Bitcoin Forum

Dear bitcointalk community,

For weeks I have following everything I can about bitcoin and mining. This is because I am from a country where there is subsidised elektricity for every houseHold Hold. I have found enough space to store 100-300 th/s at 0.01 ct ct/kwh.

I have a couple things I could use help with.
What is best th/usd ratio hardware available?
I have an offer for 260usd per th/s. I still think thats extensieve and am looking for better option. Used miners is also possible, as in a retirement place for miners.

I want to try and get a loon/investment at btcjam since I do not plan to put my own entire capitalist at risk and am looking for partners.

I can verify everything and am looking forward to read comments comments. Good and bad once;)

Kind Regards,

ZEKSAL

I will try btcjam.Com also since their seems to be no interest so far  ???

Who's giving you $260/TH? I've talked to Bitmain, Spondoolies and Avalon in the last week and haven't gotten numbers that good from any of them.

I'm guessing some old Dragon's (A1's).  That is about their going rate.   I don't think anything current gen for that.

It is very possible to get this low or lower, you just have to order the right quantity.

I've heard $370 shipped from Avalon for something like 50 units of the 4.1, and approximately "stick it" from Bitmain for $419 up to 100 units of the S5. BM would probably negotiate lower on a jumbo batch but I wouldn't advise to buy a jumbo batch without first getting a small group and seeing what it takes to set them up and run reliably, but they weren't willing to budge an inch on pricing even for a palletfull and I wouldn't advise buying an S5 at their current price point.

Please show proof of any company with current gen miner doing this.  Specifically the 3 companies mentioned in what you quoted. I don't see getting 260 and definitely not lower.

Even if the proof is very legit, I think other details would be required to get a loan at btcjam. I  doubt they would fund an operation that big.

Easily done.

http://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/holiday-special-sp20-mini-farm-batch-2 (http://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/holiday-special-sp20-mini-farm-batch-2)

$5495.00/15 = $366.33 each

$366.33/1.7 = $215.49 per Th  (Even if you go with 1.65 or 1.6 its still less then $250, cause getting them to 1.7 or higher is a PITA)

That was only 15, imagine ordering in quantities of 50+

I have been involved in several orders of $5k and much more that was all done with cash or credit card, no loans involved.

Okay, now try that with hardware that a) actually exists, and b) isn't price-hammered into selling at a loss. I know what SPTech's price break is for SP31 right now and it's certainly not that.

Guys we are going of topic with the replies. I asked for expertise not for research into my honestnes.  I can get th/s at that price, as I mentioned Electricity is so cheap that efficiency does not matter so i can also buy second hand miners. I just need findings, it does mot have to be much. And need expertise of People with 50th/s or higher operation that ks running right now

I will give you credit showing something those.  But they are sold out and will not produce SP20's anymore.  I cannot find quote but I believe they said last batches were sold at a loss.

SP has the SP31 in stock 2000/5T = 400 per TH.

Look at Bitmain S5 419/1.155 T = 375

I honestly hope I am wrong and you can show a current gen miner being sold at 260 per T but I just don't see it unless going twords old gear.

To go back to your topic.  Yes you could use BTC Jam or Loan forum here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=65.0

With being new to get loan on forum will need to jump through hoops and have collateral to cover loan. As a general rule most lenders hate to loan for mining operations.  They are normally looking for different types of loans.

You will have to have a "A" on BTC jam rating, and if you have no history it is again harder to get.  You can see current listings - https://btcjam.com/listings/f/all-terms/usd-tied,btc-tied,brl-tied,rub-tied,eur-tied,mxn-tied,inr-tied/all-ratings/safe/no-hide/asc,3/mining?page=1

Your operation you ask for 100 to 300 (of some 260 per miner) comes out to 26,000 to 78,000. 

That does not include location rent, also most locations will not want to let you modify building for mining.  You need to do a lot of electrical work, and a good exhaust system.  Then have networking gear.  The list goes on and on.

