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In a bid to raise cash for the financial year amid the struggles caused by the Covid-19 pandemic, Treasury Cabinet Secretary Ukur Yattani has reintroduced the tax, which was removed by President Uhuru Kenyatta in July last year.

“Excise duty on betting at 20% of the amount will be wagered,” said Yattani, which would mean that the amount would be levied and passed on to a person who has won on a bet, which according to Yattani would also help discourage betting in the country.

But AFC Leopards chairman Dan Shikanda and Gor Mahia chairman Ambrose Rachier argue that the tax will negatively affect betting companies supporting local teams and lead to the withdrawal of their much-needed sponsorship.

Both Shikanda and Rachier explained that betting firms have consistently supported football in the country, cumulatively delivering Sh1.6bn (US$14.8m) from 2016 to 2020, and therefore should not be punished through stricter tax measures.

In the statement, Shikanda and Rachier said the return of the tax would cause current league sponsors BetKing to withdraw their sponsorship, explaining that the excise tax was one of the reasons why SportPesa left the Kenyan market in 2018.

“The enactment of the 20% excise tax will unequivocally rule out continued sponsorship of football clubs across all tiers (National Super League, Division 1 and County Leagues), with the net effect of rendering the operations of most of the league teams unsustainable,” the joint statement read.

In a bid to raise cash for the financial year amid the struggles caused by the Covid-19 pandemic, Treasury Cabinet Secretary Ukur Yattani has reintroduced the tax, which was removed by President Uhuru Kenyatta in July last year.

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

but at same time these news are good for crypto gambling platforms which are probably going to have new users signing up very soon.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

I think the government will not apply high taxes for the casino and a gambler because it will make them feel worried about paying those taxes. It is right that the government wants to prevent the addiction, but they do not want to make them feel it is difficult to pay the taxes. But if the government really want to apply high taxes, the casino and the gambler must follow their government. Otherwise, they can not still play gambling.

I think the government will not apply high taxes for the casino and a gambler because it will make them feel worried about paying those taxes. It is right that the government wants to prevent the addiction, but they do not want to make them feel it is difficult to pay the taxes. But if the government really want to apply high taxes, the casino and the gambler must follow their government. Otherwise, they can not still play gambling.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

They are now asking the government to reconsider it.
{This is exactly the kind of news we need because this shows how the democratic countries can move forth and oppose such things, not always the tax is legit if served by the government during such times}

What do you think ?
 

What do you think ?

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10%

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.

Those taxes aren't that a lot for these people because as you have said, they are big businesses and I don't think that it's worth supporting them because they are making money out of us people of the working class, remember to not patronize these people because they only care because you make them money. I think taxation to these companies are a good thing.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

if you are a regular gambler, the tax hike won't matter to you. you will complain at the start but you will still keep doing what you're doing afterwards. it may pose as a discouragement but they will only feel such hike at the start, but later on, they will go back to their normal routine.
as long as the government is putting the tax into good use, then, maybe people will understand such move. it may be hard at the start but there will be good consequences afterwards that people can benefit from. they can always find sponsorships that will be willing to face this change.

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

Kenyan President Uhuru Kenyatta has signed into law the country’s Finance Bill, which removes the 20% excise tax on sportsbook stakes that led to local operators Sportpesa and Betin exiting the market.

The tax had been included in previous years’ budgets and was raised from 10% to 20% when last year's Finance Bill was passed in September 2019. This increase led Kenya’s two largest operators, Sportpesa and Betin – which were each already embroiled in tax disputes with local authorities at the time – to put a halt to operations in the country.

Sometimes I do think that gamblers should not carry a very heavy burden in terms of taxes because they often lose more than win. I guess majority of the gamblers are losing in total. They may win at times but lose most of the times. But I of course understand also that gambling is mostly nothing but a way for those who have the money to waste it so it is all right for them to be taxed heavily wasting money. I think a proper consultation among the stakeholders should be done prior to the implementation of this new tax policy.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

Now this is not just :
Unsustainable and unreasonable but according to them "ill timed", their whole sponsorships will be effected. This high taxation will also cause gamblers sore.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

~

I agree, taxes for gambling companies should be similar to other companies. It's kinda unfair to fax casinos so much more than all the other sectors in an economy. For the people working on the gambling industry its just a normal job. There is no reason to just focus on one sector for the tax income of a country.

20% is indeed too much and i cant really blame them out for them to react and make out some appeal for those absurd set tax.

20% is just fine as long as it was structurally planned and organized. Like for example, if the gambling industry is really taking a big growth there, the government can imposed an additional tax on a yearly basis instead. There should be a reason for another taxation and if necessary to do so.

And while the gambling industry is blooming there, the same tax proposal should also be the same for other performing industries there but again, implement it slowly as we all know some industries are still catching up with their usual phase prior to the pandemic.

There's always a reason for government to increase the tax collection, that's their job in order to sustain the economic status. We all know in most of the countries, collecting taxes are one of the main reason why they are still functioning like in my country, taxes are very important especially during this pandemic where the government needs to collect money in order to help people and deal with this pandemic.

Yes but at the same time we have to think about the people who win also and then loose a lot just because of such rules.
- Plus this is going to effect not just the players but also the companies and the sports clubs. It's complicated.

And during the pandemic, it's no secret that in most countries, online gambling is by far a good performing industry so it served as a good foundation to the government as a source of income.

In general, for this additional tax to be fairly agreed by gambling site owners, the government should also be serious in taking down illegal gambling operators and have a strict law about that so that people will not patronize illegal gambling sites and the revenue will only focus on legit websites.

I agree, taxes for gambling companies should be similar to other companies. It's kinda unfair to fax casinos so much more than all the other sectors in an economy. For the people working on the gambling industry its just a normal job. There is no reason to just focus on one sector for the tax income of a country.

The fact that gambling companies earn is normal.
Everyone who wants to play decides what he want to do with his money.
In my opinion, taxes should be lower because that would simply make casinos take less to cover their own costs and gambling would have a higher probability of winning.

There's always a reason for government to increase the tax collection, that's their job in order to sustain the economic status. We all know in most of the countries, collecting taxes are one of the main reason why they are still functioning like in my country, taxes are very important especially during this pandemic where the government needs to collect money in order to help people and deal with this pandemic.

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.

In a bid to raise cash for the financial year amid the struggles caused by the Covid-19 pandemic, Treasury Cabinet Secretary Ukur Yattani has reintroduced the tax, which was removed by President Uhuru Kenyatta in July last year.

“Excise duty on betting at 20% of the amount will be wagered,” said Yattani, which would mean that the amount would be levied and passed on to a person who has won on a bet, which according to Yattani would also help discourage betting in the country.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

That is one of the main reason why sin taxes are higher compared to other forms of taxes. To discourage people from gambling, smoking, or drinking alcohol. Gambling is a big industry and it is one of the main sources of income for the government as a whole. It is not just taxes but it attracts tourists as well.

