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1341  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Those with an incentive to attack the bitcoin network on: July 16, 2015, 07:41:25 PM
We are not talking about 51% if a bank attack. They would go 100%. Then the fork they controll win.

If they create a fork, then no one will use their fork, which will be a billion dollar waste of money. Bitcoin in its essential are a consensus reached among its users, voluntarily participating. You can not force people to use certain fork of bitcoin. Large mining pools can indeed modify transactions and even do double spending if they control majority of the hash power, but they can not affect the existing coins, which is the major usage of bitcoin right now: Long term store of value. Constant turbulence in transaction space will just drive the demand to long term saving area
1342  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Those with an incentive to attack the bitcoin network on: July 16, 2015, 07:01:00 PM
Increased activity of coin transaction will just make coin less available in circulation, thus raise its value. The more you attack the network, the stronger it grows, it absorbs all the energy that fed into it

I would consider the reduced speed of the network and the increased fees as a negative effect. Its kind of like saying that the frozen bank accounts in Greece have higher value because there is less money in circulation. I don't think this is the way to increase the value of a currency/asset. Not by a attack by any means.

Also the price hasn't sky-rocketed either due to the spam. Its a bit higher yes, but
1. Is the slight increase in price actually due to the spam?
2. Will it last?
3. Is it worth it to have it at the cost of increased fees and longer transaction times?

I would be happier without people spamming the network.

When banks froze Greece bank accounts, they definitely raise the value of euro in the eyes of Greece people, and Greece parliament passed an even more strict austerity proposal to get those euros  Grin

And since majority of the bitcoins are being used as long term storage, the raised fee will not affect most of the users, only exchanges and payment processors. Long term savers with more than 10 bitcoins does not care if they should pay 0.01 or even 0.1 bitcoins for a 10 bitcoin transaction
1343  Economy / Economics / Re: What can greece central bank do? on: July 16, 2015, 06:57:43 PM
Today's Greek parliament vote proved that money really controls everything, thus who create money will control the world. But in this sense, giving up the money creation right to someone else must be the most stupid move a country can make

isn't this a bit akin to early adopters and their dirty manipulation, or rich guys that can buy plenty of coins at once and control the market, so bitcoin also in the end, is not immune from this

Money must be spent to show its effect of control. With bitcoin you can only spend it once, then you give up that power of control to those who earned the coin. To get back those coins, you must work just like anyone else. But with endless money printing by central banks, that power of control stays forever
1344  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin is NOT a currency debate! on: July 16, 2015, 03:03:50 PM
Of course it is not, it is the most advanced value certificate that human has ever created, all currencies are like from stone age when comparing with bitcoin
1345  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: The Golden Ratio Attack. Blocks more than half full lead to mining monopoly. on: July 16, 2015, 02:48:38 PM

Lets imagine your mine with half hashpower. Lets imagine that a block can contain 6000 transactions.  Attacker has 1/2 hashpower.  Offered load is 4000 tx/block.

Attacker crafts 2000/tx block at 1coin/tx fee level. Making the rest match him (plus episilon, which we'll disregard).

His average cost for spam is 1000 coin/block (2000 * 1-rate).
His average income is 2000 coin/block (4000 * rate).  (He doesn't get income from his spam, he saves its cost however; see prior line)
His net income is 1000 coins/block, on average.


Is that possible? Wink

His average cost for spam is 1000 coin/block, but his average income is not 2000 coin/block. Because even there are 2000 transactions with a fee of 1 BTC stay at the top of the queue and get transacted immediately, the rest 4000 transactions might still pay a fee of  0.01 bitcoin, they were just pushed back in the queue, not obliged to follow the highest paying fee. The fee would only rise to 1 coin/tx if all those transactions are willing to pay for that. In a word, the spammer can only raise the fee to the amount of money he spent, the rest is not up to him

And of course he could spend huge and spam all the 6000 transactions with 1 coin/tx to occupy all the block space, then as you said that will only benefit the non-spamming miners, and those miners would still include the transactions that they want to broadcast in their blocks with a minimum fee (like exchange-mining farm cooperation)
1346  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: The Golden Ratio Attack. Blocks more than half full lead to mining monopoly. on: July 16, 2015, 02:24:29 PM
Suppose that there are 10 blocks, each with a fee of 2 btc (in future). Now a large mining pool commanding 50% of hash power decided to spam the network and raise the fee for each block to 3 btc. So he spend 1 bitcoin at each block as fee for his spamming transactions, that's 10 bitcoins total, and he mined 5 of them back, his net loss is 5 bitcoins, how would he become profitable?

