Bitcoin Forum

A few days back, the Indian government announced that they will ban the usage of cryptocurrency in India. The bill is currently in queue to be presented during the budget session (which started today).


This bill was originally formulated by Subhash Chandra Garg in 2018, who was the Finance Secretary of India then. According to the provisions, anyone found holding cryptocurrency will be charged and punished with up to 10 years in jail. Back then, Mr.Garg got embroiled in to some conflict with some of the ruling politicians and was kicked out before he could implement this law. After that the cryptocurrency users were thinking that the government had given up its effort to criminalize cryptocurrency ownership. And that was until a few days back, when they made the announcement about this law.

So what has changed now? Why a law that was rejected in 2018 is now refurbished and tabled again in 2021?

If you take a look at the charts, then it become clear. Bitcoin prices have increased by almost 3 times during the last 12 months. Bitcoin is now worth $624 billion. According to conservative estimates, there are 5 million+ crypto users in India, who holds around $10 billion in cryptocurrency. However, these figures are based only on the stats from India-based cryptocurrency exchanges such as Zebpay and WazirX. The majority of the Indian users don't use these exchanges, and instead rely on P2P platforms. So the real number will be much higher.

The current government, which is headed by the Bharatiya Janata Party is essentially run by a few corporate houses, especially those owned by the Ambani/Adani nexus. Ever since 2014 (when BJP came to power), these corporate houses have monopolized various sectors in the Indian economy. The strategy used is very simple. First destroy the competition and then rollout their own product and capture the monopoly. Take the case of the telecom sector. Established brands such as Idea and Airtel were destroyed before Ambani came up with his Jio brand. And how can they let cryptocurrency out of their control? Since it is impossible to control a decentralized asset such as Bitcoin, they have decided to ban it. Once the vacuum is created, the pro-government corporates will come up with their own version of the cryptocurrency (which will obviously be 100% pre-mined).

Now what are the options that we have?

Nowhere else in the world, ownership of cryptocurrency has been made a criminal offense. There are certain countries such as China, which are having trading ban on cryptocurrency. But even they are not crazy enough to jail individuals just for storing a code in their computers. If the ban is implemented, then the government will give at the most 3 months time for the users to get rid of their coins.

Those who don't want to sell their coins immediately have very few options. They can try to travel to countries such as Qatar, which are having visa-waiver for Indian nationals. Before the limit expires, the individuals can attempt to get a work visa or investment visa. Another option is proxy holding. You can transfer your coins to a foreign national and ask him to hold the coins for you. But this is a very risky step. Right now I can't think about any other option apart from these.

Impact for the users

The existing cryptocurrency users will be adversely effected. With institutional investment of cryptocurrency gaining pace, it is expected that investment in Bitcoin would give good returns in the near future. But even those who were aiming for long-term investment needs to sell their coins immediately. And this can negatively affect the users on multiple fronts. If you sell your coins in a gradual manner, it is possible to reduce the tax cut to 10% or 20%. But when you sell all of your holdings at once, the top-most tax slab will be applicable for most of the users and they will be forced to pay 43% tax on their holdings.

And in the near future we can expect worldwide adoption of BTC. Eventually, Bitcoin will become legal in India once more. But the Indian users will be forced to purchase BTC at that point at much higher prices and they will lose out to users from the rest of the world.  

Response from the users

With a user base of at least 5 million, the cryptocurrency users in India are not some insignificant group. They are feeling helpless, because of the lack of unity. It is worthwhile to note that at least one opposition politician (Milind Deora of the Congress Party) has come out in support of Bitcoin. Cryptocurrency users in India needs to unite and take a political stance against those who are hostile to the idea of BTC. State elections are due in four crucial states in the next 2-3 months (West Bengal, Tamil Nadu, Kerala and Assam). Bitcoiners need to use their votes effectively, in order to defeat the political factions that are in favor of the Bitcoin ban. Tactical voting needs to be undertaken.

WOW, that what I call harsh legislation!

Are you sure about making the ownership a criminal offense?! I read the news in Coindesk - https://www.coindesk.com/india-would-ban-private-cryptocurrencies-under-proposed-legislation, and they didn't mention anything about criminal offenses.

Don's panic! Nothing has been finalised yet. What we are seeing is that the crypto matter will be discussed in the upcoming parliament session. While it's most likely to be negative because majority of Indian politicians are uneducated and they simply don't want to understand what crypto is. However, Passing a law is one thing and enforcing it is another thing! If any country wants to achieve blanket ban on cryptos, internet will have to be stopped! So it is easier said than done! Just wait and watch!

I would agree with you on the voting matter! India needs to choose educated ministers. The current government is regressive in nature and sees everything new as a threat. That outlook can only be changed with education and young blood. I think India needs to choose young leaders more! 

I wouldn't agree that it will have a negative impact, in my country, most regulations only have their fangs sharpened for 3 months tops and after that, the regulations are muzzled, meaning that this will only be enforced for awhile until it dies down. If the case in my country is the same as in India which is obviously larger than mine, I do not think that the regulations will be enforced that much.

But the part you shared doesn't even mention bitcoin, it uses the term "private cryptocurrencies" which is ambiguous wording for a legal document and it is also not talking about any kind of criminal offense. It also mentioned "exceptions" which could mean bitcoin.
From my point of view this is yet another country that is going to ban majority of altcoins more specifically ICO tokens that have been scamming people for some time now and that won't be a new thing.

I wouldn't read too much into this until I can read more about the details of the proposal and not some ambiguous thing.

This is a refurbished version of the 2018 bill. Back then there was a provision for 10 years jail term, for anyone found to be holding cryptocurrency. I don't think that they have changed the provisions (apart from a few minor cosmetic corrections). To confirm, we need to wait until the bill is presented in the lower house of the parliament (which may take a few weeks more).


Obviously it is very difficult to enforce, but with such harsh punishment provisions no one wants to end up on the wrong side of the law.

@pooya87, in a communication sent to the Supreme Court of India in 2020, the government clarified that by the term "private cryptocurrency" they mean all the cryptocurrencies that are not controlled by the Reserve Bank of India.

"To create a framework for the creation of the official digital currency to be issued by the Reserve Bank of India."
It is clear that the Indian government wants to ban cryptocurrencies just for the sake of promoting their own CBDC.Also they don't plan to ban the blockchain technology,just the cryptocurrenices.
We may witness the same thing happening in other countries,when their central banks launch their CBDCs.
However,I don't believe that the Indian central bank digital currency will be launched anytime soon.
The only way to respond to such bill is to hide your private keys and use crypto exchange platforms located outside of India.

You have a wallet and you know the seed. Seeds are not in any digital device. Maybe you memorized the words or left clues in your house or anywhere that you only know what those means. How would anyone in the world will know the key and prove that you are holding bitcoin?

I see nothing to be worried when holding bitcoin in fact if you do p2p trade then there are no need to touch any exchange or government agency. You are anonymous.

I thought India is a big country with diversity but you are saying the economy is controlled by those Ambani/Adani company/guys? This will be a shame. Of course, they will not like things that could risk their control in everything.

Anyway, I think no one can stop a bitcoiner if they know how to practice their privacy.

10 years? That seems to be overly extreme for merely owning an asset lol.

Anyway, if you're from India, you pretty much have 2 choices.

• Simply sell it and wait for the illegalization to be lifted.
• Sell your holdings that has ties to you(exchanges, etc), and though I'm not telling anyone to commit crime, people could still simply accept bitcoin through anonymous services and such and simply hold them through their non-custodial wallet. Of course, people should be really cautious as a simple mistake could get them caught.
• Optional: move out of India lol.

Did they implement the rule or it is just another speculation that the government is planning to criminalize. When i searched regarding this all i can see is proposed regulation and it says it might reveal the details in the budget today and they are planning their version of digital currency. The only precaution you need to take is that the government will come after the registered users in exchanges that are functioning in India other than that there is not way they can target users holding the coins.

Why India bans private cryptocurrencies to support government solutions. The official currency will give the country more control to limit foreign influence, but it will also provide the kind of stability associated with conventional currencies. The prices of Bitcoin and similar currencies still tend to fluctuate wildly and are more susceptible to manipulation. In theory, India can accept pure digital currencies without digital traps.

Private cryptocurrencies? Does Bitcoin count? It isn't private from what I know, so I guess it shouldn't count as one? Not to mention that it seems like India is trying to develop its own digital currency, hence why it's trying to kick out all owned cryptocurrencies that are being circulated inside the country. They're basically trying to let the market use their currency instead of others, though there would be exceptions as they said. I'd reckon that as long as the community shows avid support for Bitcoin and properly state it to the government, they'd make an exception to it since really, if they put out a shtcoin as an exception and Bitcoin as not? Then hell, that'd be quite hilarious.

For most of the ordinary cryptocurrency users in India, there is only one option and that is to sell their holdings immediately without any consideration about the returns or tax implications. Those with large size holdings will be worst hit, as they need to shell out almost half of the returns as tax. Moving out of India is an option that the richer investors can consider. Many of the Caribbean nations will provide you with a passport in exchange of a donation amounting to $100,000 to $250,000. But for the 99% of the investors who are unable to afford that, the options are limited.

whether the Indian government does not conduct a study before deciding...
There is no 100% accurate reason to make Bitcoin an excuse to punish someone. there is a lot of potentials that can be felt by Bitcoin owners in India, especially in this time of crisis. I hope that bitcoin owners fight for their rights there.

