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but I think that the announcement will have already priced in the act
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Just wondering....
the Btce Tbx DRK shills are just like the old FTC ones
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i have to wonder if this isn't a good buying opportunity for xrp. It went to 333333/btc and is back to 150000/btc.
hmmm the worst is now over.
It also serves as some what of and interesting test bed if satoshi was to sell. I am sure satoshi is watching this with some interest. However Satoshi seems a lot more reasoned out and stable than this jed character and ripple and co, with the exception of David Swartz. It seems so sort if intercine issue. It looks like a FU from JED to Ripple. Also a buying opportunity........
I like ripple to some extent, however there seem to be not enough sever nodes and how the list things update, whatever they were called...that's an issue inmho.
One of the reasons I like the Peercoin community is the lack of fractious Drama and the clear cut goals.
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Define poor. Do most poor folks have cell phones?
My take is the poor is already priced out of bitcoin, the middle class is already priced out of bitcoin because people think in whole numbers. I can't tell you how many of my friends/coworkers have said, "I'll let you create a wallet for me but I want one bitcoin".
Perhaps you can help your friends understand the math that's involved. There are currently about 7 billion people in the world and a little less than 13 million bitcoins have been mined so far. There just aren't enough whole bitcoins for everyone to have one. Fortunately, each bitcoin can be divided into 100 million "whole" satoshis and your friends could each buy one million of those "whole" satoshis for about $4.50 at current prices. but people don't think like that. They want at least 1 bitcoin and the sell is there are 21 Million. this seems to be a limiting factor atm. |
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The sun deposits approximately 1 kW / m^2 of power upon the earth, and somehow it gets used up (growing plants, evaporating water, melting snow, etc). Since the radius of the Earth is 6400 km, this means the cross sectional area through which the solar power flux passes is:
A = Pi r^2 = 3.14 x (6400 x 10^3 m)^2 = 1.3 x 10^14 m^2
Since each m^2 has 1 kW deposited, this means the total power hitting the earth is:
P = A x F = (1.3 x 10^14 m^2) x (1000 W / m^2) = 1.3 x 10^17 W = 130 million gigawatts.
So how does this compare to all the bitcoin miners?
Right now, when a miner finds a block he earns 25 BTC, blocks are found roughly every 10 minutes and 1 BTC is worth about $450. So, the miners' revenue is roughly
25 BTC / block x 0.1 blocks / min x 450 $ / BTC x 1/60 min / s = 19 $ / s
Let's imagine that this revenue goes entirely to electricity and let's assume the cost of electricity is $0.1 / kW-hr. Then $19 would pay for 190 kW-hrs of electricity. But this is the amount used per second so the power consumption is then estimated at 190 kW hr / s x 3600 s / hr x 1000 W / kW = 6.8 x 10^8 W = 0.68 gigawatts.
So, the entire earth gets 130 million gigawatts of power from the sun and currently uses no more than 0.68 gigawatts on bitcoin mining.
Therefore, less than 1 part in 100 million of the total available energy deposited on earth each second by the sun goes towards bitcoin mining.
this is alot more than I thought.....considering, each human could only use about 1 part in 7000 million of the total available energy deposited on earth each second. |
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[1] when I use nxt wallet.org 1.0 on mac, and then go to update to 1.0x from jean luc repo, is says check not compatible from the blockchain and then crashes horribly. Some sort of trojan? [2] which forum is the better forum, for nxt, by better I mean has the devs there etc NXTFORUM.ORG. or https://nextcoin.org/it seemed to be the latter but now links seem to go to the former. [3] what are the risks with forgeing. There must be some risk for reward. |
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Hello,
First I would like to address the issue:
I think that bitcoin mining as a whole (all the miners in the world) are consuming a lot of power and all we are doing is creating another currency that is going to be so regulated soon that it could be pointless.
Before you say that other things require a lot of power:
Lets take the US dollar. It is not based solely on using your computer/hardware to mine which is consuming electricity rates. It has jobs that you earn the dollar without using electricity or limited like using a computer then doing other stuff.
