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Economy => Economics => Topic started by: Mastercon on May 21, 2025, 08:35:44 AM



Title: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Mastercon on May 21, 2025, 08:35:44 AM
The US keeps printing more and more money to service its debts, and monetises them in bonds. The debt burden is growing at a rate that’s not with the growth in productivity or jobs.

Now because of Trump’s tariffs, the economy is going to slow down even further, prompting the central bank to print even more money for welfare and service its debts, devaluing the currency even more.

That’s not the worst part. Since the US is causing so much economic instability and has proven time and time again that it can’t service its debts sustainably, many countries have been selling US bonds.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: shield132 on May 21, 2025, 10:13:44 AM
The US keeps printing more and more money to service its debts, and monetises them in bonds. The debt burden is growing at a rate that’s not with the growth in productivity or jobs.

Now because of Trump’s tariffs, the economy is going to slow down even further, prompting the central bank to print even more money for welfare and service its debts, devaluing the currency even more.

That’s not the worst part. Since the US is causing so much economic instability and has proven time and time again that it can’t service its debts sustainably, many countries have been selling US bonds.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN

You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset. In my country, trade is done in US dollars and not in local currency, despite the fact that the law forbids trading in anything other than a national currency.
In my country, people save money in US dollars because our currency gets devalued against the US dollar very often and somehow people have trust in it. People here don't buy stocks, don't invest in Bitcoin, they keep US dollars. I wonder how many nations are like this? If people of many other nations have this habit, then it will keep the US dollar strong, it's definitely helping them.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: AVE5 on May 21, 2025, 11:03:17 AM
You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset.

And in sure Donald Trump saw the US economy breaking down in no time soon prompted his agitation for friendly bitcoin regulations and facilities that won't comprise it initiatives of decentralized and as well the potential values of it volatilities.
Which therefore lingering to the Donald Trump signing the executive order for the US to establish on the strategic research of it federal treasures on bitcoin.
And as it's, the crumbling of the fiats has no bond of potential values which has also obliged the other countries to consider reserving it treasures on the crypto market.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Smack That Ace on May 21, 2025, 11:21:19 AM
I wonder how many nations are like this? If people of many other nations have this habit, then it will keep the US dollar strong, it's definitely helping them.

Not only people in countries hold USD but most governments around the world still hold a certain amount of USD in their foreign exchange reserves. According to the latest report, the USD still account for more than 50% of global foreign exchange reserves until 2025. That proves one thing, the US has been extremely successful in advising the world to abandon the gold standard (the most reliable asset) to use their USD, and that is also how they dominate this world.

While I hate US dominance, to be fair, the USD cannot compare to assets like gold or maybe bitcoin in the future but it is still more reliable than many other currencies. Because the United States is still the world's largest economy, by far.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Stella Mese on May 21, 2025, 11:43:09 AM

You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset. In my country, trade is done in US dollars and not in local currency, despite the fact that the law forbids trading in anything other than a national currency.
In my country, people save money in US dollars because our currency gets devalued against the US dollar very often and somehow people have trust in it. People here don't buy stocks, don't invest in Bitcoin, they keep US dollars. I wonder how many nations are like this? If people of many other nations have this habit, then it will keep the US dollar strong, it's definitely helping them.
The US dollar currency is the mainstay of some countries because of their trust which is certainly difficult to leave, because there are many strong reasons behind it, among them many countries that store US dollars or for export and import transactions of goods, most of them use the US dollar because the price is more stable than using their national currency, so with this dependence the US dollar is getting stronger and is considered safe and makes it a better exchange tool.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Uruhara on May 21, 2025, 12:06:33 PM
Although currently confidence in the resilience of the US Dollar, which is even used as a global reserve, is still very strong. But we must also see that the share of the dollar in global foreign exchange reserves is currently starting to experience a fairly clear decline. For example, in 2014 the dollar's share in global foreign exchange reserves was at 65% but then became 57.8% around the end of 2024. And this certainly raises questions about the causes of this decline. Apart from the question of trust, this decline could also be caused by the central bank's diversification into other currencies or perhaps gold. Which means that the dollar's dominance also began to weaken during that period.1

But still for now I personally even prefer holding USD over other currencies if it is for temporary savings. But in the long term all currencies will still be affected by inflation. Not only because supply is unlimited but also because of other things. So gold and bitcoin are still my main choices for the long term. Gold is for value stability and bitcoin is expected to become an investment asset that can grow rapidly in value in the future.


---------------
Reference:
1. https://wolfstreet.com/2025/03/31/status-of-us-dollar-as-global-reserve-currency-central-banks-diversify-into-other-currencies-and-gold/?utm_source=chatgpt.com


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Ishicryptic on May 21, 2025, 01:20:34 PM
The US dollar has always been the mainstream global currency for international trades, it is not a surprise to see people horde the currency in other countries and even spend it in certain places. In this regard anything that happens to the US dollar has a direct influence on the global economy because it is the number one currency for international exchange and reserve. Bitcoin has come to change this naretive, it is everything that any fiat cannot be, decentralized and has a limited supply, therefore an hedge against inflation and no single country has a control over it. I believe that in the future Bitcoin will be used more for international trades than the US dollar that can be hit by inflation. Above all it is a store of value for everybody and any country that hodl it.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: DeathAngel on May 21, 2025, 02:43:51 PM
Yep this is why we park our wealth in Bitcoin. After being in this industry for 10 years, it’s easy to forget how amazing it is to have an asset with a capped supply. There are so many good things about Bitcoin but only 21,000,000 to ever exist (with many of those lost or unaccessible) it is such a special asset. By its very design it will go up in price forever long term. Don’t get caught slipping, buy Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: cabron on May 21, 2025, 03:13:33 PM

Several countries have already dump their bonds though. Still because there is no substitute for USD, its still the most adopted currency even in countries that has their own currency.

