We'll keep bumping this date to remind NEMsters the date.
REDEEM YOUR AE BEFORE NOVEMBER 22, 2014
CHEERS GUYS
bump Timezone please  . You know the most volatility will be in the final hours  . Some of us will hang in for that, so a solid time, 12:00 UTC or whatever would be welcome. |
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I wonder how much longer 32.4 guy is going to wait . Wouldn't that be some unhappy press if he/she slipped in to the abyss with such a big bag, yikes. |
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For the record, I have been doing a lot of toying with NIS on small VMs and I wouldn't do anything less than 512MB for the folks considering Pi, just my 2 cents. On a long enough time line you get plenty of objects in memory in your JVM after chatting with lots of nodes for a while . |
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Guys, get those addresses out of your posts and in to your sigs or you'll make infinite work for our moderator(s) . Put it in your sig, and then say "send me some", at which point us nemesis folks will happily make you rich. |
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PHASE 2 FOR BTT HAS STARTEDWe'll update OPs here and on forum.nemcoin.com soon but i didn't want to let you guys wait. register address and token here -> chain.nem.ninja/stakes chain.nem.ninja/stakes/registered shows all registered with address AND token + all received NEMStake assets from the NXT AE. Everyone please check if your are there after you've registered or sent your assetRemember to read up on how to create a REAL address https://forum.nemcoin.com/index.php?topic=2488.0 and in other threads on that forum. You know... a lot of people here take the time to rake all of you folks that burn your time over the coals, but not enough people stop to say "thanks". Thanks Pat, nice work. You did a good job dealing with a lot of coordination. |
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Anyone know if there are currently posted deadlines for redeeming alt nemo silver/gold tokens at this point? Even ballpark?
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The launch will come soon, so are we going to see a marketing campaign or something special to get more people involved?
I was kind of hoping that 2000 shareholders would swarm the all the forums defending and promoting NEM. Most coins have 10-20 big pumpers/bag holders, sometimes not even that. These 10 people will create sock puppets and spam threads. NEM should have 100 times more supporters than any other coin. I would put us up there on day one with as big as a community of capable people as Litecoin and/or Doge. Only Bitcoin is clearly bigger and packed with a full house of talent, but NEM has a the youngsters advantage of having seen everything that went wrong with all the other crypto's and hopefully avoiding those mistakes. Yes. THe marketing campaign is each one of us going to 10 people and spreading the news. THat is more effective than just having press releases. Viral is the name of the game. But how can you get 10 people to care? I have given a lot of thought to this, and I don't think it is an intellectual appeal in most cases (unfortunate I know). You'll tickle the occasional person smart enough to realize the potentiality, but in most cases getting people to care will be through utility. And I don't mean anything as complex or difficult as replacing their bank (that is the end game, yes), I mean when they use nem for their in app farmville purchases or some such nonsense. It's all about our API and getting folks with viral/social/utility type apps to plug in as a matter of convenience as opposed to writing their own auction houses or marketplaces (think Diablo's auction house or something). I guess I'm thinking along the lines of redd coin or some other social currency. Okay, sorry to be a broken record. |
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Great job! Some Test-NEM would be nice: T........
Is it possible to change the default directory (C:\Users\*Name*\nem). Need my data in another directory!
