Bitcoin Forum

http://valleywag.gawker.com/whistleblower-threatens-to-expose-corruption-at-bitcoin-1538965958/@laceydonohue

Should be interest.

Finally.. This is going to get hot and heavy.

I feel like I'm watching a movie everyday.

corruption like any other

Imagine that!!

http://two-bit-idiot.tumblr.com/post/78868284696/coup-or-death-for-the-bitcoin-foundation

Thanks for the link :)

The Forum was also complicit in the MTGOX mess. The MODS would shit-can any negative post or question regarding the solvency of MTGOX.  Hope the those specific MODS lost everything on GOX.

The problem with TBI's stance is that he's threatening to publish the information unless Vessenes and Matonis step down, which implies that he won't publish it if they do.  

That's not bringing transparency to the activities of the Foundation.  If he has evidence of wrong-doing, then he should publish it whether or not Vessenes and Matonis step down.  If he doesn't, then he becomes complicit in the "cover up" he alleges is occurring.

He's rapidly becoming the kind of media whore he yesterday accused Leah McGrath Goodman of being.  Unless he's willing to publish and be damned regardless of whether or not Vessenes and Matonis step down, then he's not a crusader for truth at all - he's just another egomaniac seeking validation.

Oh boy mtgox

Completely agree, the blog post is massively attention seeking.  He could have simply mailed the two guys in question with the facts he has and told them he would reveal unless they stepped down.

Nope, that would just make him a blackmailer.  He has no integrity as a "whistle-blower" if there's any scenario under which he won't publish the information of wrong-doing he claims to have.  By not publishing, he's with-holding the very information he's accusing them of being wrong for with-holding.

I don't care whether he is good guy or bad guy - if his information is correct and the board is stacked with this type of cheating, this is real bad for bitcoin. REAL BAD. 

It's good to see the mtgox and foundation stuff starting to get fired up and talked about here again. I for one think the whole satoshi bullshit that's happening right now was a clever ruse to draw attention away from the scandal. I don't want to be a weird tinfoil conspiracy theorist but none of this smells right.

These few weeks must be the storm before the calm. Yeah right. Such fun :D

Here comes a ANOTHER crash....

lol - If people get told enough times, maybe they will eventually listen. I mean, is a hundred times enough?

I don't recall this, I was warning people about Gox for years (as were many others) and I don't recall having any posts deleted.

Not even close to enough. The problem is that it's too convenient to store them online. Silly as all get out to do that but convenient. We can't expect the vast majority of the population to adopt bitcoin and not understand the concept of don't store your money in a "bank".

Ironically, in the early days of MtGox Mark used to openly tell people not to use MtGox as a bank/online wallet (he used to discourage people from using it as a currency exchange, too).  I suspect it was more because people doing so weren't generating profit for MtGox so it was a pain in the ass for them to have to keep records for thousands of unprofitable accounts (not to mention the money laundering thing of people walking funds through an account being "suspicious" anyway).

I'm tripping everyday going by.

I agree completely.  His approach does raise questions about his motivations.  If he really just wants the resignations, why not just publish it and expect the resignations to come, as they should, after the information is released and if it is true. 

His last major revelation (the MtGox “Crisis Strategy Draft"), was given to him like a gift by some insider who is "well connected in the industry", and it definitely had an impact on the market.  Why did the insider give the draft crisis document to a blogger in the first place?   This latest revelation MAY have a similar impact on the market too.  Where did TBI get this info about corruption at the foundation?

Perhaps a market impact was always the intention. And his latest blog is constructed to provide maximum Drama. 

According to Ryan Selkis (TBI)'s LinkedIn page: He is "the Founder of Inscrypto, Bitcoin's decentralized, privately funded version of the FDIC. We reduce volatility for consumers while helping hedge funds invest in bitcoin."

Not saying that Vessenes and Matonis are innocent, but it just makes you wonder what's really behind all the style.

 

I think his original motives were probably fine.  I just think that he's come to believe in the "persona" of TBI too much now and that it's clouding his judgement.