Although dedollarization is happening, not all countries will abandon it.  I would still be keeping USD for the purpose that our local currency is dumping faster than it. If all are going down, most probably the local currencies are the first to inflate.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: viljy on May 21, 2025, 03:18:18 PM
The US keeps printing more and more money to service its debts, and monetises them in bonds. The debt burden is growing at a rate that’s not with the growth in productivity or jobs.

Now because of Trump’s tariffs, the economy is going to slow down even further, prompting the central bank to print even more money for welfare and service its debts, devaluing the currency even more.

That’s not the worst part. Since the US is causing so much economic instability and has proven time and time again that it can’t service its debts sustainably, many countries have been selling US bonds.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN


This is too straightforward a scenario. Most likely, the dollar will lose its value very slowly, and in any case it will remain as one of the currencies. Because if the dollar collapses, then all currencies will collapse, regardless of what different countries have in reserves there.

It's not that simple with Bitcoin either. There are already very large bitcoin holders. The question arises, why should they (private individuals, in fact) have bitcoin, and not conditional Brazil? Why should these people (the conditional Winklevoss brothers) be richer than an entire nation? It's worth thinking about it that way.

For universal acceptance, official recognition at the country level is needed. As a speculative asset, as it is now, bitcoin will of course continue to be ubiquitous. But it is unlikely to be able to replace the dollar. The dollar will replace something else, it is not yet known what it might be.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Ruttoshi on May 21, 2025, 03:52:51 PM
Due to debasement of the US dollar overtime, it's not wise to keep your funds in US dollars because it's fiat and fiat depreciates overtime due to inflation. This is why I am happy that bitcoin is a currency and an asset which you safe you funds from inflation when you throw some value into it.

I only have bitcoin and my local fiat for my daily spending. My future investment is in bitcoin. I only convert bitcoin to dollar when I am trading.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Ucy on May 21, 2025, 04:21:28 PM
The US economy isn't going to slow down, atleast relative to other countries economies, but the dollar will be weakened, not necessarily due to BRICS. It will be weakened along with other national currencies, will however fare better than them.
The unlimited and inflationary printing of currency is not peculiar to USD alone, it's a general fiat currencies problem. This is part of the main reasons they will keep getting devalued, but the USD won't be as bad as them. It will remain the reserve currency.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: slapper on May 22, 2025, 01:04:35 PM
There’s a ton of frustration and anxiety around watching a government print itself deeper into debt while regular people everywhere get told to just “trust the system”. And a lot of folks (especially outside the US) are already feeling, even if the headlines aren’t saying it yet. But I think it’s worth adding some nuance to how this endgame could really play out. The idea that everyone dumps US Treasuries in one big panic and instantly moves to Bitcoin is a powerful narrative, but reality is usually a lot messier, and a lot more global

What gets less attention is that trust doesn’t vanish all at once. It gets chipped away, bit by bit, until people, companies, and countries start hedging their bets in creative ways. Bitcoin and gold get the headlines, but there’s also more interest in local projects, barter, stablecoins, even weird new stuff in some regions

And if the dollar did collapse overnight? A bunch of national currencies and economies would have their own crises. But the world isn’t going to “collapse” in sync. People adapt. We’ve seen this with Argentina, Turkey, Lebanon, even parts of Europe during the euro crisis. Folks shift to whatever works, sometimes that’s USD, sometimes BTC, sometimes even rice or SIM cards


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Fortify on May 22, 2025, 01:27:54 PM
The US keeps printing more and more money to service its debts, and monetises them in bonds. The debt burden is growing at a rate that’s not with the growth in productivity or jobs.

Now because of Trump’s tariffs, the economy is going to slow down even further, prompting the central bank to print even more money for welfare and service its debts, devaluing the currency even more.

That’s not the worst part. Since the US is causing so much economic instability and has proven time and time again that it can’t service its debts sustainably, many countries have been selling US bonds.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN


It's true - the dollar is getting weaker and weaker, but this is actually a tactic that some countries use in order to increase their exports as it allows other countries to buy more. China tried to do this, but that was more of a tactical plan - the Trump approach is more likely to be misjudged fallout from his poor economic policies. The bond market is a good indicator of the strength and trust in certain countries, right now US issued debt is having to pay a lot higher rates because that trust has crumbled. Other countries don't want to buy American debt with such a reckless and wild leader in charge. The sort of leader that has no qualms bankrupting his country, either by accident or on purpose, which would wipe out all assets.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Swordsoffreedom on May 22, 2025, 02:07:48 PM
But it is unlikely to be able to replace the dollar. The dollar will replace something else, it is not yet known what it might be.

Indeed, even if the US dollar collapses, bitcoin will never be able to replace it. Because the government would never let that happen,  they would never let a currency they don't control dominate them.

It's true that bitcoin has a lot of potential, but I feel like people are being too delusional and hyping bitcoin when they think it will replace the USD or the current monetary system . It can be said that the US dollar is losing value over time because the US prints them indiscriminately but let's not forget that they have been doing so for over 100 years and still dominate the world. Their dominance may collapse due to competition from other economies but they will not collapse just because of a decentralized currency ,  we should stop being delusional.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: justinlamode on May 22, 2025, 04:16:50 PM
Due to debasement of the US dollar overtime, it's not wise to keep your funds in US dollars because it's fiat and fiat depreciates overtime due to inflation. This is why I am happy that bitcoin is a currency and an asset which you safe you funds from inflation when you throw some value into it.

