Bitcoin Forum

Is it possible to invest in OpenBazaar now or in the future?  Are they going to disperse a coin?

No

Why the hell should they create a scamcoin? BTC works just fine.

Also, it is a decentralised platform, it's not a company, you can't buy shares of it.

Can't wait for DogeBazaar.

What is the motivation for the OpenBazaar nodes to run the software?  Or maybe it doesn't work like that?

No one knows?

Why not invest in Nxt FreeMarket? It is actually already released.

nxtfreemarket.com (http://nxtfreemarket.com)

OK so maybe you have to run a node in order to shop on OpenBazaar?  That's an incentive.

How long has Nxt FreeMarket been up and how much traction has it gained?

I'm pretty sure any coin can make an openbazaar port id they want it.

Wow, watching people set their minds on OpenBazaar and completely ignore any alternatives is quite hilarious.

FreeMarket has been out for a few weeks now. The first release was basically an open beta, and the first big update was November 9. It needs more buyers and sellers, but it is definitely showing promise and is functional. It is completely decentralized and runs on the Nxt blockchain. It is not a 'clone' of anything, it is completely original code.

https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/ (https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/)

Can I connect to an open node with a browser to see it in action?

Currently you need to download + sync the Nxt Blockchain. https://bitbucket.org/JeanLucPicard/nxt/downloads/nxt-client-1.3.2.zip (https://bitbucket.org/JeanLucPicard/nxt/downloads/nxt-client-1.3.2.zip)

Once that is done, run the FreeMarket app and log in with your Nxt account. (You can browse without logging in)

https://bitbucket.org/blackyblack/freemarket/downloads/FreeMarket-setup-1.0.exe (https://bitbucket.org/blackyblack/freemarket/downloads/FreeMarket-setup-1.0.exe)

It is still very new (only released yesterday) and is not as complete as it will be in coming months. A website where you can log in and use the FreeMarket is in development.

Is FreeMarket accessible through a browser or only directly through the FreeMarket app?

The Nxt client runs in the browser. I believe you can still install FreeMarket to the Nxt client and access it through the browser, I'm not sure.

Is OpenBazaar accessible via a browser?

OpenBazaar has not been released yet. I have no idea.

I believe OpenBazaar is currently functional in beta mode.

For convenience, I wouldn't consider using one of these that isn't accessible via a browser.  I'm 95% sure OpenBazaar is accessible that way.  I'll keep an eye on FreeMarket

Fair enough. The last release (which is still available) was definitely available via browser. I'd be surprised if this version isn't. The .exe file is open sourced, and just opens a WebView to see FreeMarket.

There is already something close that has been running and established for over 6-7 months now.

Check it out:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=402667.0

https://marketplace.noblemovement.com/

Researching these myself too, thnx.

Can it be run decentralized?

In case anyone else is curious, yes, FreeMarket can be run in a browser. Just download the 'diy' option and run index.html

https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/freemarket-in-a-browser/ (https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/freemarket-in-a-browser/)

Wow nice, and you can even invest in freemarket. I'm in.

 :) No fees for the rest of 2014, but after that it will cost 7.77 NXT to list an item. And 80% of fees will be paid to FreeMarket shareholders, the other 20% to SuperNET shareholders.

from what i see that is not a decentrlized marketplace. its just a normal marketplace website running on a server. or am i missing something?

I don't see it taking off without a series of "trusted" open nodes which people can connect to if they're willing to trade convenience for security.

once the dark markets are there its going to take off.

Why need trusted nodes? It runs on the Nxt blockchain directly.


It's only a matter of time. There isn't a single point of failure, it is near impossible to shut down freemarket. This will change the game.

Some people won't want to download, install, and run special software in order to buy or sell there.  If there were a series of open nodes they could connect to with only their browser, they would be much more likely to use it.  They would be sacrificing security for convenience but they don't care.