That is only possible if you run the standalone version. I use the nis-ncc-0.4.9.tgz version. What do I have to change to use another directory? Go to config.properties for either ncc, nis, or both and change nem.folder for example, mine goes to a mapped cifs share to my nas, and looks like: nem.folder = L:\\Library\\Crypto\\NEM\\Wallet\\Data\\nem |
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Browsing the logs I see the following nodes being misconfigured: Node [mak <TBMAKOTAFIG5P4EYBO7XLPNNSKRUCYQOZPDW27UA>] Node [kullikalli <TBEG3WNGZB6ANYUAHYO2I35NRHU6HFJALQOI3CPS>] Node [nemz <TD3C6N3XKDE7W6VW3DQRHDS4YU2AGXJEGNOUPLD5>] Node [jk <TCDVUDYVCH54PNTEIWYTW5EVZQXSNORQJMODQTNN>] Node [Kuching <TAKGDHZOL4RQBZQ2R3WG6H3YDPOUISYCFVORMPFY>] Node [mainroot <TC3UULI2J4H32CUWJVQJVAGEKGTWQVEA6QCUMNNX>] Node [nemx <TAWXD42MUQHHOTSJSCAMPPN3ZNYWF64KTO47KKUC>] Node [PCPLACE <TCALBXNYAGOE4F3PE7BW3VMWCXAU3HT4B7FRYLZL>] Node [Is Ours <TD23GARPTRFJKVPWTZH62P3ATW4SXYBBS7VTFNVX>] Node [bluedude <TBATUIJTSE4JJGRKS4FVIUR3DJTOFYEAQV3W5VLK>] Node [ZORGnode <TD7KTCEUSQN263FVI3CRAJ226CT4ZUDMUPZ2CX65>] Node [cocks <TBEWHENQAAUANTGLCYUTBW4JKK4CVT2QVVVLKNTC>] Node [XeqtorNode <TASTZEHFO2RXHVUKH4UFRIAE6QN5MQF3WK5LPBGQ>] Node [fRames6 <TAWSO536FOTFSGJ7VGEDRPBIMC67TCXVFWDBWNEW>] Node [xtester <TALLLEKJTFSFO2WBM65JQEKDULCPXEBQJGIVEEGW>] Node [jorma <TBKMLIMWKHR6OOUC2T5XSQ62A2XSDERU3MPMWA5C>] You can check if your node is correctly configured (i.e. port 7890 gets forwarded to your computer) by using patmast3r's "check nis tool": http://chain.nem.ninja/checknisor if you want to check a specific ip address http://chain.nem.ninja/checknis/?ip=123.456.789.012Only nodes that are correctly configured are real supporters of the network. Also, correctly configured nodes can receive a private key for a 50M NEM beta nemesis account. do i allow "port forwarding" and then enter the port number and an ip? address or do i "white list" the port number in "port filtering" or is it something else? cant find what to do with the port number after im told my node isnt set up What you'll want to do is first set the 24/7 box on your network to a static IP by either hard keying it on the box, or telling the router to reserve a static for that computer and let the computer use dhcp. Then you'll want to use "port forwarding", and tell 7890 to go to the IP you reserved, say 192.168.1.100. LAstly, you'll want to make sure the firewall on your box has 7890 open. If you don't force a static reserved for the 24/7 box it might move around inside your network and the port foward will hit the wrong box, or no box. |
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By the way I had no trouble copy pasting the real account creation stuff in chrome.
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hello can anyone send me some Nemtest  thanks To da test net moon! Enjoy |
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hook me up brotha. address in sig . Thnks man
Enjoy. To da test net moon! |
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Sound off if you haven't got any test net beta nem yet and I'll throw some your way.
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These two polls are more polling-sampling than an actual vote. If we wanted an official vote then it would had been like the logo vote, sending a private message and it being recorded on a public list. Probably a single transferable vote like the Australian and Irish elections, due to the amount of options there can be.
I think it's too late to attempt something like this, given Beta is days off. As well the poll only indicates marginal majority support for 8 billion.
I don't know if this has to be put to an official vote. It seems like a lot of work for what could be a trivial detail. So if it means we can avoid a long troublesome vote then I withdraw my support for 8 billion or any drastic scaling.
The best solution here is probably what we discussed prior to this superstition stuff and one that can't be rounded up to 4 billion.
We do know there is going to be 700-800 unclaimed stakes at this rate. If we are concerned about people rounding up then the solution is simple: 3.8 billion coins. Nobody rounds 3.8 up to 4. They will round up 3.9 or 3.99, but not 3.8.
