kWh/day also is not kW/hour, because h/day=24, a constant so 1kWh/day is just 24kW. Something is not right here. 24kW > 1 kWh per day. Hell 24 kW > 1 kWh / hour  I think you mean 1 kW = 24 kWh per day. |
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No games use integer ops, that is what CPU is used for. My guess is it will suck at mining. Nothing in any of the reviews indicated improved integer performance. I doubt NVidia would mention Bitcoin specifically but something like "improved encryption for OpenCL/CUDA accelerated applications like Winzip" would be a good sign. It is roughly 1.3x to 1.7x as fast a 580 GTX. If it has similar relative performance (int ops vs FLOPs) that puts it around 200 MH/s maybe 250 MH/s. I agree with the post above. The good news is that because it "beats" the 7970, AMD will need to undercut on price. On edit: http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/26437-nvidia-gtx-680-price-now-set-at-us-$499 Looks like NVidia is striking back. If GTX 680 is $499 and it out performs 7970 then 7970 will need a steep cut to be competitive. Most gamers have little loyalty. They just want max fps/$. Obviously launch day prices will be higher but if they can keep the supply up I would imagine AMD needs to look at <$480 to avoid losing share. |
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Yes I think most miners would still have a problem with it. Some of us have more money then other to invest in BTC but we are all on a level playing field. Would you still by a farm of GPU for mining when only 1 person has access to ASIC now and you never will? Where do you get the idea you have a right to a level playing field? Is it fair some people have $0.04 per kWh electrical rates and some have $0.30 per kWh. If it fair some people need to build their farm one GPU at a time and other can drop $15K on a rigbox or LargeCoin? Miners compete you have no right to any "fairness". Adapt, overcome, and expand or die. No different than any other private enterprise. |
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So an update. The manifold:I found a manifold for my rigs. It is a radiant heating manifold. I was at local plumbing supply house and after explaining what I needed one of the employees found a returned open box manifold. This is a $250+ part but was marked down to $120 due to some damaged. Got them to drop it to $70 with no returns unless not water tight. I will post some images tonight but here is a stock photos. The blue caps at the top are balancing valves and the red tubes at the bottom are flow meters.  One of the balancing valves is jammed, and two of the crimp rings are warped, one of the temp guages doesn't go above 80C. It also has some cosmetic damages and tooling marks. No idea what idiot tried to use this and why the store accepted the return but I got a lot of nice features for very little cost. Now it is designed for connecting PEX piping and the adapters for each zone are proprietary which makes it a challenge to repurpose. Through trial and error I found that 1/2" ID, 5/8" OD tubing is very close to the nominal dimensions of 1/2" PEX and remains water tight even under pressure using the compression fittings which work with this manifold. I ordered some 7/16" ID tubing which I think will provide an even tighter seal. Another option is changing the fittings on each zone to ones designed for 5/8" PEX which is a good fit for 1/2" ID, 3/4" OD tubing. Since the tubing will be outside the server (connects quick disconnects on front of server to manifold) having a thicker sidewall may be better. In testing I got 5 loops (no rigs connected) running @ > 1.6 gpm (the max on flow meters). The balancing valves will make is very easy to ensure each rig gets at least 1 gpm to ensure turbulent flow. Honestly despite being damaged this is a total score. The pump and loop:Hooked the pump up to using some PVC Unions. At this point I am using 3/4" ID tubing (fits tightly over 1" PEX barbs) for the mainline because PEX isn't exactly flexible or easy to work with when testing. Purging air from the system was a challenge. I made a PVC "T" to allow a line for adding coolant and purging air. It only worked marginally. It took hours to purge air from the loops and I don't think I got it all. Went back to Lowes and picked up a 2" PVC T with some 1" threaded adapters. The larger diameter means water will slow down as it enters the T allows the air to separate easier. The heat exchanger: The good news. It is massive and well built with a ton of surface area both the fins and the internal tubing. The surface area of copper tubing is important because it is how heat is transferred from the water to the fins. You can have a giant heat sink but if it only has a small amount of tubing it isn't going to be very efficient. To put it into perspective your average 3x120mm water cooling radiator has 1/8" copper tubing usually 4 parallel lines which make one pass. Surface area of the copper tubing on 2x120mm radiator = 2 * Pi * (1/8) * 14 * 2 * 4 = 88 in^2 This heat exchanger using 8 parallel lines of 3/8" copper tubing and makes 3 round trip passes. Surface area of copper tubing on this water to air heat exchanger = 2 * Pi * (3/8) * 20 *6 * 8 = 2261 in^2 The bad news. I bought it from an ebay seller and some fins were damaged. I can fix them but I need a "rake". Worse for some reason rather than capping the 1" copper tubes with plastic or rubber plugs they sweated bronze caps (using what looks like two gallons of solder). In the process it looks like they knocked the tubes out of round. I had a nightmare of a time sweating new fittings on. I ended up cutting the caps off and having to bend the tubes back round. It look a lot longer than I had planned. Should have spent a little more because I certainly paid for any discount in manhours. Disclaimer:I hope these posts have shown that there is nothing "standard" about cooling a rack of servers. Everything requires adjustment and modification as you go. Luckily I own a lot of tools. If I didn't I likely would have had to spent $1000 in tools and supplies (wrenches, channel locks, pipe cutters, soldering torch, mapp gas, tube cutters, pipe dope, thread sealant, etc). What's next:Will get some photos tonight. Hopefully (work dependent) in the next couple days I can get the time to hook the test rig to the new cooling loop. I have enough waterblocks to test a second 3x5970 rig maybe this weekend. If everything goes good I need to pull the trigger on 20x 5970s waterblocks. |
