Bitcoin Forum

A steady coin could be of benefit as the fluctuations could or can be a problem, but what's to stop people paying more or less for these fiat-pegged coins?

no they can't replace it because the Bitshare stuff is trust based so not good to sink large amounts of money into it.

-traders and speculators will not use it if it's not volatile and that's currently 80% to 90% of the money in bitcoin

- the high volatility comes from the high inflation.

Decentralised low inflation coins (with reduced volatility) which are trustless stand a chance to get a shot imo - not the bitshares-crap though.

Both BitUSD and Nubits use highly complex systems to keep the price roughly in line with their fiat equivalent(s). The peg usually isn't exact, but it's close enough. I don't know how it works and trying to understand it gives me a headache but I suspect there is some degree of centralization going on behind the scenes.

What aspect of bitshares do you feel requires too much trust? The market pegged assets like bitUSD don't require trust to trade (no counterparty risk) like an IOU asset, just trust in the feed producers (delegates) that they aren't colluding to manipulate the feeds. Because of the difficulty in getting an active delegate position and the fact that shareholders can vote out malicious or colluding delegates if their actions are made public, I don't see this as an issue. It is also a best practice to have each delegate run by individuals / companies instead of one user in control of multiple delegates.


From what I understand about NuBits, they have custodian users maintaining buy and sell walls at $1 to keep a NuBit at that price. They use a variable interest rate to incentivize holders to "park" their NuBits and earn interest.

bitUSD and other market pegged assets on the other hand only require 2 voluntary traders willing to take opposite positions (long and short) on the bitshares internal market, the collateral of which is held by the blockchain itself. More reading for those that are interested how it actually works:

http://bytemaster.bitshares.org/article/2014/12/18/What-are-BitShares-Market-Pegged-Assets/


Edit: to answer the OPs question, I think that stable assets will find a home alongside volatile assets like BTC and BTS for their utility, but we must not forget that assets tracking the value of a currency that is strong today will also fall with that currency in the future when it collapses. So stable assets have good use in the short to medium term but in the long term a fixed supply cryptocurrency will probably be ideal (after the volatility settles down) for a global and manipulation resistant currency. BM just wrote up a good post talking about that issue: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org/article/2015/01/01/How-to-create-a-stable-decentralized-crypto-currency/

The crappy thing about it is that in order for it to become less centralized, Bytemaster and I3 have to divest. And with their amount of holdings, it will depress the price for long time.

They are constantly divesting because they're actually living partially off their delegate salaries.

When declaring a coin "centralized" it only really makes sense to compare it to other systems. The entire dev team of bitshares still holds a smaller proportion of BTS than satoshi holds of bitcoin. Compared to bitcoin, NXT, ripple, and pretty every other major system, bitshares has the best distribution.

...

Since the network security is based on stake voting for block producers and vote participation is about 16%, it is hugely centralized around Bytemaster. This is why if you are nice to Bytemaster and PM him to vote you in as a delegate, you will all of a sudden be a delegate.

...

I doubt it, BitUSD only has $10195 volume today and that's probably because it's priced at $1.04 when it should only be $1.

Both BitUSD and Nubits use highly complex systems to keep the price roughly in line with their fiat equivalent(s). The peg usually isn't exact, but it's close enough. I don't know how it works and trying to understand it gives me a headache but I suspect there is some degree of centralization going on behind the scenes.

NuBits volume is 750k, 2nd in all crypto today.

false statement

i think Bitshares bubble can pop any day now.

https://i.imgur.com/KjpNDqo.png

False what now?

didn't see that ... because the whole CMC is SPAMMED with the bitshares crap. Every hobo-coin spamms CMC ... it's just a contest who can spam CMC better  ::)

A coin that needs to take up 20 slots on Coinmarketcap with artificially created marketcaps and no backing or liquidity is not to be taken serious. I think Bitshares is a joke. They can't even ann here because they need to control the conversation. It's such an old fart.
Coins that can't ann here can't be taken serious because they obviously fear open discussion.

All bitshares did was drop you off here and that's about it...

should be time for a thread "what's wrong with Bitshares"

My friend, what are you even talking about? You know NuBits has nothing to do with BitShares right?

if i would care enough maybe i would know that. Stuff dumps before i can research it in detail - so i just wait and see what doesn't dump after 6 months ... makes life easier...

if i went looking for connections between the two i am sure i would find more than one.

Nope, made by completely different people. If anything they are competitors and you would be interested in the Nu network since you hate Bitshares so much or whatever. But a little research does sound like a good idea for you.

i'm not interested in pegged coins and also not interested in overly complicated pegged coins because pegging isn't even possible - not in free market

ok, so it's competitor. Neither of them is interesting to me... I'll buy real dollar or real euro not some experimental shitcoin. I let others betatest with their money ...

