Bitcoin Forum

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Speculation is the wrong place to speculate? :P
I would have to say that most are Bulls with short term Bearish outlook. Like myself. When we went up into the stratosphere, I knew it wouldn't last, so I prepared for shorting. I've had a Bearish bias since the 1163 top because that kind of blow-off inevitably ends in a long correction like we have seen since. This is all normal behavior of financial markets and you live a little less depressed when you aren't watching your wealth go down the shitter for an entire year.

You are soooooooooo right!

Is ever-growing blockchain problem solved?
Is ever-increasing electricity consumption problem solved?
Is ever-concentrating mining power problem solved?

Sorry, but you seem to forgot <sarcasm> tag.

Big banks and the government worry me. But the fact that bitcoin has made it this far in a few short years is remarkable, hard to imagine where it could be in 10years+. Glad I'm here now for better or worse

Right, this is why competitors like Ripple become more and more popular. Being a distributed but centralized solution Ripple is still not far from Bitcoin on the Decentralization axis.

Having problems that make BTC intrinsically (by design) not viable long term is an opportunity?  ???

But some of the problems are intrinsic to how BTC and the Blockchain work (for example the reliance on Proof-of-Work which needs the system to constantly and forever pay the miners with either big inflation or higher transaction fees, among many others), and for some of them we don't even have an idea on how to solve them yet...


Why adopt NOW something that is CURRENTLY broken/doesn't really have a plan for the long term?

Oh, yet another zealot. Your previous reply made me think that I had met an open-minded person...

Sorry, but you seem to forgot <troll> tag.

There are wonderful things about it and there are problems that may impact scalability. People are uncertain whether those problems will be resolved which = risk. Risk makes the price go down short-term, but risk is also where profits can emanate from (if you are right and most others are wrong, you win extra). The same as any market. So, the problems are, indeed, an opportunity. They, however, may also be the undoing. Remains to be seen whether solutions are commercially viable or, if as Wanderer mentioned, people move on to something that doesn't have those problems (albeit may have a different basket of problems unto itself). We'll see. All views are viable on that matter. To say that you are crazy for being bearish though is to say that there is no profit opportunity at all -- by definition if you have rewards without risk then you've found an arbitrage opportunity and those don't tend to linger around very long.

So, a whole bunch of we'll see. Probably a binary outcome -- really good or replaced.

While I normally enjoy trolling this section, I'll give you a serious response:

Its not ready for prime time.
Pointing to the Wiki and going "SEE? THEY KNOW ABOUT THESE PROBLEMS THEREFORE ITS NOT A PROBLEM" is something I see too many people do. (i.e. My water main is cracked and leaking, but I know about it therefore there's no problem). You need to get things implemented, tested, and actually running first such as invertible bloom tables. Scalability is also a major issue, 7TPS isn't going to cut it, and raising the block size limit isn't a real long term fix, Gavin himself has said such. Solutions are coming, but they need to be implemented first before you can start crowing about "oh well its not a problem". Time will tell if these get solved in a reliable manner. Changes to Bitcoin come very slowly, which isn't a bad thing. I'm not saying its broken either, but it does need improvements.

The government(s) will never let it interfere with them on a national/global level.
People seem to think that "the government can't ban Bitcoin!". Technically, you'd be correct. However If the government bans Bitcoin, it will be relegated to the shadows. No more Bitpay/Coinbase, and you can bet places like Microsoft will drop it quickly. Wall Street won't go near it either and the Winklevoss ETF is out of the question. Its main use would then be for private personal money transfers and storage. It may still retain a high price, but it won't be used nearly as much as it would due to lack of accepting merchants. There are a LOT of businesses using Coinbase or BitPay to process their BTC transactions, and if it was suddenly illegal for them to operate, a lot of these places would no longer accept Bitcoin. ISPs will most likely try and comply with the new government ban by blocking Bitcoind traffic on the default port, much in the same way they send you nasty letters if you torrent certain items.  This isn't just targeted at the US government, many others could do it too.

