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I'm all about banning guns. But, unfortunately, these are deeply engrained in America's society. I came across this article that talks about using blockchain to keep track of gun sales etc.

https://cryptotradernews.com/insights/the-president-wont-touch-it-politicians-ignore-it-is-blockchain-the-key-to-gun-control/


Thoughts?

I'm all about banning ignorance, but look where that's gotten us.  So I have a question: what if we could somehow eliminate the root cause of all violence, would you still be "all about banning guns?"

As long as humans run the government there cannot be 100% trust to enforce these decisions on people. That is why it is necessary for everyone to be able to protect from bad actors, even in the government. The above examples from the article can all be manipulated by people for bad reasons, and guns are also a good deterrent for all criminal activity. People use guns all over the world to do bad things, and it is better to have that sense of security to know that someone can still defend themselves. In a way, the 2nd amendment is an extension of the 1st amendment. (Since criminals can always access/make guns, then there has to be the ability for any person to defend from that. The same way free speech works in that any negative thing someone is saying should be able to defend against it.) Since the threat of guns will always exist on the bad side, there has to be good people with guns. And now people can 3d print one, so it makes things even easier for a criminal to access a gun to do something bad. I would argue that the guns prevent more than they cause in harm. It especially gives women an advantage in security which is important.

The other negative is that if there is a database for guns, then a criminal can gain access to that list and also know who is defending themselves or not. People don't seem to think that people overall can turn bad or make bad decisions.


The only 2 examples in the article are where guns are not permitted. Of course any crazy person will target these places there is nobody defending them.

You can take a look at how gun laws function in every other first world country as well as the gun related deaths/capita and you'll notice that there's something odd going on in the US lol

Blockchain and any existing law would help the gun control for the people who abide by the law.

However, the solution we needed is actually outside the approvals, waiting times and background checking.

What we need is to authority to control/reduce all unregistered and illegal selling and buying of guns. So instead of solving the existing law, the authority must make sure to remove and track all the marketplace, transactions and deals of these criminals.

Absolutely true.  And if we can eliminate menstruation, women wouldn't attack their husbands with rolling pins.  Lets solve rolling pin violence.

And so by this logic; if we cannot eliminate evil, there is a need for guns, right?  So why are you and all your "gun violence" pals not focusing on the root cause, which is violence, without qualifiers.  Eliminating guns is a band-aid.  It doesn't solve the issues which lead to violence in the first place.

Gun control isn't about guns, it's about control.  It's not about preventing violence, it's about preventing decent.  It's about picking and choosing who gets to perpetrate violence against whom.  

Anyone who pretends that they want to ban guns for humane purposes is a hypocrite and a liar.  Banning the ability for a law-abiding citizen to defend himself is the most inhumane thing I can imagine.  If you actually care about people then wake up and open your eyes.  Stop believing the propaganda that's only meant to keep you in chains.  

We won't register our guns and you can be damn sure criminals wouldn't either..

I think the article brings up some really good points, but what would get people to register their weapons? Even law abiding citizens may be slow to comply, if at all.

BUT... the idea for using blockchain to force registration and background checks for gun shows and private sellers is a really good idea in my opinion. That has to be addressed and would be a great first step in starting to at least try to make a change.

What's next huh, this?

https://summit-news.sfo2.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/2019/05/150519spoon.jpg

Point is, you ban something, people just move on to something else. You'd be surprised what prisoners can do with a sock.

We don't have a gun culture like the US but I don't have problems with it being allowed as long as it isn't ridiculously easy to get (like, in a fookin grocery) and that a psychological test must be made before being given a license.

As for having the gun info in a blockchain, good luck convincing criminals.

Nice insights!

The chances of someone killing children at a school with a spoon are very low, don't you think?

In the meantime, keep watching children die at schools every other week. But then again, we're the ones with our eyes closed lol

Answer these questions, please:
If we cannot eliminate evil, is there a need for guns?
Why are children being killed every other week?
How have 85 years worth of gun restrictions helped prevent children from being killed?
Are there solutions that don't include holding innocent people responsible for the actions of the guilty?
Are there solutions that don't leave innocents susceptible to tyranny?
How can blame an inanimate object for your lack of real solutions?


BTW: Stop multi-posting.  You can reply to two people in one post.

In the old days they had cannons that shot shrapnel. Why not make guns that shoot out a blockchain?

 :D

Blockchain technology is a good first step to confiscating guns, and should not be used to track ownership of guns. The government would know precisely how many guns you own, and who owns guns. Blockchain technology to track gun ownership is little different than a gun registry.

