Bitcoin Forum

I have been working for an exchange the last months, and I am really worried after seeing so many newcommers bullish on BTC's halving, that enter our telegram group. Oh, by the way, if you didn't tried XXXXXXXX yet, you should take a look because there are some wellcome bonus for trading, and without the need to perform KYC.

Now, let's go to the point. Despite I can seem as a permabear, the truth is that I don't marry any coin at all.
Don't get biased or fall in love with any asset or you will suffer a huge lost. If you entered the crypto space in the last 2 years, I am pretty sure you know what I am talking about.

Being a HODLER probable means right now a big bag altcoins portfolio with over a 90% loss.
https://i.imgflip.com/24jr9t.jpg

This is a fact:
A 0,53% of total BTC addresses control 86% of suppply.. a 2,73% of addresses control an 95,35% of supply.
 You can check in the link, and in the following image

BTC's supply distribution (https://bitinfocharts.com/top-100-richest-bitcoin-addresses.html)

https://i.imgur.com/NHwd7aP.jpg

HAving all this in mind, BTC's manipulation is INSANE and OUT OF DISCUSSION. Don't let you be fooled by BTC maximalists or cyrptogurus. Doesn't matter's news, market sentiment, whatever.. whales just decide if price go up or down. That is all. retail investor don't have any trading power at all. They will move the market and make you FOMO or PANIC. So be smarter, and take care.

Now whales are makign people FOMO, but they will probably dump hard and price  will sink. Around 5k-6k, the minning cost won't be affordable by minor players, so they will leave and  big minning groups will get all the cake. Retail investors will also sell on panic. This will happen soon, and then they could start pumping price before halving occurs. That way, BTC whales could repurchase BTC at cheap prices, and double their profits with the halving.

Regarding halving, let me inform you taht you shoudl also believe all that bullshit about new ATHs. BTC's growth has been exponential during last decade, and this won't last forever. The charts like the following one, give you a fake impression, because it is a logarithmic scale,.. at some point growth is MUCH MUCH MUCH more difficult. I doubt next halving can make BTC's price go over 15k, and then the problem for crypto industry will really start. People will wake up and understand that this is not all magic what surrounds BTC, and it can't relaly rise exponentially forever.  btc maximalists, Cryptogurus, communication media.. only think in their own benefit increasing traffic in their profile pages or platforms or shill their bags.

Halving chart (https://ihodl.com/infographics/2018-04-09/chart-day-bitcoin-reward-halving-and-price-history/)

https://ihodl.com/media/attachments/d/c7/137e64c7d__1500x0__q85.png

Please take care

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updated

Intro message edited.. my fault. Anyone thinking I would put effort on a post for just some promotion, is really paranoid. I posted the link, because I really though it is a great exchange, otherwise I wouldn't risk my reputation working for them. I have been in crypto for a long long time.. maybe I tried 80 exchanges so far, and was greatly dissapointed with the popular ones like Binance or Bitmex with their famous scam wicks, and overload errors, which had a huge loss for so many people.
BY the way.. I would never ever promote a shaddy exchange in my signature like many of you are doing. Lot of people and projects rekt already, and more will come. I received tons of complaints against Yobit in the last year (along with many many many more... Bitebtc, coinsbit, latoken... really a LOT, please conduct due dilligence before depositing your funds)  while working for cmc. https://t.me/CoinMarketCap And NO, I am not promoting coinmarketcap,...

https://i.imgur.com/bHQsncw.jpg


Just for your info, i have been trading since 1998 (yeah, i am a 41 years old guy) in traditional markets (forex, commodities, stocks,..) until 2011 when i shifted to crypto. Bought 100 BTC at 0,51$.. lost them in 2014 (thanks Mt Gox, reminder: not your keys, not your coins). I survived the dot.com and real state bubbles.. I traded with binary options.. SO yes, I would say I know what I am talkign about when it is about trading. Oh, by the way, I am working on a solution that will really disrupt this shitty unfair world, wehre newbies get rekt because of market sharks and whales. We deployed the algorithm trading system since 4th may and reached nearly a 1400% so far, but hey.. won't write its name, so no one claims I am a shiller. And if you think this is some kind of bullshit, you can find similar companies, like Renaissance technology that made something similar trading in traditional markets -imagine what we are achieving with crypto due so much volatility-.. from 100$ to $401million in 30 years  (https://qz.com/1741907/renaissance-technologies-jim-simons-and-the-birth-of-quant-trading/).

Before you claim I am a fudder, you should better make some research about me. I tried to spread good words and vibe regarding crypto everywhere online and offline for the last years.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2886374.0 BEST advice for this Crash
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5069440.0 2346 views and 417 answers I just SOLD my girlfriends car to buy more ETH at sale price :)
a fudder will sell a car to buy crypto? yeahh, probably

Anyway, let's got to the point. The paradigm changed, I am seriously dissapointed. The Satoshi Spirit is gone, as it is said in the Bronx: "this is the jungle nigga". Social inclusion, financial freedom,.. this doesn't matters anymore, it is about money. Criptogurus and Communications media shilling (both to get more traffic and income), bitcoinmaximalists shilling hard (Novografz, McAfee...) because of their big bags..
The fact is that this is a market where 95% is in hands of a few whales, the rest has nearly 0 chances to success. I have been hearing about massiva adoption, but ar eyou kidding? Who the hell will be interested in something like this? No one! The only that were to step in, are already here. What happened with Bakkt's launch, which supposedly was about to introduce crypto to financial institutions? where is the money? during launch they reached a 700k daily traded volume. The supermarket of my hood has higher turn over. And let me tell you a secret, if financial institutions entered this crypto world , your chances of success will be then negative. We are talkign about very skilled and experienced people with high state-of-the-art tech and huge resources.. so you won't get a f**ing chance against them when it is about trading.

My vision now is that there is lower and lower interest in crypto. People is reallly deceived and upset of manipulation. Let's look back  2 months ago.. China's president, Xi, said everlasting glory to blockchain.. few whales pumped the price, averyone FOMOed.. and boom 45% up. Few days later he highlighted he was talking about BLOCKCHAIN, not crypto.. and dump from 10.5k to 6.5K. And appart from this.. so many scam wicks on a daily basis.. up,down, up, down, liquidating everyone who has a leveraged position. 0 organic move! How would you call a coin that pumps 3k and dumps 4k?a pump and dump coin?

Anyone thinking halving will be great, and we will get new ATH's had just his brain washed by the BTC maximalisms.  https://agingcapriciously.files.wordpress.com/2018/01/eshtebahi.jpg
Laugh and cal me fudder while you still can. But hey, dont worry, .. it will take only 5 months to see who was right and wrong... and then the one who failed with his claims, should come to this topic and say "yeah i didn't knew a fuck and was absolutely wrong!" Just the same way that happened half year ago, when I relaized there is less and less interest in crypto, and started shorting since 13k... people laughed.. then 12k.. still laughs.. 11k 10k 9k 8k 7k...mm... don't hear much laughs anymore. And I am warning you, the bottom is still far away. I though 5K before.. now I will bet for last low at 3.4k.




My real concern is about the newbies, who don't know they are newbies.. them who entered in the last 2-3 years, and think they are already cryptogurus and pro-traders. Believing this halving miracle, without realizing the implications of an logarithmic chart.. Too many people will get rekt,..

And quoting Satoshi "If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry".. mean sorry for your loss

Let's make sure we don't fall in trap again so we need to have a fixed target in mind for buying as well as cashing out, don't just get carried away by FOMO as 2017 and 2018 should be a learning curve for us. I don't think bitcoin will hit a new bottom value but again it might go back to $6k. Better to say active and not to invest right now as it might  prove fatal but we could invest if we see a further dump before halving.

Newcomers should know what is actually happening in bitcoin halving in the past and how long it will start to take off and blast everything up to the moon. There is probably a trap in the market if people keep expecting the effect of bitcoin halving within this year. Previous halving in the past needed more months before it goes bullish.

