Bitcoin Forum

I do not know about other countries but in my country, politics has compromised the economy growth with equity.
As the transition of power evolves, the value of the citizens are depreciated in the eyes of the governments which now optimizes citizens to rely living in fortitude of bravery and accepting challenges so that we don't give it all up hopelessly.

We fight it out by ourselves like there is no government to provide us with some basic amenities and quite better to be called "a daylight robbery or extortion" that once individuals has struggled to make productive differences from the economy slavery chain of the government, you would be will assigned to revenue on taxations.

My question.... If the government could find utilizations on the citizens for taxations on generating funds for infrastructures and other government services , why don't they invest on the citizens or support those with the potentials to productiveness knowing quite well that once they makes success, they would be demanded to also contributed to the growing structures of the economy?
What the government knows is that if a successful individual refuses to comply with the government order, they will get you frustrated tending to fold your productiveness qualities or you go to jail.

So, why don't they tax the poor who barely struggle to eat?:Simply because they found those set of citizens useless and the prison will be occupied if charge them for not paying taxes since there are more Poor people than the rich in the society.

Everybody pays tax, or better put, everybody should pay tax, it doesn't matter if you're poor or rich, as far as you earn an income and have assets you should pay tax. Tax is just usually higher for higher income earner in most countries.

The problem is government officials and politicians are too greedy enriching themselves than building better places for it's citizens, especially in developing countries where there is no proper system. So if you live in that type of country you have to realize that you're in your own. People in developed countries with a working system don't have it easy but it's worse in a place without a system.
As much as countries are filled with corrupt systems, you still have to obey the laws or you'll be punished, so you have to pay your taxes.

Taxes are general, put on basic things like, income, purchases, social amenities, so rich or not rich everyone pays taxes. In most cases as one gets richer they get more financially aware and can afford to use tax loopholes that exist, meaning the not so rich may be paying more in taxes relative to what they are earning.

The rules may be flipped in your country depending on what economic policies are in place, but for majority of countries, taxes are paid across the board.

we pay taxes all the time, you may not even realize it but when you buy something, read the receipt as it mentions the tax you paid. you pay taxes over and over being poor, no one is exempted. centuries ago people wage war all because the government is collecting tax from the hard-earned money by people but now we are used to it already that even if they increase the rates, we're all obedient.

Because government is still bunch of people that has their own personal gain. That’s why government with democratic type of government on a 3rd world country usually suffer on corruption since those elected politicians is using the government as source of income to become rich.

It’s very hard to stop corruption if the person responsible of cleaning the government is one with the corrupt officials. My country is one of the best example that suffer on this kind of political corruption. Only certain family keeps being elected while they are partnering with business to tax evade while they get part of it.

We have the worst infra project despite taxpayers is paying huge taxes.

The working class are always proportionally taxed the heaviest.  The investment class (wealthy) require an incentive to invest their wealth in creating jobs for the working class so they are given a tax break to do so.

The working class also heavily outnumber the investment class so their taxes provide the bulk of the wealth confiscated by governments. 

Well yeah that is the reality especially in third world countries like mine tax itself will kill small businesses and average peoples income as all of it are subject to taxes. Rich people use debt so they pay no taxes while poor and average people can't due to the fact that it needed collaterals which most haven't. Rich people can even evade paying taxes even though they know it's illegal but average people can't. Taxes that the government collected sometimes ended up in the hands of the corrupt that is why it is so unfair.

This is the reason why the government didn't tax the poor.


The government mostly taxes middle class people because they're have a good mindset that didn't like the poor, but if they do something, it will not give a huge impact like the rich. Middle class people are the one who make the government rich because they don't mind to work hard and pay big amount of tax.

The rich pay less tax than the middle class since they learn tax avoidance and have a power to change something.

Limited resources may be one of the reasons why the government does not assist or invest more in its citizens who have the potential to be productive. They might place more emphasis on funding services and infrastructure that benefit the whole community as opposed to just a select few. Governments that are risk averse might rather fund safer projects with better odds of success. Political factors: Politicians may also have an impact on governments by endorsing particular sectors of the economy or groups of people. This may lead to an unfair allocation of opportunities and resources. Lack of knowledge or comprehension: Public servants might not always be aware of a group's or individual's capacity for productivity, nor might they completely comprehend the advantages of investing in them. for expansion and advancement.

Everybody pays tax, whether you know or not, but your taxation becomes more obvious when you have a lot of money.

Tax conditions are different in every country; some countries take it more seriously than others.

@OP, We are from the same country, and the very last time that I was out to enjoy a bottle of beer, I remember that on my receipt for payment, I saw that there was an addition for VAT on my drink. It is the same with the services rendered by some other outlets, so even if you are not rich yet or even working, there is still some tax that you pay.

Everyone should pay tax including the poor in the society as long as they are earning income. Taxes are a good thing and it is a civic responsibility. Public infrastructures would not be possible if citizens don't pay taxes and we know that these public infrastructures are for the benefits of the poor who would use it at a subsidized cost. On the other hand the poor should be taxed based on their income. They shouldn't be made to pay the same amount in taxes just as the rich. It would be unfair and unjust to them.

"Life isn't fair, Highness. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something." - Wesley (The Princess Bride)

This is really dependent on which country you live in, because I am quite happy with the services that my government provides - even if they are sometimes imperfect or elements need vast improvements. However I can see why some people in more corrupt countries might get disenfranchised with their government, as you hear some really tough stories where leaders can hoard money for a very small inner circle. In an ideal world they should tax the richest billionaires much more, however these people can often move around into jurisdictions that will bend rules to get them in, even if they do not contribute very much it looks good to have many billionaires in your country.

All politicians everywhere are owned by the wealthy.  They are the real power.  The politicians only exist at the whim of the wealthy to serve as a buffer and to give the common people some illusion of control and representation over their lives.

"The rich shall rule over the poor and the borrower is slave to the lender" - Solomon, son of David, King of Israel. 