I do not hate bitcoin and love the idea but I keep getting this idea in my brain that the world is already starting to get more demand for these supplies (fossil fuels) to get electricity. I do not want this to happen but I would like to keep bitcoin alive. I am not a hater but rather someone who looks at the whole thing. Yes the future is going into technology but do you think it would be possible to wait till the world has found a reliable power resource that will generate enough power to feed the hungry demand before we dive into the future.
Main questions
Is bitcoin a big contribution to energy consumption?
Is bitcoin = the amount of electricity used?
Will this be used as a way that people/regulators can shut bitcoin down?
My main hope is that we develop ASICs that are really efficient not per gh/s but for the world or that people find a really good way to use solar energy or other times of energy to power these electricity hungry machines.
I do not hate bitcoin.
yeah no asics will alway run as hot and fast as possible or more asics that run cool will be run, its conservation of energy. use a POS like PeerCoin or NXT, which require minimal or no mining. |
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Owning berkshire means owning a slice of a huge conglomerate of profitable, growing businesses. Owning bitcoin means owning an electronic numerical value that's guaranteed by the network.
Berkshire is a productive asset, bitcoin is effectively an e-commodity. There is virtually no intrinsic value in bitcoin (it doesn't generate massive amounts of value for society). Owning berkshire for long periods of time is investing (long-term profit and value growth), while owning bitcoin for long periods of time is speculating (believing the next sucker will buy a non-productive asset at a higher price than you).
Owning BTC means owning part of a system that can replace 50% Of what all banks do at least. Conservatively that is worth 500M~to 1T a year. Think of the costs involved in securing the back end of the banks, banking branches, etc. Then there is the cash side, the whole cash printing handling side of things is replaced by BTC that cost trillions a year to deal with. This no intrinsic value is so often repeated but never actually thought about. The number of IT consultant, systems, property, branches and all the costs and maintiance each year are huge. |
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Universities lost their "laboratories of progress" status a long time ago. Most academics look and act more bureaucrats than intellectual leaders now. They screech about funding while giving their students no real tools to use in the the real world after they leave school.
This well put. Universities are now just regulatory bodies that soak up funding to get a piece of paper that is required for a registration board somewhere. Universities have become trade schools rather than research bodies. I am forced to uni to get the recognized certification to register to work. The Uni thus has a state sanctioned stranglehold/monopoly. It's hard to think of a more f...ked up system. I had the joy of exploding this one in a Legal Philosophy/Law Social theory class at UNI at why I was forced to be there. |
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This is a problem at any stake. Random coalitions to alter the past can be formed at no cost to those colluding.
Checkpointing is not an alternative to decentralized consensus but central override of it.
The same works for Bitcoin, too. You misunderstand. The risk isn't that someone could attack the network, it is that they could attack the network with no cost. Imagine bitcoin worked using a PoS. An early adopter had acquired 1M BTC at one time in the past but over time he lost/sold/spent/transferred them. Today he has no bitcoins but the blockchain contains a history of a time when he did have 1M BTC. If the amount of the stake being used is <1M BTC he could rewrite history not by using coins he has today (a real cost), not by buying millions of mining rigs (a real cost) but by using the history of the coins he once had (no cost). He has absolutely nothing at risk and nothing to lose. If he and potentially others decided to attack the network they would rewrite the blockchain starting from when they had a larger stake, creating a parallel history where they didn't lose/sell/spend/transfer the coins. They can attack the network based on what they had (but no longer do) in the past. There is nothing at risk and no cost to the attack. THAT is the PoS problem. If bitcoin miners collude, they could alter the past.
Sure they can, however there is a cost to that attack and there is something at risk which they lose if they fail. With PoS you can attack the network for "free" using something you had but no longer do. It is very hard to secure against an attack where the attacker can do so at any time without any cost and without any risk. does this quite follow? To POS mine you have to have the coins now in your possession. The fact that you have spent them [according to your senerio] means you can not longer mine with them in a proper POS setup. Eg, spent coins, for you can not anymore accumulate coin age. Thus your mining power = 0. on another point, NXT appears to be 100% POS and has not been forked or hacked by anyone to date. Further it Appears that the network swiftly punishes miner that try to undertake dubious activity, like producing dogey blocks. |
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this is the reverse of Dr' Evils 1 meeellion dollars right?