I would agree that if you were to have bought bitcoin in 2017 you're still sitting on a loss, but you ought to know that whether you make a profit or not all depends on when you got in the market.  If you'd bought bitcoin at the beginning of 2019?  You'd have more than doubled your money--so your point is what, again?

Yeah, I can believe that.  I'm not exactly sure what to think of these halvenings, but I've always thought markets are way more efficient than this.  If you could predictably make an enormous profit just by buying bitcoin before a halving, it would be akin to being able to print money.  My spidey senses tingle when people think it's that easy, and it could be that these newcomers are responsible for driving up the price recently.  Who knows.

I agree - the fact that everyone seems to think there will be a big price rise at halving is probably a good indication that it won't happen. Of course we can never be 100% certain of anything in crypto, but if there is this much anticipation of something then that usually suggests that it has already been priced in.


I'd have that checked out.

Possibly, yes. I was kind of hoping the price rises were a response to the US/Iran thing and that bitcoin was finally showing some signs of being considered a safe haven store of value - I'll concede perhaps more wishful thinking than anything else.

yes, I agree with you op we really must always be careful and not be careless with the current increase in bitcoin. because maybe bitcoin will be a big dump before it reduces by half. but I think it will not fall to $ 3,400. according to my predictions the lowest point of bitcoin this year is $ 6000. all possibilities can occur in the cryptocurrency market, we must always observe the movements of bitcoin prices.

meh, you predict a return to the bear market of 2018 when that clearly ended over 9 months ago so price going back down to the bottom of the market is extremely unlikely. It's currently over twice that price and trajectory is upward after forming a local bottom in the high 6000s (2x the market cycle bottom).

Also you say this halving won't make the price go over $15k....umm you do realize that the bull run after THE LAST HALVING made it go to $20k right? So now you think halvings are not only going to create smaller explosive gains each time (which is reasonable and accurate) but will actually create a lower price than before! That's really where you lose any sense of logic in your argument.

Some people are so afraid that Bitcoin's future won't live up to the massive gains of the past that they come up with these silly ideas like basic supply and demand will stop working and events that are bullish will instead be bearish in this upside-down world of their imagination.

Fact is, bear market ended April 1 2019 (well technically I guess it ended Dec 2018 but the bottom ended 4/1/19). Since then, the general movements of the market have looked quite similar to the same period of time after the end of the previous bear market from 2015 - some large spikes in price with retractions, but well out of the bottom, and then stalled for half a year until the rise renewed).

Yeah the halving shouldn't be an explosive bullish event, because the crazy bull run tends to start the year after the halving do to gradual pressure from lessened supply over many months. And likely there will need to be some sort of catalyst event to actually kickstart the massive gains in this market cycle. The two prerequisites for it though seem to be the halving taking place and the market (gradually) reaching the previous ATH from the peak of the last cycle. It may hang around the old ATH for a while until some event acts as a catalyst to make the market buy up the price by a few thousand dollars, and then FOMO sets in, wave after wave, until its just too much at which point it all comes crashing down and another market cycle comes to a close. The idea that this won't happen simply cuz you're afraid of whales or whatever is silly. There have always been whales in the market.

There's no need for doom and gloom type posts like this. The market is preceding well and there is no reason to think Bitcoin won't continue on an upwards trajectory long term as always.

It is very clear it was from the iran stuff, and bitcoin has a well established history of rising during geo-political crises like this. It is definitely not wishful thinking, its ordinary and accepting thinking at this point.

Its not like suddenly tons of newcomers entered crypto the exact day the iran stuff started, and then another wave entered the exact day the second round of iran stuff happened, and then they sold some of that as soon the iran situation seems to possibly have cooled off for the time being, and that this had nothing to do with iran. When you have to contort coincidences into a pretzel to make a point, its likely a fairy tale and the simple common sense answer is correct. Iran stuff caused the price to spike, then Iran stuff stopped for at least the present so price stopped rising and is now in a holding pattern for the time being. As the guy even says, "who knows", and he certainly doesn't, he's just throwing out random conjecture to go along with his bearish outlook.

The fact is that this is the main point of your post. Is this a referral link?

Then isn't the end goal the same if BTC whales buy low and sell high cause of the panic selling of other traders? In the end, as long as you don't panic and observe the reasons for every price increase and decrease, you'd be pretty safe investing right? Additionally, as a long term trader, panicking at the face of a possible change in market in a few months, isn't that kind of bad? Since you're expected to be patient not only for these few months but also for the next few years.

This is what im trying to say too where the link given is indeed a referral which op should change or edit it.
Im not familiar with Bybit and even this ones doesnt have KYC i wont consider to use this exchange specially
if it isnt that familiar or popular.

Lots of speculation do talk about even btc would go down to $1000 or whatsoever but looking on the current movement
it hard to say that we would go back to these levels.

Thanks for the heads up but I disagree with some of the points here.
Although, I am glad there is someone who made so much effort just to make this.
It's a lot of work and I don't really like it.  ;D

Are we really going to see a new bottom or is it past the due date already?
We should have seen it already in December where people are spending way too much.
I am glad it didn't happen kicking all the FUD's out.
Now, they cannot find much reason to make the bitcoin price down again. There is just none.

Is this one of those created by the FUD group to make HODLers tremble? I don't think it will work much.

If I am not mistaken, this forum does not allow posting referral links. The OP should edit it as soon as possible.

Bitcoin falling down to $1,000 is next to impossible. Again, the content is incidental. The main point of this post seems to be the referral link.

you promote a referral link on bybit, Does it not violate the forum rules, if I see the topic title I already know you are part of the FUD that usually comes when bitcoin goes up, you are sweating and worry about margin trading that is not in line with your bet, it reads in my mind

It seems so, but unfortunately their work is in vain, a lot of morons like this in the forum because of mistakes in betting on the margin market or futures market so they suffer huge losses and make FUD diforum in various ways, this is ridiculous even looking funny people like this

I totally agree, we already know that for some reason whales can somehow move the price to their liking but spreading rumors that result in FOMO and it has been going on for like a long time already and as an investor we should already know better. Whether we like it or not FOMO will be there always but what's important is how are we responding to it, we should already know by now what we can do in our part not to be trap or fall on the trap again, we should be smart enough to make the best decision and don't be carried away by anything you hear or say because you might just be disappointed in the end.

Sure there is. As a contrarian trader, (https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/contrarian.asp) I say the more bearish and pessimistic threads, the better. I take comfort in the fact that so many people still think we're headed to $5K and below. It means they've sold or shorted......which also means they need to buy back. That's fuel for the next bull market.

We're a bit more than 4 months from the halving. People sound just like they did in February or March 2016. "The halving is already priced in, the hash rate is going to crash....."

It all seems so familiar.

i dont know why lot of people wait for cheap prices this recent days ; i think prices now very good for buy bitcoin and it will reach 10 k usd soon because halving approaching day by day and and the halving its rare chance that happend every 4 years maybe for buying at current situation of reward mining always

intro messag updated

Well, Anything could happen tbh. Just by the facts of showing a logarithmic chart doesn't necessarily mean that BTC would bottom out, and even if it did, doesn't mean that it would bottom out this halving. Though I got to agree with how the halving news is being spread about everywhere and FOMO can literally be seen on every page of the forum. And with that development, you can really expect either a large amount of traders celebrating or a large amount of traders weeping by the end of the year or so.
Ur like 22 bro, not 41. Just saying.

Did you make many people panic about your update news about bitcoin price will down again? how come bitcoin have raise above $8000 and you can said bitcoin will back with lower price under $3400, I although have been experience with some exchange market is not way you can said bitcoin back with lower price, supply and demand become why bitcoin up and down and never have exchange account become bitcoin will grow up or down.

Some were still think the price will bring down that much as they wanted to buy btc that low. I don't think btc prize will be that low again even many put many FUD about bitcoin but they will not succeed knowing the price increasing now especially halving is coming.

