Bitcoin Forum

What happened: hip3r contacted me about buying neteller, in the end he redirected me to someone pretends (or he is) elmanchez who offers his "bro" (maybe his best friend) to act as escrow. but in the end it seems like impersonator were added by hip3r or just those russians have perfect scheme for scamming by redirecting everyone to different person and in the end  you get fooled by either impersonator or using their "bro" with trusted account as escrow.

Scammers Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2822222 , https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2553198 ,

]Reference Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5257927
Amount Scammed: Thanks god the amount scammed is zero
Payment Method: Neteller for USDT
Proof of Payment: -
PM/Chat Logs:

Private messages:
https://prnt.sc/t7f0gd
https://prnt.sc/t7f0k0
https://prnt.sc/t7f19u

Telegram messages from hip3r:
https://prnt.sc/t7f1ga
https://prnt.sc/t7f1o9
https://prnt.sc/t7f20r
https://prnt.sc/t7f28w
https://prnt.sc/t7f2m7

Telegram messages by his friend/partner/scammer elmanchez:
elmanchez telegram id: https://prnt.sc/t7f342

Telegram chat:
https://prnt.sc/t7f3dr
elmanchez offers me to use his BRO escrow services for free "DireWolfM14": https://prnt.sc/t7f3vx
after refusing to use his BRO as escrow he threaten me to neg rep me :D : https://prnt.sc/t7f4bg
More chat logs:
https://prnt.sc/t7f4m1
https://prnt.sc/t7f4y3

Alt of hip3r (Bizoxi) :
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2727385
His topic about almost same exchange: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5258001
Claiming something that i said only to hip3r, which means only hip3r can know that, which also means that he is alt of hip3r
Proof that i said my money are coming from people that gamble and play poker only to hip3r: https://prnt.sc/t7g4lf
Proof that alt of scammer "Bizoxi" know something private that he never received by me but were only sent to hip3r: https://prnt.sc/t7g6a8

Additional Notes: Seems like somehow i went thru triple way scamming scheme by russians.
There is brand new account doing exchanges, one account with some green feedback to cover his ass and not in last place an "bro" escrow russian who also have reputation and being in DT.
Nice way to scam newbies and also experienced in middle stage sellers/buyers in the forum.
The newbie playing stupid not understanding english redirecting you to his friend who have experience with the forum who also uses his bro for escrow services.
In the end, only the newbie account can be burnt because the other two are playing "fair" to trick you.
Three way russian scamming scheme, a nice one! I am sure that most of the newbies and some advanced users will be fucked up by those guys..

*Wolf removed from the scam report because he had nothing to do with it

Offering an escrow is actually a good sign.
Do you have any reason to believev that DireWolfM14 is his "bro" and would not act as he is supposed to as an escrow ?


As far as i see, someone wanted to exchange with you. They offered an escrow. And you shouted "SCAM" immediately.
DireWolfM14 is reputable. I don't think he would throw away his reputation and account for 1k.

And instead of proposing a different escrow, you stop the exchange? Is that how you do business ?

Offering your friends as escrow is never a good sign mate :D
I offered escrow from the forum list and he offered me his "bro":D What a great sign is that.
I shouted a "SCAM" because someone impersonated member with green trust obviously.
Seems like you didn't even read the topic and the statements with screenshots....
It is not a good sign to impersonate in first place, and it is not good sign even if he didn't impersonate to offer your friend as escrow.
Do i have any reason to believe his "bro" is DireWolfM14 ? Let me think half a second... Yes i do.
DireWolfM14 stating in his posts he had months conversation with elmanchez and he seems a nice guy and stuff like that.
Both the impersonator (or maybe the real elmanchez)  and the newbie scammers are russians.
Newbie account is used to start the scam so if he burnt no one loses anything.
3 way scheme which can fool many people by simple psychologic tactics are pulled out by newbie and covered by two green trusted persons....
Well yeah i think something is wrong based on those facts and the screenshots above :)
I also offered escrow but i don't offered my "bro" to cover my ass right?
If you are trying to defend them please, place your statements proof based.

Edit: After exposing them it is not red flag that i was ignored instantly, the user changed his avatar on telegram and everyone stop to respond right ? :D
Even if elmanchez or DireWolf are not in that scheme and being impersonated at least the newbie hip3r is 10000% scammer because he tried to impersonate trusted members right?
But the fact that 3 way russian scam scheme is on point i highly doubt in so many coincidences

Whether they are good friends or "




Who impersonated who?
Is elmanchez the impersonated member you are talking about?

When using an escrow, it would have been very clear whether it is the real elmanchez or not ?




This still doesn't mean that he would give up his reputation by scamming 1k$.




If you get scammed when using an escrow, you either get your money back through the escrow or all 3 get a neg tag (newbie, elmanchez and the escrow).




It is.
But i still don't think DireWolfM14 would have participated in any scam.
It is a red flag from a newbie and 2 telegram accounts.

Is this a joke or you are clearly not reading the report and rising your post count?
The newbie redirected me to talk with fake "elmanchez" ( if its fake )
Which in first place means that the newbie redirected me to an impersonator.
Then in second place, the real person or the impersonator then redirecting me to his "bro" escrow...
So either the newbie is redirecting me to impersonator who starts the scheme, or the real elmanchez uses scheme to use his friends as escrow.
So if you still can't understand what is going on let me make it clear:
Either the newbie is using few names to impersonate trusted members to scam, or he is in scheme with trusted members to scam.


