Bitcoin Forum

This morning I was contacted by Yobit about possibly managing their signature campaign. I'm looking for community opinions. I know Yobit has a shit reputation, but I also know that without some sort of moderation their campaign will flood the forum with megaspam. Mods will be so busy from reports of Yobit spammers that they will have no time for anything else.

I've been watching all the threads started on this subject in the last 24 hours as well. It's amazing how quickly this is starting to get out of hand. Replies like the image below are what gets me thinking pass on the campaign but look at the alternative.

https://i.imgur.com/2jyMdrv.png

So the question here is pass on the offer or would everyone rather see a manager attached to the campaign?

I have not officially been offered the position, I am just looking for opinions on the subject in case an offer is made.

For me, I isolate the manager vs. the campaign. I believe if you are able to target the spam and thoroughly manage the campaign properly, there should not be an issue. I know that you have been able to handle large numbers of participants in multiple concurrent campaigns at once and have the ability to manage one like this.

However, the issue that stands is that YoBit has orchestrated pump & dump events that they have publicized via emails. Moreover, they (in my opinion) are pretty shady, never mind the numerous complaints that have popped up: not exclusively scam reports but support ticket nonsense as well.

It's a tricky scenario in that we do want a manager to handle the campaign for spam. However, at the same time, you are managing the campaign for a company that is doing this kind of shady work.

It's kind of like picking the lesser of two evils. In my opinion, what's best for the forum is a manager working for YoBit.

This way, we avoid a wave of spam and we have some control over the participants. The only negative that we have is the association with the exchange but the alternative is letting them have free reign over the campaign (and potentially creating the wave thereof).

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I believe that a management of the campaign by yahoo (or any campaign manager, for that matter) would be in everyone's best interests.

It will be better if there is a campaign manager like you. If you or other campaign manager denied their offer they will accept negative trusted people and if so that will not be good for us. We will only waste time by reporting them and the mod will lose time by banning them also post on meta will be increased for those bans.

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If you accept their offer try to discuss with them that payment should be the same but post quantity should be 50% or less.

Yahoo62278, you're one of the best campaign managers on this forum, hands down.  I think you ought to accept the job, because I don't think the yobit campaign is going away no matter how many complaints there are.  We all know what kind of participants a campaign like yobit's attracts--people looking to maximize their earnings by making 20 posts a day--and it needs a manager who's tough and won't tolerate spamming.  You'd be perfect for the job.

As far as the scam accusations againt yobit go, I've seen many of them but I rarely see any follow-up on them, so I never really know if the issues were resolved.  I do think they have non-existant customer service, but I've traded on their site many times and have had no issues.  I don't think they're a scam exchange and I don't think anyone's reputation should be tainted by being associated with them.  And their campaign definitely needs a reputable manager like Yahoo62278 running things.

Keep in mind, from what I read on their campaign you can make a maximum of 20 posts per day but they are not telling users to make the max daily man. That choice is solely on the user of the forum. Chasing that paycheck.

If I took the job I would have full control on who is in or out and I would also be open to users pmming me about users in the campaign. I will not have control over payments or anything, just who is in the campaign or out. I will be able to remove users at my discretion. Sorta like I did with coinroll a year ago or so.

I want to reiterate that I have not been officially offered the job, only contacted about the possibility. Community opinion here is going to go a long way on my decision if the offer comes from the Exchange.

I would like to see any reputable manager at the front of this campaign. Having been a part of your campaigns, I have no doubt you could handle something of this size, and ensuring it's not a spammy shitshow. I posted elsewhere to this effect, but up until they are a proven scam or go beyond what the community tolerates as shady activity they are no different than another campaign, they just have history.

If you are open to recommendations, I would ask them to move to payments once a week or at least every couple of days. If they want to pay for a potential 140 posts in a week so be it, but maybe put something about blacklisting users found to be spamming to pad their stats. I think you already do that but can't remember.

If the choice is between manager and no manager - I'd rather see them hire a manager. If the choice is between yahoo and some random nobody - I'd rather see them hire yahoo. I would prefer to not have that campaign on Bitcointalk at all but that's not really a choice.

Better manage something else.