I like the idea of blockchain technology to solve problems, but it is not something that can solve every problem, and in this case using it would be harmful.

1- Yes, police officers and trained people should carry guns to protect citizens.
2- Because sick people have access to all sorts of guns and submachine rifles. All they need is a driving license to get their hands on them.
3- Mmmmmm... gun restrictions? What gun restrictions are you talking about?
4- Who is holding innocent people responsible for anything? We're talking about confiscating guns to protect these innocent people.
5- This whole tyranny argument worked well in the 17th century mate. There's no need for this anymore. Take a look at Europe. No European country has citizens carrying guns in the street and no one is concerned about their governments going tyrannic on them. Like... come on...
6- How is prohibiting sick people from getting access to guns not a real solution? I'm giving you one REAL solution that works very well in Europe. The only thing you're telling me is "that's not fair what about the innocent people who don't use guns to kill other people". Well, mate, wont you rather give up your gun and have your kid feel safe at school?

Plus, to be honest, I'm more concerned with regular citizens being able to acquire military styled weapons. If we could get rid of these I'm sure the amount of public shootings would come down drastically. I can't see someone killing 49 people at a night club with just a hand gun.

1. So you want guys with guns to take guns from people?
2. Sick people have access to semi trucks, gasoline, and explosives too, what is your point?
3. This shows me how ignorant you are of US gun laws and how you are only interested in your own bias.
4. You. Banning guns disarms innocent people, ie taking their right to self defense.
5. Yeah right, everyone knows now all the governments are trustworthy! BTW EUrope? LOL! Europe is a prime example why to KEEP your firearms. Europe is going to be Eurabia in 10 years. Quite a light on the hill you are.
6. Taking peoples rights so that you "feel safe" is not a right you have. Your rights end where another's rights begin.

1- Yes. At least submachine guns and military style weapons. Of course.
2- Dude... You can't bring a semitruck and run over kids inside a school building... You're going off a silly tangent to prove your illogical point.
3- I live in the US mate. Been shooting to a firing ring before and I've been offered all sorts of guns on my way out.
4- Sure let's make all students take weapons to school so they can defend themselves! Now is when you bring up the whole "let's arm teachers" argument, right?
5- Lol... Been hearing Eurabia for the past 35 years mate. How old are you? 18? I'm sure you're all into CoD and Fortnite but the real world is different son.
6- I don't even know what to respond. You want to keep your second amendment even at the expense of people's lives. You go buddy.

Blockchain is not gonna be a solution for the end of gun violence. Gun violence is all about the mind control, people explodes unexpected which is the reason for big crimes with gun. From my view through blockchain each and every data associated with guns manufactured can be recorder but there is no possibility for the restriction on usage.

Ahh... I love those crypto media so much. This is how they are making their articles: Is blockchain a solution for *shuffle cards* gun violence? Seriously, just add some random bullshit from fighting the poverty to war stoppage and you are getting some fresh content for your crypto website.
in this case author of the article is claiming that blockchain would help to check the background of gun owners. But no one said that this background in its current form works bad. So they took the problem out of their head and offered a solution just to make some content.
That's bullshit.

If you think that background procedures are not a problem you definitely not live in the US. They are A MASSIVE problem. There are people who suffer from mental health conditions who are being sold guns! And this is mainly because the background check procedures are extremely inefficient.

Or that the current background form works at all.     8)

Then please describe how our current background check works and why should someone waste a shit time of money in order to improve the thing that already works fine?
I bet that Police definetely have their own database with all gun owners and the ones that do not have a permission to have a gun. And for some reason they are not claiming that something works bad in that part.

That is not true. Everyone that buys a gun has to go through a FBI background check. The laws are different for every state, but are rigorous. Some states even take finger prints of the people.

Your only argument is that people with mental health conditions are getting guns, which is too vague. What is the definition of 'mental health conditions'? To me that means everyone to a certain level. Does it mean everyone who is on specific medications, and if so, which medications will halt the firearm purchase?

Just one of many examples: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/feb/17/aurora-shooting-failed-background-check (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/feb/17/aurora-shooting-failed-background-check)

The problem is that these background checks are extremely inefficient. Check the article that I just linked to above. The guy went from state X to state Y. One of these states failed to identify one of his previous felonies. Blockchain could have prevented this.

How could blockchain prevented this; step by step how?
Would it start with: 'users' have to register the gun onto a blockchain? (criminals will not, so the idea fails here)

To me it seems like a simple fix that is wrong with the system(not the guns themselves), which is that every state has different laws regarding background checks. I would agree that making the background check thorough plus equal across all borders would fix the problem with the system. I would even agree with certain people being on some specific medication being part of the restrictions as well. Something has to change with the laws, and your example can be fixed by a universal background check to close that border loophole.

