Bitcoin Forum

I'd like to invest with Bitcoin Savings & Trust, but it's apparently pretty difficult to get an account and you can't get the best interest rate without risking tons of BTC. PPT is alright, but, as Meni Rosenfeld pointed out, the "insurance" is mostly meaningless and only makes figuring out the risk/reward more difficult.

I'd like to see a GLBSE asset like this:
- Each share represents 1 BTC invested in BS&T and gets weekly dividend payments equal to whatever BS&T pays minus a small fee for the owner of the asset.
- Every week at some predetermined time, the asset owner creates enough new shares to fill all bids of 1 BTC or more.

Anyone with a BS&T account want to do this?

+1

So then ignore the insurance.  Bid 1.1 and you'll get 1.28 in 28 days.  That's ~18% a month.  Is that not a fair return?

edit:  And the insurance isn't meaningless.  It means you'll get .32 btc back for your 1.1 if pirate defaults.  Using your scheme, you'd get nothing.

If i'm understanding correctly, he is talking about a higher return (similar to a pirate account) that is completely uninsured (more risk). In this way the acount holder transfers more (all) risk to bondholders while taking a smaller fee off the top than PPT does. I think it's a great idea.

I was thinking that it'd be reasonable for someone with a 7% BS&T account to pay 6.5% to the asset and keep the remaining amount. It doesn't cost much to run an asset like this, so even higher payout percentages are possible.

If you're going to do this, why even put it on GLBSE?  Just make a forum posting offering to deposit in the btcst account.  People send the btc straight to account holder and they forward to pirate.  This avoids the GLBSE fees and reduces the number of steps needed.   In fact, there's already a bunch of these.  If the argument is that there can be bidding, then go ppt.x. ;)

GLBSE makes it much easier to keep track of depositors and make payments.

Awesome!

You mean like this?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=60405.0
</shameless_plug>

Idea to plan in 10 minutes, nice :D

No.  this is completely uninsured.

I'd do it with 7% uninsured for the first month and 6.5% thereafter if I can get at least 500 BTC that are unavailable for withdrawal for the first month.  Any takers?

i'd pay out 6.9% per week every month :D

minimum deposit: 10 btc.

Meh, I'll be on your level soon enough... stupid tiered interest.

I just setup shop at 6.75% per week.  Weekly payments.

Well, theymos, you just managed to start at least three new operations in about 45 minutes.

I don't think pirate's a scammer by any means, but the growing impact any catastrophe that might befall him or BS&T would have on the network is starting to scare me.

Heh, maybe I should have tried harder to get a BS&T account so I could have run this myself. :)


I do tend to think it's a Ponzi scheme, so I view it as a form of gambling. Hopefully no one else is gambling more than they can afford to lose.

Me too. I just put in with payb.tc, and hedged it a little on betsofbitcoin. I also dumped my PPT shares... oops.

Well I guess it's a free market, but of 1?  

I guess 0.5% is OK, but then why not 0.1%, OR do you really want to sell some shares in GLBSE? How about 7.1%/wk?


I understand Theymos is respected and a good Admin for the Forum, but if his 'likability' translates into his wishes being turned into reality then it isn't a 'FreeMarket'.

However, it is a good thing. I just wished the market would have forced it to happen.


Testing... Testing...     Goat how about 7.5%/wk?  

Why would someone payout more than pirate for a pirate pass through?

Wouldn't that be obvious?  He would quickly become #1. The #1 man. The goto guy.   :)

But lets assume Goat can make 8% on his funds, he offers 7.5% to steal the market share and become 'influential'.

There are tons of reasons.  Cereal companies compete with themselves.

But what I was doing: Was 'Testing' whether 'one' guy could swing the rates. :)

#1 of handing out more than you take in isn't much of an accomplishment.

Also, why would we assume 8% when the highest rate publicly known is 7%?

Goat's already pretty influential. I don' think he'd run an investment at a loss to him just for kudos.

Please, please no.

Okay, I'll jump on the bandwagon. Here's my offer:

My account is very old - within a day of the first public BS&T offer. I'm under the limit for the full interest. I'll accept co-deposits for no fee for the first 1700 BTC. You'll get exactly the same rate I get in interest.

So, currently 4.2% until I get 300 BTC, then 5.6 % until I get 1700 BTC and then we all get 7%. All I get out of these deposits in increased interest on my holding. No insurance. If pirate defaults, you lose and I lose.

Minimum term 1 month. Minimum deposit 20 BTC. Interest paid weekly. After I get the first 1700 BTC, I'll pay out 6.75% on further deposits.

Lowest tier interest rate is 4.2%, not 4.1%, unless Pirate's thread information isn't correct. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=50822.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=50822.0))

Yep. That's correct. It was a genuine typo, not a hidden fee. I'll update my post.

I'd love to see one of the 6.75% offers on GLBSE, as it makes it easier to see if dividends are paid out in time... if nobody does it, I'll do it but I'd need one or more partners that have accounts at pirateat40 (I don't, and I most likely never will invest more than play money there) and guarantee me to deposit any amount of BTC I give to them there as well as paying out any amount of deposited BTC asap on my request (asap = within 1-2 business days or so, I have a life too...).

PM sent.

Will try after I build up my balance some more...

had to cash out some btc.

theymos,

Is my offer (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=83590.new#new) close enough to what you had in mind? I'm doing the second point by proxy. Market makers can arbitrage to meet buy side demand.

I ended up making ~50 BTC on TYGRR.BOND-P, which I'm pretty happy about. I sold long before the default. Thanks for creating it!