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I want to link my Bitcointalk name with BTCJam's. Verification code: 638a52fb-d08b-4270-abf4-d8d6a075fd6c
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IMPORTANT: Active GameCoiners Please Listen!
It's been suggested we alter the difficulty adjustment algorith for GameCoin. This would mean the the difficulty would adjust more frequently, allowing the coin to remain stable and active even if the hashrate drops significantly, as the network will respond and drop the difficulty much sooner. our difficulty adjustment would be over 20 times more frequent than it is now.
The downside is that changing the difficulty algorithm causes a hard fork in the blockchain: Those users who upgrade their clients to the new algorithm and those who do not.
So, I need to know what the active GameCoiners all think about this, because our nodes essentially form the core network for GameCoin at this point, and we need to all be in agreement before anything is done.
So guys, what do we do?
With this hard fork thing... does that mean all coins mined right now would become pretty much... dust? No I don't think so. Your old coins from the original blockchain will just be transferred onto the fork, and still be usable. Good good. I dont have many ..actually this is the only coins I have been able to get a lot of ...that is 8 k LOL. I was wondering when dif would go down cuz even now the 1 dif is labor for Nvidia cards of mine Yeah, all blocks before the fork are identical on both sides of the fork. But people who don't upgrade are going to be on the wrong side of the fork, and any coins they mine after that point won't be seen as valid by the rest of the network (except to other users who haven't upgraded) |
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I'm in. Anything that will bring the difficulty down faster is a good thing and it's not like we exactly have that much support on the current chain anyway. I'm finding 2 out of every 3 blocks at the moment with just 1.8 Mhash/s.
@litelord: I'm not so sure lowering the block reward is a good idea as those of us who have been mining it from the beginning will have been getting 1000 per block and those coming to it in future would get much less for their efforts. This will just create a negative vibe against the coin.
I have to agree. And the name is really the only feature of this coin that made it worth salvaging anyways, so that's likely to stay. But if we can get Tyrion on board to compile the new Windows QT then I'll increase the difficulty adjustment frequency and get this coin stable. |
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IMPORTANT: Active GameCoiners Please Listen!
It's been suggested we alter the difficulty adjustment algorith for GameCoin. This would mean the the difficulty would adjust more frequently, allowing the coin to remain stable and active even if the hashrate drops significantly, as the network will respond and drop the difficulty much sooner. our difficulty adjustment would be over 20 times more frequent than it is now.
The downside is that changing the difficulty algorithm causes a hard fork in the blockchain: Those users who upgrade their clients to the new algorithm and those who do not.
So, I need to know what the active GameCoiners all think about this, because our nodes essentially form the core network for GameCoin at this point, and we need to all be in agreement before anything is done.
So guys, what do we do?
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Wallet doesnt sync, 24k gme in line...
New Wallet? made sure you cleared out all the old files exept for your wallet.dat and your config? If you install the new client without getting rid of the bad blockchain, you're still going to have the bad blockchain. |
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Also, sounds like FRC is doing some interesting things, The only issue I have is that to my understanding demurrage is not done by the system, but rather by the proprietors of exchanges etc.is that the case or am I confused?
Depends on point of view. My understanding that demurrage means to deduct a fixed percentage of your balance with each new block on the network. The wallet/client does this automatically as it's directly hooked up to the blockchain. Most exchanges, however, are built in a way that they detect incoming transfers and book them to their internal account that they have set up for you. Since this account then is independent of the account via which you did your payments, they have to implement it themselves. bter.com deducts a fixed amount per day independently of the blockchain, others may choose other methods. So imo it's not a fault of Freicoin, but rather something the implementors of Exchanges have not thought of in the design of their software, they expected balances only to change through payins and payouts, but not "out of thin air". So basically nobody is to blame(you cannot plan for every unthought-of-eventuality), they just need to adopt their design. Ahh, I gotcha. So the node's global balance decreases properly with the blockchain, but the daemon doesn't automatically update the balance on all of the individual accounts? |
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In the next few days we'll have a real-world example with FreiCoin. Mostly stranded at 1-5 blocks/day after it was hyped on bter.com, many miners jumped aboard, then difficulty quadrupled and everybody left ship right thereafter.
