Bitcoin Forum

** Please keep in mind this contract is for educational and entertainment purposes only and was created to understand the limitations of ETH contracts. **

The way it works is very simple. Send 1 ETH to:
0x3325439082FF8ba7371DFdAa1AF297bBfcAc21b2

For each ETH that comes in, the contract will redistribute that wealth among everyone who has put in before that.

The only fees taken are the actual GAS fees by the ETH network.

NO FEES GO TO THE CONTRACT CREATOR WHATSOEVER!

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By experimenting with this contract, any transaction fees you incur will be sent directly to the MINERS who are securing the ETH network.

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Source Code For Contract so you can verify:
https://live.ether.camp/account/3325439082ff8ba7371dfdaa1af297bbfcac21b2/contract

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This webpage shows you all stats for this contract:
http://contractsjust4fun.github.io/WealthRedistributionExperiment/

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To test the contract for yourself, load up Mist wallet and send 1 ETH to 0x3325439082FF8ba7371DFdAa1AF297bBfcAc21b2

Then send 1 ETH from a different address.

Watch as the first address receives some ETH from the second payment! Fun times!
Now you have 2 spots which will receive ETH every time someone after you sends a payment.

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If people continue to experiment with this contract in the future, you could be collecting payments for years to come!


Part of the experiment is to see how many people we can get into the contract before the GAS becomes too expensive for this contract to run.

Feel good knowing all fees generated from this experiment go directly into the hands of the miners helping to secure the ETH network. Too many greedy contract creators on this forum.

Comments, questions, suggestions are all welcome.

The contract seems to be working flawlessly. The 5th payment just came in and it split it .25 each to the previous 4 addresses.

See it on the blockchain:
http://etherscan.io/address/0x3325439082FF8ba7371DFdAa1AF297bBfcAc21b2#internaltx

One person tried to send .001 ETH and another person tried to sent 20ETH from a contract.
Both of these transactions were rejected and returned, the contract only will accept 1 ETH.

I love it

Can someone create GUI for this?

Cool, I tried this one out and it seems to work indeed.  :)

 ::) ???Can someone create the same but with no-limits on deposits?

The last thing we need are more copy paste jobs. Every other thread in this subforum has become a cancerous useless dapp advertisement in the past few days.

Interesting,

Everyone's gain is tending toward 0 asymptotically in theory.

You can do some maths :

If you are the first to play : you will win 2 Eth !
 2th : you will eventually regain your 1 Eth
 3th : 0.66 Eth
 4th : 0.5 Eth
 >10th : you will accumulate 0.2 Eth
 >20th : you will accumulate 0.1 Eth
 and so on ...


I don't get why some people invest many times 1 Eth, it won't increase profit at all.

euh, that isn't true?

You keep accumulating forever. Its not capped at 2 ETH or 1 ETH or 0.66 ETH

And having multiple times a 1 ETH investment just increases your overall return  :)

Every participant will asymptotically have a certain amount a Eth, no?

I mean,

if you invest 1 ETH now, you will never have more than 0.3 ETH  at the end ! Maths.

No. I think you are misinterpreting the rules somewhere.
Remember: Everyone who has deposited will receive a small part of every new deposit.

So you are totally wrong on that 0.3 ETH, I don't know where you're taking that from.

I just did the calculations
and if you invest now,
it will only take 6 entries after you ( = 70 dollars in deposits from other people) to reach that 0.3 ETH that you are talking about.
That's hardly the upper limit or the end, to say the least.
And it'll take a total of 230 dollars in deposits to break-even.
Everything that comes after that, is pure profits....

To put this in perspective:
The previous ETH pyramid I've participated in here on Bitcointalk has 76 000 dollars in deposits after 7 weeks (and is still ongoing...).
And with this pyramid here (online since yesterday), the person who's going to send an entry right now, right after me writing this post,
will only have to wait for 230 dollars to be deposited after him, before he breaks-even.

Everything that comes after that, is pure extra profits for this guy.

So if another 75 000 dollars would happen to come in like with the other pyramids, this person who deposits now
will be getting a nice part of that 75,000 USD, for a mere 1 ETH (= 11.5 USD)  investment.

