Bitcoin Forum

2nd UPDATE

We are pleased to announce the upcoming IPO for Seedco Holding

http://www.Seedco.in

Seedcoin Fund is the first global seed-stage Bitcoin startup fund. The funds in bitcoin raised through this public offering will be invested in a portfolio of Bitcoin startups to be incubated by Seedcoin.

Seedcoin is a Bitcoin startup virtual incubator aiming to fund the creators of cryptocurrency related products and services such as exchanges, payment solutions, applications, mobile tech, wallets, and guide them through the first key stages of their development.


SFI aims to achieve Bitcoin-denominated capital appreciation and/or return through investments in a diversified portfolio of startups worldwide.

The startups will earn revenues from different Bitcoin-related services in a variety of geographical locations. SFI unit holders are entitled to receive Bitcoin-denominated dividends indirectly from the startups that have dividend distribution plans.

Funds raised through the SFI listing shall mainly be allocated to the Bitcoin startups and a portion shall be allocated to the management company for its operations and provision of fund management services.

SFI management company is comprised of a team of three members located in Hong Kong, Singapore and London with relevant experience in fund management, venture capital, software engineering, trading and entrepreneurship.

Offering Structure

SFI Fund will offer a total of 10,000,000 units, or 100% of Seedco Holdings Limited, all 100% of the Fund to be floated on HavelockInvestments.com.

2,000,000 (20%) will be offered on December 12th, 2013, Price Per Unit BTC0.001

500,000 Units per Block for a Total of 4 Blocks

1st Block Sold Out***

2nd Block Sold Out***

3rd Block Sold Out***

4th BlockSold Out***

8,000,000 (80%) will be offered at a later date within FY2014.

The offer on December 12th, 2013 will represent twenty percent (20%) of the units of the SFI (total units 10,000,000). These units will be offered exclusively through the HavelockInvestments.com website.


Link:  https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SFI
Public Offering: https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SFI#ui-tabs-3

Reports
https://www.havelockinvestments.com/reports.php

For a list of Companies Funded by Seedco and more information:
http://www.seedco.in/home/havelock

Interesting.

$10,000,000 is not the valuation of a company, nor of Seedcoin, this is a fund whereby 89% of the funds raised will be invested in several bitcoin startups. Out of the first raise of BTC2,000 we will invest in seven startups, payment processors, bitcoin wallets, bitcoin exchanges.. in various locations around the world. So there is not a single valuation but the valuations of the investment targets to consider. Some of these startups are at revenue and even at profit stage. For BTC10,000 to be raised over a few raises Seedcoin will help developing a large number of startups and therefore the whole bitcoin ecosystem, this is our main motivation and interest.

I've just watched an interview with you. The project is interesting.

However, are you aware about the recent change in Havelock policy that doesn't allow you to withdraw all the funds at once and invest, but only gradually and you'll have to justify to them how all the money is spent. Don't you see this as a potential issue, having to justify yourself to the exchange? It's not a practice I've seen elsewhere.  

Hi,

Actually this is not a new feature at Havelock, I have been talking to Havelockinvestments since August and the fact that funds must be withdrawn gradually and justified was already mentioned and accepted by us. We have no issue with this and we feel it helps assuring funds are used appropriately.

I tried reading your prospectus, but there were so many TLAs managing other TLAs that i lost track.

What i make out thus far:
1. You wish to raise $10,000,000 with an unsecured loan from us, so that you could, in turn, issue loans to other startups.
2. If things work out well, you reserve the right to change the terms of the prospectus at any point in time.
3. Somewhere along the line we expect to see profit, but exactly how is unclear from your prospectus.
4. Though you admit that your company is not worth 10 mil, you nevertheless are selling shares in ??? as if that ??? is worth 10 mil.  That's what the shares add up to.

Could you clear this up?  I'm not sure if i should be investing my BTC in your firm, or in a promising flash game site which is also trying to raise a few mil. on Havelock (Havelock, whose own IPO already failed to raise half the money it set out to make, but is being traded anyhow.  On Havelock.  Yeah.).
Anyhow, the flash site doesn't work, but its owner is very enthusiastic about its future.  Help me decide?
Thanks.

Hi Crumbs,

We are helping Bitcoin startups with attractive businesses prospects and some already profitable. Our structure is quite similar to standard funds whereby a management company helps a fund to find viable and interesting opportunities in a specific sector or industry, in our case, cryptocurrencies. A fund is mainly a company holding other companies shares so this is why the management team is quite important in the startup selection and investment process and management of the fund. However, I think you should mainly look at the startups since they will be the recipient of most of the bitcoins raised, a small portion of the funds raised will go towards ensuring we can keep providing services to the startups and their founders. The Bitcoin startups are located in various countries around the world and are responding to different needs or solving specific problems in the bitcoin ecosystem. Our company's value is actually a completely different topic which is not part of this IPO, the BTC10,000 we totally wish to raise - over a few offerings - is the amount of bitcoin the fund will invest. The unit holders will hold 100% of the fund. The fund will itself owns shares of the startups so the BTC10,000 should be considered as the available funds to invest in startups and the profit comes from the profit of these startups, and possibly dividends of these startups. Instead of buying units of seven bitcoin companies through seven offerings you have the possibility to buy units of a fund which plans to invest in seven startups (for now) and many more later.

I hope this is clearer, let me know if you have any more questions.

thanks

I think i get it, i'll try to put it in my own words:

1.  I hand over my money.
2.  You take a management fee, and invest my money in another company.
3.  ...or not -- that's left up to you.
4.  If the companies you invest in make money, we both get rich.
5.  If they all lose money, i go broke and you still get paid.

6.  If the above terms are still not to your liking, you reserve the right to change them at any time.

7.  I also take a risk on you or your Panamanian exchange walking off with my coin.  It would be crass to suggest such a thing anywhere but in bitcoin securities.  In bitcoin securities, on the other hand, i would be insane not to.
People who were not directly scammed by asset issuers were scammed by the exchanges.  Havelock, the exchange you are associated with, has exactly zero assets trading above IPO price.  None.

*If any of the above is inaccurate, i welcome your corrections.

crumbs, ar9, sum up how i feel about this quite nicely.

Let's focus on this for a moment.


How does this startup provide a more thorough service (in terms of speed, security, and reliability) compared to blockchain.info or Bitcoin-QT wallets? How large is the market for a Mac OSX wallet, as compared to Windows or Linux?


What sets this startup apart from BitPay.com? In other words, why should I consider using Cryptopay instead of the *very* well known (and reliable) BitPay?


This seems interesting, though I can't seem to find much information about them. Given an investment with you would partially be funding them, where I can I find a detailed prospectus for their company? Specifically, I'm looking for a business plan of sorts and at least some financials as to how they've done over the past month (it looks like they started early November).


I dug into this a bit (briefly), and as far as I can tell it's just a simple application / plugin that allows you to accept Bitcoin payments through various exchanges. What's the business model behind this, and how does this differ from setting up a typical "Bitcoin Accepted" Mt. Gox button for payments?


No qualms here; I think every country should have their own designated exchange to help facilitate local acceptance. What's the expected growth in the Mexican Bitcoin market?


I can't seem to find any information on this one. Is this sort of like a cold wallet, except stored on a SIM instead of, say, a USB drive?


This seems to tie into Hive as noted above...and how does this differ from BitPay?


Turning to your prospectus...
I see there are 3 entities associated with this project; SFI (the "Fund"), SHL (the "Issuer"), and SML (the "Management"). Am I to presume all 3 are the same company? I ask because the prospectus notes (under Offering Structure) that SHL is offering 10,000,000 units (20% on December 12th, 80% sometime within the next 365 days), but also that:

There's also a bit of a discrepency between your prospectus and website. On your website, you noted that BTC1,800 will be used for funding startups...but on the prospectus you noted only BTC1,780. I imagine this is just a miscalculated management fee. ;)



All in all, it seems interesting...but I don't know what makes you stand out from the rest. Investing in your fund requires an understanding of all you invest in, since that's how I'm able to calculate my overall risk. If you're working with "Grade A" companies to help them get started, then I expect a detailed summary of each company you deal with since my investment will, in turn, be going to them in the end. Unfortunately in this case I don't see any of that. All I see is "hey, we've been helping this set of companies get started, but they need funding and we want our cut...want to invest?".

This is how many ETFs and Index Funds operate, Crumbs. They take a management fee and invest your money into different companies. They basically provide you a service, easier way to diversify by investing in just one company.

These start-ups are also hard to get in via conventional means, most likely, so it also provides a way for people to invest early on.

Regarding the exchanges; I'd feel more confident if Havelock would allow the company to withdraw the proceeds immediately, not gradually. Saying it's a fail-safe to protect investors is stupid because an investor should perform due diligence before investing. If people don't trust the company, they won't invest in the first place.

This makes Havelock very attractive target for hackers and increases their incentives to just turn the lights off and walk away with a huge amount of BTC from several companies who didn't get to gradually spend all their IPO funds. This recent change in policy of theirs is bit disconcerting (and it is a recent policy change by the way).

This is how fiat ETFs operate.
With fiat, there are meddlesome government regulations and armed government thugs to enforce those regulations.
Bitcoin has nothing similar, so comparing fiat ETFs to bitcoin-based ones makes no sense.  Bitcoin investors can't count on someone else making laws & enforcing those laws to ensure that they aren't ripped of.
Bitcoin relies on cryptography and a powerful network to circumvent the problem of trust.  This doesn't imply that this problem magically disappears for everything touched by bitcoin.  It's very much there with bitcoin securities, as has been shown again and again.  That's why many fiat constructs can not simply be aped in bitcoin.