People are stupid. A lot of them should never "be their own bank"
I'm going to skip over the laundry list of "OH GOD LOST MY BITCOINS" threads on this forum and Reddit because we both know how plentiful they are. A lot of people don't want the responsibility of being in charge of all of their money like some here. People also aren't going to trust putting things like $50,000 worth of money somewhere you could lose it all because someone formats your hard drive. Perhaps a Bitcoin Insurance would change this, sort of like how the FDIC works for fiat.

Consumer Incentives
As been mentioned before, as a consumer I currently see no reason to use BTC over my credit card. I get cash back and buyer protection. Why would I buy BTC at a premium via LocalBitcoins, or pay fees via CoinBase? I'm introducing more middle men and fees that I don't need. There needs to be a service which allows consumers to use BTC in the same way a credit card works.

Government won't have a choice. They didn't do too well stopping the Internet did they. Fast forward to file sharing, BitTorrent is still alive and well. People were stupid before email too but they quickly learned how to use it. No consumer incentives? How about no fees!?

You say bitcoin isn't ready for prime time but I'm in the middle of watching the Bitcoin Bowl on ESPN  ::)

Redhawk is on ignore

Oh boy, not another goofball supporting corporate proprietary bullshit. Long live mega corporations! Am I right?  LOL

And where is it? https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size



Absolutely not an issue? Why do you then make an excuse in the next statement?



It's quite naive to think that some of the slices are not controlled by the same entity.



99% of my posts is trolling, I use <notroll> in the opposite cases.

Ok, I get this. For the note, I own 0 (zero) XRP.

No, of course. I don't support such bullshit.

Not sure where to even start with this.

When did the Government try to stop the internet? Maybe you're referring to mass filtering? Bittorrent isn't used by major businesses to connect with their consumers. If the Government declares Bitcoin illegal no business in their right mind is going to publicly be like "yea fuck u govt we're still accepting it anyway"

Bitcoin can only handle 7TPS but with a straight face you're going to say its totally ready for prime time and mass use because OMG BITCOIN BOWL? Thats ridiculous.

NO FEES - What whitepaper did you read? I'm pretty sure you skipped over the whole part about miner fees keeping the network alive down the road, fees which will rise. Do I need to use a fee on my transaction? No, but if I want it to confirm in a reasonable time frame I'm pretty much forced to. Not going to sit around PC Richards for 9 hours for my $500 transaction to confirm because I didn't want to send it with any fees.

Don't know exactly for first two problems, but it seems 3rd one is not a problem anymore and it won't be ever. Just look at the pie chart now. No pool is even close to 50%. BTW, for many miners out there, electricity is not a factor.

Do you mean that 3 pools at 33% each is not centralization?

What planet have you come from?

Everybody here is a bull in the wrong run. It makes sense to be a short time bear when the value is going down to make profits.

$1200 to $300, being a bear means 4 times profit.

True. Good luck continuing that trend!

Good morning inca.  Seems to be working rhus far :-\

http://s21.postimg.org/v5uii5vmb/Capture.jpghttp://s10.postimg.org/5s93j6k0p/Untitled_1.gif

Such innuendos add a lot of credibility to your posts!

Electricity for mining is not a problem. By design. Each miner makes his own individual calculations about it and then makes a decision that will make money or cost him. Non-miners don't even need to know how it works (and, indeed, most won't when we eventually hit mass adoption). Non-issue.

Had a hard time picking which post of yours to quote.  Settled on this one.  I, for one, officially like you Mr. Chow.  We may be similarly aged as well.  Some of the younger members may have not heard of schoolhouse rock.

Conspiracy thought:  this forum, which is perhaps the intersection of all bitcoin enthusiasts, is also the perfect place to deploy subversives if you are a manipulative or power-seeking entity or person.  A greater number of obedient subversives means we are onto something!

yes, it  is. But not in bitcoin. The centralisation is inforced by the inflation.

