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101  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Double-spend prevention clarification on: August 01, 2012, 04:08:39 AM
The attacker doing 1-tx blocks would simply not build off of "lucky" blocks which included transactions.

1 Attack-block
2 Attack-block which builds off of 1
3 lucky-guy publishes one here which builds off of 2
4 attack block building off of 2
5 attack-block building off of 4
block 3 is now orphaned


What would happen if two lucky blocks in a row were found by honest nodes in less than the 10 minute average?  At that point, wouldn't the honest network be working on a new block 5 while the attacker is still trying to build a block 4 to attach to his alternate block 3?  Wouldn't then the chain split favor the honest network and put mr 51% on his ass for a round, forcing him to reset and restart his attack with honest block 5?
102  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: August 01, 2012, 04:02:15 AM
I'd bet that I'm the only person in this thread that has ever openly carried a loaded firearm onto a commercial aircraft. 
Care to pop a squat and tell us about it?

It was about 1997 or so.  I was finishing up my contract in the USMC in the active reserves.  I was out of a communications company stationed in Cincinnati, Ohio.  When summertime came and we were scheduled to head to Camp Penalton, California for our "two weeks" (more like three, usually) C130 transports were not available for some strange reason.  So a 737, I believe owned by Delta IIRC, was chartered for our trip out to Cali.  We arrived in full gear as if we were leaving for war, which is how we went anywhere, at the Cincinnati International Airport around 3am.  We walked single file straight off the trucks & busses, right through the metal detectors (while the agent stood by and watched as his panel kept beeping, loudly) without a single one of us saying a word.  There was only one or two families in that wing of the airport at that time of night, and I recall walking past a family sitting on a bench watching us as a little girl about seven was wide eyed and mouth open staring.  They must have thought we really were headed to war.

We were entirely seated in the aircraft when the Captain (of the aircraft) started pitching a fit and ordered us all off the aircraft.  "Get off my plane and unload those rifles!"  So we calmly filed back off, unloaded our magazines from our M16A2's and walked back onto the aircraft with our bolts pulled back so that the Captain himself could see down into our chambers and know that there were no rounds loaded.  When we all got on and seated, we were ordered (in no uncertain terms) by the Captain (over the plane's intercom) to hang our rifles muzzle down on the back of the seat in front of us, and no magazines shall leave our packs much less come anywhere near a rifle.

So, for a few minutes, I was calmly seated onto a commercial aircraft with a loaded "assault rifle", although I was properly in Condition 3.  Can't speak for any of the other rockheads I was on that aircraft with, however.

I have no doubt that the Captain of that aircraft was former military, either.
103  Other / Politics & Society / Just found on Strike The Root on: August 01, 2012, 02:42:24 AM
http://www.strike-the-root.com/dual-currency-community
104  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Double-spend prevention clarification on: August 01, 2012, 02:29:32 AM
The first two are prevented by not delivering product until 1 confirmation.  The risk of re-org attack is significantly reduced by waiting for higher number of confirmations.    Satoshi provides analysis and simulations on this type of attack.  The "wait for 6 confirmations" is a rule of thumb based on the low probability that anyone with less than 51% of hashing power could re-org more than 6 blocks.

The way I understood it, an attacker with only a simple majority could only prevent transactions from being included in new blocks by creating the blocks himself without transactions, but even that wouldn't be certain as every once in a while an honest miner is still going to get a lucky block in faster than a 1% advantage can deal with.  Also, that 1% advantage might (theorically) permit the attacker to reverse one previous block, if he's lucky, but blocks beyond that one require orders of magnitude more hashing power than all of the honest nodes combined.  The 6 was chosen specificly because it would take a rediculous multiple of the hashing power of the whole of the honest network.

An attacker with only 51% of the total hashing power could double-spend (or simply reverse) just confirmed transactions that he, himself, just spent; but still wouldn't be able to reverse the transactions of other peoples' bitcoins, only delay them from confirmations for as long as he could maintain the attack.  But even with 51% of the hashing power, 6 confirmations is safe.
105  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Double-spend prevention clarification on: August 01, 2012, 01:24:16 AM


Without a blockchain fork, there are a couple other double spend attacks as well:

Not all double spends attempts are intentional even.  Take the scenario where someone who imports their private key from a wallet.dat into Blockchain.info, for example, and then spends the one in blockchain.info.  Then the bitcoin-qt is launched but it hasn't caught up on the blockchain and a payment is sent, which happens to spend the coin that was transferred to blockchain.info.  That would be a double spend.  That can happen seconds apart or months apart.


Thats very interesting. What does BTC do when this situation arises? Would the second tx not be allowed? .. even tho the double spend wallet hasnt caught up w/ its blockchain yet? The peers, I hope, having an updated chain when it announced the tx to the network will reject it .. because they have an updated block chain.