You mean like the MF Global case? :-\ Where were the government thugs when people needed them? latest development in that story http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-20/mf-global-managers-corzine-to-appeal-100-payout-ruling.html

Hi Crumbs,

yes the decision to invest has to remain ours otherwise our service is not so clear nor in conformity to how we present it. The management fee is actually helping us providing services to the startups to make sure they do succeed. As I mentioned above some of the startups are in profit mode but of course as with any investments there is always a probability for some to lose money at any given time. When you say 'we both get rich' let me point out to the fact that 100% of the startup equity is held by the fund, this means if the companies make money the unit holders are in first line to get dividends or benefit from the appreciation of such equity. In this particular case the bitcoin will be  transferred soon after the IPO to the target companies and should not remain long on Havelockinvestments wallets which I believe have proven safe since they started operating and the Panamanian fund is licensed. Everyone knows reputation is the first asset in the bitcoin securities world and of course this offering is a clear sign of trust on our behalf for the Panama Fund but I leave it up to each potential investor to assess any risk related to buying units via Havelockinvestments.com.

@Seedcoin

You keep messing quoting posts and make people think those are actually your words not Crumbs'.

Hi Korbman,

Re. the startups I will reply a bit later but I will also give a chance to their founders to reply, so getting back to you soon on this.

---------------
Re. these issues:

my answer:

SFI is the Fund name, the company name is SHL so yes SHL = SFI we just use SFI to make it clear this is a fund. SML is a different company, it is the fund management company managing the funds raised by SHL. As you may know a 'fund' is just a company holding other companies' shares so it needs a management company to manage those funds.

re. the management fees they are set at 11% so startups will receive 89% of the amount raised so BTC1,780 in total.
-------------

All the startup business plans/presentations have been provided to Havelockinvestments.com I will arrange it so that potential investors of SFI will have access to these asap.

First, please understand that i'm not endorsing government regulation.  It is sufficient to acknowledge that it exists to realize the enormous differences between fiat and bitcoin ETFs.  Handing over your cash to any stranger who asks for it can't be justified with "A bank teller could steal it from you too."

(1) and (2) are mutually exclusive.  Either the IPO coin are distributed to the startups, or they are in Havelock's wallet, never both.
(3)  Considering the failure of Havelock's own IPO & the failure of other recent offering -- 7C (the multimillion-valued broken flash game site), i'd say that trust is relatively easy to come by.

Most important question that everyone should ask themselves in this Bitcoin investment space is very simple one: "Would it be in their best interest to scam me or not?" or "Do they have more to win by scamming or by playing fair."

In some cases answer is yes and in other cases answer is no.

The second question should be "what's the market like?"  Today's answer is "It's in a full-throttle nosedive."

Bitcoins are transferred to the startups but the company shares are held by the fund so (1) and (2) are intrinsically associated to this transfer of coins for equity. As a unit holder you provide bitcoin to the startups and you get shares in return, the difference here is that these shares are held by the fund.

I've made a couple of investments so far in Bitcoin/crypto companies via Bitcoin exchanges and I'm pleased with them so far. One of them is in Neo&Bee, another one is in BuyAHash on the old Litecoinglobal exchange. I've also picked up some Litecoininvest shares, which has very dedicated team behind it.

Neo&Bee and BuyAHash are in the green and I'm down a bit on litecoininvest. Overall it has been more profitable than keeping the money in Bitcoin.

NEOBEE is not in the green.  Being in the green implies profit, while NEOBEE is trading at IPO prices.  Factor in the fees, slippage & the fact that millions of shares are available at IPO prices, and you're losing money.
BuyAHash, as i understand it, is a Litecoin, not bitcoin security. Not familiar with it, though if it's a litecoin-denominated, it is not relevant.
Same for Litecoininvest.

Please remember that we're dealing with bitcoin, not litecoin.

Holding shares != holding bitcoins.  If the money is given to the startups, it is no longer held by Havelock, thus making (1) and (2) mutually exclusive.

I've bought Neo&Bee below IPO price so I'm in the green atm.

Lol, many people made a bundle trading Labcoin.  I was tempted to jump in on the fun, since the swings were so deliciously predictable -- that was a great stock to trade.  Nonetheless, if not for the endless supply of greater fools, investing in Labcoin would have been pointless -- it's currently trading at 0.
I'm not suggesting that money couldn't be made trading in failing companies.  It can, it's being done every day, and it's loads of fun.

I've pondered a lot about investing Neo&Bee and I think it will very successful. I've looked into it from many angles. Mark my words, this particular stock will perform very well. It can capture growth of Bitcoin and some. Hadn't been for the sudden shutdown of btc-to and bitfunder, all shares would have sold by now.

Korbman's analysis is exactly what I'd like clarification on from Seedcoin. You've provided a list of a handful of companies with their stated goals, but nothing about the projected timeframes for deployment, possible market, or profitability. Can we get some numbers here, or at least more details?

And can we have any details about how/when dividends will be issued?

Except that there is zero basis for imagining you're any better equipped than the average bipedal life form to "help", "find", or otherwise create any sort of value. Managing other people's funds and identifying worthwhile projects are not trivial tasks; they require specific expertise. Not interest, not passion, not "we talked to some guy named Dan and he likes us", expertise. That's what you need to focus on demonstrating. And that, well before you solicit "investments".

See here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=124441.0).

The Mexico btc exchange seems interesting too.

http://www.mexbt.com/

Found this website.

as a reply to Korbman and your question I have started contacting the founders so that they can reply to the comments made by Korbman earlier

from Korbman re. Cryptopay

response from Cryptopay
We are located in Europe and one of our key feature is that we know how to become fully compliant with the current local legal framework. Our payouts to Europe don’t impose any limits on the amount and are credited to merchant’s bank account the next working day.

As our company is still early stage — we can be flexible on our business model and we are happy to provide the solutions for merchant’s with specific needs.
Cryptopay is going to roll out our POS solution within the next month and that might be something that could increase the adoption of Bitcoin payments to brick&mortar stores.
At the moment, as we don’t serve US customers, we are working outside the scope of American regulations, so our legal costs are significantly lower than in the US.

PS: We believe, that you can’t rely on just one company, even if it is “very” well known.

------------
I will post startup business plans / pitchdecks asap on:
http://www.seedco.in/home/havelock

BTC.sx pitchdeck is there now, more coming.

Sure your are right managing other people's funds requires expertise. I have been involved with private equity and venture capital for the last nine years mainly in China and South East Asia. I also would like to point out - specially for the "find" part - that I have personally met most of the entrepreneurs including the founders of MEXBT.com, GoCoin, Hive, BTC.sx; my partner has met the Cryptopay co-founders in the UK; I will meet Monero's founder next week and our Austin-based mentor has met the founder of zSIM. We have organized a conference in Singapore, the first bitcoin conference in Asia, on November 15 where many of these entrepreneurs were present and we had 200 attendees from all over the world. So in the "find" area I can say we have been quite active, in addition to the tens of entrepreneurs my two partners and I have talked to in meetups, over skype, and via email. For the "help" part we have already been providing services in finding partners, registering companies, assessing risks and the regulatory environment, defining the business model, defining the business strategy and targeting certain markets. Of course much more work still needs to be done but this is what we do daily. I think the result of this work will very soon demonstrate our focus and dedication to our main task: helping entrepreneurs around the world to build successful bitcoin-centric startups.

@Seedcoin

Does this fund also have a maintenance fee or is that 11% off a one time fee that covers all future expenses?

There is no maintenance fee, 11% is a one time fee.

Hive has been on my observe list for a while so I do recognize this as an interesting group
They have a thread here for anyone who wants to check them out
For the other assets not familiar with at this point in time
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=304060.0

Its D@T so no off topics :)

Answer from Nikos, Monero's founder:

Monero is creating a collection of plugins for various platforms that will allow merchants to easily integrate existing payment processors (Bitpay, Coinbase, BIPS, GoCoin, BitPagos) into their e-commerce stores. Merchants will not have to integrate each processor separately and the plugins will allow easy switching between them. Although the plugins will be free and open-source, Monero will generate recurring revenue through a Software-As-A-Service (SaaS) model by providing additional capabilities to merchants. At this moment, Monero does not publicize the list of features that the SaaS will provide, since they are under development. You can sign up for the Monero mailing list at monero.co in order to receive up-to-date information about those SaaS features. 

One clarification: In your question, you mentioned integration of existing exchanges, like Mt Gox. Monero will not integrate those. Instead, as mentioned above, it will integrate payment processors like Bitpay, Coinbase, BIPS, GoCoin, and BitPagos.

Claiming to have "been involved" with nary an iota of substantiation does not constitute establishing your competence or expertise. It constitutes further proof that you're able and willing to say anything, and that you're either unaware of how to present yourself or else too lazy to actually do it correctly. Same goes for passing off conference organization as some kind of artifact of financial expertise.

Yes, various idiots have been murkying the waters of this forum with similar contentless assuring for years; this doesn't mean it's in any way acceptable. You can either demonstrate that you're capable and serious, which means following the actual protocols of the field, or else you can appeal to the groups here that have no business investing and who will cheer on your good intentions 'til their last satoshi is gone. Don't mistake that second option as anything other than blowing it.

How can you be so sure of this? It would actually be against Havelock's new policy to do that. Certainly these incubated businesses don't need all the money at once, do they? Havelock can gradually dispense money based on invoices and such or some other proof showing how they're going to be spent. It's either this or Havelock doesn't stick to their own terms.

This will be a case by case decision and in conformity with Havelock's policies and approval of transfer of coins.

answer from Gabriel Miron, founder of MEXBT.com

MEXBT is the first Profesional Bitcoin exchange for Mexico, and part of Latin America.  We are aiming for an average growth of 50% each month in the first few months of operations.  Our main focus is to target the remittance corridor from the United States to Mexico, but this will be tackled after we have established MEXBT as the most reliable Bitcoin exchange in the country.  

So this 2m shares is just for the listed companies. The next 2m shares will be for future companies?

Any idea how much of these companies profits go into the dividends?

yes the next 2m shares will be for future companies, each Seedcoin Fund tranche offering will introduce new seed-stage startups.

Each company will have its own dividend policy we cannot impose a uniform dividend policy to seven companies in different markets and at difference stages of development or profitability. 100% of the company shares allocated to Seedcoin Fund will belong to the subscribers of the offering taking place on Havelock and all shares held by the fund will be entitled to the same dividends as any other shareholder of the company. I think investors should take into consideration that it is reasonable to expect that these startups, vetted by Seedcoin and guided by its managers and mentors, and funded, in part, by the Havelock members buying units of this fund, are increasing their chances to succeed among Bitcoin startups. In the event of a buy out or a major investment into these companies the Seedcoin Fund unit holders will get special dividends as compensation for their contribution to the success of these early-stage Bitcoin startups.