Interesting chart and information, it does prove that there are manipulations ongoing from people that we don't know the next move, honestly, I am not really aware of this chart and the real picture of the supply these whales are in control, are we left on their decision if they are going to crash or going to pump, the next episode will be when the halving occurs.

For someone who has been in business since 1998, posting referral links to a forum where this is expressly prohibited (in post area) doesn't look professional at all. It is also more than obvious that you intend to directly but also indirectly emphasize that the crypto exchange you work for is the best, compared to the 80 exchanges you have used so far. It's a cheap trick that can only fool inexperienced people in the forum, and just one type of advertising packed into a bunch of apocalyptic assumptions.



What you did before, and what you do now, should not be brought into any relationship, people change with time, and you have become a crypto pessimist from a crypto optimist. In short, you are trying to pass on your current disappointment to others, we should listen to you and sell all our coins on exchange you promote?



So in the next 5 months price will drop to $3400? Do you have any specific facts that support it, or is it just your feeling? Personally, I do not reject any of the options, but I also do not think it matters at all what will happen in the next 5 months. The true effects of halving are not expected until 2021, of course, if repeated 2013 and 2017.

First of all it is not the 2.73 but more like 3.33 that holds it, if you could have somehow read your own chart which I have no idea how you couldn't. Secondly bitcoin is not like fiat, having 95% of it doesn't matter because in the end you will have to sell it to turn it into cash and as long as people are deciding on the price someone could have every single coin in the whole world and it could drop to 1 cent so he won't be rich at all, it is all market make world we live in.

Bitcoin is a volatile commodity, do not shame people who think bitcoin will be 20 thousand dollars in 6 months, I think 3400 is as possible as 20 thousand, none of you are wrong, both of those things are quite possible with bitcoin and has always been because there is no regulations and anything could happen in this market.

What would you expect regarding an asset where a 4,5% is in hands of retail investors? I will enlight you.. manipulation, pump and dump..
What is the future of an asset that is losing interest? Where is the massive adoption? the institutional money? What will happen when crypto fiat appears? The more people know about crypto, the more scared they are.. scams, pump and dumps, manipulation..

Well, mark these words: this halving will be the turning point.

When BTC is not able to reach new highs, people will really lose faith on exponential gains.
As you say, anything coould happen.. but seems the direction will be down. There an increasing lack of interest from  investors, the only way this pumps high, will be with Tether doing like FED.. said that, minting free money. By the way, the New York City State's prosecutor will enjoy the lawsuit against Bitfinex and Tether for market manipulation.. if you didnt heard the voice or see the text messages  recorded about "pumping the market".. search for it.. definitely not funny!

"Lack of interest from investors"....how so? Why did the chart recently double bottom in the $6,000s and then rally to the $8,000s? That indicates buyers overtaking sellers.

This rally has been slow and orderly (unlike the short squeeze in late October) and open short interest has been quite low for months, so it's hard to see it as just a short squeeze. I also see lots of signs of latent demand.....all the bearish sentiment around here for starters.

The increase of price was probably (as always) pumped by  whale and it is not a clear indicator of more interest in BTC. please do this:turn off the computer, go out.. and ask 50 strangers about how much Bitcoin they OWN (in case they already know about BTC). You will be surprised, this is a promise. Then please come again and share your findings. thanks

About the open interest, with the recent pump OI raised from 600M. to almost nearly 800Millions in a while in world's most popular exchange for leverage trading.. It is a matte rof time until it goes to1  billion again as it did some months ago, and Bitmex Snipper begins the long liquidation party of overleveraged users

OP you're making a big deal out of nothing. There's a simple reason why addresses with over 0.1 BTC make up for about 12% of all addresses. All businesses exchanges even your wallets are making new addresses to keep the change. For this reason 50% of all addresses are almost empty and it doesn't mean there's manipulation in the air.

Your mistake is believing that all those almost empty/empty and all those full addresses belong to different people. That if there's 14 million addresses with some change on them there's 14 million people in the space with nothing to say about the price. 14 million victims. It's a wrong approach!

What if we only have 2 million unique people in the space who own Bitcoin? What if all those 20 million addresses with less than 0.01 BTC on it belong to the same 2 million people who own all those addresses containing 1 Bitcoin or more?

Thank you for that very detailed information with some good presentation.

yes, I truly believe that the market could be manipulated due to the facts you shared, however, I also think it's still possible to see a bull run because if they can manipulate to cause a bull run last time, it could also happen this time around, but we need to ensure that we get out at the right time because we don't wanna become a "BAGHOLDER" again.

Are you blind? a 0,53% of addresses own a 85% of BTC's supply. That is a ridiculous amount when compared to the total of addresses available. HUGE manipulation. If you can't see that you are blind. I did my best, to make you all wake, and I won't feel sad for all of you that lose your money for having your brain washed.. you deserve it if you just didn't wanted to conduct any due dilligence at all.
There are still chances of making money, just with leveraged trading taking advantage of price swing (due to whales manipulation of course.. ) just today, 200$ down in few minutes.. and another 100$ down and again up in few fminutes also.. yeahh seems very organic, a lot of people will be interested in investing in an asset that rises,drops and rises again a 2,5% without any reason at all. sure... (ironic)

Take out exchange addresses and custody addresses like Grayscale, Coinbase, Bitgo and Xapo and you're left with a less mad figure. Probably vastly less mad.

Even if we ignore that, 0.53% of 18,100,000 or so coins is about 96,000 addresses.

I'm sure quite a few people own more than one of those. All the same you're trying to tell us that a few tens of thousands of people will all collude as one against everyone else?

Righto.

The big takeaway here is that nobody knows where Bitcoin can be months or years from now, yes it can go down but on the same breath it can also go up, again nobody knows. In other words, we should not be listening too much with people who are predicting that Bitcoin can be a million dollar value in a specific year on the other hand the same is true with people who are predicting that Bitcoin can get so low despite the many reasons that it should not. Remember that in the beginning, nobody ever thought that Bitcoin can come this long even with its current value, it was more of a gamble and a gamble that really paid well. Newbies, of course, must make their due diligence by looking at the many possible risks here, nobody should be going into anything blindfolded.

What I claim is that any whale of them will pump or dump the price. There is no safety for the retail investor..
By the wya, I wonder where do you get these numbers.. The 0,53% of addresses are 153180 addresses that control 86,17% of BTC's supply.. said that, another 14 millions addresses own the remaining 13,83%. Seems well distributed?
And for a pump, they don't need to collude at all, just one address with few thousands will do the trick.

You hit it.. BTC went VERY high, but this exponential gain can't last forever. the jump from 1$ to 100$ , it is no like the same from 100$ to 100.000$ .. both are a x1000$, but let's do some calculations and try to think about marketcaps...
 LEt's be serious... people like MacAfee, talking about 1M. per BTC?¿ wtf?¿  this is just nonsense.. just think about marketcap then. 21 trillions, sounds feasible? I doubt it

The real problem with newbies, is that they are totally biased and have their brain washed. They will get rekt, and still don't know it. And when I talk about newbies, I am not only talking about these "Newbie" ranked members.  I realized that here in forum  are many high rank members that don't like to hear and think about what will happen when they discover they were wrong. But hey.. meanwhile, they can keep on with the advices of their favourite cryptoguru in youtuber or twitter. Later there will be time to cry or for others, sadly to commit suicide.

exactly the point ,because those who were trapped from buying in 2017 surely had released their holdings last september 2019 because at least 14k$ is not much lose than in the beginning of 2019.
and those who bought in early 2019 will be in profit even if the new bottom is $5000 because it is much higher that $3000 value last January 2019 .

That's true. Just one whale can move the market at will, because of the huge disparity in the distribution. Also the market is very small and there are exchanges with only 100btc in circulation, easy targets for a single whale.