Last time also they came up with some stupid law. The Reserve Bank of India (RBI) banned the usage of bank accounts for the trading of Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency in 2018. Some of the local exchanges filed an appeal with the supreme court of India. The problem is that the legal process in India is extremely slow and it can take many years to get a judgement. Anyway, in 2020, the supreme court said that the ban by RBI was unconstitutional.

The difference this time is that it is the government which is coming up with the law and not the RBI. If the bill gets approved by both the houses of the parliament, then it gets in to a law. Under such circumstances, even the supreme court will not show any sympathy towards the cryptocurrency users.

BTW, for the last two days, I have noticed a massive campaign by ruling party supporters in social media, where they are painting all cryptocurrency users as tax evaders and criminals. From the pattern, it looks like a well organized and well planned strategy for me.

The idea of criminalizing holding any sort of cryptocurrencies was the mad brainchild of Subhash Garg when he came up with that first draft. I don't think they will go to this extent.
Unfortunately, everything at present is being decided by a regressive government aided by a media truly gone mad. They are always fanning the flames of chauvinism because the thing that gets the most TRP in today's India is a fake display of nationality and making everything about it.

Farmers protest become secessionist movements; A murder becomes a case of snatching civilization from Bollywood; An investigation into a manipulative journalist becomes "foreign powers" trying to suppress Indians through Congress.

If this becomes political, Bitcoiners WILL lose. So while you concern is legitimate and we all need to rally, I would advice against making this about elections or anything political.

The best option is to follow the route of law and basic human right to choose. The Supreme Court has enough knowledge to judge this. As Civil society, we have to support the nascent industry and make it about financial freedom. Making it about Modi's politics or crony capitalism of the ruling party will only lead to a quick suppression using media sensationalization.

UPDATE:
LOL, I think we posted at almost the same time. If it goes this way, then God save our Sats. If the ruling party's "nationalists" are onto it, this will be difficult.

Since when has anything in India ever been good for people? I know that is not a good thing to say and disrespects all the good progress made over the years but I guess when it's come to money and crypto and finance, we're still always falling short on helping the people with what they really need. Good thing though is that crypto can't be stopped by anything in India, so we just go quietly p2p.

Moving out of India permanently is the best choice anyone can make at this point if time! Canada and Portugal have opened their immigration channel so I think educated Indians can looks for these options. India is pretty much living under a dictatorship since 2014 where the freedom of speech is brutally killed by the government. The government is trying to poke their smelly nose on every personl matter of their citizen and even trying to sell off the agricultural sector to the corporates!

I think leaving India permanently is the best decision anyone can make, especially people with job experience and professional degrees.

Do you really think that it is that simple? There are 5 to 10 million cryptocurrency users in India, and out of them 10% maybe active users who trade in cryptocurrency very frequently. Other countries are restricting immigration levels (especially that of skilled immigrants), perhaps with a few exceptions such as Canada and Australia. And even if some of them manage to immigrate, there is no guarantee that these new destinations will remain pro-Bitcoin for too long.

This is a nice briefing from India budget 2021 and I saw the impact on the Indian market yesterday when bitcoin crashed couple of thousand USD here while the international market price was constant. I was surprised to that but that meant only one thing to me, and thats buy

Criminal offence? Well it will take years for any government authority to track you down because they are not having proper infra or IT support really. They have to handle more serious issue within the country apart from the crypto currency use.

I have seen rare cases where crypto currency trader account was ceased by banks or feds. If anyway they did, by it's nature they will be released on the nominal bail application.

Please note that we have no solid rules and regulations which states it's offence. Court order doesn't matter as long as it gets pen downed on a notice in the public interest.

India tried this stuff earlier, it wont be a success. It's a country of farmers not the digital coin owners. India will have to overcome the basic problems first so that they can go rogue on crypto holders.

Again and again the RBI seems to come out with these absurd proposals that will have absolutely no means of enforcement.

We've been through this saga with China, India, Pakistan and a bunch of other countries that have attempted to regulate (i.e., ban) BTC to various extents. But none of them have worked - the decentralised nature of BTC at its core means that it has no central point of failure.

If, and it's a big if, the bill does get passed, then there may be short term panic. But I simply do not think that it'll affect either markets nor BTC fundamentals in the slightest in the medium to long run - people already know the Indian government's stance on BTC a long time ago, and they also know that any proposed law of such kind will not have any practical effect other than wiping out domestic regulated bitcoin businesses (the majority of which have already relocated/closed).

No one expects them to arrest all of the 10 million cryptocurrency users in India. What they are planning to do is to arrest a few prominent traders, hand them extremely harsh punishments, so that the remainder would remain terrorized. Unlike the Western nations where the citizens are concerned about their personal liberty, authoritarian policies are easier to implement in India, where a large section of the population is illiterate. The government will make an announcement that they are banning Bitcoin because it is being used for terrorist financing (despite having zero evidence to support their claim) and the illiterate supporters of the ruling party would immediately support the move. Already, the pro-government social media handles are spreading their anti-Bitcoin propaganda in the social media platforms.

Well, India is run by the government that is why they ban cryptocurrency, they see cryptocurrency as a threat so they have to neutralize it before it gets bigger. Your theory of India accepting pure digital currencies contradicts with your other statements which is the wild fluctuation on the prices of bitcoin and other currencies and that the official fiat currency will limit foreign influence and create a stability.

India has been spreading FUD on the media about Bitcoin for YEARS now. And the illiterate and less-technologically-savvy people, which compose a large chunk of our population just eat that up. No one does their own research or due diligence. The media has only ever reported negative news about BTC, like when scams/fraudsters are arrested and they have used BTC or sometimes I've just seen the argument that "cryptocurrency" is "hacker-currency" and some weird stuff like that. I remember India trying to push its own crypto in 2018 named Lakshmi, but never followed through with that. So, yeah, the buzz has been going on for quite a while but India has always failed to take a step and instead of regulating, it wants to ban crypto.

Also, the bill supposedly has vague "exceptions", which I believe will just be crypto owned by the giant corporations which will be excused. In words of Elon, India has gone corpo.

That is the thing, laws can say whatever they want, in theory they could even criminalize people just from the act of breathing but such law will be impossible to enforce and something similar could happen to this law if it is passed as it is.

If they pass this law and criminalize holding cryptocurrencies then those that can will get out of the country and will leave with their fortunes in bitcoin, the rest will just keep silent about their bitcoin holdings and will use decentralized exchanges, so at the end they can pass whatever laws they want this is not going to stop the adoption and the rate of growth of bitcoin at all.

Everyone knows what the "exceptions" mean. Under the "Make in India" program, Ambani and Adani will be provided with exceptions, so that they can come up with Jiocoin or Adanicoin. The government is full of retards, if they think that everyone would flock to purchase their shitcoin if they remove the competition. Crypto industry doesn't work like that. I tried to post a few comments clarifying that there is no evidence to link cryptocurrency to terrorist funding or tax evasion in mainstream news websites such as TOI and HT. But the BJP bots immediately flagged my comments as offensive and got them deleted.

I am not sure whether the Supreme Court will offer any relief for the Bitcoiners. From what I understand, the duty of the supreme court is to implement the existing laws. At the most, they can check the constitutional validity of the new laws that are being passed by the parliament. In case the parliament passes this "Bill" and makes it an "Act", then the only instance where Supreme Court will turn it down is if it finds the law "unconstitutional". Under current circumstances, there is only a remote chance of something like that happening. So I agree with the political move. The best response would be to organize Bitcoiners and make sure that the ruling party is defeated in the elections.

<insert gif of Homer Simpson disappearing into a bush here>


Unfortunately, I see it is worse, they are using this term to make sure that nothing which is not issued by the state can avoid this law. It's like rather than outlawing 400 types of drugs they make a criminal offense owning every substance that is not approved, be it a drug or goldfish food.

One thing that I'm not sure how users from India will take it.
The bad news is that obviously the one above, the good news is that the market doesn't care which brings us the second bad news, seems like the Indian influence on the price is null to negative.


You're joking, right?
You're going to fly to a different country, exchange the coins there while taking an obvious hit from the fees, and then, what? Ride back home with a bar of gold deep inside your (https://nypost.com/2020/10/16/plane-passenger-caught-smuggling-gold-in-rectum-to-avoid-taxes/)... you know what!
Do you think that the buys at the customs are stupid not to see what's happening when suddenly there is a spike in one day visitors? What if the Qatar authorities think this is not good and start confiscating your money? I wouldn't play around with anything over 10 000 euros inc ash here and we're in a union with near-zero border control and you envision thousands doing this? Let's be serious.


And yet I'm willing to bet that IF this law is passed once if you hear a knock at the door at night while not expecting any visits you will piss your pants in seconds. It will take just a  few convictions with some harsh punishments and 99% will quit. I've lived in a real dictatorship, you have no idea how effective fear is.

