Bitcoin Forum

If you sell Bitcoin to individuals in person, be very careful! People are being mugged for their Bitcoin at gunpoint. http://observer.com/2015/02/bitcoin-crime-wave-breaks-out-in-nyc/

Well this has been from the very beginning. Always best to have a trade in a public area, and try at all costs to be as secure as possible.

Yeah that is pretty scary. Thieves will try to take advantage of any opportunity they can.

Allways make deals in public place, coffe shop or something. Ppl must realise Bitcoin is money and thieves will allways go for it.

It goes to show how valuable bitcoin is and I'm surprised there are still a lot of people who seems to be oblivion about it.

I was thinking of that, the best place to conduct a transaction would be a Police Station, Bank, etc.

There is no open carry in new york city, nor will there ever be. Easy fix, trade in a public place in Manhattan. No one is gonna do a stabbing in public and get away with it there.

You don't need to transact at a bank, any busy Starbucks is fine as there will be loads of people around. There are 9 million people in NYC, and hundreds of in person bitcoin transactions per day.

This isn't a "wave of bitcoin robberies", just a good headline for clickbait. Don't feed the "news"-trolls.

Despite popular redneck belief, having a gun on you does not render your soft, fleshy body immune to tiny bits of metal accelerated to deadly velocity.

The only way to be safe(r) from gun violence is to wear one of these everywhere you go:

http://cdn3.independent.ie/incoming/article30200481.ece/f0674/ALTERNATES/h342/bo.jpg

Some relevant facts:

http://wcpeace.org/images/gun_death_statistics.jpg

http://blog.joehuffman.org/content/binary/guns_in_home.gif

 In other news, angels aren't real. Surprise!

Bitcoin is money and therefore thieves will try to steal it because it is money and they can easily exchange it for cash, and it is MUCH easier to launder than paypal. Paypal can just freeze account if reported stolen.

I would like you to source your data and provide evidence for this. All I see is some image with no facts backing anything up, and the urls are wcpeace.org which looks like a conspiracy theory website which is poorly designed, and someones random blog.

“If everybody were armed, we would all be safer” This tired old argument? That's all you've got? Really?

https://progressivecynic.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/g10.jpg

This argument promotes the micro-equivalent of mutually assured destruction (two armed and rational actors not engaging in conflict because it would destroy both) to justify higher levels of gun ownership, but it fails to work out when applied to reality.

Statistics show that guns do not make people safer, thus this pro-gun argument is demonstrably untrue on its face. Higher levels of gun ownership do not produce a safer society and often lead to a higher numbers of deaths due to gun violence.

According to the Violence Policy Center’s analysis, states with higher per capita gun ownerships have far higher levels of gun homicide—there are 3 to 5 gun deaths per 100,000 in the bottom five gun ownership states, while there are 17 to 20 gun deaths per 100,000 in the top five gun ownership states. These statistics provide a great deal of evidence that gun ownership levels in a state correlate with gun deaths, and prove that the gun lobby’s argument of universal gun ownership is simply a fantasy.

To further drive the statistics that guns don’t make us safer home, we can simply look at the research surrounding household safety and gun ownership. In houses with firearms present, the average homicide rate is 3 times higher than in houses without guns and the suicide rate is between 3 and 5 times higher. Gun accidents due to improper storage or use of firearms claim the lives of hundreds of children a year. In households with firearms, domestic violence is both more prevalent than in houses without weapons, and has a much higher likelihood of resulting in violent deaths. In all possible rubrics—self-defense, accidents and suicide—gun ownership is detrimental to the safety of those who live in a gun-owner’s household; this is not to say that there are not cases of people defending their homes with their guns, but it is undeniable that gun ownership opens people up to numerous other risks.

In addition to the statistical evidence supporting the fact that more guns don’t make us safer, we can simply look at the mechanics of a shooting. Shootings are chaotic and, if everybody has a gun, there is a very real potential for a crossfire—nobody would know who the original shooter was, thus everybody would shoot at everybody else. In this crossfire, bullets would likely hit civilians (imagine a room filled with a crowd and three people shooting at each other) and the casualty count would increase. Once the police arrive, it would be difficult to determine who the original shooter was, and it is also likely that the police may end up shooting the people who didn’t start the gunfight.

In response to the “everybody should be armed” argument, people should simply ask the gun activist whether or not they support Iran getting a nuclear weapon. By the logic that the gun activist applies, everybody is safer when everybody is armed, and this would translate to support for Iranian weapons; in reality, these people almost always say that Iran isn’t a rational actor and that giving them a nuke endangers everybody around them. When they say this, you should simply tell them that not every gun owner is rational and that unrestricted gun ownership is the micro-equivalent to letting every country have nukes.

No, I don't agree. I'm coming for your guns, because you have just demonstrated publicly that you're not intelligent enough to own them. In fact, I'm coming for all the guns, and I've got the weight of all future civilization behind me. The older you get, the less relevant your tired worldview will become. Your grandchildren will not be armed, and there's nothing you can do to change that. Yes, you may be dead and gone by that time, but no one will notice.