What would you propose to prevent such manipulation? Self-regulation by the exchanges themselves would not work, since some of them would choose to not have any, to attract more customers, and soon the sheep would flock there, causing losses for the other exchanges... I dont see any other solution than to have the State boot in the exchange's faces, allowing no more than 1% rises and drops per day, since the price manipulation comes from these highly centralized exchanges.

Lets face the fact that bitcoin failed completely at decentralization, since, like you have stated and its a known fact, most addresses are in the hands of a few, and the situation will only get worse, as at any dump most of those buying are themselves, accumulating more and more. State intervention will be inevitable in the long run, and innocent people might suffer from it, since State bureaucrats are not known for being technologically knowledgeable. So what do you propose? The scenario seems very dystopian for a solution that might be good for all.

actually the opposite of this flow has also crept into my mind. I think if everyone fomo about bitcoin in 2020 and everyone buys it and makes a profit, then who will lost? This financial market always has winners and losers, the majority lose more. then sharks would use this opportunity to sell bitcoin to fomo-only people. so I still keep myself safe and invest only 50% of my capital at the earliest time.

the problem will begin is this 5K is not just only next stop and drops further

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Just one thing, dont get wrong with this concept:
- BTC is insanely monopolized, and this is out of discussion, only crazy BTC maximalist high on hopium can't see it
- but BTC is effectively decentralized, meaning that your BTC is really yours, no one will confiscate it (state, exchange..) meanwhile you keep the keys

Thanks for adding value to the conversation. This is the point, find a way to solve th ebiggest problem of BTC (appart from low scalability, high transfer fees, low speed, INSANE harm to environment due to exponentially increasing minning cost....)
Honestly I don't see any solution to monopolization's problem. Whales will keep on playing and increasing their holdings with their P&D schemes.. and this is why I think BTC is doomed to fail. Who will catch up next? another existing crypto? a fiat crypto? a new crypto?.. who knows..

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The problem is that them that will lose are the newcomers and there are in a really unfair disadvantage. This is why we are deploying an algorithm trading system that will give a chance to newbies to succeed

Why do you guys assume whales are always successful at manipulating the market, always increasing their holdings? Whales compete against one another, and those who fight against the market get harpooned. Here's a counterpoint to your narrative:


As you pointed out, Bitcoin's wealth concentration doesn't affect its decentralized nature as money either. Whales can fight each other on the order book all they want, but at the end of the day, they can't change the fact that 1 BTC = 1 BTC. The economy will keep chugging along regardless of what they do.

And this is exactly the same for any market in the entire world. There are a few at the top and a bunch of nobodies below them. It's how everywhere and everything works. Framing it as some type of revelation has failed to shake my world.

Those at the top are more keen to screw each other than the nothings. The nothings come along for the ride.

We seem to get posts like this fairly often where the author believes they've uncovered a truth no one else has ever conceived of. Then they usually pursue it as far as they can take it and go down in flames. I prefer to sit back and let be what will be.

It is not about who is at the top, it is about their ability to move the market at their will.
So you seem any similarity in a market like FOrex where 5 Trillions are traded on a daily basis, with BTC, which has been pumped/dumped many times around a 10%, with just 500 millions traded.

If you want to communicate with people in the forum, first learn how to use quote and edit posts, otherwise, it looks pretty ugly and messy, very hard to follow.

The fact that you started using red is also an indicator that you are angry which comes from the fact that your venture is not exactly going the way you planned. All your assumptions come from research by various so-called experts, you think the future of BTC can only be predicted by number of addresses and number of transactions?

I don't know what you expected BTC to achieve in 10 years? That bankers and fiat will surrender and say that BTC is the perfect currency or store of value? It is a process that is clearly beyond what you can imagine, but you're just focused on institutional money, massive adoption that is failing in your opinion or some crypto-fiat - centralized stable coins that will replace BTC?

When you talk about crypto you mean all altcoins (shitcoins) which are only for the pump-dump scheme, but why you put BTC in the same basket with them? BTC is not a perfect coin, but it is have something others do not have, no matter what you think before or what you think now. 5 years ago I was reading the same posts you write now, and I will read them in 2025.

In what you believe at this point? In that shitcoin you promote in your sig&avatar? "1100% ROI since May 2019", sounds great, it's no wonder you've become pessimistic about BTC.

well, sorry for that in red, I was definitely not angry. I am just stating my point of view so people is aware of what could come, instead of keeping with BTC's opium of everlasting increasing profits.

I don't rely on any expert at all, with my academic knowledge and more than 2 decades trading I think I can trust my own experience.

There are many cryptos, 99% of them are pure bullshit and a purge is mandatory. I think BTC is a pioneer, but being the king won't last forever.. Don't believe me? You can ask the respective CEOs of Microsoft Messenger, Blockbuster, Kodak, Myspace, Blackberry, Nokia.. and many more. BTC has a huge problems of scalability, low speed, high cost, an INSANE environmental cost (exponential increased minning difficulty), and a disgusting manipulation due to monopolization of whales (mininn groups, exchanges.. ). I am absolutely the opinion that it will be replaced by other cryptos in the long term.

I claimed that people promoting Yobit in signature, were really not aware of what they were doing (working for cmc i received TONS of complaints against the exchange). But before you call shitcoin the coin in my avatar, you should at least inform yourself. But don't worry, I am not going to dip to your level and appear as disrespectful and reckless as you , claiming that the bitcoin mixer's purpose you promote in your avatar is focused on human trafficking, drugs, terrorism or whatever.. why? because before I prefer to be informed before I make an statement.. Just for your info, that seem are just blinded by BTC's maximalism opium, there is mcuh more outside, not just BTC. HEard about renaissance technologies before? https://qz.com/1741907/renaissance-technologies-jim-simons-and-the-birth-of-quant-trading/
Anyone that invested 100$ in 1988, obtained $401M in 2018. Take a calculator, do your maths (that is an average 66% yearly ROI).. and that was with traditional markets (commodities, forex, stocks, bonds..). The company I am working for is doing something similar, but rigth now working with cryptoassets.. yes, this company you just call shit achieved a 1376% ROI since its inception in 4th may 2019, at the time of writing this post. For your info, this is algorithm trading is nothing more than optimizing functions to maximize profits, and could be applied not just in crypto, but also in any other markets.. so we don't need just crypto to survive, and this is why we got interest from other trading companies, venture capitals and funds.

Bitcoin could go high, it could go high unlike anyone imagine it could, however, lets assume the biggest we can go is 50k and we can't go anything higher, we try and try and try and we fail to go any higher, that doesn't mean people will give up and price will go down and eventually bitcoin will be a thing of the past, if bitcoins max price that it could go is 50k, then we will keep on pressuring $50k and stay around those prices, that's it.

Sure, there will be ups and downs constantly in bitcoin world and sure we will see price dropping down but that doesn't mean that we will end up with a low price because people will give up, it has been over 10 years now and we haven't given up yet so I doubt we will give up after all these years of volatility, hell even the people that bought in 2017 peak haven't all given up just yet, no one else ever will.

+1
really i enjoyed reading all the data he provided above , some is makes sense and some others doubtful.

well that is normal to disagree on certain points,
especially when you talking about how the manipulation is clearly happening with altcoin holders has loss over 90% in value since the last bubble two years ago.

here in crypto everything seems like unpredictable due the fact nobody has an ability to interrupting the market like what you have mentioned about with 500 million usd you can dump and pump the market for around 10% or so , guess when you did that the market could responded unexpectedly like when the price of bitcoin move up from $700 to $20000 , those people who waiting for the new bottom has left out lol , will you?

I agree with you we should not be tempted by the current increase in bitcoin. because there is a possibility that bitcoin will be a big dump before it is reduced by half. but in my opinion it won't fall until the price of $ 3,400 is too low. in my opinion the lowest point of bitcoin when it falls is $ 5k. so we must still have a target to sell and buy. and don't expect too much for bitcoin increase.

