Bitcoin Forum

Hello bitcointalk!


My name is darkhelix and we are pleased to announce that we are launching the first beta of http://www.bitroulette.se . We have committed every ounce of energy we have into producing the best clean, user friendly, secure and most of all fun roulette gambling site on the net. We use 100% true random white noise generated stop positions for our wheel and do not require any extra flash, java or executable plugins. The system is 100% anonymous and all bitcoins in the casino bank are stored in cold storage to prevent theft.


Please visit our website for more details: htp://www.bitroulette.se


Check out a nice demo video on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5b0WwpdWOY

This is the third roulette site I've seen this month.  Why do you say it's the first and only true one?

True random, meaning white noise generated random stopping numbers "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_noise" ... We obviously would not be the first "roulette" website on the net...

But we are the first of our kind... I will let everyone know when registration is open. Then you can try it out and write an honest review of the game play yourself..

I think this sounds great that you're trying to use white noise, but how do the players know 100% sure that you are using the white-noise randomness 100% of the time for every single spin?

Provably fair alleviates this specific fear.  With provably fair, the trust is on the true randomness of the RNG.  But the fear that an RNG could be biased is a fear equally shared between the players and the house, so there is no inherent conflict of interests.

I personally believe RNG uses white noise audio files .wav on a loop. Instead of live fed static audio from ambient noise.

I would like to release a live video feed of our hardware setup for the numbering system in version 2. We obviously won't be handing over algos and schematics but we do as much as we can to ease the minds of players. There are plenty of ways to create a true random response one being multiple voltage points of a said server and or white noise audio which is what we use.


Eventually we will build up a good enough reputation that we won't have to prove ourselves. 

As a avid roulette player or gambler I would like to test out your site.  If your so sure that site is genuine can't you offer some free chips to test it?

I don't understand how can it be more random than random?
And why other website are not random?

Shoot me a message on skype I would be glad to set you up with some free credits to play for awhile before we release the public version this Friday @  bitroulette_se on skype.

registration closed????
I wanna try it too :D

Shoot me a message on skype.. bitroulette_se be sure to tell me who you are on the forum.

So straight off the bat your lying to promote your site ?
Hrmm, I suspect your running a scam or are just an operator with 0 morales.
Either way you will get noted in my list for false advertising.


edit: concerns regarding advertisement raised poorly by mem.

edit: does not look provably fair to me, SCAM ALERT !!!

I am not going to sit here and argue with you troll. Find another bitcoin roulette site that goes beyond "prob fair" using random.org or another third party.

First off we have not started accepting bets so we have not "scammed" anyone. You should not throw around false accusations so quickly without proof.

We have opened trials for users of the forum and have had some good feedback on the system.

We use white noise generated random numbers using a complete hardware setup, not a third party such as random.org making us the only "true random" generated setup on the net.


I suggest before you bad talk someones business you at least request a demonstration or give them try. Otherwise stay off my thread.

hey, if you cant explain your claims of "provably fair" then you should not be making ANY.

I looked through your website before making this post, I couldnt see how a player is expected to verify their bet results - can you enlighten me ?

For a true provably fair roulette game see satoshiroulette.com 's implementation.
site secret that changes every 24h + users txid are used to generate the resulting spin.

That is NOT true random...

The closest/simplest way your going to get to TRUE RANDOM numbers is this "Below" based on a generator that uses avalanche noise. Which if you search the net has passed all almost all randomness tests. The others you are listing are Pseudo Random. For example downloading random images off google images and counting all of the black pixels would be considered "random" but not "true random". This might be a little over your head... I would do some reading before trying to call someone out. And as I listed in my previous post I would like a LIVE VIDEO FEED of our hardware in version 2 with a digital print out. I am not out to "scam" I am only out to change the scene. This is a hobby for me not my day job. ;) Don't get so seriousss.

http://robseward.com/misc/RNG2/RNG_Version_2_images/rng2_circuit_small.png

reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noise_%28electronics%29#Avalanche_noise
reference: http://www.maximintegrated.com/app-notes/index.mvp/id/3469

I will however appease you and put all of this information on the website along with infographs and simplistic diagrams explaining how it works.

Thanks!

correct, but it is provably fair random which yours is not.

Im thrilled to see you sampling "your balls humidity level" to generate the seed for your RNG but we still need a way for players to verify their results which you are not demonstrating.

Additionally players need to be able to set their own seed if you really want to claim provably fair for random number games.

As I said before we have not opened for actual BTC betting and I am not here to get in a dick swinging contest. I am pretty sure I said we are TRUE RANDOM and no where on our site or this forum does it use the term "provably fair" regarding our business. So you should have stated that before you would play you would want to know that we are as you say "provably fair" and of course we will do that before opening for monetary betting. You just have a bad way of approaching people. 

There is inconsistency in your posts and defamation.

1. We do not claim the term Provably Fair - "This does not make us a scam"
2. We have not opened for monetary betting - "This does not make us a scam"
3. We never denied that we would prove random results. - "This does not make us a scam"

How about instead of "swinging your balls in the wind" you tell us what you would like to see and we will provide it. It is called constructive criticism...I can take it.

Well, It appears I may need to eat some humble pie.

Please, excuse my terrible approach to these concerns I have raised.