Whoa whoa you are pulling facts out of your ass. Please stop being so ignorant and using false facts to support your false arguments.
Look here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
Seems like the evidence is contrary. Higher gun ownership generally correlates to lower gun violence.
Look at this for example:
District of Columbia: 3.6% gun ownership and 16.5 gun murders, highest gun murder per capita in the USA and lowest gun ownership
Hmm, whos right here?

Yeah, still me genius. Correlation is not causation. By the way, I'd sure love to see one of you address this point:

In response to the “everybody should be armed” argument, people should simply ask the gun activist whether or not they support Iran getting a nuclear weapon. By the logic that the gun activist applies, everybody is safer when everybody is armed, and this would translate to support for Iranian weapons; in reality, these people almost always say that Iran isn’t a rational actor and that giving them a nuke endangers everybody around them. When they say this, you should simply tell them that not every gun owner is rational and that unrestricted gun ownership is the micro-equivalent to letting every country have nukes.

Fuckin cognitive dissonance man, everywhere you go. So irritating.

Umm you stated before that top 5 gun ownership is top 5 gun ownership, that is a lie, and the real FACTS prove the opposite, higher gun ownership is actually lower gun murders.
Please check your sources http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
Before pasting irrelevant anti-gun photos and statements

When I carry large amounts of cash into NYC dark alleys, I always bring Chuck Norris.

Still waiting.

FWIW It's very difficult to get a gun permit in NY and you're not allowed to bring them to the city unless you're a PO or similar.

Hah, I knew it, contrary to the current rumors, criminals are stupid!

The USA has invaded 22 countries in the last 20 years... of those 22, how many had nuclear weapons? 0.

How many deaths have resulted from these invasions? the government won't release figures but its estimated at somewhere between 10 and 20 million...

Oh and in case you missed it check out funtotry's response... might help you sort your dissonance out, if thats too uncomfortable for you, maybe you'd feel more at home posting on the fox news or cnn forums?

Use a meeting place which is opposite or next to a bank, so you can quickly sell your btc, and put the $$$ into bank asap

Not every cop or governement is rational and fair so by your logic, police and governement should not be armed.

On a fundamental level, they (Iran) have as much right as any other country to own and operate their own nuclear weapons.

I would be happy to live in a gun-free society if nobody else, especially the military and police, also were disarmed.

move your bitcoin trades from the shades backalleys of Bronx to somewhere public like a mall or something so you don't get mugged at gunpoint.
it not like you are dealing drugs :D

Correct. Now we're getting somewhere.

The sooner the people of the world disarm their governments, especially of nuclear weapons*, the better odds our species has of surviving the 21st century. But to do that, the people would need reason on their side, they would need to be able to point to a society of non-aggression (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLCEXtpTNYU) and contrast it against a violent government. That's impossible in any nation as attached to violence and weapons as the United States is today.

*These weapons will either be dismantled or they will be used. The world can't wait forever.

What about ISIL? They consider themselves a nation too. Do they get nukes, or because you deem them unworthy should they be disarmed? The point I'm trying to make here, is that for sanity's sake, a line must be drawn somewhere. You may draw that line differently from someone else, but your argument must be logically consistent, else you render yourself a hypocrite and a fool.

Those thugs would be more profitable, if they steal fiat from people. Why go after bitcoiners ?

Because you can steal thousands off a person's usb/smartphone and stealing thousands off a person would mean carrying a bag or whatever filled with papers.

People are being mugged for the bitcoin in NYC?!?!

It's official, Bitcoin has become peers with cash!

I am sure someone selling bitcoins, would atleast take the precaution of not carrying too many bitcoins or cash with him for such a trade.
If its a big trade he would probably use a public place for the trade.

in public places and the online world just the same, will feel fear  :-\

Just do the exchange in front of a police station, i dont think they have the balls to stab you on there.

The gif is funny :D

Anyways it's quite easy to avoid these circumstances , just deal in a public place and don't carry much in single wallet
But if you're out of luck , you will get robbed anyway :-\

Uhh no these are different issues. If there was a guarantee of ZERO guns, meaning somehow guns just couldn't work anymore, I'm sure everyone would like this, including myself. But since criminals have access to black markets, they will still get guns REGARDLESS of whether it is illegal or not. Drugs are illegal but people are still using them no? Heres the thing. Criminals will have guns regardless, but the gun laws are telling us whether or not lawful citizens will be able to own them too. People want to be armed so they can protect themselves. Having to use your gun for self-defence is rare, probably won't happen in the average lifetime but it happens to some people. You would probably want protection in that case. Put it like seatbelts. You probably won't get caught in a car crash but if you do, you would be wishing you had a seatbelt. I never said that "everyone should be armed", I am pointing out the bullshit in your "facts".

I hope exchange owners will not be getting kidnap for bitcoin ransom.