Well it is nice to see more people open minded joining the discussion.. at the end, this is the purpose of the thread, sharing opinions backed with facts and in a respectfull manner.
Regarding the altcoins... holy shit... most of them were a moneygrab or pure scams. There were teams that wanted to but weren't able (no skills, no experience..) and others that simply took some money, cashed out and left. Others didn't have a proper CFO that provided a decent planning to hedge themselves against extreme volatility (ETH raised at 1500$, was suddenly worth few hundreds..) or just  had available insane discounts to large investors (1000% bonus for $100K invested), so the dump after hitting exchange was really hard.

Your concerns about the well-being of others are incredible, maybe you could devote yourself to charity work or something? At the same time as you are promoting some wonderful tokens and algorithms that deliver impressive ROI, you claim that BTC is nearing its end, not because you have some kind of technical information, but because you have such a feeling, is not it at least somewhat frivolous and perhaps dangerous, because you direct people to possible wrong direction? What if the price of BTC in 5 months is as it is today, what if it doubles?


Problems that are constantly being worked on, so just look at the difference between BTC in the beginning of 2009 and today. We have SegWit, Lightning Network, so many good wallets (desktop, hardware, mobile), thousands of sellers accepting BTC as a payment method, countries like Germany and Japan where BTC is fully regulated. Low speed and high cost of the transactions? You gotta be kidding, compared to what, banks? When you last time send a transaction in BTC, back in 2017 maybe?

Regarding "INSANE environmental cost", with your academic knowledge, you should know how to get some relevant information about that problem, because BTC mining it has so little environmental impact that it is not worth mentioning. Please read this thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5216904.msg53584107#msg53584107) and tell me how 0.2% of the total electricity consumed by BTC mining is INSANE? And at the same time, more than 50% of that energy comes from renewable sources.


YoBit is for sure very shady exchange, but what you or I have with fact that forum rules allow such advertising?SCAM is not moderated on this forum, it is up to users to decide what is good or bad. Regarding what you promote, I get more info then you think - I am just wondering how long that company will last and how much money investors will lose at the end.

Before calling me "disrespectful and reckless" and "supporter of human trafficking, drugs, terrorism" start from the first line you write in this thread, and how you try to promote your business (even with ref link) which just tells you what your initial intentions were when you open this thread. You can also call me poisoned by "BTC's maximalism opium", but on which opium you are?

Yeah, I also do think that Bitcoin won't fall into that amount and it is really low. I expect that there will only have a slight dip probably around $6-5 but I don't think it will drop at the bottom. Actually, we could purchase now and wait til halving because everyone is speculating that Bitcoin will skyrocket after it reduced by half.

Is really everyone speculating that it will go up right away ? I would expect to see the (short-term) top before the halving and then a return to the mean. I expect the chances for the bottom to be in are much higher than to see a new bottom.

Maybe the course of our fate will be decided if we break out of the downward channel for good or we get another rejection, which will lead us to $5k, which is also the bottom of the channel in a time correlated manner.

I'll say it again, you're using the forum as if you started using it only yesterday, so look at what your post looks like, you call yourself an academically educated person?


Why do you consider people fools who can't read between the lines? You start this thread to promote some shitty exchange you work, and by creating clickbait article about some new bottom for which there is no justification in any analysis, and everything actually comes from your head. I ask you again what you will do if what you speculation does not happen in 5 months? Same as John McAfee do, say that it was only joke, or you say "in next 5 months"?


I only respond to your questions, and you are trying to say BTC is doing so badly in all possible fields. People's knowledge of BTC is different in different countries, what does it matter now how much one owns or does not own something? BTC is only 10 years old, and by some research 0.5% to max 1%, the world population is somehow involved with this relatively new technology. Asking 100 people about BTC will not change anything, even if all 100 say they never hear about BTC.


Last BTC should be mined around 2140, but 99% will be mined by 2032 and that 1% or 210 000 BTC will left for the next 100 years. Your idea that BTC is in any way an environmental threat makes no sense, and I really don't understand why it doesn't matter to you that the vast majority of the energy used for mining is coming comes from renewable energy sources, most from hydropower. During the rainy seasons, there is a huge surplus of electricity in China that miners are using for mining.

Your thinking about conserving the environment and saving electricity is at least weird. Do not care about other industry who is destroying the planet, but you have a big problem that BTC is using 0.2% of total world electricity production?


Can you read what you post? My reply on yobit has come from your : "I claimed that people promoting Yobit in signature, were really not aware of what they were doing (working for cmc i received TONS of complaints against the exchange)." Who is redirecting conversation in another direction?
You really look ridiculous and pathetic with all these spins trying to prove something, you just dig deeper into something that is just a product of your mind, without any real basis.


My English is far from excellent, but I understand perfectly what you are writing, I just don't understand why there is so much negativity you want to pass on to others under the guise of some kind of warning that new bottom is coming. I bet only you can say that my posting is based on something I do not know, despite you considering me ignorant and supporter of terrorism, drug trafficking, and other bad things. Mixers have a purpose, but not only for that you think - that this is the case not a single one would no longer exist. Bad coins can be tracked and freezed before they even come to mixer.

it seems that the manipulation happening is for the price to go uptrend.

Personally, I have accumulated a lot already last year and I never sold any of my btc for long term hold as I am expecting to see a new ATH as the halving is approaching, well, hopefully there's a pump but what's wrong with holding more if there's no pump that is happening.

one clear example of manipulation is what is happening with the BSV, it created a new ATH as price goes like crazy, but I say, people who bought at its peak should prepare for a bloody correction.

I have to disagree because it’s all about the psychology of investors. There are new people buying now that weren’t investing in 2016 at the last halving when the price was about $700.  Those people may see the current price at $8000 at a good deal just like people in 2016 saw $700 as a good deal.  Then when it starts rising, FOMO kicks in and they all jump on the bandwagon.

Who is fooling us? I mean who said bitcoin will never be 3400 again and can never be 3400 again? This is bitcoin, we can have 3400 same as 34000 and those are all technically doable stuff since there is no regulation and it all depends on if there is more dollars coming in or if there is more dollars going out of the current market. It looks like the price is going up and that is good, we are almost at $9k now and that is awesome however just because we are around that nobody really claimed we are going to $20k without ever falling back.

The bigger possibility is going up, which is literally happening, not to say 3400 is "impossible" but it is unlikely nowadays, maybe after this bull run is over (which may take some time) we can have 3400 in couple months? Maybe we will never have it ever again but nobody really denies the "possibility" of such a thing.

you still there pal?
waiting for your $3400 dip?

while we are heading to the next all time high  :D


well people thought that the $200 bsv is the peak price , but then it continue goes up $300, who's to blame? always the manipulators while actually there is no manipulation at all with solid evidence, no?

DUMP that shitty BSV!

By the end of 2018 the price was almost the same as now. Slowly by the starting of the year the price started to fall low to $3500. Further the growth started by the second quarter of the year. Maybe this can take place this year, but the halving has rewritten the years growth. Earlier when the price reached the ath it took place in a very short time, and the same can happen this time during the days close to halving.

I think not the same with 2018 because bitcoin have raise to higher price without two weeks in the new year, I think look positive for bitcoin become the same situation with 2017 have chance for bitcoin back to higher price, wait for second month on this year will bitcoin back to higher price and down with lower price, but I sure and optimist bitcoin have good day in this year.

That's a great analysis but still we don't yet id that will happen. If the value of bitcoin reall go doan below $5,000 then it could be good for traders since they can hoard a lot and this is really good for a long term investment because for sure that it will rise up again or bounce back to its current price after the fall.

But still we really don't knkw if it will go down, and a lot of prediction that it will go much higber after the halving and it could hit range value of $15,000 - $20,000.

Have pass bottom price for bitcoin and never have chance bitcoin back with lower price $3,400 because bitcoin twice from price now and look keep going on to higher price after many good time with halving and other moment to make bitcoin look stronger going to higher price, if you hope bitcoin back with lower price maybe you need waiting for long time.