Inflation = centralisation

i do believe bitcoin is also longterm going nowhere because of the inflation-mistake
Would it not have been inflationcoin it would have decentral network and miners race wouldn't have been so strong and price more stable and we would still be in the  goldrush-times and much more adoption.

Well, people hang on to bitcoin because first mover and no understanding of the outlined above.


blockchain size is worked on serveral solutions while the bitcoiners want sidechains and bloat the thing even more (wrong direction developement some alts make the correct developement there).

Now ripple even comes close in marketcap. I don't know if bitcoin will make  it but am sure some other coin(s) will.

I think bitcoin was a good start but now that it is going down: crypto should not die because bitcoin can't hold value (by design)

It's time to be honest with ourselves and  admit: bitcoin reward schedule fucks it up completely.



yes, it is broken. Next panicsell is final nail in the coffin.

Yeah yeah yeah. What inflation problem? Bitcoin has exponentially decreasing inflation.

The reason you are here bashing bitcoin is because you want to buy some.

That.  Bitcoiners think Satoshi is a magical being who could do no wrong, sorta like Kim Jong-un to North Koreans.  He made educated guesses, most good, some not so much.  Bitcoin was an experiment, still in beta now.  Thanks for bringing some problems to light & furthering knowledge, beta testers, but it's time to move on :-\

@inca:  the ~14%/year inflation problem, the one that's tanking the price now.  If you wish to use a more common definition of inflation, i.e. price inflation, then the number is way over 100% :)

How do you know this?

Another scenario exists. It is possible that they really do not like bitcoin. That being the case, the logical decision would be to walk away. But a certain class of people do not like seeing others succeed, especially at something they decided to throw away. So they are here, urging the downfall on, instead of doing something useful with their life. Emotion over reason, and largely subconscious.

With Gox, Willy and Markus gone, there's nothing left to fuel another delusional and unsustainable bubble. We're just witnessing the correction back to single digits, where Bitcoin belongs, since that's the natural value of a currency whose only real utility lies in its use as a medium of exchange on the deep web -- by a few thousand child pornographers and drug addicts. Amateur speculators can't drive the price back to the moon again when whales, early adopters, miners, developers and other bag holders are dumping en masse. Tough luck for the cultists and bulltards.

A year from now, Bitcoin will be sub 50.

Lol, that class of people sure came to the right place--hasn't been any success here for over a year :D

.... or maybe bitcoin really has a problem and those people are here to warn you about it with no bad intention because they are actually here (like yourself) to invest in a crypto that should go up, you know?

Most people on here have no idea what they are talking about because they have no historical perspective. For example they were not around when the price went from $266 to $50 in April 2013.

A few of your recent posts:


The only real question is why you expect anyone to listen to your poor attempts to smear the bitcoin price down. Certainly the predictive power of your posts is somewhere between poor and absolutely fucking terrible.

Explain the problem(s) then. It's all code. There is nothing ambiguous about it. Lay it all out.

The one strange trick that nobody wants you to know is that we have been through it all before. Many times. The verdict has been in for a long while now and they are wrong.

Buy Buy Buy   :-*  :-*  :-*

Those people don't say much. They just wait.

Some of those quotes were posted prior to my disillusionment with Bitcoin. I was still cultish, delusional and permabullish back then. (I don't know why you find such joy in digging through my post history, but whatever floats your boat, I guess.) Other quotes weren't totally spot on, but most of them were generally correct. I.e.: I saw the general trend, even if I might have missed the exact price on an exact date. I could've started digging through your post history as well, but I'm not gonna bother.

Merry Christmas and a happy new year to you and all other cultists and non-cultists.

for me the answer is very simple. You can't compare BTC with DOW index! DOW index can't disapper.
I really hope that btc will rise, and i can wait for 5 years, no problem: but, tell me, can you be sure that in 5 years BTC will be still alive or better, >350$?