Bitcoin Forum

They promised to fix the firmware to be able to support a bigger number of installed apps. This was supposed to happen in Q2 and it is almost over.

They put this blog post basically telling us it won't happen?

https://www.ledger.com/supporting-and-improving-the-ledger-nano-s/

This is just some smooth talking making me think they won't fix it. Have they been leading us on in order to try to get us to buy the X?

I want the functionality back!!

I do not think they are after it. They will fix it soon. Ledger built up a good reputation and they are not gonna put it in stake. I am using Ledger from last 2016 or so I think.

I really don't have any remarks regarding the available space for storing apps. I store my most valuable assets on Ledger such as BTC and ETH and for the rest you can always uninstall one of your apps in order to install another one you need at that particular time. You will not lose your assets when you uninstall an app so don't worry about it. 

I do not know what you really want to say whit this post? Ledger Nano S is limited with storage and that is fact, but they fulfilled their promise and reduce size of Ethereum app (https://www.ledger.com/ledger-nano-s-first-step-to-making-things-right-ethereum-app-size-decreased/), so you can have from 3-7 apps in same time on Nano S, depending which app you install.

I do not know how much apps you have in same time before 1.5.5 firmware, but I remember that somebody mentioned that it is possible to have up to 18 apps. If you need more just buy Nano X, this is new device and it is quite normal that new must be better then old, who would otherwise even took it into consideration to buy it?

New firmware is on the way, but as Ledger say, this is device from 2016 and it is limited in its capabilities.

Ledger Nano S’s firmware 1.5.5 messed up and, deliberately or not, effectively reduced the available space for loading Apps quite noticeably. Before the update, I could hold 6 or 7 apps, but the update cut that down by nearly half. The apologized and recognized their error (see https://www.ledger.com/righting-our-1-5-5-nano-s-firmware-update), committing to revert the situation by end of Q2 2019.

Nevertheless, the most recent blog entry referenced in the OP does not address this issue. What’s more, it seems to push users to considering Ledger Nano X by highlighting on a Nano S official entry blog that Nano X supports 100 apps. No date of a new firmware release has been made public yet (at least I haven't been able to find it).

Yes, It’s pretty lame, and although one can keep track elsewhere of what the Ledger protects, and load/unload apps at will, it does seem rather much a pi.t.a. if you want to do it regularly with just a few simultaneously manageable apps. I do get the feeling they will keep their commitment. We’ll see.

@DdmrDdmr exactly what I am saying/am afraid of.

I am only able to keep 2 apps on my Ledger Nano S and I am not happy about it.

I have 4 installed apps at the moment.
 
Have you checked the versions of your installed apps?
Connect your Ledger, navigate to the corresponding app and compare the version on-screen to the newest version that you can see in the Application Manager in Ledger Live. If you are missing a few updates just uninstall and reinstall them and see if that fixes anything. 

From what I see on link you posted in OP, is that user can have at least 3 app in same time, and if you pay attention on app combinations you can have 7 apps in same time.

For example you can have 7 apps in this combination : BTC + ETH + XRP +BCH + LTC + DASH + ETC or BTC + XRP +BCH + LTC + XMR + DGB +KMD. You can read more about app combinations here : Manage device storage (https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005171425).

If you use ETH, did you remove old app and install new which is reduced in size?

I get the opposite feeling. They promised to fix this months ago, and we not only has it not been fixed, but Ledger seem to have gone totally quiet on the issue. Their support pages (https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005171425) even suggest buying another device as a potential solution.

I love my Ledger, and the space issue doesn't bother me because I don't care about the majority of altcoins, but their response on this has been poor at best. It does feel like they are trying to force users to buy the Nano X.

But they fix ETH app (reduced in size), and they write that Nano S is limited in storage and that there is not enough space for some extra changes. Latest firmware (1.5.5) is probably take some extra storage, but I never see problem with number of apps which can be installed at the same time. Users need to pay attention on app combinations and in most cases they will be able to install more than 3 app in same time.

We can not say for sure is Ledger is playing game "new is better then old", or Nano S is just limited by hardware to be on the same level as before.

Time simply run over everything, hardware wallets are not exception - smarthphones 3 years ago vs today is one of the examples, but I do not see that people complain because Samsung, Apple or Huawei release new models every year. If someone can buy a new phone every 1-2 year, I do not see why problem is in buying new hardware wallet which is ten times cheaper then new iPhone or Samsung Galaxy.