Blockchain would have been that universal background system that you were talking about.

Also... Keep in mind... Most shootings aren't caused by criminals but rather by ordinary citizens who acquire guns legally. A lot of them have track records of mental instability and are simply able to pass the background check for X or Y reason like we've already discussed. Others have no record at all (which is why I would just ban military style weapons and get rid of the problem).

Bullshit. It is fundamentally evil idea to take away guns. In europe have no firearms but we still kill other humans with knifes, axes or bare hands. The problem is the killing itself, not the means by what killing is done. Maybe treating other people like equals and listening to them, and getting same in return, will reduce need for killing to near zero.

Blockchain is only a tehnological concept. It is like Diffie-Helman key excahnge. The Diffie-Helman key exchange by itself is not going to end gun violence.

Great. Now how is it related to blockchain and why the blockchain is a solution?

A quote from the article:

Maybe now everyone should store his guns on the blockchain so no one could get access to it upon the license expiration?
It seems like the system is just not working good and it needs to be fixed. There is nothing that could be done especially with blockchain and blockchain is not giving any benefits if you compare it with centralized data storage.

The blockchain technology can be implemented in every action that has to do with illegal activities or that they need transparency.
It can surely adopted and tackle issues like gun control or anything else that can't be controlled with they current systems. Politicians are just closing their eyes to these solutions on purpose.

LOL. Do you even know what's happening in the US? Children are being murdered every other week. This isn't happening with "knives and axes" in Europe bud.

From the article: After an initial background check failed to detect his felony conviction, he was given a FOID card. He bought the Smith & Wesson handgun on 11 March 2014.

Stuff like this has happened before and will continue to happen. This is why Blockchain could be helpful. To have one universal system to keep track of someone's criminal record disregarding where they come from.

Then the problem is the universal background check, not the guns. The vast majority of firearms owners respect the guns under the 2nd amendment, and it is a good deterrent for crime in places that people can have them. I believe most criminals think twice about if someone has a gun in there house before breaking into it, or doing some other negative thing.

Most school shootings are caused by bullying. Bullying is caused by economic unequality and ethnic and racial differences. They all are symptoms of disease called capitalism.

In europe there also are revenges by bullied kids. But they are done by pepper spray or less efficient means. I told, europe is totally gay, they even cannot get mass murder straight! Also, some time ago one asshole took knife and went to kindergarten and killed teacher and kids, so he can become famous.

1. "Submachine guns" are already highly regulated in the USA, way to show your complete ignorance on this topic. Tell me, what is a  "military style weapon" one that is black and looks scary to you?

2. Can you bring gasoline or explosives into a school? Why is it required that it happens inside a building to be a valid point? You just unilaterally declaring it an invalid point doesn't make it so.

3. Well then you are exceptionally willfully ignorant aren't you? You sound all American to me "mate". You certainly aren't some entitled twat who came here from another country, enjoy this nation, then expect to be able to dictate to the native citizens what their laws should be now are you "mate"? BTW, What in the FUCK is a "firing ring". You sure have all the lingo down.

4. No one is talking about compulsory weapon ownership or carry. Many teachers are former police and military and should have the ability to be armed at school if they choose to.

5. Well shit you have been hearing about it! Fuck well I guess we can just ignore the millions of illegal migrants that flooded into Europe from Africa and the Middle East over the past few recent years huh! Shit it is a cliche! That is proof enough! Europe is a joke and is no example of self defense "mate".

6. I don't even know what to respond. You make yourself feel safer by forcibly disarming people so they can't defend themselves in their own homes at the expense of their lives. You go "mate".

1- You're kidding me, right? I could go and buy an AR15 right now if I wanted to just with my drivers license. These come in all sorts of colors mate and yeah they look pretty scary.
2- How does one even get an explosive or kill dozens of people at a school as easy as it is with a gun? Silly argument.
3- Ahhhh I can already see what your next response is going to be... LET'S BUILD THE WALL!
4- LOL.
5- At least their kids aren't getting murdered at school every Tuesday evening.
6- Man how many people "defend themselves" on a daily basis? NONE. These things are innocent people killing machines. But if owning a gun makes you feel more like a man then go ahead mate! Keep on teaching those nice values to your kids.