The second would be considered invalid, and simply ignored by most peers & miners.  It wouldn't even propagate past a full client.
106  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: August 01, 2012, 01:22:41 AM
I'd bet that I'm the only person in this thread that has ever openly carried a loaded firearm onto a commercial aircraft. 
107  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 31, 2012, 09:42:31 PM
The herd has spoken! One moos, and two more moo as well.
Moo moo to you too!

(I only rhyme some of the time)

http://www.cowswithguns.com/cgi-bin/listen_animation.cgi?cart=1343770925
108  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 31, 2012, 07:34:35 PM
I said that data was statisticly insignificant, not that it didn't count.  Keep putting words in my mouth, First Accent, and our congenial conversations are going to turn dark quick.

To me, a death or injury is statistically significant.

Your opinion isn't statistically significant, either.
109  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 31, 2012, 07:12:18 PM
And no, more data does not equal to less bias.  Wikipedia is limiting itself to 'rampages' or 'mass killings' wherein one nutter goes off and starts shooting multiple people with whom s/he has no prior contact.  The Brady Campaign includes a great deal of events that involved crimes of passion, career criminals with guns, organized crime, inter-famililar violence (such as spouse abuse), etc.  In other words, they include a great deal of data on events that had causes/triggers having little or nothing to do with whether or not guns were used as the means to the end.  Nor do they bother to gather the same data on such events that did not include a firearm.  Again, the weapon is just a tool with a deliberate purpose.  The most successful career muggers are almost invariablely those who use weapons other than a firearm within juristictions that make it difficult for an average citizen to carry a firearm.  Usually knives.  Ironically, we even have the effects of such events in US law, as it's illegal to import, manufacture or sell a knife that is intended to be opened with a single action; thus switchblades & 'butterfly' knives are banned in the US.  I'm still waiting for the one armed war vet to sue for discrimination.  They didn't blame the criminal element for using the best tools (in this case, switchblades & butterfly knives) available to them for their crimes, they again blamed the manufacturers of such tools for making their products too easy to use.

From the above quote, it seems clear to me that your focus with regard to data is mass shootings, essentially deeming crimes of passion, career criminals with guns, family violence, and, I would add firearm accidents, as being irrelevant to the argument regarding gun control.


No.  You've read me all wrong here.  I was just pointing out that those data sets aren't reallly directly comparable.
Quote

And yet, you write this as well:

I think that whether or not a armed population limits rampages or not is statistically insignificant overall, even though I'll admit up front that my own life's experiences bias myself toward believeing that mykerl is correct.  I don't think that the practical argument is what really matters, as the results in either direction are not significant enough to overcome the predispositions on either side; as both yourself and myself are evidence of.

Here, you state that mass shootings are statistically insignificant.

You seem to be contradicting yourself as to what is relevant with regard to gun injuries. Myrkul wishes to be selective. You wish to be entirely indifferent, or contradictory at best.


Again, no.  I wasn't arguing for or against mass shootings as representative of gun issues.

Quote

Tell me now, would you be so indifferent or contradictory if you were one of the injured on Brady's list, or a friend or family member of one of the casualties on Brady's list? Certainly you wouldn't mind trading places with one of the affected in the theater shooting, given that you think such shootings are insignificant. Or perhaps you might wish to trade places with any of the affected on Brady's list that aren't designated a mass shooting, as you've said that that kind of data doesn't really count. 

I said that data was statisticly insignificant, not that it didn't count.  Keep putting words in my mouth, First Accent, and our congenial conversations are going to turn dark quick.
110  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Interesting conversation with a retailer who formerly accepted Bitcoin on: July 30, 2012, 11:01:43 PM
4) there will be instructions to send the dollar amount in bitcoins (the customer will have to do their own conversion)

Why?  Is there some reason that the script couldn't check the MtGox spot price when called and do the math right then?
111  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 30, 2012, 10:55:28 PM
Quote

Now that's a bias fail.  The Brady Campaign isn't exactly a neutral data source, and one known for huge cherry picking of data sets in their own right.  

It's more data. Certainly 62 pages of data for seven or so years trumps myrkul's one page of data for forty some years. You think?


