Holy cow,you need to also take a lesson in economics, O_O My brain is literally bleeding from your statement, ( not meaning to offend you) ... The fact that bitcoin has to be mined and depends on coin hashing is in itself flawed also a deflationary currency doesn't work as with the case scenario of lost coins etc etc... viable coins will be to limited to host enough trade, also bitcoin is not a currency its an "account/commodity" per definition of its act its more of an m3 account than anything. Also currency values aren't just magically printed to kingdom come. Just like with Germany and Zimbabwe and many other failed currency and governments, they only retain value by what they produce and other countries seek price value exchange in the fair market etc etc (research this topic on your spare time) ... Also Greece's debt has to do more with its reliance on Germany and what happened after ww2 .. (again research this on your time) ... and the money isn't just created out of thin air. It's a retained debt that has to be paid off through some sort of liquidation ex. IMF , Government resources etc etc....
side note: money isn't just created out of thin air ....
I understand how the money system works well enough, but you have to explain why do you think a deflationary currency is a flawed one? Even money needs to be printed, so why is Bitcoin having had to be mined bad? and what has lost coins got to do with anything? And since you brought up Germany and Zimbabwe, you just provided 2 real world cases of why debt-based, inflationary currency will always adjusts its value according. It's a proven that creating more money to cover past debt incurs even more debt, not only not solving the problem at hand but decreasing the already depreciated value of current money even more. Whatever fancy words you use to term it, it's still the same. Quantitative Easing is but a fancy word for "let's print more money and inject it into the economy". Those retained debts you speak about were still created from nothing ever since the money system went off the gold standard. It's even worse, using debt to create new money is mathematically illogical and unsustainable. It should be very, very obvious by now. |
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It's just the beginning of the end of our current money system. Whether they loan Greece even more money to pay back what they're owed (which is absurd) or accept that Greece is never paying back, the result remains the same: more money will be printed, and the more depreciated the value of money will be. It's a neverending cycle until the debt becomes too big that you can no longer create enough money to cover without triggering massive inflation reducing its value to practically zero.
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Just think of it rationally and logically ... Bitcoin uses a base standard currency = USD / EUR / CNY .... now think of it, those currencies alone account for 80% or more of the worlds GDP with established economies and backing of those currencies with the IMF and in net imports and exports to account for their value. How ever Bitcoin is based on backless speculation of a realized "Value" ... How is this value determined?? a ledger? value in property? value in its source code? backed by debt? ... There is only one way to increase "bitcoins value" currently its low volume and an influx of increase of buyer side = short term DELTA of a sellers market instead of a "buyers" market... just think of it as wanting to buy candy and the candy maker was not expecting for an increase in 100% of volume so he has to increase the price to decrease the volume. This is easy to manipulate when there are very small key players in the market. So to the question of delusional... it is up to you to understand the economics and viability of bitcoin. It is only valued as people pump real currency into it and this money is held by your Exchanges... Remember what happened when MT Gox? that is just a reminder.
Edit and addition to my post.
Jeffrey Robinson is quite correct about virtual and digital currency as the future path for currency as its more efficient and is the only measurable answer for the future. Example is Denmark, how ever it is not a "Crypto" system of money its more of a standardized system like using your debit card. This way they can deter fraud and account for various aspects of the system.