Press clips about Seedcoin Fund startups and Seedcoin :

BTC.sx : http://bitcoinexaminer.org/australian-startup-launches-bitcoin-only-margin-trading-platform/

Hive : http://www.coindesk.com/hive-osx-wallet-promises-app-integration/

GoCoin : http://www.coindesk.com/gocoin-raises-500k-bitcoin-payments-asia-south-america/

Seedcoin : http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1351315/hong-kong-based-entrepreneur-planning-asias-first-bitcoin-conference

Seedcoin : http://www.scmp.com/business/banking-finance/article/1358150/hong-kong-entrepreneurs-could-win-slice-bitcoin-pie

Seedcoin : http://www.techinasia.com/bitcoin-change-world/

--
Interviews with Seedcoin Fund startup founders :

MEXBT : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLs0WCqUemw

Hive : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUpn0UvmAok

GoCoin : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElKEGGOcFbU

Seedcoin : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpy9gt5Js_k

I wrote you an email with a couple of questions, and asked if there was a thread at bitcointalk.org you could refer me to.

You did neither, just said you were busy.

So sorry, I'm too busy to invest in your half-arsed idea of an IPO

LMAO, thanks for sharing.
I think it is quite important to share this kind of (missing) feedback with other users.

To be honest, it pissed me off. I read all their literature (2 hrs), and prepared just a simple couple of questions because their was several obvious things missing from their prospectus e.g. what % of the companies they were investing in they would actually own, which of the companies they were investing in actually paid dividends, and they couldn't be bothered to answer.

Companies that expect investment are going to have to do some basic legwork to get people onside. Some people at least attempt due diligence before giving their bitcoins to random people  ;)

This was my reply to your message on Dec. 12 (your message was dated Dec. 10 evening time) :

"I am at the Inside Bitcoin conference in Las Vegas so not easy to reply earlier.

If you want to talk I am available at 415-509-9028 and will fly back to Hong Kong on Friday morning."

from my email to which you did not answer since the 36 hours delay in my answer had discouraged you from participating to the IPO. Once again I am sorry I did not reply in the 24 hours of your message.

The 'random people' as you define the entrepreneurs who will receive the bitcoin from this raise are hard working entrepreneurs who are providing helpful and relevant services to the bitcoin community, bitcoin exchanges, payment processors, wallets, etc. Their business plans are available on http://www.seedco.in/home/havelock

None of these entrepreneurs have made public any dividend distribution plans as of today, contrary to mining operations where bitcoin may become available soon after initial hardware investment has been made, non-mining Bitcoin-centric companies live by the same rules as any other startups meaning they need to build something, original products and/or services, acquire clients and manpower to service these clients before paying out dividends. If you are looking for a short term, dividend paying investment this fund may not be the best option, although focused on seed-stage startups Seedcoin is looking for companies with promising prospects on the medium to long term and dividend distribution is not our main criterion of investment when selecting startups for the fund.

You mention in your prospectus in Havelock that all future IPO batches will also be sold for the same price of BTC0.001.

So what is the incentive for investing at this stage then? We pay the same price now as we would pay in the future, but we have more risk. And there's no dividend being paid anyway, so it really doesn't make sense to invest now, much better to wait and invest later.

Can you comment please?

Thanks for answering. Although you still haven't said what ownership % you will get of any of the companies from your investment. Can you answer that at least? That at least should be answerable.

The median equity stake Seedcoin Fund I should get from each investment in the SFI startups is 10%.
100% of these equity stakes will go to the SFI unit holders therefore the question should be 'What % of ownership will the SFI unitholders hold into the startups?" (not 'us').

There are two main reasons why I cannot give you a precise breakdown of each equity stake per company:
- fundraise on Havelock Investments is not yet complete, the equity stakes effectively acquired by SFI will depend on the actual investments completed (which may differ from the initial intention) so we need to wait for the final amount of the fundraise to know the actual stakes;
- some startups have asked us not to divulge their valuation at this stage.

However, I will go back to each entrepreneur and see who allows me to mention the agreed upon equity stake for the prospective investors of SFI on public forums such as this one. As soon as I get a positive answer from these entrepreneurs, I will publicize the information here.

fyi today's article about Seedcoin and SFI : http://www.coindesk.com/seedcoin-incubator-brings-bitcoin-startups-world/

we are doing our best to provide as much information as we can about this raise and the Bitcoin startups of Seedcoin Fund I to the general public.
 

Thank you. some solid numbers at last. I will consider investing now :)

interesting idea, following

What happens if the initial 2M shares don't get sold?

The same thing as if the shares sold:  Trading starts, shares tank. 

Can't wait to get in on the post ipo crash.

Ah ........

We will adjust the investment per startup according to total amount raised. We will keep all Seedcoin Fund I unit holders informed of any change in the investment amount depending on total amount of bitcoin raised through this offering.

Announcing SFI Entrepreneurs-Investors Hangout Sessions

We are setting up Q&A sessions with the Seedcoin Fund I entrepreneurs via Google hangout so that potential investors of the SFI IPO on Havelock Investments (https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SFI) may ask questions to them directly.

First session will be held on Saturday Dec. 28 at 10am GMT with Leon, founder of zSIM. Leon is currently in Australia (GMT+11), we will schedule another session soon at a more suitable time for US-based potential participants. Please connect with zsim@seedco.in for this first google hangout session.

Throughout the upcoming sessions you may ask questions to the founders of BTC.sx, Cryptopay.me, GoCoin.com,  Hivewallet.com, MEXBT.com, and Monero.co. You may find dates and times of future session times on this thread : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=387030

and on http://www.seedco.in/home/havelock

Recent press clips about Seedcoin and its fund raise for Bitcoin startups :

http://www.coindesk.com/seedcoin-incubator-brings-bitcoin-startups-world/

http://foundersgrid.com/bitcoin-asia

How many shares sold to date?

pls check https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SFI

number after "Units outstanding" is the number of units sold. If you go to the tab "public offerings" on that page you can see the number of units sold for each block of 500,000 shares and remaining number of units for current block.

Or you could have just told me how many shares sold to date. Never mind.

Cool, I just invested some. I really like the idea of the mexican markets and GoCoin looks great aswell.

'Teach a man to fish and he'll be an ungrateful dick about it'

Not sure that's a real saying, but I get your point :)

Yeah I'm interested too in the Mexican exchange, how much did you invest?

No news about anything here? Has the captain left the ship?

There's never been a captain, only somali pirates.

Following the end of the fund raise a few days ago we have been busy putting in place the agreements for each startup with the assistance of specialized lawyers, the term sheets corresponding to each investment of SFI is being sent out to the SFI startup entrepreneurs this week and as soon as they are approved and executed we will publish the investment conditions, investment amounts and stakes to be owned by SFI and its investors via HavelockInvestments.com.

We are currently also selecting the second batch of Bitcoin startups for SF-2, Seedcoin Fund 2. We have received more than 50 applications in less than one month via http://www.f6s.com/bitcoinstartupvirtualincubator and directly by email from Bitcoin entrepreneurs around the world.

We would like to reiterate that each offering will raise funds for different Bitcoin startups, therefore each offering should be considered as separate investments with distinctive potential returns and potential dividends. Throughout the offerings the Funds' managers will  keep the investment focus on cryptocurrency startups at an early stage of development.

Hi Lohoris,

We are considering a project in Eastern Africa but not in that state.

Cheers!
While I'm still unconvinced by this project, mostly because of Havelock's involvement, I sincerly appreciate this ironic and fun response (seriously, no pun intended).

What is it you dislike about Havelock?

Did you follow their IPO?

No, I did not.

How long will the dividends be paid from the first fund? If the second fund is started the dividends from the first fund stops?

Why would they stop?

Speaking of dividends, although regarding their initiation rather than their cessation: is there a tentative timeline for when shareholders might expect to see commencement of dividend payments?

There is no time limit for dividends as long as startups are profitable and decide to pay out dividends and as long as SFI still owns shares in that company, 100% of the dividends entitled to SFI will be paid out to the unit holders on Havelock pro-rata of their unit holdings. Any dividends from SFI and from subsequent funds (SF-2 and so forth) are entirely unrelated so payment of dividends from one Seedcoin fund does not prevent payment of dividends from another Seedcoin fund.

May I ask about payments upon the sale of companies in SF-1? Will shareholders also be paid out pro-rata?

Many thanks!

Yes, proceeds from the sale of shares held by SFI in a company could be considered as special dividends and will be treated in a similar way, they will be paid out to SFI unit holders pro-rata of their holdings. SFI will pass 100% of the payments entitled to its shareholdings in the company onto the SFI unit holders.

SFI is investing in startups unrelated to crypto mining and therefore following the same rules as any other early stage startups, only those achieving a certain degree of profitability are likely to distribute dividends in the near future, 100% of those dividends as attributable to SFI stakeholding will be passed onto Havelock SFI unit holders. Some SFI startups are profitable but not all of them, early-stage startups are usually not profitable. As a seed-stage fund SFI aims at holding stakes of startups with a high probability of later stage investment (series A) at which time SFI will exit or sell out most of its shares and distribute 100% of the shares sale proceeds to the SFI unit holders via Havelockinvestments.com (as described in a post above).

In other words: Don't expect a dividend from SFI any time soon. This sounds like a bad thing, since people here thrive on news of dividends, but in reality it's not.

These are startups; real startups don't pay dividends in the first year (or at all). Normally, the idea is to take the startup capital and either

1) Get bought out by a larger company, or
2) Become a successful medium to large sized business

In this space, buyouts haven't been very frequent, so I would say that most of these startups are probably looking at the long term. I don't really see any reason for any of them to pay a dividend, actually.

So, if you're in this for the long run, it may be a good investment. If you're looking for dividends in the next 1, 3, or 6 months - you're probably looking at the wrong stock.

