Bitcoin Forum

Hello I have come across this pool and it seem like it should have far more power considering what it is.

http://manicminer.in

This is a merge mining scrypt pool.

At the moment you can mine 9 different coins at the same time, but here is a little breakdown of how it works.

The pool has 2 types of coins.

Coins they consider main chains, and coins they consider secondary chains.

This is how they explain it on their website.


Real power for 1Mhs
Coin    Power
DOGE    333 Khs
LTC    166 Khs
DGC    166 Khs
42    166 Khs
CAT    166 Khs
HUC    1 Mhs
ORG    1 Mhs
PTC    1 Mhs
USC    1 Mhs

As you can see your hash power will be split up between the main coins, but you will put forth full power at the other chains. BUT what is even better is you do not need to mine every coin.

Say you normally mine Doge coin. You can choose not to mine the other main chain coins if you would like so it would be more like this.

DOGE  1 Mhs
HUC    1 Mhs
ORG    1 Mhs
PTC    1 Mhs
USC    1 Mhs


How to Start.

1. Sign up at manicminer.in
2. Click on "Your Account" in the top left and click your username from the dropdown.
3. Enter your addresses for the coins you would like to mine. I suggest making an address for all the secondary coins. As for main coins I would only put the coins you would like to mine as your hash is split up between the main coins.
4. Add your workers on the same page as you added the coins.
5. Click "Info" on the left side and click "Instructions"
6. This will tell you the URL and credentials to use for your miner.


Main coins
Litecoin
Dogecoin
Digitalcoin
42coin
Catcoin


Secondary Coins - Full power all the time
Huntercoin
United Scrypt Coin
Orgcoin
Pesetacoin


So if you are a person who normally mines litecoin, dogecoin, digitalcoin, catcoin, or 42 coin then this is a no brainer to use this pool.
You basically will get up to 4 times your hash power.


SOOOOOO,

Lets promote this pool guys and gals. Scrypt merge mining is power saving and more profitable than normal mining.


ANNNNND

It uses p2pool for many of the coins so you do not need to worry about giant pool hashrates messing with the network.

Happy mining.

http://manicminer.in

How is this possible?

Can anyone explain how this works?

It sounds a little too good to be true and you know what they say about that.

Well if I understand correctly. The hashes that are being created by your miner to solve a block for say the LTC chain, may also solve a block for one of the secondary blockchains because the chains are compatible.

This is my very simple understanding of it.

I'm just a noob but that don't sound right, I thought a block contained transactions, if that's right, how can it be compatible with other chains ?

Okay thanks. I will experiment on this with one of my rigs tonight.  I'm still a bit confused though.  

Huntercoin should be on top of the list of main chains. Its a coin that is grossly undervalued and I don't understand why.

Can you better explain how this pool works?

heres a bit more information https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Merged_mining_specification


I currently have a rig pointed at them for DOGE and LTC and all secondary except ORG I am working on compiling an org wallet since that is what the pool is mostly finding since the network hash of the other coins is relatively high.

If we can get more people on this pool it is by far the best way to mine, much more efficient when your incorrect hashes can be correct on another chain. :)

The pool allocated a percentage of your hash power at the main coins you have chosen. At the same time the secondary coins get your full hash power as well. Check the chart.

Real power for 1Mhs
Coin    Power
DOGE    333 Khs
LTC    166 Khs
DGC    166 Khs
42    166 Khs
CAT    166 Khs
HUC    1 Mhs
ORG    1 Mhs
PTC    1 Mhs
USC    1 Mhs

Thanks for the info.  I will be joining you soon.

How do you set it to mine just one coin, and then the others by default?

You don't, they have a set distribution according to their site.

I'm trying it out but seeing 70% rejects....I average <1% on wafflepool.

The rejected rate and accepted is totally false. I have read somewhere else which I will find for you but because of the way it works by checking muliple blockchains those numbers are not right.


To mine a coin you must first add your address so it knows where to pay. To not mine a coin simply do not add that address.

