Bitcoin Forum

Hi guys,
In the last 4 months i noted that a lot of people are creating many accounts (fake accounts) to participate in the bounties as multi accounts per user and as we all know that one of the main rules for every bounty is to use only one accounts per user.

Cheaters are greedy and harmful
Cheaters are not greedy they are so greedy, in the beginning they starting with two or three fake accounts then after a while they became having many fake accounts per one user.
They are not only so greedy but also harming, because after a while they starting to harm other bounty hunters, as an example for the reddit campaign they are using their fake accounts to downvotes the other hunters in order to decrease their stakes which logically will go to them because they are using their fake accounts to get a lot of upvotes.
Another example is for the blog/article campaign, the campaign that are beeing attacked by a lot of cheaters in the last months, they are using fake bitcointalks accounts to steal hunters' articles and adding their wallets.

These cheaters are destroying the system, they collecting a lot of tokens for each project and then sell them immediately when the project hit the exchange causing a dump in the price which also causes another loss for the investors.

I had saw a lot of cheaters and i know a lot of fake accounts on twitter, facebook, reddit, medium and bitcointalk accounts. i have a big list of cheaters but then what? every time i report tens of them i see hundreds coming and if i continued doing that i'm losing a lot of time hunting them, we need a creative solution to stop the cheaters, we want a clear and perfect system to stop and prevent them from the beginning..

Why i'm writting this topic?
my purpose from this topic is to discuss with you guys how can we stop the cheaters, i hope everyone can share here his visoin on how to stop them and after that we'll clarify and filter all the replies to get the basic rules that can be used by the bounties' managers to prevent the cheaters from being exist.
Also what is your opinion for sharing here all the cheaters accounts so they'll we known by us, so everyone can reports them to the bounties' managers for the bounties that we are participating in.

Getting kyc information beforehand can solve the problem on ICO site. But forum cannot handle this for each user, even it's a bad idea about anonymity.
Also, we see huge topics contain the same content on each page of it. The reason is signature campaigns. Lots of good information disappears within this garbage.

This is the bad side of being anonymous, anyone can make new accounts as much as they want.
Some bounties require KYC on the first go, and some ask for KYC after the bounty is done, this may save us from a few cheaters but not them all!

Cheaters are not only destroying the system but effecting the initial faith of the investors in the market ,we are in the crypyo market which is technology based market, it has the potential to coup with such type of cheaters.

I think this forum requires a merit to get Jr.member, which also significantly reduces the number of cheaters. I also recently read a topic that talks about developing cheaters detection tools through transactions between wallets, I hope it will soon be applied.

For multiusers, I think KYC is a good way or option to block them. So they cant claim on some of their multi accounts participants. But now they are good they joined those campaigns that dont need KYC so they can be safe. Also as we go further, I think theymos can strict his rule to more conservative like making member rank 20 oe 30 junior 10 to really abolish spammers and cheaters. This will hurt a lot espwcially hunters bit to clean the forum is much way important than doing bounty.

Sorry but I don't agree that raising merit requirements will stop people cheating on bounties. They are cheaters, they will just buy merit to get around that obstacle. I would stop looking for Bitcointalk to solve all your cheating problems as they are struggling themselves to stop people selling profiles and merit. If you do want to get rid of people using multiple identities to cheat bounties then the best way to do that is announce that every participant will have to complete KYC before getting any tokens. The cheaters won't bother to sign up.

What tools do you mean? please give me a link about the discussion.

This has long been applied, look at the member given a red trust by DT, there are several bounty managers who actively do that, but unfortunately, they did it without clarifying the truth is the member truly multi account or not. My advice, for each member can report this fraud in a way, every time you join the bounty program, please pay attention to the member who joined, if there is fraud, don't hesitate to report it to BM.

I'm not sure about multiple accounts as you say because bounty projects now revert to kyc for participants

Not only that I do not agree that bounty hunters dumps the market

No I disagree, bounty hunters get less than 1% of total supply

That's to low to crash a market

but that can still happen for campaigns that do not require KYC, I experienced the case several times, and I can only report to the bounty manager so that the fake account is banned from the campaign. for the supply itself depends on each of the 2 projects and it could be 1-5% of the allocation given if the bounty hunter does a dump, I'm sure it can't if the project manager indeed able to manage from the reward distribution system. and able to gifts reward fairly to those who are entitled.

There are many way to deal with this but this will be impossible if the campaign manager is lazy. The first is through introduction of KYC.this has nothing to do with the campaign manager because the Project team will be in charge of this. The second means is applicable to some specific campaign such as media campaign. this involve
(1) Making all hunters to write proof of Authentication
(2) Adding of Wallet address to media posts.
(3) permanent ban of any account caught cheating
other means is direct reporting of possible cheaters by bounty hunters caught cheating. Some lazy ass will copy somones work and register it with their ETH address.

That should make us realize the importance of KYC in bounty campaign. Moreover, there are few bounty managers here that try to solve this issue by posting authentication posts. It should now be the priority of the managers to filter who are the scammers and who are being honest. Scammers will always be scammers, managers should exert more efforts, I suggest.