Politics. They don't want to initiate projects that don't have any solid way for people to immediately see what they did, so they don't do those kinds of projects where it's designed to benefit the city in the long run. I've worked with the government before and you can see this from the way they structure their projects lol. Might be a bit biased on the one I worked on, but I think in general that's how it goes. Sadly enough even these projects that are being shown and immediately made/built still suck lol.

Though in general as others have said, taxes are still being paid by everyone. Just that at a certain point, it becomes really easy to use the laws to bypass taxes and I'd say that's the point where you can call yourself rich lol.

In our country, we are pretty much having an extra benefits compared to most other countries, which the government keep imposing taxes on their properties, their cars, houses and even their Bitcoin/Crypto Investments, all these are not worth being taxed despite the benefits of raising finance to help the government to developing the country. Every country has a natural resources and I think it's high time the government should invest into those sectors so as to be able to lessen the taxes, the poor and average citizens are finding it difficult to keep up even the wealthy in some countries are heavily taxed on their hard earned wealth.

I think people always see the fault of the government, but it is not always the case that the government is at fault because many things are to be considered. For example, in some countries, you can pay tax for your vehicle, housing, or business, so a poor man who is looking for something to survive will not have all this. Most of those properties, because poor people leave in a rented apartment and the tax on that apartment will be paid by the owner, not those that rent it, so will you say that the government only focuses on the rich and forgets the poor?

That is the main reason you will see most rich people have too much debt and loan not because they don’t have the money, but because they just want to use the strategy to stay away from tax. So in this situation, even the poor people do pay tax, but not as much as the rich do. That is why you always see the rich are the ones paying the tax but not the poor, so don’t think that the poor have no use for the government. Everyone is useful to the government because the government is for the people. 

Exactly. Taxes are mandatory. However, if you have low paying job, you are also obliged to pay a small amount of tax, but if you are working as an executive or any high paying position, you will also pay a bigger tax. As long as you declare your source of income whether it’s kind of business or job, rest assured that the government will obliged you to pay your tax on time. That’s how paying tax in our country is never a voluntary but a mandatory instead.

Grew up to understand that tax payment is an obligation on the part of the citizens to their country's government and not a thing of an option or choice in as much as you're due for it, be it a salary earner or business.

It's a sad reality that the performance of the government to their social, economic and political responsibility is lacking in this part of our world but we still have to pay our tax as it's the only way we can continue to have a right to demand and  hold them accountable. A man that doesn't pay tax doesn't have a right to demand for social amenities only when you're a tax payer that's when you can boldly criticize and drag the government for certain failures and mismanagement.

Now make i enter broken cause wetin I wan talk na about the worwor side of us.  Me notice am say the main reason why many of we Nigerians no dey fit stand up to drag the government for accountability be say  we no sabi pay tax, plenty people the hide from paying, so them mouth no fit strong in terms of demanding responsibility and accountability from the government, and the few wey the pay no go fit fight this fight fully.

Although I know say e get certain indirect taxes we dey pay for certain services we use but apart from those the direct ones we dey like run from am so e go hard make tuna fully work well as we dey think am.
Check oyinbo people and their tax life nah

Just to correct a statement, the poor people in society are not useless. I learnt that somewhere.

This is something different since you know that you can only pay tax on what you own. Then definitely paying tax for a house you rent should not be your responsibility because you are not the owner; you stay there as rent, not yours, so for this, the owner of the house is the one to pay. You don’t have to include house rent in things like this since the tenant is not the owner of the house, so he won’t be the one to pay tax. However, even if the government did not collect tax from a poor person who rents a house, it is not a big deal on a normal basis; they were not suppose to collect since the house is not their property.

But if a poor person can buy a house, a car, or anything else that a country's government collects tax from, they will definitely collect it from them too, no doubt, so to me, just because the government is not collecting tax from tenants doesn’t mean they are also pitying them. Is it not their responsibility to pay that tax? If not, the government won’t look at how poor they are; they will pay for it. 

Businesses, including landlords, always pass the tax on to the consumer.  As a renter, you are making the mortgage and tax payments as part of the rent, you're just not getting the benefit from it (equity and deductibility). 

I don't know if you've got literature or data that would back this up or this is simply expression of sheer disappointment and frustration.

However, as far as my country's revenue statistics are concerned, it's the people, the masses, everybody who's actually the largest source of income of the government. My country's revenue is mainly coming from value added taxes or taxes imposed on goods and services which everybody buys, rich or poor, powerful or helpless alike. And since majority of the people are the masses, then the government is actually heavily reliant on them for their money. The second largest source of income are taxes besides value added taxes that are imposed on goods and services. This is another revenue category that's coming from the masses.

My point is that the poor are actually heavily taxed. They're useless yet the government is actually milking them for the money they themselves would steal. So, they're not actually useless. Even if they're only eating canned sardines everyday, they remain to be the largest revenue contributor to the government.

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Source:

1. https://www.oecd.org/tax/tax-policy/revenue-statistics-asia-and-pacific-philippines.pdf

Right! So even those poor people still paying taxes in a very different ways, that's also the reason why people are struggling in their daily expenses because everything they need has a tax payment, that results higher expenses. maybe we only see the big deductions due to tax payments but in reality, the tax bill is the same for everyone, it just differs depending on the state of your life.

What kind of support you are expecting from the government? They have built collages so that you can study. Many government collages are nearly free for the citizens. Same goes for government schools as well. In my country, the basic education up to 5th standard is available for free. Many other facilities are also available for nearly free of cost. That's the support government should provide to their citizens. What other support you are referring to?

Also do you think that "individual income tax" is the only tax you pay? try to find the data for your country and you will see that the "individual income tax" probably contributes around 2% - 4% of the total taxes collected by the government. Citizens pay indirect taxes for every purchase. That's where the burden is!


People who can barely afford food, how would they pay taxes? Ask yourself!

This is the sad part there. We are clueless about these taxation charges. It's kinda unfair if you ask me. I think it's better if they will be transparent because we are not picking up the money in the ground when we walk outside but it requires a tedious process to earn it.

Maybe if we know that a thing had some added tax, we can learn to say no, or pick a much cheaper item instead. For those who have lots of money, it is still possible for them to evade the tax and many are doing it already in fact. That was wrong of course. IMO, there is no reason to avoid it, if you know that you are earning money well. Those who do it are only greedy.