Are there any more of these blockchain marketplaces besides OpenBazaar and FreeMarket?  I'd love to know how those two compare to each other.

An online service is being developed now.

Reference?

https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=6231.msg124378#msg124378 (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=6231.msg124378#msg124378)


As far as I know, no. FreeMarket seems to be the only one operating at the moment.

http://cointelegraph.com/news/112883/dear-online-drug-buyers-your-problems-are-solved (http://cointelegraph.com/news/112883/dear-online-drug-buyers-your-problems-are-solved)

I believe OpenBazaar is also operating currently, although in beta.  Thank you for the link.

Well the key difference is, that openBazaar is able to run with any cryptocurrency, while Nxt just added a feature to themselves, that will  probably not run on other cryptos. It works, but it's kinda against the spirit of open source.

No, Nxt has MGW, allowing you to use multiple currencies, including Bitcoin.

What advantages will Freemarket have over OpenBazaar?

I was under the impression NXT was required to use FreeMarket, based on this quote "To use FreeMarket, you must first have NXT installed and have a NXT account with some NXT in it." https://nxtforum.org/freemarket-releases/new-freemarket-version-standalone-app!/

If there's some sort of way to use multiple currencies from the NXT link for Free Market, it should be advertised better or linked to the actual market that works with multiple currencies.

I'd like to know this too.

Using MGW, an already existing NxT technology, you can deposit multiple currencies into the NxT Asset Exchange and trade them for Nxt. Since it is running on the nxt blockchain, yes, you must use nxt. But you don't need to go through a centralized exchange to convert. It's all up to preference, really. This is the second release, I'm sure it will continue to improve in tech. and ease of use.

I have invested a small amount into FreeMarket because I think it can do well, but that doesn't make me an expert on it by any means. If you are interested, I would recommend you to post here:

https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/ (https://nxtforum.org/freemarket/)

What I do know is that it does not log your ip, runs right on top of the nxt blockchain so transactions are very quick, listing fees are super low and buying fees almost nonexistent (1 nxt apiece), and it is already released of course.

I haven't researched openbazaar much though, it may have these features as well.

In my opinion, FreeMarket's devs seem to be a friendly and intelligent group, and seem dedicated. I think there will be more cool features to come

I am really happy about these online decentralized markets like openbazaar and freemarket. The less power the governments have to control buying and selling of objects the more freedom consumers will have.

yes i sure hope so too

Disappointed to learn this about OpenBazaar:

http://forum.openbazaar.org/index.php?p=/discussion/105/need-a-permanent-node-to-set-up-a-store

That is not decentralization for me.

O HAI.

I am one of the devs. I like to think we are friendly and intelligent :)

We certainly love feedback. "The devs are listening," I like to say. We are committed to making FreeMarket as good as it can possibly be, and for that, we need to know what users want.

Hoi, poofknuckle! Great work on Freemarket, mate. :D


This is one of the things people don't get about Nxt: its an open, de-centralised system with no set leadership structure. If people want to make an app based on Nxt, they don't have to ask any permission, just get down and do it, which is what the FreeMarket team did.
The FreeMarket app is therefore not an integral part of the Nxt core, but is an independent project running on the Nxt blockchain.
 

A phone app for free market will help it gain traction IMO. Or maybe a mobile browser accessible version.

The interface is very simple, I bet it works great on a phone through a browser.  You need to be able to connect to someone's node though.

A web interface has already been developed (not by the core team, but by another NXT user who liked FreeMarket). They still need an SSL certificate, but here's the address:

https://freemarketlite.com (https://freemarketlite.com)

That might work well on a phone browser, I am looking forward to trying that out  8)

Nice!

The site doesn't look bad on a phone browser. The list item form looks really good.