I take your point, but it is a bit of a false equivalence. Older phones become out dated simply because new ones start out performing them, they don't become inherently worse.* The Nano S used to be able to hold 10+ apps at once. If it still did, people wouldn't be complaining just because the Nano X can hold many more. The fact is the Nano S now struggles to hold 4.

*Unless you own an iPhone, because Apple are scumbags and do throttle older models to force users to upgrade.

I have everything up to date. Only able to keep two apps.

Which specific two apps are you using?

Iota and Ada.

This is strange, I see user on Reddit who have ETH, IOTA, NANO, ICX, so problem is probably in Ada app which is to big. I think you should write to Ledger support and ask them about this, since they claim 3 is minimum number of app at the same time.

I also see post from user who managed to install 10 Apps (https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/bpv3m6/nano_s_only_has_space_for_2_apps) at the same time : BTC BCH BTG PEERCOIN ZEC ZEN LTC DGB KMD RIPPLE

@Lucius
Your hyperlink needs a bit of editing. Clicking on it opens the following, https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/bpv3m6/nano_s_only_has_space_for_2_apps/[/url
Please remove the [/url part at the end and than it will work  ;)

I'm one of those people who can't manage to install more than 2 apps. Looks like I'll need to buy Nano X soon if I still want to have a hardware wallet that supports multiple coins, especially because most of my alts are moving to their mainnet soon.

Why go for buying a new product when they promised to fix the Nano S? It is just what they want. Just buy a new wallet every 2 years, pfft.

Unfortunately - I whole heartedly agree.  I have a Ledger Nano S and I have contacted their support team multiple times about various issues and each time their reply was not a solution, they basically just say sorry but you need to buy the Nano X.

I have asked them for a refund and they say no. The Nano S was like a tester, almost like they should have been free. It was over priced when I bought it. So alright whatever, I will just not buy anymore products made by Ledger. I will not recommend their company to anyone either.

Pipdips, Ledger is only promise to reduce in size ETH app, and they do that - but all of you who are complaining on number of apps installed in same time should know that Ledger Nano S is limited in hardware / storage size, and that new firmware is take some extra space. You also see that some users have up to 10 apps in same time, so it is possible to have more then two, but that number depends of app combinations.

It takes 10-15 sec to remove app and install new, and this is not delete your coins from device - but maybe we should wait new firmware and see will there be some positive changes.

For me is normal that companies improve their products over the years, they all do that. You can not buy phone, tv, pc or any other electronic device and use it whole life, most of devices will break over a period of 5 years.

I understand why people are upset about all this. Due to the "updates", Ledger have managed to make the Nano S functionally worse than when people like myself purchased it.

Sure, it's not that difficult to uninstall/reinstall the coin apps as required, but the point is that wasn't necessary... and now it is because they broke it. To then turn around and say "spend $$$ on our new model" is not an answer. That looks like "forced obsolescence" and trying to force your customers to upgrade and spend extra $$$ on something they may not need nor want. :-\

Thankfully, I'm not really affected as I don't require more than BTC and ETH on a day to day basis. However, hopefully, Ledger will get around to rectifying this issue "properly", but I wouldn't be holding my breath to be honest.

Don't even get me started. I had multiple issues with Ledger Nano S that I will not mention at this forum, but it is clear that the Nano S product was not worth the price.  Their company should refund people who complain about Nano S.  Personally I urge caution if anybody plans to use Nano S for keeping funds in there and I am serious about that.  Nano S was not well thought out technology.  Ledger proved to me that they are a low quality company with short sited business visions and they were only looking for a quick buck.  Their website looks decent but that is only facade.

What are the newer alternatives for hardware wallets?  Certainly there are plenty of new companies with hardware wallets.

That's a lousy response, but it doesn't surprise me--this is what most companies do.  Once a new model of something is released, the company gradually drops support for old models.  On the other hand, if Ledger promised an improvement or upgrade for the Nano S (which I recently bought as my first hardware wallet), they ought to follow through with it.  That's just good customer service.

I'd definitely like the device to be able to display more coins than it currently does.  That, to me, seems like a pretty basic functionality that's missing.  I get that you don't need to have all the coins you own displayed, but it sure would be nice.

I guess you haven't heard of what they did to Ledger Blue. Expensive piece of tech which in the end turned out to be a garbage.


Don't expect these alternatives to be good. Trezor and Ledger are the most widely supported hardware wallets by third parties out there. Ledger supports many altcoins while Trezor has a different security model and doesn't have any app limit since it doesn't need any apps. Have you seen ColdCard (https://coldcardwallet.com/)?