Edit: If i get scammed, i don't care who is going to get red, orange or purple flag, my money will be gone forever.
And i am doing a favor to the community exposing a scamming scheme.
If you have nothing to say in-topic, not sure what are you doing here?

Since when using your friends as escrow is green flag ? :D Since when using someone who impersonate trusted members is green flag ? :D
Dude, please...

If a trusted escrow is used, it doesn't matter or not whether he said that person X "is a nice guy". This means nothing.




So either 1) a newbie is trying to scam you, 2) elmanchez is trying to scam you or 3) you use an escrow and won't get sacmmed.




If you don't trust escrows here, you shouldn't be making any deals on this forum.




To explain how dumb it is that we went from "lets use my bro escrow who once said i am a nice guy" to "doing a favor to the community exposing a scamming scheme including a highly reputable member".
elmanchez and/or a newbie might have tried to scam you. But you shouldn't assume that DireWolfM14 is involved into this just because he was proposed as an escrow.

- Another alt of hip3r with proof added to the topic.

Please, don't post anything that isn't in-topic.
You should be friend of the scammers if you are trying to defend them.
I never said that it is bad the escrow to be a nice guy :D I said that it is bad to impersonate someone or use your friend as escrow no matter he's an angel, nice guy or a shemale.
Using your friends as escrow is always red flag.
Same as impersonating people if he is not the real guy and they are playing all "dumb"

If i don't trust escrow here i shouldn't making any deals on the forum ? :D Moron, i requested escrow and he offers me his friend are you stupid ? :D
Where you see me refusing escrow? And please, do not tell me how to do my things around, i am pretty familiar which escrows are trusted and which not.
And for sure impersonators, and people who offer their friends as escrows are not in my trust view for sure.
Do not tell me in my topic what i should assume or not please.
There is the facts and everyone have brain.
If you don't sit tight and watch the show.
I am saying that either this newbie is pulling an impersonating scam, or more people are involved.
As far as i go, i find more alt accounts of the newbie scammer.
It is not sure how this scam continue, but it is sure it starts from 2 newbie accounts that using names of trusted people.
I can't confirm that elmanchez and DireWolfM14 are involved, but i already confirmed with screenshot proofs that those two newbies accounts are connected and trying to scam impersonating other people.

**** EDIT: I cannot confirm that elmanchez and DireWolf are involved in this scam scheme, but consider their names are pulled in the scam attempt from the newbies, i must put their names inside.
So far a newbie added two impersonators and tried to scam and also alt account of the same newbie is providing information which only his first newbie account knows which makes them connected.

He offered to use a reputable member as an escrow. You declined. Did you propose another escrow? What was their reply?


The fact is that a reputable member has been proposed as an escrow.
Whether he once said that the user is a "nice guy" is irrelevant.

Your definition of "friend" is a bit loose.


However, i am not denying that someone was trying to scam you.
Very well imaginable that it indeed was elmanchez. Check this thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5256818) out.

But i am confident that if you were to accept DireWolfM14 as an escrow, you wouldn't get scammed.

The impersonator offered to use his friend as "escrow".
Yes i denied to use fake friend escrow from fake impersonator :D:D:D:D
You are not denying that someone is trying to scam me, but you trying to twist my words :D
It is obvious that someone impersonated here and the impersonator or the real person i don't care what's the case, wanted to use his "bro" as escrow.
You should have at least above 100 IQ to realize that either the person who offered the escrow is impersonator, or the "escrow" will be impersonated or both are just simply impersonators..

Even if he is not impersonator, i was never ethical or being accepted around to use your friends as escrow pal... No matter how trusted they are, they will always defends his friends in the end

He offered to use an reputable escrow.
BTW, when did we go from "bro" to "friend"



The escrow can not be impersonated if you make your deal via PM on this forum.
If you however, would theoretically be stupid enough to do everything via telegram, that's a different story. But i don't expect anyone to be that stupid.

Really? Then how 12312 scams were made on this forum by forwarding messages from the real persons ? Thru PM.
You continue to post your non senses trying to defend the scammers :D If you are from their circle, don't worry, the others will also catch you.
And i want from "bro" to "friend" because that's what friends are calling each others :)
People ALL THE TIME doing EVERYTHING thru Telegram.
In the hardware section many many trusted sellers such as offordscot and many many others doing their deals thru telegram.
In currency exchange also many many sellers and buyers such as gameristo and many others doing their deals thru telegram.
Since you start acting like the impersonator with the same questions, i will start to think that you are the impersonator and not the elmanchez.
You asking the same questions as the impersonator like you are using the forum for very first time and playing dumb :)
Please, keep posting so i can make the proper connections proof based that you are in that scamming circle.

I am not afraid to expose impersonators and scammers and i do not care are they trusted, legendary or any ranks.
All scammers should be treated as scammers.

I don't get your point.
If i am communicating with X via PM, there is no way to spoof these PM's. What are you trying to say?




So why don't you then include how you know that they are indeed friends?




I don't care what others are doing.

If you receive a PM here giving you a telegram id, there is a connection between the forum account and telegram.
If you however communicate with a random stranger on telegram, he then gives you a different telegram id, you obviously can't know who this is.

Use your common sense.




So.. which questions are you referring to?
Whether or not you proposed a different escrow? (You still didn't answer that question btw).