A couple of weeks ago, he was just another blogger with opinions on Bitcoin stuff.  He got handed some pretty explosive information and now he thinks he's Bob Woodward or Carl Bernstein.  He's making himself the story by adopting this "fearless crusader for Bitcoin truth" persona and I guess he's kind of intoxicated by all the kudos he got for the MtGox Crisis Draft story.  All of a sudden he feels very important in the Bitcoin space and it's clouding his judgement.

What a whistleblower does is blow a whistle, that is, tell the truth about something.

Not try to make a deal in exchange for his silence that basically amounts to "Do what I say or else."  That's what a blackmailer does.

bitcoin is in need of serious cleaning, a new start. seriously.

Everyday more interesting news related to Bitcoin pops out. I wonder what other shocking news will there be tomorrow.  :P

Yep. Just cause it's bitcoin it's a huge deal, but if this was some typical FIAT banksters that did it, everyone would just shrug and bail them out.

Never trust a third party. Let's just put all of our coins into cold storage and call it a day huh?

Genjix announces that he's having another closet sale, and I'll formally announce that I'm Rassah's mother.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7178/6854289715_027bcc904b_n.jpg

Hint: Pangia is one of many trolls whose purpose here is to disrupt the forum.

The only unknown is whether he just does it for kicks, or is a paid professional.

Nuke a niche currency that (at least currently) has little effect on the economy outside that niche, and because the banksters hate it, the media they own have a field day.

Nuke the entire economy of the world?  Here, have some free money from the taxpayers so you can double your bonuses this year.

This is more exciting than most thrillers ;)

Edit: I hadn't read the thread carefully enough. The comments here are more balanced than i first thought.

• Whistleblower Threatens to Expose Corruption at Bitcoin Foundation is "reporting" on a post by "The Two-Bit Idiot (http://two-bit-idiot.tumblr.com/post/78868284696/coup-or-death-for-the-bitcoin-foundation)"
  Read the comments at Reddit (compared to here/this thread), and prepare to be surprised.

The forum might be OK, but the Bitcoin Foundation looks really bad right now.

if people who want to elect themselves to try to be the face of bitcoin are doing unethical things or comitting fraud or what not ,  it should be released.  it's the bitcoin community self regulating itself.

with that said,  whats with all the dramatics.  just release the documents man, stop trying make a name for yourself and cause added drama and suspense.

Yep, that is exactly what Reddit was ripping on him for.



Not just new leaders, but a whole new "foundation".

A phrase my grandfather used to say comes to mind.  "Shit or get off the pot."

Did you throw the pot at his face after you're done " here,,, all yours.... bitch!"

Let's see if we can get 10 to 15 more MtGox and Satoshi threads going. We're running low on places to post meaningless horseshit about those two subjects.

Do mods ever combine threads here, it might be a good idea.

Whistleblowers get fame. Blackmailers get the job done. If the people who are poisoning the place are removed that's better than congratulating ourselves on how informed we are. He's going Taken and that's what's necessary now.

There's a bit too much hopeyshamey going on here. Exposure is nothing if you don't have power. I'd rather have a fire put out than be told up to the minute what the temperature is. What I find hilarious is that after exposing we would then have some long winded process in which people will be removed and some other charlatan take their place, when we can just have them remove themselves.

Blackmail is effective. Whistleblowing only gets half the job done. After the whistle is blown, someone still has to apply pressure or procedure. Why not cut to the chase?

Do you really need to know the gory details of what anyone with half a brain already knows? If you see someone harming someone else, do you A) shout and spend a long time trying to get the people in power to stop them, or do you B) stop them? This obsession with information is just delaying effective action. Removing two people directly beats months of trolling by supporters and accusers which only allows the next shyster to take over.

Blackmail and extortion are unethical, immoral, and for that matter, often felonious.  I need no moral lessons from those who use such tactics.