So if you would like to mine only doge and then the 4 secondary coins, then only add those wallet address.

Hope this helps :)

I have also read that you can stop the rejects by raising your workers difficulty. Give that a try. I am as we speak.

I have found where I read the part about rejects https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=16039.0

Are you 100% sure?

Excerpt from the documentation (  http://manicminer.in/docs/mining (http://manicminer.in/docs/mining) ):

Mining power is automatically balanced between main chain coins, in order to maximize the probability of finding also a valid share for secondary coins and complete a block as soon as possible.

Bear in mind that your power will only be divided among main chain coins, but it will be full for all secondary ones.

At the moment, we are allocating more more power to DogeCoin because it is more profitable. This could change in the future, because the pool will adapt its strategy to get maximum rewards for our miners.

You don't need to do anything, no coin choice, your power will be allocated automatically. Just make sure you get wallets for each coin in order to receive your rewards.


It is not clear. My interpretation of the doc is that you have no choice of the hashing power repartition, and you simply do not get paid for the hashing you provided for a coin when its wallet is not setup.


Can someone from ManicMiner confirm? (their forum is 404)

Here is some more info

http://www.reddit.com/r/dogemining/comments/1yyske/merged_scrypt_mining_is_here/

Still waiting to confirm your question about choosing a single main coin.

That's not true, you just don't get those coins. There is no choosing coins.

Source on this? This is my reason for not mining. I don't want to mine the other coins, but I'm not going to let them just go down the drain.

This looks interesting so I wrote about it over on CryptoCoinsNews. (http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2014/03/04/guide-simultaneously-mining-5-scrypt-coins-full-hashpower/)

If someone from ManicMiner is reading this, please contact me via PM. I'd like to ask you some questions.

Awsome, I am awaiting a response from some Devs myself for some more clarification, hopefully the article will help.

I am not sure myself, it is quite hard to figure out proper stats for some of these large coins without a larger hashrate. I can confirm that I had my doge and LTC with all the others, except org because I cannot compile it :(, and I was getting DOGE, LTC, and PTC.
I read USC has most blocks being found at f2pool now because our hashrate is low.

And what's the deal with Potcoin, I see the wallet is selectable but don't find other info on it?

Did anyone check if this actually works?

Im in, but very strange.. 40%rejected, cant see shit about what am i mining... bad developing or scam, you decide!

Giving it a whirl for 24 hours with 40MH/s. Not like there are huge profits anywhere else that I'm missing out on! So far I have a pile of ORG, a few PTC, and a single lonely HUC.

I started with all brand new wallet addresses, so I'll update after 24 hours (approx. midday EST tomorrow, 3/5/2014) with some initial results.

I contacted the developers:



Question: So is it possible to invest all of my hashrate to doge and not lose any of my hashrate to the other coins?


Answer: No, sorry, this is a merged mining pool, but please, see the power-sharing table and say to me if you can think you are really loosing something.

http://en.manicminer.in/docs/mining

And check the values of these coins, specially 42 and PesetaCoin, at the exchanges like cryptorush or cryptsy.
Remember, the secondary chain coins fall to you FOR FREE, we take the right shares from the main chain ones and use it directly, no power user on it.

i´m looking foward to your answer.. this whole thing is a kind of mysterious^^

Indeed it is. 1.5 hours in and it looks like I'll also have some DOGE, 42, and USC to add into the mix, although USC isn't traded anywhere that I can see. A couple of initial thoughts:

1) It would be good to have a wider selection of primary coins that the pool can switch between based on profitability.

2) Auto-exchange to BTC would be nice as it's a pain keeping track of 9 different wallets plus the various exchanges that are needed to accommodate the coins.

So I guess I want something like Wafflepool or CleverMining but with merged mining. Shouldn't take more than a few minutes for someone to set up  :D

I did 1.4 mh/s for 16 hours so far and have this

Currency   Balance
42   0.00000297
DOGE   919.9153608
CAT   0
LTC   0.0061456
DGC   1.12782264
HUC   0
PTC   15.16324673
ORG   3291
USC   2.68625245


I'm not sure how much time it was on my backup pools but they show activity so I must have had trouble connecting to manicminer at some point.

