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Other => Beginners & Help => Topic started by: btcjoin14 on September 04, 2014, 12:45:48 AM



Title: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: btcjoin14 on September 04, 2014, 12:45:48 AM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: MicroGuy on September 04, 2014, 12:59:38 AM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

 I think Satoshi pulled a random number from his derriere.  :D


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: Slark on September 04, 2014, 01:03:11 AM
I always wondered this myself. Why 21? Is creator of bitcoin fond of blackjack or something? This number has some hidden meaning or it is pure random... I guess we will never know for sure unless someone will found a source.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: knight22 on September 04, 2014, 01:09:14 AM
It is just an arbitrary number. The point is to set a limit.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: DannyHamilton on September 04, 2014, 01:09:29 AM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

Because that's how the mathematics worked out.

More specifically, it isn't 21 million.  It's actually 20999999.9769.  It's just easier for everyone to remember and say "There will never be more than 21 million created" than is is to say, "The maximum that could potentially have been created is twenty million nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred ninety-nine and nine thousand seven hundred sixty-nine ten-thousandths".

What Satoshi actually did was choose a reasonable sounding number 50 and decide that the block reward would be 50 bitcoins per block for the first 210,000 blocks.  Then he decided that in order to have a fixed quantity, but not have a sudden drop off, the block reward would be cut in half every 210,000 blocks.  If you do this cutting in half and adding up all the blocks (rounding down to the nearest satoshi value every time), you'll find that the exact amount of bitcoins that are created by the time the 6,930,000 the block is created is 20999999.9769


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: iluvbitcoins on September 04, 2014, 03:48:36 PM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

Because that's how the mathematics worked out.

More specifically, it isn't 21 million.  It's actually 20999999.9769.  It's just easier for everyone to remember and say "There will never be more than 21 million created" than is is to say, "The maximum that could potentially have been created is twenty million nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred ninety-nine and nine thousand seven hundred sixty-nine ten-thousandths".

What Satoshi actually did was choose a reasonable sounding number 50 and decide that the block reward would be 50 bitcoins per block for the first 210,000 blocks.  Then he decided that in order to have a fixed quantity, but not have a sudden drop off, the block reward would be cut in half every 210,000 blocks.  If you do this cutting in half and adding up all the blocks (rounding down to the nearest satoshi value every time), you'll find that the exact amount of bitcoins that are created by the time the 6,930,000 the block is created is 20999999.9769

every 210 000 blocks the reward is halved

and there is a total of 21 million coins

it has to have a meaning


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: amaclin on September 04, 2014, 04:17:00 PM
Quote
every 210 000 blocks the reward is halved

and there is a total of 21 million coins

it has to have a meaning

21 is half of 42
42 is Answer to the Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe, and Everything


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: DannyHamilton on September 04, 2014, 04:23:02 PM
every 210 000 blocks the reward is halved

- snip -

it has to have a meaning

Block difficulty is adjusted so that blocks occur on average every 10 minutes.

10 minutes X 210,000 blocks = 2,100,000 minutes.

2,100,000 minutes / 1,440 minutes per day = 1458.333 days.

1458.3333 days / 365.242 days per year = 3.99 years.

It looks to me like he started by deciding that the block reward would be cut in half every 4 years, and then calculated that out to discover it would be 210,379.392 blocks.  Then he probably just rounded off to 210,000.

As far as I can tell, the unexplained magic constants in the bitcoin protocol are:

  • Starting subsidy of 5,000,000,000 integer units
  • A Bitcoin defined as 100,000,000 integer units
  • Subsidy reduced by bit shift (essentially divide by 2 and round down to nearest integer unit)
  • Subsidy reduced every 4 years, rounded to be exactly 210,000 blocks
  • Difficulty adjusted every 2 weeks (2016 blocks)
  • Difficulty adjusted for average 10 minutes per block

I see a lot of numbers in there, but not many 21s.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: hyperdimension on September 04, 2014, 06:46:25 PM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

Because that's how the mathematics worked out.

More specifically, it isn't 21 million.  It's actually 20999999.9769.  It's just easier for everyone to remember and say "There will never be more than 21 million created" than is is to say, "The maximum that could potentially have been created is twenty million nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred ninety-nine and nine thousand seven hundred sixty-nine ten-thousandths".

What Satoshi actually did was choose a reasonable sounding number 50 and decide that the block reward would be 50 bitcoins per block for the first 210,000 blocks.  Then he decided that in order to have a fixed quantity, but not have a sudden drop off, the block reward would be cut in half every 210,000 blocks.  If you do this cutting in half and adding up all the blocks (rounding down to the nearest satoshi value every time), you'll find that the exact amount of bitcoins that are created by the time the 6,930,000 the block is created is 20999999.9769

Very interesting, I didnt know about how it wasn't 21 million exactly.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: Scoremaster on September 04, 2014, 06:53:42 PM
21 million because it pays to be rich! lol idk but honestly....

it is because 21 million has a significant number, the legal drinking age in most states of U.S.A. Satoshi is also my uncle.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: MightyBTC on September 04, 2014, 07:03:37 PM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?
Only the God knows why.If it were unlimited then may be it wouldn't have got any value.Mysteries is what this world is full of


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: Ayers on September 04, 2014, 07:07:18 PM
arbitrary number i guess, or maybe he started from the block value, so why 50?


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: iluvbitcoins on September 04, 2014, 08:21:36 PM
21 million because it pays to be rich! lol idk but honestly....

it is because 21 million has a significant number, the legal drinking age in most states of U.S.A. Satoshi is also my uncle.

well, 21 is one of the perfect numbers

Quote
The 21 chapters of the Gospel of saint John, totaling 879 verses.

The 21 attributes of the Wisdom. (Ws 7,22-23)

Number of chapters of the book of Judges in the Old Testament.