If this guy expects any support, he really needs to demonstrate specifically that Vessenes and Matonis specifically are the root of the problem and actually need to be removed rather than simply resolve their conflicts of interest.  I think if he could do that, he would have already.  He can't, so instead, he blusters.

"Obsession with information," basically meaning "don't bother me with facts," does not impress me much as an argument.

I have a very low regard for extortionists, and almost as low a regard for those who claim to have staggering revelations at their fingertips, but the dog ate their homework or they have some other bullshit excuse why they can't just say the truth they claim to have.

and centralised bodies claiming to represent decentralised interests.

Your'e right, but not completely. If everybody only trusted them selves, we would just be a bunch of nerds with hundreds of thousands of Bitcoin in our wallets worth pennies.

For everyone screwing you over, there has been another two businesses that turned out to be legitimate, moving bitcoin forward. So rather, please consider us valuable slaughter pigs instead! If only security conscious bitcoiners were around, bitcoin would still be under ground.

+1

Also, there's a lot of ordinary people who have lost money in Gox and if this guy has info about what went on he shouldn't be playing games with it.

What is immoral about blackmail? Is it immoral to keep secrets? Is it immoral to accept money? What makes accepting money to keep a secret immoral? Do you not like black males?

Is drinking immoral? is driving immoral?

Lying is always immoral as it implies that you are acting against your own knowledge for the purpose of influencing others decisions. If you do it out of personal reasons it's even more immoral.

blackmail is immoral too, it's not a case of selling information to the highest bidder.

Whistle blowing is considered ethical because;
1. there is no personal gain, other than possible gratification to the whistle-blower.
2. The injustice / breach of contract he does to ones he blows about, is less than the injustice he exposes to public.

If you own the road you are drinking and driving on then yes it's perfectly acceptable, if you're driving on someone elses road where it is outlawed then it becomes immoral

Maybe TBI only has circumstantial evidence and is playing a bluff?  If he truly has evidence that will be damaging to the market, it seems he's trying to be a hero but protect his own interest at the same time.  Either way you have to question the integrity of this guy.

Ah, think is gonna be interesting .. 72 hours? lets see what happens after that ? :P
Basic point : Don't trust

This is criminal.  He continued to state that nothing was wrong while unloading bitcoins onto unsuspecting buyers while him and his cronies made off with the loot.  All withdrawals will be made public during the bankruptcy proceedings.  Both USD and BTC withdrawals.  Mark is going to jail.

I think you are right there. This will be a trial followed world wide. Probably with televised witness statements and pleas ( if that's allowed in Japan?)

Here's a moral lesson: you want some official entity to do your job for you. It's ok when someone with a title or badge is extorting and blackmailing in your name under color of official procedure. Delusional.


Circular arguments. He knows that if he releases then it will be a long round of accusations and support trolls and all energies will be wasted chasing them one at a time. On the other hand, if they resign on their own, then other charlatans will see that as the ceiling and won't bother. More information is just to make us feel better.

They made themselves the root of the problem by appointing themselves to the position. Even James T. Kirk resigned.


No it means stop staring at the things you already know and do something about it. The Bitcoin Foundation is not a government body. They do not deserve our hesitation. They already failed to warn people about MtGox, just as rating agencies failed to downgrade banks.


I have a very low regard for sitting on your ass. The Magna Carta was produced under duress, look it up.

It's called playing chess when the people in charge are not doing anything. It's called amplifying your power to create change when as an individual you are powerless. The ONLY REASON anyone wants more information is so they can get their emotional kick without actually taking action. You don't want to hold anyone responsible, nor do you want to take action.

Do we actually know how many ordinary people were hit, how much money by the average Joe was lost?

I was expecting to find dozens, if not hundreds of threads and posts screaming about lost money. It is a shock how casual this lost money thing has been handled in terms of an out cry or stories.

Which makes me think maybe the actual numbers of average Joe's isn't as high as you'd expect. Are we dealing with a case where 80-90% of the money that disappeared was from big business or rich investors or what?

On the other hand stealing a small amount from thousands of average Joe's is perhaps smarter BUT again where is the real stories and out cry?