Oh no, please. I am scared. Do not expose by bitcointalk mafia circle.
I see it coming.. the next time a newbie is messaging you on telegram trying to scam you mentioning my name, i will be the accused one. I got it.

Please, use the forum to research how people were scammed by forwarded messages in the past.
There is no way to spoof a message but trick a newbie with forwarded one.
I already included how do i know they are friends. He simply called him  "bro".
And no one will call random person like that but only friend of him or someone he trust or work with.
Dude, the world and the forum is not doing circle around you. You will be noted only when you defense proven scammers.
The fact is that impersonator offered me to use an escrow which will be also impersonated.
And you expect me to agree and not refuse to that ? Dude, i am not born yesterday, i know what those kids are doing..
Why would i waste time purpose anything to someone who i already exposed as impersonator/scammer ?
Or you expect people to waste time with scammers like you do?
If you catch someone doing that would you really waste your time with that scammer?
If you don't respect your time, i do respect mine and i have better things to do than doing long conversations with fraudsters.
After exposed i don't need to share even 1 second more with that idiot.

And still my point holds.. you can not impersonate someone via PM on this forum.

Just because some people get tricked by that, doesn't mean that you can impersonate one like that.
People get tricked through more stupid ways. Sending an email claiming to be X has already tricked people.

If you use your common sense, you won't get tricked that way. So.. using an escrow on this forum communicated via PM is safe.




Did you ever consider that someone might actually trust an escrow and/or already have worked with a specific escrow?
Your statements are contradictory.




If you fall for an impersonated escrow (e.g. via telegram), its your fault.

The point is, you can't know whether he actually wanted to scam you.
If you would have made sure that the person indeed is elmanchez and was trying to scam you (e.g. by impersonating an escrow via telegram), he would have been given a neg tag to avoid any further scams.

But you didn't. Instead, you created this thread with zero purpose. There is no proof that elmanchez is involved in this.

1. As I see on the screenshots, he simply asked you the question "What do you want to do business outside the forum" which is a dangerous method of exchange, the possibility of losing money with a probability of 99%

2. You rejected a request to deal a transaction in the forum. Deals in a telegram are not recommended.

3. He was quite adequate, unlike you, in my opinion, no offense, buddy.

4. In my memory, ESCROW transactions are carried out only on the forum, to protect themselves.


In my opinion, you put yourself in this thread, good luck.



In addition, I know a person under the nickname @ hip3r
I bought from him 200,100 and 30 WMZ, I have all the transactions in my wallet, can show it like proove
He sent me the money first.

I think you need to stop driving slander on people, including hip3r and DireWolfM14


Here is screenshot from @hip3r who are really honest man and always ready to sent money first if you're trsuted enough.


https://i.ibb.co/7yqd6Sb/image.png

So, do you confirm that it was actually you talking to OP ?



And who is it? What forum account is associated with this telegram ID ?

Yes, accpeting that, i'm doing business with @hip3r last week, he is buying Neteller/Skrill and selll USDT,QIWI,WMZ,Payooner, everything is clear.
His bitcointalk name is @hip3r
You can check the main screenshot, which OP will never show us

Agree that OP can't prove anything
After all, I just offered him a deal in the vast expanses of the forum.

I don't know what's going on here, or why I'm being dragged into this, but no one contacted me for escrow.  If elmanchez had contacted me for escrow for a currency exchange, I would have happily obliged.  Yeah, I said I like him, and I still do, so why wouldn't I help him trade safely?

---

I think there's some confusion here.  I believe that elmanchez is saying he's traded with @hip3r, not the OP.

---

@elmanchez, did you contact the OP on Telegram, and are you Telegram user @hookgo?

Right!


hip3r is difficult to understand English, and according to him,the client refused to deal on the forum, and wanted to hold it in telegram.
of course, I told him that this is illegal, transactions with escrow from the forum must take place in the forum.

I didn't do or say anything wrong..

So it is confirmed that @hookgo is your telegram username elmanchez ?


The user is: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2822222
where he posted his telegram username: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5257927.msg54679365#msg54679365
But you can not find the telegram username there now and the post is edited today at 02.37.14 PM Maybe just removed the telegram username (not sure)
Loyce archive: http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5467/54679365.html

This seems a bit weird to me.
How were you able to do business with hip3r (bitcointalk account) with the telegramid @hip3r last week when he just registered less than 3 days ago ?




No confusion here. That's exactly what i wanted to be sure of because the story seems fishy.

---

He just confirmed it:

I called him from the other forum bitalk.org , and say to him he can do his bussines also in this forum

I will never refuse to provide any screenshots dont try to talk behalf me.
The interesting part is that your previous posts and google says ur telegram was same as your username, and you contacting everyone from unknown telegram not
Insert FlashInsert ImageInsert HyperlinkInsert EmailInsert FTP Link|Insert TableInsert Table RowInsert Table Column|SuperscriptSubscriptTeletype|Insert CodeInsert Quote|Insert Listnoted anywhere so we can verify you.
Also asking for your bro to be escrow? Cmon man :D You and your friends just failed to scamm me. Ofc you will claim you had previous deals with your scamming newbie profile to cover your ass from being caught.
Also, where is your bro yo post here? :D Do you guys often do shady deals with different telegrams? And since when talking on telegram for deals is illegal ? :D
99.99% on the forums contact people thru telegram for faster respond and communication on the hardware and  exchange secti9n. If that were really you why you are lying others and trying to put your bros to help you out?
Is that how green trust members operates now? They making accounts with friends, exchange reps and then using them as escrow? Nice nice...

