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Title: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 02:33:56 PM There is one simple and quick way to determine that Bitcoin is scam, and that is: market price evaluation. In the case of legitimate market instruments, one can easily evaluate whether they are overpriced or underpriced in the market. However, in the case of Bitcoin this is impossible.
Examples: If a bond with a face value of 1,000 dollars, a coupon of 5% and maturity in 2 years, is priced at 500 we immediately know it is underpriced. If priced at 2,000, we know it is overpriced. If an egg is priced the same as pizza we immediately know it is overpriced because these items are used for satisfying human needs and we empirically know that the utilization capacity of egg is lower that that of pizza. If a guy was granted a loan in the amount of 1000 units of fiat money and used only his Dacia Logan as collateral, but then he manages to buy a brand-new Bugatti Veyron for that money, we immediately know that one unit of his money was overpriced because the utilization capacity of Dacia Logan is lower than that of Bugatti Veyron. And finally, if the book value of a stock is 50 dollars we know that if it is priced at 10 it is underpriced, if priced at 1,000 it is overpriced. As we can see, in all these examples we have objective, neutral and price independent factors that set up the level for determining whether something is overpriced or underpriced. How can we do that for Bitcoin? What objective measurements set up the above mentioned level? How would we know if Bitcoin is underpriced or overpriced? Well, it is impossible to know this. Bitcoin is not a company, so it cannot be evaluated through book value or earnings. It is not a debt asset like bonds or fiat currencies, so it cannot be evaluated through face value or collateral. Bitcoin is not good or service, so it cannot be evaluated through utilization capacity. In short, it is impossible in principle to know whether Bitcoin is overpriced or underpriced. And that simply confirms the fact that there is nothing behind Bitcoin. There is no underlying value for evaluating the investment into Bitcoin. This can be best seen through the comparison with fiat. Although, at first sight, it seems that fiat currencies have no underlying value, this is not true. Why? Well, because today's dollars or euros are debt based assets, i.e. they are products designed for people who want to consume goods and services today and return them in the future. These people are called borrowers. When the banks grant them loans, new dollars or euros are put into cirtualtion, which are then used for access to the pool of goods and services that gets filled via economic activity of the general population. But since borrowers have to repay their debt with salaries they received for their economic activity - for their contribution to that pool of goods and services, this reduces their purchasing power, i.e. access to the pool. In this way they return goods and services back to the general population. All this is backed by collateral, and in case of borrowers default, their land, cars, houses and other property will end up in the pool of goods and services for the general population to buy with fiat that borrowers put into circulation. Now, are miners - those who put bitcoin into circulation, and in that way also receive goods and services from the general population, obligated to return goods and services back to the general population? No , they are not. Is bitcoin backed by land, cars, houses and other property of Bitcoin miners? Obviously it is not. So fiat currencies are debt assets backed by collateral and this is their underlying value. Bitcoin on the other hand has no such value, and it is a scam - fake money/asset, designed to extract goods and services from the general population. That is why one can invest into Bitcoin only on the basis of guesses, opinions, beliefs, or conjectures about its future value. These are then spread through advertisements and propaganda to attract new investors. And this is exactly how investment scams operate - in the absence of underlying value, all kinds of manipulative tactics are used to attract new investors. Bitcoin is therefore a classical investment scam. It's just that it's well masked as a market instrument. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: freightjoe on December 03, 2018, 02:42:42 PM You are correct
The problem is that many Bitcoin "investors" in here are either too stupid to understand they have been scammed, or are too ashamed to admit it. Instead, like a sultry 4-year old, they stomp their feet and cry "FUD" and "Buy the dip" and "HODL" Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: bkbirge on December 03, 2018, 02:48:55 PM What's the objective value of a secure triple ledger system with worldwide adoption?
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: timotron on December 03, 2018, 02:53:03 PM I don't think Bitcoin is a scam, they used to scam people, yeah, but its not a scam.
Just listen to this guy and get all answers: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJWCJCWOxBYSi5DhCieLOLQ Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 03, 2018, 02:54:33 PM All of the above are valid concerns but hold true for gold and precious metals as well. Do you regard those as scams too?
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: dohh on December 03, 2018, 03:33:21 PM All of the above are valid concerns but hold true for gold and precious metals as well. Do you regard those as scams too? This is where You are very wrong. I wont write down all aspects, that would take too long, but only main differences, what makes BTC a scam, while precious metals are not. First: no other mining includes precious "deflationary" mechanism, that does nothing but lessens reward for same task exponentially. That is nothing else than pyramid, doesnt matter how You name it. It would be same, if Goldakatoshi somehow set, that after too years gold miners will harvest 2 times less than today, after 4 years 4 times less, then 8, then 16. You see how quickly it grows. So its fraudulent in its core. Second: Gold can not be forked. There are reserves to mine, or there a not. Simple. Forking, segwit and lightning network are nothing but delay mechanism for winning time for scammers (mostly early whales) to cash their early free coins in. No body know ratio of produced coins and those which are cashed in permanently, because of very low transfer fees, whales can trade coins between their own wallets and give impression of any "market price" which they can find idiots at. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: franky1 on December 03, 2018, 03:45:07 PM How can we do that for Bitcoin? mining cost equilibrium is the bottom line value its its cheaper to mine then buy people mine if its cheaper to buy than mine people buy. so look for the most effiecient mining cost and you learn the bottom line mining cost which miners wont sell below you soon learn the number of times the price went below bottomline mining costs ovr many years is negligable because people are not fooilish Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 03, 2018, 03:57:08 PM This is where You are very wrong. I wont write down all aspects, that would take too long, but only main differences, what makes BTC a scam, while precious metals are not. That's a cop-out answer. First: no other mining includes precious "deflationary" mechanism, that does nothing but lessens reward for same task exponentially. [...] Second: Gold can not be forked. There are reserves to mine, or there a not. Simple. [...] Goldbars can be faked: https://www.businessinsider.com/tungsten-filled-gold-bars-found-in-new-york-2012-9?IR=T https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/fake-gold-wafer-rbc-canadian-mint-1.4368801 https://globalnews.ca/news/3169363/10k-in-fake-gold-bars-uncovered-during-edmonton-police-investigation/ ...and those goldbars are as "gold" as Bitcoin forks are "Bitcoin". That being said, these 2 arguments contradict one another. The first statement criticizes Bitcoin for being deflationary while the second statement critizes Bitcoin for supposedly not being deflationary. (while also arguing in the first statement that precious metals are not deflationary and then arguing in the second statement that precious metals are deflationary). So what's your argument? Please clarify. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: dohh on December 03, 2018, 04:16:02 PM This is where You are very wrong. I wont write down all aspects, that would take too long, but only main differences, what makes BTC a scam, while precious metals are not. That's a cop-out answer. First: no other mining includes precious "deflationary" mechanism, that does nothing but lessens reward for same task exponentially. [...] Second: Gold can not be forked. There are reserves to mine, or there a not. Simple. [...] Goldbars can be faked: https://www.businessinsider.com/tungsten-filled-gold-bars-found-in-new-york-2012-9?IR=T https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/fake-gold-wafer-rbc-canadian-mint-1.4368801 https://globalnews.ca/news/3169363/10k-in-fake-gold-bars-uncovered-during-edmonton-police-investigation/ ...and those goldbars are as "gold" as Bitcoin forks are "Bitcoin". That being said, these 2 arguments contradict one another. The first statement criticizes Bitcoin for being deflationary while the second statement critizes Bitcoin for supposedly not being deflationary. (while also arguing in the first statement that precious metals are not deflationary and then arguing in the second statement that precious metals are deflationary). So what's your argument? Please clarify. No, its not cop-out, its straightforward and a bit cut as short as possible. I have explained here the same thing over and over again many many times, before current fall began. Goldbars can not be faked against any serious security check and can be sold to total morons only. And my arguments dont contradict, because You refuse to read them correctly. I wrote "deflatiory" because this is an excuse of halvening. Its nothing more, than a building block of pyramid, instead of hierarchical levels time of mining matters in this scheme. https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Controlled_supply Second chart is perfect for explanation. Its a scheme and You understand it, if You have any part in Your brain, that does math. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 04:22:33 PM All of the above are valid concerns but hold true for gold and precious metals as well. Do you regard those as scams too? Millions upon millions of men and women use gold daily to adorn their bodies. We all use electronics that have trace amounts of gold in them. Gold is used in dentistry, medicine, aerospace, and elsewhere. More than two-thirds of newly produced gold is utilized this way. Meaning, gold has utilization capacity and we can use gold to compare it with other goods or services. In that way we can determine whether gold is overpriced or underpriced. For example, we empirically know that a gram of gold has lower utilization capacity than a car, and higher utilization capacity than an egg. So if it is priced above a car, we would immediately know it is overpriced. If it is priced below an egg, we would immediately know it is underpriced. In short, things with utilization capacity are not scams. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 04:23:29 PM How can we do that for Bitcoin? mining cost equilibrium is the bottom line value its its cheaper to mine then buy people mine if its cheaper to buy than mine people buy. so look for the most effiecient mining cost and you learn the bottom line mining cost which miners wont sell below you soon learn the number of times the price went below bottomline mining costs ovr many years is negligable because people are not fooilish But when one buys Bitcoin, one is not buying a specific amount of kwh of energy. If instead of Bitcoin, an egg would be a reward for generating a new block, your argument would sound like this: "mining cost equilibrium is the bottom line value of the egg". And this is obviously foolish. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Caeser2001 on December 03, 2018, 04:29:55 PM All of the above are valid concerns but hold true for gold and precious metals as well. Do you regard those as scams too? This is where You are very wrong. I wont write down all aspects, that would take too long, but only main differences, what makes BTC a scam, while precious metals are not. First: no other mining includes precious "deflationary" mechanism, that does nothing but lessens reward for same task exponentially. That is nothing else than pyramid, doesnt matter how You name it. It would be same, if Goldakatoshi somehow set, that after too years gold miners will harvest 2 times less than today, after 4 years 4 times less, then 8, then 16. You see how quickly it grows. So its fraudulent in its core. Second: Gold can not be forked. There are reserves to mine, or there a not. Simple. Forking, segwit and lightning network are nothing but delay mechanism for winning time for scammers (mostly early whales) to cash their early free coins in. No body know ratio of produced coins and those which are cashed in permanently, because of very low transfer fees, whales can trade coins between their own wallets and give impression of any "market price" which they can find idiots at. Peter Schiff is that you? Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 03, 2018, 04:47:22 PM Goldbars can not be faked against any serious security check and can be sold to total morons only. Same is true forks, so what's your point? And my arguments dont contradict, because You refuse to read them correctly. [...] Hence my request for clarification. Let me rephrase your statements the way I understood them: First: no other mining includes precious "deflationary" mechanism, that does nothing but lessens reward for same task exponentially. That is nothing else than pyramid, doesnt matter how You name it. It would be same, if Goldakatoshi somehow set, that after too years gold miners will harvest 2 times less than today, after 4 years 4 times less, then 8, then 16. You see how quickly it grows. So its fraudulent in its core. 1. Bitcoin's supply is limited, which is bad. The supply of precious metals is not limited, which is good. Second: Gold can not be forked. There are reserves to mine, or there a not. Simple. Forking, segwit and lightning network are nothing but delay mechanism for winning time for scammers (mostly early whales) to cash their early free coins in. No body know ratio of produced coins and those which are cashed in permanently, because of very low transfer fees, whales can trade coins between their own wallets and give impression of any "market price" which they can find idiots at. 2. Bitcoin's supply is not limited, which is bad. The supply of precious metals is limited, which is good. Broken down like that, those statements are contradictory. Kindly point out the nuances that I missed. Millions upon millions of men and women use gold daily to adorn their bodies. We all use electronics that have trace amounts of gold in them. Gold is used in dentistry, medicine, aerospace, and elsewhere. More than two-thirds of newly produced gold is utilized this way. Meaning, gold has utilization capacity and we can use gold to compare it with other goods or services. In that way we can determine whether gold is overpriced or underpriced. For example, we empirically know that a gram of gold has lower utilization capacity than a car, and higher utilization capacity than an egg. So if it is priced above a car, we would immediately know it is overpriced. If it is priced below an egg, we would immediately know it is underpriced. In short, things with utilization capacity are not scams. Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have utility as well though. Monetary transactions, as enabled by Bitcoin, have utility, otherwise we would have neither banks nor credit card companies nor remittance services. On the other side if you look at gold purely from a utility perspective, we are looking at a clearly over-valued asset. If industrial (and cosmetic) utility were the only determining factors, gold would (1) be less over-priced in comparison to other metals that see comparable practical use and (2) not run counter-cyclical to economic growth (unlike platinum, for example). Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 04:59:08 PM Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have utility as well though. Monetary transactions, as enabled by Bitcoin, have utility, otherwise we would have neither banks nor credit card companies nor remittance services. Monetary transactions are enabled by internet and miners equipment, not by Bitcoin. Bitcoin is a spreadsheet entry which has no utility. Egg and gold have utility because humans can consume them for fulfilling their needs. With spreadsheet entry, no human needs can be fulfilled.On the other side if you look at gold purely from a utility perspective, we are looking at a clearly over-valued asset. If industrial (and cosmetic) utility were the only determining factors, gold would (1) be less over-priced in comparison to other metals that see comparable practical use and (2) not run counter-cyclical to economic growth (unlike platinum, for example). Millions upon millions of men and women use gold daily to adorn their bodies. We all use electronics that have trace amounts of gold in them. Gold is used in dentistry, medicine, aerospace, and elsewhere. More than two-thirds of newly produced gold is utilized this way. Meaning, gold has utilization capacity and we can use gold to compare it with other goods or services. In that way we can determine whether gold is overpriced or underpriced. For example, we empirically know that a gram of gold has lower utilization capacity than a car, and higher utilization capacity than an egg. So if it is priced above a car, we would immediately know it is overpriced. If it is priced below an egg, we would immediately know it is underpriced. In short, things with utilization capacity are not scams. Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have utility as well though. Monetary transactions, as enabled by Bitcoin, have utility, otherwise we would have neither banks nor credit card companies nor remittance services. On the other side if you look at gold purely from a utility perspective, we are looking at a clearly over-valued asset. If industrial (and cosmetic) utility were the only determining factors, gold would (1) be less over-priced in comparison to other metals that see comparable practical use and (2) not run counter-cyclical to economic growth (unlike platinum, for example). Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: bkbirge on December 03, 2018, 05:06:14 PM Bitcoin is a spreadsheet entry which has no utility. Egg and gold have utility because humans can consume them for fulfilling their needs. With spreadsheet entry, no human needs can be fulfilled. That spreadsheet entry is extremely important, I think you are missing the value there. https://hackernoon.com/why-everyone-missed-the-most-important-invention-in-the-last-500-years-c90b0151c169 https://www.quora.com/What-is-Triple-Ledger-Accounting Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Marbelli on December 03, 2018, 05:18:34 PM everything is very simple. if bitcoin is undervalued, then it rises in price; if overestimated, it drops accordingly in price.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 03, 2018, 05:18:51 PM Monetary transactions are enabled by internet and miners equipment, not by Bitcoin. The internet alone, by itself, does not enable monetary transactions. What do you think pays for the mining infrastructure? Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 05:21:21 PM Bitcoin is a spreadsheet entry which has no utility. Egg and gold have utility because humans can consume them for fulfilling their needs. With spreadsheet entry, no human needs can be fulfilled. That spreadsheet entry is extremely important, I think you are missing the value there. https://hackernoon.com/why-everyone-missed-the-most-important-invention-in-the-last-500-years-c90b0151c169 https://www.quora.com/What-is-Triple-Ledger-Accounting Can you please answer one simple question: how can you utilize bitcoin, or in other words, what can you do with Bitcoin besides transfer it to another person? When you answer it you will grasp the full stupidity of links you provided. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 03, 2018, 05:25:16 PM Monetary transactions are enabled by internet and miners equipment, not by Bitcoin. The internet alone, by itself, does not enable monetary transactions. What do you think pays for the mining infrastructure? Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: ict on December 03, 2018, 07:10:28 PM In my opinion. if bitcoin is a fraud then the financial authorities in each country must ban and ban this currency. however, investors do not feel cheated and the financial authorities in each country also do not prohibit the use of crypto. Crypto prices are largely determined by supply and demand so we cannot control or determine crypto prices.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: dohh on December 03, 2018, 08:06:09 PM In my opinion. if bitcoin is a fraud then the financial authorities in each country must ban and ban this currency. however, investors do not feel cheated and the financial authorities in each country also do not prohibit the use of crypto. Crypto prices are largely determined by supply and demand so we cannot control or determine crypto prices. Its a very good fraud and authorities are stupid. Even with much more obvious frauds they take time, before they act. Kairosplanet is a perfect sample how slow the authorities are. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Lochshire on December 03, 2018, 10:08:27 PM Can you please answer one simple question: how can you utilize bitcoin, or in other words, what can you do with Bitcoin besides transfer it to another person? When you answer it you will grasp the full stupidity of links you provided. Your argument seems to hinge on this single premise: That bitcoin has no intrinsic value other than something for people to trade back and forth. If you look at every non backed currency in the world you will see the same thing. No value other than as a "product" to be transferred between people. Bitcoin is only a scam as far as pretty much every paper currency in the world is a scam. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: evichi on December 03, 2018, 10:22:07 PM The fluctuation in bitcoin price comes as a result of pure buying and selling of the cryptocurrency. When more people buy bitcoin, the value simply goes up, when people sell bitcoin, the price geos down. The value at each point in time reflects the activities being performed with bitcoin. It is far from being a scam
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: loveinberlin on December 03, 2018, 10:39:23 PM I don't agree that this is the undeniable evidence that btc is a scam because it is a good coin with the huge potential and I m sure it will prove this in 2019 as most experts believe in its power
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 04, 2018, 05:34:13 AM Can you please answer one simple question: how can you utilize bitcoin, or in other words, what can you do with Bitcoin besides transfer it to another person? When you answer it you will grasp the full stupidity of links you provided. Your argument seems to hinge on this single premise: That bitcoin has no intrinsic value other than something for people to trade back and forth. If you look at every non backed currency in the world you will see the same thing. No value other than as a "product" to be transferred between people. Bitcoin is only a scam as far as pretty much every paper currency in the world is a scam. So Bitcoin has nothing to do with fiat currencies. The latter are debt instruments. The former is scam designed to steal good and services from the general population. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: 1993jochico on December 04, 2018, 05:46:04 AM tl;dr
Simple words that will affect you. "if you dont really believe in bitcoin why are you here and wasting your time in this what you call scam?" No one is concern on other peoples money, thats how people think then you cant say that you are here just to enlighten us. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: dohh on December 04, 2018, 06:36:43 AM tl;dr Simple words that will affect you. "if you dont really believe in bitcoin why are you here and wasting your time in this what you call scam?" No one is concern on other peoples money, thats how people think then you cant say that you are here just to enlighten us. You see, You are wrong here. There are many people, who put justice ahead of self-interests. If You dont care its a scam and You are OK scamming other people´s money, I am not... My story is very simple: my brother came to me last year (december 2017) and wanted to borrow money, because he had "an extremely profitable investment opportunity". Well... my brother is a good person. A good truck driver and he can fix almost anything, that breaks down. But he is not home in IT, economics, math. He has a wife and he is a loving father of 2 lovely children. The sum, that he wanted to borrow, was worth half of his household. He just wanted to earn profit, to allow bigger house for his family. I saved him from BTC, accidentally. If he asked from somewhere else... Anyway, if there is just one person like my brother, reading this site, changing his mind about putting his hard-earned money into BTC, then my job here is done. If there is really none... then well... thats my time wasted and thats also a risk, Im willing to take. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: mindrust on December 04, 2018, 06:50:12 AM I remember these type of posts in 2015 while the price went down to $200 from $1200.