Four stages of grief. Whistleblowing and arguing are the permanent denial stage. People are more or less embarrassed and ashamed. Also they spent all their energy screaming at Gox support, they have none for the problem.

I haven't had my posts censored, and I've been very negative on Mt. Gox.

My first post warning about Mt. Gox was on April 14, 2013: "That last strongly indicates that Mt. Gox doesn't have all the cash it should.  (Under Japanese money transfer law, they're required to have 100% of funds deposited with them in a bank account separate from their own funds.)" (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=173680.msg1837924#msg1837924).

When Mt. Gox said on June 23, 2013 that they'd "overloaded their bank", I wrote: "Mt. Gox claims they overloaded Mizuho Bank, the second largest bank in Japan, with 515 branches, 26 million customers, and revenue over one trillion yen. Yeah, right." (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=231960.msg2560059#msg2560059)

On June 29, 2013, I posted info on where to sue Mt. Gox in the US. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=246705.msg2616632#msg2616632)

On July 2, 2013, when Mt. Gox's "2 week hiatus on withdrawals" expired and withdrawals didn't resume, I made a lot of posts. On July 3, I wrote "Mt. Gox missed the deadline. They are now in default. Time for their creditors to go to court in Delaware." (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=244439.msg2645732#msg2645732)

On July 4, 2013, I wrote "That's an indication that Mt. Gox is short of cash. They can keep their scheme going if they slow down withdrawals so that more money is coming in than is going out. This is exactly the kind of behavior seen just before Madoff's fund went under. If you have cash in Mt. Gox, get it out now. If they're legit, it won't hurt Mt. Gox. If they're not..." (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=249490.msg2654325#msg2654325)

On July 8, 2013, I wrote: "Many readers here don't realize how abnormal Mt. Gox's behavior is. With real-world brokerage accounts, when you order a withdrawal by wire transfer, it's in your bank account within two working days. Usually one. Often the same day.  A brokerage house that fails to deliver on a withdrawal is in trouble. Big trouble. If a firm has major problems servicing withdrawal orders, it's big news in the Wall Street Journal. Other firms refuse to deal with them. In the US, FINRA regulators ask hard questions. Lawyers and auditors descend on the firm. The firm may go under within days. That happened to Lehman Brothers, Drexel Burnham Lambert, MF Global... In each case, within days of default, the firm was out of business. Mt. Gox is trying to play in the big leagues now. They don't get to act like they're dealing in trading cards. " (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=249658.msg2683420#msg2683420)

On July 15, 2013, I wrote: "Someone needs to sue Mt. Gox.  Now. ... Pay attention, suckers. You don't have to put up with this shit. You really can take steps which will eventually either get you paid or Mt. Gox out of business." (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=28488;sa=showPosts;start=520)

Skipping ahead a few months...

On January 26, 2014, I wrote: "It's clear that Mt. Gox is near collapse. No USD withdrawals for eight months, delayed EUR withdrawals, delay on JPY withdrawals, delay on BTC withdrawals, and a 22% spread against other markets. How many red flags do you need? This isn't a "support ticket" issue. This is a "send lawyers, guns, and money" issue. Anybody with money stuck in Mt. Gox should be talking to a lawyer, the Japan Financial Services Agency, the US SEC (yes, they have jurisdiction because Mt. Gox registered with FinCen, sells to US persons, and has an office in Delaware), and suing in the Delaware Justice of the Peace court, the Delaware Chancery Court, or in Japan. It's important that some victim make this problem known to law enforcement in Japan. That will keep the principals of Mt. Gox from fleeing the country. " (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=431117.msg4758601#msg4758601)

I've been posting stronger and stronger warnings about Mt. Gox for months. Those are just samples. There are many more; see my posting history. As far as I know, none were censored.

We warned you. You didn't listen. Now suffer.

You never know man. Your warnings maybe saved a handful of people. I for one thank you and everyone else who screamed from the rooftops.

I hope this gets some media attention.

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