I'm interested in trustless and decentral coins aswell as a free market so your complicated toycoins are really not interesting to me.

I don't think I'm going to be able to leave this conversation without calling you an idiot. You've made it pretty clear you don't  know what you're talking about.

 Bitcoin has >$1 million of selling pressure a day in new coins coming from miners.

 the more utility BTC gains and the more purchases are made the more selling pressure is created.

that's correct but your conclusion isn't






wrong - only coins that were bought can be sold - it's a zero sum game. You're telling myths.




"So the higher in price and the more popular Bitcoin becomes the less it is able to sustain itself as selling pressure from the miners and retailers grows proportionally."

correct - only from miners though ... that's why you switch to low inflation coin not pegged shitcoin with no advantage

low inflation alts are the answer actually.

Nobody wants 'pegged' coins - not even merchants because that shit isn't even tested for anything. Nobody accepts bitUSD - i know i wouldn't take it in a trade.

i agree: selling coins to a merchant is equivalent to selling a coin on the market

i don't agree merchants would hold BitUSD before they would hold the real USD - why would they? It's only more risk for them.

i agree: selling coins to a merchant is equivalent to selling a coin on the market

i don't agree merchants would hold BitUSD before they would hold the real USD - why would they? It's only more risk for them.

Bitshares isn't interesting after how protoshares and lottoshares dumped.
These guys' coins can dump on you any moment - we have seen that in the past. They lost credibility. I don't want to hold these coins - especially not longterm.

litecoin inflation is high, so is bitcoin inflation - but buying Bitshares isn't a thing that's a real alternative to it - it's gonna dump almost certainly ... this week or next month - not a difference. It's going to dump sooner or later - end of story. Not good to put money into.

When it dumps, it dumps hard. These guys coins always dump extra-hard because when they do they fail. Bitcoin/Litecoin dumps but not that hard.

From an average joe's point of view, something like Nubits is safer and could be reliable. I personally think that Nubits and Nu system has to prove that it can work. I have no doubts about the NU system but its needs to prove to everyone it can be pegged to the dollar 1:1 reliably. Once the Nu system reputation has been established, this does have value to the average person. I could see NuBits used as a mainstream currency like the dollar/euro, but replace Bitcoin, no. However on the flipside, I can't see Bitcoin being adopted as a mainstream currency because of the volatility involved.    

I've heard from a bitshares core dev that the shapeshift API will be integrated directly in the official bitshares full node possibly as early as next week, and will also be included in the light wallet (still in beta). This is huge for both bitcoin and bitshares!

This means that you can now use BitShares as a decentralized hedged bitcoin wallet. You can receive bitcoins from an exchange or from your friends, and hold it in bitUSD, and then send it out again to a bitpay integrated merchant, or lighthouse, or a bitcoin debit card or wherever else you want. All done exactly the same way as you send bitcoins normally using normal bitcoin addresses, except that while you hold the bitcoins they are hedged against volatility so if you send in 100 USD worth of bitcoin you will be able to send out 100 USD worth of bitcoin as well at any point in the future. All this is done without counterparty risk, you hold your own private keys at all times, and you need zero AML, zero anti-terrorism anal probes, and there's no way your money can be seized or frozen - just like bitcoin was always meant to be.

It's this kind of feature that is going to make bitcoin go mainstream. If anyone can hold and use bitcoins without having to worry about volatility we will begin to see an increasing amount of people shifting their money into crypto. As bitcoin is the onramp and offramp for all cryptocurrency, and is the payment rails on which cryptocurrency will be spent, the more money that goes into crypto as a whole the more bitcoin benefits. Bitcoin is already the most convenient way to spend your money in the whole world, with the addition of decentralized volatility hedging by consumers there's no reason why all commerce shouldn't go through the bitcoin network. BitUSD itself will never be a threat to bitcoin as a payments system. No merchant is ever going to accept BitUSD since it's so much easier to accept bitcoin since it has all the infrastructure and enables you to accept bitUSD as well, so bitcoin and bitUSD will never have to compete, but can instead grow side by side.

This makes bitcoin more valuable. It means you can buy bitcoin and then never need to touch fiat again. It's like making fiat exchanges more secure by turning their exchangeUSD/exchangeCNY/exchangeGOLD etc a cryptocurrency secured by a blockchain. Here, bitshares is the exchange. By pairing up with an altcoin bitcoin can stay decentralised with no need for any centralised locking services.