Just to show that he is lying: https://prnt.sc/t7jn7p

@elmanchez

If you met him on another forum and he indeed is honest, why don't you then just finish the trade (assuming OP still wants to do that of course)?
Just use an reputable escrow (doesn't have to be DireWolfM14, if OP doesn't want to).

If OP is still willing to do it, you could easily show your good will and clear up all misunderstandings.


Shouldn't all parties be happy with that?

Please, check the screenshot from my very last post

I can only offer my assurance that if I were involved both parties would have been safe, regardless of my relationship with one or the other.

Nevertheless, I understand your suspicion.  There does seem to be something weird going on, but I'm not sure what yet.  For now I'm going to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.  I do, however take exception to your accusation that I'm somehow a party to a scam attempt.  I have not been contacted for an escrow request, and I am in way coordinating with elmanchez to facilitate a scam.

More lies from elmanchez? https://prnt.sc/t7kfb5
Seems like this guy is either stacking his victims to scam and call other people with bad names to stick them together and scam quit or something is wrong here.
Someone here is lying and i will find out who tried to scam me

He gets entangled in an extraordinary number of shady deals though. That's either very bad luck or perhaps some actual correlation.

Seems like many people are involved in this scam.
From newbies to trusted, legendary members and green trusted.
Just received some "feedback" on my profile that i never have spoken or dealt with.
Friend of elmanchez or Wolf, i can't be sure but abusing the trust system is not something that you should prove your wrong or right...
So far i provide every evidence my eyes catch and check this out: https://prnt.sc/t7ko4v
I never ever spoken with the user who placed some feedback on my profile after i open this scam report: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=317618

And this is coming right after the failed scammer i catch "elmanchez" feedback:
https://prnt.sc/t7kogo

elmanchez, if you were not guilty and legit, you would never spam and abuse the trust system with bullshits :)
There is a lot of proofs on this topic and people will decide.
Now same as your useless feedback, i will do just the same for you, place a feedback but at least mine will be proof based.

Once you were caught here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5256818.0
And now you denying all your lies and scam attempts again ?
Dude, how come you trying to scam twice in row... Thanks god not successful.


Even if i end with red trust for no reason, i will expose this scam and i am pretty sure elmanchez is involved with the newbie here and DireWolf have nothing to do.
Seems like elmanchez tried to scam the newbie but he failed because the newbie provided me information that shows he never deal with him.
And elmanchez tried to close my eyes with lies which i expose with the newbie.
Elmanchez also used his DireWolf name to "threaten" me without Wolf's knowledge.
2 Scam attempts so far both failed.
But it is interesting his friends are tagging my account now because of this report which proves i am in the right way...
No one will make actions against me if they are not guilty...
That only proves i am in the right way..

Also interesting fact, why elmanchez using different telegrams to contact each person?
On his last scam report he says his telegram is same as his name here: https://prnt.sc/t7l2dm
But now, he contacting me, the newbie and everyone else with different telegram after saying 3 days ago he is not using telegram anymore....

This thread, together with the other thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5256818.0) is more than just suspicious.

Regarding the linked thread.. i mean come on.. Who receives a message saying "please send a message containing address X to account Y" and does exactly that.
This is either some kind of extremely stupid behavior or some kind of a reinsurance if you get called out (i.e. "i received the message and blindly did what the person i don't know requested").

I mean, alright. Benefit of the doubt.
But together with this here, i tend to believe it indeed was just a reinsurance for himself instead of just stupid behavior.

If he wasn't scammer, the newbie will never tell me that he never dealt with him.
Also, he deleted our telegram conversation so i cannot add more screenshots :D
Thanks to the newbie, i have more information that the newbie and him was never dealt
The more interest fact that elmanchez is meriting him and keep saying he had deal with him.
No matter his behavior and  failed scamm attempts should be taken serious.

At least all members from the scamming scheme will be exposed.
So far, i got few negative feedbacks for nothing from people that i never even know they existed before they placed fake negative feedback on my profile.
Right after i open this topic against hip3r and elmanchez  i received negative feedback from those alt accounts of the scammers:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2533861

Bump! elmanchez and his friend hip3r should be both tagged.
Enough proofs were provided.

And it seems to me that there is something suspicious here, because too much has happened in a short time and some explanations are not very logical. I got a PM 4 days ago from elmanchez where he ask me for some PP - > BTC trade, although we have no history of trading nor have I publicly stated that I want such a trade.

There is nothing suspicious about this PM, but I think everyone should be even more careful when it comes to any trading - and especially avoid Telegram.

I believe there is nothing wrong with telegram because 99% of people using it here for fast communication.
The problems are actually different here based on the situation and the provided screenshot proofs.
A newbie claim for exchange, then comes elmanchez who work with him obviously covering his ass with Wolf as escrow.
In other place, elmanchez changed his telegram name week ago claiming he's not using telegram anymore but contacting me from some telegram without verifying, but thanks god in this thread he verified that he's the one contacted me.
In other hand, the newbie said he never dealt with this person as elmanchez claim because i caught their scheme.
It is obvious that elmanchez is trying to cover his ass with newbie account somehow and involving Wolf name as his "bro" to cover escrow services.
The only thing that elmanchez was going to lose if i didn't catch them was the newbie account which no one give a fuck about.
That kind of behavior should be punished and he should be tagged for suspicious activity and two failed scam attempts for the last month.