This pyramid right here has just launched this weekend (only 1 day online) and has received about 187 USD in deposits so far,
with a potential of reaching 76,000 like that other pyramid.
If this pyramid only reaches 1 % of the success of the other biggest one here on this forum-section on Bitcointalk,
this already gives a great profit for those depositing right now.

So you are making a big mistake / miscalculation somewhere... :)

Yeah i understood my error. You are right ;)



However, let's make some forecasting :

We assume there is 20 people already in at the time i post this.

If you invest now 1 ETH,

it will take 30 more participations to reach the 1 ETH you invested (1/20+1/21+...+1/52)

To reach 2 Eth: 120 more participations from now !
To reach 3 Eth: 370 more participations from now !
To reach 4 Eth: 1000 more participations from now !

Going over 6/7 Eth is not very likely as it would need more than 50000 participations...



And we didn't talk about transaction fees:


Let's find the moment where all the transactions costs surpass 1 Eth ( approximative )
n*0.005>1 ETH=> n>200

The contract will fail and keep failing after the moment we reach 200 Eth invested.

This contract, if it never ends, will give you in the average 2.5 ETH if you invested 1 ETH, not a lot more.
Only the 4th first participants will go over 4 ETH.




Everything said here is approximative, especially for the transactions costs.



PS : there is something interesting in the code, translated to be clearer as :

for k=0 to n do :
   transactionAmount=1/n
   pay  participant[k] with 1/n ether
  

As the first participants are paid first, the transactions that will fail first will belong to users that came in late. Just a detail.

Well, that's the definition of a pyramid, isn't it  ;D

Here is a webpage that shows you all of the stats for this contract:
http://contractsjust4fun.github.io/WealthRedistributionExperiment/

It shows each address participating in the experiment, how much they've earned so far, and what their next payout will be.

re: 200 ETH limit, is that really true?
even if the gas costs more than 1 ETH, it will just take you longer to profit, but the contract will still split the 1 ETH across all addresses evenly. The webpage should help you better visualize the potential of this contract.

I like the novelty and experimental nature of this one.  The risk is low and the behavior is different from standard ponzi contracts.  I'm curious to see what kind of response this gets.  I think it'll be entertaining to watch it generating increasingly fractional payments with every new entry.

At a time, all outgoing transactions will fail.

what happens from this point?

Wow this is cool,
nice to see you made a GUI for this pyramid :)

Indeed the GUI is simple and clear, nice !!  8)

We need to create the same, but with any amounts.

Indeed this is interesting - lets see how it will work with diversified deposits

Alternative suggestion: If you required each payout to be the same, so each deposit is the payout multiplied by the number of existing users, each player would get their initial deposit back once the total number of players had doubled.

It's already at 20 deposits.
Maybe now is a nice time to start marketing this one more publicly, other than solely this Bitcointalk topic.

Certainly given the fact we now have a GUI (http://contractsjust4fun.github.io/WealthRedistributionExperiment/) which makes that much easier :)

give it an upvote if you can.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethtrader/comments/4dfppm/eth_wealth_distribution_experiment_0_fee_supports/

It seems that it has been removed there  :-\

Already failing?

No, we are just talking about the reddit submission.
But Reddit isn't a good place to advertise anyway.

When are we going to reach 30 participants?  :)

Part of the problem is that it's all the same people participating in these games.

One thing that can help bring more new people in is to have whatever changes are necessary to make myetherwallet.com work for sending to contracts.

Once this is easier to do it will be possible for the masses to come and play these games.

The only people that can play right now are those willing to figure out how to setup geth and download the full blockchain. need to lower the barrier of entry.

Shapeshift being back online will help too.

This is real good point. Honestly, I have no clue why there is a technical limitation with online wallet... Do you have more insights ?

MyEtherWallet.com has an "Advanced / Offline Transaction" tab which allows specifying a higher gas limit when making payment transactions to contracts, which is sufficient for most of the basic investment game contracts.  The page is confusing the first time through, but once you understand the steps it's pretty straight forward.  It would work for participating in the majority of gamified contracts being played on this forum.