I only have bitcoin and my local fiat for my daily spending. My future investment is in bitcoin. I only convert bitcoin to dollar when I am trading.
As long as the fed have the power to print as much dollar as they will, the US dollar will continue to experience inflation. Bitcoin is really a game changer as it gives us the opportunity to escape the inflation that is prevalent with fiat currencies. Bitcoin have just exposed the inflation in the dollar, something we never knew existed. Prior to this time, we have been using the USD to escape inflation in my country but the coming of Bitcoin just make this better and much more interesting.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: pooya87 on May 23, 2025, 11:49:09 AM
That's the nature of all Ponzi schemes, they pay the victims until the day they catastrophically collapse. US economy and its fiat have been a Ponzi scheme for a long time now and the chances of its collapse are increasing every day.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat,
Hopefully BRICS countries release their currency and make it backed by something (gold, oil, gas, etc.) and break the cycle of non-stop fiat printing...


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Lida93 on May 23, 2025, 12:37:49 PM
You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset. In my country, trade is done in US dollars and not in local currency, despite the fact that the law forbids trading in anything other than a national currency.
In my country, people save money in US dollars because our currency gets devalued against the US dollar very often and somehow people have trust in it. People here don't buy stocks, don't invest in Bitcoin, they keep US dollars. I wonder how many nations are like this? If people of many other nations have this habit, then it will keep the US dollar strong, it's definitely helping them.
When your government still uses the USD as reserve currency what do expect the citizens to do?
You won't blame them, for their ignorance is fed by the government lies on national TV's about how the US dollar is still as strong as whenever.  Whereas some persons are still conservative with their mindset on innovations like bitcoin when looking at where to hedge their funds away from their local currency depreciation and with how the USD has been the traditional means of valuation to their local currency they seem to trust it without questioning it current status quo.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: coupable on May 23, 2025, 05:39:57 PM
The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN

Bitcoin may be part of the solution, but it certainly isn't the solution. Bitcoin cannot replace the dollar because they have different characteristics and functions, in addition to the limited number of bitcoins, which makes it more of a store of value than a widely traded currency.

Today, after this long history with the dollar, I am increasingly convinced that our crisis with the dollar is not its poor performance or the disasters it causes, but rather that we cannot get rid of it. The Bretton Woods Agreement made it a tool of power in the hands of America, whose influence has grown stronger and expanded through the dollar, whose issuance and distribution it controls. This massive power has turned weaker economies into American quasi-colonies, as they lack national sovereignty and can't issue any decisions that affect the dollar's central authority, as this would undermine America's interests. America would not allow this, even if it meant destroying any country entirely if it considered adopting policies that were inconsistent with its interests.

Personally, I don't know what the solution could be, but at the same time I know that it is not easy to get rid of the dollar and that we are all stuck with the dollar.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: el kaka22 on May 23, 2025, 08:15:23 PM
While OP is right about the fact that this is unsustainable, since there is no alternative, nobody really has any other way but accept things as they are. World loves to say capitalism (liberal way of living) is the best one, but then complain about it, and they bash communism (rightfully so) as opponent.

But the reality is, Norway, Finland, Sweden, all figured out and lived amazing 40 years, if that was possible (they are not as good as they used to be today) then we should ALL do what they did during that 40 years, if possible. It's combination of taxes and help being balanced, you let rich be rich, but also help poor not be that poor, and when you find that perfect balance, then it helps your nation to be the best one out there.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Smartprofit on May 25, 2025, 11:10:11 AM
The economic and financial situation in the US is very bad, but it must be admitted that in other countries (the European Union, China, Russia, etc.) things are even worse.

After all, the US is still a great power that creates 25 percent of the world's gross domestic product (previously - 50 percent of the world's gross domestic product). The US is still technology, democracy, a good demographic situation and a strong army.

Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.

Yes, indeed, the US dollar is starting to lose its position in the world, but this process is gradual, not avalanche-like. I think that the US government will manage to reform the modern financial system before the final catastrophe occurs. At the same time, in my opinion, Bitcoin will continue to rise in price.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: LDL on May 25, 2025, 12:37:11 PM
The supply of a country's local currency is generally unlimited and this causes inflation in a country. If for some reason the country's reserves become short, the government tries to fill the shortfall by increasing the supply of money, resulting in a more widespread increase in inflation in the country. Well, the Bitcoin supply is 21 million, which means that it is not possible to increase the supply of Bitcoin in any way, which is why Bitcoin inflation is never possible. For this reason, many scholars have said that Bitcoin will be the regulator of the future world and that people will choose Bitcoin as an alternative to money.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: takuma sato on May 25, 2025, 02:23:38 PM
The main point of fiat currencies are obviously the fact that they can be printed on demand. If the supply of fiat was not elastic, then governments couldn't be able to fund their programs through issuing bonds, which the bond market then buys in hopes that the yield % is higher than the expected inflation. The problem is when the expected inflation % is higher than the current yield. Example: US10Y debt is being dumped because the expected inflation from tariffs and other unknowns (or knowns, such as the history of QE of the FED) are pushing the yield higher, so the yield needs to be high enough that it looks attractive to investors. 5% is not attractive for investors on the US30Y and 4.5% on the US10Y. So debt is being dumped in hopes of higher yields, or in hopes that the inflation expectation goes lower again. Since governments just like to eventually print itself out of problems, that is why BTC thesis remains bullish.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: AVE5 on May 25, 2025, 02:24:50 PM
The supply of a country's local currency is generally unlimited and this causes inflation in a country. If for some reason the country's reserves become short, the government tries to fill the shortfall by increasing the supply of money, resulting in a more widespread increase in inflation in the country. Well, the Bitcoin supply is 21 million, which means that it is not possible to increase the supply of Bitcoin in any way, which is why Bitcoin inflation is never possible. For this reason, many scholars have said that Bitcoin will be the regulator of the future world and that people will choose Bitcoin as an alternative to money.