1. As I have said several times already you don't have any fucking clue what you are rambling on about no matter how much you pretend to. Submachine guns, or any gun with any type of fully automatic fire function are highly regulated, rare, and quite expensive to obtain. You don't even know what you are talking about. An AR15 is not functionally any different than hundreds of other hunting style rifles except to exceptionally dumb and easily manipulated people who think it "looks scary"

2. Ever heard of improvised explosive devices? You can build explosives from products at any grocery store. Are you really arguing a building fire is not capable of harming masses of people? Again, just because you call it a silly argument doesn't magically make it so. You aren't even attempting a refutation, just calling it silly and moving on as if it is a given you are correct.

3. If only smarmy replies were equal to logical arguments you might have something here. Again, more avoidance of the subject matter, trying to be cute instead of making an argument.

4. See number 3.

5. No, they are only getting kidnapped by rape gangs and being pimped and stabbed. Also there aren't any European countries with over 350 million people.

6. Actually the CDC did a study (https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/91da/afbf92d021f06426764e800a4e639a1c1116.pdf) on this and on the LOW end they calculate over 500,000 defensive uses a year, on the high end 2.5 million defensive uses. You pushing this personal delusion that no one uses firearms defensively is just outright retarded and a denial of reality. You have a right to your own opinions, not your own reality and "facts".

I'm done talking to a wall

The point is if you follow it to its logical conclusion, these "preventive" measures would just have people locked up and working from home (government still needs money, ho ho).

First they said that guns are bad, bad, bad, so they took them. Heck, even took them from police. Then these nutjobs started beheading unarmed police with knives. Knives bad, even butter knives! So they take the knives and that spoon. Then someone scoops cop's eyes using a spoon and plunges it into his brain. Spoon turns out to be truly bad, so confiscate them all and glasses as well since they can be broken and used for cutting people. Ad infinitum.

https://i.imgur.com/VhVQqQB.jpg

Thank you for admitting you have no logical argument and your points are entirely emotionally based.

I see a lot of talk about "them" taking guns.. but I don't think that's what the article was really talking about.

While having all law abiding citizens register their weapons on a blockchain-based system would be nice, it's unlikely to gain traction.

However, using blockchain for a national ID system of sorts and utilize it to perform nationwide, state-by-state background checks for new purchases would help immensely.

As would using blockchain to force private sellers to perform quick, and instant BG checks

The current system is broken... people are getting weapons that should never even see one in person. A blockchain registration system could eliminate extensive waits for "complete" background checks. It would take the government middleman out of the equation. It would eliminate errors of state criminal records not showing up in the state search or otherwise being overlooked.

With the right infrastructure in place, gun purchases at shows would still be instant, foregoing the 5 day wait, BUT... we could be sure that it's not a career criminal that simply dresses well and knows how to speak to the seller.

The author brings up some additional points where blockchain could be utilized, yet likely be a bandaid or simply for "show." But using blockchain for new sales and purchases is a pretty brilliant idea in my opinion

The first step towards confiscation is registration. Not only that such a list is a tremendous security threat. Here (https://www.ammoland.com/2019/05/gun-crime-is-a-made-up-word-from-the-anti-gun-world-here-are-the-real-numbers/#axzz5obFmKQlB) is a great article that does a very thorough breakdown of the official stats of "gun crime".

I have not personally looked, but I have read that instructions on how to create explosives are available on the internet. The Boston marathon bomber used materials freely available at stores.

If someone wanted to kill many people at a school without a gun, they could wait until school is out and run over some of the many people that are in school parking lots or walking just outside campus, or crossing various streets adjacent to the school.

The key to stopping gun violence is not gun registration, that will lead to confiscation, it is providing adequate countermeasures to gun violence. Places like Chicago have a lot of gun violence because criminals know there is a very low chance a law-abiding citizen will have a gun to shoot back with, and places with less restrictive gun ownership and gun possession laws, have less gun violence because criminals know there is a higher chance of getting shot back at.

Gun Control is not a solution.

Thinking that there is gonna be a gun control and blockchain is helping to guarantee that, it will just create delusions, as most of people dont see the full image of what is happening around the world.

You need to do at least a tiny bit of research before engaging in a topic you know nothing about. Did you know that without the scary looking "furniture" an AR-15 functions exactly the same as any other "non-scary" semi-automatic rifle? Did you know that more people are killed (in the U.S.) with hammers than with rifles (go to fbi.gov and RESEARCH)? So out of the rifles that are used, the scary looking ones are just a subset. And since the media dwells on it every time an AR-15 is used, it's a small subset. It will probably become a larger subset ONLY because it is a popular rifle but it is likely that hammers will continue to be used more that any style rifle to kill people.
"I can't see someone killing 49 people at a night club with just a hand gun." LOL@U Go look up Virginia Tech shooting. O.K. He only killed 32 but 49 were shot. And I guess in a way you are correct. He didn't use "a handgun", he used 2. When you have a clue, come back and play again :)

Confirmed kill with MRE spoon:

https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/Ranger_Gets_Confirmed_Kill_With_MRE_Spoon/5-1836058/

Gun freedom is the way to support a free blockchain.     8)

Thoughts? My visceral reaction is "fuck you" and stick your love of an all-powerful government up your ass.