Im sorry to say but most likely you will not find a investor online.  You most likely will need to fund yourself, or have a plan for bank or someone who knows you to try to get funding.

I have got the location ready for usage. About the electricity, you are right. Most of my appartments will need rewiring to make sure no shortcuts or other issues can occur. I have attached a cooling system in every room. All of this can be backed up by pictures of the appartments.

I need mining hardware, thats all I need to start of. I would be very interested in people who run a operation that is getting unprofitable, since I can take over their miners and keep them part of my opperation so we can benefit together!

Guys I know some of you are reading this and could offer me great help, dont hold back, I have a lot to offer in return and am a Business student so I have done some calculations and have some basic knowledge on doing business.

There are lots of sites offering second hand miners for 200usd/th/s ofcourse this is not ideal but still, with almost no electricity costs they could still gain a good profit.

I would suggest starting small and growing.

But how you talk about 100T of gear there just is no way it will be in a apartment.  It will take a building/warehouse and a lot of things done to it.  Residential miners will be much much less then 100T.

You are right sir. The point is I have more than one appartement. I plan to put 20th/s per appartement. But thanks for thinking with me guys.. Keep it going and private message me if you have any hardware or other specific info

20TH/apartment? So 11-13KW (at best) of use... I think you'll find that's beyond what most apartments can handle.

Also, 20TH will only make $1855, so rent is going to kill you, let alone power. Where are you located?

Sorry to have gone off-topic with gear price calculations. I wasn't questioning your honesty so much as hoping you'd reveal your source so I could also get in on hardware at that price.

It is a country in the middle east. Im summier it is 50degree so every house has lots of colliers. Rent is no problem aswell (oftopic) haha. The hardware is an esyimate from hardware I already purchased second hand and China import.

You'll need many extra AC units. 20THs when its 50 outside will break a single 4000 BTU AC. I don't think this plan makes enough sense to succeed.

Ahh, I get it.  ::) hosting is being advertised by telling it isbimpossible to do. I can make the devices work without heat problem dont try to sell me cloud mining.
The prices are crazy!. I try to get 25 th per appartement. I can grow the operation from there since rent will be 250 Inc. Electricity. I need the right hardware and expertise to be as efficiënt as possible. Any one a suggestion, feel free.

When you say 50 degree do you mean in F or C?

Degree C. In the sun at extreme. Its near Turkey

Ok wow I highly suggest trying on a small scale.  That is extreme for a ambient mining.  

I think you will be surprised how much heat they can put out.  Maybe someone has some advice but 122 F to start with is like a nightmare for a miner. You will not be able to pull outside air in and exhaust it out.    You will have to have all air going through AC's.  20TH in that like you mention is just going to be hard.

Around 117F ambient a SP20E, will need to be slowed down to 1.35Th to operate without hitting 125C on its cores.  I imagine 122F it will need to be even slower, the SP20Es have a very hot running core, so they will probably still operate in this heat but at lower hashrates. As far as other miners I do not know, I only heat tested the SP20E.

Is evaporative cooling an option? If the relative humidity is quite low and water isn't expensive to supply, a passive evaporative inlet system could do quite a bit of good.

We are hot here also, but we use evaporative cooling system.

It is better to build your own warehouse if you have some space , it is better than using apartments.

If building a new warehouse is an option with you, then let me know to tell you what kind of evaporative cooling we use here.

Please post pictures of the bill to repair the AC after you break it with 20 TH in one apartment.

I feel bad this turned into such a anti-mining thread.  I think OP has a lot of challenges to say the least though.

For some helpful advice can you tell us what miner you ordered? (By price it sounds like a A1 1T I'm guessing)

You could also host some miners for some less risky and less capitalistic returns.

He's already decided that hosters are just trying to trick him, and that everyone's warnings about hosting in an apartment in a country where it is 50C regularly is part of the long con.