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541 MH / 139W = 3.89 MH/W
I think you mean 541 MH/s / 139 W = 3.89 MH/Ws = 3.89 MH/J True although almost nobody has a clue what a Joule is and most people understand a watt. Saying MH/W isn't accurate but I have to admit it is a bastadization that I use. Still your right it should me MH/J and since this is a thread about calculating the efficiency it should be done right. Post updated. |
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kWh & watt hours = units of energy (power over time) vs KW and watts = units of power 100 kWh (how do you know?) * 1000 = 100,000 watt hours 30*24 = 720 hours 100,000 watt hours / 720 hours = 139 watts hours / hours = 139 watts (not watt hours, you divided kwh by h leaving KW and then converted to watts) Note you can express this more simply as 100 kWh * 1000 / 30 / 24 = 139 watts but the above helps to show the conversion of units. (541 MH/S) / (139W) = 3.89 MH/WS = 3.89 MH/J On edit: corrected for accuracy. Often you will see this expressed as 541 MH / 139W = 3.89 MH/W. It is technically wrong but I have to admit I do it to. Most people are more familiar with the concept of watts and kWh than Joules. IF someone is saying 3.89 MH/W they likely mean 3.89 MH/J. Or 1947600 mhashes per hour / 500400 J = 3,89 MH/J . Correct? Then MH/J (or MH/W) means (Mhashes per hour)/(J or W)? Yeah you lost me here. Alternatively you simply use a kill-a-watt mete and measure the current. Take hashrate / current. BTW I doubt you have a rig which only uses 139W. I am not sure where you "know" you are using 100 kWh per month but that likely is the source of your error. |
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Deflation doesn't stop economies. Computers get cheaper every year thus nobody buys computers right. Might as well wait forever for cheaper ones. Oh wait they do. Computers, movies, games, HDTVs, ipods, ipads, digital cameras, renewable energy products (PV solar, wind turbines, etc), and essentially all electronics all get cheaper with time. Obviously they are the slowest and most stagnant part of the global economy right.
For someone to "own half the world" they would need to
a) mine half the coins - which is impossible.
b) never sell not when the coins the have are worth $10K, not when they are worth $10M, not when they are worth $10B.
c) risk losing everything by a & b.
I can see it now.
"Fuck no I am not selling my stash. It is only worth $82 billion. Billions is for suckers I am living in my mom's basement until it is worth trillions. Trillions is the smart money. ..... NO MOM I CAN'T TAKE OUT THE TRASH. I am trying to become the worlds first trillionaire".
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alright thanks.
about the payment, is it send directly to my wallet? i mean, i didnt put an address for it anyway, like on deepbit or other pools. Thats what im unsure about.
Yes it is sent directly to your wallet. By default p2pool gets a new address from bitcoind (your wallet) each time it starts. If you want to use a fixed address you can by using the -a command line argument. Using a fixed address IMHO makes it easier to keep track of payments. There is no concept of "progress" in p2pool (or any mining) so you can restart with a fixed address at anytime. It can be any address it doesn't need to be one from the bitcoind running. |
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How is it not personal information to know what he is doing with his money/bitcoins? He's broken no laws (at least none I'm concerned with) and has just as much expectation to privacy as much as anyone else. I can understand wondering, but going so far as to think you deserve to know?
Hijacking others' hardware and stealing their electricity is fine for you? And doing that in order to steal boatloads of blocks from legit miners? The guy is a fucking criminal that should be lynched a.s.a.p. First of all he likely is using a botnet but there is no proof of that. He could be for example testing a massive ASIC cluster. Second he hasn't been given any due process. Are you really advocating lynching based on suspicion? Still even if he IS a CONFIRMED CRIMINAL and he has had his day in court Mt.Gox STILL has no right to just hand out personal information. Period. If the Police want the information they will provide a warrant. If some nervous nellies on the internet want it well they can pack sand. |
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If they don't meet the 4-6 weeks you can cancel and get your money back ... guaranteed. There is nothing else "backing" it. Not a single person has received units in <6 weeks. Some early January orders just shipped.
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I agree with you here, so we can ask MtGox: are those blocks being cashed out or not?
Without asking for name, surname, address and so on. What makes you think you have the right to ANY transaction information on any customer? |
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Mt Gox shouldn't tell anyone anything about any account without a court order. I mean come on people see the forrest from the trees. Would you be happy if your local bank shared information on your transactions because some people online wanted to know some answers?