I think there is no problem for well established casinos with a lot of turnover money monthly or yearly to pay this amount of tax.However the government should make a clear example when they are forced to pay it and not force every single casino to pay it.An example would be a casino who makes let's say 50 million dollars turnover a year should pay this tax and one that makes let's say up to 20 million dollars is excluded from paying it.There should be some regulation to this kind of excessive tax and should not be forced to anyone.

Did you mean gambling taxes collected by the government are because of sin? I think that word should not be used here. Also what you meant by 'it is not just taxes but it attracts tourists as well'?

No government that allowed gambling in there country see it as a sin, so far it is allowed, but are only taxing gamblers as a form of internally generated revenue and nothing more.

I think there is no problem for well established casinos with a lot of turnover money monthly or yearly to pay this amount of tax.However the government should make a clear example when they are forced to pay it and not force every single casino to pay it.An example would be a casino who makes let's say 50 million dollars turnover a year should pay this tax and one that makes let's say up to 20 million dollars is excluded from paying it.There should be some regulation to this kind of excessive tax and should not be forced to anyone.

The aggressive taxation imposed on gambling-related industries are to possibly deter the owner on expanding its operations on a country, not unless the country relies heavily on the industry for generating jobs and gaining a lot of economic advantage on the said industry, for example in Macau (though technically not a country). If the population only spends on gambling and losing it there, what money is there left to circulate on the economy? Perhaps this is the government’s reasoning and I couldn’t blame them, really.

It is not hard for the government to ban gambling in their country, this is very common in some countries of the world, while some countries see it differently because knowing of taxes and how they can effective generate taxes from gambling companies. I do not think any government wants to deter the owner of a gambling companies to expand nor doing anything that can discourage people from not gambling, but they need more revenue is their target.

Depends on the countries economical capacity or capability because there are countries which can really stand without really needing much about gambling business revenue and this is why you can see that there are countries that do ban it no matter what and been minding much about their citizens protection about gambling addiction and since they can cope up with other source in terms of taxation then that wont really be an issue but for most countries
where gambling business is one of their main source in terms of revenue so it really hard to believe that it would be completely banned so easily.

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.



Now this is not just :
Unsustainable and unreasonable but according to them "ill timed", their whole sponsorships will be effected. This high taxation will also cause gamblers sore.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

They are now asking the government to reconsider it.
{This is exactly the kind of news we need because this shows how the democratic countries can move forth and oppose such things, not always the tax is legit if served by the government during such times}

What do you think ?

-snip-

Do not mind me to talk more of religion here, most countries that ban gambling is not because they rely on the taxes or not, like in Islam, gambling is forbidden, which means they ban it  because of their religion. There may be some other religions that speak bad of gambling, and forbid it, they can also ban it like in the Muslim countries. Banning gambling is more of religion, it is not about taxes or no tax. This is my own opinion.

Actually, there are still many countries in which the taxes are much higher than it, more than 20%. But yeah, it will depend on how gambling itself in the country and how the companies. Many big companies of gambling should not too worried about this because it may be only part little of the profits. However, yeah, not all gambling companies are successful and many are new to the world so that the taxes seem very high.
I don't know why but currently, there are so many issues about rising or existing any tasks in gambling and also in the crypto world. In this word , the governance really picks the right chance to get money from the companies and all people many more.

Yes, there are which is higher than 20% which is way too much imho but those business owners would have any choice? If they wont follow on whats

mandated then theres no operation for them so its a matter of choice for them neither they would deal with that high tax and continue to operate or

just simply ignore and dont deal with it on whats been asked and completely shut off business. They are free to choose but surprisingly there

are still business owners who do deal with those high tax because they do know that they can at least compensate it.

I agree, there has to be a threshold for which is going to pay this and that amount for the taxes. Well, the government knows that casinos are earning huge amount yearly and that's why they're the easiest industry to put tax with.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

I do support this view.

The taxing power is limitless as it is one of the three (3) inherent powers of the government where they can exercise it for revenue or preventive measures. The twenty percent (20%) excise tax is imposed primarily to discourage the people from gambling due to its negative effects in the society. While this measure is not an absolute guarantee that businesses will opt not to enter the gambling industry, it is nevertheless a revenue measure for the government that will enable them to create projects from such revenue.

if they will done this after the pandemic they will get less income because people will have less time to spend in gambling but if they will do it now ,
people will be force to follow it just to continue playing a gambling but they can do it slowly and not shock the gamblers by applying the new tax rates .

This is why its important to look in the bigger picture and 20% is considerable.

There's even 50%. LOL

https://casinodepositbonus.com/features/the-ultimate-guide-to-gambling-taxes-worldwide/
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10899-019-09899-0

This is why its important to look in the bigger picture and 20% is considerable.

There's even 50%. LOL

https://casinodepositbonus.com/features/the-ultimate-guide-to-gambling-taxes-worldwide/
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10899-019-09899-0

This is why its important to look in the bigger picture and 20% is considerable.

I agree with those who oppose the government in applying excessive taxes, sometimes I also don't agree with what the government is doing to gambling companies,

That's huge the government is very hard on the companies related to gambling have the reason to make a complaint, they can file a complaint about reconsideration not really a good move for the government because of the pandemic, and they should if they will not now, the government can do that again, they should first do a consensus or a study if 20% is reasonable.

No. They'll go back to their old lives and do things that they used to do for their incomes. They may not go back to gambling anymore as their sources because it's an unstable way of living.

Right from time government always kick against gambling because they seen it like a thing that will bring corruption to the society, if eventually all systems of government, government always dislike this because i dont think they are of benefit towards them, those gambling companies I'm not hundred percent sure that they pay tax or they generate revenue to government, if eventually they pay thier tax government will no be against them again, from the looks of things.

its risky but it help many people to earn after loosing thier jobs because of pandemic .
 many are thankful to it but many have finalized their decisions to return working in a real job because its always better to live in a more stable life .
 they cant return to the exact habit but they can return playing for fun during their rest days .

Maybe the government needs to approach the gambling owner and discuss more details with them so they know the problem that makes the gambling owner feel objection with the taxes that will apply to them.

It needs more communication between the government and the gambling owner to find a win-win solution for both of them.

I am sure that the government can get the taxes from gambling while the gambling owner will not object to the government's tax amount.

Usually this is the normal scenario where the government consult businesses with regards to the new implementation, and this should be in favor to both parties since many casinos are also suffering during this time of pandemic. Casinos are voicing out because of too much taxes, the government know there’s money in casinos but they can’t tax everything. It’s good that casinos are voicing out because this can benefit the gamblers as well.

Better to do so, there's always a good way to hear both sides and to know if what might the best solutions to solve the issue, government also needs to hear the other side and check if adjustments can still be done.

That's what they needed to do, bringing ideas that both side will benefits, gambling site owners also need to open up to make a better resolutions with their concerns.

Usually this is the normal scenario where the government consult businesses with regards to the new implementation, and this should be in favor to both parties since many casinos are also suffering during this time of pandemic. Casinos are voicing out because of too much taxes, the government know there’s money in casinos but they can’t tax everything. It’s good that casinos are voicing out because this can benefit the gamblers as well.

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.
[...]
What do you think ?