But don't be worried by a lack of dividends, because not every big company even pays them.

Two famous examples are Berkshire Hathaway and Apple.

Two somewhat less famous examples:  Labcoin and Active Mining.

Many thanks for the prompt answers. Much appreciated.

Well I have be talking to Havelock since August 2013 and I can tell you the due diligence on Seedcoin has been very thorough and we had a very high number of exchanges before agreeing on the process and approving the offering. I am grateful to Havelock for letting us offer Seedcoin Fund units to their members and providing funds to these Bitcoin startups. Investments in startups, being involved in crypto activities or not, are always risky but sometimes risk can pay off well, and Havelock is one of the few options available for anyone to invest in these startups.

More info on the Eastern Africa venture coming soon...

Just my 2 satoshis - I really think offering the zSIM alternative to M-PESA (or maybe in collaboration?) would be an amazing opportunity, not only for bitcoin but also the unbanked of Africa.

Agreed, though that's more western Africa unless I'm mistaken.
In eastern Africa I guess they will need something to help or replace hawala.

That's more North Africa (the Maghreb) but it's still a good point. If you can make it sound like Bitcoin is more in keeping with 'Islamic Banking principles' you may find it takes off very well.

Investors deserve to be kept in the loop kind of surprised that I am just hearing about most of this information now
In the Disclosure
I became aware of the GoCoin news 4 days ago, 3 days after Seedcoin did. I instantly brought these questions up with Seedcoin and they assured me they would inform the market within a few days.

Guess I wait but looking back nobody has done anything in this thread since January lol

Does this company not give monthly or quarterly reports? How is an investor supposed to know what is going on? Looks like it has been a scam all along.

Well they are strangely quiet about their operations would not call that a scam quite yet though

I don't think they are a scam, they just were not prepared to deal with general public investors and don't care about them very much.

All updates for the SFI Fund are made public through the UPDATE tab section when clicking on the Fund:

https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SFI

Hi Peter,

I was at Inside Bitcoin NY last week, then DATA meeting in DC, then at the Toronto Bitcoin Expo 2014. We try to be as open and available in what we do, failure to update this thread on bitcointalk does not mean there is any issue with our operations. Fyi I invite you to contact any of the founders of the following startups: Cryptopay, CoinSimple, MexBT, Hive, zSIM and BTC.sx and ask them about Seedcoin and our involvement. I am in regular contact with all the entrepreneurs on a regular basis, helping them in various areas or providing assistance through our mentors and legal advisors. We are busy making sure these startups go to the next level of funding and I am confident SFI unit holders will benefit from our early involvement with these companies. Many VCs, angel investors and boutique investment firms are seriously looking or investing in Bitcoin startups, Seedcoin is in a unique and privileged position to benefit from the increase of interest from investors in this space. I can be reached at any time via <info@seedco.in> if you have any questions about our operations do not hesitate to contact us.

Sorry about any delay in providing timely information about GoCoin and its refusal to accept our investment. We have worked with the GoCoin stakeholders and founder since last November and we did not manage to finalize this investment. I would like to assure all SFI unit holders we have made our best efforts to complete the investment in accordance with our investment policies which have been accepted by the other startups until such time as GoCoin legal advisor eventually informed us of this decision. While the information was received earlier by email we had to discuss it internally among our partners and our lawyers and I have also met with GoCoin stakeholders in the US last week. We have removed GoCoin from the Seedcoin website. We have not removed GoCoin from the SFI Havelock initial investment prospectus but we will remove GoCoin pitchdeck from the SFI startup list. We will ask Havelock Investments approval to issue an update for the SFI investment prospectus.
We maintain cordial relations with GoCoin's founder and stakeholders and wish them success in their ventures.
At this stage we have decided not to introduce a new startup in SFI as we are aware that several of the current SFI startups may need additional bitcoin investment and such investment may result in a stronger case when discussing with future external investors. SFI has committed BTC1,400 to the six other SFI startups so far. 11% of the fund raise was meant to fund Seedcoin operations and startup support activities out of which we have paid 5% of the bitcoin fundraise to Havelock Investments. Any further investment in SFI startups will be communicated prior to the operations and will result in the acquisition of additional shares of these startups by the fund and therefore an increased stake for SFI unit holders.
We are working hard on a daily basis with SFI startups so that their performance may attract serious and reputable series A investor interest to reach positive results for SFI unit holders.

Thank you for your updates.

Thank you for your updates as well, glad to hear some news about the current state of affairs at Seedcoin.

Good news everyone!  You have a twin, Seedcoin II!
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=582933.0

Yeah, fund one down 20% from IPO with no news on any startups. Why not go for round two?

Updates are regularly posted on https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SF1

We are doing a monthly update/newsletter next one to be published next week. We are conscious this is a fast pace environment and will do our best to update more frequently.

I would like to emphasize the SF2 startups are new startups and present fresh investment opportunities, potential investors may assess these ventures and ask questions on the individual threads of each startup on this forum in the Marketplace -> Securities section.

More info re. SF2 on http://www.seedco.in/home/havelock/SF2

Will Seedcoin I be investing in Seedcoin II?
Seems like a perfect opportunity, given the freed coin from GoCoin defection (good riddance, I say!)?
Or...

No, SFI funds are only used for SFI startups.

Why isn't Seedcoin II one of these startups?  Not enough promise?

Porky/Lambchop/MP,

So now the 'fun' of trolling NeoBee has ended, is this your new target?

Edit: I won't bother reading your replies. I learned long ago to keep your accounts on ignore.

Warning people to GTFO, long before the inevitable OKTHXBI! from Danny, is trolling?  You were trolled by Danny, not me.

I tried to help you.
You thought you knew better.
Predictably, it ended in tears.

Hear that everyone? We should be listening to every 12 year old troll with a chip on their shoulder.

Every time I check a thread here I notice it is littered with ignored posts from you or notlambchop. Sometimes I read what you two have to say in the hopes you may have grown up and decided to add something of value but thats never the case.

Seriously why do two you do it? Don't you realize that your mindless trolling convinces nobody to not invest?

You both have spent literally hundreds of hours on this forum and posted nothing but shit. Why?

I do this to rid Bitcoin of fail and AIDS.
I patiently explain to your ilk *exactly* what will happen, and point to to those who failed to listen -- where there is much moaning and gnashing of teeth.
When all I've foretold comes to pass, as it always does, I do not waste you and cast you aside.
No.
I craft your misadventures into compelling cautionary tales, so that some innocents may be spared your pitiful fate.

You can keep telling yourself that but we all know it's not true. You spam every thread saying "bad investment" but instead of using logic/reasoning to convincing people, you use emotion and attempt to create drama/fud which is largely ignored.

To be clear I don't think seedcoin is a particularly good investment but I have not really done any due diligence. But if you have, then you should stop wasting your time with useless posts and let us know why this is a shitty investment in your opinion.

jimmothy, it's obvious to me that you are willfully uneducable.  Which doesn't mean you should be angry or sad.  Oh no, jimmothy, God don't make junk.

I have chosen to use you as a learning aid, jimmothy, a thing I can point to when a child misbehaves.  "Study your lessons," I'll say, "or someday, you'll grow up to be like ...that!"  The child would shriek, but after that one nasty shock she would truly comprehend the perils of failing at life, and apply herself to her studies.
:)

MP got buried by the banhammer so your looking for ghosts :)

Oh, jimmothy.  Why do you need so much convincing of things that are obvious on their face to everyone else?  I mean, I even use pictures--children understand pictures...

http://s22.postimg.org/xew0sia1t/Capture.jpg

IPO price:  ฿0.001

Last sell: ฿0.00002

Bonus question @Havelock:  Any comments?

So the share price is getting dominated and no timeline on dividends? Meanwhile quite a few of the startups are making announcements about success yet no income for unit holders. Is Seedcoin going to provide details of the commercial arrangements it has struck with it's companies so that unit holders can understand whether they should expect any sort of dividend.

So far the only security which seems to have ever been a success seems to be AsicMiner and even that was shortlived.

AM was in a steady decline since its listing on Havelock.

http://s3.postimg.org/vsprxiwcj/Capture.jpg

I'm referring to it's Div's, to be honest that's what i care about the most, SF1 has yet to pay any divs at all, they've invested in a heap of companies doing apparently high volumes but yet no div payouts.

Does anyone know why SF1's value is collapsing? Got to say, I'm a little pissed off - I recently lost some BTC in NEOBEE.

With Apple's announcement that they're going to accept Bitcoin wallets, surely selling Hive is one way to get some money back to us investors?

It seems like a good time to followup on this asset
When is the next financial report due for Seedcoin and how have companies progressed so far.

I was about to sell earlier, but decided until there was a small update to wait

good thing i only have 26 shares so im not worried about that i cant decide if i should even keep them or sell before if goes down further
is this project dead whats the deal?

@stompy

No update since the SF2 IPO in regards to SF1 had a mail on May 5 but nothing for June yet

SFI update as of May 9, 2014 - Seedcoin Nominated Most Influential Investor at Blockchain Awards 2014

The Blockchain Awards 2014 have selected Seedcoin as one of the top three most influential investors for the year along with Marc Andreessen and Roger Ver at Bitcoin 2014, the yearly Bitcoin conference organized by Bitcoin Foundation.

You may vote here :

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1XGPghf1OsdgTmrsiEscWqcPjssfDX3u8IE-PBOLebc4/viewform


About Seedcoin

Seedcoin is the world's first seed-stage Bitcoin startup virtual incubator, whose objective is to invest in the creative entrepreneurs of the cryptocurrency economy and help them develop the future services, products and applications re-shaping the way we interact with money on a daily basis. Visit http://www.seedco.in/ for more information.


About Blockchain Awards

Presented by Bitcoin Foundation and Blockchain.info, the first annual Blockchain Awards 2014 celebrate innovation and excellence in the bitcoin community. The awards will be held on Friday, May 16 at Bitcoin 2014 on the Main Deck of the Passenger Terminal Amsterdam.
Visit http://bitcoin2014.com/ for more information.

