Hey, all you guys claiming that AnCap may lead to things like bit powerful companies using their strengths to bully the little guy
Statists resort to this belief as a form of fearmongering. It is, of course, a lie. They can't possibly know whether this would happen in a stateless society, and we know this is so, because whenever they want to "prove" their belief, what do they do? They bring up examples of statist societies, where the examples of organizations who supposedly are "very dangerous" have, in fact, been empowered by (you guessed it) a state. It's nothing but projection, see? Statists project the fact that in their statist system, they support the accumulation of murderous power in the organized criminals doing business as "government", who, of course, trample on the little guy as much as they want. They pretend this is a form of "protection", but, of course, it isn't protection any more than any other Mafia charging you "protection money" to "protect your business from burning down". Their whole "argument" boils down to "I want the strangers I worship to kill / cage / rob me if I disobey them, because I am scared of strangers killing / caging / robbing me". Anyone with two brain cells to rub together understands how pathologically lunatic this Livestockholm Syndrome is. It is a classic example of projection of abuse to deny their own abuse. No point in debating someone with their mind made up, so disrespectful and assuming. |
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That percentage of what I would call "tax" is always being debated and changed. I don't think or have an exact utopian figure but I would prefer something over 10% but under 20% to go towards infrastructure, education, basic health and a standing army. But is taking, by force, not more than 20% of a person's productivity not slavery? If it is not, why is it not? What quality sets it apart from 21%, or 100%? I am not saying more than a 21% tax is slavery. I just don't want to give a blank check to people I don't know personally and have any oversight on where my money goes. I do not believe a "tax" forced on me is slavery because I believe their are public services that are better handled by a more centralized administration that a private for-profit company. OK. Would a 100% tax not be slavery, then? 100% tax would "in fact" be slavery being that I would not be in control of any of my productive output. So then you still have not answered my original question. At what percentage is it not slavery? Like I said before, there is not an exact number. You should just take away that I believe their are basic responsibilities that I do not believe some private entity will be a good custodian of, better than a central administration (ie: a government). |
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Slavery is the appropriation of 100% of a person's productivity, is it not?
lrn2freedom Can you tell me what this means. Learn 2 Freedom sounds nonsensical. It means the only freedom that there is to find is in one's mind. Real slavery is not appropriation of 100% of one's productivity. The real slaves are the people who are guided by their ego, their fear, their greed, their addictions, their thoughts and their delusions. Those who expect something else than what is right in front of them, those who fail to realize that everything is already here and that nothing exterior can truly free or enslave them. Look at the poor myrkul, he's enslaved to his idea of what ancap is, what it should be, what it should look like. He's so attached and married to this idea that he starts wasting his time responding in a thread that has the word "trollitics" in the first line. And now he might be raging a little, because I predicted that after ignoring me quite vocally, he'd go out of his way and click the infamous "show/hide" button, just because he's identified himself so hard to this idea and he wants to know what this stupid frenchman dares to say about it. Myrkul, also the game. Bottom line : freedom is subjective, it's not a percentage of whatever. Yes, freedom of the mind is something only you control, you are responsible for and only you can give away to other ideas. |
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That percentage of what I would call "tax" is always being debated and changed. I don't think or have an exact utopian figure but I would prefer something over 10% but under 20% to go towards infrastructure, education, basic health and a standing army. But is taking, by force, not more than 20% of a person's productivity not slavery? If it is not, why is it not? What quality sets it apart from 21%, or 100%? I am not saying more than a 21% tax is slavery. I just don't want to give a blank check to people I don't know personally and have any oversight on where my money goes. I do not believe a "tax" forced on me is slavery because I believe their are public services that are better handled by a more centralized administration that a private for-profit company. OK. Would a 100% tax not be slavery, then? 100% tax would "in fact" be slavery being that I would not be in control of any of my productive output. |
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Slavery is the appropriation of 100% of a person's productivity, is it not?