What do you think ?

 https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules (https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules)

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

Government will say that gambling is sinful act so people won't gamble a lot if they have to pay huge tax from their earnings which story applies to the liquor and cigarettes or any tobacco which legally approved by governments still they don't encourage people using it just with the taxes but their aim is to make the people to pay more and no government is here to help a common man, they just favour the big companies so they can get bribed in the election times.

I think that every tax on what is harmful should always be increased to discourage people from consuming that product or service.
Some examples of what I am saying are... cigarettes, alcoholic beverages, hookers and also gambling.

I see, I'm starting a controversial discussion, but given the need for greater tax collection, it's preferable to raise the rates of non-essential and harmful services to the population (whether in terms of health or finance) than for other essential services.

Of course, every tax increase is bad and it needs to be done reasonably when it's unavoidable.

In our country, they call it a sin tax, the government charged high taxes on liquor and tobacco but the company is not not really affected, but the consumer since they add up it to the price resulting in a high price. On gambling taxes, I think this is not applicable as casinos are tax according to their income, and even if the government will charge a high tax or let's say an excessive tax, they will still be profitable.

Another way to get money,
GOVERNMENT: " Let's add some more taxes on these casinos"
Casinos: (less players and less exposure) = Bankcrupt
Says only the shitty government will be the one on the profitable side   as a common thing will be such a butthurt for new Casinos, excessive taxes can affect them real biggy, if they got little marketing. Added taxes will only be infavorable with Big Ones.

Another way to get money,
GOVERNMENT: " Let's add some more taxes on these casinos"
Casinos: (less players and less exposure) = Bankcrupt

Another way to get money,
GOVERNMENT: " Let's add some more taxes on these casinos"
Casinos: (less players and less exposure) = Bankcrupt
Says only the shitty government will be the one on the profitable side   as a common thing will be such a butthurt for new Casinos, excessive taxes can affect them real biggy, if they got little marketing. Added taxes will only be infavorable with Big Ones.

I think that every tax on what is harmful should always be increased to discourage people from consuming that product or service.
Some examples of what I am saying are... cigarettes, alcoholic beverages, hookers and also gambling.

I see, I'm starting a controversial discussion, but given the need for greater tax collection, it's preferable to raise the rates of non-essential and harmful services to the population (whether in terms of health or finance) than for other essential services.

Of course, every tax increase is bad and it needs to be done reasonably when it's unavoidable.

raise cash for the financial year amid the struggles

This whole idea is a tale as old as time, government short of money seeks to confiscate funds from private people and company operations.   What is proper policy is to increase revenue in order that government is supported by a country doing better, to confiscate is too close to ending that business, sector or people even may flee the country.   This isnt an alien event in any country really, I can remember reading about how The Beatles famous band of the 60's were forced to leave the country and record an album on a remote tropical island where they would not lose most of their earnings.   The UK government later went broke in the 1970's unable to balance their budget the IMF had to bail them out and they would reform and revise laws in order to aid business not destroy and take funds, took a decade to fix though at least.   Very common unfortunately and the currency lost a great deal of value.

This is indeed an approach you suggested that I can very well comprehend and from a first glance there isn't much that speaks against your suggestion. Raising tax in the business sector that harms small innovative companies is definitely worse than raising tax on cigarettes and alcohol, gambling and prostitution.

Most of the big companies involved with gambling have very complex corporate structures that save them shit loads of tax payments anyway.

I think every business that is destined to make people's lives worse should be taxed very very heavily. However at what point are you doing something that is against freedom? For example beer is bad for you, it is not healthy and if you drink too much beer for too long you will die, that is a known fact but its legal and you can buy it and drink it if you want, for a world where many drugs are bad for you and illegal, for some reason things like beer and cigarettes are allowed.

So if you say 500%+ tax on the price and 50% tax on the income for something like beer, so instead of 3 bucks its 15 bucks per beer, would that be against freedom? I think many people will say so, but then how can you allow weed to be illegal in many nations? Long story short there is a line there but it is a blury line and nobody really knows what to do about these things.

That also seems true to me and the companies of gambling sites that really make a lot of money will undoubtedly have set up certain constructions so that the money can be funneled through other channels and countries. they really don't pay the top price of their turnover, they would be crazy if they do. Tax avoidance is allowed, evasion is not. As long as they stick to that it's not a problem

Most of the big companies involved with gambling have very complex corporate structures that save them shit loads of tax payments anyway.

I'd argue here that casinos aren't businesses designed to make your life worse. It's just there as an establishment, business, as a casino. It in no way forces anyone to actually partake in their business and the person themselves is solely at fault if their lives were ruined due to addiction. Same idea with beers, tobacco, etc. Sides, price increase only pushes people to spend more on it since if they really want to buy it, they'd still do it. Most people have already experienced it anyway, prices increasing gradually throughout time, it didn't really stop them.

For people who can afford and willing to continue even that huge amount of implemented taxes there's no stopping them to partake with this activities.

Exact, and for those unable to pay taxes, there is always the possibility of migrating to a country where fees are more affordable. This is clear for gambling that operates entirely over the internet.

For physical bookmakers this is a little more complicated, but it could be worse since there are several countries that don't even allow this type of venture.

I do support this view.

The taxing power is limitless as it is one of the three (3) inherent powers of the government where they can exercise it for revenue or preventive measures. The twenty percent (20%) excise tax is imposed primarily to discourage the people from gambling due to its negative effects in the society. While this measure is not an absolute guarantee that businesses will opt not to enter the gambling industry, it is nevertheless a revenue measure for the government that will enable them to create projects from such revenue.

It makes sense. Just like how people treat the increase of sin tax in tobacco, liquor, etc. They don't bother with the tax as long as they want to take part in it.

In other words, people know how to adjust and there will be a time that they are now used to experience an increased tax.

Gambling operators also know how to adjust if ever they will be imposed by the additional tax of the government. They will pass it to their customers in a way that is not noticeable or proposed a win-win situation for both parties.

There is also yet another possibility, when the tax on something is too high like on liquor or cigarettes people will find products that did not paid those taxes and that are cheaper because of it, this is why governments need to be careful about how they tax something as too high taxes can generate black markets, and the same is true for services which is the category in wich gambling falls, if the taxes are too high then illegal casinos will appear and people will prefer them over the legal ones simply because they give better odds.

the problem happens when lobby affects the decisions of the government on what should be allowed or not and what should be taxes or not.

curious that I just read Rothbard's book: Anatomy of the state
so I may be a bit biased against the possibilities ofthe government to make good decisions

 ;D

^ It is possible, but my question is if there is an illegal gambling casino which is you think they are much better than the regulated one, will you still gamble it there? For me, I don't, because most the illegal gambling casino has shady activity, not unless, the government will hunt them and force to stop operation which is very risky if you have a fund on that casino. That is why even how taxes will apply to the casino, they are still preferred this since they are running a business, besides, generating tax must have a calculation per annum and I don't think there is a casino that give more than 80% to the government, usually from 10% to 50% probably.

One effect of the high taxes: Maybe the high taxes a meant to discourage Gamblers from playing a lot because this pandemic can turn users into addicts and this is one way to slow the process down.