Will we ever see any dividend from this thing? This looks like pretty shit investment so far and communication from SFI is pretty much non-existent.

Anyone that put money into this should have realized that this is a very long-term play. The value here, if any, lies in the equity of Bitcoin startups - dividends won't be paid out for a long time, if at all.

This is more of a true venture capital investment - Marc Andreessen isn't hounding Coinbase for dividend payments, is he?

To illustrate third-party risks / probability of seeing profit in this venture,
http://1-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/biz/image/1393/18/1393183655655.jpg

Two loosely related conditions have to be met for the Bitcoin investment to pay out dividends:

1.  The issuer must make a profit.
2.  The issuer must not run away with your money.

http://cdn.gifbay.com/2013/08/raccoon_steals_cat_food-70182.gif
                         Fig. 1

Now allow me to place the Seedcoin scenario into a more familiar context for our young investment enthusiasts:

In a strange town, you find yourself in need of a dime bag.
Prudently proceeding to the shittiest part of town, you are attracted to a young gentleman (SF1) offering to take your money and BRB with teh bag.
You, being a wizened veteran of such dealings, hand over the money and tell him to "hurry back bro."
The gentleman reveals to you that he's not a runner himself, but knows the runner, will now go find him, hand over your money, and wait for the d00d to come back with teh bag.

You hand him another twenty & wait.

Can you bring back your crumbs persona? The NotLambChop persona's outdated kidspeak (teh, d00d) gets tiring after a while.

Twentyseventy, my pedagogy is aimed at the educable--our younger finance enthusiasts.  I have explicitly stated this my previous post.
But I do thank you for bringing the needs of our geriatric money revolutionaries to my attention.  Anything in particular you'd like to study?

disregarding the comments here, this is feeling too much like neobee for my liking time to sell up for me, good luck guys.

I am pretty surprised by the price development. Has anybody tried to analyze the orderbook and the transactions during the time of the price drop?

What is there to be analyzed? It's as simple as that: this "investment" is sh..t and the price is going down... to 0.

Why? What do you not like about them? Do you have any arguments to back up your claim?

A better question to ask is "what is it you like about them?"  BTW, SF1 used to be called SF.  Then there was a second IPO, SF2.  That instantly failed because obvious.

Can you be more specific, instead of just being negative? Seems like you all knew it before. Why? What did make you "know" it was bad?
Or are you one of these guys who lost a lot on Bitfunder/MPEX/... and now thinks everything is necessarily bad?

@doolittle:  I have lost exactly nothing on Bitfunder, MPEX, BTCT, etc., etc., by virtue of laughing at the available offerings instead of "investing" in them.  If you would like to know my take on this particular "fund," please read my previous posts in this thread.

  ~Happy investing

Yes, I have just spend 10 minutes to go through the whole thread and to look at your postings. I have found nothing of value.
Just a graph of the chart and some meaningless chatter.  jimmothy already said it all.
Congratulations: you just wasted another five minutes of another human beings life.

Either my posts are devoid of value, or ...let's just say like you, my cat finds them less interesting than, oh... a new cardboard box.
So instead of getting upset, maybe go look for a fun cardboard box to play in?

This implies that 5 minutes out of 10 weren't wasted.
Not bad.
Not good, but definitely not bad either.

LOL. I knew somebody would catch on that :)

*Boop*
http://pinkie.ponychan.net/chan/files/src/139950706907.gif

http://s11.postimg.org/l9oexbxn7/Capture.jpg

Deeply discounted, and plenty of it.  Go go go!

Perhaps you missed something?
What?  Related to this?
Nah.

NotLambchop,

Wow looks like your all knowing and telling me not to buy at 0.00018 was one of the best moves I could have done.

/s

Anyway the company is looking at buying back shares at 0.00045 and while a good bet for those that want out and bought low I'm sticking with the fund. The equity in the holding company is definitely an interesting move but I reserve any decision on that value til we see at what ratio they are looking to do.

However those that were able to buy in below the 0.00045 mark it looks like you will be profiting either way.

Anyone else have thoughts on the announcement?

You appear in this thread exactly 0 times, don't remember advising you.  Are you sure you're logged into the correct account?

Regardless.  Jumping out of a 10th story window in hopes of getting rich is stupid.
It doesn't become unstupid even if you happen to land on a pile of fluffy garbage bags and avoid injury, finding a ten dollar bill in one of them.

Stay safe, and
 
  ~Happy investing!

No it was your poorly made anti Havelock thread a couple months ago.

Link?

Buy-back offer - November 4, 2014

Subsequent to a consultation period initiated by Seedco Management Limited on October 1st the results of which have been posted on Havelockinvestments.com, Seedco Management Limited has decided to proceed with a buy-back and unit to share conversion offer.

From the date of this post SF1 units will no longer be trading on Havelockinvestments.com.

As stated in the Seedcoin Fund disclosure document (the “Prospectus�), the Seedcoin Fund (“SF1�) is the trading name of Seedco Holdings Limited (“Seedco Holdings� or “the Company�) which, as described in the Prospectus, is “the issuer of the units... (and)… the custodian of the shares of the Bitcoin startups�.

According to the Prospectus (page 5) there is a clause titled “Buyback policy / Termination of operations policy� that explains the mechanism to buy-back the units of SF1 (“Units�) from unit holders. This clause states: “SF1 shall reserve the right to close the listing […] closure may be effected via a buyback of all outstanding shares. Pricing of the shares will be based on the 30-day weighted moving average of the unit prices on the exchange prior to closure.�

As of the date and time of the temporary interruption of trading of SF1 units on Havelockinvestments.com, or October 1st 12 noon EST, prior to the consultation poll, each SF1 unit was priced BTC 0.00015 per unit with a monthly high at BTC 0.00029894 and a monthly low at BTC 0.00005 in September. However, Seedco Management Limited has determined that the buy-back price shall be BTC 0.00045 per SF1 unit.

Subject to holding more than 2,000 SF1 Units at the time of this offer, you will be sent a message by email within 10 days of this post, with the details of Shares and the conditions for the exchange of Units to Shares. Should you elect to exchange your Units for Shares you will be required to submit identification documents in order to become a shareholder of Seedco Holdings Limited. SHL Shareholder shall hold the equivalent proportional ownership of the Company via Shares as held in SF1 via Units.

If you are not eligible to subscribe for the shares via a SF1 Unit for SHL share exchange, your Units will be bought back via Havelockinvestments.com.

Thank you for your support and thank you to Havelockinvestments.com for the opportunity to contribute to the SF1 startups and the Bitcoin ecosystem.

Thank you for investing with Havelock Investments!
https://www.havelockinvestments.com

So... They are paying people back .00045BTC when they charged them .001BTC for the share. Considering that they are a fund that kept everything in BTC, this is incredibly fraudulent, as there is no reason the value of the fund should have changed (other than investments in companies, however they haven't invested in many startups, leading to the obvious conclusion they are still retaining a significant amount of BTC on hand).

It's actually fairly ingenious for a scam.
Step 1) create a fund that does essentially nothing, but you've got a clause in there that you can buy back shares based on 30-60 (etc) day moving average, 2) pretend that you're actually doing something for a little bit, 3) cease all activity for a time greater than a multiple of 30-60 days, so that by that time most investors had dumped their coins and crashed the price, 4) magically come back and take advantage of the clause, using the IPO funds to buy back all the shares at the dirt cheap average price.

With an IPO raising BTC2,000, and a buyback of BTC900, that's not a bad haul for 11 months of doing nothing.

does this mean you need 2001 shares to qualify for transfer, or just 2000 only?

I was thinking much the same thing but with the added step of gaining additional "good guy" points by pointing out that the 30 day average is more like 0.0002 and then graciously offering 0.00045 instead.

Note: I'm just using very rough numbers for illustration.  I can't be bothered to actually work out what the true average is.

2,000 units or more

I did not realize we had ceased all activity for a while... oh, sorry you mean we were pretending to do something and then, we ceased pretending we were doing something, which is even more ingenious than 'pretending we are actually doing something'... but all the while we were busy making investors "dump their coins and crash the price"... since we have magical powers no problem we can come back and take advantage of the pretending we were busy doing (apart from that time when we ceased doing that) and 'magically' buy back the units.

After all this non-activity I am anxious to take more days off being busy non-pretending.

If you think my answer does not make sense, please read again your initial statement, that should clarify it.

Could you offer some possibilities why the price dropped from the initial offer price of 0.001BTC to 0.00015BTC, a whopping -85%? As an investor, it really pained my heart to see the price of such a good security dropping so much.

Are the major shareholders in any way related to Seedcoin? Were all the securities sold to Havelock investors for all 4 blocks? Were there any securities unsold to Havelock investors and later taken up by Seedcoin or entities related to Seedcoin?

Look, SeedCoin, you can pick one or the other. If you think that the value is far in excess of your buy-back price, then you're doing the unitholders a disservice.

The price tanked due to the climate of bitcoin and bitcoin securities. From the very beginning this was a long term investment that you couldn't expect anything for at least a few years. But because bitcoin changed so much (ie new investments, the price dropping or new alts ect) people want to constantly move their bitcoins around to the next big thing. The issue is most investors are amateur investors and couldn't properly assess what they were investing in and are very susceptible to hype. This cause people to sink money in at ipo then try pulling it out but there simply wasn't enough buy support to allow for that. There were 2 million shares released but it was rate rare to ever even see 1000 share buy walls when the price was above 0.0005.

That said I completely agree the value is over 0.001 bitcoins per share as the companies are doing great. Plus the value when bitcoin was invested in these companies for equity was when the buying power of bitcoin was 600+ USD. So by today's standards not even factoring in the growth I'd feel the value of the shares would be closer to 0.002 bitcoins. Because of this I have been buying since ipo consistently.

Now I am quite happy to convert to a registered SHL holding however they have not indicated the qualifications required. Currently they have not indicated if US citizens are able to convert. So I'm hoping they can but won't know until those emails are sent out our Seedcoin clarifies on here.