3.8. also makes the superstitious people happy as 3 is an important number in both the west (Holy Trinity) and Asia (in Asia it means alive or birth, hence birth of a new economy) and 8 is a very important number in China. so the 3 + 8 together could mean "the beginning of prosperity".
So it seems simple that you could burn 200 stakes, which would make every NEMholder wealthier through deflation, and the remaining unclaimed stakes (as per the newsletter) can be put in that investment fund if that is what ends up happening.
That sounds like a pretty reasonable compromise to me. No fundamental changes to the code base, but the numbers change . Still need to update the docs less anyone scour and fixate on that anywhere in our literature, heh. |
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Hold the horses, as I suggested earlier, do we actually have a sponsor from the dev team willing to agree this is feasible with the time remaining? Granted I see it as a constant change and a regression test with JUnit, but that is my uninformed assessment. Secondly, I know TaunSew and others maintain some of the documentation. We okay signing them up for something on short notice like this? I think we'd want a few of them to say "yeah sure we'll do it". I don't know if I have seen that yet either. Lastly, can we just formalize the position with the regulators on the NEM team that the mechanics stay the same just scaled in proportion? A formal statement on that would be good to avoid a suckerpunch to the the AE prices. If it is changed before it hits an exchange there shouldn't be too much backlash as everyone will still get what they paid for in proportion. I think that statement would need to encompass alt nemo too right? Like cold wallet is 2000 instead of 1000? Not sure what else would be affected. Given markets are never 100% efficient or subject to emotional influence, is there any chance we actually induce market cap reduction? I think the fact that the NXT AE assets are fixed and not doubling it should spare any sort of shock sell off. I suppose some of that could be tolerated with the understanding it increase long term success, still... but this one would most easily be resolved by the vote of people deciding if they are willing to risk what they put in. I don't see why this would happen, but anything is possible. |
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Oh I certainly am not intending to offend anyone. What I'm saying is all things being equal (which appears to be the consensus from North American's and Europeans here?), 8 is as arbitrary as 4, but apparently is less upsetting to the largest number of people. It also seems like Asia just generally adapts quicker to new technology culturally than European and North American markets. I had Japanese friends laugh at our cell phones (this was the pre iPhone days) in the states and tell us they'd had features like that for years. "Every kid in Japan is already banking by phone" or whatever it was that now escapes me. I believe I read North America has the least inertia with broadband too despite being a major initial developer. I Believe I also read that North America severely lags behind Europe and Asia in math and science. I'm always reading about some viral technology thing going on in Asia that I have never even heard of. Some mobile app, cyborg conversions, biometric implants, whatever. On the other hand I see things like Facebook and Twitter as an American invention (for better or for worse). Maybe American's want to play bejeweled, post pictures of their food or check in to the gym but not take control of their personal finances or use cool prosthetics.
Granted this is somewhat baseless and purely on observation from the news, but it just seems like Asian markets adapt quicker to new ways of doing things, and therefore they seem the natural catalyst to break a cryptocurrency out of its infancy so long as it doesn't get under the noses of regulators too quickly. I remember all the trollbox FUD about "China banning exchanges!" and the purported associated crash of BTC to sub 1000, then 900, then 800 and so on levels earlier this year. There are assertions floating about in the interwebs that much of the value of BTC was Chinese nationals using it to bypass the strict limitations on moving currency in and out of the country. I would just easily believe it was Wall Street investors, drug dealers, and libertarians too, who knows. I would have to guess laundering money, whether criminal or benign in intent is a natural companion to the utility provided by Bitcoin.
If I have offended you with these statements my apologies in advance. For the record, I am in one of those "Slow" North American markets with crappy broadband before you accuse me of elitism.