Bitcoin is backed by its own protocol, based on mathematics (to be specific, cryptography). You need to solve equations in order to produce new coins, and solving those equations require computation in the form of miners, and miners require power and operational costs to run. The true value of the btc will be based on the costs to mine those coins. Without miners, you won't get bitcoins. And in within the mining world is another free market at play: operation costs, how fast miners can hash, electricity rates etc. All these would give btc its true value. Bitcoin as a protocol is a lot of things, being a currency is just one of its utility. It's fully independent of any control until a time one has more power than the rest combined, be it in the form of hashing power or having a huge bankroll to influence its natural progression. All currencies in the world are currently backed by debt, controlled by the government, with full authority to print as much as needed and as when feel like it. This debt-based money system is illusionary and is not sustainable, as shown by the latest, biggest example of it all: A country, Greece, going bankrupt, and simply just walk away. And they should, it's money created out of thin air anyway. |
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I agree, and I like it that way. It shows Bitcoin is reaching maturity as a currency, and no longer speculative
Doubtful in the extreme. This current state is the result of 18 months of bearish battering. The people who have stuck around are possibly struggling to believe it might actually go up for once. Everyone else has gone off to nurse their broken dreams. Once a rise is properly confirmed the cycle will slowly slot into gear again. There'll be new waves of speculation ready to be tickled up and down by our bearish friends when it goes tits up again. Rinse and repeat until the mid 2020s perhaps or for all eternity. I really don't think so. I see it from the perspective of the mining of coins which ultimately determines its value. It correlates with the difficulty level that it is at now. If you study the graphs it's concave, between end 2013-2014 that's where the spike happens (due to interests, development of better miners, etc) and now it's reached a plateau. That would be the real value of the btc, whether speculated or not, because that's what Bitcoin was created for: a currency that is based on maths, applied onto the real world, where most currencies are controlled by the government. |
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I agree, and I like it that way. It shows Bitcoin is reaching maturity as a currency, and no longer speculative
wut no more wild swings and volatility. No merchants would like to receive payment knowing price might drop the next day, and no buyers would like to spend knowing price might rise the next day. Stability is the hallmark of a workable currency. |
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I agree, and I like it that way. It shows Bitcoin is reaching maturity as a currency, and no longer speculative
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The psychological level of $300 has been breached, it should maintain at that for a while, maybe continue to rise for a few more days but I'm convinced 300's the new 266 now. I wouldn't want the price to skyrocket in such a short time as that would hinder adoption and utility and that's not good. I'd rather have bitcoin stabilize as it has been for the past year. With price stability, and with developments to identify problems and to improve the protocol (as exposed by the stress-test) Bitcoin is becoming more a currency now than a commodity to be hoarded and held. But one never knows, with the whispers of a coming financial crisis sometime 2015-2016 that's even bigger than 2008, Bitcoin might just explode again. Interesting times ahead, but all in Bitcoin's favour no less.
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there are more than 17000 unconfirmed transactions at the moment. I'd say more than 10 hours if this continues mine got stuck since yesterday until now, and that was when number of unconfirmed tx was around 8000-9000, now it's almost 20k, I'd say another 24 hours AT LEAST |
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All these stress and frustrations due to the blocksize being a measly 1Mb, come on, why can't they just increase it?
No, it's just a part of the development of the wallet software ... it's a new area not very tested : the saturation Bitcoin network. Now, developper can correct or add feature to re-calculate more quickly, the fees that the user MUST use to have the 10min confirmation. It's good for me.  http://bitcoinexchangerate.org/feesWell, if these are growing pains, I guess it's all for the better, but if it's all a matter of reprogramming, then I think fees should be fixed and that transactions get confirmed on a first come first served basis, no jumping of priority because of higher fees. If not, there always will be incentives to spam and spam and spam. Plus, there're some cases where transactions with lesser fees get confirmed faster than higher ones, so it's not like higher fees work all the time. |
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All these stress and frustrations due to the blocksize being a measly 1Mb, come on, why can't they just increase it?
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the next big price rise would be the halving of blocks to 12.5btc ...in 2017.
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No worries kid, you could not have caught a better time to buy up. By the time you're in college you would've made so much more gains than if you had that in fiat kept in some bank which probably would've use YOUR money for themselves anyway. Good job.
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Also - how it feels to be fool bagholder?
You were told to sell, you didn't listen.
Now everyone, family, friends, colleagues think you are Tommy the fool for buying magic beans.
Your life is ruined, because you didn't listen to professionals and were ignorant sheep who wanted to get rich quick.