Thanks for the advice. I am deffinetly not putting all my money into this with the chanse of underestimating it. I am really taking in all the advice you guys are proviDing. I am still sure I can pull this of Because I can kkeep opwrational costs really low. I will keep you up to date and am still looking for ambitious People with expertise.

Regards

Zeksal

Current update';

The appartment does need rewiring to handle 25 th. The cooling is al set and will manage. We allready had 5 AC's that are very powerfull in the apartment. I am still looking for good hardware deal, unfortunatly most suppliers are sold out currently.

Regards,

Zeksal

At this time either s5's delivered in like 3 weeks or used hardware buying is your best bet if you want to attempt such a feat.
Even my two s3's at home deliver a good chunk of heat.

We have been asking this for a while.

With price and 1T unit mentioned I'm guessing it is a Dragon 1T(A1).

I am buying second hand miners in the Netherlands. Electricity is 20ct per kwh here. Many miners sell their miners under market prices. These are used miners and most are around 1w/gh.
I have noticed spondoolies and other big mining hardware suppliers are out ofbstock so this is best option for me atm, I am still open for any suggestions or anyone that has around 20th to show me picture

Regards

I would highly suggest doing some ROI math.  If really 20 cents per KWh it is considered high, not low priced electricity.   With 1w/gh chances are you run at a loss.

Most pictures of 20 TH will be small warehouses not houses.  Houses you would need to spread it around unless wired up very nice.

Own investment
5k hardware costs
1k rewiring
250usd operation Cost per month Inc. Electricity

Electricity will be 20hours a day so I calculated month inkome per month at average 1200usd for approx. 22th/s

So I can operate as long as I can make more then around 400usd a month. In it for longterm bitcoin garnering aswell.

With 22 TH of A1 gear it sounds how are you making a profit at "Electricity is 20ct per kwh here"

Assuming 22TH of A1 gear that is 22,000 watts approx.  You would be paying approx 50 dollars a day in electricity.  This is approx 1500 in electricity for A1's not 400.  I see you making a profit of around 18.60 each day (at current rate).   

To pay for gear it would be 5000/18.60 = 268 day's to pay for equipment if difficulty does not go up.  You add difficulty you will have a very hard time at 20 cent KWh.

My friend can you read?  ???
In the Netherlands electricity is 20 ct/kwh.
At the location that I am planning to put the miners electricity is 2 ct/kwh approx, but we have agreed on
a fixed amount with the electricity provider, of 100 usd a month for the whole 22th/s opperation.

I suspected you were in Netherlands from your said you were purchasing miners there.   You never did say country you were in.

If you got it for 100 usd yes that is extremely cheap electricity for that amount.

The thing is, it is not a real country. Kurdistan is an autonome region in Irak. No taxes and Regulations.

I noticed you said "20 hours a day". Why only 20? Most mining operations are 24x7 full time operations. Virtually all the income calculators would have assumed 24 hours/day in terms of mining. I will assume that you can get good Internet access where your are going to set this up? Stopping and starting miners for 4 hours out of the day may be inconvenient and not entirely smooth every day if you aren't on site.

This is just a guess.  But I know of a data center that was built in very very low electricity.  But during peak times they could lose power.  But even though not 100 percent stable, it was cheap.

But I have no idea on Kurdistan infrastructure.

Yes that is a very good point. The person Who is head of Electricity is a Friend of ours so we can arrange Electricity and yes I have calculated on basis of 20hours.
Profits per month for 22th are calculated at 1800usd where I took 1200usd as monthly income from operation

if you are trying to get a loan for a minin operation, its best to build up your rep then link your ebay profile.

people can see most of those things, and tell either you should be trusted or not. Also, the amount you are asking also depends as well. If the loan is absurd and huge amount, then most wont agree, and explain how bitcoins will be paid back.

I have my money right at the moment. Im planning to start with 20th/s atm but might use btcjam as a way to grow if the Profits are as planned