Unfortunately, your view of Japan as a "fast-adapting hub of technology" is a very antiquated view of Japan. Japan has been lagging behind in the technology sector for years now, and I would say Japan is anything but "quick to adapt" when it comes to trying new things. Yes, we have NFC payments on our phones already, and we have a few things here and there that might seem "cutting edge", but in reality barely anyone here even knows how to use a PC at the most basic level unless they are trained on the job for it. I mean, I still have to FAX or snail mail most of my documents for business here as 99% of my clients refuse to accept digitally signed PDF files via e-mail. Japan is, on the whole, scarily xenophobic and simply does not want to use any non-Japanese technology. It took years for Japanese people to warm up to non-Japanese cell phones (like the iPhone, which was a huge flop when it first hit the market here), Facebook (which only in the past couple of years has started to become more common than the Japanese-created SNS mixi), or even YouTube (which still I do not think is as popular as the Japanese-created video site niconico douga). Anyway, I don't mean this to be a Japan-bashing post or anything like that... I just want to give you some perspective and remind you that America is still the leader of the world when it comes to technological innovation and adoption. Just because you have slow broadband does not mean you guys are losing the technology arms race. I know "the grass is always greener on the other side" and it is easy to fall into a sense of despair when you only cherry-pick the good things from every other country and only focus on the bad within your own, but reality usually tells a different story. As I don't live there I will take your word first and foremost on that one. I may also be unfairly interchanging South Korea and Japan in my head on some of the articles I have read. I can't speak to China's adoption of technology, but I expect in this case it wouldn't escape the regulators eyes and the firewall. Not to beat a dead horse, but given most of the world is going mobile and forgoing the traditional PC, having a highly usable mobile app could still tip the scale in blockchain technologies favor even for the most inept user. So in that regard, any country could be the tipping point I suppose with mobile usage surging the way it has been. In fact, it could be the regions we least expect, with the least established infrastructure as the mobile phone gives them a way to secure their assets without the risk of corrupt institutions and civil unrest. It is perhaps these places that have the most potential because of the lack of established financial process (there is nothing to unlearn, only rewards to be had) and not industrialized nations. Regardless, it sounds like making any assumptions about the viability of one region over another in terms of adoption is a bad idea. Furthermore, it sounds like it may be time to let the currency in circulation topic slide so as not to disrupt the faithful that have put up their hard earned bits to support the price in favor of hypothetical people that have staked nothing. |
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I think this option could result in a lot of dissent from existing stakeholders. Or maybe people will like it? I think it's possible that a larger market cap could boost NEM capitalization significantly. For one, there's probably people who are pricing NEM in just NXT and therefore the prices could hold to an extent if you boosted the total supply. Your NEMstake would scale in this option and you would benefit from this market capitalization increase. Then there is the psychological. Look at the Doge effect - 90+ billion coins and it brought in many people who were able to afford millions. Masses of people spending $10-$100 to become a is always going to be better than a dozen guys pumping in tens of thousands. Doge I think did ok. It wasn't the total supply itself in Doge that was controversial - it was the hyper inflation from PoW mining and then the instamine whales who got in early dumping on the new comers (which is arguably no different than NXT and a factor why people ceased coming to NXT. Why buy something that never goes up because as soon as it rebounds some whale dumps?). Not a lot not to like really. Worst case the supply equalizes the demand and we aren't really worse for the wear right? The important thing here is that it isn't like someone paid 50k nxt on Poloniex to get 1,000,000 and then gets screwed when it suddenly halves in value (worst case) as the supply is doubled. That would kind of piss me off. Anyone that has paid or will pay for a piece of the pie will be sorted in proportion. I guess I personally don't understand the mechanics of inflationary coins that well and the psychology it induces on the market in terms of value to make a good judgement other than a highly ignorant statement like "doubling the supply should halve the value per unit" in a perfectly efficient market. |
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I am leaning towards agreeing with everyone that this discussion should probably just be left alone. It seems like there are quite a few who do think we should change the total amount of coins, but I think that decision will ultimately undermine investor confidence, at least in the short-term. Long term, it really could go either way, but I think that the effects would be so minimal that risking short-term investor confidence is too much of a risk for a very minimal long-term gain (if any).