Not in last place, he's abusing the trust system placing false and fake negative feedback on my profile and also bring his other alts to do the same because i caught them.
If i were wrong and there is nothing like that, he would never do that and also use his alts to abuse the trust system and place fake negative feedbacks.

I know scams are not moderated but by ethical view point why no one tagging those scammres ?
Elmanchez and hip3r ?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2822222

I'm kinda interested on what escrow type you are explaining here https://prnt.sc/t7f28w? Is this some kind of a 3rd party app? It seems that you are insisting to used the escrow that you preferred and you even suggest to send BTC/USDT to you first.

I understand your point on accusing that he was scam because he called the escrow his "Bro" which even I will be  worry because they might set you up and you have any idea who the escrow is. But I believe Elmanchez said that to explain the "FREE" escrow fee that he offers to you earlier in your conversation.

DirewolfM14 has a loan business here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5132594.0) in the forum and invested money more than the amount you are dealing. So there is no way he will scam you if ever the deal was made inside the forum.

---

The proof that he attempt to scam you is not that strong. You are just upset because the deal didn't go through in your preferred way of doing escrow and you easily jump into conclusion without checking the escrow he was referring because he called it "Bro".

PS: It will be really helpful if you can provide my request about your preferred escrow service.

I am not using any 3rd party app for sure, actually, if you check most of my posts, you will see i suggest people to use forum escrows.
And why would i not offer anyone to send me money first if he wants to? Is that crime or something bad? Or i am not allowed to handle trades by my self if the other party have no problem with it?
My point is not only that he wants to use his "bro" which as we can see he is not even close to his "bro" but the way that the guy lied and manipulated.
In first place he invites friend of him to be escrow, and then telling that he have done previous deals with that newbie.
After that, if you see the screenshots the newbie confirm that he never had deals with this person, and Wolf come in this topic saying he only had chat with this guy and they are not "bro's" for sure (from what i get).

DireWolf's name was removed from the topic as you can see because from everything we collected as evidence so far, it can be seen that elmanchez were "cleaning" his hands with Wolf and lying about deals in the past with the newbie.
Dealing in the forum and outside the forum is just the same if you deal with someone honest and not a scammer.
Scam reports are not moderated and even if you get scammed in forum with proofs or outside forum with proofs it is the same.
It is absurd to communicate and try to deal with newbie in the forum because of the restrictions for private messages per day/hour and so.
Everyone around using Telegram and that's not secret or something bad.
We all do need faster communication.
I am not sure why everyone around think that dealing inside the forum via private messages is more safe than dealing with the same person outside forum (telegram,skype,messanger or any chat program).

As you can see, no one cares about failed scam attempts from green trusted member, no matter is it off or on-site.
Those failed attempts are obvious.. Or i should wait him to scam me before i post this ? :D

Becuse here their are records of proof of the conversation that your trading partner cannot delete or tamper with here on Bitcointalk.. On telegram either person can delete all of their messages at any time from both partie's chat screens..
Bitcointalk forum records are very highly trusted, provable, and automatically archived.. Telegram is not..


If you think telegram is just as good of a place to do business then why aren't you taking this to the telegram scam accusations board but instead are bringing it here?

If it didn't happen here often times their isn't much that can be done about it here..
Scammers can get away with a lot more on telegram than here.. That's why it's packed full of scammers and people get scammed there all the time and nothing can be done about it..

Point noted. The way you way you provide screenshot of evidence is a bit not easy to understand your point. You should put the whole conversation and just censored the words you didn't want to show.

---

Based on this statement .

I agree that this transaction is a bit fishy at all. Because if they are partner it means that they trust each other and means they have previous deals before or else they know each other personally. I will be watching your thread for future development.


You can arrange the transaction on telegram first which I always do too and finished it inside the forum. Just make sure that both sides agreed to the terms you setup so that only the escrow will act upon inside the forum to closed the deal. In that way, there's no risk that impersonators will scam both of you.

It's a good call for you to decline the deal if you feel really uncomfortable about it. I'm not telling that they are scammer but it's the right choice if you have doubt.

Personally as someone with brain, if i see the things going wrong by anyway, i take my time to screenshot the entire conversation before it continues to go more weird and nonsense.
Everyone  making large to big deals should have that in mind.
Actually when you delete your private messages, i am not pretty sure they are recorded anywhere... And if they are after being deleted, that's scary.
There is no difference on private message "security" and telegram "security" because in both ways, the scammers can get away with the same it depends on their skills.
We share different opinions which is normal.
You can't point "Telegram", "Messanger" or any app for communication as den of scammers.
There is tons of reports daily here in the forum and we do not call it that way either.
Scammers are everywhere and not  a private message, telegram chat or meeting can save you from them.

1. Your screenshots from telegram could be completely fake..

2. Bitcointalk PMs do not get deleted on both ends like telegram.. Bitcointalk PMs can also be verified by mods or another trusted user.. On telegram you can make any name you want and fake an entire conversation.. Not here..