If yahoo62278 manage it what problem may happen? What will be a loss for the community? What will be loss of you? Why you are telling not to take this project? Do you think yahoo62278 is not fit for the project? Or do you think yobit will stop their marketing if yahoo62278 does not accept their project? Yobit is good at marketing they know very well than us what will be better for them. So, if you have any issue then tell that so that we can know about the issue.
edit:

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According to your post history (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=946119;sa=showPosts) you are fit to provide such a piece of advice without any elaboration.

You don't really need follow-up on these accusations to see that something is definitely going wrong on their site.

I'm not saying that the entire site is a scam, but they're definitely trying to wrestle away as much money from their customers as they can through Pump & Dumps, preying on the unknowingness of their "new" customers. (which is 100% gambling with really, really bad odds, without most users knowing it.), and their InvestBox, which, although they say it isn't, is the literal definition of a ponzi, where you receive x% of useless tokens daily.
https://yobit.net/en/investbox/ - "Tool for devs to promote their coins" - my ass.


There's a literal timer counting down until their next P&D IEO scam is happening. https://yobit.net/en/ico/timer/

Not to mention their questionable ticker practices; https://bitcoinexchangeguide.com/warning-russian-crypto-exchange-yobit-uses-ticker-name-to-fraud-traders/

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I'm not saying Yobit shouldn't be allowed to be promoted / that their members should be tagged, but it really shows to me these participants have no morals/don't care what they're promoting at all.
Perhaps i'm speaking from a position of luxury, and kind of hypocrite. I don't know. Might be just me.

I do not think his issue is with me personally but with the reputation of the Exchange. It's really a case of controlling the chaos IMO. Manager = control                    
no manager=chaos

Kinda like suchmoon implied, they're gonna run the campaign regardless. Rather some control vs no control?

I mean, it would be good for Yobit if you were managing it, but not for you. As you said, Yobit has shit reputation.

Control is an illusion.

I don't think it is required. I think yobit will check everything post count, payment, etc. The campaign manager will check either participant creating a quality post or not. If they can create a quality post then the manager won't do anything if they fail to create a quality post then the manager will remove from the campaign.
And for payment, few projects already here on bitcointalk who are paying more than yobit so I don't think payment rate should be lower.

I think this is more a situation of wether the forum population thinks this is advertising a shady exchange and whether you're ok taking money from a [potentially] shady website to promote it. I can't comment on your reputation as a manager or the exchange because I'm not that familiar with either, but using the spam the campaign will cause to try get the job seems a bit iffy to me though its good you've brought it up here for discission.


Wouldn't this be like saying there's always going to be drug cartels so I might as well do their admin and promotion for them because someones got to do it even if I don't [maybe an xtreme example but as above I think this is more a discussion about whether yobit should be promoted rather than anything else].


There's surely not just one option here. Can't the admins shut down these sorts of campaigns? Surely they can't be allowed to just spam everything everywhere??? Isn't this something the forum staff should be dealing with and prohibiting it it's such a big issue???


Maybe you running it is the lesser of two evils but you would obviously be very biased here because I'm assuming there's money on the line for you and youre not going to be running it for free.

I made comments in another similar thread abut yobit for further reading = https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5133795.msg50691004#msg50691004

As a campaign manager you have vast knowledge and you know better how to spot spammers. For that reason I think over spamming could be monitoring by you. Yeah its true that yobit has bad reputation where we have seen lot of issues in the past about them. In my opinion you can rise some conditions to continue their campaign management where i believe having a manager of yobit from this forum will be much helpful for community to solve issues that relates with yobit. You can continue if they are able to pass your own jurisdiction.

There are certain people who have even more of a laissez-faire attitude than me.

Objectively better for the forum. Though this is not cemented yet as he has not received an offer.

I'm sure that the amount of participants will be limited, either through a hard cap on the number directly or via the selection process indirectly.

If you do decide to manage yobit's campaign I would honestly suggest you to rather reduce the number of accepted posts per day, otherwise people are gonna make unnecessary redundant posts. Swear to god, it will be sp annoying to read the same posts being posted by the same people over and over again, only rephrased differently. I would suggest to reduce the number of posts, and increase the pay per post, so the campaign actually seems viable to manage.