If they don't allow US citizens to convert I won't be taking that lightly. I am completely unwilling to sell back at a major loss when the shares have much much higher value. I do understand why they are deciding to move it off Havelock and I agree with it I simply do not agree with the value they plan on buying back at. I think a full refund is the only acceptable buy back price but even that I personally wouldn't want to sell back at due to my valuation of the shares.

My only question right now is... Has the Seedcoin lawyer identified any thing that may make holders of 2000+ shares unable to convert to SHL.

Thank you for making comments worth reading. However you should realize that 'full refund' IMO is not the right wording here; no one is refunding anyone, this is a buy back process and although you and some of the investors and/or outsiders to this process may feel the pricing is low please consider that there is no obligation for anyone to 'refund' nor to buy any of these units at a higher price than the last seller's price previous to our first information re. to a potential buy back.
I do not think any investor on Havelockinvestments.com is asking any fund to 'refund' their units based on the original IPO price, this would seem a dangerous precedent and in disregard of basic fundamentals of the investment process. SF1 Funds have been raised (back in January) and invested, any other operation such as this buy back process is a completely separate process, made with privately raised funds which could have been used for any other operation.

Well you have to understand from the communities perspective you provided the fund per the terms of the prospectus. A buy back while indicated in there required a liquidation, accusation or other major event affecting share holder structure then the fund may be closed. The only event I can see was poor performance of the pricing which did not affect shareholder structure. People bought in at 0.001 then just under a year later are being forced to be bought back at 0.00045 for no real reason. Many including myself want to keep this regardless and as stated before I do hope to be able to convert. Many may still feel this way but can't convert.

Like you said the value of the shares are much higher than the prices being bought back at. Whose the one profiting from this transaction? The company buying back is getting the identical shares everyone paid for at a dramatically reduced price. If people felt the security was worth 0.00045 they would have placed sell orders at that price.

The issue isn't that your closing down the fund on Havelock. It's that your forcing people to sell something they don't want to sell at a huge reduced price because others have sold at that price or lower previously.

If I sell you a security at 0.001 and the companies are doing well and growing then I shouldn't be forced to sell back to you at 0.00045 because someone else sold for cheaper than that. As a venture capitalists what would you do if you invested money and had the same thing happen to you?

As well I would really like an answer about conversion of US shareholders to SHL holdings.

This comment was made as a personal hint to be taken in an ironic way. It could be taken out of context by some and given a more serious meaning. It is not a financial assessment in any way and should not be construed as such, it is a token of personal faith in SF1 since I have been deeply involved with SF1 for now more than a year as I started speaking with entrepreneurs back in Summer 2013. My remark, in case anyone missed this, is meant to draw the attention to the fact that I find IMO a hypocrite would have the audacity of blaming someone to see value where he/she did not only a few weeks ago. There is no 'value' for SF1 to be seen here other than the price of the last seller's price.

In response to your comment I do not agree with your remark about 'doing the unitholders a disservice'. In order to know if unit holders may or may be better off we would need to assess what would happen if no one bought back any units and let these sit at BTC 0.00015 with extremely low levels of trading. We now give the opportunity to unit holders to hold shares in these startups, that may be a better option in the long run for these unit holders. Granted we do not give this opportunity to all unit holders and that is unfortunate; however, unit holders with less than 2,000 units had units which represented at the time of the consultation poll effectively BTC 0.3 (maximum) in bitcoin value, for which they will now get BTC 0.9 (maximum - or 3 times the last selling price). For those holding much less, anywhere from 1 unit to 100 units of SF1 (worth BTC 0.00045 to 0.045 at buy back price) for example and this is a common case among SF1 unit holders the unavailability of the share conversion option may not seem to be a huge problem, as seen during the consultation poll conducted in October.

But wasn't the value the equity in the start ups? Per the prospectus in the event of a buy out of a start up company the unit holders will be compensated pro-rata. That's where I find the value in the shares. The price on Havelock had no bearing on that and that is where I developed my value for the shares.

I've highlighted the part here that really matters with regards to my comment. I do understand that you're converting to real equity for over 2,000 shares but I find it unfair that you're excluding this possibility for smaller shareholders.

'pro-rata of their unit holdings' refers to how many units of SF1 holders may hold, in this case this is a buy back not a single startup private acquisition by a VC fund for example.

re. the question about the investor eligibility to convert shares, please contact us at info@seedco.in as this is a conversation we would like to follow up on a case by case basis, and for which we need more information from you, thank you.

I will send an email about asking. However i was just meaning that the value of my shares were done in terms of the chance of a company being acquired not that I expect the buy back to follow that term. I personally do not agree with the buy back price but as long as I can convert I personally will be happy while I feel bad for others that can't.

Edit: email sent

I can understand but please believe we have tried our best to offer this to all unit holders. There were too many unit holders with small amount of units to be able to do so and we regret this. It was never our intention to deprive unit holders from the opportunity to continue participating to this investment venture but legal and economic constraints eventually prevailed. This is why we have clearly mentioned this constraint in number of units in the consultation poll on October 1st and hoped that traders willing to convert into shares would be able to reach that level between the publication of the results of the consultation poll and yesterday.

Oh dear, apparently I struck a chord on this one, and it's resonating well.

It seems your definition of activity is slightly different than mine. After all, if I'm working hard to make something happen, building up a venture capital enterprise in the process, I'd love to show my investors what I've accomplished and how far along the next project is. It's easy to drum up support for your venture if you involve investors from the start. Get them excited for the things you're doing!

From what I've gathered, however, you went offline essentially right after your second round IPO, ceasing all updates (or even hints) on what may be going on in the background. I judge a company by not only how aggressive they are in building a Bitcoin business (and the viability of said business), but also by how they interact with the people who funded their ventures in the first place.

So yes, you've ceased all activity in the community's eyes, regardless of what you say to the contrary. You may be working incredibly hard in the background, but you've got nothing to show for it. No updates. No dividends. No financials. No recent news articles promoting any of the startups you support. There's nothing going on that would lead any of us to believe that you haven't ceased activity.

I'm sorry but you are completely wrong on this area.

http://bitcoinmagazine.com/17553/seedcoin-and-startups-btc-sx-bitcoinatm360-bitsim-coinsimple-mexbt-share-exciting-news-this-fall/

Most recent update. Should they have posted it through Havelock probably but they promoted it through Twitter. All of the start up companies, Seedcoin itself and CEO Eddy Travia have been very active in Twitter posting consistent updates. How did you even try looking? Seriously a simple email to them would have provided the information you needed. I've emailed them several times and got replies usually within 24 hours (time zone differences make it difficult to get them right away).

Even beyond that the companies and Seedcoin have spoke at many bitcoin conferences with meXBT just recently announcing developments at money 20/20. About a month and a half ago cryptopay announced their project Jetcoin and sponsorship of a football player.

 The information is easily searchable I don't know why you couldn't find it. If you want to stay up to date get on Twitter and follow them it is by far the easiest way to stay up to date.

I found that link, yes, but that's the only recent update they've had (outside of twitter apparently, since I don't follow that, but that falls on me). Nothing on their own website.

I misspoke earlier, and thus stand partially corrected. I understand the companies they support have been active. My weight on the word "activity" was directed more toward Seedcoin themselves than the projects / companies they worked with. The way I see it, money was given to Seedcoin...which went somewhere (and you can't assume it went to the companies they supported until they can back it up with data)...and then that was pretty much it. For all I know, Seedcoin may have barely played even a minor role in the development of some of these companies (especially if they had additional outside funding / support besides Seedcoin), even though that may not be the case at all.

I understand and agree with your points, and I understand Seedcoin's point of view as well. I'm just hoping for others to see the other side of it; since when is it appropriate for a company, one that raised a couple thousand Bitcoins, to not make a substantial effort to communicate with the people who funded them? 140 character blurbs every couple days doesn't qualify to me, but perhaps some people find that comforting.

Here's the break down however GoCoin negotiations fell through. Here's a site with an easy to read table

http://bitcoin-betting-guide.com/james-cannings-blog/seedcoin-fund-i-update-no-gocoin-what-next/

Here's a more trustworthy site

http://www.coindesk.com/seedcoin-gives-btc-sx-500-bitcoins-funding/

There still is questions of what was being done with the extra 380 bitcoins however when I emailed asking about it they said they were in talks to further fund their current companies even more. Now that is completely unofficial and have no clue if that actually happened. And I wouldn't mind clarification on this as well.

I really recommend emailing the owners of the start ups and ask them how much Seedcoin has helped them as from everything I've seen Seedcoin has done a ton in providing these companies exactly what they need to grow into good large companies. Seedcoin's leadership seems to have provided the networking, advice and I even think legal help to foster these companies during their early stages.

I am more concerned that the initial 4 blocks were not subscribed fully by retail Havelock investors like you and me. As a result, the unsubscribed blocks were taken by Seedcoin or Seedcoin-related entities. Since they hold huge quantity of securities, they can dump them at any point in time, and cause a dramatic drop in price. And indeed, when you look at the price chart, you will see several huge dumps, causing a huge drop in price, which did not recover.

If the price can be influenced like that, Seedcoin can certainly manipulate the price for the last 30 days, and the eventual buy-back price.

Seedcoin has yet to comment which IMO, they should.

Regarding the condition to convert Seedcoin units to shares, I hope Seedcoin can consider the request for existing unit holders to buy back the units from Seedcoin at the Seedcoin-determined buy-back price of 0.00045BTC so that the unit holders have an opportunity with the conversion. Yes, they did have an opportunity to buy the units during the consultation window but like that Seedcoin mentioned, it was a consultation with no confirmed decisions made. So now when the decisions had been confirmed, it is fair that existing unit holders with less than 2,000 units should have an option for conversion, through buying back of the shortfall.

Where do you have information that the for blocks weren't completely sold and that Seedcoin had large amounts of them to be able to  tank the market? I've watched the market daily for the past few months and there was only ever one really large sell off that decimated the market. The rest were a few thousand here and there. Plus the buy walls were never very big. One larger holder of 5000 to 10000 could easily tank the entire market and according to the poll the average of share holders above 2k was 26k shares. So it's not unrealistic that one of the many large shareholders just decided to get out and sell off everything.