To be emphatic, inflation or devaluing of fiats isn't only focused on the USD nor just the US economy but rather every other countries. But at the US economy is being tackled in a global discord like this is because of the regulatory and economy global supply power of the US which most countries also holds their national treasures tied with the US treasure bonds.
So since the fiats isn't backed with physical values and re he fact it won't have a limited supply due to it commodity factors to manage the economy and as the economy might be faced with geopolitical sentiments, the fiats number of supplies will be unlimited so it could serve it steer the elastic economy.
So  it's vulnerable to be manipulated on inflation if not in a short term maybe somewhere in the future just like the USD which had sometimes posed values of treasures.
Bitcoin will remain a hedge against inflation because of it limited supplies and it decentralization of which the world rest of the world has always hope for the day to be free from US economy regulatory policies.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: philipma1957 on May 25, 2025, 03:24:10 PM
The US keeps printing more and more money to service its debts, and monetises them in bonds. The debt burden is growing at a rate that’s not with the growth in productivity or jobs.

Now because of Trump’s tariffs, the economy is going to slow down even further, prompting the central bank to print even more money for welfare and service its debts, devaluing the currency even more.

That’s not the worst part. Since the US is causing so much economic instability and has proven time and time again that it can’t service its debts sustainably, many countries have been selling US bonds.

The endgame for the dollar is not the BRICS or whatever other stupid fiat, it’s when everyone loses trust in the whole “printing money to growth the economy” mindset and sells their US bonds because they finally realise the debt is worthless and the US won’t be able pay it.


That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN


Good luck with this idea.

Trump is in to default the usa bonds.

Everything points to intentionally crashing the dollar by the trumpeter.

Ie this is a deliberate act by the USA and we will get to see it happen.

I have zero idea that btc will save the day.

Since

Trump
Putin
JiPing
Jong Un

Maybe all declare the death penalty for holding it once the USD is dead.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: shinratensei_ on May 26, 2025, 02:44:58 AM
I've switched to bitcoin for my remaining fiat when I see the US 10 year note bond yield isn't going down.
At the same time I also want to grow my capital faster so bitcoin is like the best choice there is.

But I don't think those nightmare scenario will happen, the world have no alternative but to use USD for international trades.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: viljy on May 26, 2025, 06:39:48 AM
The economic and financial situation in the US is very bad, but it must be admitted that in other countries (the European Union, China, Russia, etc.) things are even worse.

After all, the US is still a great power that creates 25 percent of the world's gross domestic product (previously - 50 percent of the world's gross domestic product). The US is still technology, democracy, a good demographic situation and a strong army.

Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.

Yes, indeed, the US dollar is starting to lose its position in the world, but this process is gradual, not avalanche-like. I think that the US government will manage to reform the modern financial system before the final catastrophe occurs. At the same time, in my opinion, Bitcoin will continue to rise in price.

Do you know what the structure of the GDP of the United States is? 80% of these are services, not a real product. Moreover, even consultations and other small things are recorded in the services, that is, it's all air. So the real GDP is not like that at all. At the same time, the United States consumes about 40% of global GDP, meaning in real terms it consumes more than it produces. How does this happen? Very simple. The difference is provided by the main industry of the United States, the "production" of dollars.

By the way, what are Trump's tariff wars? This is a look at the same situation, but from a different angle. Trump believes that the United States is overpaying for the import of goods with too many of these "dollars out of thin air," or in other words, the debt is growing too fast.

In fact, if we consider the United States as a factory, then they moved the production facilities to China, and left the factory management (administration) in the United States. And they called this factory administration a post-industrial society. But such a society cannot exist without products from factory workshops. And then Trump appears and says that the salary for the factory workers is too high, because the factory administration already owes the workers too much (the national debt is 36 trillion) and it is necessary to reduce salaries (introduce tariffs). Naturally, nothing happened, because the factory administration does not produce anything, and it will simply die without workers' products, because it is impossible to eat office papers or even just dollars.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: summonerrk on May 26, 2025, 11:53:28 AM
When I watched the documentary about Nixon untying the dollar from gold in 1971, I just couldn't believe it could happen so easily. He literally made a statement on TV and in the press after France decided to exchange a bunch of its dollars for gold, and England followed suit. It's so funny to see that in the world, the fates of such decisions were not made by some world council, but simply the United States took all the decisions personally.
And the skill of diplomats decided the fate of nations and currencies, I mean that a little more and gold could have been tied not to the dollar, but to the pound. But the British sent a scientist, not a politician.
Amazing diplomacy, and how ordinary words and skills of people lay the foundation for the future.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Smartprofit on May 26, 2025, 03:07:50 PM
The economic and financial situation in the US is very bad, but it must be admitted that in other countries (the European Union, China, Russia, etc.) things are even worse.

After all, the US is still a great power that creates 25 percent of the world's gross domestic product (previously - 50 percent of the world's gross domestic product). The US is still technology, democracy, a good demographic situation and a strong army.

Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.

Yes, indeed, the US dollar is starting to lose its position in the world, but this process is gradual, not avalanche-like. I think that the US government will manage to reform the modern financial system before the final catastrophe occurs. At the same time, in my opinion, Bitcoin will continue to rise in price.