The Supernet already has Freemarket which is the same as open bazaar.  It's symbol is called UNITY.  https://bter.com/trade/unity_btc  Also, with the coming Vericoin SuperNET wallet you can give Freemarket a test run or you can use it right now via nxtfreemarket.com.  I believe the fee is around .15 cents to post something for sale on Freemarket (a decentralized Ebay) but free for the rest of this year.  You can invest the Freemarket coin/asset directly using an NXT wallet.  Read up more below.

http://nxter.org/supernet-newsletter-6/

I could be wrong but I think the web interface was developed by the core team.  That NXT user just made his node publicly available so anyone can connect to it over the internet via the standard web interface (and I believe it's overloaded right now).

So I've torn open bizarre apart, and it's good stuff. Pretty well written. Code is pretty solid, for what it is. Better than you usually find in crypto space, which coming from me says a lot.
What I'm not so confident in is the way it's distributed. I think that when this thing goes live, and they work out the feature set, that there will be targeted attacks against their embedded SQLite databases, probably in the form of rogue stores. You download a rogue store, which may have some tweaks in the way it's built, and bingo bango, you've made open bizarre do something it wasn't intended to. How dangerous something like that might be remains to be seen. Maybe I'll reserve comment for when the rest of the must have features are finished.

Right now, all you really have with it is a promising looking, semi functional mockup with some core account features down. I'm glad they're getting press coverage, but the program is nowhere near ready for prime time just yet. Even going so far as to call it alpha quality code is a stretch.

Also, installing the thing is one of the most brutal software install experiences on Ubuntu that I've had in a very long time.

Thanks for the review. I am waiting for a more polished product.

How anonymous or not is Freemarket vs OpenBazaar?

I think soon a lot of coins will have decentralized market places.. I could name a few that aren't being discussed in this thread. Same with Turing complete scripting. Crypto 2.0s are moving quickly.

FreeMarket is not really free, coz sellers have to pay to post items there. There also fees for each transaction.

I developed the web interface because we all needed a way to view the listings without running the software. It's back up now, my vps just sucks. I need to upgrade it.

Matthew

The advantages of Open Bazaar over FreeMarket:

1) It`s free to list goods on Open Bazaar while FreeMarket charges sellers
2) You can use multiple crypto currencies on Open Bazaar while on FreeMarket you can use only nxt.

I was very disappointed to read that in order to sell something on OpenBazaar, you have to set up a node and keep it running all the time.  If your node goes offline, so do your item listings apparently:

http://forum.openbazaar.org/index.php?p=/discussion/105/need-a-permanent-node-to-set-up-a-store

That seems like a potentially huge privacy/security hole and it's not what I'd considered decentralized.



Which are there besides OpenBazaar and FreeMarket?

The web interface was made by that same user. The core devs didn't make it.

Doesn't the core FreeMarket interface work via a browser pointed to localhost like NRS does?  If so, that's a web interface.

FreeMarket is "free as in speech," not "free as in beer." It is without restrictions, not without cost.

The fees are extremely low though. You're looking at 15 to 20 US cents to post an item and sell it. A buyer will pay about 2 cents. That's no matter how expensive the item is, and variable quantities will be in the next release, so if you sell several of an item, the fees to post per item will be even lower. Post 100 of an item, and you're paying 0.02 cents per item.

Without fees, any marketplace will be full of spam.

The core interface is a web interface, yes, but the interface at fremarketlite.com is different. That one was not made by the core team, that's what I meant.

I have not yet tried either on a phone, but the core one is responsive, so I am hopeful that it will look good on a phone.

If true, that sounds a bit... risky. If you need to run a node in order to sell your items, then you are a target, possibly an identifiable one. This is exactly the structural flaw that SR, SR2, etc have. If you rely on a server, you will be found and taken down/prosecuted. The blockchain solves this particular problem.

Hey folks, Sam Patterson here, I'm the operations lead on the OpenBazaar team. There's been a few misconceptions about OpenBazaar in this thread I'd like to clear up, and I'm happy to answer questions.