And no, more data does not equal to less bias.  Wikipedia is limiting itself to 'rampages' or 'mass killings' wherein one nutter goes off and starts shooting multiple people with whom s/he has no prior contact.  The Brady Campaign includes a great deal of events that involved crimes of passion, career criminals with guns, organized crime, inter-famililar violence (such as spouse abuse), etc.  In other words, they include a great deal of data on events that had causes/triggers having little or nothing to do with whether or not guns were used as the means to the end.  Nor do they bother to gather the same data on such events that did not include a firearm.  Again, the weapon is just a tool with a deliberate purpose.  The most successful career muggers are almost invariablely those who use weapons other than a firearm within juristictions that make it difficult for an average citizen to carry a firearm.  Usually knives.  Ironically, we even have the effects of such events in US law, as it's illegal to import, manufacture or sell a knife that is intended to be opened with a single action; thus switchblades & 'butterfly' knives are banned in the US.  I'm still waiting for the one armed war vet to sue for discrimination.  They didn't blame the criminal element for using the best tools (in this case, switchblades & butterfly knives) available to them for their crimes, they again blamed the manufacturers of such tools for making their products too easy to use.
112  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 30, 2012, 10:41:33 PM
Myrkul,

Here are some shootings for you: www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/pdf/major-shootings.pdf

Why don't you get to tallying, graphing, calculating, and hypothesizing?

Now that's a bias fail.  The Brady Campaign isn't exactly a neutral data source, and one known for huge cherry picking of data sets in their own right. 

It's more data. Certainly 62 pages of data for seven or so years trumps myrkul's one page of data for forty some years. You think?

Merge the data, if you so please.

Not me, I've no interest in trying to prove any such thing.  I think that whether or not a armed population limits rampages or not is statistically insignificant overall, even though I'll admit up front that my own life's experiences bias myself toward believeing that mykerl is correct.  I don't think that the practical argument is what really matters, as the results in either direction are not significant enough to overcome the predispositions on either side; as both yourself and myself are evidence of.

My argument is more basic.  Self defense is a basic human right, and if I, as an average citizen, are denied access to the most effective forms of defense that I can afford by any reason whatever, then my basic human right has been infringed.  Sure, I'm still responsible for what I do with those tools, but they are just tools.  If I never need to use it, then it's still worked for me; but if I should be so unlucky as to have to use a weapon in my own defense, I'm okay with being required to justify my actions to an impartial jury.  But not one that is predisposed to beleive that the mere act of ownership of a tool is criminal, regardless of it's design characteristics.
113  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 30, 2012, 09:18:43 PM
That Silver Circle movie seems like something I might be willing to contribute towards, but they don't take Bitcoins it seems.  Which is kind of strange, since they are obviously fine with taking US $.
114  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 30, 2012, 09:06:47 PM
Myrkul,

Here are some shootings for you: www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/pdf/major-shootings.pdf

Why don't you get to tallying, graphing, calculating, and hypothesizing?

Now that's a bias fail.  The Brady Campaign isn't exactly a neutral data source, and one known for huge cherry picking of data sets in their own right. 
115  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Guns on: July 30, 2012, 09:04:54 PM
Myrkul,

Here are some shootings for you: www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/pdf/major-shootings.pdf

Why don't you get to tallying, graphing, calculating, and hypothesizing?

Or, you could just be honest and admit that you already know all the numbers in the world won't convince you.

Whatever it is you said, it doesn't apply to me.

For example:

Quote
In my experience, the side that can't address their points with serious intellectual honesty is usually the wrong one. You don't need cheap tactics and underhanded behavior when logic and facts are in your favor.

Hence the reason that myrkul needs to be intellectually honest, instead of selective in his data choices.

Perhaps he is biased in his data choices, and simply is not aware of it.  That's not intellectually dishonest, just normal bias.  We all have bias, expecially journalists.  So rather than argue that his data is cherry picked (which it certainly is, but not necessarily with an intent towards biasing the data set) why don't you run down that list of rampages that he provided for you (from Wikipedia, not exactly a source known to pick sides) and do the average for the entire thing and let's see what the whole data set says.
116  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Interesting conversation with a retailer who formerly accepted Bitcoin on: July 30, 2012, 08:56:37 PM
Of course, in reality, the chance of an increase in value pretty much balances out the risk of a decrease in value. If you want essentially zero risk, Tony provides that service, and it's still cheaper than credit cards.

Yes, but HOW... I would either need to shift my whole cart to a new platform, or do everything by hand (and still pay the exchange fees). Both increase costs. taking bit-pay as an example I only save .59% over pay-pal (16 cents on the average transaction.)

Perhaps, but you do save.  If the bitcoin trade volume never amount to much, you've lost nothing for trying it; however, if the trade volume justifies a lower cost method, you'll be motivated to make it happen at that point even if no one already has. 

Still, I'd wager that, now that the developers know that there needs to be a plug-in for 3Dcart, it won't be long before you have what you need.
117  Economy / Goods / Re: Announcing my first product, Clothes Detergent on: July 30, 2012, 01:14:38 AM
I'd be willing to try it if there are still samples.