lrn2freedom Can you tell me what this means. Learn 2 Freedom sounds nonsensical. |
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That percentage of what I would call "tax" is always being debated and changed. I don't think or have an exact utopian figure but I would prefer something over 10% but under 20% to go towards infrastructure, education, basic health and a standing army. But is taking, by force, not more than 20% of a person's productivity not slavery? If it is not, why is it not? What quality sets it apart from 21%, or 100%? I am not saying more than a 21% tax is slavery. I just don't want to give a blank check to people I don't know personally and have any oversight on where my money goes. I do not believe a "tax" forced on me is slavery because I believe their are public services that are better handled by a more centralized administration that a private for-profit company. |
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You should just leave my own or anyone elses family out of this discussion. You're just stating pure speculation about people you know nothing about or even ever had any contact with to try and suit your political goals. Even if it were true, that is their views and that has none or very little bearing on my own.
That's funny, because the anti-abolitionists had much the same views of the slaves, as you do of humanity as a whole. (Or is it just some people, Dalkore? Which group of people would you enslave for their own good?) They viewed them as savages, who needed the guidance of a civilized white man to get through their lives. Well if you equate having a government as slavery, then you are beyond any rational discussion. Even slaves had a government before they were apprehended by slave-traders. Slavery is the appropriation of 100% of a person's productivity, is it not? At what percentage does it become not slavery? 99%? 50%? 20%? If the slaves are allowed to pick who gets to be Overseer, does that make it not slavery? And perhaps you forget that the slaves were not captured, typically, but sold, either by their own "governments" or rival ones? That percentage of what I would call "tax" is always being debated and changed. I don't think or have an exact utopian figure but I would prefer something over 10% but under 20% to go towards infrastructure, education, basic health and a standing army. I am quite aware that in the beginning of the African slave trade, it was those African nations own aristocracy that sold their own people into the slave-trade through blood-debts. I am also aware that the demand for this cheap form of labor outstripped the supply until non-African slave traders started sending in raiding parties to get who ever they could find. |
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You should just leave my own or anyone elses family out of this discussion. You're just stating pure speculation about people you know nothing about or even ever had any contact with to try and suit your political goals. Even if it were true, that is their views and that has none or very little bearing on my own.
That's funny, because the anti-abolitionists had much the same views of the slaves, as you do of humanity as a whole. (Or is it just some people, Dalkore? Which group of people would you enslave for their own good?) They viewed them as savages, who needed the guidance of a civilized white man to get through their lives. Well if you equate having a government as slavery, then you are beyond any rational discussion. Even slaves had a government before they were apprehended by slave-traders. |
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If you think 500 TH/s is a low estimate, I will gladly take you up on a bet of significant size. There's no way in hell we're reaching 500 TH/s within 2 months.
Why not take on a bet of non-significant size? I think you have a winner here. I don't think we will hit 500 TH/s in 60 days after ASIC launch either. Also I have run calculations that I am using to see if I will actually buy an ASIC 2nd batch. |
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You seem to assume AnCap would be run by corporations. You are wrong.
Humans are social animals. Deal with it. But it does not follow that Humans are social animals, therefore, corporations. My great grandpa was a sliver/gold prospector in California and Oregon. He need that you needed to be forced to do what is right, that is why he carried a revolver, rifle and shotgun on his person. He lived in an AnCap society, guess what, it sucked and life could be cheap and depending on where you were, much cheaper. You dropped a great, Dalkore. You may have also selected the wrong side of your family tree. Go far enough back, and you'll find someone who would be very upset with the views you espouse. No one is advocating people becoming corporations. In our society, it would almost be mandatory as form of prudence because the risk of being sued and having your assets getting a lien or face being ex-communicated from your trading group / community is very real. You should just leave my own or anyone elses family out of this discussion. You're just stating pure speculation about people you know nothing about or even ever had any contact with to try and suit your political goals. Even if it were true, that is their views and that has none or very little bearing on my own. |
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You seem to assume AnCap would be run by corporations. You are wrong.