On the node issue: Yes, you need to either run a node yourself or connect to someone running a node in order to see the network. Right now, there aren't third party services for you to connect to through the web. However, this will undoubtedly occur at some point, and so users who don't care about decentralization will connect to a "gateway node" to conduct business, and people who don't trust third parties will run their own.

Also, running a node isn't like running a server. It's a small program that you can easily run on your own computer, easier than running a full Bitcoin node. It's very similar to a bittorrent client.

It's been suggested several times that OpenBazaar doesn't have code out yet. That's inaccurate, we're actually on our third beta release now. You can read more (and find the Windows version) here:

https://blog.openbazaar.org/beta-3-0-tabriz-is-released/

We're not claiming this is ready for real trade (though many items have been bought and sold on it) but if you check out our GitHub (on develop branch) you'll see that we have one of the most active projects in the entire Bitcoin ecosystem:

https://github.com/OpenBazaar/OpenBazaar/tree/develop

We're excited about what has been built so far, and the wonderful support we've gotten from the community. We hope that by Spring 2015 we've have a platform that the Bitcoin community will be able to fully embrace as the primary way to conduct business within the Bitcoin economy.

Oh, and to answer the original question of the thread: No, there's no way to invest in OpenBazaar. This is an open source project to unleash free trade on the world, it's not a way to get rich for the devs. No fees like other platforms, no need to be tied to a single altcoin like other platforms.

Thanks Sam for clearing all that up. It sounds like a great project.

Nope.  Openbazaar wants to use arbitrators (which is like 3rd party middleman).

Opensource (from the start/launch) decentralized markets using smart contracts are better,  no middleman.

Are we getting our own Moneroman in Nxt now? :(

What... what was that?

Either a complete lunatic or, as Damelon points out, a 'Moneroman88' FUD technique: anti-Nxt'er pretends to be an insane pro-Nxt'er, thereby pissing off everyone.

And once again, peace and tranquility descends upon BTTland.

Hi Sam, was your comment made in response to the issue I raised?  If so, I think it's worth pointing out that you also need to run a node to connect to FreeMarket but that once you list your items there, it is no longer necessary to run a node since the listings are stored in the NXT blockchain.  I am told that with OpenBazaar your node must remain online to keep your listings online because the listings are stored on the computer running the node instead of in the BTC blockchain.

Yes, I was pointing out why that isn't such a problem.

Blockchains are obviously awesome for many things, but we decided not to use the blockchain for storing information about product listings. Listings (or on our platform, Ricardian contracts) need to be able to change and be signed by multiple parties in a chain of commerce in order to provide an immutable record of trade. This wouldn't be able to be done quickly, at scale, with a blockchain.

If the only objection to running a peer to peer network is anonymity, there are many way to address this. First, you can join a peer to peer network and be anonymous; I2P, Freenet, Bittorrent and others have shown this. But more importantly, if you don't want to run a node for anonymity reasons, you won't have to. Services will exist that let you log into their node and conduct your business.

I looked for the NXT FreeMarket repository to see how they're dealing with problems like spamming the blockchain, reputation, escrow, multisig (does it use that?) price fluctuations, etc. I couldn't find it, is it open source? Can the community see how this product has been made?

I don't mean to dump on their product, I think we want as much competition in this space as possible. But creating a decentralized marketplace that is user friendly is very, very hard. We've had people using OpenBazaar for buying and selling real goods since August, but we still haven't gotten it to the point where we're calling it ready, and probably won't be for several more months.

https://bitbucket.org/blackyblack/freemarket

Thanks for your response.

https://bitbucket.org/blackyblack/freemarket/src

There are no sources...

There doesn't appear to be any code here, where is the code viewable online?

https://bitbucket.org/blackyblack/freemarket/src

Can people open issues, or make a fork, or submit pull requests to the NXT FreeMarket project?

To my dismay, the core source seems to be closed currently with plans to open later.

Copied this answer from the nxtforum freemarket thread (https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=5408.msg132768#msg132768):