100% agreed. I have been to India multiple times, and I can tell you that the Indian prisons are not for the light-hearted. Even if there is only a 0.0001% chance of getting caught, the vast majority of the users are going to dump their holdings. Those users who are residing in the EU and the US can post whatever they want, about disregarding the law. They fail to understand the ground reality in India.

It so amazed sometimes the behaviour of some government towards the citizens that elected them into the office and with the above information you point out I believe the current Indian government are following the same strategy used by the Chinese government before they create their own Central Bank Digital Currency but it a shame that their decision will only affect the development of the country because there's a lot blockchain Dev from India.
With that been said, due to all this issue, the recent list of countries in the world that are communist which India was excluded is totally wrong and they need to be include.

Government and their selfish habit.


We never can tell, let's wait cause the Wazirx Chairman and other cryptos related CEO will try to convince the government just like he once did. I have once before now that cryptocurrency will have many enemies due to its trend during the total lockdown, the recent surge in price, and the institution which are the major investors. Besides, I am sure the banking setting and some government are not happy as we speak.

No, it isn't like that. There are around 8-9M Indian crypto traders who bought or sold cryptos at least once in last 12 months. The number is not small. The first day after the bill announcement, Indian market experienced a deep fall. Before 2018, Indian situation had direct co-relation with average International bitcoin price. But after the introduction of pegged coins like USDT, market is working in two way: Indian Rupee <--> USDT <--> bitcoin

Current price of US Dollar in Indian Rupee is Rs. 73. Now see the chart below:

https://i.imgur.com/JZ5tLQe.png
(image courtesy: WazirX)

USDT price declined to Rs. 60 (-20% from international price) on 31st Jan. So, first hit was taken by pegged coin. With current Indian volume, impact on USD price of bitcoin would have started if price of USDT declined below the level of Rs. 54-56, after that USDT would have been saturated and bitcoin would have started falling in dollar value. But that didn't happen because Indians expected that Finance Minister would say something about the bill in budget speech but she didn't say anything making people believe that cryptocurrencies are just small petty item in government's list of agenda and bill most likely won't be passed. Hence, positivity once again kicked in Indian market on 1st Feb and USDT price is once again trading around Rs. 74-75 (1-2% premium).

I just wrote a post in Indian section highlighting my views on why the bill most likely won't get passed: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5313704.msg56250260#msg56250260

Yeah, they need to be careful because of all the country in the world India has the most hostile country in terms of their national law. From the start, Indian people have faced this issue for years now and they're not gonna make it right since the bill has already been passed. However, India has also put some pressure on the investors of BTC since they implemented this bill. If I were living there I should be careful where I get or send my BTC because once it passes on some criminal address, it would be a pain in the ass.

Sorry to burst your bubble but that's the Indian market, and as you can see on any graphics that shows the trading in the world it had zero efect, Elon twitting one meme about bitcoin has more impact on price than the entire parliament of India and its central bank board committing seppuku.
10 million 100 million, write every number you can if all their holdings are not touching one-tenth of coinbase volume it's nothing.
Just imagine if this proposal would have come from the SEC  :-X


Before that, you would need a volume a bit higher than 10 million. I understand the reason while you try to picture things this way but that's the reality proven tens of times in the past, news from India is not making a dent in the price in any way.
Leave the patriotism aside and try to be objective, in the current situation I doubt that even news from Japan or even a few countries in Europe (except the big 5)  would swing anything, all eyes are focused on the US.

Look even on this forum, is anyone running for the hills hearing the news? Nope!

Thread title is overtly sensationalized. India has not made ownership of Bitcoin a criminal offense yet. We do not the final form of the bill yet. Whole industry is eagerly waiting to know the final form of this bill.

Bitcoin is considered as a breathtaking cryptocurrency. People are preferring bitcoin more than other currencies. But it is shocking that in most of the countries, transaction of bitcoin is illegal.
Even, in India bitcoin is considered as an illegal transaction system. India is planning to introduce law to ban bitcoin. It is very difficult to operate bitcoin in India. As governments can't control bitcoin they don't like it at all. Some analysts are saying that Indian government may be planning to issue their own official cryptocurrency which will be controlled by governments or financial authorities. The main purpose behind it is to gain financially, as India has a big population, so it will certainly have impact. India has also issued punishment for using private cryptocurrencies like bitcoin. Traders and investors are not happy with this decision.

If it passes it's going to be a dead law like one of those laws in the UK where you can shoot a Scott found carrying a bow and arrows in York :D

How are they going to prove that you hold Bitcoins? How are they going to find spots in jail to hold people if this is more a misdemeanor than a crime? Are they going to put people in jail with thieves and murderers? It's going to be counterproductive and make them a lot of enemies in a very short time.

Pretty stupid of them to even attempt it.

That's true. The logic is that this bill is essentially the same as the one which was formulated by Subhash Chandra Garg in 2018. Back then, he had such stupid provisions, such as 10 year jail term for owning cryptocurrency. But during the budget speech, there was no mention about cryptocurrency by Nirmala Seetharaman (finance minister). But that can't be taken as a positive sign, because the budget speech was very short (~90 mins) and it is not mandatory that the planned bill should be discussed during the speech.

The budget session of the parliament runs for a month and in this session the bill will be placed in both the houses. Now it depends on the government when they want to present the bill. It all depends on the government whether they want to priotize this bill.

I can feel the disappointment from the crypto community in India regarding the fate of crypto in India, because it looks like the Indian
government is very strict on crypto. Several times planning to ban cryptocurrency, then often the Indian government issued negative
statements against cryptocurrency. Hopefully the crypto community in India can convince the government to be friendly with crypto,
because the Indian people need cryptocurrency to help restore the economy.

The budget session is divided in to two parts, and if I am not wrong the bill may be introduced during the second part. The first part is scheduled to run from 1st February to 13th February and during this session the priority will be taken up by discussion related to the current budget and the implementation of the farm laws. After that there is a recess from 14th February to 7th March.

The parliament will meet again on 8th March. The second phase of the budget session will run from 8th March to 8th April, and during this time most of the bills that are on queue will be taken up and tabled before the parliament.

i get that they can shut down exchanges that take fiat but how exactly do you ban ownership of something intangible, like are they going to come to your house and scan your computer for the keys or invent a metal detector that detects ledger and trezor or something

I guess they are primarily concerned with two aspects - conversion of cryptocurrency to fiat (and vice versa) and the purchase of various items from online marketplaces using cryptocurrency. Your point is very valid. It is very difficult to prove the ownership of a cryptocurrency wallet, even if it is having links to a KYC-enabled exchange. Unlike the case with bank/demat accounts, there is nothing that links a particular individual to a certain cryptocurrency wallet address.

But then you need to understand that the education level of ministers in the current Indian cabinet is not that great. Many of them have no idea about cryptocurrency and are mostly dependent on the bureaucrats for all this information. The bureaucrats are also not much better. Only when they implement the law, they are going to find out that it is such a blunder.

Why do you guys fall prey to such predatory tactics all the time? Hilarious. This isn't the first time this happened with the current Indian government and it certainly won't be the last in my opinion.

This is just another useless bill(most likely) which will probably be tossed aside. They have threatened crypto investors with jail etc multiple times before, but achieved nada at the end of the day.

Stop losing it everytime the media publicizes this crap for their own benefit. Just my 2 cents.

Regardless of them, their governments don't like this and everyone has to abide by the rules and the country in which they live. I think this is not too new in this market, and then everything will come to an end for this market, it will not happen and vice versa we still see Bitcoin with new values. I remember many countries claiming to ban the use of cryptocurrencies, and gradually I see them accepting and studying it :), like that, we will see their government again one day make another decision.

During the initial phase (around 2014-15), there was a lot of misinformation related to Bitcoin and that was when a lot of the countries tried to ban cryptocurrency. But that changed once it was known to all that only a minuscule fraction of the Bitcoin transactions are linked to illegal transactions. A lot of the countries which previously tried to ban them reversed their decision and made Bitcoin legal in their jurisdiction. But India seems to be moving in the opposite direction. They are trying to ban Bitcoin, although it was legal earlier.

Lets see how things will go, there are bigger problems the government is facing right now, the farmers protest will be a priority by that time even though they downplay the gravity of the issue and till now they have not announced any recovery package for the economy.

As if the government understands the rest of the issues in India :D . Take for example the farm law or the GST on how they are implemented or the demonetization or the CAA replicating the Nazi regime, there is nothing the current government did that is helping the common population. All the above mentioned were implemented without much thought process and you cannot expect anything different from them.

Hoping that the voting changes from EVM to the old ballot papers so that they do not tamper with the elections. If not how could they be in power even with all the blunders which includes selling of almost all PSU and we will see more sales by the government in the second phase of the budget.   

It is ridiculous to blame the EVM for the success of the right-wing. I am a regular visitor to India and I saw before my own eyes how the political scenario changed there. The UPA government of 2004-14 engaged in naked minority appeasement, which caused a polarization of the Hindu votes towards the BJP. The opposition needs to understand that if they want to win elections, then they need to prevent religious polarization. Because if polarization occurs, then it becomes 75% Hindus vs 25% non-Hindus.

And from what I have found, there is widespread support for the CAA and the farm laws. Opinion polls conducted by various news agencies also confirms the same. Once again, the opposition parties made the mistake of giving this a religious color. The media houses (many of which are supportive of the ruling party) seized the advantage and did the rest. They made CAA a Hindu vs Muslim issue. And similarly, the farm law protest is being painted as a Hindu vs Sikh issue.