The other effect from these high rates is going completely anonymous which means a missed opportunity for the government to collect revenue from gamblers as they will find alternative places to play the games they love.

In our country, our government is actually obviously promoting gambling since they could get lots of taxes from it which will benefit the corrupt officials. Instead of discouraging gamblers, they see it as another opportunity to gain funds. Tax is actually part of gambling, and it honestly supports a huge part of the economy, so no matter how heavy it is to pay huge taxes, we should still take responsible for it.

If your government also warns the people about the danger of playing gambling, that will help people realize the risk and play gambling carefully. Otherwise, the government will see that many people will be addicted to gambling sooner or later and if that happens, they need to spend more money to cure them. Yes, tax is part of the economy, and we should pay that tax as a citizen. The gambling industry in your country and another country also contribute to the growth of the country.

You really think so? ;)

Do you know how many warnings there are on cigarette packages about potential cancer and what not? It doesn't really bother anyone. I have never heard that someone quit smoking because the government warns smokers about cancer and other illnesses.

I don't think warning about gambling will prevent anyone from playing. I think more real life stories of people who really got into trouble sharing their experiences could help, but even then it is still everyone's own decision.

It is somewhat pointless if they would be keeping on making out warnings but at least they are really showing off some concern but actually they dont really care at all.Those were just complimentary or some form of formality just to make themselves that they do really care but actually theyre not.

If government is really been that in concern into their citizens health then they wont really be allowing thing in the first place.

This just really proves out that tax and income would really be their main priority rather than into other health problems or concerns.

Why do you side with the enemy? Big companies look like they are the victim here but that "excessive tax" that you are talking about isn't going to be of any help to you, they will just have more money to line their pockets. What we should be reacting is that we should be happy about the taxes because they help for a bigger government fund.

I don't think that they had enough, they are probably losing just a small percentage of their annual profits when the taxes for their businesses are increased and isn't gambling a profitable business? Why they worry about it when they can probably just make people spend more on their casinos, they are good at it anyways.

It is somewhat pointless if they would be keeping on making out warnings but at least they are really showing off some concern but actually they dont really care at all.Those were just complimentary or some form of formality just to make themselves that they do really care but actually theyre not.

If government is really been that in concern into their citizens health then they wont really be allowing thing in the first place.

This just really proves out that tax and income would really be their main priority rather than into other health problems or concerns.

In many cases the government can't make perfect decisions because that is the paradox politics are up against. If they do their job very good, the strongest unit within a state is the economy, but once that is achieved, the problem is that the economy takes over or at least exerts influence over political decisions, hence it is not the perfect state anymore. Lobbyism is an issue and I am sure gambling is an industry that has strong lobbyists under its belt.

There is a lot of truth in your words. Big companies have turned into big scammers - for example, it annoys me when they do business in one place, but pay taxes on the other side of the world, this is completely absurd. But when fighting these scammers, there is a very big danger of giving too much authority to the government, the government in most cases is also an enemy and is trying to crush all our rights and freedoms.

That's probably the case, we all know that businesses are just trying to maximize their profits and that taxes are their natural enemies. I think the reason that they worry is probably because they will pay more taxes no matter what.

And who is the enemy here? Big companies or governments? Or they are two faces of the same coin?

Lately, we have many topics about gambling taxes in some parts of the world... and I guess it's good to know what's happening around! Here on the forum, and in comments around the internet, I see some people think higher taxes are ok, others disagree... and I see some good arguments from both sides!
My opinion is simple, perspective depends on the place where you live! And from one end of the world to another we have many different countries, with different laws and regulations! Most of all with different social and many other policies! What I wish to say, there are not many countries that are well-governed countries... where paying taxes really pays off for everyone! Most countries (and I am from one) are a complete disaster! Governments and big companies are sucking out the money to shell companies abroad, as KTChampions said! It's a sad truth, but in countries like this higher taxes are just making more problems for the majority!

Why do you side with the enemy? Big companies look like they are the victim here but that "excessive tax" that you are talking about isn't going to be of any help to you, they will just have more money to line their pockets. What we should be reacting is that we should be happy about the taxes because they help for a bigger government fund.

@iv4n question is a must for understanding the system

gov + big corporations forms the Corpostate and this is the main governor in many places (the first I saw using this expression was @notsofast on twitter)

As an example: in Brazil one of the biggest donors for the biggest 2 opposing political parties is Itaú, a huge bank.

regarding @traderethereum comment: some corporations will even prefer to pay the fine than the taxes, specially if judgements are slow and they can buy the fiscals

Sure. If you do not restrict large companies and governments, they turn into a disaster. High taxes are a disaster, as are companies that completely avoid them. But governments turn into a disaster in the same way: if the government collects taxes but does nothing good, and the other extreme is that the government collects too many taxes, does something good, but at the same time completely restricts our rights and freedoms. It is very difficult to find a balance in solving this problem, which is why it is always relevant and discussed.

It is somewhat pointless if they would be keeping on making out warnings but at least they are really showing off some concern but actually they dont really care at all.Those were just complimentary or some form of formality just to make themselves that they do really care but actually theyre not.

If government is really been that in concern into their citizens health then they wont really be allowing thing in the first place.

This just really proves out that tax and income would really be their main priority rather than into other health problems or concerns.

No matter how high the place taxes on gamblers winnings it can't still discourage them from participating in gambling because it's a source of livelyhood for some citizens in developing nation's. Most of those gamblers are jobless and have no other source of survival outside gambling so making gambling tax high might not be the best approach to discourage gamblers

Maybe they will hide some income and not report it to their government because of the high taxes.

This is true that business owners have options to avoid tax. And guess what, there's a legal way of it called tax avoidance.

However that requires critical steps so instead of doing that, owners are complying with the usual and common process to avoid the hassle.

Tax avoidance is legal , Tax evasion is illegal.

Maybe they will hide some income and not report it to their government because of the high taxes.

Even if it is completely legal. I think the loopholes that allow this to happen should be closed.

There are no loopholes in my opinion as I search about it, tax avoidance has legal ways to done properly. And in case the government will know this, it won't be subject to closure since that business who do some tax avoidance still comply with paying tax. They don't evade it.

It's a famous practice of some businesses today for years especially those in the middle tier. As long as these businesses are updated with their tax commitment, they won't be subject to closure even they are doing tax avoidance since they don't evade it.

This is true that business owners have options to avoid tax. And guess what, there's a legal way of it called tax avoidance.

However that requires critical steps so instead of doing that, owners are complying with the usual and common process to avoid the hassle.

Tax avoidance is legal , Tax evasion is illegal.

That's their other way to lessen the tax that they should be obligated to pay. It's been happening with different businesses and that's the reality that the government can't chase.
They might have some of those businesses that might not pay the right tax but still they'll pay but with lesser tax due to their low income declaration.

<...>

There are no loopholes in my opinion as I search about it, tax avoidance has legal ways to done properly. And in case the government will know this, it won't be subject to closure since that business who do some tax avoidance still comply with paying tax. They don't evade it.

It's a famous practice of some businesses today for years especially those in the middle tier. As long as these businesses are updated with their tax commitment, they won't be subject to closure even they are doing tax avoidance since they don't evade it.