It usually differs from country to another but each country has what we call a tax bracket. If you earn x amount of salary, then you might belong to a bracket where the government can tax you 15% to 30% of your salary. Probably lower if your salary is also lower.

How does this not help lower / middle class people?

The government only helps people under a specific economic class and once they start earning, they stop all kinds of support and taxes them. Obviously with how much they are paying in their daily expenses, they are bound to go back to poverty again. This can be called the paradox of poverty which I think was very well explained in this video: https://youtu.be/D9N7QaIOkG8?si=02Q0JF1kXkuqcbDM (https://youtu.be/D9N7QaIOkG8?si=02Q0JF1kXkuqcbDM)

Unless for third world countries where the revenue generation and tax paying system is not as strong and effective as possible, making it possible for the lower class citizens of those countries not to pay tax because the popular opinion from the poor people is that paying of taxes by them is seen as extortion from the side of the government.

Due to this popular notion attached to the taxes collected by the government, it becomes difficult for the government agents to effectively collect those taxes making it more popular that only the rich people are the true taxpayers of the government. When we say rich people, in this context it also means those with thriving businesses and so on.

Since, in those kinds of countries, the class of people are differentiated by their environments which means the rich people oftentimes live in expensive and well coordinated environments like estates in big cities etc, making it easy to collect taxes from them. whereas the poor people live in a slums where houses are not properly built and people are always resistant to government enforcements.

The government do invest in human resource as well. Athletic events, beauty pageants, talent contests, scholarships and others are only some of the things that government set a specific amount of money for. Those people represent the country and can increase economic growth either through promotion of tourism or just winning awards and bringing home bragging rights for the country.
They don’t charge the poor because there’s nothing to charge them for. If they are not earning anything and they are still being taxed, that will create inequality in the society.

Most governments function in this manner thanks to the human greed factor which is something that will most probably never change in my honest opinion. They tax the hell out of earning people in order to survive.

Very few governments don't unfairly tax everyone though, but they make sacrifices in some other places. This is reality sadly.

This is something that most people sometimes forget, making them unaware that the tenant has actually paid tax on the rental and this will certainly be very beneficial for the land owner or landlord who usually takes advantage of the rent. I personally prefer to buy land directly if the location is quite suitable and strategic as I want at a price that is not much different from the usual market. Because the price of land itself is usually also influenced by the place or location of the land, as well as the rental costs which vary greatly from one land to another if the location is not the same.

It is not possible for the government to support its huge population. So it is not right to expect anything from the government. Even if the government does not support anyone, he cannot continue without the support of the people. That is, the more taxes the public provide, government will be richer. Because of which it is said that if he does not help anyone, he expects the people of his country to be rich. But there are some differences between developed and developing countries. The more taxes are provided in a developed country the people of that country will get more advantages. But in developing countries, especially those countries which are involved in corruption, the taxes cannot be used properly by the government.

Of course we all do pay taxes. To be precised we pay taxes via incomes and also purchases but quite trickish by the government that they extract these taxes from the people in most unknowingly manners such as increase of goods and service charges or likely to say inflation. That's when the government sights that even the poor laments on why asked to pay taxes even when they ain't accountable to making income in any ways.
Rather the obvious task payers are the income earners which the rate of their taxes is depended on their incomes rate.

Well, the government does not care about those excuses. As long as you are a citizen of the country, you are entitled to pay tax in due time.You can only manage to avoid some tax after you have discovered the loophole to avoid paying some tax. You cannot decide to be unsuccessful because you are scared that the government will ask for tax when you have grown a successful business or company.

I think the government of my country is trying their best, but yet they cannot still empower all the youth. Since we know that the government also has its lapses, we don't have to depend on them and wait until they empower us. But one thing is sure: whether the government empowers you or not, you are expected to pay tax when the time is right. 

To be fair, you can only find a loophole in paying taxes when you are super rich. The more complex your company is, the more likely you can find a loophole among regulatory laws. So the richer you are, the more you can escape paying taxes. Which is quite ironic if you think about it.

The poor are the ones who are fined hugely for not paying taxes when they can barely afford their daily needs. The taxes they collect are usually used for corruption anyway.

This very argument is the reason why the Ronald Reagan Tax Reform worked in the first place. They supposed that since businessmen are the ones that carry the whole economy of a country, in this case the USA, they should be taxed less and have the brunt of the work be passed on to the micro-citizens and the average joe. You realize how this lead to fucked up situations later down the line leading up to Ronald Reagan becoming labeled as the worst president in history.

There's a fine line between "investing in the productive members of the society" and "lifting tax obligations to the rich" you have to understand that the poor can't pay taxes because they are fucking poor.

I don't know where are you from but there must be some programs in your country that help farmers, startups, tech companies and local business/production in your country. I don't think it's abandoned at all. They won't fund every business but there must be some niches that country wants to develop and with the right mind and good team, it's possible to get funding.

By the way, governments don't tax poor people but it's not like they tax rich people too. There are three classes: working class, middle class, and upper class. Working class does the most job and gets the lowest payrate. The middle class might be working as much as work class but they get better quality of life but still, they are the most pressured class, middle class pays the most taxes, they are the true strength. Upper class pays the least taxes because they are rich, have connections, influence, power and the possibility to bribe others, so, you know, they don't pay much taxes, middle class pays the most.

They do and that why they are investing the tax money on infrastructure that bring more employment opportunities, better healthcare, better roads,etc so if they do what they propose then they are investing on citizens and we can't expect them to put money on everyone's pocket which will leads to inflation. So the organic way to develop the economy is generate revenue, reinvest in the country which help people to make money so they could pay taxes and the cycle keep repeats.

Quite convince able that everyone actually pays this taxes but the middle class people are the ones that the government focuses more on the tax structures because the middle classes may not be affordable to loose their source of income if they intends to thwart the governments order.

And besides they do not really understand the system of government yet so they would always be flexible to be controlled by the government unlike the highily rich people who knows the garbage in and the garbage out of the system of grievance.