Mist/Geth still seems to be the best interface for interacting with contract functions.

I expect that Shapeshift's temporary issues are a part of the reduced activity the last few days.  That and people have lives during the week - or so I hear.  There are a few exchanges that have announced they'll be bringing ETH trading online within the next few weeks - I expect a flood of newcomers with each exchange that brings ETH online.  ;)

i agree about shapeshift. i would have put some Eth into these pits, but waiting to move my BTC to kraken, then waiting for 6 confirms, then pulling out takes too long...then its already too late.

So go into advanced, increase the GAS price  (to what value?) then go back to basic send transaction and send to the contract?

Someone should put this in screenshots to make it easier for new people to participate.

Also, is it possible to make necessary changes to the MyEtherWallet to detect a contract address vs regular address and auto adjust the gas accordingly in the basic transaction tab?

I've read suggestions of changing the Gas Limit (which is 21,000 by default in MyEtherWallet) to something in the range of 200,000 to 500,000 when sending to contracts.  Any excess will be refunded automatically, it's just an upper limit.  The more complicated or data intensive a contract is, the more gas it will need to operate.

https://www.myetherwallet.com/#offline-transaction

I was able to make everything work by using the most recent version of MyEtherWallet which has updates for setting gas limits:
https://github.com/kvhnuke/etherwallet/archive/mercury.zip

As soon as this new code live on MyEtherWallet.com it will be a lot easier for new people to come in, fund a wallet with shapeshift (back online horray!), and play a game.

Cool, looking forward to it. Someone else just participated as well so people keep coming  ;D

code is legit

Yes, and I've always received my payout correctly. I'm keeping track of it with an Excel sheet.

Investing now would be profitable if there would be 40 more participants...

The first won 3.6 though. Only the 8th first participant got more than their 1 Eth investment.

There are 21 participants at this moment.
So the fact there are already 8 having a profit is actually pretty good for a pyramid.
That's more than 1/3rd who are having a profit already right now  :)

Plus it's more fun when you see some action after every deposit.

Since this contract has no destroy function, nothing I can do will stop it. So if you think from now until the end of ETH, 40 more deposits will be made, then you could be profitable in this little experiment.

and if not, you get to play a role in understanding how Ethereum contracts work and it only costs you 1ETH plus gas minus whatever you get back from future depositors.

Improvements coming to the webpage this week and advertising banners. Now is the time to get in. Just4Fun

Nice! Looking forward to this  ;D
Advertisement is everything with these games, so it's nice to hear this stuff is coming.

Images are ready.

Is there some minimum post requirement needed to be allowed to post images here?

When i use the bbcode img tags, it just shows a link.

testing it:
http://etherscan.io/images/combine2.png


Besides this forum here are a few other places to list the contract:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereumprojects
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethdapps
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethdev
http://dapps.ethercasts.com/

There are also 15+ networks the banner can be listed on.

As promised:

New main image:
http://i67.tinypic.com/2khbu8.jpg

Ad Banner 468x60:
http://i64.tinypic.com/2aj88le.gif

Updated website:
http://contractsjust4fun.github.io/WealthRedistributionExperiment/

Indeed, there a minimum post requirement. You have to be Jr Member to display image (activity 42)
If you are active, you earn +14 activity every two weeks ;)

Thanks for that info. I need to get more active on here. It is key that the new image be displayed in the OP.

The new MyEtherwallet.com is released now. Sending ETH to contracts is now easier than ever!

In fact, you can now generate a special link that has the destination address and gas limits preprogrammed.

Here is an example for the Wealth Distribution Experiment:
https://www.myetherwallet.com/?gaslimit=200000&to=0x3325439082FF8ba7371DFdAa1AF297bBfcAc21b2&value=1#send-transaction

More info on this update:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4faooz/myetherwalletcom_v20_aka_mewtwo_has_arrived/

Now that 'normal people' can play these games too, I expect things to accelerate.

Good news, it is finally made more easy !!

How long did it take ? Anyone here know ? It seems nice but I just wanna make sure it goes as said.