I was blamed to be a trol.
As I told many times we are forced to choose the better from the worst deals around. An the only thing left is to struggle for roi. Ants is the best deal but there is plenty of room for price reduction. And it will never make roi.it is obvious that he can not scale with installation so I wish him to keep his chips in a safe place ;D away from mining :D
The big issue is that regular business is making 20-30% profit, but all chip suppliers want at least 50-100 times profit for their chip. I have had enough with nre cost bulshit. Let them keep their chips and their miner. For instance with imaginary cost of 0.5 btc there will be a plenty of room for manufacturer profit which he deserves and some hope for us to make a bug but that is what is called greed

Don't mix your purchase price methods.  If your purchase price is fiat, stay fiat.  If it's btc, it's btc.

Last price for the miner is 1.45btc, but it's currently sold out.  That is what you have to earn back.  My 2 miners cost me a total of 5.05btc, and I've earned over 3btc so far, so I have less than 2 btc's left to earn which I estimate will be less than 25 days, regardless of what btc/fiat is.

If your purchase price is fiat  1499 Euros, that is what you have to earn back.  It the miner makes 1 btc in 30 days and 1 btc is worth 1499 Euros, did you make ROI?  yes you did because your purchase price is 1499 Euro's.


Then you start mixing purchase of btc's.  Yes, you can buy 3 btc's right now.  That is a totally unrelated investment same as buying twitter stock.  If you purchase 3 btc's right now and in 30 days same as above btc goes up, woo hoo.  But what if btc goes to 200 Euro's in 30 days?  See?  unrelated investments.  Just like if I say twitter stock goes up in 30 days and you could have purchased x amount of twitter with your 1499 Euros.

This. I have two of the 4.25 S1's about to go +ROI, and some later ones that will probably get there as well.

I had 4 @ 4.25BTC. They mined 14.5BTC up to first week of February and then I sold them and the power supplies on eBay.

My army of 17 Antminers bought in 4 batches over the course of December/January have paid off for sure, considering I won one in an raffle. Thank you again sushi, #1 most reliable shipper I've met on this forum. Buying 4-5 at a time certainly made ROI easier to match with difficulty changes, but even now at their current price and their very power hungry nature, hard to justify buying anything right now that ships more than a month away, thats more efficient in terms of wattage/Gh/s, with many new faces in the industry now with actual working products. This time, last year it was literally just 2-3, now we have over a dozen, and more on the way so I hope this allows the prices to drop as a result.

For ROI, about 3-4 months invest will back

Just thought I'd update and say that my S1 units have finally reached a complete BTC->BTC ROI.  It took a couple of weeks longer than projected due to poor luck at BTCGuild, but otherwise it's all gravy from here on out.

using antiminer s1, everyday about  0.01-0.02 BTC

First Order: 2.2BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.4BTC), placed Jan 11th. Earned 2.21205773BTC
Second Order: 2.0BTC (coupon adjusted from 2.2BTC), placed Jan 15th. Earned 2.026430436BTC
Third Order: 1.9BTC, placed Jan 19th. Earned 1.903669895BTC

This doesn't include a small amount earned on backup pools, as well as an average of 0.163BTC per unit in unpaid shares at Eligius. It also doesn't count merged mined namecoins. Since mid January each unit has used ~672kWh of electricity, with a cost of ~$80 or 0.138BTC at current rates.
Breakeven reached after ~70 days.

Is this mining BTC straight up or on a multipool? it seems there are plenty of sha 256 coins that are more profitable than bitcoin it seems.

I think I misplaced a decimal point calculating things going into this mining project :)
I'm showing .012 to .015 BTC per day is that normal?

Thank you

Non overclocked S1 should be about 0.018 right now

I am doing something wrong then?
I just setup on ghash.io
Stratus difficulty was at 512, I just changed to 256 today maybe that will make a difference?
Thank you

How are you calculating your daily return?

Even with ghash.io being one of the largest pools they still have daily variance in payouts and I think they also don't pay out at the same time each day.

As it happens I have exactly one S1 on ghash.io (set to autopay daily) and the most recent payouts are:

0.0153
0.0212
0.0155
0.0240

As you can see there is quite a difference.

Of course the buyer pay the fee for everything like ebay fee, paypal fee or postage. A simple calculation.

Thank you for the reference
I have not done a payout yet, and am coming up on my first week of mining there.  I merely take the BTC balance and divide by the number of days.  Doing that I am at 0.015.  I see your average is .019.  I feel I am leaving .004 - .005 on on the table every day, and can't figure out how.  My worker one day stats average is always above 200, currently it is 200.24 Gh/s

Do I have to tell it to not to namecoin or other things in my setup somewhere?
Is my difficulty set to 256 proper?  I was getting the same results at 512.

Thank you

Try BTCGuild.  I mined at ghash for about 1 day and wasn't happy with the results.  This was a while back, though, around beginning of January...