Bitcoin Forum

Some people may already be aware that AT has been launched on a mainnet (via the Burst altcoin - http://www.theuknews.com/index.php/nav/newsr/5228) providing Turing complete "smart contracts" including the world's first decentralised Lottery (which is already running).

Whilst CIYAM Developers have *zero* VC funding nor any IPO funds we have however managed to create our "smart contracts" implementation and see it through to launching on a mainnet in a relatively short space of time (no easy feat)

It has been noted that the fact that currently ATs have to be written in an "assembly" language makes them not easy to develop but at the same time it should be noted that we are looking into using LLVM in order to allow ATs to be written in C or C++.

The Ethereum project have not only decided to not use any well known high level language (they have created their own) but they are also now forking a web browser (something that we have no plan to do as we think most people are simply not going to want to change their browser).

Also AT has been designed from the start to work on multiple blockchains (i.e. relatively easy to integrate with any alt and will get easier as we progress) and we plan to be able to demonstrate an "atomic cross-chain transfer" within the next month.

It is a "David vs. Goliath" issue that we face but we feel that providing a system that supports major existing high level programming languages and all main browsers and allowing all blockchains to join in is perhaps something that might be more appealing to the devs in this field compared to the Ethereum approach.

AT documentation can be found here: http://ciyam.org/at (and yes it is rather technical)

Your comments are welcome.

/begin rant

I think it's interesting that in the us gov, at very high levels, including the treasury, we have a bunch of former goldmansachs employees.

They are " former" employees.

Then when their gov term is up they often get rehired. This known as the revolving door. It is this revolving door that has blurred the lines between golmansachs and the us treasury, they might as well be one and the same.

Etherium has 2 "former" goldmansachs employees. "Former" employees, until they get rehired.

Who the fuck are they fooling? Maybe a 20 year old vitalik?


/End rant..

Good job CIYAM very impressive.

We have a very simple policy - we don't *hire* people (be they from a GS background or any other).

Instead we promote the idea that those that are interested in the project can contribute (with actual coding or other useful things).

A bit misleading when you say mainnet but it's an alt.

Not sure why that is misleading - we have never said that it is running on Bitcoin.

(so you are saying that alts don't have mainnet's at all?)

I don't think Ethereum is going to be launching on Bitcoin either (or do have evidence that they are going to do that?).

Well, I didn't say alts don't have mainnet, but it's still a bit misleading.

In any case, I personally have no idea nor any desire to find out what Ethereum is. As for your project, what exactly is it useful for(to the point where it is necessary to create a new high-level programming language)?

I'd be keen to know why you still think it is misleading (we have no intention to mislead anyone).


It allows people to create general "smart contracts" so the exact same use that Ethereum has. Also we have developed an "atomic cross-chain transfer" AT that will allow for peer to peer trading of digital currencies *without a trusted 3rd party*. I think that has at least some real worth to people.

As to creating a new "high-level language" we are not doing that (but Ethereum is).

Can you link me the white paper?

For AT you can see the design here: http://ciyam.org/at

The first document is the main technical description of how AT works.

Interestingly it seems that CIYAM is being DDoS attacked right now.

sanks!
EDIT:  sorry dawg, it  doesn't work!

I can resolve ciyam to 69.160.255.187 but destination host is unreachable.

tubes are clogged


how are you guys securing the blockchain? what is the consensus mechanism ?

I still don't see why I should invest in anything that isn't MAIDSafe, it's the original project (started in 2006) and has lots of interesting stuff already shown. How are the other MAID alternatives any better?

Yes - maybe we are being attacked by those that don't want to see us succeed (it should be working again in a few minutes).


AT is blockchain "agnostic" (so it doesn't care how the host blockchain does that).

Link should be fine now.

Yes link is up and running again.

Here you can see the main specs: http://www.ciyam.org/at/at.html

and the API calls here: http://www.ciyam.org/at/at_api.html

You will also notice some tests. These tests are using the older version of the AT as well as some of the use cases are using the old API and they will be updated soon.