Regarding the reputation, I can't say any good or bad things about yobit, not from my perspective. But yobit is very shady, at best, and have failed to properly communicate with their consumers. So when you decide to take up their campaign management, there's a fair amount of responsibility on you, if yobit takes time to payout, which could potentially take weeks and months.

Another point to be noted is that, there have been consequences for managers in the past for managing campaigns for questionably/shady/the ones that have proved to be a scam(eg. Bitconnect),so sort that out first. Use disclaimers, and inform users about the potential risks, and that you won't be held liable for things.

YoBit is pretty much shady in their activities over the past few years and there have been numerous unresolved accusations over them. Managing the campaign is equivalent to promoting/endorsing a shady scam even though you don't explicitly state in the topic or stand by them. You are a good manager and seems to endorse or manage only trustworthy exchanges, coins or websites campaigns. But YoBit doesn't seem to fit in any of these criteria. Along with that, even some of the non- shitposting members doesn't see through the websites they promote. Most of them blindly follow the words of the manager.  Also you need to hold an escrow of the payment since most of them never trust with YoBit and their shady past. Considering that, it would be better for you to turn off the YoBit campaign since that could surely hurt your reputation in the forum apart from the promotion of a shady service.

Secondly, the problem YoBit spammers create here recently. Since they have launched a shitty campaign to spam the forum to the maximum, it is better that someone should contact them at the earliest and limit the spammers. Spams generated from the YoBit guys can be controlled to quite an extent if each one of us take the initiative to report the shit posts. Controlling the spam is very much different from risking the reputation of yourselves and your work as a campaign manager over the years.

Recently, if every one of us were aware of the DuckDice campaign we would feel like it would be better if you don't get involved in the campaign to control the spam. notaek was tagged for being an escrow of the funds for the campaign which was launched by DuckDice themselves. I believe there would be some sort of serious consequence if you manage the campaign solely. (Either way, this is just my assumption)

I have to disagree to this ,the most part of responsibility goes to the campaign, when they tell forum users that they will pay up to 20 posts a day, then it's pretty clear that most if not all of them will try to maximize that number, and that's  140 posts a week per account.



True, and Yahoo is a decent manager indeed, but it all goes down to how many people they are going to accept, knowing that most of them will attempt 20 posts a day, if say they are accepting 100 members, that's 2000 posts a day for him to check, not sure if that is doable, he might just ruin his reputation by managing this campaign, so i would run the numbers before even thinking about accepting this.

good luck yahoo.

I think they would have to pay you something like $10 per user per day for it to be worth it. Theres gotta be at least a couple hundred people in the campaign.

I would ask them important questions, like since you are managing it do you get to make the rules for the campaign?

Glad to hear that you got a reply from Yobit.

Keep Yobit's shit reputation aside, because they've already lost their reputation here and nothing left to lose again for them...

But the most important thing I can think off now is to save the forum from spam and cheating and that's the thing only a good manager can do, no doubt you are a good manager with the capability to handle 100s of participants. I wrote "cheating" because if there is no manager then it is more likely we can expect multiple accounts enrolled. It's not about Yobit, it's about the campaign and the payments, we just can't allow cheaters.

If you don't take the job then they will run the campaign and you know what, they do not have any affection towards the forum and they will ruin the forum by allowing spam.
And another thing is we will be favoring cheaters if someone from the forum doesn't take the control.

Take the job and save the forum.

I don't know, but this sounds ironic on so many levels.

Extremely ironic I would say. I am totally against cheating bounty campaigns and I personally never did that even when I had more than one account (now have only this one active), but the managers here ABSOLUTELY ,TOTALLY do not give a shit who is in, they accept broken English members just because they have been given positive trust from DT and they opt to remove even good members who speak a decent English but they have negative trust.

This issue will never end, it is easier that mods ban people who do spam the forum rather than a person deciding who is in and who is out.

https://yobit.net/en/signature/details/

     Well, I certainly hope that yobit is going to be offering a premium wage for being the gatekeeper to their shitshow. It's going to be a great deal of work sifting through posts and finding spammers. Especially, when the campaign manager has no control over who joins in. I think that the last time yobit had this campaign, hilariousandco (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=164822), had the unpleasant task. (At least he was acting in that capacity for the brief time that I was on the yobit signature campaign, years ago.) I'm all for the OP taking this job since letting this sig campaign keep going on auto-pilot is quite an unpalatable option.