Barely usable right now. Having a solo-mined block from 8.5. that's still not reached maturity.
I'm sending my fpga hashing power there right now as there's a planned fork in ~15 blocks where they introduce a new diff adaption algo that should act much faster (144 last blocks taken into account as to my understanding, diff can halve within that many blocks).
Also with the other unique concepts of Freicoin I think it's one of the most interesting coins.
Should keep an eye out for how it turns out for the coin with the new algo.
Also as a side note for traders: At the hard fork there'll be a hard diff adjustment to 1/4 of current diff, so profitability should immediately jump from ~25% to ~100%, offering interesting possibilities for miners that are mining at that time and also for traders...
And for gamecoiners as a research model... :-)
Yeah, difficulty would've exactly quadrupled. I'm pretty sure that's the ceiling on difficulty increases. Also, sounds like FRC is doing some interesting things, The only issue I have is that to my understanding demurrage is not done by the system, but rather by the proprietors of exchanges etc.is that the case or am I confused? |
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I was mining up until last night (maybe 2 blocks an hour). I had to stop as I need to rebuild my mining computer inside a crate to give more air circulation. I'll jump back on it later tonight and stick with it until we hit block 20160 at least.
The standard 2016 blocks difficulty retarget certainly seems to be a coin killer at the moment. With new coins being launched every day miners hop from one coin to the next and a coin can easily end up stranded with a high difficulty and the next retarget too far away for people to continue with it.
It really needs the difficulty to be retargeted a lot faster to avoid this. Maybe once every 100 blocks.
I was thinking so, but as discussed we sort of need to get everyone on board all at once to avoid a nasty hard fork and alienating half of our people. But yeah, if the difficulty retarget was a little quicker, it'd be less prone to abuse (from being too low) and collapse (from being too high and everyone bailing out). We would definitely see some more realistic numbers. We'll also be wanting to add some new checkpoints for the correct side of the fork once the community decides we should go forward. |
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Nice! Is it alright if I post links to this and the QT client download on the GameCoin page over at alt-co.in? Also if anyone has any c++ experience and wants to actually work on the new fork, PM me and we'll talk. |
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Hm ok already thought so that this would be the standard algo with only slight mods. Consistent with the quick'n'dirty approach everything seems to have been done by the adaptor.
When changing the algo it will mean a hard fork, so we should be careful in getting it announced properly.
BTW, I grabbed those 980 fees myself...
Sent another transaction with 1020 fees out. Grab it !
Yeah, i figured any intense changes would, which is why i sort of waited until we could gather some community support/solidarity for the coin. It'll just take some doing to find some time in my schedule for a more complex endeavour like that (This is just a hobby for me, though I do write code for a living as well). |
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Oh it seems to be the only viable option for the moment. I'd just be a little wary of anything that handles my money and doesn't offer me at least an account to connect all those wallets to. Especially when the owner "developer" hasn't changed default dummy content from the template, and has typo'd the subdomain on the page. Those were some of the issues that plagued GME when it was released the first time  Even without a login, it seems reasonable in how it works: You send, the other sends, you get it forwarded. Other one does not send within an hour, you get yours back (probably without fees, doesn't state so explicitly, but I'd assume it to be that way. So I assume in any way that it'd be better for me to initiate any deal by sending the GMEs first since we do not know how many confirmations it takes until they are there. BTW, jayo89, you seem quite fluent with the source code - any idea of what new diff we can expect after diff change? What minute interval does the source aim for? Would you consider yourself able to implement a more dynamic algorithm like with BitBar, or the new one about to go live with Freicoin in ~20 blocks? The difficulty change seems to follow the standard algorithm, so the difficulty is going to drop proportionally so that the average hash power over the last bit would be enough to mine coins at the target rate. I was thinking of using a more fluid algorith that would sort of look at a "graph" of mining activity over the period, rather than an average. ie if mining power is obviously on a sharp decline, make the difficulty lower than only a slight decline, even if the averages in those two scenarios would be the same. This would hopefully make for difficulty adjustments that are more realisitc, preventing both an unsuitable difficulty for the whole network, or a ridiculously low difficulty that is taken advantage of by the opportunistic few. Also, from the source code: 838: static const int64 nTargetTimespan = 3.5 * 24 * 60 * 60; // Gamecoin: 3.5 days
839: static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 2.5 * 60; // Gamecoin: 2.5 minutes
840: static const int64 nInterval = nTargetTimespan / nTargetSpacing; Difficulty shift is aimed for every 3.5 days, assuming a block is found every 2.5 minutes, that gives us a difficulty retarget every 2016 blocks. |
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We've got way too many coins that have been totally abandoned by their "developers" as is, shouldn't we leave this stuff to the people who are actually interested enough in it to take initiative and learn the right way? It's like handing someone a paint-by-numbers kit and telling them you're teaching them to be an artist.