I don't understand the concern of most people in the crypto industry. When the price is on the low, there is panic and concerns as to when the price would increase and now the price is increasing there is still threads and analysis here and there that is warning people that they should not even take it serious. The question is what exactly do we want in crypto as it is beginning to seem that nothing is satisfactory to anyone again. We speculate but when things are happening in that direction, we begin to panic.

Most holders have few 100% profit. Holder that have 90% loss needed to buy Bitcoin at $90000. Was Bitcoin ever $90000?  Even the ones that were super unlucky and bought Bitcoin at lets say $16000 have right now 50% loss.  But rare have chance to buy that high. Most bought bitcoin in $1000 or less levels.  To have 90% loss you need to trade. And you can make a 90% loss really fast that way. Can take only few days if really unlucky.

Already did 6 months ago at $200. It's amazing how people could pump this shitcoin to a new ATH.
I could make more money on this but at least I got some more BTC for it. Long Satoshi, short Craig.

People with LONG position, hope you have a tight stop loss. The last days price has been plunging while open interest keeps on rising. Around 860M. now on Haye's (aka liquidator) exchange.Think this will keep on rising, and when reach 1billion, it will dump really really hard (in the past did it easily with 1000$ down and tons of liquidation notifications in B. Snipper).
In the heatmap you can also see a big buy wall at 8.2k which should keep LONGs safe, but google about "spoof orders".. this walls are not so reliable. yesterday a $40M. dissappeared in  a while.

https://i.imgur.com/r66MmZm.jpg

Now the tittle of this thread doesn't sounds so stupid.. right? While most of people remained bullish I have been shorting the market. Wish you had a tight stop loss..otherwise the loss must be really huge

Suppose one could look at any number of threads about price predictions, single out the ones with hyperbolic language and we'd see equal swings of either. So they look either brilliant, or downright silly. But then, we all know to take threads like these with plenty of grains of salt right?

Also, stop loss should have triggered for most. Probably a lot of buy triggers and then stop losses too along the way, but anyone with orders at 5690 would be smacking lips now.

Being short always will miss the large rallys possible even in a bear market as sharp corrections are possible.    Shorts themselves are future buyers, the ideal is gain both ways and some manage that I guess.
   Any short I have is only to really hedge my longs, I dont like to close a short at a loss so I'm ok with a market move downwards and I can be bullish on a longer term time scale.   I dont see theres a real conflict as prices can move to any level for short duration, people assume its forever when it can just be a unique price on that day.  I always try to compare it to sales in a supermarket, the shelf price is the result of so many factors.   Thats a complicated way of saying many will hold and lose nothing by doing so, the people who borrowed in another currency to go long in Bitcoin are forced to dance while the market shoots bullets at their feet.   Every bit of news is amplified beyond reason, it does not mean BTC itself is in any way less useful or of less value then yesterday.

So far as a bottom price, when we lost the 50 day and 200 day so easily it was quite a big negative.   Its possible we return to the context of 200 week I suppose but I think we have other longer term measures possible and I'll reference them before deciding.   Seems we have more time to go for this upset generally, no rush.

Shorting the market since January? That must have been hard for you seeing 10 thousand for so long.

I hope you weren't shorting with leverage. That would be like sex with a hedgehog :D

I've got to tradingview, to try some analysis, but it seems to be impossible.

The manipulation was hard, really hard. There is a single red candle in the coinbase chart, going from 8k to 5k just today. Its a single entity dumping the coins. My guess is it dumping around 10k bitcoins, enough to make this effect in all exchanges. Maybe its something related to CSW court case, but I doubt it.

Also coinbase is leading the dump, the others are following it.

I never thought of this happening since the beginning of the year. It perform very well and there is halving coming up. Now, we are below $5k in our local exchange site. I'm actually surprise, didn't see it was coming. What's even worst is, we may go even lower or maybe not worst since we could finally buy at a lower price we didn't expected. The dump is really hard, it was fast.

The price being high is important to BTC being the utility it needs to be,

 about 1M a btc ~ 10M a btc.

This would allow you to throw in 10~100 billion at the market and not move it and so have the required liquidity to wrest control for GOV's dictating financial policy and sanction.

So I *want* a high BTC but not primarily for the USD$ amount or FIAT amount, rather for the displacement effect of the current banking system.

I think we are going to shake out a lot of holders right now. There should be a few epic dead cat bounces.

Exactly! If you only come to the market to short, and keep shorting against the market, you will hurt yourself. You short to go long and you go long to go short, when the trend reverses.
At this point it's a bit late to short.
If you short now, you bet on the epidemic lasting for a few more months. If you go long, you bet against it. It has to be said: you aren't trading with or against Bitcoin's trend, because what we're witnessing is not a trend, but a panic that originated from stocks, gold, oil, and all other markets.

Nope, I was shorting because I expected whales (yes, that people that converted BTC in ponzi) to dump, but this coronavirus is still worse. I said 8k when BTC was at 13k in summer... then 5k, 3.5k.. now I say $1000 soon. Anyone still thinking BTC is digital gold, safe haven , ... and all this bullshit propaganda, deserves to lose his money.  Do you think I am wrong? Ok, open long.. time will tell us who was right.

A Bitmex exit scam could throw the price to sub-$1000. I would guess something around $700.

But it will last few minutes, since this price is from the previous bear market recovery (2013), so people will flock in to buy.

Also, nobody is selling due to virus doomsday. Most investors who sold, were gambling in Bitmex, or were legacy investors (from hedge funds, for example) who sold to cover other asset's losses. The culprit for the escape of legacy money is the pandemic fund. (https://qz.com/1017805/the-world-bank-issued-425-million-in-pandemic-bonds-and-derivatives-designed-so-investors-pay-in-the-event-of-an-outbreak/)

Now, I could not care less for legacy money, as they will eventually return to bitcoin when the mass vaccinations starts. But Bitmex, seriously, why the crypto sector let this thing run? I'm concerned with the sector's direction over it. Its time to get rid of the "hodlers cult" and start to be serious about bitcoin. I run a full node everyday and I would like to see it succeed. It will not succeed while the sector keep this "freedom" bullshit discourse up. We dont want freedom for thieves, we want value for holders.

Because it's voted into existence and sustained by the degenerate gamblers. Everyone flocked to Bitfinex despite its shonkiness because that's where the action was.

There's no getting rid of it. It needs to grow out of this phase and move onwards. You can't really force that or magic up its early arrival. The best you can do is outlast it.

any reason to expect that? bitmex is a money printing machine. they have a strong interest in not exit scamming.


what is anybody gonna do about it? bitmex is registered in the seychelles and operates from HK. the USA government can't even touch them, let alone anyone else.


what thieves? if degenerates want to gamble with huge leverage on a shady exchange, who is getting hurt? i don't believe these narratives that bitmex is fundamentally bad or controls the market. that is just a different way of generally blaming "manipulators" whenever the market moves against you.

Theres always some circling overhead looking for chances to go short and pick off weak longs, but it takes progressively greater skill in order to get in and out alive with the prey in their talons.   At some point the market would rather just go long and see how far we can go in that direction.   
  Dont fight the tide, even the largest wave recedes retracts and restarts its motion again and is never exactly the same in the next instance as the last.    So I do think we are in revision here of the larger move of the last 7 days and then we begin the next weekly bar and see how far we go.

https://talkimg.com/images/2023/06/12/A7e35.png

   The action fits my old chart quite well I reckon, both with trend from last summer high but also some reference even to the 2017 top there such is the vast range we tracked.  So below the 200 week average we are underneath the ice, its abnormal and we'll see how main markets and BTC react in sentiment.   Dare I say it could be considered a positively developing chart from here (if repeating), but we need time as surely the market wont agree all at once.

I have been long since 2015 and did great.