Yahoo, please take this job because this campaign urgently need manager. It's terrible to see what's happening on Bitcointalk in these days when campaign was relaunched. There are so many spammers wake up after long period of inactivity who joined this campaign and making 20 shiptosts/day. 20 posts max limit, no campaign manager, no rules, it's terrible combination. With unlimited number of participants situation on Bitcointalk can be out of control. Now we can see Yobit spammers shitposting almost everywhere. And I hate to be asociated with these spammers. Even Merit and trust systems can't help now, it's enough to have high ranked account and voilà, you are in campaign.
And I think 20 posts per day limit isn't a problem if campaign have manager who is doing his job properly. Nobody is forcing you to make so many posts, for example I rarely make more than 5-6 posts per day.

I prefer to have a manager, nothing is foolproof, but it is impossible to know without trying, if you accept, it will be better, for being a member of the forum that many trust.

I don't participate in pump schemes or other illegal activity, either, I don't want to feel like a criminal for participating in this campaign (this is how I have seen who participates to be treated indirectly), the complaints are many, of many exchanges, if it is proved that the Yobit is fraudulent, I said proved, I will be the first to leave the campaign. Since the platform is still active, for me there is nothing proven...

Anyway, in my opinion you must accept, everyone knows your integrity here and the negativity of the exchange will not be able to affect you ...

In my humble opinion, I think that yahoo is the best fit for this compaign. As the OP mentioned, he will have the access to the accepted and the refused members which will essentially reduce and remove the red-tagged members and will only let trusted members join the compaign. Yahoo is already famous and I will personally say that having a moderator taking care of the compaign is a must because things will get better in terms of making the compaign clear, having a spreadsheet and an organised environment that could make the compaign more trustful. So, I think that the OP is the best fit for this job and I think that hiring a moderator is a must, go for it yahoo!

Yahoo can not do anything with it, in my perspective. The point is at the beginning, Yobit don't care about their needs to find a manager, just manager, not high quality manager.
They should not blame that they don't consider at hiring manager at the start, or they did not have experience with running campaign.
I am not sure, but maybe they shown intention to hire Yahoo or if accepted, deal made, it just one of the fake signals that they don't want to spam the forum. Let's see, what will happen if Mr Yahoo can only manage official participants via application form, spreadsheet, but behind the scene, Yobit actually accept more hidden participants by themselves, and Yahoo won't have information about those supporters. Yahoo, as manager of Yobit campaign can reject to pay for shit posts, but he can not prevent other users (who don't apply via Yahoo's application form) to wear signature, spam and get payments from Yobit.
I even doubt that they temporarily accepted even Member rank. Some guys at Member rank worn Yobit signature and spammed recent days. Maybe they simply tried to cheat the campaign, but who knows if Yobit actually accepted that rank.
https://i.imgur.com/qAAEPfP.png
I don't know where Yobit have such huge funds (if they really pay for their supporters) to run the campaign. If the fund come from hard works, they won't do this, in my perspective. Running campaign with totally shit posts that even don't catch intention of forum members to read it, so will they really spend their time to click on hyperlinks in signatures or visit Yobit site, I doubt that they won't.

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Something should be required to participate, like this, only 5 merits required from posts made in last 4 months, I don't think it is an unreachable requirement.

Yobit is not a small exchange site and they are not new. They are earning a huge amount from their site. And for this campaign especially for the negative campaign, they will earn many more. They will earn more from negative campaign instead of their paid campaign (signature campaign).

This will also reduce the number of posters as many people are joining because of the privilege to post more since the pay is very poor. More post means more money.

It is right that "the more you post the more you earn; until you reach your limit" But if they decrease post limit and increase pay per post then both (participant and yobit) will get the benefit.

I doubt a campaign of this size is even manageable. Pajeets are coming.....