Verily I am in doubt of the top politicians do pays these taxes when they are the ones programing the taxations and they are still the ones to give judgements so in a real essence, the taxes of the poor and the middle classes of people are getting the riches richer.

An obvious negligence that the poor and the middle classes are being oppressed on the struggling of their survival and financial upgrading just to enrich the riches richer by the taxing structures.

This is sad, I know that most of us believe that we shouldn't be relying on the government. But they should be the first responder in help and aide for their citizens. At least in the little that they can, there should be support from them on helping their people to survive and provide their provisions, not an actual provision from them but the process and steps should be lightened by them.

Check out your government if they have educational programs like free basic education from primary to secondary because that's how they invest to individuals.

That's an incentive to them.

They contribute in so little ways and to the point that they are only earning money for their food and can't even tax them with that.

I mean they are taxing basically everything, aside from the oxygen you are breathing (I wouldn't be shocked to learn even that's taxed in some nations), but they are not helpful when you want to get rich, that's the issue. Governments love rich people, but they people who are not rich or trying to be rich.

So, you either inherit a lot of wealth, or you just happen to get lucky very quickly with their own system. Look at people like roaring kitty, that dude turned 50k into 500 million at some point (much less now), you think anyone can repeat that? Of course not, that was a one time thing in history, probably fixed by now, so believe me when I say this, if you start poor, then government will do their very best to keep you there.

I will not agree with you on this because it is not every government but some governments. You cannot use because of some governments to conclude because I know of governments that created so many billionaires through their policy. A good example is the Chinese government. If you think that government does not help citizens become rich, read the article^[1] that explains how the Chinese government created many rich people even more than the U.S. How will a government even tax poor citizens? It is when the people are generating income that government will be able to tax them. Check every government generating high income through taxes, it means their economy is working and citizens engaged in gainful employment. There are actually some governments that tax their citizens to death even when they have not do much to better their lots. You can see such governments mostly in Africa where the citizens are left to their fate because of sharp disconnect between the government and the citizens. We cannot use these few cases to generalize.

[1] https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/china-created-more-billionaires-u-s-now-it-cracking-down-n1278438

Anywhere the government will not be making money they won’t get their self involved and that is one of the reasons they don’t want to get their self to much involved with bitcoin and even at that in some countries you will still pay tax in every transaction you make in bitcoin. And like you said they would have been asking us to even pay for the intake of oxygen, they keep making their citizens pay money with us benefiting from the tax we are paying because most of the things we make use if we still pay for it we still pay for hospital and even other extra bills to survive what is now the benefits of government collecting tax they just collect people’s money and spend it on things that are not important that is the government for you. Government love rich and business people because they can heavily tax them for those establishments.

One of the sweetest thing is to inherit money because it will be a continuous things not as if you start thinking of were to even start from. The question is do people still get lucky because the way things are going it’s as if luck is no longer on our side except if you gamble and you win money. 50k into 500 million that will be witchcraft bro because still wondering how that is possible. Government are good in suffering people so they don’t want us to get rich but it’s all in a matter of time.

Nobody cares for anybody. Anybody who will pretend to care for you, even if he or she does, he or she is doing it for some reasons known or unknown to you. Except one's mother in most cases. Every other person 's care has limits. Being it Your brother, sister, uncle, aunty, nephew, nieces and friends. Let alone government that doesn't even know you let talk of knowing your condition. And if you are talking about caring for the entire citizens, greediness, selfishness, wickedness and lack of sympathy will not allow the government to care about their people.

Government that are so greedy to the extent of not being able to pay even their citizens salaries anymore? Government that are so selfish to the level of looking for a possible way  of making the condition of their citizens worse than the one they are? Government that is focusing on empowering their own children and wives? They only know how to loot public funds. For example, my country Nigeria, things are getting worst everyday. our current president i don't even know what to say about him. is he confused or he is just deceiving us? Or he is just been wicked to the citizens? Imagine this man spending billions of Nigeria's currency on useless anthem while students are on strike, workers are on strike due to economic hardship, lack of the payment of outstanding salaries, lack of good roads and other infrastructural mismanagement.

The most painful aspect of it, is that, since the coming of this government, the first things he introduced were removal of fuel subsidy, unification of foreign exchange and increments of tax leveled on companies and industries which all made the condition of the citizens difficult. And as at the time of my writing the government has not done anything about it. God is our savior.

This is very simple, such decisions will require a long term thinking that is rarely found on a democratic system, politicians care about getting elected and remain in power, if they were to enact policies which could take effect 20 years down the line, then their political opponents could benefit out of it while doing nothing to deserve it, so in their minds those kind of actions and plans are heavily discouraged, and instead prefer to take short term actions that can be attributed to them in the case they happen to work.

Of a truth every one is required to pay taxes to government if only the system was to be transparent such that the dividends of the taxes the masses are paying are visible to them but however, except a poor man has a source of income they should not be taxed. The poor ones in the society are trying to survive so they don't deserve pressure to pay taxes because had it been the so called government were to make good use of the revenue being generated by people who pays their taxes it would have had significant results in reducing the rate of unemployed youths on the streets but it is just so sad that after collecting this taxes, they don't care to bring forth projects that will employ higher numbers manpower to deliver them by so doing everyone will even persuade others to pay taxes and people would gladly pay without delay.

Instead of the government to use this income that is generated for infrastructural development and other projects, they often share the money among the themselves and enrich their businesses while the masses are there suffering yet they are still paying taxes.

How much the state taxes the citizens and how much they get in return depends strongly on a country. In my country, people have been losing their purchasing power for over a decade, but there is a strong objective reason for it: a much bigger country waging a war against us. Then there's corruption, which is a big issue. But I think we don't have progressive taxes, so people normally pay the same (at least, when it comes to income tax). Also, the tax authorities are very lax, so a huge amount of people don't pay their taxes or pay way less than they're supposed to. As for the social support, we have free basic medical care for everyone, free higher education (highly accessible with around 50% studying for free), and very cheap public transport throughout the nation.
Investing in support for citizens is a great idea, and I agree that countries usually don't do enough of that. As for taxing the poor, in my country they are taxed, but overall I think it's very unfair and unproductive. If a person is barely making ends meet, taxes make a huge negative impact on that person's life. In the meantime, this money is almost nothing for the state, as these people have very small salaries anyway and thus the amount they pay in taxes is miniscule (for the state, but not for the poor).

lol in my country it is not only a 'big' issue. It is probably the biggest root of all of our problems, it is so bad that even our president has accusations of evading taxes while other politicians are using public funds for their own personal matters. How would our country progress if the taxes that are supposedly should be used for development are being used for other matters?