There are two gun policies that work to minimize the risks of gun danger. One is "everyone has guns", the other is "no one has guns". Anywhere inbetween won't work, and that's why America has such a high rate of gun-related problems compared to everywhere else, which goes closer to the "no one has guns" approach (while in America, many people have guns but it's far from everyone).

Well the no one has guns isn't exactly working out as the cities with very low gun ownership have lots of gun related murders, since lawful citizens can't get them but criminals can illegally.
Check this statistic out:
https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/09/11/uk-violent-crime-rate-eight-times-higher-than-the-us/
Maybe we have more gun violence but they have 8 times the amount of other crime than us, and they have very little guns.
The no one has guns approach will not work unless every single gun is somehow redundant and does not fire at all, which is not possible.

By the looks of it that guy had his femoral artery or vein slashed and is bleeding out all over his leg and the ground. I wouldn't consider that funny at all. I honestly hope the guy lived...

Violent crime rate includes people being punched in the face, kicked, pepper-sprayed, etc...

Would you rather get punched or shot at?

This story could have only happened this way:

http://cdn.buzznet.com/assets/users12/sweetp/default/accountant-street-gangs--large-msg-115848259934.jpg

LOLOLOL

Did not read the whole story (read the first two and last paragraphs). I can't believe there would be people who will 'force' people to transfer their Bitcoin. If I were to exchange with stranger.. I will meet him or here at a busy place.

"It's always better to have a gun and need it, than not have a gun and not need it."  Little off topic but one of my favourite lines from Trailor Park Boys (who do accept bitcoin).

Well of course I'd rather be punched but I'd rather not be assaulted at all, if I was carrying and drew my weapon then the assaulter will likely run away as usually they just have knives or just fists to try to rob you with. I'd like to point out that violent crime includes things like knives which are also lethal.

And what would you do? If they are robbers they will get their guns before you do, if they are more than one you can't do nothing about it.

That is clearly urine running down his leg, there was no slashing involved.

Trailer Park Boys pushing an ignorant redneck pro-gun agenda, what a surprise.

If your assailant comes up behind you with ANY weapon, your gun is worthless.
If your assailant puts his weapon to the head or throat of you or one of your loved one, your gun is worthless.
If your assailant catches you while you're sleeping, your gun is worthless.
If your assailants outnumber you, your gun is worthless.

If (one of) your assailant(s) is frightened into discharging his firearm when you draw yours, your gun could get you killed.
If your assailant doesn't at first notice that you have a gun because it's concealed, your gun could get you killed.
If the police arrive and mistake you for one of the criminals, your gun could get you killed.
If you fire on your assailant and fail to kill with the first one or two shots, your gun could get you killed.
If you fire your weapon and kill your assailant, your gun could land you in prison.
If you fire your weapon and kill some other poor bastard, your gun WILL land you in prison.

On the other hand, if you simply hand over your wallet to your assailant, you are pretty much guaranteed to get away unharmed.
I would rather have pepperspray over a gun in 99 out of 100 situations involving an armed criminal.

Literally the ONLY situation in which I'd rather have a gun is if my assailant intends to kill me from the outset. I'm a nice guy, so that's pretty fucking far fetched.

Do I really need to go on?

Femoral artery?!!!  Geez way to take a gif WAAYYYYY out of context, dude!   :D

The guy is clearing pissing himself, touching his wallet with pee, and touching the dollars in the wallet with pee, thus disgusting the robber in the process.

i don't see the difference between trading bitcoin and trading any other stuff, if you sell any kind of stuff to a shady person in a non-public place you are gonna get mugged and you deserve it for not using your brain!

I agree, he wouldn't stay upright bleeding that fast.

That gif is really sad, Its inhumane to slash someone like that only for a few dollars.

disagree that its like the wild west, cause NYC residents can't legally bear arms so they are forced being victims by law

still better being mugged by a privateer than government officials like happened to  Shrem, the BurtW guy or the guys in Florida  :-[

I can't really tell what was in that gif but I have to say that if the man was carrying a gun, and he drew it while he was told to draw his wallet, I guarantee you the robber would have run away, because with the knife he would have had to jump forward, which doesn't immediately stun/stop them and the man could have easily pulled the trigger in the time he was lunging at him.

Precisely what quantity of wealth makes it humane to slash someone? Damn capitalists and their twisted mental gymnastics.

When will we learn that life is priceless? (http://workers-compensation.lawyers.com/lost-limb-award-schedules.html)

i tried to buy from someone in nyc on localbitcoins yesterday and he was afraid to meet up because he didnt know me lol

That's an explosives suit, not a bullet proof vest.

You did not present any "facts", just hype.  You're more likely to be killed in a car crash if you drive a car, you're more likely to drown if you swim a lot.  You're more likely to be taken seriously if you present an argument and back it up with actual facts and sources.

Fact: More guns means more gun murders and more gun suicides. The Harvard Injury Control Research Center (http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/index.html) has accumulated a considerable body of evidence about the relationship between gun availability and gun violence, concluding that more guns means more gun murders (http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/index.html) and more gun suicides (http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/firearms-research/gun-ownership-and-use/index.html).