To answer your question more thoughtfully and respectfully. No. It doesn't help the situation one bit since it's not the government's business to know if I own a gun or how many guns I do own. That being said crypto wouldn't help.

There are many problems with registering guns - one of them is the legalistic rigor that is applied by prosecutors and how that is applied in this instance. I own a 20 gauge shotgun. For those not in the know that is a very underpowered shotgun best used for pests. My uncle has it. Why? Because he has a pest problem by his garden.

Now let's assume we agree that privacy issues and telling the government everything I do is not a problem for me. (It is, hence my original statement.)
 
Lots of people lend each other firearms.  Now, say I lend my uncle my 20 gauge. Do I have to tell the government that I am transferring this firearm before I do so? What is the process by which I do so? Does he have to be there? And, when he returns it, then what? Are you beginning to see part of the problem in what you're suggesting?

A firearm is not analogous to cars - firearms are like the class of motorized vehicles. They run the gamut from dirt bikes, to cars, to jet skis, to pick-up trucks, to motor boats, to snow mobiles, to yachts; to RVs.

That's why people have so many of them. They are NOT interchangeable. (And that doesn't even bring up collecting.) Now imagine each time a parent let their child use the car they would have to first tell the government. And then, when the child finished using the car, they too would have to tell the government.

Yeah brother. That ain't gonna happen. And crypto won't help.
 

After the third popup, I stopped trying to read your article.

My first thought is a question: why do people like to seek help from the government and laws and try to force their views on others? Why are you a bigot OP?

When you don't like that people around me are catholic and go to church every Sunday, you don't fraternize with them, ignore them, or sell your property and move. You don't go around town telling them to stop believing and you don't write letters to the government to ban public display of religious views.
It's the same about eating meat. You are a vegetarian, you're welcome to grill onions and carrots while I grill a steak. Those who call the police or write to the government because they don't like something are cowards and bigots.

We always want the blockchain to solve all the problems we have in this world without an understanding of what the underlying philosophy of this technology projects

Fine the blockchain technology has been applied in a vast majority of issues but how do think it will help solve the problems created by guns?

For crying out loud, the blockchain technkolgy is a primary solutions for data problems not the issue of violence

Is regulating or reducing the number of gun owners the solution. Blockchain cannot change the happy trigger folks who resorts to pulling the trigger at the slightest provocation. I still don’t see how that solves the problem IMO.

Who would be the miners? Because they are the decision makers.

And outside of gang members who are those "happy trigger folks"? It's not the law abiding gun owners and it's certainly not those with a concealed carry permit.
Most of the US is as crime-free and as violence free as Europe. The great percentage of crime is located in a few areas within a few cities.

Look at the statistics. Don't take my word for it. And by looking at statistics I mean just that - go to the US Government statistics themselves and not articles which conflate things. Do you want an example of the media being disingenuous? They conflate gun deaths with gun crime. 2/3 of the gun deaths in the country are suicides. Now, if you think that getting rid of guns would get rid of suicides then you would have to ask yourself how is that Japan has a higher suicide rate than the US - and they don't have guns there.

Does that even matter right now?

If the miners are the ultimate authority on what the proposed blockchain does, then of course it matters.

This is something that hasn't been brought up in the thread before. Yeah, who would be operating it? What would be the incentive to keep it running?

Do you think gun enthusiasts can run this instead of having large "miners"? I'm thinking something like when people run torrent apps on their phone. Like, by a gun and the download the app.

This would just be the gun ownership records though, the psychiatric records of gun applicants would have to be in a different chain.

Psych records would not necessarily have to be in a different chain.

And right, what if gun enthusiasts were running it? You would have a radically different and certainly a better product than if gun restriction nuts were running it, or if government personnel were running it.

But I don't see where this would change any of the arguments made. The controversy would continue unchanged. Decision making would simply be out of the hands of the politicians, it would seem.

For the record I know the NCIS background system works pretty darn well, and almost all the protests and arguments that it's bad are wrong and politically driven.

Blockchain gun control is BS - https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=slam+gun.

8)