Humans are social animals. Deal with it. We are social and some are animals and some hold themselves to a higher standard. |
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No, just sad and disappointed that this old turd is getting trotted out again.
Massive corporations evolve into require governments. Fixed that for ya. And Dalkore, I'm sure your great-great grandpa would be very saddened to hear that you're of the opinion that people need to be forced to do what's good for 'em. My great grandpa was a sliver/gold prospector in California and Oregon. He need that you needed to be forced to do what is right, that is why he carried a revolver, rifle and shotgun on his person. He lived in an AnCap society, guess what, it sucked and life could be cheap and depending on where you were, much cheaper. |
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Myrkul is under the impression that we can have totally voluntary societies that have voluntary governments which will be run effectively with all private 3rd party services.
I am under the impression that you do need some form of coercion to get a large body of people to do what is in their best interest but only so far that they are not infringing on the people around them and that certain services must be provide through some collective institution that is not private but public and is mandatory.
I say mandatory because people have a habit of putting things off until you needed them yesterday (procrastination). I also believe these services are few and that power should existing regionally with very limited push to a body that handles large areas like a nation. Basic Human Rights, Rule of Law, Precedent, Free Speech, Dissent and innocence before guilt are also key. Also I would only allow corporation for limited periods of time and not extend limited liability to board members or officers (shareholders yes).
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Why does any second post must be related to BFL ? For that is butterlylabs.com forums.
Why is BFL in your signature? Obviously the OP wants to state his opinion on "this" forum. |
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I only turn on TV to watch 20 weeks of NFL football, presidential debates and the NBA finals. I spend my free time reading history and other various old texts, along with contemplating the thinking about issues we have faced and face today.
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I'm going to pass on the ABS. It had a "fail" grade when reviewed at HARDOCP and I would rather not fry my expensive video cards because of the awful DC output quality. I did reply to mrb's thread about getting an AX1200 though. If it falls through though, I am -still- looking for a quality power supply. Well there is a lot of controversy about that specific review but regardless, mine has been in service for 9 months without issues, I believe it was a build quality issue on some of the batches. Newegg has a bunch of reviews you can read from many owners. Either way, thank you for your consideration. |
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Coming up with a format for listing posts and request posts would be helpful so it is easy to browse for items.
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I'm trying to run all 4 cards from 1 motherboard, so I'm assuming I will need a quad crossfire board.
Nope, my board will all run 5 cards. You just need PCI and PCI-E extenders so you can get some ventilation about them. I'll make a package for you. This is how I ran these rigs. This wont be for mining, will the extenders cause any performance issues? If is isnt for mining, then yes I believe so. I can sell you some good PSUs though. Ill check my ASRock board to see what it supports. I think I'll need atleast an 1100 to run 4x6970 How about a (1) ABS 1100 Watt PSU (80 plus gold) - BTC8.75? What do you need the 4 cards for if you dont mind? Serious machine that is not for mining? hash cracking. feel free to build me an entire system  Everything but the cards and hard drive. Im on it, Ill give you a good deal. It will be a Board, CPU, Ram and PSU. You supply the rest. PM me with the zip code it would ship too. Thanks |
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I'm trying to run all 4 cards from 1 motherboard, so I'm assuming I will need a quad crossfire board.
Nope, my board will all run 5 cards. You just need PCI and PCI-E extenders so you can get some ventilation about them. I'll make a package for you. This is how I ran these rigs. This wont be for mining, will the extenders cause any performance issues? If is isnt for mining, then yes I believe so. I can sell you some good PSUs though. Ill check my ASRock board to see what it supports. I think I'll need atleast an 1100 to run 4x6970 How about a (1) ABS 1100 Watt PSU (80 plus gold) - BTC8.75? What do you need the 4 cards for if you dont mind? Serious machine that is not for mining? |
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