If you don't be careful, you'll find yourself selling your coins for a loss. This is what this posts aims. Good old FUD. Just like op thinks bugatti veyron is a better car than dacia and he sees the reason about the price of a bugatti, apparently people think the same for bitcoin since it is the leading crypto currency. To him bugatti and dacia prices makes sense apparently. Try to explain a bugatti's price to somebody who lives in Africa. He'll look at you like your a lunatic. For most people, spending that much money on a car (no matter how good it is it is still a car) is a crazy idea. Op finds that perfectly fine but when people decide to do the same for btc, he goes nuts. Hypocrisy. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: btc-room101 on December 04, 2018, 07:02:28 AM Wow does the OP realize that not one in a 1,000 on this board can understand what he just said?
BITCOIN is proof that the education system has collapsed, and that the majority coming out are morons. We all know that the majority of our HODL-ers are 'millennial' and such, just getting by, but trying to get rich quick, and bitcoin came along and promised them the moon. But you can't explain this concept of intrinsic value to a moron? How its impossible. Just like when you ask the morons, "Where is the missing $600 Billion USD going to come from to bring BITCOIN back to prior values", they will not answer the question, because they're incapable of such thought. ... OP is correct, you can be QUANT, or a math or physics guy and bitcoin makes no sense, there is no way to even calculate volatility, or any common mean-reversion algo, largely now because of the parabolic-rise and its collapse. BITCOIN is what it is, "Virtual Money", really no different than money used in "Farmland", or any VR program online, the fact that it can be traded in the physical world is very thin, But while the MORONS feel confident that bitcoin will return to the 'moon' the quants scratch their ass and say "How do we model this bitch?" and you can't guess you can't model virtual-currency, using physical asset modelling, so maybe we need to find a new way to model virtual assets, but the models would still worthless in the real world. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: btc-room101 on December 04, 2018, 07:06:02 AM I remember these type of posts in 2015 while the price went down to $200 from $1200. If you don't be careful, you'll find yourself selling your coins for a loss. This is what this posts aims. Good old FUD. Just like op thinks bugatti veyron is a better car than dacia and he sees the reason about the price of a bugatti, apparently people think the same for bitcoin since it is the leading crypto currency. To him bugatti and dacia prices makes sense apparently. Try to explain a bugatti's price to somebody who lives in Africa. He'll look at you like your a lunatic. For most people, spending that much money on a car (no matter how good it is it is still a car) is a crazy idea. Op finds that perfectly fine but when people decide to do the same for btc, he goes nuts. Hypocrisy. It's the theory of large numbers, back in 2015 when capitalization was in the millions, anything was possible, including 2x-4x roller coaster rides, In 2017 when BITCOIN came near $1 Trillion USD capitalization you entered astronomic happenstance, there is no way for this bitch to go back up there, its down for the count. All parabolic rises end this way, in the TOILET Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: btc-room101 on December 04, 2018, 07:13:54 AM How can we do that for Bitcoin? mining cost equilibrium is the bottom line value its its cheaper to mine then buy people mine if its cheaper to buy than mine people buy. so look for the most effiecient mining cost and you learn the bottom line mining cost which miners wont sell below you soon learn the number of times the price went below bottomline mining costs ovr many years is negligable because people are not fooilish Mining was rational when profitable and you could sell to a sucker, as you mined, HODL was always a MORON position. Buying BTC with real cash, was NEVER rational. Getting BTC for free 2009-2014 by mining was rational, buy bitcoin is when the exchanges showed up and pimps, and the bullshitters and pump&dump team that run btc today. Now that mining is no longer profitable, the easy game is over, now only morons will buy bitcoin, which means its going to zero, because the smart guys will sell-out, and find a new ponzi. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: VaLeRaaa on December 04, 2018, 07:45:22 AM I don't agree that this is the undeniable evidence that btc is a scam because it is a good coin with the huge potential and I m sure it will prove this in 2019 as most experts believe in its power A well-known political figure also expressed a similar opinion.“Blockchain itself is a mathematical technological concept and an interesting and important methodology,” the tech investor said. “Cryptocurrencies — bitcoin and all the others — that’s a Ponzi scheme.” Barak said he doesn’t believe that “it’s possible to make a currency in this way in the current generation.” Accordingly, he will not invest in crypto. “I wouldn’t invest in anything that’s related to cryptocurrencies,” he said. https://www.ccn.com/bitcoin-is-a-ponzi-scheme-says-former-israel-prime-minister-ehud-barak/ Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: mindrust on December 04, 2018, 09:28:50 AM It's the theory of large numbers, back in 2015 when capitalization was in the millions, anything was possible, including 2x-4x roller coaster rides, In 2017 when BITCOIN came near $1 Trillion USD capitalization you entered astronomic happenstance, there is no way for this bitch to go back up there, its down for the count. People said the same thing when btc reach $10bn for the first time and went down to 2-3bn. We are only above x7 of the previous ATH Market Cap. That's nothing. We will be looking at a multi trillion market cap in a few years. All parabolic rises end this way, in the TOILET Really? All parabolic rises you said? How about this? https://i.ibb.co/NVTSmrS/dd.png and... https://i.ibb.co/VYYXM3T/ddf.png Now show me the dead fucking parabolic rise in 2014 if you can fucking find it on the chart you fucking genius newbie account. Mining was rational when profitable and you could sell to a sucker, as you mined, HODL was always a MORON position. Buying BTC with real cash, was NEVER rational. Getting BTC for free 2009-2014 by mining was rational, buy bitcoin is when the exchanges showed up and pimps, and the bullshitters and pump&dump team that run btc today. Now that mining is no longer profitable, the easy game is over, now only morons will buy bitcoin, which means its going to zero, because the smart guys will sell-out, and find a new ponzi. According to you nobody should be mining now, yet people still do! What about that??? Did you know there was a difficulty adjustment in case people stop mining? Do you? Apparently you don't. Go read a book moron. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: btc-room101 on December 04, 2018, 09:34:24 AM It's the theory of large numbers, back in 2015 when capitalization was in the millions, anything was possible, including 2x-4x roller coaster rides, In 2017 when BITCOIN came near $1 Trillion USD capitalization you entered astronomic happenstance, there is no way for this bitch to go back up there, its down for the count. People said the same thing when btc reach $10bn for the first time and went down to 2-3bn. We are only above x7 of the previous ATH Market Cap. That's nothing. We will be looking at a multi trillion market cap in a few years. All parabolic rises end this way, in the TOILET Really? All parabolic rises you said? How about this? https://i.ibb.co/NVTSmrS/dd.png and... https://i.ibb.co/VYYXM3T/ddf.png Now show me the dead fucking parabolic rise in 2014 if you can fucking find it on the chart you fucking genius newbie account. Mining was rational when profitable and you could sell to a sucker, as you mined, HODL was always a MORON position. Buying BTC with real cash, was NEVER rational. Getting BTC for free 2009-2014 by mining was rational, buy bitcoin is when the exchanges showed up and pimps, and the bullshitters and pump&dump team that run btc today. Now that mining is no longer profitable, the easy game is over, now only morons will buy bitcoin, which means its going to zero, because the smart guys will sell-out, and find a new ponzi. According to you nobody should be mining now, yet people still do! What about that??? Did you know there was a difficulty adjustment in case people stop mining? Do you? Apparently you don't. Go read a book moron. Well your 2014 graph clearly shows a 75% loss after a parabolic-rise, and that by definition is a toilet run in loss. Your second graph 2017 parabolic ponzi rise, just shows the bitcoin going to $21k, but fails to show it falling to $3k, which is another 90% loss, that wiped most people out. All parabolic rises end this way, Now the problem now is where do you folks get the new $600 billion USD to get btc back up to or above $21k?? You don't, you can't, When people lose 75%, or 90% of their money, and they bought shit on margin, they're wiped out for life. Most of the morons bought in the recent sucker rally on credit-cards, and they're in debt for life. They're screwed, and people like you don't even care. Lastly, please don't post charts, we have all seen these stupid charts they don't help the discussion. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: mindrust on December 04, 2018, 10:00:01 AM Most of the morons bought in the recent sucker rally on credit-cards, and they're in debt for life. They're screwed, and people like you don't even care. These are assumptions. I bought when it was $15k. I didn't go all in however like you think i did. I was Dollar cost averaging like I was doing since the previous year. Weren't there people who bought btc with credits? Probably yes. Are they morons? Yes they are. How can people's stupidity affect bitcoin's intrinsic value? It doesn't. If those people haven't had bought bitcoins in 2018 January, they were going to buy something else and still going to lose their money. That's called dumb money. And again, even if they were dumb in 2014 just before Gox collapsed, they still did well in 2018. They weren't that dumb after all!! (unless they were using borrowed money) You like to throw assumptions without anything to back it up. In other means, You are FUD'ing. Go do it more. I'm buying all your cheap coins. Make it cheaper. See you in 2021. I don't think you'll be around. Time will tell. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: pat4cryptoreal on December 04, 2018, 10:23:34 AM This analysis of yours sounds legit and current. But let me just tell you that it is just an hypothesis that you have not gotten a concrete prove yet. Do more research to validate your assumption. Some of the technology you are thinking they are widely accepted across the globe may not survive if they pass through the amount of pressure and attack bitcoin is passing through.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 04, 2018, 12:38:44 PM Monetary transactions are enabled by internet and miners equipment, not by Bitcoin. The internet alone, by itself, does not enable monetary transactions. What do you think pays for the mining infrastructure? Because you stated above that transactions are enabled by the internet and miners. Obviously the internet by itself can't enable transactions, so in this case miners are required. But what do you think pays for mining? (spoiler alert: Bitcoin does. No native token, no mining, no permissionless monetary transactions via the internet) To repeat: The utility of cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin is monetary transactions. Whether Bitcoin is overpriced or undervalued is a different question, of course. But if you accept that banks, credit card companies and money transmitters (and by extension their respective stocks and bonds) have utility, you also have to accept that cryptocurrencies do. Everything else is just cherry picking. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: FuryBeast on December 04, 2018, 12:44:22 PM Bitcoin is not scam. At least it's supported by the blockchain technology. Bitcoin is very manipulative, but this doesn't mean it's scam.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: pucunghul on December 04, 2018, 12:55:51 PM I never thought bitcoin was a scam, which was used to deceive people in the form of investment, if bitcoin is a scam bitcoin won't last for 10 years, and there is a lot of evidence bitcoin isn't a scam because there are many, successful people and become billionaires the result of investing and trading in bitcoin.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: sinkfish on December 04, 2018, 12:58:45 PM bitcoin is proven legit, the price is manipulative, but doesnt mean its a scam.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: CryptoBull31 on December 04, 2018, 01:12:01 PM Bitcoin is the most advanced value storing and transferring technology ever developed, making a sovereign store of value possible - no government or bank can censor your money - and it can be moved within minutes to any place on the planet, essentially making it a free alternative to offshore banking available to anyone. When you look at bitcoin as a technology within a certain socio-economic context it is obvious that bitcoin is greately underpriced, whether it is 3,000$ or 15,000$ for a bitcoin it is still underpriced.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 04, 2018, 02:10:14 PM Monetary transactions are enabled by internet and miners equipment, not by Bitcoin. The internet alone, by itself, does not enable monetary transactions. What do you think pays for the mining infrastructure? Because you stated above that transactions are enabled by the internet and miners. Obviously the internet by itself can't enable transactions, so in this case miners are required. But what do you think pays for mining? (spoiler alert: Bitcoin does. No native token, no mining, no permissionless monetary transactions via the internet) To repeat: The utility of cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin is monetary transactions. Whether Bitcoin is overpriced or undervalued is a different question, of course. But if you accept that banks, credit card companies and money transmitters (and by extension their respective stocks and bonds) have utility, you also have to accept that cryptocurrencies do. Everything else is just cherry picking. Ability to transfer something (money, bitcoin, text, picture or whatever) is indeed - utility. But this ability belongs to the transferring system, and not to the thing that is transferred. Everything can be transferred via some transferring system but that doesn't mean everything has utility. Picture has utility because it is used by art lovers for the fulfillment of their aesthetic senses. Car has utility because it is used for driving. Dollar has utility because it is used for borrowing goods and services from the general population and returning them back later. Hence, these items can be both - transferred and utilized. But bitcoin is just an empty spreadsheet entry, and as such it cannot be utilized by anyone anywhere, but only transferred. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 04, 2018, 02:29:11 PM Ability to transfer something (money, bitcoin, text, picture or whatever) is indeed - utility. But this ability belongs to the transferring system, and not the thing that is transferred. Everything can be transferred via some transferring system but that doesn't mean everything has utility. Bitcoin is a spreadsheet entry and it has zero utility. Bitcoin the network can not function without Bitcoin the currency. These "spreadsheet entries" are what pays the miners, similar to how other "spreadsheet entries" pay bankers, marketers, developers, etc. These "spreadsheet entries" pay the transferring system. You can't have one without the other. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: SnapDown22 on December 04, 2018, 02:39:12 PM I don't think Bitcoin is a scam, they used to scam people, yeah, but its not a scam. what I know is that the scam from Bitcoin has been scanned a lot and I regret joining in at that time and I realized that it was a scam and I would not use telehgam againJust listen to this guy and get all answers: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJWCJCWOxBYSi5DhCieLOLQ Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 04, 2018, 02:52:50 PM Ability to transfer something (money, bitcoin, text, picture or whatever) is indeed - utility. But this ability belongs to the transferring system, and not the thing that is transferred. Everything can be transferred via some transferring system but that doesn't mean everything has utility. Bitcoin is a spreadsheet entry and it has zero utility. Bitcoin the network can not function without Bitcoin the currency. These "spreadsheet entries" are what pays the miners, similar to how other "spreadsheet entries" pay bankers, marketers, developers, etc. These "spreadsheet entries" pay the transferring system. You can't have one without the other. Of course, but the bottom line is this. "Spreadsheet entries" in the form of Dollar or Euro are created for the borrowing of goods and services from the general population and returning them back later. On the other hand, "spreadsheet entries" in the form of Bitcoin and Crypto are created for extracting goods and services from the general population without returning them back later. And that's the difference between a legitimate business and a scam. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: ecnalubma on December 04, 2018, 03:32:18 PM I think this is a ten year old debate, In my opinion bitcoin is not the real product but Blockchain technology is the real deal. Even Bitcoin will disappear the technology that it bring will change the whole concept of history, people dictates value of everything and sometimes even the most useless things becomes precious and valuable I think bitcoin is from those things.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: HeRetiK on December 04, 2018, 04:00:16 PM Of course, but the bottom line is this. "Spreadsheet entries" in the form of Dollar or Euro are created for the borrowing of goods and services from the general population and returning them back later. On the other hand, "spreadsheet entries" in the form of Bitcoin and Crypto are created for extracting goods and services from the general population without returning them back later. And that's the difference between a legitimate business and a scam. If you are referring to the circular flow of income -- that applies to Bitcoin as well, not just fiat currencies. You can get paid in Bitcoin for goods and services and you can in turn use Bitcoin to pay for goods and services yourself. You can buy mining hardware using Bitcoin, pay your electricty bill using bitcoins you mined and spend the remaining bitcoins on Pizzas or whatever else you need. Granted, there's friction with the classical banking system (ie. when converting to fiat) but if you stay within a closed circuit of crypto it's rather frictionless, especially globally speaking (anyone who ever sent money abroad will know, as well as anyone who ever ran a small online business with international customers). Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: waitforme on December 04, 2018, 04:03:58 PM Do you think banks are always the biggest trap in the world? Altcoins are headquartered and officially operated. Why be scared and worried that it is a scam? You can see that the way and operation of Crypto are the same, trading activities depend on trading. I believe Bitcoin is not a scam.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: wdnj on December 04, 2018, 04:10:42 PM whatever anyone will tell bitcoin is not a scam but the system doing what bitcoin can be.