Ok, fine, according to you I deserve to lose my money. That will happen only if Bitcoin dies, which I'm still willing to bet against. Most of my money was and still is in Bitcoin and will remain there until one day I need it for retirement. We'll see who is going to laugh last.

I can also tell you that I've been here when Bitcoin was trading for $500 and people were committing suicides over it. I still held. Some people just have to lose money to understand the true value of some things.



I'm not a trader, rather a long term investor and from my point of view all indicators are shoing that the move below 6k was driven by panic. It looked like the first move to 6k was a short liquidation wave and the next one that dipped below 4k was a panic followup by people who basically turned off thinking when they saw the first move.
Fear index at ATH, oversold RSI, no change in fundamentals. For me it's a buy opportunity all over again.

Have to expect more declines in the coming days. But I'd never think that we don't have some room for recovery still we have but we don't know when or until crisis been over. The market mark for another huge dump as the spread of the virus becomes pandemic and it sounds like worrying enough to think of selling. Yes, it can be sort of worries and can be a normal effect because it wasn't normal anymore. But something we need to calm because it never helps to decide but rather fuel at its worse.
We are already at $5k from $4k in the past day...it was a big jump to see and have some chances to move high again. Well, this only hope (not an assurance).

We are still on very shaky ground. We managed to close the week near the 200-week MA (not above) and that's about the only good thing to say. With that upside fake out just now, the daily and hourly charts both look terrible. This huge wick on notable volume indicates a lot of bulls just got trapped between $5,500-$6K. They will pressure the price down now:

https://i.imgur.com/9bevABW.png

Declines in the coming days makes it sound like new lows but I think sure negative action but only to fill in previous movements.   It is a buy generally, harder to say over what time it will recover because it has alot more work to do.    6000 is resistance for now, definetly in a struggle to keep its short term momentum from the bottom as find 2 day average as possible ceiling.  
  So levels of interest are 6000 5500 4700 then 3850 but Im not sure we go back to the low.   I guess BTC being so volatile can quite easily test the nerves and boundaries, need the confirmation to any bottom to really rise thereafter.  OBV if I read it right and just volume generally is that we are caught within this box 6k to 4.7k so I will guess on a touch down before breaking the box either way.

    Most negative perspective would be to see 2014 to 2015 when we last slipped this 200 week and its like over year there it took to step back up and become more bullish & go anywhere.  I do remember a long lull then, lack of interest, belief, excitement and I dont relate that to now when BTC can be more used then ever, avoiding cash notes is sound advice now.

Everyone.

Unfortunately we are back at $4k now, bitcoin dump 15% today, a big dump which could result bitcoin to dump further.
Well, it seems like OP knows something here, with the rate btc is going now, its not possible to see $3400 in the next few days.

We again experiencing downfall and we can't say where the market will proceed. Either way we need to focus with our investment and assess your
position from time to time. It's not easy to hold when you keep noticing that the value is falling.
The possibilities of seeing the bottom moving to that barrier is really there needs to be well aware.

There is an all out war on multiple levels out there, biological warfare, oil war, regular war, economic war etc. Everybody is throwing what they have at each other and through their proxies. Sources from China are telling me that the government is "shaming" people and kinda asking them "How is Bitcoin doing for you these days?" implying Bitcoin is a scam ( I have one source but if someone else can confirm that would be great). So if the Chinese are off the boat ( for now ) it is possible to see further dumping and stagnation at the levels until at least May when the halving will occur. In other words ..best time to buy BTC !  ;D

I feel bad about the market now. I supposed to think that also and might OP is right about his prediction.
Well, if that suppose to happen in the coming days, I have to accept it and that is the only thing to do rather than being infected with a virus of being a panic seller. I didn't do that coz that was suicide. I know and I believe that this may over soon, I have to wait for it no matter how long it takes. I've been doing this before and there is no reason why I can't make it.

prediction of op looks legit so yeah , his predictions can happen and its hard to accept it  .

most of us now are hoping for recovery and many threads released lately about hope and recovery of the price and then suddenly there are also this threads that tackles about more declines.  
i like it when you say we have experience this before and we have surived so how much more ?  this are the words that im also holding just to give me stregnth  or hope to continue hodling .  

The big problem here is the brain washing we have been suffering by BTC maximalists. They must shill BTC because their future (money in their wallets) depends on new fish entering the system, and  hindering the scape of them who are already in. I can either hold, light a candle and pray, but this won't save my ass when BTC dumps to 1000$ or lower. I don't want to get at this point and say again "shit, I should have sold my BTC at 5k and rebuy now 5 BTC at 1K".
well, make your bets, decide, we will see who was right in few months from now on

One solution for it is to not sell everything, just a part of it (maybe half, if you are still on profit), and put the order to rebuy lower. So if you miss the mark, you will still hold some coins for future profits (in case of a recovery). People like to deal with absolutes, just look at the answers to my recent posts, you are either a member of the cult or a "nocoiner".

Just a quick reminder for everyone here: the initial intention of bitcoin was to shield investors when financial crisis in the legacy system happens. This was the original idea. And bitcoin failed the task.

However, I will not say the culprit is Bitmex, I will say, instead, that the culprit is the hodler cult, which brainwashed people into treating bitcoin as a religion, ignoring the issues surrounding its adoption. In this way, bitcoin was quietly infiltrated by the legacy system, and now its useless to shield investors from its caprices.

Needless to say, the hodler cult is allied with this doomed system, as some answers from its members to my posts clearly shows. In their view, to have a derivatives casino with 2000% leverage is "normal", even after its proven this caused the failure of bitcoin as a store of value.

They will keep hammering it as a "normal" business, because they are allied with it. So they brainwash people to buy and "hodl" for 200 years while they place bets on these derivatives markets, making fiat money out of people, and jeopardizing bitcoin in the long run.

First of all, I consider Bitcoin today as an investment that will bring me profits due to the volatility of Bitcoin.  But I believe that every Bitcoin user will receive a much larger profit if Bitcoin is used as a means of payment in a person’s daily life, as the demand for this coin will increase many times over.  But there is a global problem for this, which consists of scalability.  Of course, this problem cannot be solved quickly and whether it is possible to solve it is generally unknown.  Nevertheless, each of us understands that the value of Bitcoin also lies in the fact that Bitcoin is not subject to inflation and this is the main value of Bitcoin that exalts it in front of fiat funds.  If we consider the possibilities of Bitcoin for the near future, then someone can lose or get a good income, it is very difficult to predict.  But I am convinced of good prospects in the future and if I do not rely on Bitcoin as the main source of income, then I will leave Bitcoin for long-term storage.

And what you shill in your avatar and signature? Is this something better than BTC maybe? Most people on this forum are here because they share the same interests, and have the freedom to discuss them in accordance with the rules of the forum. No one is forcing anyone to invest in something, there is no "brain washing" and no conspiracy theories that people like me just want to profit by introducing others to BTC.

Your "few months" slowly ticking, and regardless of the crisis BTC has not yet sunk (to your great regret), and I hope you will be here on May 11, 2020 - though I'm sure you will, like all other fudsters do two things : disappear or add another 5 months to see some new bottom.

Are you in love with me?  ;D It is overhelming.. but well, I can handle it as it is online love. One again you are the only one who talks about my signature here, I  only talk about that subject in the respective bitcointalk thread, not promoting here..so sorry, I don't play your game as I am not in kindergarten since  along time ago.
Regarding BTC, (THE PURPOSE OF THE POST), people is free to discuss, so yes, I posted a DETAILED explanation of my claim.. And you are again wrong, there is a lot of brainwahs, shilling, propaganda... Bitcoin is supposed to get mainstream as we talk to friends and family to buy.. seems more ponzi than a multilevel business. who shills BTC? these people that already got big wallets.
The fact is that are many coins much more efficient (faster, cheaper, ..) and less manipulated than BTC (where 95% of supply is under control of 2.5% of addresses). On top of that, lets add the upcoming central bank digital currencies (CBDC).. And to finish, the big coronavirus pandemia never seen before by anyone alive today in the world. Things will get realy worse, all markets will dump and it is already proven the safe haven/digital gold of BTC is bullshit, as it was dumping nearly 65% some days ago. You don't like because you want to marry BTC? great, but leave people decide AFTER knowing ALL the facts.