Homicides committed with firearms peaked in 1993 at 17,075, after which the figure steadily fell, reaching a low of 10,117 in 1999. Gun ownership during this same period of time has steadily declined.

http://www.nij.gov/topics/crime/gun-violence/Pages/welcome.aspx loads of facts for you here, but you may not like them.

I think this is pretty telling, the states with stricter gun laws and less guns per household have significantly lower mortality rates. Must be a coincidence, huh? Just like nations with stricter gun laws...

https://i.imgur.com/7w9aJHn.png

Are you rednecks done denying reality yet, or do you need more factual ass-whooping? Maybe if you pray hard enough, cowboy jesus will descend from heaven and shoot me down with his pearly white colt .45.

Probably not though.

This is not news.  They even rob cash at gun point.  Another article trying to degrade bitcoin

There are a lot of obvious solutions. Namely well populated, open areas with good lighting. It doesn't hurt bringing a friend along as well. Or simply meet at the police station.

Yeah, I thought not.

Lol your facts were proven wrong and so far you haven't provided any facts whatsoever, so your "factual ass-whooping" obviously hasn't came yet.

Probably, the buyer was known to the seller from the previous trades and he had some trust on him. He just got a bit careless. Can't blame the guy.

Seems like very thuggish behavior. Surprising to see this sort of behavior coming from Bitcoiners - who usually tend to be intelligent, nerdier-type people. Most Bitcoiners would probably make better use of their time and skills by hacking computers, running botnets, coding viruses, exploiting security holes in exchanges, etc. or, you know, running a legitimate business or offering a legitimate service - than stealing via force and physical violence.

How come? I thought the supreme court had that bolshevist antigun bullshit fixed in D.C.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/District_of_Columbia_v._Heller

Why does that ruling not apply to NY  ???

But it really is fine as how blood pops out after sometime and by the way how the hell does that robber do it ???

Hahahahha :D :D
No no! though that was good one , but he is not peeing ,that is blood

---

Fermoral artery is the main artery which gives blood to your lower body , and if that is cut , the blood will actually come like a fountain and pretty fast

Like you say, prevention is always better. Possibly, with so much media attention, bitcoin sellers will take these simple precautions.

Are guns illegal in GB?

If it were blood, it would appear blackish on the ground, not clear like the urine it obviously is. Wet pants look darker than dry pants. Enough about this fucking gif.

Okay! whatever it may be
Who cares!
Wait! the guy dipped the money in his urine and gave it to him
LMAO

Yes, that did happen. Delicious urine money, yet another reason to use bitcoin :P

How many of those people deserved to die? Lot of this is likely from gang violence. I don't have facts for it but assuming US has much higher gang population and gang violence.  Gun control won't change that, we have printable guns now.  Facts and statistics don't matter though, the people for gun control are already convinced.  People that want the choice to own a gun don't give a shit, it's not about statistics, something else ingrained in ancestry, history, freedom of choice.  The idea to concede something they can use responsibly because of accidents, idiots and criminals doesn't sit well.

I'm not the type of sociopathic asshole that believes he has a right to decide who deserves to die. I'll leave that up to the redneck southern judges (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poL7l-Uk3I8) and politicians.

Yeah, because everyone knows Oklahoma and Wyoming have countless roving bands of deadly gangs.  :D

Obviously.

Gun control is proven to reduce gun deaths (http://www.iop.harvard.edu/new-statistics-indicate-gun-control-works). Why are you assuming random bullshit, by the way?

Who's we? The tiny handful of geeks with 3D printers? Yeah, they are a real menace to society. Are these the same folks in your imaginary gangs?

Clearly not to you.

Facts and statistics tend to have that effect.

That's why we have prisons, which is not to say that I'm a fan of prisons. But I'm even less of a fan of entitled american gun nuts and the near-constant shooting sprees they enable with their ignorance.

Probably they meet in a quiet area, if you do the exchange IRL dont do it in a small street like in movies, meet in mcdonalds or something.

I prefer to wear one of these:
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4VJIj_qdqc0/hqdefault.jpg

If you think guns only make you less safe then why do we send cops with guns to stop violence? Would our troops be more safe in Afghanistan if they went on patrol unarmed?

I'll take my chances defending myself thank you. Maybe you'll get lucky if you are being attacked and someone nearby will be prepared to do something.

They don't give cops guns to stop violence. Trying to shoot your way to non-violence makes as much sense as trying to fuck your way to virginity. They give cops guns to ensure that violence continues to be monopolized by the state, for the interests of the state. Cops are expendable to the state, that's why the reward for an NYPD officer who has been shot is a paltry $10,000. How much do you think that reward would be if you shot a congressman or other important millionaire? The elite doesn't give a shit about some random cop any more than they do about you, that tiny amount of money is just for show. The state has no interest in stopping violence, capitalism could not exist for one hour without systematic hierarchy-based violence. The state is very interested in controlling how that violence is directed, however.