After thinking about it carefully for a significant amount of time since this discussion came about, I have come to the conclusion that the risk to reward ratio for this decision is simply not good enough for me to be able to support any changes.
Have you heard about the changes in companies' shares in stock markets? They usually come suddenly and then you have been given a letter, a notification that each share is splitted into 8 (for example). In such case the value of the owner's shares is the same, but the amount of shares has increased, not doubled but 8 times. I think that the investors do understand this kind of changes. No one has eaten his words crypto markets are rarely, if ever logical and most of the counterintuitive. Even though the change would have no effect on the value of stakes, can you really trust such an illogical and irrational market to make the logical and rational choice to ignore such a change? There just doesn't seem to be enough gained from such a change to warrant making it. Like Amy said the risk:return ratio just isn't good enough for us to go ahead with this.. Why risk having a number that Asians consider unlucky or deadly? They are quite superstitious ,at least in my experience . If something negative were to happen however small they might be more likely to stay away. Isnt it a good thing that we are taking Asian beliefs , superstition and psychology into account ? Its respectful. Now as long as we have plenty coins to cover a fantastic future does it really matter how many there are? I will say again that Nemstakes are not a true representation of value as at the moment they fall under certain parameters and that price is not something to worry about. If anything the change to coin amount would bring increased news coverage and interest. The superstition is real, which is why I had to really think about this for a while. And of course it is good to take the concerns of other cultures into account, especially when we are dealing with something intended for use by everyone around the globe. However, the more I thought about it the more I realized that this is really not even a discussion worth having. Mainly because even though the supply will be 4 billion, this is only in the beginning. The total supply will not be 4 billion for very long, considering it is inevitable that some NEM will be burned for one thing or another. Therefore, to change the original plan simply so we can have something other than 4 billion in the beginning seems like a drastic measure simply to accommodate a superstition that likely will not make much of a difference in any real world scenario. Again, I live in Asia so I am very familiar with the superstition; but, the more I think about it, the more I think nobody is really going to care and the risk of making any changes to the original plan at this point after nearly a year of nobody caring is just too high, in my opinion. Also, I know to those of you who are not very familiar with this uniquely Asian superstition this sounds even more silly, but please understand that sometimes things that may seem strange or insignificant to one culture could be vastly important in another. So, I am glad that we are having this discussion but in the end I think we will probably be just fine with 4 billion. +1 For people who don't want to change Euro http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/currency/EUR.htmlUSD http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/currency/USD.htmlCNY http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/currency/CNY.htmlAll : http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/I think european should not give their opinion  Well the way you put that could offend the Europeans on here. I hope that wasn't your intent. However, it's true that digital currencies are becoming popular faster in East Asia than they are in North America and Europe. This isn't a guaranteed thing, I mean PayPal is used by many people in the United States and that userbase is much larger than Bitcoin. However you also have to remember that digital currencies seems to be attracting the remittance market and $capital bypass market which *drum roll* is predominately East Asian and South East Asian. Other then sending money over there as remittance, nobody in the US is actually interested in acquiring Asian currencies but things like Bitcoin allow people to acquire $USD equivalents. Oh I certainly am not intending to offend anyone. What I'm saying is all things being equal (which appears to be the consensus from North American's and Europeans here?), 8 is as arbitrary as 4, but apparently is less upsetting to the largest number of people. It also seems like Asia just generally adapts quicker to new technology culturally than European and North American markets. I had Japanese friends laugh at our cell phones (this was the pre iPhone days) in the states and tell us they'd had features like that for years. "Every kid in Japan is already banking by phone" or whatever it was that now escapes me. I believe I read North America has the least inertia with broadband too despite being a major initial developer. I Believe