Somehow, the government can find if something wrong happens and if the casino does not pay the taxes based on their income, the government will trying to chase them and make sure the casino will pay.
I am sure the casino will have a side business besides having the casino business because they have much money to have or create the other business.

What do you think ?

No matter how high the place taxes on gamblers winnings it can't still discourage them from participating in gambling because it's a source of livelyhood for some citizens in developing nation's. Most of those gamblers are jobless and have no other source of survival outside gambling so making gambling tax high might not be the best approach to discourage gamblers

^ It is possible, but my question is if there is an illegal gambling casino which is you think they are much better than the regulated one, will you still gamble it there? For me, I don't, because most the illegal gambling casino has shady activity, not unless, the government will hunt them and force to stop operation which is very risky if you have a fund on that casino. That is why even how taxes will apply to the casino, they are still preferred this since they are running a business, besides, generating tax must have a calculation per annum and I don't think there is a casino that give more than 80% to the government, usually from 10% to 50% probably.

great points @iv4n
do you see any way out? where would you start in terms of reforming the system?

I think crypto can be a game-changer of course

but would start here by descentralizing decisions, giving more power to city > state > country instead of the opposite
probably having smaller taxes for income, taxes on consuming specially for superfluous stuff and UBI to give everyone a cover to be out of poverty line and be able to pursue education and opportunities (see Andrew Yang ideas, would be interesting to see it applied somehwere)

This is too much for common sense, i think. I mean that this point "“Excise duty on betting at 20% of the amount will be wagered,”" is beyond good and evil. In all normal countries casino pay tax for their income and in some EU countries gambler pays VAT from what he won. Not from total wager amount, this would be too stupid.

Yes, they may find it out but maybe that's too late for them or they will just impose a penalty which is also payable and easy to be done by that company that will have its sanction.
It's just a process that will keep going, a cycle and repetitively done by those casino companies that have been doing it for years to save a lot of money from their taxes.

We all know that it's still from the gamblers' money that betting companies pays their workers, ads placement and other expenses that is being made. By imposing such a strict and exorbitant tax rate is detrimental to betting companies and also the gamblers because the companies will also look for ways to maximize their profits in order to balance their projection.

They are now asking the government to reconsider it.
{This is exactly the kind of news we need because this shows how the democratic countries can move forth and oppose such things, not always the tax is legit if served by the government during such times}

This is too much for common sense, i think. I mean that this point "“Excise duty on betting at 20% of the amount will be wagered,”" is beyond good and evil. In all normal countries casino pay tax for their income and in some EU countries gambler pays VAT from what he won. Not from total wager amount, this would be too stupid.

I understand that people can become emotional everytime they see tax hikes or new taxes to be implemented but can we have the numbers before and after the tax  was removed?

The proposal would tax the gamblers and not the casino or bookie. These companies thinks it would affected indirectly since one of the aim of the law is to discourage players but does that really stop them from gambling?

We all know that it's still from the gamblers' money that betting companies pays their workers, ads placement and other expenses that is being made. By imposing such a strict and exorbitant tax rate is detrimental to betting companies and also the gamblers because the companies will also look for ways to maximize their profits in order to balance their projection.

Are you sure about this? Recently i read an article where it was shown that Microsoft working in Iceland paid exactly 0 dollars (in Iceland). I understand that Microsoft is an international corporation and it paid taxes somewhere else, but this is unlikely to suit the residents and the government of Iceland.

There it goes, the scenario about taxation how much more for local casino gambling and other small operations that has been paying to their government based on shady regulations. It was so sad to think that it was so unfair, for legal business who paid tax according to their willingness but has been abused without any power to refuse just because of requirements needed to ran their business. Bigger gambling companies should be law abiding, otherwise they'll be put into closure.

The government had structured everything in such a way that all gateway that brings in money into a particular country is charged with tax, most of the gambling companies in my country are heavily paying tax and they are threatened to close down the company if they refuse to pay tax. The government tax collectors also the IRS are the unfair set of corporation that act unjustly, they are all critically criminals.

I think when the government withdraws from very high taxes for a company then I am very sure that the money can be used to cover the state debt and what is important for the development of the country you live in because the country will not be able to develop when there is no help from the people, suppose tax as our help to create a better country.

So as a government what is your job if you are always going to take money from the people's pocket without giving them more opportunities to make money. Actually the tax is for the people who is having money to pay the government but now a days it turned into upside down, the middle class people is paying more taxes than a billionaires.

the government must take a look at the situation because what they are doing now is just like they are milking the people thru huge taxes.

Government set the tax rates and if you are living in a democratic country then you are having the rights to select the person who is going to set all these tax rates then why we are blaming the leaders since we are the one who selected them as to be a one.

In a bid to raise cash for the financial year

Companies excessive taxing may be resulted from excessive taxing from the government as well. Since as mentioned that companies are trying to balance out their profit and financial responsibilities, hence the tax. But I think one way to look at the extremeness ordered of taxing is due to the degree that the government is taxing the company in turn.

In an election, it's not everyone voted for the officials. There's a division with the votes and whoever gets the highest votes and gets the majority, it's the winner.
And that's why some of those people that didn't actually voted for them are the ones complaining that they don't like such policies that they seem to be a disadvantage to them especially in business matters like owning a casino.

Lol enough of companies , because they are not the one who suffers from taxation so they don't have to act as victim here .

That is how the democracy works and literally 51% wins over 49% if there is only two contenders and 26% itself can declare as a winner if 4 contenders have equal amount of vote banks, that is why these government wants to keep the people separated in the name of colour, religion, etc.

Government set the tax rates and if you are living in a democratic country then you are having the rights to select the person who is going to set all these tax rates then why we are blaming the leaders since we are the one who selected them as to be a one. It may be too much from our side but to a government, there is no ethics, they just need taxes, if they are in need of more money they will increase the tax rates. So if you want everything should be done in a fair way then we need to pick the right one who can understand all these consequences of increasing the taxes.

Excessive taxes make some gamblers limit gambling, everyone in this crypto world really avoiding taxes and so as gamblers, the thing with this implementation is that gamblers will find other ways to avoid those taxes, so they might change to another platform that does not requires taxes. The government is always there, they will always try to gain on every business they can have.

Unsustainable and unreasonable but according to them "ill timed", their whole sponsorships will be effected. This high taxation will also cause gamblers sore.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

They are now asking the government to reconsider it.

~snip~
In many of the countries, the gamblers are not taxed. Only the casinos are taxed on their profits.

there are tons of loopholes and it's quite naive to think governments will be able to close it all.
specially for digital business its somehow not that hard to find ways to pay no taxes, you'll still need money to pay for accounts offshore, and its possible to do it all legally

for physical products its always hard but sometimes feasible

This is why Biden is asking for countries to somehow try to make their tax codes to become more similar in order to try to close the loopholes that we have in the system, but this is going to be impossible especially when it comes to tax havens, those countries get a great deal of their income due to charging low or no taxes to all to those that decide to have their money there, if they were to do something like this then the country will go bankrupt, as we can see this means that we are always going to have countries willing to provide loopholes on purpose to the rich.