So you trying to tell me that screenshots from telegram could be fake, but screenshots from PMs cannot be fake ? :D
I mean if you delete your PM's or the scammer deletes it, mod can verify it ? :D
What fake conversations what names dude ? We are talking about proven failed scammers here, how does your conspiracy theory is connected with the scam report ?

Screenshots can always be faked.



If person A sends person B a private message and deletes it afterwards, the message still remains in the inbox of the recipient (just like with emails).
When you report a PM to a moderator, he will see its content.

So, yes. A moderator can verify PM's.

Awesome, now lets not talk about what butterfly's can and cannot do and lets clean our place from people like those from the topic...

Can hardly feel sorry for someone who refuses to listen to advice about the dangers of doing business on telegram..
Go on ahead and get scammed again..


For all I know you are both/all parties trying to scam elmanchez out of a guilt trip refund..

I didn't do that post someone to feel sorry about me.
I did this post to warm the community about those scammers and give them information what they are doing.
We both know that scam section is not moderated and no one actually care about anyone loss but at least there is tags from DT members to warn other people.
If you feel that those scammers are welcome to run around doing whatever they want, feel free to not tag them :)
Yeah, all those proofs above clearly show how we all trying to scam elmanchez *sarcasm*

Hello. I apologize for my English writing through google translate. Yesterday evening, the circus performed by Boombl4 ended. In order to put everything in order, time is needed. Another point, I don’t know English and it will take some time to find a translator and translation too. I decided to post a light version. These are screenshots with a few explanations.

Friday June 26th, evening with me. Boombl4 knocked on my telegram, I wrote him a private message on the forum. Moderators can check.
http://prnt.sc/t8s84c

June 27, I have the night. Yes, I was not mistaken.) After accusing me of fraud and scribble on the forum, Boombl4 is still negotiating an exchange with me. Boombl4 sent an email to escrow (monbux) and gave it my email. I do not mind because I have no doubt in deceiving Boombl4 and want to sleep.
http://prnt.sc/t8s9ea

June 28, morning with me. I receive a letter from escrow. Thanks Google. Your mail is the best.
http://prnt.sc/t8s9xq
http://prnt.sc/t8safr

June 28, day after evening with me. As they say "No comment"
http://prnt.sc/t8scmj
http://prnt.sc/t8scw9
http://prnt.sc/t8sd39
http://prnt.sc/t8sdda
http://prnt.sc/t8sdkw
http://prnt.sc/t8sdvp
http://prnt.sc/t8sepg
http://prnt.sc/t8sfer

I repeat this light version will be full later.

And two more points
1. I am ready for three users, whose reputation no one doubts, to provide screenshots of some of their transactions in recent times.

2. I live in Minsk. Perhaps on this forum there are people with a reputation from my city or country. Maybe someone happens in Minsk. I am ready to meet in person and show that I am really engaged in an exchange.

Boombl4 can you do the same !???

Sure, firstly, not sure which is the person you are talking last few days, but you were blocked by me back in 26th.
If that's some some 11iq attempt from elmanchez to save his name after the scam attempts, could you please show us where and how this exact telegram chat after 26th is mine?
Please, share with us Private message from me confirming you are talking with me on telegram after 26th or anywhere (not in telegram) this is connected with me.
Yes, i had conversation with you till 26th, after you tried to scam me with your russian gaylord friend, both of you were blocked.
Can't wait for your answer, i swear i won't eat all my pop corns before that.

Quick edit: Could you please tell us also why you edit your telegram name from your topic right after the failed scam attempt with your russian girlfriend ? :D

The first thing i'd like to know is whether the signature is valid.

Monbux was last active May 14, 2020, 01:41:32 PM.

I doubt this mail is from him.
Could you please forward this email to alice.bob123@web.de ? I want to check the mail header (whether the address is spoofed) and the PGP signature.

There are already such impersonating and scamming attempts reported under Monbux's identity, with similar fake emails.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5110916.0

The telegram users from above screenshots was surely not monbux (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=133846).

The PM embedded:
https://loyce.club/other/PMtopic5258399.png

If this PM is real, the following post (2 days earlier) is not (or no longer) true:
(archived (http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5467/54677374.html))

Note: In general, I don't trust screenshots, and I'm ignoring the Telegram screenshots because anyone can say they're someone else on there.
As I said in another topic: by using Telegram, you make it very easy for scammers and very difficult for anyone to ever find out who's trying to cheat. Most of this stuff can be discussed in a public topic on the Currency exchange (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=53.0) board.
The "evidence" in this topic is terrible to review. It's a mess! Now compare that to http://loyce.club/archive/details/topic_5252054.html and please just keep deals in the open when possible!

Apart from who's trying to impersonate who, I don't think DireWolfM14 gets any blame here. He's not even the one calling someone their "friend".

I've seen him do quite a lot of deals, which increases the chance of hitting a scammer.

After reading the first 30 posts in this topic (while ignoring Telegram screenshots), I still haven't seen any convincing evidence.

The other thread was indeed more convincing. It was dumb to PM someone else's addy, but I can imagine how a naive person trying to be fast does something like that.

I'm not convinced yet. I am quite convinced though that Boombl4 is out for blood, with or without valid reason.

Telegram is a scammer's paradise because it allows to delete the other user's conversation, you can change your nickname, and I've seen people get tricked by hiding the nickname and using someone else's nickname as "bio". Telegram is great if you know who you're dealing with, but anyone can claim they own a certain Bitcointalk account. If someone for instance claims he's me, it's pretty likely it's someone else.