This is freaking ridiculous. I am sure that there will be riots later on if this bill has officially passed and come to fruition. I am also feeling that Indians may have to relocate themselves to another country by applying a working visa or even change citizenship.

If I were born as Indian and currently staying there, I would panic and plan ahead to move to another country where it’s crypto-friendly and will apply for a change of citizenship permanently.

It is ridiculous. But the situation is not as favorable as that in the developed nations. The cryptocurrency market in India is quite large, with somewhere around 5 million to 10 million active users. But when compared to the overall population (1.4 billion), this would look like minuscule. 90% of the population doesn't have enough education to understand what is cryptocurrency and the technology behind it. If the government claim that cryptocurrency is being used for illegal purposes, then these people will support the government's stand. So forget about the users rioting, or even protesting against the move.

A better option is to travel to some other country, so that you can trade with your cryptocurrency holdings. But I guess stompix has already explained the impracticality of any such move in one of his posts within this thread.

Have read the article but haven't seen anything that means criminal offense but maybe this was just a misunderstanding. I hope that it wouldn't be the case because I don't like the idea of bitcoin being labeled illegal to be possessed which makes it to the same level as drugs. This legislation wouldn't be a problem for the people in India that uses cryptocurrency in the long run, Indian government has always had this on and off relationship with cryptocurrencies for the long while and most of the time those legislations didn't even last that long, I may not be accurate with that but I think that it is evident that each legislation doesn't have a permanent fangs to enforce the law which is a good thing for bitcoin community in India.

I think they (Bitcoin users in the country) would do well if they rely on the fundamental laws in the country that prevent people (esp those in position of authority) from abusing their powers. I believe there are laws in the country that recognize the right to own good assets like Bitcoin. What people in position of authority should focus more on is regulation and the prevention of abuse/misuse of good cryptocurrency. If they could jail people from using crypto, they could aswell jail people from using any other asset they don't like whether the asset is good or bad.

That's too inconsiderate.
There are worst crimes than this. I don't understand why government making life difficult for citizens.
Instead of creating this kind of law, why not regulate it.
At the long run, I feel they will still come back to Bitcoin, so why all this.

You have no idea about the fascist government that is ruling India, they will jail anyone that they seem to be challenging their views, if you look at the current situation you have no idea how many news reporters are in jail as well as comedians who made jokes against them, only a fascist government can sent people to jail without committing any crime and that is what they are doing.

Of what difference is this from a dictatorship? To me, they are the same exact thing, just redecorated. Otherwise, what do you call a system that has no respect for fundamental human rights, a system that doesn't allow free will or permits you to ask questions! I feel for the people of India even as I cry my continent!

Sometimes I begin to o wonder if those in places of power and are antibitcoin aren't observing trends of Elion Musk who happens to be the richest man in the world now and a proud supporters of bitcoin and cryptocurencies. These are proud opportunist and business moguls that are able to see the future of potential commodities and how to exploit it.

Sadly the Indian government has planned to subject it's citizens to a high level of poverty than they have it today. Aren't these leaders supposed to aid the people's suffering? Bitcoin empowers more than any government can ever do and it never segregates as per status. Imagine the lots of users running signature on the forum.
It's just sad for Indians.

Exactly. They also have many uneducated people & often use religious doctrine to excuse some of their behavior. One of the worst places to live. They can't arrest anyone because they don't know who is holding crypto.
It is impossible to track. There many things that are illegal and still done. They have quite a few other problems they should probably be focusing on that but I guess money is number one for them and the fact that so many people are unemp[layed doesn't matter. Maybe they should be planning to educate the country better rather than this.

Not specifically pointing out bitcoin. It is referring generally on cryptocurrencies. I think this article only cause panic on crypto holders to sell their coins rather than losing the value and be accused as criminals. How can you be criminal when you invest using your own money. On the other side, maybe the government is planning something better for dealing with crypto but I guess it is somehow impossible to control crypto.

Find a friend that you trust outside India, best with an LLC, and sign a contract with them to 'manage their crypto actives' with a salary of 1000 rupees per month.

This is valid for every destination where crypto is forbidden or heavily taxed. There are other options, but this is the easiest one.

If the Indian government is stupid enough to make the proposed bill in to a law, then there is no doubt that we will see a lot of companies offering such services to the Indians. They will trade with cryptocurrency in countries where it is legal (i.e all the other countries apart from India) and then they will send the fiat funds to the Indian user, marking it as "software purchase" or something similar. Cryptocurrency wallets can't be tied to a particular individual, and therefore the government won't be able to do anything in this case. But don't be disappointed. They will come up with even more idiotic laws.

Maybe you gonna be safe as long as you don't detected by government of using cryptocurrencies. AFAIK, if you only make transaction with company that operates outside India the government not gonna find out and since they seem to ban Bitcoin meaning there won't be any local exchange which actually acts as detector to find out who uses bitcoin thus you gonna be forced to use global exchange.
However, the punishment seem too harsh, so many years just for owning bitcoin that you buy with your own money, if the government don't feed their citizen why they need to make such harsh punishment.

The government itself knows that no matter what sort of laws they come up with, the complete eradication of cryptocurrency usage is not possible. That is why they want to terrorize the users with such harsh prison terms. Just imagine this. If this law is passed by the parliament, then anyone owning a particular code in his computer can be imprisoned for 10 years. On the other hand, the punishment for attempt to murder is also 10 years. Violent rape is punishable by a term of 7 years in jail. According to the Indian government, if you own cryptocurrency in your personal wallet, then you deserve more punishment compared to the rapists and murderers. So the intention is very clear. They are imposing disproportionate punishments, in order to create a feeling of fear in the mind of cryptocurrency users. And they believe that it will result in 99.99% of the cryptocurrency users selling their assets.

Cryptocurrency legalization in India is still lacking. The court removed only some of this country's central bank's restrictions on banking and financial institutions as a whole with any crypto currency related operations. Therefore, there is no legal regulation of cryptocurrency in India in general, and the attitude of the government to it not entirely clear, given the fact that the special commission created by it recommended that the country be completely banned from cryptocurrency. We need to see what crypto currency laws will be adopted there.

So you saw minority appeasement when UPA government was ruling, why did you fail to see people getting killed for having their food of their choice during the BJP reign and you will see many FIR in which minorities getting killed because the RSS and BJP factions thought they were carrying beef. I am living in this country for a long time even though i travel outside from time to time but i have never heard these sort of situations earlier where people are killed for reasons beyond any comprehension.

The only reason the BJP came into power is simply because of the Pulwama attack and have you visited those places, i have and you cannot carry weapons and there will be checking point with soldiers with automatic riffles at designated distance every few kilometers and you think someone could carry huge amount of explosives and knowing the route map of the vehicles and timing so that a bus load of army personal will be traveling so that they could create a blast ::).    

I have no idea in what lens you are viewing the country, if you are looking at the polls conducted by the BJP media and their IT propaganda cells you will see them having the majority, can you show any independent polls conducted by neutral agencies. Since you already know that majority of the national media is a propaganda tool for the ruling party i would like to hear about that.

Since you touched upon this topic, CAA was diverted into the Hindu Muslim issue by the ruling party and they know how to tackle these protest, the same they are doing it with the farmers protest, they are trying to paint them as Khalistan movement and Hindu Sikh issue. They only know to divide and rule that is an age old agenda by all the warlords. Majority of the people now understands the true color of the right wing nationalist who have no history in freedom fight movement but try to rewrite history by different means necessary using power and i bet they will not win another election anytime soon.

What i don't get here is why "Criminal Offence"?  i heard that in Nepal using Bitcoin is also a criminal offence things that made me think , How that this become criminality when you are only Having a Virtual Money that you gather either payment for a Job or you Bought by your own money ?
how this violate the rules of every country like india and Nepal?
actually this has been running for years and years yet there is no clarity about what's the Indian Government stands really .

@ eaLiTy, they are winning elections after elections, and this proves that the ruling combination enjoys widespread support. In 2019, they won the states of Arunachal Pradesh and Haryana. Last year, they won Bihar by such thumping margin despite 15 years of anti-incumbency. During the 2019 parliament elections, BJP alone won 37.4% of the vote, which is a ground breaking achievement. So we need to admit that they are very capable of winning the elections on their own.

And one of the reasons for this rise is the poor performance of the opposition parties. They don't even have any capable leaders. And every time the BJP set up some trap, the opposition politicians just fall in to those traps. Take the case of Pulwama for example. Some of the opposition politicians made wayward statements and BJP managed to paint those statements as "anti-national". I don't want to divert from the topic.. so I am not going in to detail.

So our primary concern is about the proposed bill against cryptocurrency and how to respond to it. amishmanish in one of his posts warned that if this thing gets political, then Bitcoiners will lose out. I have to partially agree with him. If Bitcoiners organize themselves politically, then the BJP and its supporters in the media will claim that those who are doing illegal activity have now decided to defeat them in the elections. These people are very expert in pushing fake propaganda. So whatever we need to do, it should be done discretely.