16 hours of mining on a 2.4 rig and i would have 6500 doge. I don't think this is worth it.

I make that about 0.00279 BTC in 16 hours, so extrapolate out to 24 hours = 0.004185 BTC for 1.4 MH/s = roughly 0.003 BTC per MH/s per day. That's around 1/3rd of what Wafflepool or Clevermining would return  :(

Edited to add: that calculation is slightly unfair as it doesn't account for pool downtime. So far I've seen a lot of up/down in CGMiner. There's also a good chance that profitability would increase considerably with a higher total hashrate to throw at the higher difficulty coins.

Ended the experiment after 4 hours or so. Pool is unfortunately down as often as it's up, and as much as I love a good experiment I can't have my rigs losing mining time constantly. Even with a backup pool configured there's still way too much lost time and work.

Also it looks as though the merge-mined coins (HUC, ORG, PTC, USC) are essentially worth what you pay to mine them e.g. 0.00000006 BTC for ORG and USC doesn't even have an exchange.

Nice idea that will maybe mature into something worthwhile one day.

I'm trying it too... but seems too shady (no way to visualize proper stats) and nor profitable  :'(

This isn't how merged mining works. Coins need to patched (and therefore hardforked) for them to be merge mineable.

Namecoin example: https://github.com/namecoin/namecoin/blob/namecoinq/src/auxpow.cpp

Whatever is going on here, it certainly isn't merged mining.

They aren't claiming that DGC, DOGE, LTC, or any of the "main" coins are merged. Only HUC, ORG, PTC, and USC are claimed as merged. USC and HUC at least are designed to be merge-mined. Don't know about the others without looking.

Nevertheless, this looks very scammy.

72 hours' test (which should be enough to sort out variance even if this is running p2pool underneath) at ~50Kh/s yielded:

DGC   0.34859148 vs ~5 elsewhere
DOGE   60.78225803 vs ~650    
LTC   0.00426753   vs ~0.04    
42   0.00000050   vs ???
CAT   0.03166796   vs 1
HUC   0 vs ???
PTC   0.94306607 vs ???   
ORG   0 vs ???   
POT   0 vs ???
USC   0.09437904 vs ???

The total of all that is about 0.00013645 BTC per day total for all coins and being very generous about a guesstimate at the value of USC.

That's about 9¢ per day for 50Kh/s. Coinwarz says 50Kh/s would yield 11¢/day on Catcoin, 32¢/day for 42, 22¢/day for LTC, 27¢/day for DOGE, or 14¢/day for DGC.

Bottom line: you'll get more value out of straight-up mining Catcoin, the worst performer of the bunch.

Maybe not a scam, maybe just incompetent.

I lost about 70¢ running this test. Hopefully it will save others the time of repeating the mistake with real hashpower.

I don't see Orgcoin on manicminer.in but I remember them announcing over in our forums and I see some folks here saying they're getting some.

It looks like ManicMiner is using p2pool, if that's the case you need the following settings or you're going to see a lot of wasted/rejected hashes.

expiry=10, scantime=9 queuesize=0

If you still see > 10% rejects then turn your intensity down a bit.
Orgcoin has a 10 second block time, having your expiry higher than that means you're totally wasting hash power.
Also I'm not sure about mining USC & Org together they use the same pch message header and that could be confusing things.
In the next major release of Orgcoin that will be fixed, but we never expected to be merge mined with other merge mineable coins.

If you want a quick run down on how merge mining works look at namecoin or devcoin both of which are regularly merge mined with bitcoin.
To put it in it's simplest terms the mergemined coin is setup to accept the parent coins PoW as its own.  This is especially acceptable in instances where the child coin is quiet (not a lot of transactions going on). And it helps to make the coin far more resilient against 51% attacks since the child coin effectively gets the hashing power of the parent to protect it.