Do you know what the structure of the GDP of the United States is? 80% of these are services, not a real product. Moreover, even consultations and other small things are recorded in the services, that is, it's all air. So the real GDP is not like that at all. At the same time, the United States consumes about 40% of global GDP, meaning in real terms it consumes more than it produces. How does this happen? Very simple. The difference is provided by the main industry of the United States, the "production" of dollars.

By the way, what are Trump's tariff wars? This is a look at the same situation, but from a different angle. Trump believes that the United States is overpaying for the import of goods with too many of these "dollars out of thin air," or in other words, the debt is growing too fast.

In fact, if we consider the United States as a factory, then they moved the production facilities to China, and left the factory management (administration) in the United States. And they called this factory administration a post-industrial society. But such a society cannot exist without products from factory workshops. And then Trump appears and says that the salary for the factory workers is too high, because the factory administration already owes the workers too much (the national debt is 36 trillion) and it is necessary to reduce salaries (introduce tariffs). Naturally, nothing happened, because the factory administration does not produce anything, and it will simply die without workers' products, because it is impossible to eat office papers or even just dollars.

Donald Trump has many reasons to worry. And it’s not just the huge foreign national debt of the United States.

In the conditions of a potential war with China (and such a scenario is quite probable), the US government cannot allow the production of strategic goods to be located outside the territory of the United States. Moreover, the US government cannot allow such production to be located on the territory of a potential enemy.

The US, as a state, in my opinion, is not only a management center for the world’s factory for the production of goods. The US also has production, the US has universities, the US has engineers, the US has skilled workers.

In the US also has the ability to attract new skilled engineers, scientists and workers from other countries. And if America does this on a systematic basis, then I have no doubt that they will succeed.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: justdimin on May 26, 2025, 06:08:22 PM
Do you know what the structure of the GDP of the United States is? 80% of these are services, not a real product. Moreover, even consultations and other small things are recorded in the services, that is, it's all air. So the real GDP is not like that at all. At the same time, the United States consumes about 40% of global GDP, meaning in real terms it consumes more than it produces. How does this happen? Very simple. The difference is provided by the main industry of the United States, the "production" of dollars.

By the way, what are Trump's tariff wars? This is a look at the same situation, but from a different angle. Trump believes that the United States is overpaying for the import of goods with too many of these "dollars out of thin air," or in other words, the debt is growing too fast.
Tariffs are just a way to make sure that other nations do not get this much money from Americans, meaning take money out of USA. So when he puts tariffs in, he is saying "if you are going to sell your product here and take money out of USA, you better pay a big tax so that we keep some of it", and not like the people are keeping some of it, you are not buying a 100 dollar product from China, and then keep 25 of it to yourself and would be paying 75 bucks, no, that is not the case.

What is happening is that if the company stays with the same, then they are selling a 100 dollar product, you are still paying 100 dollars for the same product, but this time USA is getting the 25 dollars of it, without doing anything at all, the government is the one who takes it. Of course, this is bad for other nations, and this is bad for Americans too, only good for government of USA.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: EL MOHA on May 26, 2025, 09:06:22 PM
Bitcoin may be part of the solution, but it certainly isn't the solution. Bitcoin cannot replace the dollar because they have different characteristics and functions, in addition to the limited number of bitcoins, which makes it more of a store of value than a widely traded currency.

Personally, I don't know what the solution could be, but at the same time I know that it is not easy to get rid of the dollar and that we are all stuck with the dollar.

Yes it has always been said that bitcoin cannot replaced the fiat currency but can only act as an alternative currency to it, even though I think there was some exergeration by the OP about the fall of dollars but we can’t simply ignore the fact that it’s power is definitely going down most especially with the economy crisis they have which might lead them to inflation and with the pressure of the BRICs forming its own central currency, it wouldn’t take dollar off the top like that but will definitely affect it.

Where do I see bitcoin coming, I think with bitcoin ever growing adoption and with it’s already proven capability of been a good store of value many who have actually held dollar as their only reserve currency might consider diversification into bitcoin and then use other fiats like BRICs central currency for some trades. This is the solution I fathom will happen in future


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: viljy on May 27, 2025, 04:40:44 AM
Donald Trump has many reasons to worry. And it’s not just the huge foreign national debt of the United States.

In the conditions of a potential war with China (and such a scenario is quite probable), the US government cannot allow the production of strategic goods to be located outside the territory of the United States. Moreover, the US government cannot allow such production to be located on the territory of a potential enemy.

The US, as a state, in my opinion, is not only a management center for the world’s factory for the production of goods. The US also has production, the US has universities, the US has engineers, the US has skilled workers.

In the US also has the ability to attract new skilled engineers, scientists and workers from other countries. And if America does this on a systematic basis, then I have no doubt that they will succeed.

Yesterday I saw a fragment of Trump's speech on this topic. He said he didn't want to manufacture rags like T-shirts and socks in the United States. He wants tanks, AI, chips, something big to be made in the United States. Which is already similar to the USSR, which also did not want to sew rags, but wanted to make tanks and grandly turn rivers from north to the south, as a result, the thirst for rags destroyed this country. Of course, this is just an analogy, but a country with lopsided development, even if it is AI, becomes vulnerable.

Tariffs are just a way to make sure that other nations do not get this much money from Americans, meaning take money out of USA. So when he puts tariffs in, he is saying "if you are going to sell your product here and take money out of USA, you better pay a big tax so that we keep some of it", and not like the people are keeping some of it, you are not buying a 100 dollar product from China, and then keep 25 of it to yourself and would be paying 75 bucks, no, that is not the case.