PM me your address, please; and I'll send one out next chance I get.
118  Other / Meta / Re: Fault of Bitcoin community on: July 28, 2012, 09:46:16 PM
You need to grow thicker skin, or consider hitting that ignore button to the left.  You don't have a right to not be offended.
119  Other / Politics & Society / Re: What is environmentalism, really? on: July 28, 2012, 09:42:55 PM
Quote

Back then, we washed the baby's nappies because we didn't have the throw-away kind. We dried clothes on a line, not in an energy-gobbling machine burning up 2,000 watts – wind and solar power really did dry our clothes back then. Kids got hand-me-down clothes from their brothers or sisters, not always brand-new clothing. But that young lady is right. We didn't have the green thing back in our day.


My kids had fitted cloth diapers, hand made in Canada.  They weren't cheap, either.

The overall cost was cheaper though.

Quote

Back then, we had one TV or radio in the house – not a TV in every room. And the TV had a small screen the size of a handkerchief, not a screen the size of Yorkshire.


I've never owned more than one television at a time, although my current one does have a screen the size of Yorkshire.  It also only uses 70 watts to do much more than what used to take 450 watts, so I'm okay with that.

Quote

In the kitchen, we blended and stirred by hand because we didn't have electric machines to do everything for us. When we packaged a fragile item to send in the post, we used wadded up old newspapers to cushion it, not Styrofoam or plastic bubble wrap.


I've never had a newspaper subscription, and I've never known a Millinial who did either, whether they were inclined to be green or not.

Quote

Back then, we didn't fire up an engine and burn petrol just to cut the lawn. We used a push mower that ran on human power.


Those are still made, BTW.  I've got two of them.  They actuall cost more than a cheap gas push mower, but last a decade longer at least.

Quote

We exercised by working, so we didn't need to go to a health club to run on treadmills that operate on electricity. But she's right. We didn't have the green thing back then.


I have a Trek 7.1 that I commute 8 miles each way one whenever I can.  I did it exclusively for 3 years from May of 2008 to Aug. 2011; and I've had other jobs in the past that I commuted by bike too.  Over my working adult life, I'd say I've owened a car to commute with a bit over half the time.  Not owning the car at all is the money saver, as most of the costs of a car are maintaince & insurance, not fuel.

Quote

When we were thirsty, we drank from a tap instead of drinking from a plastic bottle of water shipped from the other side of the world.



They don't really come from the other side of the world, they come from a small bottling factory with an industrial reverse osmosis unit in your downtown district.  It's tap water, just read the label.

Quote
We refilled writing pens with ink instead of buying a new pen, and we replaced the blades in a razor instead of throwing away the whole razor when the blade got dull. But we didn't have the green thing back then.


This one's bullshit.  Very few people reused pens or razors unless they had too.

Quote

Back then, people took the bus and kids rode their bikes to school or walked instead of turning their mums into a 24-hour taxi service.


You meet some really interesting people on public transit

Quote
We had one electrical socket in a room, not an entire bank of sockets to power a dozen appliances.


That changed for valid code & human safety reasons, not because people had more things to plug in.

Quote
And we didn't need a computerized gadget to receive a signal beamed from satellites 2,000 miles out in space in order to find the nearest fish and chip shop.


Wow, total ignorance about how cell phones work.  The only signal beamed from space is GPS, and every bit of that is solar powered.

Quote
Remember: Don't make old people angry.

We don't like being old in the first place, so it doesn't take much to piss us off!!!

You guys would do well to take this one to heart.
120  Other / Politics & Society / Re: What is environmentalism, really? on: July 28, 2012, 07:46:55 PM
Quote
The Green movement aims to extend the lifetime of exploited resources of our environment.
Wow, never thought of it that way.

It's also not true, at least not in any practial sense.  In my own experience, those who "wish to be green" and are willing to use government to compell others to also do as they would wish are religious zealots, not scientists.  They, as a rule, are impervious to new facts or data that may not have been available (or not widely available) at the time of their religious conversion.  I'm no less committed to the environment than I ever have been, I've just come to the conclusion that most of the actions that are proposed by the Green movement are ineffective at best, and terriblely counterproductive otherwise.  Even one of the founders of Greenpeace has done an about face concerning civil nuclear power, and nuclear power was one of the scientific issues that started me down my alternate path.  I love watching "Stossel" on Fox Business Network each thursday, and this past one had a bit on the EPA that I agree with compeletly.  Stossel (himself a well known former liberal turned libertarian) stated the issue well for myself, by saying that when the EPA was founded, there was much need for it, but since all of the low hanging fruit has been dealt with over the past 40 years, all remaining gains are economicly very costly and thus result in job losses.  I also agree with his libertarian position that, although it's true that in a libertarian world the public could class action sue major industrial polluters, in practice our justice system is too screwed up for that to be a practial solution.  Thus the EPA must continue to exist as a reflection of our society's collective desire to restrict pollution to the economicly necessary minimum possible but no further.  My greatest complaint about the EPA is that they have no authority over the greatest pollutors within the USA, namely government institutions themselves (particularly the US Military), so further gains from federal actions cannot be expected.
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