By the way, most industrialized nations don't miliarize the police the way the United States does (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUdHIatS36A). We're unique in our gun-obsession, just like we're unique in our prison population and our lack of universal health care. If you want to understand American politics, you only need to follow the money. The US gun industry is a 32 billion dollar industry. You associate guns with liberty because you have been programmed to since you were a small child. You were programmed to love guns because a handful of very powerful rich people profit enormously from your ignorance. Same reason Americans love their cheeseburgers and other mass-produced garbage fastfood, that kind of food is much more profitable than fruits and vegetables.

Our troops would be a hell of a lot safer if they weren't in Afghanistan. Unfortunately for them, they are expendable assets just like police officers. It is deeply concerning (but not surprising) that a gun owner such as yourself doesn't understand the distinction between civilians on home soil and military personnel in a foreign war zone.

Lol! you know Delicious doesn't fit there at all right ? :P

I'm not afraid of my government or the cops. Hell, my guns are better than their low bid firearms. I do not feel oppressed by capitalism and I think it works better than other systems.  For example I am trusted to carry a gun, speak out against the government, vote for my leaders. It's far from utopia, but never in human history have people had it as good as we do.

Of course there is a distinction between war and crime. But both situations use firearms to fight firearms. Anyone who thinks you don't need a gun has been watching to many movies.

So again, I'll stick to what I know works. I fully support anyone's right to risk it without a gun. But I would not do that. I'm going home tonight.

You could have the best, fanciest gun in the world and you'd be just as dead if a bullet from the shittiest, cheapest gun struck one of your vital organs.

Great for you, check your privilege (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides).

You sure about that? Anxiety disorders affect 40 million adults in the United States (18% of U.S. population). 1 in 10 Americans is clinically depressed. 1 in 4 college students are depressed.

The United States is today almost certainly the most mentally ill society in the history of the world.

You must be joking. Hollywood glorifies gun culture like mad!

You'll stick to what you believe works while ignoring overwhelming evidence to the contrary. I'll stick to an evidence-based existence.

"(...) there are 3 to 5 gun deaths per 100,000 in the bottom five gun ownership states, while there are 17 to 20 gun deaths per 100,000 in the top five gun ownership states. These statistics provide a great deal of evidence that gun ownership levels in a state correlate with gun deaths, and prove that the gun lobby’s argument of universal gun ownership is simply a fantasy."

I feel like Beliathon is a troll. He ignores facts and pull them out of his ass to strengthen his weak argument.
view the facts for yourself http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
The highest gun deaths by far is 16.5 in the state, and gun ownership is only 3.6%.
Hmm, less guns equals more gun deaths, sounds like a good plan lets remove all guns.
Stop making things up Beliathon.

You are correct RodeoX. Capitalism IS the best system, is communism working well in Russia right now? Which is the best country in the world? The USA. Canada is also rated among the best as well, and both of these use capitalism and have some of the least poverty rates.
Capitalism works if YOU work

Russia is a capitalist oligarchy (http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2013/10/10/231446353/if-you-think-wealth-disparity-is-bad-here-look-at-russia).

That's adorable. You remind me of this blonde girl (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA) from the Newsroom.

America is the best in only three categories:

-Number of incarcerated citizens per capita
-Number of adults who believe angels are real
-Military expenditure

it looks that just happened one time,the thread is so sensationalist

Last 2 are irrelevant, first off other peoples religion have nothing to do with america, there is freedom of religion remember?
Military expenditure has allowed us to achieve world superpower, and STAY there. If anything were to happen we could easily win any war even if our allies turned on us. Yes Canada has less military expenditure but if the alliance between Canada and the US was broken, Canada would get absolutely destroyed. The world's strongest military is what allows it to stay strong and make these aggressive decisions and counter terrorism and all this invasion into other countries and getting things done. First one I agree is not very good and embarrassing actually.

Considering the southern states are where most of the gun nuts live, I'd say it's pretty damn relevant. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RfUj09pWfM)

The media highlights what gives them viewership points. Do you blame them?

there is a video, showing how an unarmed guy gets robbed with a simple knife

it could not be any clearer that a firearm would have been a gamechanger, resulting in a dead piece of scum and dry pants

BUT STILL the gunhaters come out and write horseshit, it is incredible ::)

that's true ...the media does not always show what actually happens or what happened.

Firearms held by both people... would have resulted in 2 dead bodies.

QFT

This is what we get in exchange for our gun culture:

NSFW! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-0uqFTBclo NSFW!

-Charlie Stross (http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2015/02/a-different-cluetrain.html)

It may be shocking news now but it is just natural development. It is normal evolution, everything with some value will be targeted by thieves and eventually stolen. You just need to protect your bitcoin as much as your 'normal' money.

He wears, not carries, his weapon, folks. That's important, because its for safety. Because they are both safety instruments that protect you. That's why it's the same. Get it? It all makes perfect sense.