this limit the demand from the people from BTC uses. there are more important thing than participating in a scam one. all we need to have is the knowledge on it. if you dont anything then never invest! Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: fxsurfer on December 04, 2018, 04:42:22 PM Of course, but the bottom line is this. "Spreadsheet entries" in the form of Dollar or Euro are created for the borrowing of goods and services from the general population and returning them back later. On the other hand, "spreadsheet entries" in the form of Bitcoin and Crypto are created for extracting goods and services from the general population without returning them back later. And that's the difference between a legitimate business and a scam. If you are referring to the circular flow of income -- that applies to Bitcoin as well, not just fiat currencies. You can get paid in Bitcoin for goods and services and you can in turn use Bitcoin to pay for goods and services yourself. You can buy mining hardware using Bitcoin, pay your electricty bill using bitcoins you mined and spend the remaining bitcoins on Pizzas or whatever else you need. Granted, there's friction with the classical banking system (ie. when converting to fiat) but if you stay within a closed circuit of crypto it's rather frictionless, especially globally speaking (anyone who ever sent money abroad will know, as well as anyone who ever ran a small online business with international customers). No, I am referring to the fact that for every dollar that is in circulation, there is a borrower who was issued a loan and used loan created dollars to get(borrow) goods and services from the general population. For that reason he is legally obligated - by the loan contract (backed by collateral), to return dollars back to the issuer (bank), and in the process have less purchasing power for goods and services. That is how he "returns" borrowed goods and services back to the general population. On the other hand, bitcoin miner used bitcoins to extract dollars, goods and services from the general population, but unlike borrower, he has no obligation to return goods and services back to the general population. Thus, unlike Dollar, Bitcoin is not debt instrument that reduces purchasing power of borrowers through the banking system. Hence, in the first instance we have: 'borrowing goods and services from the general population - returning goods and services back to the general population', which is legitimate. In the second instance we have "extracting goods and services from the general population", which is a scam. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: blockoption on December 04, 2018, 04:52:26 PM What's the objective value of a secure triple ledger system with worldwide adoption? Good question.Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Lochshire on January 09, 2019, 05:04:46 AM No, I am referring to the fact that for every dollar that is in circulation, there is a borrower who was issued a loan and used loan created dollars to get(borrow) goods and services from the general population. For that reason he is legally obligated - by the loan contract (backed by collateral), to return dollars back to the issuer (bank), and in the process have less purchasing power for goods and services. That is how he "returns" borrowed goods and services back to the general population. On the other hand, bitcoin miner used bitcoins to extract dollars, goods and services from the general population, but unlike borrower, he has no obligation to return goods and services back to the general population. Thus, unlike Dollar, Bitcoin is not debt instrument that reduces purchasing power of borrowers through the banking system. Hence, in the first instance we have: 'borrowing goods and services from the general population - returning goods and services back to the general population', which is legitimate. In the second instance we have "extracting goods and services from the general population", which is a scam. So your objection to Bitcoin is that it doesn't follow socialist style flow of funds and instead follows capitalist flow of funds? Using this logic then paying with cash instead of credit or a loan would also be a scam as it follows the exact flow that Crypto does. Every dollar in circulation is NOT the result of a loan. If you borrow money then it would be, but if you earn it then it is not a loan as you are free to keep it as long as you want and never spend it. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: GaPR on January 09, 2019, 06:39:17 AM I feel that this topic is published and maintained with a single purpose: - find the idiots who will now sell their BTC, at these prices.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: nutildah on January 09, 2019, 07:46:22 AM OP's long-winded post does not constitute "proof" of anything.
If you buy bitcoin just to HODL it and hope for a miracle, well, that's your decision. Nobody is forcing anybody to buy bitcoin. If you buy bitcoin to use it for what it was intended: an easy way to move currency on the internet and across borders, then you're not losing anything except from purchase and transaction fees. I use BTC just about every day, for purchases, to send money to people, to buy other coins, to buy phone data, and then for recreational stuff like sports gambling. There's no authority telling me I should or have to buy bitcoin; I do it out of my own free will, just like everybody else. Edit: I just saw this topic was created on Dec 3rd. How can we do that for Bitcoin? mining cost equilibrium is the bottom line value its its cheaper to mine then buy people mine if its cheaper to buy than mine people buy. so look for the most effiecient mining cost and you learn the bottom line mining cost which miners wont sell below you soon learn the number of times the price went below bottomline mining costs ovr many years is negligable because people are not fooilish Still feel the same way franky? This theory is now officially out the window. Most miners are now mining at a loss. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: kalel18 on January 09, 2019, 01:08:25 PM It depends upon situation how to transact with the bitcoin holder, and if you want a high price or negotiable price so be it buy if you want and make it a profitable. In that case you are the one how to hold your money how to use it and if bitcoin scam you blame your self because you chose to.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: gabmen on January 10, 2019, 01:27:40 PM Do you think banks are always the biggest trap in the world? Altcoins are headquartered and officially operated. Why be scared and worried that it is a scam? You can see that the way and operation of Crypto are the same, trading activities depend on trading. I believe Bitcoin is not a scam. Well the so called "proofs" Can be seen in a lot of different perspectives. And people who against bitcoin may very well find a lot of these to draw others away from btc. But people who have been dealing with bitcoin for a long time now know that it's anything but a scam Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Krsps on July 14, 2019, 06:35:54 AM Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are here to stay. Money, any form of money is based on trust and Bitcoin's trust is growing by leaps and bounds, all the time.
This is just a partial list. Bitcoin now accepted: Cheap air Expedia Microsoft Wikipedia Overstock.com Tiger direct.com KFC Subway Subs Name cheap Playboy A.T.&T. Starbucks Hotels You can buy gifts cards for Amazon.com K-mart Home depot and hundreds of others business. Video games And now so many online stores and business from newspapers to charities, to real estate, to shop keepers restaurants, and growing... https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin/who-accepts/ The fear is there because it is unregulated by the government. But most of this fear is from the government itself, and their propaganda. According to different reports you would have a hard time getting a government job, or even passing a security clearance if you own a cryptocurrency account. https://www.stripes.com/news/us/bitcoin-a-shadowy-realm-as-us-weighs-security-clearances-1.529596 The governments are going to hold put as long as possible on legitimizing bitcoin and cryptocurrencies but they already have a foothold worldwide. It may change an dgo up and down but it's not going away..and has as much chance as being stable as any other money, because people and companies are putting their trust in it. As far as being a scam and anybody's brother's losing his life savings, or anybody at all and losing it...that is tragic! But hardly because it is a scam. It's from bad luck, poor trimming, and bad judgment. Who would put their family at risk but gamblers? And you don't need bitcoin for that. Anybody can gamble and lose any kind of money. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Anonylz on July 14, 2019, 07:29:13 AM I wouldn't say btc is a scam but highly manipulated yes, someone that bought btc at $1000 won't see it from your own perspective, even though it is not very clear what determines the price of btc when it increases so much within a short period and then slow down or go way below, still can not regard it as scam.
Title: Bitcoin is not a scam Post by: Baronets on July 14, 2019, 09:00:24 AM Sorry guys, but I haven't read all of the replies, but I would like to make a couple of comments.