This is why Biden is asking for countries to somehow try to make their tax codes to become more similar in order to try to close the loopholes that we have in the system, but this is going to be impossible especially when it comes to tax havens, those countries get a great deal of their income due to charging low or no taxes to all to those that decide to have their money there, if they were to do something like this then the country will go bankrupt, as we can see this means that we are always going to have countries willing to provide loopholes on purpose to the rich.

have you been to Brazil?
this kind of candidate you talk about is quite rare here
most of them will simply defend the public machine and want it to grow, almost like a parasitic relationship.

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.

What do you think ?

 https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules (https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules)

Biden is planning to impose a minimum corporate tax rate of 15%. I don't know how practical is this idea. It may still be possible to apply these laws on ecommerce and other businesses that operate physically. But online gambling doesn't exist in the physical form, and it will be very difficult for various governments to get information on their citizens who use these online sites to gamble. The government can come up with more and more innovative measures, but none of them is going to be 100% effective in preventing tax evasion.

^ I can not agree more on this, because gamblers should oblique to pay taxes aside from the casino. We should declare tax to the IRS, I don't know what is the process but I think that is the right way especially if you are in a country that very strict on implementing taxes. Because in every winning we had and becomes profited, we should be required to File an Income Tax Return or else, there is a penalty or whatever circumstances waiting ahead. Because id filing tax there are individuals and non-individual process.

^ I can not agree more on this, because gamblers should oblique to pay taxes aside from the casino. We should declare tax to the IRS, I don't know what is the process but I think that is the right way especially if you are in a country that very strict on implementing taxes. Because in every winning we had and becomes profited, we should be required to File an Income Tax Return or else, there is a penalty or whatever circumstances waiting ahead. Because id filing tax there are individuals and non-individual process.

Honestly, 20% is big enough and that is like we are paying more on taxes rather than our winnings, maybe 10% is acceptable and it was fair for all but 20% is excessive.

I think if a country has a large tax fee, then we must be able to think positively who knows the tax they provide is that big to increase economic conditions and infrastructure development in Kenya, so that the country is increasingly known to many people.

They might as well just tell all of the gambling operators to exit the scene altogether.


If Kenya were really serious about raising revenue then they could be doing this way smarter. Heck, just position yourself as a haven for these gambling institutions by providing a reasonable corporate tax rate and you should be raking in millions if not billions in revenue straight away.

I don't get these governments sometimes. Revenue raising is so easy if you just play your cards right - have a robust regulatory framework, be open-minded, and don't be greedy.

What you describe as easy is either something governments in poorer countries don't even want or they just can't come with a robust regulatory framework. And we probably don't have to discuss the "greedy" term. That might even be the biggest problem for most of the people, any nationality included.

Also, competing with places like the Cayman Islands or so is almost impossible, isn't it? Or some other set ups in Panama. There is literally no tax. How low should Kenya now go to really attract large corporations?

Now this is not just :
Unsustainable and unreasonable but according to them "ill timed", their whole sponsorships will be effected. This high taxation will also cause gamblers sore.

During pandemic the gambling is a huge income source for them and the government alike. Therefore I do believe that either they should have done it slowly or done it after the pandemic.

They are now asking the government to reconsider it.
{This is exactly the kind of news we need because this shows how the democratic countries can move forth and oppose such things, not always the tax is legit if served by the government during such times}

What do you think ?

 https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules (https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/12178/kenyas-biggest-football-clubs-join-forces-to-oppose-new-tax-rules)

Biden is planning to impose a minimum corporate tax rate of 15%. I don't know how practical is this idea. It may still be possible to apply these laws on ecommerce and other businesses that operate physically. But online gambling doesn't exist in the physical form, and it will be very difficult for various governments to get information on their citizens who use these online sites to gamble. The government can come up with more and more innovative measures, but none of them is going to be 100% effective in preventing tax evasion.

In a way I am surprised this is the path that Biden took, the democrats have being stating that they will make use of modern monetary theory which basically states that they can print as much money as they want with no repercussions, after all we know that inflation is in fact a tax and the higher the inflation the higher the tax people need to pay, it seems he took a more orthodox path but even then it is going to be difficult to force businesses to pay those taxes as they have the best experts around the world to help them to avoid doing it.

In a way I am surprised this is the path that Biden took, the democrats have being stating that they will make use of modern monetary theory which basically states that they can print as much money as they want with no repercussions, after all we know that inflation is in fact a tax and the higher the inflation the higher the tax people need to pay, it seems he took a more orthodox path but even then it is going to be difficult to force businesses to pay those taxes as they have the best experts around the world to help them to avoid doing it.

Although, I am not good in economics like that but I think what you comment here is not absolutely perfect, how is tax related to money printing and inflation? Let me make an illustration. For example, if there is an inflation and the economy has been affected, if the country fiat currency has been devaluated, still know that it does not affect the tax value because tax is in percentage. If $20 of 2011 is now $200 in 2021, someone that will bet with just $1 in 2011 will want to bet with $10 in 2021 to achieve the same aim as a result of inflation and currency devaluation. If the printer won, tax will be deducted in percentage which would have also increased but of almost the same worth of certain time in the past.

Governments all over the world are raising taxes in order to recover some of the money they lost during the pandemic and they could not have chosen a worst time in order to do it, the economy is weak, in fact they should be doing the opposite and trying to do their best to get smaller but that is never an option so they are going to raise the taxation on every single industry that they can and I will not be surprised if they kill a few industries due to this increase in the taxes corporations need to pay.

^ I can not agree more on this, because gamblers should oblique to pay taxes aside from the casino. We should declare tax to the IRS, I don't know what is the process but I think that is the right way especially if you are in a country that very strict on implementing taxes. Because in every winning we had and becomes profited, we should be required to File an Income Tax Return or else, there is a penalty or whatever circumstances waiting ahead. Because id filing tax there are individuals and non-individual process.

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.

I find it bizarre that you find 20% strange. It is the norm for most developed countries right now and seems like a fair amount to pay. That tax money should be going to fund everything that support the business - from maintaining the road network, to the medical/police/fire services, to the courts which prosecute violent thugs or thieves that may attack the casinos, to help the transport infrastructure that patrons use, paying for civil servants who should be keeping everything running with minimal corruption and many more things. It is very easy to forget that tax is meant to be a collective pool for the best interests of the public, especially if you come from countries where you struggle to trust those around you to be playing on the same level.

The government is taking this as an opportunity to increase the tax and the problem is that they will be using the pandemic as an excuse to increase the tax and once they increase there is no way they are going to reduce them even if the economic situation settles down and keeps on booming. If they are reducing the tax of the common man and increase those taxes then it would be great, but you cannot expect that as well with many governments.

The government is taking this as an opportunity to increase the tax and the problem is that they will be using the pandemic as an excuse to increase the tax

If the country is really got heavily affected by the pandemic, it's just reasonable to increase tax on some performing industries amid the pandemic. Gambling is no doubt one of the top-performing industries so to consider them adding some tax to them just makes sense.