I think I can accept high taxes if the way of living is good, and the government is efficient and productive

You know what? I thought of this many times in the past, this tax of a thing is selfish at times. Could you believe that till today, I can't say that I have benefited a single cent from the government? This is bad. Not for educational aid, health, or even any social intervention, it has always been struggling here where people have to think beyond the circle to make money as gainful employment that will be sufficient to solve your needs and those of your family are so scarce.

Upon all, the government continues to collect tax in various ways, and if I count it correctly, maybe in 4-5 ways for ordinary citizen (excluding employment tax and others). Recently, they still came up with a useless Cybersecurity tax, something that is the sole responsibility of the government to bear. They wanted to tax us 0.5% extra on all electronic transactions in addition to VAT and others, but people fought it fiercely and they had to abandon it. This is to show how cruel and insensitive they are despite their high corruption, negative economic remarks, insecurity, you name it.

I thought of this tax issue one day and I thought to establish my company (if God bless me with one) in another country where most benefits will be there rather than in my country. This could sound cruel to you but nothing encourages me to pay my taxes in my country just because there is nothing appreciative I can think about my country if I flashback except pain and regret that I am a citizen.

Then you should fly to first world countries.

For rich people who live in first world country will see your country is the best place to live since they will get many benefit due to corruption culture.

But for middle class or poor people who live in third world country will see first world country is the good place to live since you can get paid higher than working in your country and the country is fair with anyone.

OP, is it just me or your English is kinda broken. I don't understand everything you are trying to say in this forum thread.
The government is paying for your education and healthcare with the tax payers money. The roads and streets you are walking on are built with money coming from the tax payers. Yes, I agree that the rich and more productive people are forced to pay higher taxes, but that's the main concept of the "welfare state". When you have more, you contribute more to the society.
I don't think that the poor people are completely useless. They can contribute to the society by doing different kinds of labor, instead of paying taxes(since they have no money). Such labor could be cleaning the streets, for example.

The poor too are taxed, the tax is not always in the form of you paying the government. The things you buy and the food you eat are taxed beforehand.
There's a high level of corruption in government. Anyone that gets elected to the government are approached by rich business that pays them and their parties a hefty sum to make policies according to their interest. The government don't really tax the ultra rich, they create loopholes for the ultra rich to not pay tax or compensate back the tax they paid on one way or other.
The government gets most of its revenues from the middle class and normal workers. And it benefits from not working in favor of them or the lower class. For someone to be rich, there should be poor people willing to work for cheap.

The taxes imposed by the government on the people are of course indiscriminate, the whole community certainly has to pay taxes if they want to get any goods, in this case it will be very detrimental to the people if they cannot benefit from what they have paid to the government.

A government that can be controlled with money really doesn't care about their society and all they think about is a group of people who can benefit themselves and if this continues of course a country will certainly be on the verge of collapse and as you said it is very true indeed. There are some people who have a lot of wealth, they falsify tax documents and do not fully pay taxes, of course this will be very detrimental to the country, but they can hide behind their wealth and they are also close to the authorities at that time.

Those who employ other people at wages below the average worker, of course they never think about their workers, they only use these workers to make money for them and we think this is really undesirable and these workers must be willing to do work for cheap pay. because there is no other choice that they can do.

They care for the people at the very least, the people is the one that's working those jobs and getting those salaries after all, there's no way that you'd want to be doing some kind of dominion over someone when you neglect them totally, pretty sure that you'd make a lot of money if you take at least some care of the people that are working in your country, the more they work then the more that they're going to pay your taxes. They don't have to wait for the individual to get rich just so they can get taxes from them, most of the stuff that we do are already taxed and most countries have a form of lottery in there so that's another way that they can collect money from the people.

Taxes stink. Nobody likes to part up their hard-earned money to the government. But life is a shit, and then you die. Taxes are just part of the game. And honestly, the more the government taxes you, the more you're forced to evolve.

Consider it this way: you will need to work harder, smarter, and more creatively if the government is always nagging at your neck. The financial jungle is going to require you to become a fucking predator. And that is not a negative thing. It is an alert. There's fire beneath your ass. Thus, rather than moaning about taxes, turn them into a drive to improve yourself. Recall that the only restrictions you have are those you impose upon yourself. Thus, do not let taxes to stop you. Permit them to advance you.

In my opinion, there is no problem if the government emphasizes paying taxes as long as it is transparent and people can enjoy the results of the taxes they pay. This is different from what happens in my country, Indonesia, currently we are required to pay taxes of around 12% and other additional costs and even a 3% deduction from our monthly salary for insurance called TAPERA.

Actually difference cases with my country taxes transaction with the other after paying taxes they can earn easily with medical healthy, free education cost until enjoying public transportation more comfortable. Most important how taxes transaction adopting by government can help the citizen get more better medical healthy exactly for them not stable with financial condition.

Of course, each person has different financial capabilities, so even though the nominal tax charged by each person is the same, it feels heavy for some people, especially those who only have a small salary. In my country, those who are subject to income tax are those who earn above $3k per month, for those below that, the government still provides compensation, so it's actually not that bad as long as we treat taxpayers wisely.

Indeed, there are certain rates and certain criteria for paying tax, just as in my country there are certain income limits that are subject to payment of personal tax, and even that is calculated using a formula after deducting income that is not subject to tax, such as how many dependents you have. In fact, if all the elements run well, it won't be burdensome, but many people are exposed to corruption, which creates negative thoughts about tax rates.