Just as bullets and and kevlar vests are the same. Just as shields and swords are the same. Just as a wall and a battering ram are the same. Attacking and defending. Ignorance is strength. War is peace.

I also sometimes carry a flashlight and always carry a first aid kit in my car. Oh and I very rarely wear my kevlar vest. I'm not sure what your arguing now? Equivocation on the word wear? I hope you get into a debate and not a gunfight.

The way a person (ab)uses language reveals a great deal about the way they think. That's my point.

Not suprising. People get mugged for $, why not for BTC

Maybe because not everyone carries more than 1000$ around, However a trader might be carrying more and maybe forced to empty his bitcoin wallet.

Holy cow, you can't argue with gunhaters  :P

The attacker was armed with a knife, it is complete nonsense to assume that he would have owned/used a firearm just because the victim could legally have worn one

I don't think it works like that, in fact knives are easier to get than guns so the hurdle (both in obtaining the weapon, and the potential prison time) would have been much higher.

The attacker could legally and easily obtain the knife, while a gun is harder to get, and not legally, for most criminals. Here in Switzerland you can forget about owning a gun legally with a criminal record, same goes for US and most other places.

Recommendation. All gunhaters write a 20 page essay about what this saying means: Colt's guns inspired an old saying: "God created man, Sam Colt made them equal."

it means that guns do not guarantee you win in a conflict, but they will bring you to an equal level with an attacker. In the video above, the unarmed man was inferior to the attacker. EVEN IF BOTH HAD A GUN THEY WOULD AT LEAST BE ON THE SAME LEVEL.

Read more: Samuel Colt Biography (Inventor) http://www.infoplease.com/biography/var/samuelcolt.html#ixzz3SyeOKa77

Nicely said! As i said earlier , guns do not kill people , it's better to have gun on both side

I had no idea I was abusing the language by correctly structuring a sentence. But anyway, what would you do then? You see someone shooting up a mall or whatever, what response do you have? I suppose you could show them some statistics or tell them how you think America is mentally ill.  Me, I will be in a position to end this. I hope I never have to put a bullet in some deranged psychopath but I would not hesitate to do so if needed. If you were there at the mall also you would give me anything and everything to save you. The only thing in the world that would matter to you is my gun.

You're living in a self-indulgent paranoid fantasy land if you think owning that gun is ever going to mean you get to play american hero and save a bunch of folks from a shooting spree. Statistically, this is so improbable that it's simply not going to happen. It's revealing that you would choose this example in your argument because the fact that you think this way about your gun is self-delusion. It's a false sense of security, a childish clinging to control over your life (and death) in a world in which that's nigh impossible. This is the problem with american gun mentality. "oh, I need  this because I could get robbed or a burglar could come into my home!" but you'll notice these people never seem to know the burglary rate of their town, or any other relevant facts and statistics about gun ownership in the place they live.

It's a tool for which you have no relevant use, a tool you bought so you can create a certain identity for yourself. That gun is part of who you are. You are no different from suburban white high school nerds who get their mom to buy them a cheap replica sword at the county fair because they "need it". You don't need it. You're never going to need to fire it, and you know it. The sooner you admit this fact to yourself, the better.

http://valeriewaters.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/youre-not-your-job1.jpg

I know this may sound really, really terrible... but this a good sign hahaha (I'm really sorry for those parties involved though, seriously). People (thieves in this case) are treating it like currency, straight up.

Ok, I'm delusional. So says the guy who thinks he can win a gunfight without a gun.  ::)

Maybe YOU don't need a gun where you live. When I lived in St. Louis my neighbor across the street was killed when shot through the neck at his front door. Another neighbor I didn't really know killed two car jackers and took one bullet in the process. My GF at the time faced 3 violent home invasions. They came to my house also but fled when they saw my gun. Another friend who ran a bike program was shot in the stomach by a 13yo.(On a dare!) In the 90's I heard gunshots all the time and there were places you could not even go. Fortunately where I live now I have less to worry about. Although people here are still killed all the time by armed criminals.


I'm guessing you think the police should handle things. Cops are great at carefully analyzing a crime scene. They will photograph and tag your body, odds are they will even catch your killer. Luckily you will not be alive and don't have to worry about  your concern of accidentally being shot. The police have a much worse record than CCW holders. About 11% of police shootings are wrongful and kill an innocent person. By comparison about 2% of shootings by citizens kill an innocent person.

Yeah, I can't argue that this isn't extremely fucked up. These two are just from the past month:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-0uqFTBclo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jhEY_NfXJU

There are no winners to be found in a gun fight, only survivors. One comes away alive and a murderer, possibly with PTSD and/or serious physical injuries, the other dies. Both lose a great deal.

All participants in violence have already forfeited their humanity. You're not delusional, you're deluded. Others have caused this affliction in you and you are not to blame for it.

It's not good in any case... of course some nutjob is going to try to kill you over Bitcoin because it has purchasing power, but theres nothing positive to get from this.