In fact, such things are hard to avoid. Multiple accounts do not violate forum rules, so it cannot be avoided. In addition, dozens of bounties are posted every day in this forum, and we can't ask each bounty manager to be as strict as yahoo.

I think no bounty campaign allows multiple accounts, if you participate in a single campaign with multiple accounts they will track and blacklist you and will not send you any tokens, if you read the rules for eaxh bounty campaign you will see it is written clearly in each campaign.

Cheaters always find ways how to deal with KYC if needed in bounty campaign.

It is true, bounties are just a small percentage of the whole supply that even if dumped they still can't caused major changes of the price of the token. I have known of an ICO wherein the tokens price dip even if bounties were not given yet so i assumed that it is not all the time that the bounty hunters are causing the dip of the price.

Those who use multiple accounts are not stupid, they will do many ways so that others are not known, especially the bounty manager. One other way to deal with this issue is, every bounty manager must implement strict regulations, especially for those who take part in the signature campaign. Each signature campaign participant must make a constructive post in large numbers, so that those who take part with several accounts will be overwhelmed by the existing rules.

Sometimes bounty managers focus on the numbers and the success of the bounty program and care less about implementing stringent measures in tackling fraudulent participants. As much we try to kick against KYCs, I think it's a veritable tool in curbing the menace of cheaters in different bounties. There are several problems KYC helps to solve, from multiple registrations from one person to cheats who claim the stakes of others by duplication their name on the spreadsheet. 

A lot of Bounty hunters are anti-KYC, and will be the first to cry foul when cheaters do their thing. So, for me it's expedient that bounty managers implement and this must be done ab initio, it must be part of the general rules of the bounty and not introduced midway or at the end of the campaign. This give the bounty hunter the choice of deciding whether or not participate in a bounty which KYC is required.

with a lot of fake accounts popping up, this is because the total supply for bounty hunters is very little, so in my opinion don't be unilaterally prosecuted.
try as in previous years the total supply is up to 25% to 30%.
in my opinion this also needs to be corrected

I think these cheaters knows about their violation such as doing many accounts in the forum wherein they are greedy since most probably they wanted to join as many bounty campaign they want. I hope these people should refrain there doings as this is not a healthy environment and it's more of a very individualistic personal interest for their own advantage.

There are bound to be some implications with the characteristics of this market. However, I do agree that technology will give us a way to coup with this. I also believe that we need some sort of regulations(a lot of people might not agree on this). In my opinion, if everything is in moderation, regulations are good to boost confidence and build faith in the market.

Unfortunately, until recently, it paid to create fake accounts a do bounty, but now I think that the merit system plus the junior demotion has resulted quite positive for us.

Honestly, if we are all smart enough to be able to identify cheaters from the real thing, this space would be a better place as cheaters will rather get frustrated eventually but for the fact that there are gullible investors, the space is not regulated, then the chances of seeing cheaters thriving will always be there. As much as we want to blame the cheaters, we also have to blame gullible, inexperienced and naive investors as well who are always too lazy to read in between the lines. If you know what to look for in a team as well as product availability, you will not need a soothsayer to tell you whether you should be investing in a project or not.

This reply has no relation to the topic, i hope you can read the topic again to know the subject we are discussing.

I would not talk or negotiate with them, because there is no point in this, it seems to me that the opposite improves the possibilities for creating normal projects and more secure systems.

I definitely agree with you but what can we do? I think it will be figured out by the destiny. You know, like the market will wipe them out by itself somehow.

The solution to this problem is that the project will pay the tokens to the bounty participant's wallet on the project's ICO website, and ask everyone to KYC. It will eliminate a lot of cheaters. However, they need to redistribute their stake after eliminating the cheaters.

I think the main problem is not entirely in greed, but the fact that payments to bounty are now extremely small compared with the same period in 2017. And of course this situation will provoke people to dishonest work.

The only thing that we can do is stay safe and be careful when loggin in our wallet.
Because no system is safe. everything that in internet is hackable

This problem is somehow kind a plague that everytime you do tend to report or bust em up they would still continue to exist that's why I'm not really surprised that cheaters would always
exist yet abuse can be done without even being detected and come to think that managers or handlers aren't perfect too when checking out multi-accounts so we wont really have anything to be done to stop
them completely but somehow when we saw up individuals caught on such act then its always be advisable to report them immediately to be given an immediate action.

If a project can be cheated majorly in anyway it is a worthless piece of shit

Move to a project that is trustless from the outset

POW is the only way

There are two major solutions to curb using multiple accounts for bounty campaigns.. First one is restricting one account per IP on the participation form, by restricting one IP address to one account it'll cut multiple accounts registration drastically and secondly using Kyc, though it's not palatable to all bounty hunters but it can still help in this regard, either upfront or at the end of the bounty campaign to screen out fake and multiple accounts on spreadsheet

Merit has certainly helped but there are more important things for the project team to focus on, like meeting the softcap. If someone uses multiple accounts it is not a big deal to them, as long they fulfill the requirements of the bounty then every form of promotion will help

I think that is already a problem that has to be tackled as a community, it is very difficult to do something individually with those cheaters, the most you can do is denounce them to the bounty managers and provide them with all the necessary assistance to take action on the matter.