What is happening is that if the company stays with the same, then they are selling a 100 dollar product, you are still paying 100 dollars for the same product, but this time USA is getting the 25 dollars of it, without doing anything at all, the government is the one who takes it. Of course, this is bad for other nations, and this is bad for Americans too, only good for government of USA.

In practice, it is not China that will pay this money, but consumers in the United States. It's just that the product will be sold for 125 dollars instead of 100. The tariff would work if there was an alternative to Chinese goods. But there is simply no alternative.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Unknown Op on May 27, 2025, 11:29:03 AM
The economic and financial situation in the US is very bad, but it must be admitted that in other countries (the European Union, China, Russia, etc.) things are even worse.

After all, the US is still a great power that creates 25 percent of the world's gross domestic product (previously - 50 percent of the world's gross domestic product). The US is still technology, democracy, a good demographic situation and a strong army.

Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.

Yes, indeed, the US dollar is starting to lose its position in the world, but this process is gradual, not avalanche-like. I think that the US government will manage to reform the modern financial system before the final catastrophe occurs. At the same time, in my opinion, Bitcoin will continue to rise in price.
There should be limited supply of USD for the global economy because if there will be more supply of dollars or unlimited supply then there will be inflation rate in the USA which will be bad for American people. Trump should contracts with the countries by watching the benefits of public but there should be no loss of public but print more money is bad for USA economy and for the global economy because the persons who have money in the form of dollars their dollar price will go down and he will become poor and less people will hold dollars.Dollar was best currency in the past but now that is not as famous as cryptocurrency because cryptocurrency is working like brand and millions of investors have easy life due to cryptocurrency.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: davis196 on May 27, 2025, 11:38:25 AM
Quote
That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

OP, aren't you contradicting yourself. You say that many countries would get rid of their USD reserves and US government bonds, but at the same time, you say that the countries with USD reserves would collapse. That doesn't make much sense, if you ask me.
The US economy crashing would most likely cause a global economic crisis, but I'm not sure that this global crisis would happen the same way the Great Depression occurred back in the 30s. Maybe the process of dedollarization would reduce the global influence of the US economy and financial system, making all the other big economic powers more resilient to external shocks. The collapse of the US dollar would cause a small global recession for a year or two, which could be followed by a fast global economic recovery.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Minor Miner on May 27, 2025, 02:34:28 PM


Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.


According to data from SIFMA, the US Treasury bond market is huge and is considered the most liquid market in the financial market, fluctuating between 500-700 billion per day. So it would be incorrect to say that if Japan or China dumped US Treasuries in the market, there would not be enough liquidity or no buyers.

Not to mention, other countries hold bonds because they believe in the US economy, so even if the market is not liquid enough, the Fed will immediately intervene to stabilize the market. Because if there is a lack of liquidity or a lack of buyers, or the US will not want to buy back either. There is no reason for the world to trust them anymore, so I bet the US will never let that happen. 


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: coupable on May 27, 2025, 03:27:05 PM
Bitcoin may be part of the solution, but it certainly isn't the solution. Bitcoin cannot replace the dollar because they have different characteristics and functions, in addition to the limited number of bitcoins, which makes it more of a store of value than a widely traded currency.

Personally, I don't know what the solution could be, but at the same time I know that it is not easy to get rid of the dollar and that we are all stuck with the dollar.

Yes it has always been said that bitcoin cannot replaced the fiat currency but can only act as an alternative currency to it, even though I think there was some exergeration by the OP about the fall of dollars but we can’t simply ignore the fact that it’s power is definitely going down most especially with the economy crisis they have which might lead them to inflation and with the pressure of the BRICs forming its own central currency, it wouldn’t take dollar off the top like that but will definitely affect it.

Where do I see bitcoin coming, I think with bitcoin ever growing adoption and with it’s already proven capability of been a good store of value many who have actually held dollar as their only reserve currency might consider diversification into bitcoin and then use other fiats like BRICs central currency for some trades. This is the solution I fathom will happen in future
I also don't believe BRICS countries will succeed in creating a unified currency, given that it has been proven that they cannot adopt any of their local currencies as an alternative to dollar. The euro experiment in Europe also failed, exacerbating economic crises at the expense of others. The only logical solution is to adopt a new store of value, given that the United States holds the largest quantities of gold in its reserves and will not allow its use, which would pose a threat to the dollar and thus to its global power and influence. Bitcoin currently offers a good alternative to gold, and therefore I expect that with the increasing adoption of Bitcoin, its price will become more stable, and it will be possible to create a currency backed by Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: philipma1957 on May 27, 2025, 05:57:18 PM
The economic and financial situation in the US is very bad, but it must be admitted that in other countries (the European Union, China, Russia, etc.) things are even worse.

After all, the US is still a great power that creates 25 percent of the world's gross domestic product (previously - 50 percent of the world's gross domestic product). The US is still technology, democracy, a good demographic situation and a strong army.

Regarding US treasury bonds (treasuries) - countries like China have a lot of them. But in practice, they cannot sell them quickly, since it is simply impossible to find buyers for such a large volume of bonds.

Yes, indeed, the US dollar is starting to lose its position in the world, but this process is gradual, not avalanche-like. I think that the US government will manage to reform the modern financial system before the final catastrophe occurs. At the same time, in my opinion, Bitcoin will continue to rise in price.

Do you know what the structure of the GDP of the United States is? 80% of these are services, not a real product. Moreover, even consultations and other small things are recorded in the services, that is, it's all air. So the real GDP is not like that at all. At the same time, the United States consumes about 40% of global GDP, meaning in real terms it consumes more than it produces. How does this happen? Very simple. The difference is provided by the main industry of the United States, the "production" of dollars.