Sometimes being humane means putting the lives of good people over the life of a criminal. But as you mention it is good for nobody involved. Not only may the shooter have a hard time dealing with the mental strain of having killed someone, they will be financially ruined. That is why I am licensed to pull my weapon ONLY if someone is about to kill me or someone in my immediate presence. Anything else is a crime. I can't stop a crook from stealing or even a pedophile from raping a child in right front of me. The allowed use of a gun is extremely narrow in the law. Those of us who are willing to take on the responsibility of CCW are not the violent cowboys you think we are. I deplore violence and think it is used far to much in our society. I think it's sick how we entertain ourselves by watching the voyeuristic drama of people hurting each other. I'm a liberal who likes NPR and the arts. But none of my high minded philosophy will mean anything if faced with a life-threatening situation. I ask for nothing more than to exercise my right to defend myself in the highly unlikely event that someone id trying to kill me. I'm not going for Batman here.  :)

There are many circumstances where I would rather have a knife than a gun, especially within 10 feet of the target.

One of these is a good option for personal defense if you are trained:

http://www.theultimateknife.com/599-fox-karambit-black-g10-fighting-knife-emerson-wave-size-m-xl/
http://www.theultimateknife.com/fox-dart-tanto-karambit-black-g10-fighting-knife-emerson-wave-size-m-xl/

I would recommend every family to arm themselves with at least a 12 gauge shotgun.

This is also a really good project to support to arm more individuals with unserialized AR-15s :
https://ghostgunner.net

Any arguments with gun control advocates is pointless to make as they live in a delusional world not represented by facts, will claim "correlation does not equal causation" for inconvenient facts that don't support their agenda and don't apply the same principles to their own "facts" , and simply don't have any practical solutions to solve gun violence when faced with the fact that I can make a gun for 20 dollars in my garage.

I would like to hear of any practical solutions to control gun ownership that doesn't involve supporting the gun ownership disparity with a trained group of dangerous psychopaths.

"Your Honor, years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth. I said then, and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free."
-E. V. Debs, Statement to the Court, September 18, 1918

I saw this on facebook

It's a grand sentiment to place all people on equal footing. I totally agree that is where we should start. But the guy in the quote above fails to recognize that in history there has never been a time free of criminals and there will always be people in jail. I'm not sure what he thinks should be done with the many violent criminals who are in jail now. Let them out? Think he'll be free then?

Real criminals step outside of society for their own gain at our expense. They steal what you worked for and take what they want. I am NOT "of it". They made a choice to be criminals and that's cool. But no crybaby crap when they forfeit their freedom or get blown away. Life is about choices and dealing with the results. Don't want to get shot by me? Easy, don't decide to kill me.

Here you reveal the limits of your historical vision. Of course there was a time before criminals, there was a time before history, and we call it pre-history. 500,000 years of simple existence in harmony with nature.
Just as there was a time before criminals, capitalism, and inequality, there will be a time after these things as well. We are a species in our social infancy, having just awoken from the long sleep of pre-reasoned society.

I find it offensive that you lump all criminals together as a malignant monolith. I'd argue that many criminals are just trying to survive the best/only way they know how, with no intention of hurting anyone. It would be just as unfair for me to lump all capitalists together as sociopathic parasites, when in reality it's only the vast majority of highly "successful" capitalists that are sociopathic parasites.

It's revealing that you believe your society is so wholesome that only evil or insane people would choose to step outside of it. You must be very privileged indeed, to think that is reality.

This is not a good sign in anyway . For example even the ISIS is asking for ransoms in bitcoins, and that is getting it in the bad books.

I said "real criminals" because i assumed you would try bringing in the irreverent point that some criminals are not bad guys. Have you seen the inside of a prison, I have. Guess what, they ALL say they are just "victims of the system". Poor crooks they HAD to beat that old lady to death because... the system made them. They should be rewarded with a cookie.
B.S. Do the crime - do the time.
I think you will remain willfully ignorant no matter what I say.  You seem to think without the police violent crime would go away. Or that it is unreasonable to defend yourself because there is no such thing as murder. Fortunately my entire country agrees with me and I can carry most anywhere.

Best of luck and I sincerely hope that you never encounter the violent criminal element that lives near you. If you do, try complying I guess? Let them finish raping your family then try making them some tea to get on their good side. With some luck maybe they wont kill you.

Yes.

Even if you trusted the police, the average response time for them to arrive and assist a victim far exceeds the time frame of theft, rape , or murder. In the Us the supreme court has decided that police officers have no legal obligation to prevent a crime in progress even when on duty... they can stand by and laugh or watch it all happen in cowardice.

The sooner one realizes this the sooner one realizes that one ultimately has to take steps to protect oneself, family and lastly community. This is not done through faith or by empowering a bunch of dangerous thugs/gangsters either but by being a responsible member of the community.

This doesn't mean that one needs to only rely on weapons for security and I would first advise one to take other precautionary steps before getting a weapon if they are on a budget.