Most financial instruments are scam(ish) designed for the benefit of the bankers, and not for the retail investors. Mining has no relevance to the value of Bitcoin in my opinion. All of the Bitcoin that will ever exist have already been created. Mining for new blocks is relevant to the support of the coin transfer and registration infrastructure only. Bitcoin will continue after the last mining reward has been allocated. The value of an item is determined by market forces ultimately, and this is why a wooden table constructed by me is worth less than a table constructed by a professional carpenter. The creation of a cryptographic proof of work has added a new category to the range of virtual assets. Bitcoin is one of only a few coins that really do have a value as a virtual asset. Title: Re: Bitcoin is not a scam Post by: nutildah on July 14, 2019, 09:09:45 AM Mining has no relevance to the value of Bitcoin in my opinion. All of the Bitcoin that will ever exist have already been created. You sure about that? Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Dapper on July 14, 2019, 11:09:34 AM Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Look at all the people who think that XRP, BCH, PAX, etc. are the future of crypto. LOL.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Krsps on July 17, 2019, 02:14:19 AM Bitcoin now accepted: Cheap air Expedia Microsoft Wikipedia Overstock.com Tiger direct.com KFC Subway Subs Name cheap Playboy A.T.&T. Starbucks Hotels You can buy gifts cards for Amazon.com K-mart Home depot and hundreds of others business. Video games And now so many online stores and business from newspapers to charities, to real estate, to shop keepers restaurants, and growing... https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin/who-accepts/ As an addendum to this, if you are buying a gift card at less than cost price, then you are almost certainly buying a gift card which has been stolen, or bought with stolen ("carded") credit card details. If this gift card is reported as being stolen or fraudulent obtained, and you use it, you will obviously lose the value as the card, and also run the risk of losing your account. With Amazon this can also mean a permanent blacklist of your address and other accounts details (email, credit card number, etc.) If you are going to trade bitcoins for gift cards, best to stick to a big retailer such as Bitrefill. ...Although, I've seen even most trusted users turning into scammers, ... Since I put buying gift cards with btc as partial proof its not a scam, I would hate for anyone to get scammed by buying gift cards. - By either giving you a used gift card number - Or giving you a gift card worth less than what's promised - Worst would be when they leave you without giving anything to you and just run away with your BTC, And as you know, BTC is irreversible so you can't even claim anything back. So, be very much aware of the purchases you make and always look for a very trustworthy guy to purchase such things. I won't advice about any escrow because my experience says that nobody will accept to become an escrow for such deals due to the fact that they can't check the gift card for you and they won't bet their dignity for some bucks where you may come up and say that the escrow cheated you by redeeming the code himself. So I am including some information brought up by other members to beware of buying gift cards and only buy from sites that are more reliable. One is Bitrefill. There are infinite ways to get scammed, unfortunately. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: 42K on August 06, 2019, 09:03:32 PM I think everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. There's no way bitcoin can be scam because what bitcoin is marvelously doing in cryptocurrency is really great. There are times coins that are created into the system tend to be scam but that shouldn't be applied to bitcoin. Bitcoin will forever survive.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Kapyong on August 07, 2019, 02:15:16 AM Bollocks.
'Scam' means a dishonest rip-off. There is no dishonesty in BTC, and no-one is being ripped off. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: giantrobot on August 07, 2019, 02:42:20 AM Your article is great and detailed, your opinion has been discussed from many previous articles, but in my personal opinion Bitcoin is the currency that holds the virtual currency market.
Like gold, silver and diamonds, Bitcoin has no real value. Its value depends on rarity as well as depending on the ability to hold the market so it has a high price when converted into currency. You know, our market will grow in the direction of cash removal and replacement with virtual money, so the value of virtual money has been determined to be converted from cash. That's why high-value Bitcoin is not so strange because it is a potential currency. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: ghost424 on August 07, 2019, 09:50:00 AM There is one simple and quick way to determine that Bitcoin is scam, and that is: market price evaluation. In the case of legitimate market instruments, one can easily evaluate whether they are overpriced or underpriced in the market. However, in the case of Bitcoin this is impossible. Examples: If a bond with a face value of 1,000 dollars, a coupon of 5% and maturity in 2 years, is priced at 500 we immediately know it is underpriced. If priced at 2,000, we know it is overpriced. If an egg is priced the same as pizza we immediately know it is overpriced because these items are used for satisfying human needs and we empirically know that the utilization capacity of egg is lower that that of pizza. If a guy was granted a loan in the amount of 1000 units of fiat money and used only his Dacia Logan as collateral, but then he manages to buy a brand-new Bugatti Veyron for that money, we immediately know that one unit of his money was overpriced because the utilization capacity of Dacia Logan is lower than that of Bugatti Veyron. And finally, if the book value of a stock is 50 dollars we know that if it is priced at 10 it is underpriced, if priced at 1,000 it is overpriced. As we can see, in all these examples we have objective, neutral and price independent factors that set up the level for determining whether something is overpriced or underpriced. How can we do that for Bitcoin? What objective measurements set up the above mentioned level? How would we know if Bitcoin is underpriced or overpriced? Well, it is impossible to know this. Bitcoin is not a company, so it cannot be evaluated through book value or earnings. It is not a debt asset like bonds or fiat currencies, so it cannot be evaluated through face value or collateral. Bitcoin is not good or service, so it cannot be evaluated through utilization capacity. In short, it is impossible in principle to know whether Bitcoin is overpriced or underpriced. And that simply confirms the fact that there is nothing behind Bitcoin. There is no underlying value for evaluating the investment into Bitcoin. This can be best seen through the comparison with fiat. Although, at first sight, it seems that fiat currencies have no underlying value, this is not true. Why? Well, because today's dollars or euros are debt based assets, i.e. they are products designed for people who want to consume goods and services today and return them in the future. These people are called borrowers. When the banks grant them loans, new dollars or euros are put into cirtualtion, which are then used for access to the pool of goods and services that gets filled via economic activity of the general population. But since borrowers have to repay their debt with salaries they received for their economic activity - for their contribution to that pool of goods and services, this reduces their purchasing power, i.e. access to the pool. In this way they return goods and services back to the general population. All this is backed by collateral, and in case of borrowers default, their land, cars, houses and other property will end up in the pool of goods and services for the general population to buy with fiat that borrowers put into circulation. Now, are miners - those who put bitcoin into circulation, and in that way also receive goods and services from the general population, obligated to return goods and services back to the general population? No , they are not. Is bitcoin backed by land, cars, houses and other property of Bitcoin miners? Obviously it is not. So fiat currencies are debt assets backed by collateral and this is their underlying value. Bitcoin on the other hand has no such value, and it is a scam - fake money/asset, designed to extract goods and services from the general population. That is why one can invest into Bitcoin only on the basis of guesses, opinions, beliefs, or conjectures about its future value. These are then spread through advertisements and propaganda to attract new investors. And this is exactly how investment scams operate - in the absence of underlying value, all kinds of manipulative tactics are used to attract new investors. Bitcoin is therefore a classical investment scam. It's just that it's well masked as a market instrument. The statement is somehow misleading and might give people the idea to stop supporting Bitcoin. Some users have already used Bitcoin as their front on their Business to give people hope because if they are only given the Good Side of Bitcoin, then people will already believe it. Some investors do not have enough knowledge to know what is true about Bitcoin. If you are defaming Bitcoin and telling people that it is an scam, then why do you keep using it and why the effort to defame it? Can you gain something from it? Everybody here in the forum must have gained something from Bitcoin not just Financially but also the Knowledge it gave us about Blockchain Technology. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: joe50 on August 07, 2019, 10:02:54 AM If BTC is scam, i believe everything is scam, GOLD, USD, all currency.
The value of USD back years and what it can purchase back years is nothing to compare this era. Everyday, all currency depreciate and things goes higher than expected and more money required to purchase stuff. Everything is scam. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Johnzky on August 07, 2019, 10:41:19 AM You are correct So why still in here?whats the purpose of you and OP being in cryptocurrency if the legitimacy of the first and pioneer crypto coin(in which Bitcoin)is a scam?The problem is that many Bitcoin "investors" in here are either too stupid to understand they have been scammed, or are too ashamed to admit it. Instead, like a sultry 4-year old, they stomp their feet and cry "FUD" and "Buy the dip" and "HODL" Does it much more better if you and your folks leave this market and find your life outside this community?we are all free choose which way to go and we fin bitcoin as valid.so if in your part that this is scam the free to go and let us stay here Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Turk Ace on August 07, 2019, 07:46:21 PM NICE FUD POST XD XD XD get a life kay?
I am still waiting for your proof? Why are you even here? Spamming up the forum your complete and utter shit. Do you even know what you are talking about or did you just copy paste this to trigger people? Nothing you said makes any sense and clearly have no understanding of how trade worls and why we use currrency. I suggest you gain a basical understanding of the economy. You are correct The problem is that many Bitcoin "investors" in here are either too stupid to understand they have been scammed, or are too ashamed to admit it. Instead, like a sultry 4-year old, they stomp their feet and cry "FUD" and "Buy the dip" and "HODL" Why are you here? Well I have a house full of stuff I bought with this so called "scam" I also have work because of it. You are correct So why still in here?whats the purpose of you and OP being in cryptocurrency if the legitimacy of the first and pioneer crypto coin(in which Bitcoin)is a scam?The problem is that many Bitcoin "investors" in here are either too stupid to understand they have been scammed, or are too ashamed to admit it. Instead, like a sultry 4-year old, they stomp their feet and cry "FUD" and "Buy the dip" and "HODL" Does it much more better if you and your folks leave this market and find your life outside this community?we are all free choose which way to go and we fin bitcoin as valid.so if in your part that this is scam the free to go and let us stay here Lol ikr. The person is clearly a moron xD Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: killat on August 12, 2019, 08:29:03 PM As a lot of people said before me, money in general is a scam. We print papers and agree they have x value. They don't have it inherently.
Once upon a time, a country could print money only if it had gold to back it up. Now that's not true anymore, so goverments (actually the private banks that print money for them) make money appear from thin air. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: erricducducan26 on August 12, 2019, 08:40:38 PM You've choosen a really hyping title ha
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Meysa_richa on August 12, 2019, 10:49:30 PM If true this Bitcoin is a fraud, then the person who did it is a super person or a large group.