I don't get the bill though. It says that they will prohibit the use of Private cryptocurrencies in India but they are willing to promote the technology behind cryptocurrencies. Does that mean as long as you publicly tell the authorities that you are using cryptocurrency, it's ok? since it's not private anymore and you won't be able to hide it.

Or maybe they are prohibiting the use of other cryptocurrencies but willing to let people know about the use of cryptocurrencies because they want to create a cryptocurrency of their own for the Indians to use.

This is likely. If cryptocurrency or some of its types are outlawed, it will be on a par with drugs and other similar items that are withdrawn from civil circulation. You are not defending your ownership of drugs, are you?
I don't even know yet how the price of bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will react if a law is passed in India banning cryptocurrency. On the one hand, without India, cryptocurrency may well exist and develop further, and on the other, this can be an example for other states.

https://indiawantscrypto.net/

May be, update this in your OP.

Details: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5314760.0

This is a very good initiative launched by Nischal Shetty (CEO of the Wazir X exchange). I have emailed my MP explaining briefly why the usage of cryptocurrency should be encouraged and how India could lose out in the future with such regressive attitude (fortunately the parliamentarian who represents me is very well educated, unlike most of the illiterates in the government). Social media can be a very powerful tool, if we want to make our opinion heard. And from what I can see, it is already trending in Twitter:

If crypto has not yet been legalized in India it will take a long time for india to create ownership of bitcoin criminal offenses. Crypto and bitcoin are out of control although India wants to make bitcoin differently out of self-interest, it has not yet been legalized in the courts of their country. That's why you can't hide anything about crypto and I agree with you that if India wins a lawsuit it is one of the tools to spread social media news information about everything in their activity can be found.

I think so too, it's mainly fear mongering just to open up capital and market to their own CBDC, but still the 10 year punishment still too harsh, as you mentioned it's even heavier punishment than rape WTF? I wonder how indian people respone to this kind of law.
But i bet majority of btc holders who uses it silently gonna be fine since no one know, and I doubt the government could fully detect all the people who uses BTC,other countries have tried but also seem to fail. I wonder what kind of method they gonna use.

They remained silent for so long. Only when the exchange rates shot up from $10,000 to $37,000 within 12 months time, they rose from their deep slumber. Now the government want a slice of the pie and they are attempting to do that with their CBDC shitcoin. The problem is that these guys don't have enough education or intelligence to understand the factors behind the rise of cryptocurrency. First, they need to understand that cryptocurrency became popular mostly because of its controlled supply principle and decentralized nature. The CBDC version of cryptocurrency won't be having any of these qualities and as a result it is doomed to fail.

In my opinioin, soon we will see the same laws in other countries. Govs dont like money that they cant control

Too early to say that. There are a number of governments out there, which have taken a much more positive view about cryptocurrency. Japan is a prime example. They were the first country to fully legalize Bitcoin and the government attitudes haven't changed since then. The only issue is that the tax rates in Japan are a bit higher compared to the other territories and therefore we don't see a great deal of crypto-related businesses that are based there. Japan is having a very strong national currency and therefore the government doesn't have anything to worry from the usage of cryptocurrency. The same can't be said about third world nations such as China and India, where the national currency is heavily manipulated.

Reports are coming out regarding the Bihar elections, they did not manipulate the EVM but the accusation is coming out in regards to the Form 20 used by the returning officer when calculating the total votes. Usually the returning officer calculate them and then the observer monitors everything and then the results are announced but in the Form 20 uploaded in the website the some of the returning officers signed the document well after results are announced and that is not how elections are done.


I completely agree with you on this part, the opposition is not strong enough and they always fall for the trap the BJP set for them and they do not have a strong leader who can articulate things nor they are promoting people who are capable enough to take the leadership roles.


Take a look at the history in which how the government always approach any protest, they try to make them anti national, if we set out to protest then they will make us the dark net drug suppliers and money laundering group and they can make our life a living hell in the name of investigation.

Take a look at this article:

https://swarajyamag.com/economy/why-india-should-buy-bitcoin

Why India Should Buy Bitcoin 


This was the topmost article in Swarajya, a news website that is run by a right-wing group that has close links to the ruling party. This may be an indication that at least some circles within the government are not comfortable with the proposed ban on cryptocurrency. And I believe that it is a good sign. And the article was one of the best I have ever read, which supports the legalization of cryptocurrency. And this figure caught my attention as well:


It claims that India is having some 2 million active cryptocurrency traders (don't ask me why figures for China are missing).

When this draft was leaked couple years ago I panicked but now I have learned not to, we'll figure when it becomes a law, pretty sure they will give enough time dispose crypto if implemented.

Bill doesn't say about any criminal offenses tho.

A country-specific ban can never be implemented. Because cryptocurrency is easily transferrable from one country to another, since it is a digital asset. If Bitcoin is illegal in one country and legal in another, then the users will simply use markets in the other countries where it is legal. Also, cryptocurrency is decentralized and it is not possible to link a particular cryptocurrency wallet with a real identity.

If India bans the ownership of cryptocurrency, then most probably the users will ask their friends in other countries to claim the ownership of the wallet (the authorities don't have any way to find out whether a particular wallet is controlled by the Indian national or the foreigner). That will happen, even if the passwords are not shared with the other person. When there is a requirement to sell the coins, the foreign national would do that and send the proceedings as a gift to the Indian national. In the end, the Indian government will lose tax money that they could have received from the sale of Bitcoins. 

If you compare the WazirX BTC/INR chart with Binance's BTC/USDT chart, you will know why we get these kind of fear mongering statements or Ban statements happen in India from time to time.

Most of us knew that in the current situation of India(Covid), The finance minister and all the other high ranked politicians have better things to do. There was nothing of such regulations were going to come in the budget this year.

Personally, it was a great dump for me to buy BTC/ETH, and I did. And as soon as the minister started budget the price went up back to USDT rates.  :)

In my opinion the key moment in the fact that very often politicians uses lots of moot points in order to manipulate with votes and appreciations of voters. The situation with cryptocurrencies and Bitcoin in your country is not the exception. The saddest in all this that users are as always suffer from it the most. Hope the situation will change for the most suitable variant for users.

Well.... follow the lesson learned from the Prohibition of Alcohol in the USA. the Prohibition in the United States was a nationwide constitutional ban on the production, importation, transportation, and sale of alcoholic beverages from 1920 to 1933 Source : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prohibition_in_the_United_States

So, when they banned it, people started bootlegging (doing it illegally) and the government lost Millions in taxes. All smuggled goods evaded taxes... so the government eventually gave up and they lifted the ban.

A ban makes the use more appealing to a lot of people and the developers will cash in on this opportunity to develop more decentralized services to cater for this need, which is almost impossible to stop.  ;D ;D ;D

It means they fear Bitcoin!
This proves Bitcoin is effective, as a competitor  to their monetary systems.

Hail Bitcoin and stick with it

If they accuse you for holding Bitcoin,
what evidence do they have?
Maybe that you transferred BTC from an exchange?
Tell them you sent the coins to another person,  not to yourself.

And when you spend Btc to make a purchase  online ,  pretend that it was not you sending them, but you asked another person  to  do the transaction for you.

How can they prove it's not true?

I snipped the rest of the discussion so that we can get back on the topic of Cryptocurrency. ::)

The political ambitions and machinations of BJP are a different beast altogether and it is not our job to do anything about this juggernaut.

Crypto is for the young, tech-savvy population. It is also useful for those who are just beginning to see the benefits of Digital India. (Checkout TikTok stars making money on DOGE in west). It fits perfectly with the Digital India initiative. All crypto exchanges in India are KYC'd so there can be no ML issues with them. Those exchanges are also supporting several ERC-20 tokens which allow the quite, little programmers to contribute and earn from those projects. If those exchanges or holding such tokens is criminalized, it will be a big setback for all those people working on these new opportunities.

Repeat after me,
"Modiji does not want that"
"Modiji wants Digital India"
"Modiji wants to help the youth"


"Modiji loves youth"
"Youth love crypto"
Hence,
 
"Modiji Loves Crypto" #Modijilovescrypto
Tweet it, Trend it.

Lets follow the simple formula and leave the politics out of it.

The topic is about the politics and how an elected government in a democracy could bring up laws and regulation without following democracy method. I am not involved in active politics but i am not a fan of right wing fascist politics as we already saw dictators like Hitler and Mussolini and you do not need another in the near future as the world is tired of these political regimes polarizing people with lies and propaganda.

We are seeing the digital initiative of Modi, how many months they disconnected the internet connection in Jammu and Delhi and they think they can control everyone with all the control they have. You are aware of the things that is going on, you are into business and lets talk about how GST impacted your business and how about the impact in your business in the last one year. I personally do not care about anything what any government brings, i do not want anyone to set up a business in UAE  :P (pun directed to you :P) but i personally know people that are affected with the rules and regulation in the past several years and i know many that were forced to shut their business in the past couple of years.

India has been a factory churning out excellent software engineering talent to the world.
Banning Bitcoin wont hold good for this country's future.
Just like Venezuela tried to force its crypto to the people no one wanted it. This will be a similar fate.
They will just drive Bitcoin underground in India which is good thing because decentralized exchanges will flourish and India can be the brain child of Decentralized exchanges' success story.