May we start again and address some key concerns:
1) You claim "The First And Only True Random Online Roulette", casino.bit (think thats the one) uses a real roulette table which I would argue is true random.
At this point it is hair splitting but I would argue you are not the first "true random".
2) I see in your reply you do have plans to provide a method for players to verify their roles, this is ideal.
3) Will players be able to set their own client seed ?

I will also agree that this thread got out of hand quickly and I am willing to do whatever it takes to make sure customers feel at ease when betting with us. Again sorry for snapping back so quickly.

Roulette wheels themselves are not true random, there are WAY to many factors that can disrupt the randomness of the wheel itself.

For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Zj_9ypBnzg

I will look into client/server game seeding and talk to my cryptography programmer. Since we do use hardware to generate white noise which I have not heard of anyone else doing we may have to create our own seeding system based off the prov fair "engine". 

In the end all online casinos and games have some risk.  We have taken the stance to be ad free, spam free and are trying to create the most advanced random generated wheel that we can.


Off to bed now :D - dark signing out for the night.

Mem, I really think you should remove the negative trust that you gave the OP.  Just because he doesn't have a provably fair casino doesn't mean that he is running a Scam casino.

There are some examples of non-provably fair casinos that are still fair, like live-feed video dealer roulette.  If OP is going to set up a video feed of the white-noise detector, that could suffice for fairness.

I totally agree. Lets give this roulette a chance.

...wat?

i think of it as Venn Diagrams with the provably fair set being a full subset within the fair set.  The way bitroulette is set up could be within the bounds of fair, but not in the provably fair.

this is just a dealer's skill.  After spinning the ball 10,000 times, they have a good idea where the ball will drop a short while after the let the ball go, but this why they don't allow bets after a certain time.  to prevent this type of skilled Advantage play.

Notice that he only is able to predict the spot when the ball is close to dropping.  HE won't be able to predict it before that point.

my point is that roulette wheels are still very random.

I think a live real casino broadcast makes more sense because not only is it live but anyone can visit the casino, and you can see the players physically in the casino betting on the table too so you know the result is not 'just for you' ... i think that solves the trust issue with RNG ... like on our www.allcoincasino.com :) (shameless plug!) but i think its better than promising that 'its fair'.

Oh, ok, I just clicked it and say "roulette system" and x'ed out.  Yes, ball control is real but very few dealers want to go to big boy prison for cheating a casino.

I have played there.
I like simple and clean design of the site. Multiplayer roulette is really god a way better than https://www.satoshi-karoshi.com/?a=Roulette.index. Drag'n'drop works great. There is chat for users. Notifications and Croupie are good.
I do not need "Provably fair" with user seed if they can prove that result is true random generate using white noise.
We have only one value chip and it is hard to place big bet at one number you need to place it chip by chip.
Wrong colors of numbers. (Red numbers are black and reversal.)
Wheel animation is not so good.
No explanation about max bet.
History should be improved with at least 20 previous numbers and some percentages.

Just ordered the LCD print out for the RNG hardware, We will also be creating our own "seed" system to provide validation of all randomly generated numbers which will allow all players to check TRUE RANDOM numbers.. Including testing the validity of true random in any benchmark testing such as dieharder or rngtest.. Lets change the standards of online gambling here guys ;)

What is the problem here? Why all the negative trust?

such claims and not even being Provably Fair? :) Cmon..
Come back when your roulette is provably fair.

They didnt claim that they are Provably fair. That is misconstrued by mem

So, is this casino legit or not?  I normally play Bitcoin Roulette @ CasinoBitco.in cause it's Provably Fair. 

For a game like, Roulette, please only play at a Provably casino...

 8) ::) 8)

Would the competitors stop trolling this threads. Provably fair is only fair in perception. This is the first tests of our true random system where white noise is filling the entropy.... If your "provably fair" engine/algos can hold up to dierharder feel free to show me or shut up and sit down.

The system we will use:

The server seed and all multiplayer client seeds will be created by white noise entropy making them 100% true random.

Server seed and client seeds will be issued before each game and will display on your table along with the game ID.

After the round ends you will be able to use the API to request all client seeds and server seed for the game.

These can be ran though our algo to reproduce the random number.

Using true white noise takes any influence that we have out of the equation. The hash is not generated based on controlled Pseudo Random factors.
 




Example of using entropy to pull random numbers:

Dieharder/rngtest entropy testing using Raspberry PI SoC Chip:

https://i.imgur.com/MENKKDd.png

https://i.imgur.com/pp6jkj1.png

https://i.imgur.com/ECYiZ5t.png

https://i.imgur.com/XyeE7Kl.png

I heard (correct me if I'm wrong) that the only way you can have real randomness is to implement hardware solution which would costs 10s or 100s thousands of dollars.

I still want to try this.

done & done :)

I got a bit trigger happy with all the ponzi's I was branding and ended up in here all charged up and over zealous :P

I would argue heavily against that.
The moment players are inputing their own seed either manually, via their own RNG formula or via txid (blockchain based casinos) you have a level of trust and fairness unparalleled in any other casino game.

I need to jump on and give it a play when its ready before I can fairly comment further, feel free to shoot me a PM when its ready.

Agreed, provably fair is fair.  By definition, Players need to make sure they do everything in their power to ensure fairness, and the house will abide by those conditions to provide that fairness.

What you're asking, bitroulette, is:  Is it random?  This is a tough question.  I think the way most btc casinos answer is that if they're using a level of technology equal to or surpassing that of online (and offline) real-money casinos (they use PRNGs as well), then it suffices to say "yes,it is random".