How does it feel to lose your precious money?
How does it feel to be dumb?
One can never have enough of bitcoins. Money isn't that precious really. Money can be created infinitely whenever, but bitcoins are limited and only 25 are made every 10 minutes, as of now. Nobody really own bitcoins to get rich quick, people get bitcoins now because it will be harder and more expensive to get them in the future. Those who think bagholders are fools, we think they're the fools too for not having any bitcoins when you can! That's egoistic, ignorant AND dumb! |
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We have to wait all the 21 million of bitcoin and after we will can determine the real value , at the moment is only a pure speculation.
It seems you are confusing value with price. Ever since the first block was mined the value proposition was created and etched in stone. No , I don't . What is (for you) the real value of bitcoin at the moment ? Value and price are two specifically different definitions but surprisingly easily misused in normal, shallow, general everyday conversations by normal everyday people such as yourself, either out of convenience, laziness, or maybe just pure ignorance. And when you asked what is (for you) the real value of bitcoin, it seems you know the difference between value and price but your first post about waiting to determine the real value, you've confused that with price. |
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this is how you do it. yep, this is how you win in life |
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Equity markets are suffering a 10% correction. I doubt this is the "big correction" many foresee. However, bitcoin is enjoying a nice bounce along with gold which is not a coincidence. It is ironic that someday Main Street will consider investment in bitcoin a "flight to safety."
To call it a 'correction' is putting it mildly. Market's getting unstable and those in power are just trying to prop it back up, but for how long. Observe the rich, they are already pulling money out of fiat and putting into assets. Either a major hyperinflationary depression, or a total collapse of the system, is looming. It's just a matter of time when main street start to realize it's just as practical and more convenient to put money into bitcoin that can hold its value just as good if not better than other assets. |
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Wake up.
What dream are you guys in that say if the dollar collapses people will want bitcoin so bad that is pushes it past a million dollars each??? The only reason why it'll cost a billion dollars each is because paper currency will be worthless & unfortunately by all these places typing BTC to USD, your bitcoins will be worthless & won't buy anything anyway! People would rather use another less manipulated currency, print a completely new currency, use gold or silver, make new coins similar to gold & silver, or many manyyyyyyy other possibilities before saying hey, lets use bitcoin! LOL! WAKE UP!!! If the dollar collapses, people will run to anything that can hold a value against it. And when the people realize bitcoin can actually hold a value just as good as gold or land or antiques, collectibles, paintings anything that can hedge against the falling dollar, why the inconvenience of buying and keeping gold, some hundreds of years old antiques or paintings, why not just use the so much more convenient Bitcoin it's basically the same thing: a hedge against fiat. Actually no, that's what you would want it to mean... but the rich people who run the earth do not value this little pyramid scheme as anything! So you will be stuck trying to convince people to take your useless digital currency anyway, basically the same way you guys are trying now what can I say then haters gonna hate |
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Just think of it this way. You are at least richer than people who has less than 20 btc in their wallet.
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Wake up.
What dream are you guys in that say if the dollar collapses people will want bitcoin so bad that is pushes it past a million dollars each??? The only reason why it'll cost a billion dollars each is because paper currency will be worthless & unfortunately by all these places typing BTC to USD, your bitcoins will be worthless & won't buy anything anyway! People would rather use another less manipulated currency, print a completely new currency, use gold or silver, make new coins similar to gold & silver, or many manyyyyyyy other possibilities before saying hey, lets use bitcoin! LOL! WAKE UP!!! If the dollar collapses, people will run to anything that can hold a value against it. And when the people realize bitcoin can actually hold a value just as good as gold or land or antiques, collectibles, paintings anything that can hedge against the falling dollar, why the inconvenience of buying and keeping gold, some hundreds of years old antiques or paintings, why not just use the so much more convenient Bitcoin it's basically the same thing: a hedge against fiat. |
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hold. by the time btc is one mil probably a loaf of bread cost 10k
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