Also there is a link to the .cpp prototype. http://www.ciyam.org/at/_at.cpp.html

We will be glad to answer any questions regarding the provided informations.

lot of stuff to chew...

That project was not about "smart contracts" but about P2P storage and it is not designed to be incorporated into existing blockchains (so apples and pears).

Escapes me why so many projects feel they have to tear Ethereum down in the process of explaining their own virtues. As for the comment about refusing to look at Ethereum, there is a good reason they are building their own browser, and its a very interesting one. To say that people  will not want to switch their browsers is to say people would never want to switch from autos to air travel. Ethereum envisions a different web experience for the average user. Not just of the same web, but a different kind of web in which the current web is just one dimension.

Personally I am no Ethereum fanboy but I think it is a very interesting project.

OP: I would have been interested in learning about AT but the OP does not say what it is or link to any information.

i'm watching this post to educate myself.. not sure what all of this means but in the coming days i hope to have a better grasp on the subject.

layman's terms would help a bit.. i know about turing and etherium but this whole post is nonsense to me at this point.

It is - as is Codius and all three projects have their respective strengths and weaknesses.


Sorry - documentation is here: http://ciyam.org/at but understand it is really aimed at devs (so is very technical) - I have added the link to the OP.

Do you know what a 'testnet' is?

Ethereum is much more than just simple smart contracts.
I think you are doing better not to compare your project with them everytime.

But I have a question. Besides Burst, are there other coins interested in implementing your AT? Some serious projects like NXT, etc. etc.?

Qora will be doing AT very soon and a few other alt coins have approached us with interest to implement AT.

Qora is almost dead. What about NXT, Bitshares, Bitcoin, some top 10 or at least top 20 coins?

I'd say wait and see about Qora - Bitshares has its own SC system and Bitcoin is not interested in one for now.

ATs are also much more. It might be the "engine" that provides smart contract functionality, but also can close the gap between these different platforms, giving them a way to communicate through ATs. It can be the link of a larger cryptosystem with multiple different platforms in it. 

If you think the purpose of what we are trying to achieve here ( not specifically us - the AT team ) but in general, then the key word is decentralization. Decentralization does not mean one chain or one platform rules them all, that is not decentralization. The competition is a good thing as it pushes the creativity upwards. There are a lot of developers ( and not only devs ) that have spend hours working on their coins and all we want is to give them a chance to be updated with the latest technological achievements and that is the reason we created AT.

You skipped NXT! Would you be up to help if approached by them?

They were initially involved but then rejected AT in favour of some other smart contract idea.

Can it work with crypto torrents?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=932096.msg10231367#msg10231367

What effort would be involved in enabling the project to become an in-wallet torrent seeder?

 http://ciyam.org/at is down

http://ciyam.org/at/ is working for me.

Sorry guys - unfortunately bitronictech.org (the service I use to host ciyam.org) has been rather unreliable of late (if anyone knows of a better hosting VPS service that will let me use my own VM image and pay in BTC for under 50 USD per month please point me at them).

Hi CIYAM,

Congratulations on AT! You've obviously put a lot of effort into it and it's a wonderful project. Thank you.

I've been coding for over 20 years and I still have difficulty writing actual code in AT machine code.. Sorry.. gave up machine code on my Spectrum 48k.. ;-p (ld hl 16384.. etc.. )

Is there any chance of converting a higher level language, say like java, into AT commands ?

Could we come up with a parser which converts a minimal java.lang subset into AT ?

I believe you mentioned this in some other thread but i can't find it..

The developer of Burst has created this: https://github.com/BurstProject/ATAssembler which makes it much easier to write ATs (you don't need to do raw machine code which is a huge step forward).

Currently we are looking to extend this into a "macro assembler" that should make building ATs much simpler and our main strategy is to use Software Manufacturing (so that code is *generated* from just using HTML forms meaning that you wouldn't need to actually "write code" at all).

Eventually we'll get to adding a HLL assuming the project gains enough momentum but we have only a small number of part-time devs and basically zero funds so we can only get so much done (this is where Ethereum does have a huge advantage over us).

You can also find a "tutorial" here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=949438.msg10408276#msg10408276