By the way, what are Trump's tariff wars? This is a look at the same situation, but from a different angle. Trump believes that the United States is overpaying for the import of goods with too many of these "dollars out of thin air," or in other words, the debt is growing too fast.

In fact, if we consider the United States as a factory, then they moved the production facilities to China, and left the factory management (administration) in the United States. And they called this factory administration a post-industrial society. But such a society cannot exist without products from factory workshops. And then Trump appears and says that the salary for the factory workers is too high, because the factory administration already owes the workers too much (the national debt is 36 trillion) and it is necessary to reduce salaries (introduce tariffs). Naturally, nothing happened, because the factory administration does not produce anything, and it will simply die without workers' products, because it is impossible to eat office papers or even just dollars.

Okay and every Apple piece of gear is produced by the USA just not in the USA.

This fucks up accounting and measurements bigly

I picked apple as it is the most obvious one.

Oh what  percent of gear runs android?
and what percent runs Microsoft.

One can argue android is a service
One can argue windows is a service


but they are closer to a renewable fuel that the gear needs to run.

also toss in mac iOS

whats left linux

yes we could switch to linux but it would be a mess until the switch happened..

The world setup is complex.

Trumps biggest issue is he wants to simplify it to "merica" wins rest of the world loses



Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Richbased on May 27, 2025, 07:10:20 PM

You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset.

The reason why some people still trust the dollar more is just because United States is the world power, if they are dethroned the dollar will become worthless but why do people still thinks that the dollars will come back stronger again when the world is getting fed up of this Fiat currency called the dollars. Now that countries are trying to embrace bitcoin as a strategic reserved asset, the dollar sure will lose its value the more.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: shield132 on May 28, 2025, 10:53:17 AM

You know what's funny? The fact that many people still buy US dollars and think that it's the safest asset.

The reason why some people still trust the dollar more is just because United States is the world power, if they are dethroned the dollar will become worthless but why do people still thinks that the dollars will come back stronger again when the world is getting fed up of this Fiat currency called the dollars. Now that countries are trying to embrace bitcoin as a strategic reserved asset, the dollar sure will lose its value the more.
I believe that people have illusions about the current state of the world. Many people think that the USA is a powerful country that controls the whole world and everything goes exactly according to their plans. There is another part of people who think that we should learn Chinese because soon China will take over the world. Then there is a group of people who think that Russia will rule the world and etc...

In my country, people invest in US dollars because they look at exchange rate and haven't heard anything about inflation. When they see that one day 1 USD costs 2.73 Gel and the next day it costs 2.75 gel, then 2.77 gel, they think that US dollar is getting stronger and by investing it, they are not only beating inflation but get profit. They don't understand that besides the inflation of national currency, the US dollar is also experiencing inflation and that's why everything is becoming so expensive.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: mindrust on May 28, 2025, 12:37:14 PM
That’s inevitable for every fiat currency out there. If I had to take this one step further, i’d say that’s the only purpose of the fiat currencies. They simply exist to expand. If the central banks don’t print more, the system will collapse. Call it a scam, theft, call it whatever you want but that’s the harsh reality we have been living in since the 1970’s when Nixon removed the gold-dollar peg.

Why did he do it? Not because he wanted to. Frankly, he didn’t have a choice. When your opponents cheat and rip you off by printing money, you don’t have a choice but to follow their example.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: jaberwock on May 28, 2025, 06:08:42 PM
OP, aren't you contradicting yourself. You say that many countries would get rid of their USD reserves and US government bonds, but at the same time, you say that the countries with USD reserves would collapse. That doesn't make much sense, if you ask me.
The US economy crashing would most likely cause a global economic crisis, but I'm not sure that this global crisis would happen the same way the Great Depression occurred back in the 30s. Maybe the process of dedollarization would reduce the global influence of the US economy and financial system, making all the other big economic powers more resilient to external shocks. The collapse of the US dollar would cause a small global recession for a year or two, which could be followed by a fast global economic recovery.
While I do disagree with his assessment. I assume he is saying "nations are getting rid of their USD investments because the ones who doesn't will crash", which makes sense. Both statements are true to each other, if you think USD will crash, then you sell it and get out, and the ones how don't will have trouble.

I do disagree with it though, while I believe USD doing terribly, their luck is that others are doing even worse, which means USD could crash even more, and it would still be best currency, only because others are doing a terrible job. If we keep investing into USA bonds and so forth, then we are going to see, it will do better than almost all nations. You need to realize USD is strong compared to others, not compared to its old self.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Ever-young on May 28, 2025, 07:20:44 PM
That’s when the US dollar collapses and all the countries with dollars in their reserves also collapse. It will be total Armageddon and the worst economic crisis.

That is when everyone realises THE ONLY WAY IS BITCOIN
For countries they need to fix what ever they are doing and stop depending on the US dollar as reserve some are already gradually moving their reserve and reliance off the dollar which is good but saying bitcoin is the only safe zone that won’t be accomplished with the limit supply that Bitcoin have and lot of countries who might want to depend on it, if it’s for individuals stacking to escape inflation Bitcoin is the perfect solution, but for countries thru should look for better alternative to strength their economy individual and not to allow it being controlled by the country which currency they put so much value on yet the country manage to over print and increase its supply which in turn contributes to devaluing it.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: shinratensei_ on May 29, 2025, 05:46:16 AM
This is exactly the reason why the market are so bullish with risky assets including bitcoin.
It seems people want to get rid of inflationary things and want to save their wealth somewhere else and bitcoin is one of the option to hedge.