This is exactly how innovation happens - its not clean and tidy, and ordered - that happens when someone writes the timeline history for crypto currency in 20 years time. By creating this easy to do kit, everyone can learn the basics, and we move on to the next problem. The next problem is how do you encourage people to have enough trust in your coin to give it real value? You have already answered a part of that question - by not abandoning it unpatched after a few weeks! Think of this development as the difference between Hollywood and YouTube. Cryptocoins are Youtube, and once in a blue moon, something makes it out of the site, and onto the big screen, or the Hollywood mainstream - but its rare. In the history of the Internet, who remembers every development that lead to the next innovation? Nobody. Its only the big fish that make it, and that is why we should consider this altcoin making kit the best idea to come out of cryptocoins for at least 3 weeks! But they aren't learning the basics. they're learning how to fill in specific blanks without knowing how the engine works. And you need to learn more then the basics to maintain a project like this. An alt-coin isn't something that can be created and it's "done". That's where garbage coins come from. It's not a "big fish" it's diluting the market. A proper "starting pont" to creating a coin is the fully documented source from the few very successful coins out there. If you can't make a proper coin from that, you probably shouldn't at all, because you won't know what to do when shit hits the fan, or the creator gets bored when they aren't rich in 4 days and abandons. Who here could actually do the coding necessary to create a coin???
I have some ideas for a coin that will set it apart from any other coin out there
Who here could actually do the coding necessary to create a coin???
I have some ideas for a coin that will set it apart from any other coin out there
I can program a bit.. willing to give it a try as i also have some ideas for real improvements ^ This is the type of stuff we need. The people with the plan seeking the people with the skills. WAY better for the economy. |
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I want kill my CalinCoin testnet with a 51% attack. To achieve it I have to create a new seperated network which begin mining another blockchain from genesis or from last checkpoint. Give this network more PoW power. Let this network discover the other network. And then Boom?! the other network will be eaten up?  More or less. when more than half the network nodes are reporting the "bad" blockchain as valid, it means that unless intervention is taken, eventually the "bad" blockchian wins over because it's getting more confirmations. If left completely unchecked, eventually the entire network would be overrun with the bad blockchain. |
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Okay am I the only one that thinks it's a terrible idea to make it easy to produce these garbage coins?
A brief tutorial can't teach them how to write the code necessary to impart anything unique or different into the coin, meaning that pretty much all the output resulting from such a guide would be absolute garbage. Do we really need more useless coins with a different name and a different logo, maybe.
Please, if we are going to educate people, can we not try and take a shortcut? maybe teach people what cryptocurrencies are actually about what what makes them tick. Maybe then all these little skiddies would have a little respect for the work that's gone into some of this stuff.