For being able to deceive people all over the World. And this is amazing! Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: rodel caling on August 12, 2019, 10:57:01 PM I don't think Bitcoin is a scam, they used to scam people, yeah, but its not a scam. Just listen to this guy and get all answers: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJWCJCWOxBYSi5DhCieLOLQ Exactly mate bitcoin is useful for good and to give convient to the users, people are the scammers not the bitcoin itself, scammers use bitcoin for bad intentions to get easy and quick earnings. Simple to enjoy how to avoid become a scam victims use bitcoin wisely do not trust without any investigation or study about the project you want try to invest. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: mirakal on August 12, 2019, 11:36:24 PM Bitcoin to survive this long, I don't think we can still call it a scam, it's like you are calling a gold a scam because bitcoin is a gold in the internet and it has even better usage than gold. Bitcoin has increase its adoption as it's already accepted in big companies now, and those gambling industry are benefiting a lot with bitcoin also and personally I do gamble and I enjoy being anonymous using bitcoin, so as long as bitcoin is not ban, we will see an increasing demand from that industry alone, how about the demand on other industry as well, I'm sure if we will sum up it will be huge.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Daniel91 on August 30, 2019, 03:47:29 PM Bitcoin to survive this long, I don't think we can still call it a scam, it's like you are calling a gold a scam because bitcoin is a gold in the internet and it has even better usage than gold. Bitcoin has increase its adoption as it's already accepted in big companies now, and those gambling industry are benefiting a lot with bitcoin also and personally I do gamble and I enjoy being anonymous using bitcoin, so as long as bitcoin is not ban, we will see an increasing demand from that industry alone, how about the demand on other industry as well, I'm sure if we will sum up it will be huge. Bitcoin has more and more users every day and also more and more merchants are adopting bitcoin, even governments or state-owned firms as Croatian post recently. After all, if I can pay for a product or service with bitcoin and a merchant can get a fiat money for that bitcoin easily and immediately, what is the problem here? Isn't the pension system a real fraud? Pensioners receive money from younger people who are still working but there are less and less young people every day and the pension system collapsing like a tower of cards :) It's classic ponzi in my opinion. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Zionatin on September 12, 2019, 10:45:01 PM Such a troll post. Are you trying to ee how many people you can annoy? If bitcoin is a scam then I love this scam. In fact it is the best scam ever. I would use this scam 100x before I ever use fiat again. Fiat is worse then a scam so what does that make fiat?
Don't feed the troll please. Unless you feed him so fat he pops ^^ Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: elisabetheva on September 14, 2019, 07:04:24 AM If true this Bitcoin is a fraud, then the person who did it is a super person or a large group. agree, why so far many people have used and done a lot of activities with bitcoin. if it is indeed a fraud, then so many people in this world have been lied to and deceived? does that make sense? no one forbids giving a different statement, but the majority of the statements are decisive.For being able to deceive people all over the World. And this is amazing! Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: antisocial77 on September 14, 2019, 12:39:40 PM honesty i didnt read it. its obvious that you posted this just for fun (i hope) if you are serious, its worse, means you dont know anything about it and you have to research better and dont make us laught at you.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Ryker1 on September 14, 2019, 06:11:44 PM If true this Bitcoin is a fraud, then the person who did it is a super person or a large group. agree, why so far many people have used and done a lot of activities with bitcoin. if it is indeed a fraud, then so many people in this world have been lied to and deceived? does that make sense? no one forbids giving a different statement, but the majority of the statements are decisive.For being able to deceive people all over the World. And this is amazing! Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: muhhentuhhen on September 16, 2019, 05:50:29 PM I don't think that it's scam Behind BTC is very strong technology called blockchain.In my opinion bitcoin is proven legit. Bitcoin is often called a scam or a pyramid by those who did not buy it, for example, for $ 100, and now, watching the current rate, bite their elbows and console themselves with the fact that "all this will collapse soon." Another category of people who consider Bitcoin a scam is those who have a bitter experience in dealing with cryptocurrency fraud. Some guys, due to their lack of education, do not even try to understand what trading is. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: NewBet on September 29, 2019, 04:05:54 PM I don't think that it's scam Behind BTC is very strong technology called blockchain.In my opinion bitcoin is proven legit. Bitcoin is often called a scam or a pyramid by those who did not buy it, for example, for $ 100, and now, watching the current rate, bite their elbows and console themselves with the fact that "all this will collapse soon." Another category of people who consider Bitcoin a scam is those who have a bitter experience in dealing with cryptocurrency fraud. Some guys, due to their lack of education, do not even try to understand what trading is. Not only is Bitcoin called a scam or a pyramid by those who did not buy it, but also by those who bought it and sold it only for the price to sky rocket to the moon and they couldn't get back in. Also, by those people who don't understand it, who think that it's some random fake digital currency but don't understand the underlying blockchain technology. To be fair, most people aren't experts in it... but we understand the point of it. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: teosanru on September 29, 2019, 04:15:54 PM There is one simple and quick way to determine that Bitcoin is scam, and that is: market price evaluation. In the case of legitimate market instruments, one can easily evaluate whether they are overpriced or underpriced in the market. However, in the case of Bitcoin this is impossible. I don't know why this post from way back 6 months got bumped up but being a student of economics I would definitely love to answer this. It's absolutely true that the market comprises of all the assets of securities which are valued as per some underlying fair value. Now this in Economic or financial terms is called Intrinsic Value of that asset. Now does every asset has an intrinsic value?Examples: If a bond with a face value of 1,000 dollars, a coupon of 5% and maturity in 2 years, is priced at 500 we immediately know it is underpriced. If priced at 2,000, we know it is overpriced. If an egg is priced the same as pizza we immediately know it is overpriced because these items are used for satisfying human needs and we empirically know that the utilization capacity of egg is lower that that of pizza. If a guy was granted a loan in the amount of 1000 units of fiat money and used only his Dacia Logan as collateral, but then he manages to buy a brand-new Bugatti Veyron for that money, we immediately know that one unit of his money was overpriced because the utilization capacity of Dacia Logan is lower than that of Bugatti Veyron. And finally, if the book value of a stock is 50 dollars we know that if it is priced at 10 it is underpriced, if priced at 1,000 it is overpriced. As we can see, in all these examples we have objective, neutral and price independent factors that set up the level for determining whether something is overpriced or underpriced. How can we do that for Bitcoin? What objective measurements set up the above mentioned level? How would we know if Bitcoin is underpriced or overpriced? Well, it is impossible to know this. Bitcoin is not a company, so it cannot be evaluated through book value or earnings. It is not a debt asset like bonds or fiat currencies, so it cannot be evaluated through face value or collateral. Bitcoin is not good or service, so it cannot be evaluated through utilization capacity. In short, it is impossible in principle to know whether Bitcoin is overpriced or underpriced. And that simply confirms the fact that there is nothing behind Bitcoin. There is no underlying value for evaluating the investment into Bitcoin. Edit:just saw OP is banned so I don't think I am getting a reply :P This can be best seen through the comparison with fiat. Although, at first sight, it seems that fiat currencies have no underlying value, this is not true. Why? Well, because today's dollars or euros are debt based assets, i.e. they are products designed for people who want to consume goods and services today and return them in the future. These people are called borrowers. When the banks grant them loans, new dollars or euros are put into cirtualtion, which are then used for access to the pool of goods and services that gets filled via economic activity of the general population. But since borrowers have to repay their debt with salaries they received for their economic activity - for their contribution to that pool of goods and services, this reduces their purchasing power, i.e. access to the pool. In this way they return goods and services back to the general population. All this is backed by collateral, and in case of borrowers default, their land, cars, houses and other property will end up in the pool of goods and services for the general population to buy with fiat that borrowers put into circulation. Now, are miners - those who put bitcoin into circulation, and in that way also receive goods and services from the general population, obligated to return goods and services back to the general population? No , they are not. Is bitcoin backed by land, cars, houses and other property of Bitcoin miners? Obviously it is not. So fiat currencies are debt assets backed by collateral and this is their underlying value. Bitcoin on the other hand has no such value, and it is a scam - fake money/asset, designed to extract goods and services from the general population. That is why one can invest into Bitcoin only on the basis of guesses, opinions, beliefs, or conjectures about its future value. These are then spread through advertisements and propaganda to attract new investors. And this is exactly how investment scams operate - in the absence of underlying value, all kinds of manipulative tactics are used to attract new investors. Bitcoin is therefore a classical investment scam. It's just that it's well masked as a market instrument. Well to be true intrinsic value almost all want satisfying power is derived by the utility of each every person. Which means an asset which brings utility to me has a different value to me and a different to you. For example, If I am fond of pizza my utility for pizza will be higher and so will be the price I am willing to pay and same might not be true to you. So this is absolutely rubbish comparison. Coming to the fact that BTC is an sort of security so better is a comparison with fiat. You said that fiat has some great value because of the underlying debt. But the fact is that if it would have got it's value from underlying debt then it's value would have been negative. It is derived from the GDP of a country and demand supply forces. While BTC too has a protocol which may not be physical but intangible and that doesn't means this protocol has no value? Moreover, what about gold? it's value is merely because of its scarcity as a metal and lusture. It has no economic activity going on. Same is the way with BTC. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: 2double0 on September 29, 2019, 04:44:44 PM It is well worth nothing if you are trying to show it as a ponzi here because if there sustains higher demand always over the total 'limited' supply of something, then I don't think you can call it out a scam. Gold and Diamond are two other forms of classic assets which are given value based on their quality, purity, cuts and clarity 'for diamonds specially' but these were all made possible due to institutions that came and gave knowledge about these specific agendas of the metal and hard rock, else during ancient ages, who knew about all these properties? They just gave it a simple value based on which groceries, clothes and even shelter was used to be bought through these. Is Bitcoin any different here? There is a difference, Bitcoin is 2 steps ahead, it is advanced and robust to leave behind all these old assets, monetary types and their systems.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: NeironixNV on October 28, 2019, 01:29:53 PM I don't think that it's scam Behind BTC is very strong technology called blockchain.In my opinion bitcoin is proven legit. Bitcoin is often called a scam or a pyramid by those who did not buy it, for example, for $ 100, and now, watching the current rate, bite their elbows and console themselves with the fact that "all this will collapse soon." Another category of people who consider Bitcoin a scam is those who have a bitter experience in dealing with cryptocurrency fraud. Some guys, due to their lack of education, do not even try to understand what trading is. Not only is Bitcoin called a scam or a pyramid by those who did not buy it, but also by those who bought it and sold it only for the price to sky rocket to the moon and they couldn't get back in. Also, by those people who don't understand it, who think that it's some random fake digital currency but don't understand the underlying blockchain technology. To be fair, most people aren't experts in it... but we understand the point of it. A lot of people, I think Bitcoin is a pyramid, but neironix made it clear to me that these people are mistaken and do not understand the fundamental foundations and functioning of this system. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: panganib999 on October 28, 2019, 05:59:49 PM All of the above are valid concerns but hold true for gold and precious metals as well. Do you regard those as scams too? Well the post could really make sense and has a point, but maybe people are being blinded with features of bitcoin that they didn't found on fiat. One of those features could be the decentralization of bitcoin, making tyhe assets of users be free from the manipulation of the government which people or investors highly prefer for they want complete power over their assets, who wouldn't want to, right? Plus the convenience. So no matter how sensible the concern said above, if people don't wanna believe you, they won't.Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Ashong Salonga on October 28, 2019, 11:51:17 PM I do not think that bitcoin is a scam. It is proven that it helps a lot of people even though the price falls. Maybe some people says it is scam because they do not know the reason why it is falling. There is no enough reason to remove their doubts towards it.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: hermawan9416 on October 29, 2019, 10:20:12 AM Bitcoin is not a scam, it is an opportunity, and it is up to you to decide how you take advantage of this opportunity.
Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Youghoor on October 29, 2019, 12:11:09 PM There is one simple and quick way to determine that Bitcoin is scam, and that is: market price evaluation. In the case of legitimate market instruments, one can easily evaluate whether they are overpriced or underpriced in the market. However, in the case of Bitcoin this is impossible. Examples: If a bond with a face value of 1,000 dollars, a coupon of 5% and maturity in 2 years, is priced at 500 we immediately know it is underpriced. If priced at 2,000, we know it is overpriced. If an egg is priced the same as pizza we immediately know it is overpriced because these items are used for satisfying human needs and we empirically know that the utilization capacity of egg is lower that that of pizza. If a guy was granted a loan in the amount of 1000 units of fiat money and used only his Dacia Logan as collateral, but then he manages to buy a brand-new Bugatti Veyron for that money, we immediately know that one unit of his money was overpriced because the utilization capacity of Dacia Logan is lower than that of Bugatti Veyron. And finally, if the book value of a stock is 50 dollars we know that if it is priced at 10 it is underpriced, if priced at 1,000 it is overpriced. As we can see, in all these examples we have objective, neutral and price independent factors that set up the level for determining whether something is overpriced or underpriced. How can we do that for Bitcoin? What objective measurements set up the above mentioned level? How would we know if Bitcoin is underpriced or overpriced? Well, it is impossible to know this. Bitcoin is not a company, so it cannot be evaluated through book value or earnings. It is not a debt asset like bonds or fiat currencies, so it cannot be evaluated through face value or collateral. Bitcoin is not good or service, so it cannot be evaluated through utilization capacity. In short, it is impossible in principle to know whether Bitcoin is overpriced or underpriced. And that simply confirms the fact that there is nothing behind Bitcoin. There is no underlying value for evaluating the investment into Bitcoin. This can be best seen through the comparison with fiat. Although, at first sight, it seems that fiat currencies have no underlying value, this is not true. Why? Well, because today's dollars or euros are debt based assets, i.e. they are products designed for people who want to consume goods and services today and return them in the future. These people are called borrowers. When the banks grant them loans, new dollars or euros are put into cirtualtion, which are then used for access to the pool of goods and services that gets filled via economic activity of the general population. But since borrowers have to repay their debt with salaries they received for their economic activity - for their contribution to that pool of goods and services, this reduces their purchasing power, i.e. access to the pool. In this way they return goods and services back to the general population. All this is backed by collateral, and in case of borrowers default, their land, cars, houses and other property will end up in the pool of goods and services for the general population to buy with fiat that borrowers put into circulation. Now, are miners - those who put bitcoin into circulation, and in that way also receive goods and services from the general population, obligated to return goods and services back to the general population? No , they are not. Is bitcoin backed by land, cars, houses and other property of Bitcoin miners? Obviously it is not. So fiat currencies are debt assets backed by collateral and this is their underlying value. Bitcoin on the other hand has no such value, and it is a scam - fake money/asset, designed to extract goods and services from the general population. That is why one can invest into Bitcoin only on the basis of guesses, opinions, beliefs, or conjectures about its future value. These are then spread through advertisements and propaganda to attract new investors. And this is exactly how investment scams operate - in the absence of underlying value, all kinds of manipulative tactics are used to attract new investors. Bitcoin is therefore a classical investment scam. It's just that it's well masked as a market instrument. First and foremost, do you understand the principle and economics of demand and supply? This principle makes us understand that, when there is an increase in the need for a particular product with a fixed rate of the product been produced, the market value of that product increases with respect to the fixed production rate. In the opposite way, if the need for a product is fixed at a specific rate and there is an increase in its production, the market value of that product decreases. With bitcoin, this principle plays a specific role in its market value determination. Bitcoin is never a scam. How can a scam be in existence for ten good years without having problems and failures? People need to just accept the fact that bitcoin is the future of money... Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Baby Dragon on October 29, 2019, 12:53:52 PM Bitcoin is not a scam, it is an opportunity, and it is up to you to decide how you take advantage of this opportunity. It depends on a persons perception but I also think the same way because I know that it wasn't bitcoins fault to be associated with scams and no one wants to take the blame because scammers have different faces which makes it more difficult to find out the real scammers. There are a lot of people who used bitcoin to deceive others just to get the benefits that they wanted so I can't find any reason why it was accused as fraud. Its just that people doesn't have enough understanding between using it to scam and bitcoin is scam, well we don't have to force them to see it let them think what they want since we can't please everyone to like or understand bitcoin. Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: Clement Kaliyar on October 29, 2019, 01:24:54 PM I do not think that bitcoin is a scam. It is proven that it helps a lot of people even though the price falls. Maybe some people says it is scam because they do not know the reason why it is falling. There is no enough reason to remove their doubts towards it. Hope you have read what OP is telling, he is comparing to government bonds and its security to bitcoin which in itself is a dumb comparison . You cannot even claim the scam part with the falling prices, only stupid people who does not have any idea about any financial market will claim these stupid things.You are in the market for a long time and yet you are not sure whether bitcoin is a scam or not ::). Title: Re: Simple and undeniable proof that Bitcoin is a scam Post by: uray on October 29, 2019, 01:53:18 PM That is why one can invest into Bitcoin only on the basis of guesses, opinions, beliefs, or conjectures about its future value. These are then spread through advertisements and propaganda to attract new investors. And this is exactly how investment scams operate - in the absence of underlying value, all kinds of manipulative tactics are used to attract new investors. Before coming up with accusation you need to study and understand what you are talking about, bitcoin is not a private company to attract investors so that they can run with the money collected and if you understand the basic market structure you will not write these dumb things, still you have time to understand the market as everything is publicly available and i am sure you are not having the technical skill to understand the codes but if you can then you can test those too :P.Bitcoin is therefore a classical investment scam. It's just that it's well masked as a market instrument. |