However, it's not just about the increase but that 20% tax is to encourage other gamblers to gamble as for sure if the casino operations will face a much higher tax than usual, they might pass some fees increase on their bettors.

In the long run, let's see if this planned of government is really effective to reduce the gambling activity in their country.

If the country is really got heavily affected by the pandemic, it's just reasonable to increase tax on some performing industries amid the pandemic. Gambling is no doubt one of the top-performing industries so to consider them adding some tax to them just makes sense.

However, it's not just about the increase but that 20% tax is to encourage other gamblers to gamble as for sure if the casino operations will face a much higher tax than usual, they might pass some fees increase on their bettors.

In the long run, let's see if this planned of government is really effective to reduce the gambling activity in their country.

Latest news indicate that there is short of a worldwide consensus on a 15% at minimum tax. Not all countries are joining but it is already surprising that US an EU are finding at least some common ground on these discussions. Many companies, particularly those that are large and can easily relocate are pretty much free to chose where they do business, so it is not a question of them being feed up with taxes, it is more about their perpetual complaint about anything that is going to make their bottom line smaller.

In my view, if you want to do business in a country, you need to support all that is given to you as "free", such as law, security, infrastructure, customers with money to spend, etc... that is not free.

that's true, they need to look at the bigger picture here. the perks they are getting from a certain area. anyway, they can close down their business if they are really not generating income. there are countries that implement higher tax than them. also, they can relocate to countries that they believe they can get advantage of.
the tax is where the govt getting their funds for various expenditures for its people. just hope that it is not pocketed by officials.

In a way I am surprised this is the path that Biden took, the democrats have being stating that they will make use of modern monetary theory which basically states that they can print as much money as they want with no repercussions, after all we know that inflation is in fact a tax and the higher the inflation the higher the tax people need to pay, it seems he took a more orthodox path but even then it is going to be difficult to force businesses to pay those taxes as they have the best experts around the world to help them to avoid doing it.

An increase in taxes always affect the middle class more than any other economic group. Because the upper class and the institutions make use of various loopholes to avoid paying any taxes. To an extent, the US federal reserve can increase the supply of banknotes. Since USD is the world reserve currency, even if additional amount of banknotes are printed (to an extent), the inflation will remain within tolerable levels. But it is a very thin line right now, with the federal debt fast approaching $30 trillion level.

Because there are Huge funds in Machineries lol  ;D

Brazil is really a fan of gambling (though like almost all the country in the world)

Going to other countries is somewhat a hassle thing to be done by a business owner considering on overall expense that you would need then that would really be a headache

unless if your business is already too big and you can support all the possible expenses then its your choice but i would say that it is much better to deal with higher tax instead.

If you do saw your business can still sustain despite of additional tax then i dont see the worth of transferring to other countries just for that sole reason.

If they do not mind to moves to other countries because they do not want to pay high taxes, they will do that because the business owner will do many things to have less expense. But if they can sustain with all things and even get a profit, they will not do that.

But before the business owner opens their business, they already have to know how much their expenses every month. Maybe it's not about the right amount, but they have the calculation about that. They also discuss that with their consultant so the business owner can get help from them.

would be curious to have the data on how many business close each year solely by the fact that they didnt do the correct calculations if they are profitable or not after-tax

regarding gambling, tax are problably not the biggest problem since the margins are quite high, am I out of my mind?
how high are the margins for casinos? (probably a huge difference for physical vs. digital too here

Although, I am not good in economics like that but I think what you comment here is not absolutely perfect, how is tax related to money printing and inflation? Let me make an illustration. For example, if there is an inflation and the economy has been affected, if the country fiat currency has been devaluated, still know that it does not affect the tax value because tax is in percentage. If $20 of 2011 is now $200 in 2021, someone that will bet with just $1 in 2011 will want to bet with $10 in 2021 to achieve the same aim as a result of inflation and currency devaluation. If the printer won, tax will be deducted in percentage which would have also increased but of almost the same worth of certain time in the past.

would be curious to have the data on how many business close each year solely by the fact that they didnt do the correct calculations if they are profitable or not after-tax

regarding gambling, tax are problably not the biggest problem since the margins are quite high, am I out of my mind?
how high are the margins for casinos? (probably a huge difference for physical vs. digital too here

The only data will be in the government hand and the government will not give that data to the public. Maybe if you contact the business owner and ask them about that, you will know the data. But I guess they will not give that data easily as we do not relate to them. I am not sure about the difference, but the physical casino will be the government's main concern.

The big companies in gambling eventually had extra taxes because the government increased the amount of taxes when the economy went down because of inflation more gamblers are addicted to gambling because they have higher taxes so many gamblers give up gambling and do not pay taxes.

Gamblers has to pay taxes too unless they keep winning and they know that there's a responsibility but if it's more of losing, then there's nothing that they can pay taxes because they've gain nothing. But for the bigger companies, they're the ones that usually pay taxes, bigger taxes and if the government says that they have to pay with an increased tax percentage, they have to follow the order.

The only data will be in the government hand and the government will not give that data to the public. Maybe if you contact the business owner and ask them about that, you will know the data. But I guess they will not give that data easily as we do not relate to them. I am not sure about the difference, but the physical casino will be the government's main concern.

Not sure if that data is of any value because if a company fails to make correct calculations whether or not they can operate at a profitable level, it is solely them who are to blame. I mean they could of course consult tax advisories and certainly get accurate data. That's nothing you could blame a government or any tax rate for. That's the responsibility of any and all businesses.

Inflation is in fact a tax, for example if the government wants a million dollars in additional cash on their coffers how they do this? They can do this by raising taxes which brings them an additional million dollars, but people hate to be taxed even further so how to get one million dollars on their coffers but at the same time not produce that reaction from the population? They use the inflation tax, basically they just print one million dollars obtaining the same result that they will get by raising taxes, but this has the effect of raising prices, it makes the economy more unstable and it steals from the wealth of their citizens.

Heavily depends on the country you are living in. I know some countries raise quite hefty taxes for gambling, but a lot of countries raise no taxes or very close to zero. There are a lot of European countries who raise no taxes for gambling.

 And even more, inflation helps concentration of wealth to increase

have you heard of the Cantillon Effect?

Heavily depends on the country you are living in. I know some countries raise quite hefty taxes for gambling, but a lot of countries raise no taxes or very close to zero. There are a lot of European countries who raise no taxes for gambling.

Heavily depends on the country you are living in. I know some countries raise quite hefty taxes for gambling, but a lot of countries raise no taxes or very close to zero. There are a lot of European countries who raise no taxes for gambling.

There are two types of taxes. First one of the tax paid on winnings by the gamblers. As you have stated, this tax is zero in most of the European Union nations (because the gambling industry is already taxed, and if you tax the winnings as well, then it will account as double-taxing). But the winnings are taxable in countries such as USA and India. Now the second type of tax is the tax paid by casinos on their revenue. The OP is talking about this tax, and as far as I know, all the EU nations have very high tax rates for the gambling businesses.