To me it looks like the bankers in Davos convinced the  PM of India  to go this route. while other can watch if it works or not. The PM has been fooled again to experiment with his people first because other countries cant afford to destroy its people with experiments like this to keep people under control and in a despondent state.

Is bitcoin a private crypto currency? I think this are those altcoins created by projects led by people that might disrupt their future digital currency. I hope they would be educated about crypto currencies and I hope the best result for our users in this fight. If they could just learn and understand what it is.

That's very sad, these kinds of governmental regulations curtail the freedoms of the citizens, and such strict regulations, 10 years in jail, seriously?? It is also very frustrating that cryptocurrencies are nearly the only thing in which Third World countries could keep apace with any other countries, cryptos could've provided opportunities to become more independent, improve the economy, I seriously don't understand what were they thinking...

The language used in this (proposed) legislation is indicative of the education/knowledge level of the ministers and bureaucrats who are involved. As you have mentioned, Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies such as Ethereum are not "private" cryptos. They are decentralized and all their transactions are available in the public. Here what they mean by "private" is any asset that is not controlled by the central bank (in case of India, the Reserve Bank of India, or the RBI). Now it is not our duty to educate these people. If they are positioned in such high ranking positions, then it is natural for us to expect at least a basic level of education from them.

I have no love lost for the our current rulers. Least of all for their no-dissent-allowed governance. They have trained a huge section of the population to get offended about cultural identity and can get anything done with the help of that troll army and pliant media, for the time being. What i mean is as crypto community, we should pick our battles carefully. This one is about the financial benefits and benefits to the startup culture that crypto brings.

Eality buddy, I only care about what happens with crypto and not about Modi's politics. The farmer protests in Delhi will go to their conclusion which essentially depends on how much support they can garner. Internet connection has been restored in J&K in a phased manner. Those are all different issues though. What i am concerned with is that I should be able to stay where I am and still work and earn in crypto.
Also, I may have given the wrong impression as I am not into business. I do think positively about it and am aware of what GST did to small businesses. It is what i have to unemotionally call growing pains or collateral damage in some cases. ::)

Nigeria too had placed a ban on crypto link: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-05/nigerian-central-bank-orders-closure-of-cryptocurrency-accounts I agreed with you that other countries will follow-suit, this is quite disappointing the government should have look inward and tap in some benefits of cryptos in term of taxes of course cryptos serves a foreign exchange for their country , there are lots of developers, traders etc who earned cryptos as income invariably exchanging it to rupees thus boosting their economic activities this an eye-opener to the electorates to vote against leaders who wants to intrudes into their private lives.

India has a long history of harassing the freelancers who mostly receive payments from outside the country. I am not sure about the exact date, but 7-8 years back the government made it extremely difficult for the freelancers to receive salary for their work through PayPal. A lot of restrictions were imposed on PayPal. For example, the Indian users are not allowed to keep a balance in the PayPal account. If they receive a payment in their account, then they should immediately transfer it to the linked bank account. They can't make a payment to anyone using the PayPal balance.. all this crazy restrictions were imposed because the government believed that the freelancers are not paying income tax on the $100 or $200 they receive for their work.

These people don't have any problem when the corporates cheat on their tax dues. India recently reduced the corporate tax rates from 33% to 25%, and even after this there were reports of frequent tax evasion by the corporates, amounting to billions of USD. But when a freelancer receives $50 for his work, the IT department become hyperactive and in no time sends a notice to his house.

There are at least 50,000 Indians who are directly employed by the cryptocurrency industry. Indirect employment amounts to many times that number. What are these people supposed to do now?

News websites are exaggregating the actual content in my opinion, this is just the old bill and it has been in the pending status and no information about it for this year as well but there were lot of debates going on the internet media that it will be banned and CBDC will be launched for India, blah blah...

This is really bad, like what the heck is wrong with these governments people? So, they want to follow the same steps like China did, ban cryptocurrency and then introduce their own dumb digital currency which I know for sure is going to fall, because I have already seen a few countries that tried to do this and it never worked out for them, because nobody was ready to make use of a government issued digital currency, like who will even do that?

For a long time now they have been talking about banning cryptocurrency in India and at a time I thought it was over, and now they started it again :o.

A small correction. The bill that the Indian government proposing is much worse. Chinese government never made the ownership of cryptocurrency a criminal offense. They just prohibited trade between fiat currency and cryptocurrency. But the Indian government wants to jail anyone who owns cryptocurrency. Even the Chinese bill was of no use and it didn't resulted in a decrease in cryptocurrency users in that country.

The Chinese government eventually came up with their digital Yuan and it had some success in being used for international trade. But from what we have seen, the digital Yuan has mostly replaced fiat payments and it didn't had a large impact on the cryptocurrency trade.   

There isn't a point in fighting what you intend to clone or would eventually accept in future. Its simply a waste of time and effort. I don't know how these politicians can seat down and instead of deliberating on pressing issues of the country, they just focus there attention on how to ruin with the mindset of replacing with something similar more like forcing it on the people and anything forced doesn't work so well.
Besides, Bitcoin and other Alt coins today are valued as much due to world usage and not some intending crypto that would be bounded by boundaries, it definitely won't work so well as it defies the universality nature of cryptos.

They just simply want to generalize Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies as private and illegal. Instead of making these cryptocurrencies regulated, they just simply want an outright ban without even studying their possibilities. They only focused on the bad side of crypto, not trying to dig in with it's real and positive use cases.

India has the 3rd largest population density in the world, and for the bitcoin and crypto aspects behind is a big puddle, a long story.  India is not the first time to show disapproval and request differences with bitcoin, but in my opinion, the experience with covid19 has made the friendliness between this country with bitcoin and crypto closer to the goodness.  and the state in which bitcoin and crypto are best against the germs of translation when all is still fumbling for the vaccine supply.
A positive point can be placed on the scale and changed it.

Here is the latest development on this topic:

https://news.bitcoin.com/indian-government-crypto-bill-cryptocurrency-law/



I can't vouch for the authenticity of this article and I didn't find the same news published anywhere else (although they are claiming that it was first published in CNBC-TV18). But if this is true, then time is running out for cryptocurrency users in India. The article claims that the government wants to fast-track the bill, and take the ordinance route.

^^^ If they take the ordinance route, then it will be introduced by this month itself. Because the ordinances can be brought up when the parliament is not in session. And I am a bit suspicious about the haste they are showing. It is like they don't want the Indian cryptocurrency holders to get the benefit of the bull run. Why should they show unnecessary haste, when the exchange rates are rising very fast? That is, unless they have an intention to cause losses to this group.

With Tesla making the announcement about moving a part of their cash reserves to Bitcoin/Gold, I am pretty sure that other companies will also make similar moves. No one want to trust the US Dollar and keep their wealth stored in USD. I won't be surprised if it ends up like the Zimbabwean dollar or the Venezuelan Bolivar. The Indian rupee may fare even worse. And no matter how hard the stupid governments try, no one is going to use their hyperinflated national currencies.

There was clarification from the finance minister (Nirmala Sitharaman), and yesterday she made it clear that any cryptocurrency that is not issued by the Reserve Bank of India will be illegal in India. So if there was any doubt on anyone regarding the upcoming ban, I hope those doubts are cleared by now. For the Indian cryptocurrency users, we need to think about our next course of action.

https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/features/story/is-india-going-to-ban-bitcoin-here-is-story-so-far-1767746-2021-02-10

The government seems to be very adamant in banning cryptocurrency. And they want to ban it as soon as possible. The statement from Sitharaman is very suspicious. Why after sleeping for three years, they want to bring this legislation in a haste? I guess their corporate friends have got some ideas on this sector. Most probably they want to come up with some shitcoin and before doing that they want to eliminate the competition. BTW, I want to know who are the members of this Inter-Ministerial Committee (IMC). Given the fact that most of the ministers from the ruling party are illiterate, it would be interesting to know the composition of the committee.

Turns out that the bill is much worse than we ever anticipated. Even the existing holders of cryptocurrency will be penalized, even if they agree to immediately liquidate their crypto assets.

https://www.livemint.com/market/cryptocurrency/get-ready-for-hefty-penalty-to-legalize-your-crypto-assets-11613064974027.html


The government strategy is very simple. They have run out of money and now they want to confiscate wealth from successful people. From what I can understand from the article, the government is proposing a transition period, where the existing cryptocurrency users will be allowed to sell their assets. But here is a catch. The government is proposing a "heavy" penalty on those who doing so. In the end the penalty may work out to 50% to 75%. One the remaining amount, the income tax of up to 43% needs to be paid. So in the end, if someone is holding $100,000 worth of cryptocurrency, the government will take away $90,000 and leave the individual with around $10,000 in funds.

This is nothing but plain daylight robbery. I don't know what to say about those people who still support the criminals who run the government.

Soon other countries will do the same. We should be ready for it

I have already explained about it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5316416.msg56327803#msg56327803

What the Indian government is proposing is not just the prohibition of cryptocurrency, but also confiscation of wealth from the existing cryptocurrency users. As such, it is against the constitution. I hope the supreme court of India will nullify this measure, if it gets passed in the parliament.

And I don't think that other countries will follow such measure, because wealth confiscation is against democratic ideals. Forget democracies, even dictatorships such as those in Cuba and North Korea would think twice before ordering wealth confiscation.