You've certainly touched upon the important issue of generosity companies, but.... The fact is that most of the bounties now do not pay tokens at all.

Its huge collision bounty hunter cheaters with ICO cheaters! And that's the problem that everyone have to deal. I don't think KYC is solution and I'm strongly opposed it, because of many KYC data stealing scams.

If a game plan can be created as an investment model, the fraud can be prevented even if it can be. At least if not all, it's a start.

Yes, it is a problem long time ago and it will continue to be one as long as there is bounty campaign. People will always find ways to cheat because of this "greed". They want to have bigger piece of the pie, that is why they cheat or we might say that they are in dire need of money. Bounty managers i think should find ways how to combat these cheaters as they are destroying the community.

The solution to that is nothing far fetched from each participants submitting their data through KYC. Despite this KYC, some participants will still cheat, because some of them use fake identities. So they can make copies of national ID and passport that are fake. Although, nit many can do that, so it will definitely reduce the rate. Afterwards, we can now begin to look into details on the KYC documents submitted, but that will be dine by the project team.

That's depend on the required papers to pass the kyc, for example (passport/identity + bank statement or bank prove of address + selfi) will make it hard to be scammed.

Well, there are some platforms like ICOBench that helps with KYC information for teams and practically make sure they are verified based on some KYC criteria. Asides that, I would say laziness of people to look in between the lines, and see the writings on the wall is what makes a whole lot of people to end up being a victim of these cheaters.

Not everyone will have the same positive mindset towards something, just in the same way that we have evil people all over the world, but the thing is that as an individual, you should at least; know how to identify some of these things when it comes to investing in anything at all. How can you know where you are investing, when you do not even understand the system itself?

Cheaters is educated people with low asset, they only need big reward from bounty program with easy way. They will kill the system soon as possible and create bad image about bounty hunter, not good but stop them it look's impossible. We need better device and technology to track them and of course big money will involved. Let's bounty manager decides and handle this problem, we can't do nothing.

by first educating yourself and second by giving that knowledge away to others and educating them.

if you hang around for a while you will gain enough experience you find out all the scumbag ways that people use to cheat others. and the only thing you need to do is to inform others, even if they don't listen.

Those components are very much present in this market. But that is life, they need to work harder to make more money. But in terms of efficiency, more and more people involved in a campaign will make the ICO project better. I only really hate spammers, who do not take the job seriously!

As I can see , forum administration intending to fight cheaters by tightening bounty campaign rules. For example : you can no longer participate in any campaign being a newbie. You have to be at least a Jr.member to participate , this is not so easy to do now because you need to prove your competence on the forum and get at least 1 merit to become elighible to participate in bounty campaigns. I think these changes will positively affect the number of cheaters , let's just wait and see how effective these changes will be.

Yes, I completely agree with you, moreover, many bounty managers abuse their power and blur the reward on their fake accounts, I wrote about them repeatedly, they harm and cutting the wood on which they sit. Such a system will not work with time because of such an appeal to it. For example, I no longer write anything about new projects in my blog. The only thing I do is wear a signature and a few tweets from bountyhive.

You yourself can see how many projects are now collected here for example, look at Enkidu, they have not collected anything, because they have a bounty Manager, does whatever he wants and has been seen in bad things.

There are a bunch of tools that allow you to weed out a significant portion of fake accounts and pay a reward to those who really benefit from their work, helping to promote the project. Not some faggot grab onto.

Cheaters are always going to be part of every system as well as fraudulent activities. Even in the real life, banks themselves are involved in fraudulent activities just like some few banks recently involved in one with JPMorgan and the likes of Citibank being involved. The thing here is, as an individual, what are you doing on your own to be able to not get caught up in all of these.

This is where knowledge comes in. If you have no knowledge, you can never find it easy to even identify anything at all when it comes to scams. Cheaters are not the only ones damaging the system, gullible investors are too.

Over time, you begin to distinguish cheaters. fake projects aimed at pumping funds and draining into the pipe

Do not panic, in the first  you can always participate in companies with kyc, however, the moderators do not sit still, I'm sure after the latest updates on the site has become much less such users

I think that you are right and it is worth fighting with scammers, but now in addition to multiaccounts it has become fashionable to buy bots that will write for you any comment or make a repost.

Honestly, I think cheaters are stopping themselves.

Bounty hunting has grown so out of control that there is now was more supply than demand.
Basically, it just is flat out not profitable and can not be sustained.
When you have lots of people becoming bounty hunters, and each bounty hunter doing multiple accounts, it will come crashing down.
As people start to realize that bounty hunting is not profitable anymore. it will start to balance out.

Of course, for us that have done bounty hunting and made profit before, it totally sucks.
I have seen so many good projects absolutely destroyed by scammers.
They actually bring bad press to the project and then go and crash the value of the very token they were promoting.
So for now, I think it just needs to run it's course.