Although I also wonder when will the money printing and m2 supply will stop climbing up.
At some point I'm sure it will stop, but people are already so deep into the hedge against inflation.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: viljy on May 29, 2025, 05:54:58 AM
Do you know what the structure of the GDP of the United States is? 80% of these are services, not a real product. Moreover, even consultations and other small things are recorded in the services, that is, it's all air. So the real GDP is not like that at all. At the same time, the United States consumes about 40% of global GDP, meaning in real terms it consumes more than it produces. How does this happen? Very simple. The difference is provided by the main industry of the United States, the "production" of dollars.

By the way, what are Trump's tariff wars? This is a look at the same situation, but from a different angle. Trump believes that the United States is overpaying for the import of goods with too many of these "dollars out of thin air," or in other words, the debt is growing too fast.

In fact, if we consider the United States as a factory, then they moved the production facilities to China, and left the factory management (administration) in the United States. And they called this factory administration a post-industrial society. But such a society cannot exist without products from factory workshops. And then Trump appears and says that the salary for the factory workers is too high, because the factory administration already owes the workers too much (the national debt is 36 trillion) and it is necessary to reduce salaries (introduce tariffs). Naturally, nothing happened, because the factory administration does not produce anything, and it will simply die without workers' products, because it is impossible to eat office papers or even just dollars.

Okay and every Apple piece of gear is produced by the USA just not in the USA.

This fucks up accounting and measurements bigly

I picked apple as it is the most obvious one.

Oh what  percent of gear runs android?
and what percent runs Microsoft.

One can argue android is a service
One can argue windows is a service


but they are closer to a renewable fuel that the gear needs to run.

also toss in mac iOS

whats left linux

yes we could switch to linux but it would be a mess until the switch happened..

The world setup is complex.

Trumps biggest issue is he wants to simplify it to "merica" wins rest of the world loses



Yes, you're right, that's the problem. When I gave the example of a "factory" and an "administration," I was referring to the production of relatively simple consumer goods that could technically be returned to the United States within a reasonable time. However, high-tech manufacturing, such as Apple, cannot be moved to the United States within a reasonable time frame.

The production culture has been created for 20 years, and includes not only production lines, but also trained personnel and engineers. There are no such trained personnel in the United States, and the cost of training, and then the salary level, not to mention the duration of staff training, will make the cost of production very high.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Mate2237 on May 30, 2025, 09:37:04 PM
The effects of the trade war is definitely going to have a negative effects on the u.s economy which will lead to the dollar losing it value on the global market so trump should look for immediate and long term plans to absorb the effect of the trade war because it's going to be having a very bad effect on the economic stability of the united states of America



In this current world we are that is becoming highly unstable with a bitting inflation rate all over the world America is not doing herself any good by proceeding with this unfortunate trade war which to me is also having it negative effects on the United States of America economy


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: Yokkattannee on May 31, 2025, 12:29:31 AM
The effects of the trade war is definitely going to have a negative effects on the u.s economy which will lead to the dollar losing it value on the global market so trump should look for immediate and long term plans to absorb the effect of the trade war because it's going to be having a very bad effect on the economic stability of the united states of America



In this current world we are that is becoming highly unstable with a bitting inflation rate all over the world America is not doing herself any good by proceeding with this unfortunate trade war which to me is also having it negative effects on the United States of America economy
with this trade war it can cause many sectors to be hampered especially the global economy and its effects that will occur, and the US economy is also not free from its impact including trade tariffs that trigger supply chains that will make it difficult for business people. and the dollar will also lose its value slowly especially when investors lose interest in the dollar when economic growth slows down. because export or import transactions use the dollar currency and that can be the trigger.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: pooya87 on June 01, 2025, 05:04:18 AM
Trump is in to default the usa bonds.
If they do default, then it would be the end of dollar and the end of USA.

The problem with living on printing trillions of dollars every season out of thin air creating debt, is that it creates addiction. They can't just magically give up such a large amount of liquidity overnight.

If they default, they won't be able to print anymore, with dollar crashing and burning and budget deficit going through the roof, you'd be lucky to see hyperinflation because it would cause ultrahyperinflation. Meaning in the morning you could fill your gas tank with $500 and by noon it would cost $5000 and by tomorrow it would be $50000. By the end of the month half the population that are already armed to teeth would have had killed each other.


Title: Re: Non-limited US dollar supply
Post by: doomloop on June 02, 2025, 08:55:34 PM
That’s inevitable for every fiat currency out there. If I had to take this one step further, i’d say that’s the only purpose of the fiat currencies. They simply exist to expand. If the central banks don’t print more, the system will collapse. Call it a scam, theft, call it whatever you want but that’s the harsh reality we have been living in since the 1970’s when Nixon removed the gold-dollar peg.

Why did he do it? Not because he wanted to. Frankly, he didn’t have a choice. When your opponents cheat and rip you off by printing money, you don’t have a choice but to follow their example.
Which is why people are saying that we need to find an alternative to it ; bitcoin. If we end up with a mistake, then are we just suppose to keep doing the same mistake again? We should be trying to fix it right?

If you one day mistakenly wear your left shoe on your right foot and right shoe on your left foot, would you continue to do that for 50 years? Of course not, you would take it out once you realize it's a mistake, and wear it properly. But for some reason, we made this mistake, in every nation I think, and we kept going. Which means, this "mistake" benefits some people, when it should. Who does it benefit? People who want to grow their companies marketcap, but can't if we do not print more, so the rich are benefiting from this mistake.