I'm talking about something that is fact, and you are promoting scam project, or better to say you shilling it more than most people any other project, including BTC. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5132229.msg54083976#msg54083976

Also, what you are shilling so hard is based on plagiarized whitepaper, although you and your team don't have any particular problems building your business on something that doesn't belong to you. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5133185.0

I will not comment on all the other nonsense you wrote, you completely ignored one of my post before, but now I see you are rather moody, due to the price of BTC, pandemic, or something else...

Once again..what you talk about has already been covered but you didn't wanted to search or read it. Anyway this post is about BTC. Obviously you don't have anything to add or can deny my claims.. but your portfolio dropped a 40% since I opened this thread, and will go worse. Ok, you are free to hold it and keep losing money, and I am free to express my points so others don't get trapped and lose their money. I have seen already too many people cry because they lost money.. and the problem was, when the money didn't belogn to them. I just warn people so they don't make the most stupid mistake of their lives, purchasing now, thinking that BTC is dirty cheap and can only go up, because will happen just the opposite.

https://media.tenor.com/images/b4e8b195be7d8578f5b80b0e50fb05e4/tenor.gif

PS: will come back to you when BTC reachs the 3k mark again.. and later on 1K  ;D

I agree with ChiNgadOr and that's why I'm now a supporter of BSV.

The hodlers cult wants to delude people. Just look at their thread, the WO thread, where their clique displays their luxuries, like cars, yatchs, hookers, expensive restaurants, etc. They want to fool uninformed people to buy bitcoin and expect those things will appear magically if they hold for some years. All lies.

The clique is made of earlier adopters, who started to invest when bitcoin was still a currency for buying Magic the Gathering cards. That is, it is a ponzi scheme, and even people who adopted it post-2013 bubble (like me) dont have all those luxuries they try to sell to people. That's one of the reasons bitcoin is going to three digits: investors dont want to put money into it after bitcoin's recent failure to shield them from a financial crisis, caused by a fake "pandemic".

I just feel sorry for the miners, developers, etc, who are really involved with several different projects, both on bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, and dont need to show off cars, yatchs, hookers, etc. These guys are having their work being destroyed, corroded by the inside, by bad marketeers, who happens to gamble with paper speculation, to bring bitcoin down and the entire crypto sector with it.

These marketeers appeals to the most stupid side of the human brain, the one which controls consumerist impulses, and pack it together with empty promises of "worldwide adoption", while at same time preaching "freedom" for paper speculation to quietly infiltrate and destroy it. They gamble into it, otherwise they would not defend it. To say Bakkt and other financial devices will bring some good to bitcoin is to treat bitcoin (and all the other cryptocurrencies) as simple ponzi schemes. Turns out it becomes like that, when all you have is a small clique, a very closed club, benefiting from it, at the expense of all the others, who actually believed on the potential of those projects. That's why this bear market is permanent, and bitcoin will dump to the bottom of $0.85 in 2028.

40% you say? As far as my memory serves me, the price of BTC was even lower in December 2019 (around $6500), and at this moment is $6800 - what I lost since you open this FUD/Self-promotion thread? What I lost since 2015 when I first time invest in BTC at price of only $200? My portfolio is up more than 30x since 2015, and this is hard fact which you can challenge as much as you want. From time when faucets pay 5 BTC per claim, and to time when 1 BTC is worth almost $7000 many people like you are been buried BTC hundreds of times, and none of them are on the forum anymore, you will be just one of them.


You forget that if BTC fail, all other crypto project will follow - and that is including that crypto-exchange you are working now, and that project you are shilling. Your speculation was, and still is "in next 5 months" since the opening of this thread, so you have until May 11, or you will still extend the timeframe to another 5 months, maybe 5 years?

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This should be recorded for history, see you in 2028.

All the signs were there. Looks like the infection took hold, there's no way back and now the only things left are 'thoughts and prayers'.



This reminds me of the phase that r/btc went through. They latched on to the idea of Tether being the thing that would 'bring Bitcoin down' and spent weeks ghoulishly fingering their toilet areas in a frenzy as they pondered the various scenarios in which it would play out.

They could not muster up the calories to make the cognitive leap that it just might affect every other shitcoin very much too including their own one.

Double quoted, Lucius dude.
What a bunch of losers indeed. :-\

BSV supporter? wtf! no way, there is only one bitcoin, and this is BTC.. sadly the ecosystem has been corrupted as f**k.. and now only brainwashed people is left to support the expenses of the early ponzi adopters.


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Well, I come back to you when BTC reach 1k or 2k  in the next months.. and I would be expecting your answer here.

Definitely, please do.

forwarded from a conversation in a chat..
"About the bullshit of digital gold.. Gold is a tangible asset, it has multiple uses and it has been used to transfer asset value across borders, very similar to BTC and others. But if you buy your partner a gold ring, necklace etc I’m sure it will have a different affect to buying him/her the same value in BTC 😂
now, lets forget about the shitty manipulation (95% of supply in hands of a few), hash monopolization (7 minning groups with the almost the whole control).. BTC will eventually crash for good, it has a while to go yet. Once the STOs market develops BTC (already an outdated technology) along with most other crypto’s will be gone for good, the clock won’t start ticking until that moment anyhow. One reference that most people in this space don’t understand is burn rate and if you don’t have cash flow you have nothing. You can always do a fork though and pretend dilution doesn’t exist.
And now let's talk now about facts. Who dares to name a company on NYSE, Hang Seng, FTSE, NASDAQ, LSE or ASX that can survive for 10yrs without raising additional capital and only gets traded on perception, provides no dividends and has no potential income ?
So agree that 99% of crypto’s will be destroyed once STOs start offering dividends.
JSE, LSE, SSX (plus many more will follow) all regulated global IOSCO exchanges are listing STOs this year, this will be the demise of the junk, which is a good sign as only the best will survive.
Appart from this, BTC lacks speed, security fundamentals are flawed, transaction per sec...way too slow. BTC will continually slow by design, environmentally it’s a disaster (waste of energy) and it is most definitely not a store of value. It is no good for payment of goods nor a store of value but it’s great to trade 😂 (while you keep shorting of course if you want to make money!)
you can be tracked, i don’t care for criminals, so I don’t personally mind but there is a false perception of being hidden. but you can actually be pin pointed.
Lose your password and lose your wealth
LightningNetwork is a bandaid"
In some time, you will have a bunch of worthless nothing (=btc).. and you don't like to hear it.. but this is the sad truth.
And keep in mind I don't claim fiat is the answer.. with the 6 trillions inyected yesterday, USD is really fu**ed

Tell us more about STOs. Are they useful? Can they be trusted or are they just more pump and dump schemes?
Can I buy them with bitcoin? In what exchanges? I dont want to spend fiat on any non-crypto trade, too many regulatory restrictions.

I think that no one is building too large and very beautiful illusions regarding all cryptocurrencies, with the exception of enthusiastic enthusiasts from the cryptocurrency community.  Most investors and other cryptocurrency users believe or hope for the prospects of a particular project in the future and therefore invest their money in these projects.  But as always, the leaders are Ethereum Bitcoin, although Bitcoin is popular mainly due to its volatility.  Undoubtedly, after a certain time, most of all these projects will not withstand competition or simply cannot be in demand in the market and in society.  Based on this, most of the cryptocurrencies will cease to interest anyone, as you said.  I believe that if you ask the question who do you live in the cryptocurrency market after a while, then the answer will be the high capitalization of certain cryptocurrencies today.  In any case, fiat funds will not be monopolists in the financial currency market.