1347  Economy / Economics / Re: What can greece central bank do? on: July 16, 2015, 04:05:20 AM
Today's Greek parliament vote proved that money really controls everything, thus who create money will control the world. But in this sense, giving up the money creation right to someone else must be the most stupid move a country can make
1348  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Those with an incentive to attack the bitcoin network on: July 14, 2015, 12:27:13 AM
Increased activity of coin transaction will just make coin less available in circulation, thus raise its value. The more you attack the network, the stronger it grows, it absorbs all the energy that fed into it

1349  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Those with an incentive to attack the bitcoin network on: July 13, 2015, 02:52:14 AM
bitcoin.conf

minrelaytxfee=0.0002

 Cheesy
1350  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Randomising Brain Wallet - idea on: July 13, 2015, 12:16:07 AM
Something very easy to remember for you but impossible to guess or brute force for others... What if you are kidnapped? Get some bodyguards before doing this  Grin
1351  Economy / Economics / Re: The two percent mantra on: July 12, 2015, 11:15:51 PM
The majority of the actors are ignorant, a few wise mind who understand the truth won't change anything. Even everyone have internet access, most of them are still ignorant

But with bitcoin these a few pioneer can seek their paradise in another monetary system, and after they got very success, people will blindly follow as before
1352  Economy / Economics / Re: How is it possible for fiat to "disappear"? on: July 12, 2015, 11:09:33 PM
From macro level, fiat money disappears when the trust to that currency is totally broken, for example Zimbabwe dollar

It is very easy to break that trust while difficult to maintain it: If suddenly it requires 10X more dollar to eat a hamburg, then everything's price will explode and government suddenly lose the ability to purchase or drive any project with the money they have (even banks raise the interest to 20%), then their only choice is to print more money to handle the situation, which make the situation even worse. So once that trust is broken, there is almost no way to prevent the collapse

But so far, people's trust to fiat money is still intact, this is because they don't have any knowledge about modern money creation
1353  Economy / Speculation / Re: I really like how calm the forum is! on: July 12, 2015, 10:58:04 PM
Speculators need more dose  Grin
1354  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can anybody stall Bitcoin for 72BTC per hour? ANSWER: NO on: July 11, 2015, 06:14:34 PM
Could this attack itself partially initiated by large mining pools? Because they get part of the spam coin back through fee, it does not cost them too much, but it will make lots of coins on market occupied during the attack, thus raise the exchange rate. With more and more coins trapped in unconfirmed status, the coin supply on market will become less and less, a great help for the speculators who are pumping up the price at the same time
1355  Economy / Economics / Re: [POLL] Bitcoin has actually value ? on: July 11, 2015, 09:00:49 AM
Value is all subjective, for certain people bitcoin has huge value, for some others it worth nothing
1356  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: The attack on the network is not hostile on: July 11, 2015, 08:33:57 AM
This is merely a simulation about potential bank attack scenario when bitcoin really take over traditional banking services  Grin

At its extreme, banks could print several billion dollars per day to facilitate magnitudes larger scale attack, in order to totally stop bitcoin network. But this simulation proved 3 things:

1. the attack won't stop the network totally, someone who are willing to pay a higher fee would not be affected, and because majority of coins are used for long term storage, people have the option to wait

2. nodes have certain flexibility to exclude spamming transactions, so that even some nodes were brought down by the excessive loads on mempool, many other nodes will just add some filter based on the attack, so the money spent on attack will basically achieve nothing but enrich miners

3. the exchange rate will jump during the attack, due to transaction capacity now becomes scarce and demand is even higher than before
1357  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Are we stress testing again? on: July 10, 2015, 01:17:55 PM
And the exchange rate just jumped. This again proved that bitcoin's value is not mainly decided by its payment function, but investment and speculation, both do not require a high transaction frequency, and can afford to pay a high fee to get the payment done when needed

The other use cases are international remittance and drug dealing, again both are typical large transactions over $50, so even the fee rises to $1 (e.g. 0.003 btc), it is still acceptable

1358  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin hit $280 on: July 10, 2015, 12:24:01 PM
Here's an interesting inverse, Litecoin: https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/litecoin

The opposite way to the BTC spike. Don't know if it's really that, but Litecoin made a large rally over the last few days.

Perfect timing, someone is selling huge amount of litecoin today, price dropped 50% in a couple of hours, again proved that litecoin is a pump and dump instrument

It is similar on bitcoin, obviously a planned pump by Chinese exchanges, all of them showing a large spike of short squeeze, I guess all the people who were shorting bitcoin were wiped out
1359  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: We ARE under attack.. we NEED to act... on: July 10, 2015, 12:20:36 PM
Someone is cashing out litecoin big time  Grin
1360  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Are we stress testing again? on: July 09, 2015, 10:14:15 PM
mempool is at close 80mb and 95k transactions. what's the critical number for nodes to go down?
RAM.

Restart the node and you delete all pending transactions and start from scratch!

Yep - you don't even have to restart the node - just kill and restart bitcoind. -*yeah, good point- as bitcoind starts up it requests transactions it missed*

As far as the critical number goes, it's hard to say. bitcoind currently takes around 1GB on my linux node - presuming a lot of nodes have only 2GB, perhaps it would take 10X current or around 1m transactions in mempool to start causing serious problems?

My node has been up without restart for over a week (so up for all these recent tests) and is connected to 60+ peers.

getmempoolinfo

{
"size" : 2178,
"bytes" : 2634223
}

According to task manager Bitcoin Core is using 500MB of RAM (slightly more than my web browser).

Sup? Everyone here knows you can modify your fee rules to ignore transactions that you consider spam, right?

Mine 1-week-uptime node's getmempoolinfo shows 5xxxx for size and 124xxxxxx for bytes, 5 minutes after a restart of the process, size become 1476 and bytes become 3xxxxxx, let's see what it will finally show, I guess after 6 hours it will catch up with the rest of the nodes
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