Really? Anyone think Mt.Gox becoming the Police and/or sharing financial info with people on a forum is a GOOD THING for Bitcoin? Really?
Mt.Gox has to comply with the law and that requires anti-money laundering and KYC laws but there is nothing that requires them to provide transaction transparency to anyone. Any info Mt.Gox has on customers isn't THEIRS TO SHARE. Period. If you want info from Mt. Gox then get a fracking court order.
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so i bassicly have to wait...?
and when / how are payouts being made? it isnt stated in first / second post...
Payouts are made when a block is found based on the % of shares you have from the prior 24 hours worth of shares. p2pool currently finds a block every 6 hours on average (although that can vary significantly). p2pool.info has some good info on projected block completion times, your "cut" of the next block found (will be 0 until you find at least 1 share), history of blocks found and more. |
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He is probably right with JTAG Probing, modern FPGAs include pretty good bitstream encryption. But it is as with any DRM, futile for the long run. just one example: http://it.slashdot.org/story/11/07/21/1753217/fpga-bitstream-security-brokenThe nice thing about it: It's perfectly legal to do it, basically the same thing as jailbreaking a phone. Now sharing the bitstream would be another story. So BFL is safe as long as nobody with access to a decent lab comes along. Well sadly in the US it would be illegal. DMCA makes circumventing encryption for ANY REASON even a legit one a crime. Granted the law is an abomination and should be repealed but as of today it is on the books. |
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I think the bigger question here is how is our new MM cashing out?
To cash out $90k a month on mtgox.com is multiple steps in verifying your identification.
Yes. Just when BTC price was recovering nicely you get this huge vertical drop. Either the botter cashed out, or ppl are catching up with this story. Anyway I would not have ordered a 5830 yesterday if I had read this before. This is bad bot for miners and BTC, since someone can get it for free stealing, and that is not exactly what inspire the trust of the market. If some antivirus company will not save us soon, I fear that we are freaking doomed. That is the biggest sob story nonsense of the morning. Either you have a need for doom & gloom or you are short BTC. "save us"? Really? |
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Spreading a FUD about "we can read your communication, we can decrypt your data". That's the goal of the message.
They simply want to scan all e-mail and web traffic and build a semantic graphs to get a clue whats happening on the Internet. Cool project, but no cracking of ciphers, IMHO.
I'm not sure. If they get enough messages from you which are encrypted with the same key, they might be able to guess the key much faster. If by "enough" you mean a couple quadrillion a year for the next century and you are stupid enough not to use salt then they likely could brute force the key "faster". As in "only" a century not a million years. Strong well executed encryption with sufficient key strength can't be brute forced. Not by the NSA datacenter, not by a plentary sized supercomputer. Now they can brute force a lot of other things like poorly constructed passphrases, weak encryption, OS which leave plaintext fragments lying around, the weak passwords in a server password list. |
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It depends on the transaction. Think someone will hire 200 GH/s of hashing power to Finney attack a Big Mac combo meal?
Could you accept 0-confirm BTC for fastfood? Probably.
Think it might be worth it to Finney attack a $27 million Gold Bullion sale?
Could you accept 0-confirm BTC for high value hard to trace transactions? Likely not.
The goal should be to maximize profits not minimize fraud. Credit cards have >0% fraud. Businesses accept them because the added profit > added fraud.
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Is there any other e-currency worth mining at the moment? Maybe Namecoin?
Namecoin can be mined for free with Bitcoin (merged mining). There is no economic value to mining just Namecoin. |
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Well unless you add a block to the CPU, don't count it in (same goes with PSU inefficiencies), since all the heat will only be coming from what you have blocks on. You could do 2 or 3 5970s, and even downclock them for a better mhash/watt while still getting enough to keep the pool warm.
If it's underwater, if the heat does not go into the water, where else will it go? =) If heat is the desired product, there are zero inefficiencies. The only thing there needs to be is something to make sure the CPU and PSU get their heat carried away so they don't burn up. There will not be any net air flow - the air pocket will get hot in proportion to how well the heat can transfer out of the air and into the water. A CPU block and a water-cooled power supply would probably be necessary. Air is a very good insulator. |
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I agree with rjk. If you have a specific attack you believe has merit post some code or psuedo code. On the other hand if you haven't thouroughly looked over the SHA-256 function to the point that you understand all of the operations, why they exist, and can manually hash a block of data from start to finish then I recommend you start there. Much of what you describe sounds like (may not be true but it sounds like) someone who hasn't taken a very detailed look at how SHA-256 (or more generically a cryptographic hash) works.
What you describe wasn't even possible with SHA-1 but a key point to SHA-2 was improving the element inter dependencies to make meet in the middle attacks (which are theoretically possible but nobody has pulled it off on SHA-1) infeasible. While you are looking at SHA-256 take a look at SHA-1 and see how much the inter-element computations have improved from SHA-1 to SHA-2.
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