It's a double-edged sword: we're better off without the spam, but helping them hire higher quality posters helps them to get better quality advertising and reduce the (already very slim) risk of their campaign getting banned by theymos.

Since you're posting my quote: I've seen several users tagged for promoting a scam in their signature. I've only done that once (here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=303026); feel free to add more) and won't do it for campaign participants, but all it takes nowadays is one out of many DTs to ruin somene's reputation.

The first step would be to set a Merit requirement: if someone haven't earned at least 10 Merit in over a year, he has no business in any campaign. If someone bought 10 Merit for a bad post, that easily disqualifies him too. YoBit could for instance use my list of earned Merit (http://loyce.club/Merit/userID_merit.txt) to reject anyone who doesn't meet a certain minimum.

That might help a bit but we've already seen plenty of merit networks helping accounts to rank up/receive more merit.

The Yobit campaign needs a manager!
Reopening the campaign only with lower rates would mean that in the end everything will turn out to be the same as we have seen before.

I have been a member in this campaign since I started here on this forum, and it did not go well on multiple sides.
The number of one unconstructive one liners was really enormous!
Written posts were not counted because we had flaws in the bot that was intended to overview the posts.
And after a while, payments were made maybe twice a year.

These would be the main problems you would have to deal with if you decide to accept managing this campaign.
I would be glad if you do.

Money is not everything for the reputed member like you. I feel that you should not affilate yourself with the exchange who has scammed 1000+ ethereum of users. I happen to read one thread in Scam Accusation and reading that i say OMG to myself how can one live and sleep scamming 1000 plus ethereums.

I would feel slightly blackmailed by the whole thing.

They're basically saying dear hard working manager with a hard-won rep, associate with us no matter what your feelings are about us or we turn your workplace into a cesspit. Those aren't terms I'd feel very turned on by.

If I were running this forum I'd assign a mod for a few weeks specifically to thrash the participants into submission. It's a twat magnet and no matter how many of them are moaning about that label, the evidence is everywhere for now. At least it rounds them up into a neat pool for culling.

As alot said earlier either Yahoo accept Yobit offer or not they will the campaign because the forum moderators are not against it and the previous allegations which were raised about exchange are not been follow up by the accusers with that we can't be sure if the situations are not settle. Besides, I believed people deserve to be giving a second opportunity but what I will advice Yahoo to do is to reduce the daily paid posts to 10-17 which I think should be Ok for participants who are not spamming or greed.

Most of the people advice to reduce the total paid post per day because most of the people going to spam if they are getting more paid posts per day but why this is only happening with yobit where max paid post is 20 only when we compare that number with stake it is nothing.They are paying upto 0.1BTC per week for high rank members for that they have to make 1000 posts in week or 142 posts per day. ???

There is mix/different options about Yobit and they have lots of unsolved accusation. I had problem also with Yobit and resolved it almost after six months. I am not sure how many valid accusation there. But seems Yobit running campaign again by their exchange directly which is encouraging spammers (according to most of reputed members). Also there is lot of thread made against Yobit spam.

But question is, really can we stop spammers by opening new thread every day? Is it possible and wise decision to tag all Yobit participants? If not, then is it not better to allow a campaign manager like Yahoo62278 to manage thier campaign? I believe by managing their campaign at least we will able to prevent spammers from forum. A well reputed manager obviously will manage by his/her own style.

So from my side I don't think there is any problem for handle their campaign by Yahoo62278 or any other well reputed managers.

I agree with you. Campaign with high spam risk like this must have a manager. though it's only two days of this campaign, a lot of people talking about them. Negative or positive they are still being promoted.
Yahoo should accept to manage this campaign and keep it under control as far as possible.

I use Yobit exchange and I can't complain to any withdraw or deposit problem. Also never use his support because I had no need.

They have a few shady things. He doesn't do wallet updating or delists coins, and it is possible to trade altcoins from the old chain but of course, it is not possible to send this coin to a newly updated network. Because the users are left without their coins. Investbox is another risky action. He offering high daily/weekly percent just to hold his own worthless tokens. But their value falls more than an earned percent, in the end, it starts with the denomination and new circle. visible fraud.

I think this thread has served its purpose and I will lock it for now. Thanks everyone for your opinions.