Interesting video that shows how gun control advocates really don't have any realistic solutions and clear arguments:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6USouHCdmyo

Don't be absurd. A capitalist society with no police would mean no government, so dominated by two or three megacorporations in true neo-fascist nightmare world style.

I believe an egalitarian post capitalism non-economy would make possible for our species the permanent transcension of violence, within a few generations of the "post-capitalism moment".

In 2015 there are dozens of effective non-lethal means of defending oneself. Tranq guns, pepperspray, foam spray guns, handheld tazers, projectile tazers (!), super high-powered flashlights to name a few. To say nothing of taking the time to learn proper martial arts self-defense. There are many martial artists and military personnel that can disarm a gunman in seconds given the right opportunity. But if you refuse to take the time to learn these life-saving skills and instead opt for the easy and relatively cheap solution.

Buy a handgun. God forbid 'muricans would get off their fat asses and do some exercise, right? Do you place such a low value on human life that you bypass all these perfectly viable, safer methods of self-defense and go straight for maximum lethal force? Guns are for two kinds of people, the lazy and those who callously disregard the priceless nature of human life. Be honest with yourself, what would your beloved Jesus Christ think of that?

More guns makes everyone less safe overall, same is true of more cars and more fast food restaurants. We have more of all three because they are very profitable industries, and in capitalism profit always finds a way to be made, just as information finds a way to be free.

If you sold gold the same would happen as it would with anything that has value for scumbags to make the cash for their next fix, the trick is knowing this to begin with then making rules which you never brake even if the deal is good for the cash flow because what is good for the cash flow may not be so good for the blood flow  ::) Rule number one 'trust no one' public place at all times maybe stake out before sitting down in the coffee shop, i dunno just be smart when dealing with 'anything' of value.

NYC is a criminals' utopia where the only "civilians" who can carry effective self-defense tools are criminals and the 1% bribers. Meet in a courthouse past armed LEOs, metal detectors, and X-ray machines, and you probably won't get robbed in there. On the way to or fro though...

Oh, and 1) most GSW are survivable, according to mortality rates and 2) most defensive gun uses don't require any shot(s) to be fired to stop the criminal, so fuck the "guns are only for killing" categorical BULLSHIT.

Only true in open-carry situations which basically means NO major US cities where more and more of the population is crowding.

BS, but a Devil's Advocate knows that.

Open carry (merely having a holstered or slung gun constantly exposed in public and not gripping it) is not a defensive gun USE. It can be a passive deterrent - if the criminal sees it. But some don't assess their surroundings well enough. If they do see it, the self-preservation instinct less than 1% of humans lack, will cause criminals to seek a softer target or target area.

Brandishing (gripping your gun, while pointed in any direction) is not "open carry". It can be deemed a crime if you grip it as an aggressor and not a defender.

The most common defensive gun use, drawing your pistol from its holster or bringing a slung long gun to bear (as you are about to fire to stop an immediate threat of death of great bodily injury) is not "open carry".

The least common defensive gun use, actually firing that gun when the criminal does not immediately stop their threat, is not "open carry".

This tends to end with tragedy in our major cities. Haven't you been paying attention?

This is my primary field of study. Non-anecdotal citations, please!

I might have to re-think selling on localbitcoins.
Although I never really hold much bitcoin on my phone.

Yup but they assume you do so you are always risking getting robbed. I dont use localbitcoin IRL interaction anymore. Cant trust these hoes.

I heard about someone in italy lost over $50.000 of BTC because he was robbed on a street.
The "buyer" attacked him with 2 other guys and he had a choice.. Lose 50k or die.

So he lost the 50k, and then 2 months later they were caught and he got his money back.
Lets hope that people can stay safe with their BTC in the future.

Yea hoes are usually untrustworthy. I wouldn't want to meet any bitcoiners in real life, 98% are scammers and 1% are shills, then theres the legitimate members  ;D

Transparency is an underappreciated feature of the blockchain. Conservatives, libertarians, and anarchists all tend to fetishize anonymity, but none of them seem to have considered what financial transparency could mean when applied to the elite, instead of only applied to the peasants as it is today. They have discounted a paradigm-shifting feature of a post-fiat reality. Money being created by democracy, rather than by the state. A public ledger with transparency, instead of a private ledger with none.

Yes transparency is underappreciated but there is no built in anonymous feature in it. Sites like bitmixer.io and sharedsend from blockchain however have solved this with their mixing program which does a really good job.

Well it is as valuable as the market rate dictates. Even if it wasn't only 1/1000 as valuable as now, someone possessing 1000x the amount would still be rich. It comes down to how well people know Bitcoin.

It comes down to how many days have elapsed since the genesis block. Finance getting attacked by computer science, g-fucking-g the game was over before it began.

https://i.imgur.com/HkocExO.gif

Heres what I think. If people want to STEAL bitcoin, it obviously has become a real thing, because it has worth to thieves. If bitcoin is so shitty like how the media says it, then why are so much people hacking bitcoin exchanges and stealing it?

There's a reason the Enron doc was called "the smartest men in the room".