During 21 days the Prince of the kingdom of Persia (protective angel of the enemy nations) resisted to the Michael Archangel as well as to the angel of the prophet Daniel. (Dn 10,13)

Jacob worked three times seven years to keep the herds of his uncle Laban to obtain two wives and two maidservant, who were used to him also as concubines as it was the habit to the period. (Gn 29,15-30)

this is also interesting

Quote
For Claude of Saint-Martin, "the number 21 is the number of destruction or rather of universal termination, because, as 2 is separated from 1, it is necessary that it has a means of to unite there if it wants it. This number shows at the same time the command of the production of things and their end, as well in the spiritual one as in the corporal one."

Quote
Represent the harmony of the creation.

Source
http://www.ridingthebeast.com/numbers/nu21.php


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: Foxpup on September 05, 2014, 06:47:57 AM
There's also the fact that 21 million is within an order of magnitude of the maximum number (67,108,863.99999999) that can be precisely represented to 8 decimal places in double-precision floating-point format. That's probably not a coincidence.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: urumchi on September 05, 2014, 01:46:03 PM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

Some people look for conspiracy theories behind every simple thing.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: ihuntbtc on September 06, 2014, 12:45:15 PM
Isn't it a completely arbitrary number?  ::)


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: oceans on September 06, 2014, 01:10:39 PM
This is something that always had me wondering, why was it 21? If I didn't know for sure or had not seen replies in this thread I would be certain that the reason was just a random number he chose. Never heard of any conspiracy theories myself however I agree there is always someone making a conspiracy theory out of something.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: dodgecharger on September 06, 2014, 04:14:15 PM
6 blocks per hour
* 24 hours per day
* 365 days per year
* 4 years per cycle
= 210,240
~= 210,000
Sum all the block reward sizes:

50 + 25 + 12.5 + 6.25 + 3.125 + ... = 100
Multiply the two:

210,000 * 100 = 21 million

 :)


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: kodeon.CEO on September 06, 2014, 11:39:20 PM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

I think it's difficult to say since no one here actually created Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: jaberwock on September 07, 2014, 12:44:45 AM
Because it had to  some number.

Why you shirt is black/white/wharever color, and why it is 12:42:26 when I made this post?

Is there any hidden stuff about these facts?


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: nextblast on September 07, 2014, 09:23:55 AM
because there are totally 210000  tons of gold on earth
100BTC == 1 ton of gold  :D :D :D


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: Wealthy on September 07, 2014, 09:41:34 AM
May be Nokamoto created or thought of bitcoin while he was 21 years old.That's is unknown mystery


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: btcjoin14 on September 07, 2014, 10:25:23 AM
Why was 21 million the number of bitcoins to be created?

Because that's how the mathematics worked out.

More specifically, it isn't 21 million.  It's actually 20999999.9769.  It's just easier for everyone to remember and say "There will never be more than 21 million created" than is is to say, "The maximum that could potentially have been created is twenty million nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred ninety-nine and nine thousand seven hundred sixty-nine ten-thousandths".

What Satoshi actually did was choose a reasonable sounding number 50 and decide that the block reward would be 50 bitcoins per block for the first 210,000 blocks.  Then he decided that in order to have a fixed quantity, but not have a sudden drop off, the block reward would be cut in half every 210,000 blocks.  If you do this cutting in half and adding up all the blocks (rounding down to the nearest satoshi value every time), you'll find that the exact amount of bitcoins that are created by the time the 6,930,000 the block is created is 20999999.9769

thanks a lot, DannyHamilton


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: btcjoin14 on September 07, 2014, 10:42:51 AM
because there are totally 210000  tons of gold on earth
100BTC == 1 ton of gold  :D :D :D

:D nice ,BTC is digital golden !!!


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: panju1 on September 07, 2014, 10:52:06 AM
If the number of coins was any different, would bitcoin have been less popular/more problematic?
I guess not!


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: DhaniBoy on September 07, 2014, 12:19:31 PM
if true 21 million BTC is now circulating in the world, then maybe the BTC will be the number one crypto currencies in the world, because a lot of the wear BTC, it could have an impact on the exchange rate of BTC which will further increase, hopefully this will soon happen ...  ::)


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: nextblast on September 07, 2014, 12:40:09 PM
because there are totally 210000  tons of gold on earth
100BTC == 1 ton of gold  :D :D :D

:D nice ,BTC is digital golden !!!
Yeah, BTC is the new gold.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: BeginToMine on September 07, 2014, 01:05:55 PM
Maybe it is more simple that you would like it to be. It is just a good number of 21 and million is just because many had atleast 1 BTC :)


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: panju1 on September 07, 2014, 03:08:36 PM
because there are totally 210000  tons of gold on earth
100BTC == 1 ton of gold  :D :D :D

:D nice ,BTC is digital golden !!!

BTC is probably digital gold 2.0  :)


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: silvestar on September 07, 2014, 03:30:39 PM
6 blocks per hour
* 24 hours per day
* 365 days per year
* 4 years per cycle
= 210,240
~= 210,000
Sum all the block reward sizes:

50 + 25 + 12.5 + 6.25 + 3.125 + ... = 100
Multiply the two:

210,000 * 100 = 21 million

 :)


True, but as Danny mentioned, the choices of these "magic constants" are still unexplained.
Why was the block time set at 10 minutes not 5? Why was the block reward set at 50 btc not 100? etc.


Title: Re: Why was 21 million ?
Post by: minerpumpkin on September 07, 2014, 05:24:43 PM
Yeah it's effectively an amount that Satoshi deemed appropriate. He had to consider block-halving times and thus the slow fading-out of block rewards for miners, in transition to transaction fees that 'pay' the miners.