I have not heard about it but now I have, I took the time to look for it but it seems I was already familiar with its effects I just did not knew it had that name, after all we know that when the government prints money like it did during the crisis of 2007 it gave that money to the owners of big banks because they were too big to fail, but by saving them with all of that printed money they stole from the general population, a classic case of privatizing the profits and socializing the losses, and somehow governments think they can get away playing this game forever, fortunately now with bitcoin we have a currency that allows us to escape those effects and governments do not like this one bit.

I am always happy to see guys like you add helpful information to whatever I say! :) Sure, I can't know it all but you are definitely right.

Anyway, gambling and the winnings of it depend heavily on who we are dealing with!

20%? Is this even real ? Most of the companies not related to gambling pay lower than 10% but not the same in Kenya when it comes to the sports gambling. Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule.

It's such a bad time to implement it but you can't blamer a government that wants to have money coming in times of pandemic, but one of their reasons to prohibit people from gambling is a bad one, if they don't want people to gamble in their country they should ban gambling, they really want to justify their additional taxes to these gambling companies, which is also suffering from this pandemic.

Online gambling is flourishing... I guess you wanted to say that land-based casinos suffered from this pandemic, but it's not completely true! They had a long break, but in my country, they are still working well, despite everything!

Whom else to blame than governments? Government should work for the people, not for big companies! Simple as that! But we have totally opposite situation in most parts of the world, where government officials are getting rich while they help big companies/corporations to earn more and more!

Of course, the application of taxes to casinos depends on where the casino is located, because I agree each country imposes different rules and
taxes on gambling industry. Indeed, most casinos do not actually experience a tax increase, because raising taxes on casinos will have an impact
on reducing gambler interest. So it's not surprising that there are still many countries that don't raise taxes on casinos, because the government is
more focused on raising taxes for big companies right now.

Wasn't there a lockdown in your country? I thought the whole world went through this.
Judging by the fact that now all over the world severe discrimination is gradually being introduced against those who do not want to be vaccinated, online casinos will always have a good share of the gambling market.

Wasn't there a lockdown in your country? I thought the whole world went through this.
Judging by the fact that now all over the world severe discrimination is gradually being introduced against those who do not want to be vaccinated, online casinos will always have a good share of the gambling market.

It's such a bad time to implement it but you can't blamer a government that wants to have money coming in times of pandemic, but one of their reasons to prohibit people from gambling is a bad one, if they don't want people to gamble in their country they should ban gambling, they really want to justify their additional taxes to these gambling companies, which is also suffering from this pandemic.

It's such a bad time to implement it but you can't blamer a government that wants to have money coming in times of pandemic, but one of their reasons to prohibit people from gambling is a bad one, if they don't want people to gamble in their country they should ban gambling, they really want to justify their additional taxes to these gambling companies, which is also suffering from this pandemic.

online casinos are not affected by the lockdown at all, they even get more visitors IMO
then it's really not natural that online casinos are not willing to pay 20% tax when their income increases

After all, the government should make other policies in this pandemic era regarding tax payments, in my country tax payments can be delayed during this pandemic and of course this policy is very good for the people's economy. At least there are loosened rules regarding taxes during the pandemic because after all, the government cannot only rely on income from taxes because there are still many from other sectors that can at least be income.

It's such a bad time to implement it but you can't blamer a government that wants to have money coming in times of pandemic, but one of their reasons to prohibit people from gambling is a bad one, if they don't want people to gamble in their country they should ban gambling, they really want to justify their additional taxes to these gambling companies, which is also suffering from this pandemic.

Yes, there was a lockdown, and casinos didn't work! It's why I wrote they had a long break! After lockdown, they started with a shorter working time, but for some time they are working their "normal hours"! My sister is working in a casino, so it's where I get information about this... I am not going to land-based casinos!

I agree, online casinos are becoming more popular! But that doesn't mean that ground casinos will disappear! Some people simply like to visit them, and for them, gambling is about going there, talk with people, gambling... drinking coffee or something stronger while doing all that!

Online gambling is flourishing... I guess you wanted to say that land-based casinos suffered from this pandemic, but it's not completely true! They had a long break, but in my country, they are still working well, despite everything!

Whom else to blame than governments? Government should work for the people, not for big companies! Simple as that! But we have totally opposite situation in most parts of the world, where government officials are getting rich while they help big companies/corporations to earn more and more!

You mean to say that the physical casino in your country were not closed in the time of pandemic ? That's strange because the pandemic has the impact on the whole world and not a single country was safe from this virus. The countries who didn't applied the early lockdown , later had to pay the price when patients affected from covid19 rise to the alarming numbers.

would love to see comparison data on all countries number of cases x lockdown duration x lockdown start date.

but still, wouldn't be surprised to know some countries had casinos open, specially countries where lobby is strong, in Brazil they reopened churches before schools
many messed up things going on in Politics

“Excise duty on betting at 20% of the amount will be wagered,” said Yattani, which would mean that the amount would be levied and passed on to a person who has won on a bet, which according to Yattani would also help discourage betting in the country.

Now the biggest football clubs have joined hands to oppose this rule

I would not be surprised of this as well, we must remember that some economic sectors are very strong and as such have influence over the policies governments can take and they can change them to their favor, so it would not be surprising that in a country where the gambling industry was strong and politicians accepted bribes the physical casinos remained open for longer or were not even closed on the first place, for example where I live all businesses were open before schools showing how little the government cares about the education of the children.

Wasn't there a lockdown in your country? I thought the whole world went through this.
Judging by the fact that now all over the world severe discrimination is gradually being introduced against those who do not want to be vaccinated, online casinos will always have a good share of the gambling market.

I am not 100% sure whether Las Vegas fully closed its doors, but what I do know is that gambling in Las Vegas hit an all time high in the beginning of 2021! :D

People freaked out when they reopened their doors fully. It was crowded anyway, but who would have thought they will bounce back with an all time high?

I would not be surprised of this as well, we must remember that some economic sectors are very strong and as such have influence over the policies governments can take and they can change them to their favor, so it would not be surprising that in a country where the gambling industry was strong and politicians accepted bribes the physical casinos remained open for longer or were not even closed on the first place, for example where I live all businesses were open before schools showing how little the government cares about the education of the children.

I don't see any discrimination into those people who don't want to get vaccinated and that's an another part of concern since we aren't talking about business or revenue on here.

About tax then its just actually a thing which should be asked or required upon since we know on how tax do really plays a role on economic development on a certain country.

Gambling business is generating big revenue and its just right that they would be asking more than into those businesses which are lesser in terms of overall revenue.

It seems to me that we are seeing the beginning stages of discrimination against those that do not want to get vaccinated and personally I do not like it, even if I would take the vaccine as soon as it is available in my country I think we should encourage other people to take it but not force them or criticize them, after all it is their bodies and they can do whatever they want with it, however if they do not want to take it then they should still keep all the precautions in place so they avoid getting the virus.

Vegas casinos got closed. If I remember it right, Vegas was one with the most number of confirmed cases in the US.

That's right, they were closed during the pandemic but as soon as the vaccine has arrived and most of their staff and gamblers have been vaccinated. They've been reopened again, there's another discussion for this actual topic and made for sure the gamblers to be happy again to be back to their favorite seats and games.