The scenario in India is different, because there is a large group of largely illiterate and brainwashed followers of the ruling party who will stand by whatever policies they make. Most of these people live in slums and have a deep hatred towards successful people who have access to good quality living. Obviously they will support measures such as wealth confiscation. But I don't think that such measures can be introduced in any of the developed nations.

That sounds like tyranny, and they are most likely overstepping their boundaries. Reminds me of a post I read about US making ownership of Gold criminal offense 30years ago or so. I guess If you dig up gold back then and keep it, you'll are considered a criminal?
I wouldn't bother too much if the Indians are limited from buying to much to prevent the devaluation of the Nation's fiat currency. But asking people not to own a currency/asset at all sounds like lawlessness and tyranny.

So when they outlawed ownership of gold, did that worked? The answer is no. The same would happen this time as well. People would go to any extent to protect their wealth. The COVID 19 pandemic has given national governments an excuse to print banknotes without any limit and thereby reducing the value of these notes to less than that of toilet paper. Corporations such as Tesla are moving to Bitcoin and gold. If the government thinks that they can prevent this by threats and blackmail, then they are just a bunch of fools.

Isn't this way too harsh for just owing a crypto? I can't believe having btc in your wallet will automatically tag you a criminal without actually committing any crime, I was expecting a more friendly approach from governments but it seems some of them are adamant, they rather wants to frustrate their youths who are the highest crypto patroniser,
Just few days ago the Nigerian government put a ban, why this government taking harsh laws towards crypto  ???

I am sad to see this thing happening in India, a country I considered to be ahead a lot of miles in adopting modern technologies and adhering to democratic ideas enjoyed by many in other countries. India has the potential to be a big leader in the world of blockchain and technology yet they got some leaders who are afraid of the future of money and so they assumed that allowing legit cryptocurrencies to flourish can mean that the government is going to be left out. Banning is not the best solution and millions of Indian people can suffer due to this policy. Seems to me that those in the government are not that open-minded and they are not willing to have an honest dialogue with the emerging cryptocurrency industry in India. A sad development.

That is good clarification that it is not all the crypto currency but there is specifications .

I know that Bitcoin has been allowed by RBI right? so meaning BTC is not one of those who will be illegal .

What ? issue has been on the run for long years now mate, the moment i enter this forum that banning Issue from RBI and the government is always been the problem of Crypto users in india.

Some of the biggest names in technology are from India, and examples are Sundar Pichai and Satya Nadella. But the Indian government has historically taken a stance that is against technological innovations. The situation became worse ever since the right-wing government has elected in 2014. Some of their contributions have included banning porn, and taxing stock dividends at a rate of 43%. India is definitely a leader in terms of technology, but if the current government stays in power most of the skilled people would be forced to emigrate.

We all are jumping to a conclusion here, that the Indian government will ban cryptocurrency completely.

Just to let you know the Bill needs to pass through both houses first. Then there will be a debate and after that, the crypto community in India still can take this issue to the Supreme court before the bill becomes a law.

It will take time and It is not so easy for a law to be formed in India

So, be patient and do not jump into any conclusions. India is still a democracy.

^^^  They are trying to fast-track the bill and introduce it as an ordinance. In that case, they don't need to put the bill for voting in both houses of the parliament. Three days back (on 11th February), the finance minister told media that she want to introduce the bill as soon as possible, for reasons best known to her. And about the last part, I am having my doubts whether India is a fully functioning democracy right now.

"Ordinance replacing Bills are brought before Parliament to replace an Ordinance, with or without modifications, promulgated by the President under article 123 of the Constitution of a subject." this is the definition.

Now, which existing ordinance is the government going to replace? As per my understanding, this is a bill because no such ordinance existed in India. I am not sure what you mean by democracy but just to clarify your doubt, democracy has four pillars and if one pillar is not functioning properly then there are three others that can rectify it.

Private cryptocurrency issued by the state, so that's mean it's prohibited to own almost all crypto that exist right now right? Wow that's actually really harsh, banning is one thing but confiscating crypto assets? that's tyranny in my opinion. If they want to earn money from crypto realated income then they can tax it, no need for punishment on top of the heavy tax. Crypto holder should just hold their crypto until the the finalized bill is passed and decide what to do after that.

If the government had a conciliatory approach, then it should have done the same with other sectors as well, such as gambling. Despite repeated requests from the public, they have refused to legalize gambling or cannabis consumption. The same goes with cryptocurrency as well. They want to ban anything that they don't like. You know how stupid they can be, when porn is banned in the country. These people still have a 15th century mentality, and it is difficult to do reasoning with them, or their supporters. 

They are too much, why did they doesn't allow people to use this kind of technology as long as they are liable to use it and has the capacity to use it? It is sounds unfair for me they should done other thing rather than this thing, I think you should follow the rules mate for now it could be hard to stop and wait for the next update for this rule and law but you should abide it in order for you not to punish by them, I am sure sooner or later they will let people to use it again.

Here are the latest news about the impending ban:

https://www.wionews.com/business-economy/india-mulls-bitcoin-ban-existing-investors-to-get-transition-period-363262

India mulls Bitcoin ban, existing investors to get transition period



https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/technology/crypto-exchanges-experts-may-move-out/articleshow/80913360.cms

Crypto exchanges, experts may move out


The rich investors are planning to move out to other countries. It is the middle class which always fall victim to these stupid policies of the government, as they can't afford the huge expenses involved in getting a second passport.

Well, this will be a tough time for cryptocurrency holders in India. The Indian government has been studying the possibility of legalizing cryptocurrency for a very long time, but in the end decided to ban its circulation. In this case, the people should take to the streets and express their protest against this decision. However, even if this does not lead to anything, then this government will also not last forever. To a large extent, everything will depend on how the leading states will treat the cryptocurrency.
On the other hand, we will have an experience of how effective a ban on the circulation of cryptocurrency in a separate, moreover large in territory and population, country can be.

Being a regular visitor to India, I can assure that it is not going to work. There is a large section of the population which supports the ruling party and that is why the government is so confident about these measures. Their supporters will defend them no matter what sort of laws they bring. During the last couple of years, they have introduced many controversial laws, and the opposition can't do anything about it.

And another factor is that 1 or 2 million cryptocurrency users doesn't really matter, out of a population of 1.4 billion. The vast majority of the population lives in rural areas. 95% or more haven't even heard about Bitcoin. If the government claims that Bitcoin is used for terrorism and therefore they need to ban it, then the vast majority of the population will support the government move.

This India hating Bitcoin is already a classic issue now. What can we expect from this country, how many times do they ban Bitcoin or cryptocurrency? People supporting crypto in India maybe quiet a few, they need right people in the government to stand for them and act as there voice. This FUD doesn’t work to the current market anymore, people are used to it already.

Ordinary Indians are losing out as a result of the hostile stance of the government. When the news first came out, the prices in various Indian exchanges and P2P platforms went down by as much as 20%. A lot of investors either sold their coins, or cancelled plans to purchase more coins. And in the end this resulted in huge losses for them, as the exchange rates rocketed from $19,000 to $49,000. Indians are not benefiting from the current rally, as they don't want to take the risk and invest in BTC at this point.

There is some good news regarding this issue. One media outlet has reported that the government may be considering to postpone tabling this bill for a few months. As per the original schedule, the bill was supposed to be tabled during the second phase of the budget session (8th March - 8th April), but now they are saying that it has been postponed to the monsoon session (September 2021). This news is yet to be confirmed, but here is the link:

https://www.business-standard.com/article/economy-policy/cryptocurrency-bill-may-not-be-tabled-in-the-current-parliament-session-121022600068_1.html

The latest news (or rather rumor) is that the bill has been postponed to the next session of parliament. It will probably give a few months time for the cryptocurrency users in India. Also, the postponement is a sign that at least some individuals in the ruling party believes that the ban will do more harm than good to the economy and the tax collection. And perhaps another concern was the state elections, that are scheduled for April.

This situation clearly demonstrates how strong states are in regulating the circulation of any financial assets on their territory. If India introduces criminal liability for the use of cryptocurrency, the only real fight against this is to seek the cancellation of this ban also through parliament, through legislation. To do this, you can use the mass unrest of the people and any other options. Only if people themselves do nothing, then the authorities will put them in jails one by one.

I haven't travelled to India ever since the pandemic broke out, and therefore I have to admit that I don't have ground updates. But some of my friends in India are saying that there are signs that the government may rethink on the proposed bill. As of now, it looks like the finance minister has decided to postpone presenting the bill in the parliament for "further consultations". I strongly suspect that the campaign against the ban carried out through social media platforms had an impact on this decision. The ban was essentially proposed by corrupt bureaucrats such as Subhash Chandra Garg, and the ruling party politicians simply went along as they don't have much of an idea about cryptocurrency. Now they realize that the bureaucrats were wrong.

I am still hopeful that the finance minister will reject the bill in its present form and go for a regulatory bill similar to what the Russian parliament approved a few days back. All that said, I don't think that mass unrest is a viable option. During the last two years, there have been several incidents of mass unrest against proposed legislations (such as Article 370, farmers bill, CAA.etc). But none of them were fruitful.