Right now at the time of this writing Orgcoin is trading for 200 satoshi on cryptorush.  We've never pumped this coin.  All promotion has been limited to 1 posting here and 1 over at cryptocointalk. 

We have some pretty lofty goals, and 100% of all profits each month are given to the charity, non-profit or good cause selected by our members.  Please see www.orgcoin.org for more details.  If you have any questions please feel free to hop in irc.freenode.net /join #orgcoin

Thanks everyone for the interest!

I read that a lot here and it makes no sense. The market determines the price, and dictates what a coin is worth.

wow actually a interesting post in this forum.

thanks!

Exactly.  Im not sure if the dev is scamming or an idiot.  This is grossly inefficient.    Actually a net loss trying to mine too many coins at the same time.  Merge mining sucks, and ruined a lot a good sha256 coins.

Orgcoin has a windows wallet now.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=415705.msg5560738#msg5560738

+1

Looks like the site is charging 2 transaction fees to withdraw your coins. One the site keeps, on top of the transaction fee the coin charges.

Very interesting. Any long term users of this pool can post reviews?

Yeah, I have been using this pool for about a month, I really don't know what is so damn hard for people to understand. The guy that compares how much he got vs solo mining the coin is missing the entire point, of course you'd get more of the main-chain coins just solo mining. Your hash is split up over the main coins, like litebar only gets 2% of total hash power. The sec-chain coins like USC get 100%.

And there is no way to 'choose' a main coin, you mine them all, whether a wallet is configured or not, I would like it to have normal hash-power per coin and stuff like that but it does have a block list for all the coins (except LEAF for some reason.... I guess they haven't gotten around to adding it to the site yet). At only 380kH/s I am getting around 0.0047 btc a day, when I was solo mining DOGE I was getting about 0.0035 btc a day. So overall I am making more money than I was solo mining coins.

Sometimes it will take a very long time to get paid, like DOGE for example, I don't really know why this is but I only get paid any doge every 3-4 days, but its everything that I should have been paid throughout that time. And SPH and BUR have been set to only payout 2x per day do to too many transactions too quickly slowing up payment processing all around. The rejects have been taken care of by new code on the server side, I know get 0% rejects all around. You also get better hashrates from using the cgminer-3.7.2 by kalroth with the xIntensity settings, using this allowed me to set the gpu-threads to 2, cut the thread-concurrency to half, and increase my 350-80 kH/s to 380-420kH/s. So even if you don't use manicminer, I'd still suggest using the kalroth cgminer version for any coin, you'll get more power and there seems to be less load on the system and my card is actually 1C cooler than with just 1 thread and double the thread-concurrency.

This site is  not perfect by a long shot but I do like it, and the support is very responsive, I have emailed them several times with either problems or questions and they usually respond within a day unless it requires them to really dig into the logs.

I can say that I personally doubt that this is a scam, I seem to be getting paid what I should get paid based on the percentage of hash power that is suppose to be on each coin. If you look at it like all coins somehow get the same amount of hash then obviously you will think something is wrong because you can't understand what is actually going on. It's actually kind of sad to read all these posts by people whom I'd assume would actually know something about how cryptocoins works, but its a bunch of ignorance slapped about like gospel.

Sure the BUR, ORG, USC, FSC, are either not on an exchange or exchange for only 1 satoshi but that doesn't mean that they will -never- be on an exchange and will only ever be 1 satoshi, why not take the free coins? And LEAF is already on cryptsy, the price has bounced between 1 and 3 satoshi but doesn't mean it will always be that...

If you don't like the idea for whatever reason then you don't have to use the pool but tell people its a scam just because you can't do the math correctly is a pretty shitty move in book.

cany one comment on recent average payouts per/mh for this pool?

as stated earlier you can getting more or less a quarter more out as litecoin mining thanks to TOTAL merged mining. In no way 4xtimes more, keep in mind.

I just pointed one of my boxes there as a test and it would not even connect  - using the instruction they supply - not impressed at all.

The OP still lists ORG as a viable coin.  That coin died the day it came out.  Anyone offering to mine or sell you orgcoin is a scammer.