Governments and the wealth that controls them don't really want you to become rich.  For the system to work most citizens need to remain in either the government dependent category (welfare) or in the wage / salary category where you shoulder the largest percentage of the cumulative tax burden.  There is a reason public education systems do not teach financial responsibility and society, corporations, and media instead push the traps of debt and consumerism upon the populace. 

A country's government uses all sources of domestic revenue to run the country. These include foreign earnings export earnings direct and indirect taxes etc. Many of us may not know that we pay taxes without our knowledge because those who are not eligible to pay direct taxes indirectly pay taxes to the government by purchasing daily necessities. Again many rich people take all measures to evade their taxes which is a big obstacle to the development of the country and nation.

It's even more insidious than that.  Governments spend far more than they steal in taxes.  They must borrow the remainder.  The treasury bills that I invest in when the interest rates are high enough are nothing more than loans to the US Government that they must pay back with interest.   

I do not think that "they do not want you to get rich" is the right thing to say here, they just don't want general public to have a decent life, but they do not care about the individual. If you personally end up building a business and become a billionaire one day, they are not going to stand on your way, but if you want to make the minimum wage in the USA 20 dollars, they are going to do all they can to try and stop you, that's the most important part.

That is why there is a difference between "they do not want you to get rich" and "they do not want us to get rich", if you say one, then it's like they hate you personally, if you say the other it's mostly about them wanting more money and power at that moment and not really personal.

Well, I like your synonym but though they both conveys the same point rather, you made it been clear that the government is not just against one citizen but every citizens.

Without being doubted, the government do not want us to get rich but want the riches all by themselves so, whoever of us that gets riched without weighing on the wages and salaries but on investment and tradings strickly on personal entrepreneurship are like being taking the government unaware.

So before the government could realize your drift, you have already established your richness as an individual so, all they could do is to start extorting from you by taxations.

Each country has its own laws and each country's taxes are different. It is sad to say that in our country, the rich and the poor are all taxed, which I am not entitled to. Even if the government taxes everything from above, those poor people can never change their condition. Even essential commodities and foodstuffs are taxed.

The people are already grinding in the mill of inflation, everything will be charged from the top. Both the poor and the government would benefit in countries where the governments take care of their people and take care of their needs, those countries become developed, and countries in which the government only fills its own pockets never get out of poverty.

I wish to remind you that complaining would depend on the country. In top countries, the tax is duly used that it makes sense to pay it as required. If you’re in a country where the tax isn’t used properly maybe due to bad politicians in power then I understand your why. I think the reason why tax isn’t asked from people with lower earning is because it’s not so much to get from them, and yet they’d keep struggling. As we can tell, wealthy people have more and the tax isn’t a lot for them to pay.

Complaining will worsen the situation we are experiencing both now and in the future, paying taxes is an obligation for everyone but if the government cannot manage it well then everyone will choose to avoid paying it due to various reasons they have, I think those who have there is a lot of wealth and the taxes they have to pay are not large, of course they have done things that are contrary to the law and I am very sure they will falsify their tax documents and it is impossible for some people who have a lot of wealth but have a small amount of tax to pay.

I think, you know that government cannot make progress without collecting taxes from the citizens in a country, because that is their source of income which they can use to finance other projects that will bring development to the country. If the country is not developed, it will be the shame of the government and if the country is developed to be among the developed countries in the world it will bring good name to the government in power, government need to collect taxes from poor and wealthy in a country. I think, there are some government that are investing in their citizens to grow and bring progress to the country by giving citizens capital to start up a business, giving citizens scholarships to travel to any country of their choice to study.

To be fair, rich people do not pay that much tax anyway, it's us that carry the load and I believe that it should definitely not be an issue for us to pay these taxes, that's fine. What I believe is that everyone should pay their fair share of the taxes, I am fine with paying high amount of taxes that government charges me, that's just how governments stay afloat, one thing I am not happy about is companies avoiding tax, and rich people avoiding tax. So far, for the past 100 years, not many governments made it possible for rich people and companies to pay taxes, if you ever try to, they just move their headquarters somewhere else.

This is why I suggest revenue based taxes, for every sale made in that nation, even if you are a foreign company, your revenue will be taxed. That would work wonders, you can either stop selling or have to pay taxes, those would be only options.

It is ok to pay taxes specially when the amount is depending on your status in life, because taxes is used by the government to improve the economy, building structures, hospital, road, schools, etc., if the government officials are not corrupt the country will not suffer from the different rising of daily needs price, and medicine, or in high tuition fee in public schools, they don't care for no one but they care about the taxes because the taxes will help a lot in the  monthly or yearly budget in the country.

While taxing people could be quite annoying, but yes you are right, if they are the one who also benefit or majority will benefit out from those projects made through taxes, then I don’t think complaining will still be reasonable. After all, the tax they have to paid is just a small percentage out from their whole one month salary.

However, poor citizens are not required to pay tax simply because they also lack the means to pay for it. But if ever they also land stable jobs in the future, surely they won’t be exempted as well paying their taxes.

Yes, it is just a small percent of the salary. But I think why people complain is when they aren’t seeing the result of the tax they are paying. And like I said, it depends on the country. There would be a country where citizens are discouraged from paying tax because all they have paid for years can’t be seeing. Meanwhile some top countries can visibly show you where your tax goes. I’m talking about countries where there’s good roads, government hospitals, proper water and power supply, and all of that.

You should know that government help is limited. meaning they can't afford to train everyone in the society, government have their role to play but can't help everyone. It is the obligation of a parent to take full responsibility of their children while the government take care of the moral and legal right of a person. It is certain in every country that government will require tax from its citizens to make the economy great. Though where the government only play most role is when they employ you in any of the sector like agriculture, political, educational, industrial and judicial sector etc. after a person might have graduated from Higher institutions, the person will go in to labour market and may get employed or may be self-employed which as a full grown citizens of a country wether government employee or private/self employed, you have the right to pay tax to support your country. it has been like that for a very long time. If government want to train everyone in the society, am afraid the economy may go bankrupt.