But, if you do make this service, you should make a coin that people use to pay for it called CoinCoin: the coin you use to buy new coins.[/sarcasm]
And this is why I really think writing a document about how its done would be good. You can't teach someone to be a commited, dedicated, or competent software developer with a document (and to create a successful coin, you're going to need at least one of those). The projects are open source and the code is pretty well documented, so anyone with the technical background necessary to create and support/maintain a project like this for the forseeable future already has everything they need to get started. Giving newbies a shortcut doesn't teach them any more than giving someone the answers to a test would. Yeah, you're showing them what to do, but without an actual background in development they aren't going to have any idea why, what to do if their coin comes under hostile attack, etc. We've got way too many coins that have been totally abandoned by their "developers" as is, shouldn't we leave this stuff to the people who are actually interested enough in it to take initiative and learn the right way? It's like handing someone a paint-by-numbers kit and telling them you're teaching them to be an artist. |
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No login available on an exchange/escrow service? Seems like the one feature they would ensure is developed before launching.
Also looks like they've still got the default copyright message on the template that was used.
Haven't actually used it yet but read about it here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=198891.0 and it seems to work. Open for alternate suggestions. Oh it seems to be the only viable option for the moment. I'd just be a little wary of anything that handles my money and doesn't offer me at least an account to connect all those wallets to. Especially when the owner "developer" hasn't changed default dummy content from the template, and has typo'd the subdomain on the page. Those were some of the issues that plagued GME when it was released the first time |
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Hi, I was mining until yesterday to keep it going, and it seemed like others were mining too, so I switched to something where I can be sure to get coins that I can convert easily, as I still need to get my hardware/electricity investments back. Seems like now there is nobody else mining (no new block for ~9h). My suggestion: I'll continue mining with my 3MH (should give an average of two blocks per hour at current difficulty) and you make me an attractive offer in btc or ltc for 200k gme so that I can afford to continue mining. I will switch back to mining gamecoin for the time being until offers pour in. Sounds fair? I suggest the automated escrow service at http://exchange.dudeami.com/ for doing any exchanges. Kind regards Mike No login available on an exchange/escrow service? Seems like the one feature they would ensure is developed before launching. Also looks like they've still got the default copyright message on the template that was used. |
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Yeah I thought also about such a program.
It's very easy to make a alt-coin, when you look FeatherCoin , CNC and all this *****Coins.
They changed 20 lines of code to set another amount of coins and an other IRC channel name.
The other changes were only to replace "litecoin" by their coin name.
20? try six. And they never update their repo with checkpoints as the blockchain grows (mostly because they don't know how), so they get 51%'d after a week. |
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Okay am I the only one that thinks it's a terrible idea to make it easy to produce these garbage coins?
A brief tutorial can't teach them how to write the code necessary to impart anything unique or different into the coin, meaning that pretty much all the output resulting from such a guide would be absolute garbage. Do we really need more useless coins with a different name and a different logo, maybe.
Please, if we are going to educate people, can we not try and take a shortcut? maybe teach people what cryptocurrencies are actually about what what makes them tick. Maybe then all these little skiddies would have a little respect for the work that's gone into some of this stuff.
But, if you do make this service, you should make a coin that people use to pay for it called CoinCoin: the coin you use to buy new coins.[/sarcasm]
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The network hashrate has picked up nicely. Blocks are being solved quicker than they have been the previous few days. Should help us hit checkpoints and retargets a little quicker. Can't wait to see where we can take this coin. First step is more games for GameCoin. Someone should make some carnival style coin games. *will accept royalties from profits made using my ideas I'll also donate some time to help with these projects if anyone wishes. Until then, it's back to throwing GameCoins at the slot machine. http://alt-co.in/slots.phpYeah, as I said before, I'll aslo help people integrate GameCoin into their games if I'm able. I might be changing the GameCoin promo for the slots a little, but it looks like we'll be keeping it, as well as adding ways to get bonus GameCoins into any future games we put up. Hopefully this will spread the coin into further circulation, with more people holding a smaller number of coins. That's how a healthy economy works Someone should also make a GameCoin arcade that accepts 0.25 GME to let you play some classics in-browser. |
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I did the deletes and everything, but even though I get the snyc thing, it still functions perfectly.  Glad to see some progress, and community work bringing gamecoin back to life. Anyone up for making a good gamecoin logo? I was thinking a GC in the center, or something. And a Gamey design or feel to it. Yeah i just cobbled something together quick because what was there was just awful and obviously lazy. |
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