Still seems like there should have been more time for market clearing
Out of curiosity how was the share distribution
% of users past the threshold and the % of users below it.

Please note that as of November 4, 2014 SF1 trading has been halted on Havelockinvestments.com

Subsequent to a consultation period initiated by Seedco Management Limited on October 1st the results of which have been posted on Havelockinvestments.com, Seedco Management Limited has decided to proceed with a buy-back and unit to share conversion offer.

Subject to holding more than 2,000 SF1 units at the time of this offer, SF1 unit holders may be considered eligible to convert SF1 Units to Shares.

However, since November 4, we have received a few requests by unit holders holding less than 2,000 SF1 units who have expressed interest to buy additional units in order to reach the 2,000 units minimum threshold for conversion into Shares.

After discussion with Havelock Investments we have decided to allow one time single purpose trades at the fixed price of BTC 0.00045 per unit for those unit holders who may wish to reach the threshold of 2,000 units only. If you are a potential buyer or seller of SF1 units at BTC 0.00045 per unit please contact us at info@seedco.in mentioning in the subjet “private transaction of SF1 units” before November 12th 12 noon EST. The private transactions will be brokered via Havelock Investments upon our submission of information to them.

I have not get any mail from you and I had 5 000 shares.

I don't want to be paid half of what I paid for them, I want shares.

Please contact me to do what is necessary about that.

Yes, this is starting to get worrying. No timeline for share conversion and no communication after 7 Nov.

agreed +100%
we should have some news by now. What are thier strategies even? how are these shares to be issued? when?

I honestly believe this is a legit fund and has promise, but these sort of gaffs with the details do not sit well with me. EVERYBODY is doing it, shabby practices and slovenly PR has been normalized here. Hate to say it, but every single f*** up from all the various securities will lead to the sort of government intervention everyone would not like to see. It will hurt everybody. Way to go, guys.

Sorry for the delay with the messages to the unit holders of SF1 who have more than 2,000 units. Havelock had to process more private transactions than expected for some SF1 unit holders to reach the 2,000 units threshold. We also wanted to make sure unit holders had ample time to let us know if they wished to buy more units before initiating the conversion process. We should get the final feedback from our lawyers on Monday Dec 1st and send an email to the unit holders with more than 2,000 units during the week of Monday 1st. Although delayed please rest assured we are working on the logistics of the conversion process and we will proceed with this operation as previously announced. Thank you.

reply to AcoinL.L.C

Seedcoin doesn't provide enough capital for the amount of equity they want (15% equity is absurd)
-> equity varies from startup to startup

especially since Seedcoin's management team doesn't have much experience
-> a co-founder of Seedcoin has worked for banks, central banks and IT for the last 20 years (it seems finance and IT are a good combination for identifying startups with potential in the cryptocurrency space), another co-founder has 10 years experience in private equity and VC investments.

 and Seedcoin is unknown to many VC's (i.e. they don't have a network)
-> we know many VCs and investors, and Seedcoin startups have been in contact with many VCs as well

Better companies would apply to better incubator / accelerator programs, such as boost, TechStars, or Y Combinator, among the numerous ones out there that are better established.
-> anyone is free to apply to other incubators or accelerator programs, we respect the ones you mention. Please appreciate we have started an incubator specially focused on Bitcoin startups, obviously it would have been difficult to do so 4 or 5 years ago when bitcoin was unknown to most. We started in Summer of 2013 and in that space we are among the early investing and incubating pioneers. Fyi we have contacts with Silicon Valley based incubators and they respect our work.

CoinSimple has a whopping 16 fans on Facebook, doesn't offer a product that brings much value to vendors. I can't see them signing over 50 vendors.
-> your opinion solely, CoinSimple's team has been working hard to deliver a great product enabling vendors to accept bitcoin very easily and the team includes famous members of the crypto currency world

Hive great product, poor monetization ability and to much competition.
-> should entrepreneurs stop innovating in sectors where there is 'too much competition'?? this kind of arguments would apply to many successful startups

While bitSIM has a solid management team, their products are to techy for the average user. Not to mention open source wallets (such as Bread) destroy bitSIM's market for smartphones.
-> have you ever used BitSIM? your comments demonstrate you are not familiar with the product.

CryptoPay limited market potential. To late to the game, and not enough funding to compete with existing larger players.
-> is market potential for Cryptopay the same that is pushing the valuation of companies like BitPay or Coinbase well above the USD100m mark? funding is an issue for all startups...

BitcoinATM360 leases Bitcoin ATM's. Not a terrible idea, just very limited market. My bet, is that annual profit won't ever break 25k.
-> BitcoinATM360 does more than leasing Bitcoin ATMs. 'My bet' are the key words here... for disclosure BitcoinATM360 is backed by Seedcoin but has not been financed via SF1.

mexbtc as with other providers, limited market with large market share leaders already inplace. The bitcoin economy isn't large enough to support several large companies in each business sector.
-> then let's hope meXBT continues being the leader on its market in Mexico... Mexico and Latin America have a great potential, meXBT is well positioned to benefit from that potential.
I would also like to draw your attention to the fact that the bitcoin economy is still a nascent economy, the volume of transactions for example in one geographical sector may not be sufficient today for a 'large' player today (unclear about the meaning you may give to 'large') but could be in the future, or at least, we and the entrepreneurs hope so.

Btc.sx is their only investment with any realistic promise. However, bitfinex and the chinese exchanges will give them a run for their money. I don't see them surviving long term.
-> here again, speaking without understanding the model of BTC.sx.. Bitfinex is a partner of BTC.sx and chinese exchanges could potentially be partners as well.

This seems like a quickly written, misconstrued view of what we do. We are open to criticism and comments but if you wish to share your analysis of our work, qualifications or the potential of the startups funded via SF1 - please do a proper background work first. We are helping the development of the future leaders of the digital currency economy, this is a long term play that cannot be achieved in a few months.  Entrepreneurs work hard to achieve goals in the ecosystem they envision. Being active and entrepreneurial, and supporting these talented individuals contribute to reaching this vision.

+1440!.Well Done Seedcoin

Well the dividend change of Dealcoin makes me suspicious of Seedcoin by extension
No notification of an upcoming dividend change and I'm getting the perception of a potential breach of contract and a running away of the funds first with Seedcoin and now slowly moving into dealcoin.



Update:
** Dividend Updates
------------------------------------------------------------
The dividend for the next 12 months stays unchanged at BTC0.0001. A typo was made in our dividend payments on November 30th. A payment of BTC0.00005 was issued instead of the expected BTC0.0001. We have now corrected this mistake and a further BTC0.00005 will be issued today December 1st 2014.

The issue is most people viewed this investment as a loan where you put in X and if you get paid less than the value you paid then you are getting scammed. The problem however is that the closest classification of this fund is a growth ETF(I am not a professional investor so if I'm incorrect on something please feel free to let me know and correct me).  This is a fund that provides equity from several companies in the bitcoin sector. Unlike mutual funds which have a NAV 's calculated only daily based on changes from the trade value of each stock. Then the mutual fund can only be sold back after this calculation each day. As well the fund is required to buy back at this price at any time you wish to sell it.

An ETF or growth ETF in this instance trades just like a stock. Because the NAV is based on the market value at that time. As well you sell into the market so on a small market cap like this with very little buy orders compared to the number of units or to the sell pressure then your going down quick.

The NAV is how they calculated the initial value then tripled it. Now is that a good representation of the value of the fund? Absolutely not. Amateur investors being the majority of traders and after SF1 lost it's hype and people realized this was not paying dividend any time soon (they should have realized this at IPO) people got their attention pulled to something new. There is a new listing almost every few days offering better than believable results that gets their attention and the only capital they have is tied up and SF1 is the only thing in their portfolio not really being exciting instead is slowly dropping as buy demand drops.  So they sell which lowers and removes even more buyer demand as people still buying likely know it's long term but expect waiting will let the price drop either further.

At least that's my take and why I invested over time as price dropped. I won't be happy selling back at the given buy back price so I'm hoping I won't have any issues converting my shares.

Edit: Well this was in reply to AcoinL.L.C response however looks like that was deleted

hey guys, there's a little problem with the subscription form you sent out. It states that we have until the 30th DEC 2014 to get the electronic documents to you and then it states that if you get the electronic documents on time we have until the 16th January 2015 to get the physical documents to you. THEN at the bottom of the letter you state that if you do not recieve PHYSICAL documents by 23 DEC 2014 we have not met the requirements?????? WTF?????

guys, you sent out this forum at the busiest time of the year and then want us to send physical documentation on the 23rd or the 16th January???? which one is it? I didn't have a lot of time when I first got the forum so I quickly read over it and saw 30th dec 2014 (electronic doc deadline) AND 16th January (physical doc deadline) I open it today and read it more thoroughly and you put 2 DIFFERENT DEADLINES. I'm sending my electronic documents right now (23rd Dec 2014) and I am getting you the physical ones before jan 16th 2015, but there is no way for me to get you the physical docs by December 23rd THAT IS TODAY!!!!!!!!!!

Guys, I want in on this subscription, I believe that this misunderstanding is not entirely my fault (Im not even sure which dates you meant?) so I hope you are willing to allow me in still.

Please clarify this mess OK??????

heres a copy paste of your confusing letter. please clarify which date is which and give a little amnesty to all us people who were understandably confused by it...