I mean they are not "forced" to because they can't, but also we need to remember that even poor citizens do pay taxes. Well maybe not pay income tax, but when you buy something as simple as bread, you are getting taxed, you can buy water, beer, cheese, whatever you are buying, it is all costing you money to pay the tax for it as well, and remember those companies who built those, also pay taxes, so they put that in the price as well, so that means you are paying that too, in order to keep those companies profitable so they can continue.

All in all, even the poorest person will pay taxes, just not income tax, otherwise they are still somewhere along the chain and will be paying taxes without a trouble, so it should not be an issue at all.

Government have the responsibility to create enabling environment for people to survive. There should provision of infastructure and job opportunities to enable people earn a living. How do you expect parents to take care of thier children when there are no means of making money..

It is mandatory to pay tax to the government if you are gainfully employed. But we all know that in most countries the government is corrupt which has led to the looting of the country's resources. I assume that OP is trying to state that if the government wants to get more revenue from tax, they should create more employment opportunities for citizens. His point is that a country without basic amenities and job opportunities will not be able to generate high revenue from taxes.

The means of financing the government of every country are taxes and other sources that are used for the welfare of the people. Again if the money is not collected the country has to resort to loans. But what the government collects from us again creates various opportunities for our work so that our work productivity increases and can contribute to the domestic economy. Again there are many countries that are corrupt and there is no accountability in their activities and economic development does not accelerate in those countries.

Generally i really have no problem with taxation, most of the time, the more questionable thing is how good they put those taxes to use, you know through providing public facilities and giving healthcare for their citizen, I think that's what matters to judge whether the taxes really put to good use or not.

Can't deny that country won't run without taxes and most of government that are good already investing in their citizens through scholarships and low interest loan, the reason why government don't taxes the poor because the poor is the one that needs welfare, taxing them kinda defeats the point isn't it.

Honestly, if any, it'd be great if the government can somewhat adopt better approach on disclosing the use of their taxes to the public sort of increasing the transparency. so, the public like us could know that there's no leakage of money that doesn't benefit the taxpayers at all.

Very few people suddenly "become rich", they have either developed a company over many years or worked their way up through company ranks to ever higher salaries. During that time you have progressively paying more tax as you move through the different tax bands based on earnings. At the lowest rungs of salaries, you might pay 20% on your earnings and at the highest you might start paying 40%+ on earnings but the change happens gradually. You seem to think that taxes are inherently bad and is just a one way street, you pay money for nothing in return. However, unless you have a completely corrupt and/or incompetent government you are paying for things that are used throughout society and many things that you may never encounter, like prisons.

Do you think it is the rich that are paying for your taxes, the poor are those paying more taxes, you're paying for yours and that if the rich. You get taxed more when you buy things in retails because all the business are adding their taxes and they add prices to the goods being sold and when you buy things, you're paying more but the rich buy in whole sales, the discount you get would make your expenses to be reduced.  The rich has ways they use to avoid taxes but the poor man aren't allowed such privileges so they are the only ones the government can suck dry for their taxes.

The government will make it to look like everybody is receiving equal taxes but in reality the poorer you are the more taxes you pay. The money might be small in your eyes but lookout the percentage you're paying in comparison to the money you have but the rich is paying less and left with more wealth. The government doesn't pray for you to be rich because when you do you'll be out of their trap and with your connections you'll be able to get out of taxes but the poorer the citizens remain the more the government gets to fund their budget without improving the economy.

Taxes follow a curve similar to a bell in which those at the opposite sides, those that are incredibly rich and those that are very poor, do not pay much in terms of taxes, but as you begin to move to the center, the taxes you need to pay grow significantly, as we must remember that we pay taxes not only when we do so explicit to the government, but we do so when we make almost any transaction, the issue is that while I can understand those that have nothing to pay a low amount of taxes too, it is a problem when the rich do it, as there are people out there which are billionaires and that pay less taxes than we do, and this is clearly unfair.

That is right. The ones at the top and at the bottom aren't heavily impacted by taxes. The middle classes are. The government protects the richest, because if regulators introduce tax policy against them, their wealth leaves the country immediately to a more friendly country which won't charge them at all... Meanwhile, the poors don't have much to contribute and heavily rely on welfare programs to survive, so the final burden is carried by the middle classes, who are the most prejudiced ones, since they want to work and thrive, but find many obstacles on the way, because the government sabotages them all the time through abusive taxes.

As far as I've seen, countries haven't managed to get rid of this vicious cycle yet. Here in my country, officially, around 40% of the yearly income of an average citizen returns to the government through taxes. That is insane, and for much less we already had armed revolts in a far historical past against the imperial government.

It is not really a situation where the government is waiting for people to become rich, before they are taxed.. they simply tax rich people more to help them to pay their salaries and also to help them to pay for services that they need to render to the community.

Who will fund these services, if the rich are not helping to pay for these services?

Taxes are income retrieved from workers monthly to contribute to the account of the country for the development of the country as well but we are not seeing much of these taxes and the area they are being used all the government could do is to impose heavy taxes on especially private owned businesses.

No job opportunity but open a small successful business boom government and their tax issues.

But even if the laws states that the rich should pay high taxes, due to their wealth they can use all kind of tricks to pay way less taxes than what they should, this is a problem that has existed for a long time and governments are trying to combat it, but since the rich also give money to politicians to get elected, this means that whatever laws that are passed with this purpose are left with a lot of loopholes which can be exploited by the rich.

This is very correct, and unfortunately it is making middle class live like poor of the old days as well. If you are in the USA and making 40k a year, then you are poor, and you do not pay that much taxes and government doesn't "benefit" from you, if you are making a million dollars a month, you could protect it in a hundred different ways, but if you are someone who makes about 10k a month, which is 120k, you are not poor, but you are not "that" rich neither, so they tax you to hell, and you can't afford a decent house most of the time because of it.

I believe that we are going to end up with rich people eventually getting a bit more taxed, because the current system is not sustainable, and there won't be any other method left even if they want to avoid taxing the rich.