That's a very good point, and it would solve the problem of very large and unclear accusation threads on Bitcointalk.

Another good point! Since he said he would refund this user (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5256818.msg54651759#msg54651759) (even though it hasn't happened yet), he might have painted mark on his account for other scammers to target.
All this is of course speculation. But I agree with you: I can hardly feel sorry for someone who ignores and even denies the many scams on Telegram.

The main warning should be: don't use Telegram for users you don't know!

Since the whole conversation took place on telegram, it is quite hard to find evidence without looking at the chat log.
But elmanchez himself confirmed, that this was his account:

---

IMO it is more than just suspicious, that

• He was involved in the linked scam by sending an address he does not possess to some random person
• He suggested hip3r to register on this forum to have another channel for his (hip3r's) business. They allegedly met on another crypto forum. But afterwards hip3r refers OP to elmanchez. This doesn't make sense
• He lied about previous deals with hip3r by claiming they already made deals. hip3r on the other hand was denying that.
• He contacted Lucius via PM (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5258399.msg54697151#msg54697151) and asked him whether he wants to trade PP for BTC, without them both ever having deal nor Lucius asking for such a deal somewhere

While there is no evidence that he intentionally scammed the other person in the linked thread, and no evidence that he indeed tried to scam OP, the are enough signs to assume that he indeed actively tries to scam others.
The same applies to all these new ponzis. There is no concrete evidence, that they are not paying 100% daily. But there are enough signs to believe that this is a scam.

If there were some unassailable evidence, both a type #1 and type #3 flag would be appropriate. However, i agree with you that this is not the case here.

---

I'd even go farther and would say to not use telegram at all.
Deleting message from the other parties chatlog is retarded.

There are better messengers available.
Either Signal (which uses old ID's in from of a mobile number), that's probably not what people want to use on the internet or Threema (which costs a few bucks), which people are not ready to pay because they are extremely cheap and don't want to spend 2-3$ for a secure communication application.

bob123, of course I can send you a letter. There is no doubt that it is not real. Even if I assume that this is real monbux and he convicted me of fraud, I am sure that he will not go to the bits.media forum and bitalk.org to write in my topics that I am a scammer. And the call to write in this thread will be ignored.
http://prnt.sc/t98qa2
http://prnt.sc/t98qwp
http://prnt.sc/t98r8u
http://prnt.sc/t98rjl
http://prnt.sc/t98s33

In this screenshot, from my point of view, Vise Sentos confirms that it is Boombl4
http://prnt.sc/t98u2i

Let's look at the situation in general in terms of logic and common sense. We started negotiations with BooMbl4, agreed on escrow services. Boombl4 suggested monbux and began to explain in general how escrow works. I was alerted by the fact that the transaction should take place in @telegram. Having difficulties with English, I invited a third person to the negotiations. After talking with him, Boombl4 accused me (us) of fraud. Boombl4 immediately added me to the block. Up to this point, everything is more or less clear. The question is what happened next? The fact that I talked with someone I think is beyond doubt. Boombl4 says that it was not him. Let's say. So it was a different person. The question is, how did he get into our chat with Boombl4? Or is this a new chat? If this is an old chat, am I blocked? Maybe this is a new chat? I’m unlikely to be an idiot. Well, let’s omit all these questions and suppose I communicate with a new person. By the end of the day, my negotiations with the new man again come to escrow monbux and the @telegram deal. Deja vu? I don’t think so. It seems to me that the version with a new person has a lot of questions, but if instead of a new person to leave Boombl4 all the questions disappear.

Finally hip3r and elmanchez will get what they deserve


"Mhm", by the same logic you were talking with me after 26th right :D And the real monbux were sending you emails right :D:D:D
You fucking scammers will never ever learn...
Anyway, next time when Barack Obama message you in telegram, redirect him i have few questions...
Since when random people over telegram saying they are someone means anything?

You will not decide.

You told me fairy tales what top exchange you are. So show at least one screenshot or proof of at least one transaction. Show profiles in other forums. As far as I understand, you are not against sharing in @telegram, so why is Boombl4 nickname on the forum and Vise Sentos in @telegram. This can confuse and scare your customers. You exchange wmz, show me your webmoney wallet. I want to see at least something.
Personally, I have a lot of questions for your exchanger activity.

Even your nickname belongs to a public person.
http://prnt.sc/t9krlw

In the free time, i am also: Batman and Rambo (Depends on the mood).
Could you prove your words? Please, show us proof about your statements same as i did.
Oh sorry you can't :(

@Boombl4, two questions:
1. Is "Vise Sentos" your Telegram user ID?
2. Did you suggest using monbux (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=133846) as your escrow provider?

1. It is not my telegram
2. I suggested the user to choose anyone from the list.
3. As i already stated above, the user were blocked.
4. I can create two telegrams and use any name to create semi/same conversation between two people to make it look like i were talking to the right person.

*Now i understand why people suggest to not deal in telegram.
I were thinking the scammers are stupid, but seems like consider they are few in that scheme, few heads can make the scheme better than only elmanchez.

We all disagree, you can’t argue.)