No, I did not hear about what happened with Ledger Blue.  Can you explain?
 
 
It is good to see people suggesting alternatives to Ledger. Soon enough, hardware wallets should not be much more other than having a built in iPhone app. I am surprised that major retail stores like Best Buy do not yet commonly carry hardware wallets for sale.

Ledger Blue has a built-in Bluetooth which was supposed to be used by some apps. Yet, users are not even able to pair the mobile Ledger Live app with it; they have to use a USB cable. As far as I remember, Ledger employees mentioned that it might also allow users to interact with their wallet without having to use a computer. Right now, there is nothing you can do with that large screen. Oh, and it doesn't support as many coins as Nano X and Nano S do (https://shop.ledger.com/pages/supported-crypto-assets).

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate Ledger. They released a product which turned out to be a failure, charged a premium price and didn't release many software updates for it (at least they tried to do something (https://www.ledger.com/new-ledger-blue-firmware-version-2-1/)).

Ledger Nano S does not even allow some computers to work with it. Their company will probably just say, go buy a new computer, and also buy a new Nano X.


Wobbly stance. I do not like the Ledger company at all and I can not recommend their products to anybody.

You need Windows 10 to be compatible with the Ledger app. So if your computer can handle Win 10 you are good to go. The only other requirement I know of is a 64 bit OS but that is also pretty standard nowadays and a lot of other software doesn't work on 32 bit OS anymore, like Adobe products.

What other requirements are there? 

They are pretty clear which operating system you need to be able use Ledger Live: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360006395553-Download-and-install-Ledger-Live.

Those requirements don't actually apply to the Ledger Nano X. It is perfectly possible use the Nano X with an outdated operating system, provided you pair it with another client such as Electrum, rather than Ledger Live. Given that Windows 7 support ended in 2015, and extended support will end in 6 months, I don't think Ledger are really obligated to support operating systems that the manufacturer no longer supports.

As I've said before, I am also disappointed that Ledger haven't yet addressed the issue regarding space and number of apps on the Nano S, but I would hardly go so far to call the device a failure based on that. It's a minor inconvenience at worst.

Ledger Nano S is stop working with Ledger Live after firmware update to 1.5.5 on Windows 7 (in my case), but it still working in combination with Electrum, and any other third-party wallet. Nano S is also working with Android 7+ version with OTG cable, Windows 8+, Linux and macOS 10.8+.

I have also some problems with Nano S in past, some of them because of my mistakes, but all in all i'm satisfied with what is most important when it comes to hardware wallets, and that is security of private keys. I bought hardware wallet just because of that, and now I should say it is bad product because I can not have xx apps installed in same time? I could only quote o_e_l_e_o "It's a minor inconvenience at worst.".

New firmware for Nano S should be out soon, maybe Ledger will find way to fix problem with size of some apps - and in few months Nano X will probably be on discount (Black Friday, Christmas New Year holidays) and if price of Bitcoin is go up it will be good deal to get one for less then 0.01 BTC.

I have the nano ledger s and my laptop i use is windows 10.


How is the ledger blue compared to the nano ledger s?


I mean unless you don't want to delete an app and install it every single time you use it, then get a ledger blue?

Ledger Blue is terrible. Ledger barely supports it and you can't even buy it from the official website anymore. I have already explained why it is bad in this post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5157498.msg52040537#msg52040537).


As far as I remember, Ledger Blue has slightly more memory, but it supports less coins. If you don't want to bother with reinstalling apps and want to have a functioning Bluetooth then Nano X is a better choice.

Let's all just admit that the Ledger company does not have it's act together - They never did and they never will.

What is a better alternative for a hardware wallet company that is not out the just for a quick buck / to rip us off?

The only company that comes to my mind is Trezor. It's fairly easy to get in touch with the founders. They usually reply to messages in the official Telegram channel. They promised to port Trezor T software to Trezor One and they are working on it. Note that Trezor devices are completely different. They don't support as many altcoins as Ledger devices do. They don't use Secure Element, but both hardware and software are completely open-source. Thanks to that, someone even created a hardware wallet (https://www.archos.com/products/crypto/archos_safetmini/index.html) which is basically a Trezor One in a different chassis.

I cannot understand all this drama and crying about storage space in ledger nano s.

You do not need the apps installed to hold your coins. You don't need the app installed to receive coins. You just need the app installed if you want to send coins.