I hope they change their mind, at least the situation in the world will force them to do so.

Close to 15 million cryptocurrency users in India. The sheer numbers will make sure that the government can't ignore them. The ban proposal was first suggested by Subhash Chandra Garg, the then Finance Secretary in 2018. The finance minister just went ahead with his plan, without realizing that a ban could cause huge losses to the Indian investors and may result in a backlash against the ruling party. At least now the politicians have realized that they can't blindly trust these bureaucrats to take important policy decisions.

For all the unlawful laws they introduced they will probably pay when it comes to the next elections, the farm bill protest is one of the biggest since the independence and look at the elections that took place in Punjab after that. The cryptocurrency community is not here to raise protest, the groups that includes the exchanges owners created an influence group to make them understand the situation and explain what a ban could do to the market and that is the only solution that can make these ignorant politicians understand the ground reality.

Farmer protest was going on the right track until the Republic day. The public mood changed, after some of the protesters changed the national flag at Red Fort. Some say that supporters of the ruling party infiltrated the protests and did things like Red Fort raid and attack on policemen to devoid the farmers of public sympathy. Anyway, now it looks as if the support for the protests have waned.

Looking at the Indian political system, the ruling party is supported by how the system functions. They have their strongholds in a few states such as UP, Bihar, Gujarat, MP, Karnataka and Rajasthan. These 6 states account for almost 40% of the parliamentary seats and this means that they can ignore the other states and come to power solely by concentrating in this region.

The situation is quite fluid now. I hope that the finance minister has now realized her mistake. Legalization and regulation will be mutually beneficial for both the government and the Bitcoin community in India. Let's see how it goes from here.

You are not following the facts but still saying what the narrative created by the central government and the media they are holding, it was a planned operation and none of the farm leaders were in that protest but it was lead by a person belonging to the ruling party and even with that situation no one changed the Indian flag from the Red Fort, they hoisted the farm flag alongside and some of the media created a narrative that they changed the Indian flag which was debunked even by world media.

Lets take a look at this situation, in Bihar they won 53 seats out of the total 253 seats and how they are ruling, money and how they are able to blackmail the opposition party members and force them to join BJP, even Meghalaya they have won 2 seats out of 60 seats and BJP is ruling and that can be said in Jammu Kashmir and Goa as well.

Lets see how the situation will unfold and i am hoping that the narrative of ban will be changed by the influencers.

These politicians will never think about the people involved with any kind of business. They go with a plan and execute it as planned. They never look for the suggestion or survey from the people who are the making use of it. In India there is nothing to worry about the ban of cryptocurrencies, because I came across an article stating about political influencers owning large mining farms. This means mining is being set similar as an industry, but none were aware of it.

This is the first time i am hearing about this story, from where you got this breaking story about political influencers owning large mining farms. I have not seen any huge mining farms in India even though i have seen smaller ones because the cost of setting up a big farm is huge and then to control the temperature inside the farm is a big task.

Waiting for hear what the government is planning to implement, either way i am not that worried as i will find any alternative options if they come up with stupid laws.

I agree with eaLiTy.

I have never heard about any large-scale Bitcoin mining activity in India, because it is not profitable. First of all, it is almost impossible to get the necessary licenses and permits to start such an operation, since Bitcoin falls in the "grey area". And then there are practical difficulties. During the summer time, temperatures can rise to as much as 45 degree Celsius and therefore additional cooling requirements are there. Electricity is more expensive when compared to the other countries and finally the mining hardware needs to be imported from China (by paying a steep excise duty). I don't know how the mining farms in India can compete with those in China and Russia, given these circumstances.

One possibility is that there may be a group of people who want to convert their unaccounted money in to Bitcoin. In such cases, they can go for mining. But now that possibility is also not there, since Bitcoin itself is illegal in India. So why should they convert their wealth from one illegal asset to another, that too at a loss?

From my perspective It happens on the other third country too same with Indonesia, I suppose there are still some Mining Farms but not really big as the other farms on developed Country.

In indonesia there no need something like this, There is no need licenses or anything for that and i'm really curious about this one, What kind of licenses that needed to build an mining farm on india? Maybe you have some article or anything?

"Prohibit all Private Cryptocurrencies in India However allow to promotes it's technologies" I don't really understand it yet and I think the law still sounds a little ambiguous (?), Since it's still on Introduction & Consideration Stage maybe it still can change? I take an example from my country (Indonesia) Basically we are prohibited to use crypto for direct payment (Buying Goods, Services, etc) But we are allowed to use it as Digital Asset and need to convert it first to fiat before using it, Well maybe in the future india will consider this option too?

Yup and kind of tiring already when we are keep on discussing same issue over and over again.
Why not just accept the fact that India will never accept Bitcoin that easy and not until the government sees how they will benefit and profit from this adoption.
I don't think that People supporting crypto in india is Few when crypto is already a wide market in that country.

Maybe in time but not this soon.

Operating without a license is risky in India, as the cops can arrest you and confiscate your equipment. Last time when someone tried to install a Bitcoin ATM in the city of Bangalore, he was arrested and not just the ATM, but also his mobile phones and laptops were confiscated by the cops. The individual mentioned here tried to argue with the cops saying that he had applied for a license, but the authorities refused to grant it. The cops refused to listen and put him in jail. So it is a bit tricky. You can't operate without a license. And at the same time, it is impossible to obtain the license.

BTCitcoin is not illegal in India, it is a misconception as there are many chatters about a complete ban and till now everything is fine. Running a big mining farm is not feasible and profitable in India let alone having any elaborate plans to convert unaccounted money to BTCitcoin when there are several other ways to do with fiat currency  :D.

Since you are talking about Unocoin ATM situation, the case was squashed by the court recently even though the cops took a stern stance and arrested them but the lawyers were able to convince the judge that it is just a kiosk and not an ATM .

The guy who installed the kiosk spent some time in jail. What is the use if the case gets quashed by the court after one or two years? He faced a lot of harassment as his house was raided and his personal belongings (phones, laptops.etc) were taken away. This is the price Indians have to pay for trying to popularize technological innovation. And it is not surprising that 99% of the Indian techies migrate to the United States at the first available opportunity. Just imagine how the Indian economy could have benefitted, if people like Sundar Pichai and Satya Nadella had stayed in India. But it seems as if the government don't want these people.

Hmm, I think it's little bit tricky is he was installed the ATM on public place or on his private sector? (Home or his Estate?) If he was installing it on public i think it's normal but if he was installing on his private sector that means the case is quite complicated, I take an example on my country, Indonesia. We are freely to sell Bitcoin or other cryptocurrency as Digital Assets which is intended for commodity trades and not an Currency to replace the fiat.

They were the owners of Unocoin exchange and they were out on bail but they faced harassment and for three years they need to run around to sort this out as their bank accounts were frozen and just last month they were exonerated. Since they had the financial background they could fight against these inappropriate lawsuit. 

Sundar Pichai and Satya Nadella went abroad to do post graduation and majority who move out of the country go out to do their post graduation or Phd then stayed back and if they can successfully complete the course they will get placed in good companies. I bet if they stayed in India they will not be this successful but will be in a good position.

For the Indian economy to flourish you need to get rid of corruption and there is no protection for investors and you cannot expect any foreign investors building something in a volatile situation.

Hating bitcoin is a crime.

Even with all the money power, it took them three years to get a ruling in their favor. Imagine what will be the case if similar incidents happen to some of the middle-class cryptocurrency investors. They won't be having enough resources to sustain the legal fight, and even if they have the resources, there is no guarantee that they will receive a favorable judgement in the end. Going against the state is not practical in India.

The difference is that a normal citizen will not take the risk to install a BTCitcoin kiosk fearing what happens if you are in a legal tangle, you will burn your resources and you will be spending most of your time fighting the authorities and there is no incentives in doing so but when an exchange owners installs a kiosk he does have the incentives and he might have taken the legal advice before installing them and it is not a secret that it will take years if you are caught in a court case.

Here is the latest news on this topic:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-cryptocurrency-ban-idUSKBN2B60R0

A lot of people were hoping for a rethink from the part of the government, after the high-pitched social media campaign. But the government hasn't moved a bit and they are very adamant about the blanket ban on cryptocurrency. They are planning to ban all the cryptocurrencies that were invented outside India. It is very simple. They will ban established cryptocurrencies such as BTC, ETH, LTC and ADA, so that their cronies such as Ambani and Adani could come up with the "made in India" version of cryptocurrency.

So does that mean that the shitty government will come out with a bunch of centralized cryptocurrencies created as per your term invented (a mere copy using a open source code)  :D. I have no idea about the internal politics but i understand that they ruling party is a right wing organization who are notorious for creating community violence and the minority are harassed.

What i cannot understand is that, are these official government publications about it publishing these or just rumors spreading in the social media as we are seeing these threads for months.

It's not just rumors. The finance minister (Nirmala Sitharaman) and the Minister of State for Finance and Corporate Affairs (Anurag Singh Thakur) have been releasing frequent statements related to the topic for the last 2-3 months. They have made it clear that they don't have any objection to the usage of "Blockchain", but they will not allow any "cryptocurrency" to operate within India. Also, I don't think that Reuters will publish anything unless it is completely verified.