If we do not receive an electronic copy of the completed and signed form, copies of your
passport and proof of address from you by the 30th of December 2014, we will assume that
you do not wish to subscribe for Class B Shares in SHL and that you have elected to accept
the offer for bitcoin, whereupon Seedco Ventures Limited will send you the relevant amount
of bitcoin (at a rate of BTC0.00045 for each SF1 unit held) to your account with Havelock
and transfer your units to Seedco Ventures Limited. !
If you do send us electronically the above documentation by the above deadline, then you will
have until the 16th of January 2015 to send us via a courier the original certified copies of
your proof of address and passport or ID. Physical documents should be sent to: !
Seedco Holdings Limited
2305A World Wide House !
!
Office address: 2305A World Wide House, 19 DesVoeux Road, Hong Kong SAR
Registered address: P.O. Box 957, Offshore Incorporations Center, Road Town, Tortola, B.V.I.
P!1
19 DesVoeux road
Central, Hong Kong !
We will not issue the Class B shares in your name until we have received the full documentation
from you. If by the 23rd of December 2014 we have not received the physical documents
then you will have not met the conditions for this subscription process and you will have
deemed to accept the offer for bitcoin. If there is any other reason that makes it impossible for
you to post the documents to the above address by the stated deadline then please contact us
immediately at info@seedco.in. !
Lastly, by subscribing for Class B shares in SHL you accept that any former agreement you
had with Havelock and/or the SF1 Fund will expire and the only contractual relationship you
will have will be with SHL as a shareholder in Class B subject to the terms and conditions set
out in SHL's Memorandum and Articles of Association. !
Yours faithfully,

also, please clarify what you mean by "certified" copies....do you mean notarized by a notary public?
thanks

Hi,

Yes, I saw the email message you sent us as well. You are correct there is a typo in the last date, sorry about that. The deadline for the receipt of the physical documents is January 16th 2015. We will resend a message correcting this to the recipient of the original email. Please note you still have time to send this information, no panic...

Thank you.

No need for certified copies, this has been confirmed as of yesterday after discussion with the agent.

For anyone concerned by the SF1 units conversion please find below a reminder about the deadlines to submit the documents
in order to convert your SF1 units to SHL shares.

Deadline to submit your documents electronically (to info@seedco.in) : December 30th, 2014

Deadline to submit your documents by post sent : January 16th, 2015.

The postal address was mentioned in the message sent on December 12th, 2014.

Got everything sent digitally and physical copies are with the courier. Sorry about the panic, the typo caught me off gaurd and just when everything was closed for Xmas good luck in 2015

No problem, thanks for sending the documents.

All the best for 2015!

So, what are SF1's plans for issuing shares to the owners? Is it going to be counterparty? I would like to know how or what platform you plan to use so I can familiarize myself with it now rather at the last minute when I may be very busy.

Are you guys trying to create something like Y-combinator in bitcoin world ?

That is the plan. See the seedcoin website for details.
This is a long term one. Not focused on dividends so much as having a stake in growth areas therefore increasing share value. The trolls hate SF1 but so far they are running smoothly.

I believe they will be registering the shares directly in the shareholders name using traditional processes. So these wouldn't be very tradeable. But as you indicated in your other post this is a long term deal focused on equity so a buyout is the biggest chance of a payout. However I did contact mexbt and they stated they plan on paying dividends once their revenue increases and is stable. I assume btc.sx will be similar. I am looking forward to converting soon and hope we can get a bit more info once this conversion is completed.

Not counterparty, just traditional shares.

yes correct, traditional shares registered to the shareholders' names (hence the documents required).
more information will be sent to all shareholders soon, we are now working with the lawyers on the share registration.

will the shares be put through counterparty or similar in the future? I do not have a problem with traditional shares, however, seedcoin being a bitcoin entity should be using the blockchain don't you think? I mean, if you are selling sportscars you wouldn't drive an old beater into work every day would you?

I'm guessing seedcoin has just not dialed in all the logistics for blockchain shares yet, has more pressing business getting us all listed and legit with the lawyers, but hopefully in the future we will hold our shares in the blockchain.

Ehhh in not sure that's the best way. Bitcoin and blockchain technologies are still very new and early in development. Because of this using a method such as that opens a lot more risk. As well for the fund to be viewed legitimately traditional methods are usually the best. The only thing systems like counterparty add is the ability to trade easily. Trading in Havelock did not prove worth while due to the poor demand and poor ability to assess the fund of shareholders.

I think this way is for the best. Convert and let them sit for a bit and I have a feeling there will be a payout in a few years either via a divided from market leader or from a buyout.

Yes, sure, I agree, but... In a few years there should be some sort of viable decentralized exchange. I'm leery of counterparty since it is so new and the bugs are yet to be discovered. Also I would need to spend an entire afternoon figuring it out.
I see this SF1 as long term. I am inquiring about long term ideas.
Just seems to make sense that a crypto company would operate within the block chain if and when ever available.

I have not heard from Seedcoin since like more than a month ago. Anyone knows what is happening now?

Stay away from this thieves (Havelock) a lot of people lost a lot of money in their scams

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=989850.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=986763.0

Good grief, the mounting problems with these guys are getting worse than I had originally thought. Like, the wheels are officially coming off kind of worse.

Looks like this SeedCoin will turn out to be another "hit" of Havelock, but to the investors's purse!

seed coin is moving to traditional shares (supposedly) so they wont be on havelock anymore soon enough.

i'm getting so jaded, looks like every security is bullshit. either they are outright scam, or they just dont know what the hell they are doing and can't produce. either/or, take your pick. everything ever offered is fail.

people will look back on this whole mess in the future and laugh. "oh yeah, the great btc securities sham of the 20-teens. the wild west of crypto, man! crazy times. Lotta peeps lost they shirts! whoo-ee!"

thats about the long and short of it. I know I've lost more than I care to admit. oh well...shit  >:(

We have now closed SF1 on Havelock and have registered the former SF1 investors who converted into shares into the members registry. If you are among those investors and you wish to have more info pls contact us at info@seedco.in; if you are just asking about general information about Seedcoin we have been posting information on social media, such as the fact that two of the Seedcoin startups, CoinSimple and BTC.sx have been selected as semi-finalists of the SWIFT Innotribe Startup Challenge 2015; BTC.sx team will pitch in London and CoinSimple in Singapore.
We have also posted photos on the Seedcoin Facebook page about the Seedcoin Coworking Space at Espacio Bitcoin in Buenos Aires where up to 18 desks are available to Bitcoin startup entrepreneurs. Seedcoin Coworking Space is co-sponsored by meXBT and BTC.sx.
Seedcoin management team members were in Barcelona to attend the World Mobile Congress and '4YFN' (4 years from now) parallel event where they met Bitcoin entrepreneurs. Seedcoin Chief Startup Officer will be moderating the Startup Ecosystem Panel at Inside Bitcoins NY on April 28.

We are currently working on new projects and a new website to be unveiled this month. More news re. Seedcoin, its current startups and future plans re will be made this month.

It will be good to see the new website and upcoming developments.
Sorry about my previous cynical remarks, I have lost a LOT of BTC in various poorly run, or just plain fraudulent BTC securities over the last year and I am still stinging a little. From the looks of seedcoin all is being handled professionally and looks to do well, longer term. Maybe this will be "the one" and I might see some of my losses recouped.

Good Luck and Godspeed!

good to see this fund is moving forward. still looks good with the hive, bit.sx ... Coincilium etc. now being listed on AIM, keep up the good work guys, ive got a good feeling about this one... ofc Ive been wrong before... but maybe this one's the winner...

I haven't been keeping up with Seedcoin developments in quite some time
I did notice that the website seems to be in a 404 though so not sure what the new link is but seeing the post said there would be one in a month back in April perhaps I'm just unaware of it.
http://coinsilium.com/home/team (or seedco.in)

Yeah, I got my info in a mail because I think they are only sharing with investors ATM . They are setting up to trade on the AIM platform which will go live soon, then more public announcements, but things are looking bright for these guys. They lost some investors' faith when they failed to secure OKcoin into thier incubator but looking at where OKcoin went since then, I'm glad they got passed on.
BTC.sx alone has me very interested. Hive is a real up-and-comer too.

The AIM platform as in the bloomberg one ?
http://www.bloomberg.com/trading-solutions/buy-side/

I'll look forward to it then although I probably got the wrong AIM platform but it's good to hear at least one Bitcoin asset is not a complete piece of crud we have a lot of those ... (Besides Rentalstarter and Dealcoin which seem to be ok rest have been pretty bad even all mighty-AM died in burning flames)
And OKCoin and Ver did had a fun dispute they were lucky in a sense to let that one go, but Hive and btc.sx are good companies so your right seedcoin will have some nice development and growth assets in their portfolio.

Thanks for the heads up Gog

AIM is the area of the London stock exchange that deals with startups http://www.londonstockexchange.com/companies-and-advisors/aim/aim/aim.htm (http://www.londonstockexchange.com/companies-and-advisors/aim/aim/aim.htm)
One of the seedcoin companies will be the first blockchain fintech company to IPO there. This should be in the news soon. The guy running SeedCoin is Eddy Travia who I've only heard good things about.
Seedcoin had a lot of regulatory hoops n stuff to get past in the beginning and were slow to get rolling, but they haven't been sitting around. They've got solid companies in their stable, got themselves away from the sketchy and not-entirely-trustworthy havelock, have issued all shares to shareholders privately and following all the correct legal procedures, now will trade offerings on an internationally recognized legit exchange. Everything looks good IMHO

I think they are rebranding themselves as Coincilium too. There will be press releases any day now.

Coinsilium (of which Seedcoin is a fully owned subsidiary) plans to list on AIM (the growth market of the London Stock Exchange)

media have been relaying the announcement here :

http://www.cityam.com/220137/worlds-first-blockchain-ipo-happening-london-coincilium-eyes-aim-listing
(company name was misspelled by City AM on that url - corrected in the text)

http://www.cityam.com/220231/why-i-chose-float-fintech-business-london

http://uk.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-and-blockchain-firm-coinsilium-plans-aim-ipo-london-2015-7

http://cointelegraph.com/news/114904/uks-1st-bitcoin-company-ipo-on-track-amid-supportive-environment

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000398550

Thanks for clearing that up. It's still great news!
Any news on when or where these see kin SHL shares are going to be tradable?

We will announce the date when 'COIN' shares are tradeable on AIM as soon as the date is confirmed by the London Stock Exchange.

Could we know the indicative price for the placement share to qualified investors?

Coinsilium has forecast they will be trading on AIM around 2nd week of August (about now)
I'm excited to see how it performs...
It would be better if I could actually trade the shares though
How's that going to work out? Limbo isn't good.