It is not true! I have no evidence that escrow offers exactly Boombl4 (Vise Sentos). There is a screenshot where I already agree to monbux services (red line), please note Boombl4 (Vise Sentos) asks for my email (blue line). The question is, why does he need my email? We do not need to know each other's email, each escrow communicates with his email. This is the only way to prevent phishing via email. And in general, the screenshot shows how Boombl4 (Vise Sentos) explains to me that transactions in @telegram are normal. This screenshot of Boombl4 (Vise Sentos) does not reject.
http://prnt.sc/tapas5

Want to say that after you blocked me, I created a clone of Vise Sentos and corresponded for two days? I sent myself phishing emails, arranged a circus with escrow, and then on behalf of escrow I left posts on bits.media and bitalk.org about what hip3r is a scammer? It looks like idiocy, but even if you imagine that this is true the question arises. What is the point and why spend time on this? I'm new to bitcointalk.org, if I'm a scammer what prevents me from making a new account?

I can tell you. If I understand googe translate correctly, I did not change the name @telegram, but deleted it at your convincing request. Apparently you saw in me a naive guy with 5k usdt and you were worried that someone else would put me down. On the other hand, I think the rules of the forum are not forbidden to delete your contacts in the topic. By the way, now I added @telegram, it is the same (@ hip3r), you can check.

Boombl4 (Vise Sentos), please explain. Why doesn't your topic have @telegram listed? You do a lot of exchange, and as I understand it from your statements, @telegram is suitable for this. Why do you have the @Visesento username in @telegram and the public username is Vise Sentos? Usually, if the name of the exchanger on the forum does not coincide with the name in @telegram, the topic does not indicate just the name in @telegram, but gives a direct link to the account in @telegram.

hip3r you and your russian gay friend are both mentally ill.
Also, both of you are the worst stupid failed scammers i ever meet (thanks god).
I am not sure how both of you are still not tagged.

Who is crazy and a scammer we will see!


Boombl4, if "Vise Sentos" is not your public @telegram username? How do you explain this screenshot?
http://prnt.sc/tcrvfz

Bump, those scammers still waiting to be tagged before someone get scammed.
Newibe, i do not care what someone in telegram told you anything.

So from the very beginning it wasn't you talking to me !?

Boombl4(Vise Sentos) The more lies on your part, the more questions for you.

Shut the fuck up already you failed russian scamming scum
You and your gaylord russian scam shit is going to be tagged soon or later.

1. I still haven’t received a response from your @telegram ID.
2. No need to entangle the rest here, only you and me. You have already confused everyone enough. We will deal with the rest later.

Boombl4 you run on all topics and scream what scammers are all
You wrote that your money from gambling in your own topic https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5233776.msg54053279#msg54053279
And here you write that no one knows about it and I'm a clone of another person
I have nothing to do with other people in this forum.
I have my own theme and my sales methods and exchange rates

The attack of the russian newbie alt clones :D:D:D:D
You are all welcome, bring the whole russian section in this report guys.
All of you are warm welcome :D

You're a bad detective
You can complain to the moderators of the multi-account so that they check
And do not speculate
In order to blame people you must have proofs
And you run and shit in the topics that everything around scammers
You have 99% of posts about it
Need to answer for your words.

Boombl4, you were asked a specific question! "Vise Sentos" is your @telegram ID? Or do you keep all fools?

This thread has been nothing but a waste of 4 pages worth of forum space.  

The only thing I really see that happened here;

1. Boombl4 suggest an escrow hip3r didn't like.
2. hip3r asked elmanchez for help in understanding and finding an escrow.
3. elmanchez suggests an escrow Boombl4 didn't like.
4. Boombl4 starts this thread, claiming that elmanchez' suggestion equates to a scam attempt.
5. Nobody can seem to explain what really happened, or accept that nothing happened.
6. People's stories change.
7. No one is willing to admit they are Vise Sentos
8. The whole thing degrades into a pissing match.

So yeah, business as usual in the Scam Accusation board.   :-\
Carry on.  ::)

DireWolfM14, I apologize for my English, it is probably difficult to understand.


1. I am not against real "monbux" now. After Boombl4(Vise Sentos) explained, it seemed strange to me that the deal should go through @telegram. I also had questions about some points.

2. I don’t know English, so I asked the person who called himself "elmanchez" to speak Boombl4(Vise Sentos). I needed to know why the deal would be in @telegram and some organizational issues. I met the person I asked for help the day before. I am not familiar with "elmanchez" in this forum.

3. In general, it is true, although I assumed that there would be negotiations on working with "monbux".

4. I do not know why Boombl4(Vise Sentos) opened this topic initially, but later he realized that it could cover it. If they blocked me right away, I would not prove anything to anyone or tell anyone. Perfect plan, but failed. Thanks to the community.

5. In a nutshell. Me and Boombl4(Vise Sentos) agreed on a deal. During the negotiations, Boombl4(Vise Sentos) accused me and other users of fraud. Boombl4(Vise Sentos) created a topic in which he accused me and other users, and at the same time negotiated an exchange with me. As a result, he brought to the deal not a real "monbux". Fortunately, I did not believe it and my finances did not suffer.

6. I do not understand(


7. DireWolfM14, you asked the question Boombl4(Vise Sentos), he replied that he was not "Vise Sentos". Although the screenshot shows everything. Ask the moderators, then only Boombl4 wrote a private message.
http://prnt.sc/tec5bc

8. So many people pulled into this place that the truth was lost.

Show me how i am connected with this guy "vise whatever" you russian scammer