I also read that North America severely lags behind Europe and Asia in math and science. I'm always reading about some viral technology thing going on in Asia that I have never even heard of. Some mobile app, cyborg conversions, biometric implants, whatever. On the other hand I see things like Facebook and Twitter as an American invention (for better or for worse). Maybe American's want to play bejeweled, post pictures of their food or check in to the gym but not take control of their personal finances or use cool prosthetics. Granted this is somewhat baseless and purely on observation from the news, but it just seems like Asian markets adapt quicker to new ways of doing things, and therefore they seem the natural catalyst to break a cryptocurrency out of its infancy so long as it doesn't get under the noses of regulators too quickly. I remember all the trollbox FUD about "China banning exchanges!" and the purported associated crash of BTC to sub 1000, then 900, then 800 and so on levels earlier this year. There are assertions floating about in the interwebs that much of the value of BTC was Chinese nationals using it to bypass the strict limitations on moving currency in and out of the country. I would just easily believe it was Wall Street investors, drug dealers, and libertarians too, who knows. I would have to guess laundering money, whether criminal or benign in intent is a natural companion to the utility provided by Bitcoin. If I have offended you with these statements my apologies in advance. For the record, I am in one of those "Slow" North American markets with crappy broadband before you accuse me of elitism. |
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You are assuming this is somehow an Asian thing. Here's an experiment: make a coin and give it a total supply of 666,666,666 and see how many people are interested in buying it. Maybe you could get some decent capitalization in the fringe world of alternate trading but you would probably just be attracting "l33t" people who think demonic numbers are cool.
The PS4 argument isn't a particularly good one anyway. Samsung Galaxy 4 (Korean company) doesn't even market a Samsung Galaxy 4 under its' western name in Asia but labels it: "SHV-E300K/S/L" (300 as opposed to 400").
Didn't we have a post a few pages back from a bank note collector stating there was very clear evidence to support this position and it clearly defied logic (as most markets do)? I can tell you my landlord rented my flat to me for superstitious reasons despite the fact that I didn't offer the most money (aspects of my financial history met their lucky number formulas that are well beyond my understanding; they are Chinese). That isn't anecdotal, but very real exposure first hand and I am just one person with no cultural context for that. I also directly experienced this with one of my suppliers in China surrounding an order for 4 thousand units of something  . No joke. I'm not Asian, and I don't live in Asia, but I was told by a few friends of mine who meet both of those criteria that the general observation is that no one admits it, but everyone privately observes it. Of course that is a generalization, but when I asked many people on their opinion on this exact subject there was never surprise, or even the need to have to explain further, just a quiet nod of the head with a smile. |
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Forgive me for posting twice on the matter in rapid succession, but I want to propose a highly practical solution to our amount of minted coin problem after walking away and indulging in a spirit.
At this stage in the game given our time left until genesis
1) Do the devs feel this change is trivial? I presume it goes something like change a constant definition and re-run unit tests. Would need a senior dev to give the nod.
2) Do the community maintainers of our collective documentation feel they would have time and are willing to put forth the effort to update all the documentation and material we have in the wild with mentions of amount of coin in circulation? I have already seen a lot of dated stuff in some of that with the auction still mentioned and things of that nature.
If the answer to either of those is no, it is a moot point.
If the answer to both is yes, then I put forth the fact that 8 is no more arbitrary than 4. If you want to pull such a stunt now would be the time. If someone is aware of the presumably esoteric reason we chose 4, then forgive my ignorance and enlighten us with the error of our way in suggesting this change. If not, then 4 has nothing to stand on anymore than 8. I think we can afford a few bruises over the last minute changes if the supporting literature reflects the new information with a perhaps very delicate annotation about why the change, if it is even worth drawing attention to (might do more harm than good). It wouldn't in any way alter any of the existing mechanics around the claiming of stakes other than to say everything would be x2 in conversation and policy. One change to coin market cap (it is only an asset there anyway right?).
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