We do know that when it comes to taxation then they would really be surely focusing into those big fish or something that would be giving out results in a short period time rather than they would really be making out some considerations on taking up some focus into its citizens on which they dont even know if these people would really be that paying up their taxes on the moment that they would really be landing with their own jobs and other things that they are getting involved into. This is why they wont really be wasting up those funds to be that putting up focus into its citizens. They will really be surely sticking into those things on which they do know that they could really be able to take advantage with. This is why on the moment that they would really be needing up to choose then it would be understandable with that obvious thing.

It is really just that sad that they would really be focusing into those single point but still not all places or countries wont really be that having that kind of priority in towards into their
citizens on which there are indeed places that do really give out that benefit.

In my country, the situation is completely different. The government gives privileges to very poor people (those on social welfare) but taxes poor people (those not on social welfare). Middle-class is doing well, self-employed people don't pay taxes and the other part has high salaries that are enough to have a normal life. The rich people have a real heaven here because they don't pay taxes, get many benefits from banks, many discounts on lounges, hotels, gyms, swimming pools and etc... Rich people pay 1% tax sometimes, recently the government was considering to offer them tax free money transfer from offshore zones. Life is different everywhere, it's not like government waits for you to get rich, I would say that it's the quite opposite, once you become rich, you have more power and influence and government respects you more.

I agree with you, whether you are rich or poor you must pay taxes, taxes are meant for everyone, not those who have become rich, everybody individual in the country needs to pay their taxes because according to the law, everyone is equal, no any citizen is going to complain that he or she don’t have money and can’t pay taxes because even when the government when to provide for the country it is being provided to both poor and rich people, if it was the rich people that suppose to pay taxes that means the poor people don’t need to complain about the government and when people are talking about government they shouldn’t talk because they don’t use to pay taxes, I don’t know about another people’s country but in my country taxes is being paid by every individual and it is compulsory for everyone.

The tax system for governments says if you are making money from there system, it's a must that you have to give them some % of what you earn, that's what the government does. So, the poor people don't earn from the system, how do you expect the government to tax people who are barely trying to survive and get some food to feed their self and their families, it will be so wicked of the government to tax the poor who don't have basic amenities of the government.

If a government give you in the left, you will surely give them some in their right hand and that's how it has been since democratic system, even before them there were tax from people and those were even worse than now because either you are poor or rich, earn less or more, you will be forced to give money to the government and if you don't, you will be punished but all those are things of the past.

Plot twist, they aren't earning anything. What now? You get a millionaire who has 10m in the bank and he inherited all of it. He leaves his job and spends every day sunbathing, playing golf and driving expensive cars. How will you get him to pay tax if he doesn't have income anymore?
Another situation that comes to my mind. A millionaire hires himself and gives himself a minimum wage. He's the CEO but gets what inexperienced workers get so that he doesn't have to pay any taxes, since you based all of it on income ;)

The government never waits for you to become rich to require you to pay taxes - as long as you are one of the individuals who pay taxes, they will ask you to pay it. The government is too good at taking advantage of its cityzen, isn't it?

So far the government has taken several positive approaches regarding the legality of crypto trading and investment. Their target is to get tax revenue from you - it's already in place so you have to pay tax on your investment and trading profits.

There is some certain country that is not civilized that is why some countries is lacking behind because they don't know the methodology they will apply in order to boost their economy so if a wrong group or people is piloting the affairs of the country it is obvious that that country will be I'm Anarchy in terms of infrastructure and also in economy of that particular country, because that's what we call human development if government have a good leaders who is governing the people with interest of love and peace and unity I think they will be empowerment of human capital that will help to sustain the economy of that country, but currently government does not like to associate or empower people because there are there for their own selfish interest not for the interest of the masses

Government subsidize for the poor people and middle class people pay more taxes than rich people. Here are many businessmans who  do not pay taxes because they they are intelligent people,they only use the money of middle class people which is stored by them in banks. They take debts from the banks on the very small interest rate and then they invested in assets like in property and gold and when Government demand taxe ,they show bankruptcy and they show, they have nothing to pay  because they have to pay debt and government do not take the taxes from debt people.In America, that system is common but in my country ,that is not common because our country is Muslim country and most of our businessmans pay tax .

Yes, as long as there are assets that have to be paid taxes, the government will pursue them, no matter whether you are rich, simple or even poor, what is clear is that they will always pursue taxes.
In my country the government does issue subsidies to the poor, but at the same time they also collect taxes from them. It could be said that they receive subsidies or assistance from the tax money they pay.
However, the problem is when the government cannot manage tax finances well, or they even engage in corrupt practices with tax money. This is one of the things that is still a fundamental problem, where people who only care about themselves are still roaming around.

That is just the bitter truth. Intentionally countries that faces instable economy or standard infrastructures can turn out to human resources it's economy revenue is not sufficient to balance the system.

A lot of countries capitalizes their economy revenues on natural resources but countries that does not have it would diversify to human resources and capital productive by introducing and engaging the masses on different productive factors such as agricultures, creativities, technologies and entrepreneurship.

All these above amenities would really developments, boosten national infrastructures that the masses can be able to pay taxes.

On the contrary of what OP believes, rich people know how to avoid taxes, legally. I am not talking about not reporting your income or anything illegal like that. Rich people avoid taxes through their corporates. Anything they buy will be on the balance sheet of the corporate. The accountant will write lots of income tax off because the corporate won’t be making money on the paper but it is constantly buying assets and growing. That’s exactly how amazon.com became an industry giant. Once you figure out this trick, it is pretty easy to get rich because you will be paying nothing to the government. It is a very big advantage most people don’t have.

I agree with you, we all pay taxes daily, and we may not even realize it. We do, however, pay taxes when we buy items and live in our homes. Do we know why some companies increase the prices of their products? It is because they want to remove the taxes. In my country, even when we were traveling, the driver was required to pay taxes, which were deducted from the amount we paid for transportation. Due to the increase in rates in society, we have gotten used to paying taxes. Taxes are necessary, and we must follow the rules as the world changes. In my country the government is against cryptocurrency and they has removed P2P trading on several exchanges. However, after their point of view, they said that we would be taxed at a rate of 7.5% on each transaction, and we have no choice but to agree with what they said since we need access to those exchanges for our benefit.