Do you really send your coins all the time? Can't you uninstall an app and install another when you want to send coins? That's literally takes less than 2 minutes.

And you can keep installed BTC eth (and all its shitokens) and one more protocol coin (eos, Tron and all its shitokens).

 That's not that inconvenient , unless you are a frenetic trader , sending and receiving coins at super human speed. And you must be doing that with 4 different blockchain!

You can track your balance on ledger live as well even without the device plugged in

^There are many active traders who use Ledger and when they store just 5 apps, they get the 'insufficient space' message which is horrible. Many people trade in ETH, BTC, BCH, EOS and other coins and Ledger has to come up with an option to save more apps. It's inconvenient to keep installing and reinstalling apps when you need to use them as it's such a small device and not a laptop which can be done with one-click. It also has no option to increase the space by attaching an external device.

Wasn't their original app made for Chromebook?  Then they did a little switcheroo by releasing Ledger Live while also deciding to cut out Chromebook users.  That would not be great for Chromebook users using Nano S.  It is doubtful their company would do anything about that other saying to "just buy our newer Nano X!" or "just go buy another computer to use with your Nano S".

Case in point.

No. The original app was a Google chrome extension, not an app made for chrome book.
They never made anything specific for chrome book users afaik

It wasn't so good ledger live was a great improvement

To remove / install new app user need less then 30 seconds, and some users have up to 10 apps in same time because it is not only about limited storage, but also about app size and app combination on device.

I see you do not understand how to use Ledger Nano S when it comes to installing / removing apps. This is something users do via Ledger Live, and Ledger Live is software you can install on your laptop, so it is actually one click for install app and one one click for to uninstall.

You can't do it with just Ledger Live and you need the device too. I have installed BTC and ETH apps via Ledger Live and it was not so easy as it was the first time and checking the computer and the device was a pain but now I am used to it. Also, while doing it I got logged out due to inactivity from Ledger Live and then again entering the PIN, password etc.... It also took a long time to sync for the first time and I got errors while doing it which I had to fix (updating the old firmware 3 hours and 30 minutes for adding bitcoin wallet).

As I did not uninstall any apps/update any apps, I have no clue but it's certainly not so easy as installing apps on my mobile and laptop.

Same applies to when you want to send coins.
If you don't want to send / access your coins, you don't need to install a different application.

When you want to send coins uninstalling and installing a different application literally takes less than 30 seconds.




It really isn't hard at all.

Open ledger live -> ledger manager -> Click on 'install' -> accept it on the nano -> Done.




Well, you should keep your firmware updated all the time. That is not related to uninstalling/installing apps at all.

And you don't get logged out after a minute of inactivity.




No, it is way easier.
3 Clicks and 30 seconds.

I really don't see any issue at all.

^It was the first time I updated the firmware after getting the device in 2018 and crashed in between while syncing: I explained my problem here in detail (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5139901.msg51012022#msg51012022)

I had a problem with my Nano S that it wiped itself clean yesterday following an update to Ledger Live. Restoring it from the seed was a lengthy process but installing the apps took literally 20-30 seconds for each. Not sure why you experienced those problems but you should certainly keep your firmware updated to the newest version. 

This is strange, you try to update Ledger Live and Nano S is just reset to factory settings? Few days ago I also plug-in my Nano S and it fail to start, some message appeared about limited mode or something like that, and that I need to try repair... I just unplug Nano S from USB and connect it again, and then is start normally.

I know that some users have problems on Windows 10 due to some update, but I see also that one user on Reddit report that his Nano S is also wiped when he try to send some coins. This is answer from Ledger :


It seems that Ledger users have a much bigger problem than number of apps which can be installed at the same time. So check your seed in Ledger Live with Recovery-Check (https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360007223753-Recovery-Check) in order to ensure complete accuracy.

Yep. I updated Ledger Live, the update was successful. After that I wanted to check if there were any updates to the installed apps on my device so I went to the Account Manager. When you click on that you need to give permission so that the device connects to the Account Manager by clicking on the right button on your Ledger but instead of that text the Ledger logo kept blinking on the screen and I couldn't do anything but to unplug and plug back in.
After restarting the device I saw the Welcome screen that you see the first time you turn your Leger on. I had to setup a new PIN and install all the apps again.

Very odd... I just did the same thing without issue.

Updated Live, opened Manager, connected device... uninstalled all apps, then reinstalled all apps (for the record, I got 6 before running out of space - BTC, ETH, STELLAR, BCH, LTC, DOGE) without any issues.