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Gold, every day all day. Time will tell, but when the economic USD shit hits the fan, people will flock to gold-silver, not btc. There's no historical precedence for it. Btc is a bubble.
nah its to easy to insert capital controls on gold, to hard to transport it and cut it up to actually use, and it can be confiscated. Force can always be used against gold and always has. Force can not change maths. |
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In real life, without being specifically targeted, how common - realistically speaking - is it for bitcoin owners to end up with keyloggers and trojans and malware specifically programmed to sniff out and steal bitcoin without the user going somewhere specific or downloading something specifically related TO btc in the first place - which would seem rather easy enough to root out.
Sincere questions and observation.
Don't have numbers, but I suspect machine take-over tools may now scan for Bitcoin wallets "just in case". Bitcoin for the first time, allows you to instantly transfer value in an irreversible way: over the Internet. Most online banking involves reversible transactions; and are not nearly as lucrative. There is also the long-term possibility that trusted giants like Apple, Google, and Microsoft may start installing key loggers for one reason or another (rogue employee, 3-4 letter agency request). The only way to guard against that is to keep the bulk of your funds off-line. this. I beleive there is a class of virus software that operates as follows scan for wallet.dat if found copy and send off. <hacking starts agianst weak passwords. waits for the password to be entered. keylogs and sends password. it then re-encrypts you local wallet. A small test amount may be sent. This allows th hacket to potetinally let you keep filling your wallet with out you realising you have been hacked, unless you were lucky enought to twig the small amount gone. Then the hacker can elect to clear the wallet, or wait for you to put more in. It is in hackers interest not to clear the wallet immediately, as that would be obvious and you can't use it at all anymore to withdraw but may keep filling it. |
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Innocent until proven Guilty in Court by a Jury of your Peers
with the option for an appeal(s)
Or trial by media, internet and Mob rule.
Take your choice people.
We aren't punishing him though, just speculating on the fact and making decisions on whether to make use of his services or have business relations with him. Public speculation may sound in deformation |
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An "accused"
Any one can accuse anyone of anything.
There is a vast difference between accused and found guilty in a court of law.
It's called proof beyond reasonable doubt.
Even then a justice system sits within the frame work of an election system that can set the laws subject to a constitution that usually bares a higher standard of difficulty to change.
Such hyperbole and sensationalism evaporates in the light of reasoned thinking.
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I feel like all these stories require further investigation. As much as we all like to talk about backdoors and keyloggers, I have yet to hear ANYONE losing their accounts to keyloggers.
I agree with this. Post Snowden, It's seems plausible that there are backdoors keylogger in hardware, eg intel and amd. Aso probally widows software. I mean why wouldn't there be? The Gov just leans on them to do it. I'm not sure how easy this is to check in the circuitry of an intel chip, though I think some one would have noticed by now....maybe. Using a linux o/s offline that signs transactions seems the only safe way. This is one of the driving reasons I wrote my coinwatcher software. I can load a html web page, and see all my addresses with no login, no private keys, no wallet, no sign in or anything and I can conveniently see what is in my addresses. Though I would use behind TOR so block chains that it queries do not get wise to where your IP. |
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Error with Source Forge File fixed
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Watch multiple addresses for BTC, LTC & PPC coins from one page and total amounts without logging in or signing up anywhere or having to re-enter addresses into a block explorer  you can find it here https://sourceforge.net/projects/coinwatch/files/CoinWatch.zip/downloadput your addresses in the coinwatch/addressAndtype.js press the go button and go!!!!! Consider Tor Browser for you own addresses. I have put some random addresses in there already for you to just try and as examples of how to put addresses in This has no time limit to use. |
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clearly English is not your first language, but i have to say, that was some of the most sophisticated English writing i have ever read! hilarious too!  English is my first language...I chose a particular style that will translate in a particular way to a particular reader... |
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China is as China does, they will heavily regulate or ban Bitcoin, this kinda goes without saying and always has.
The only thing of great interest is whether decentralised methods of exchange can exist in China. When they exist, I'll get cautiously excited. (And even that still might not survive China crackdowns, since they probably can block the Bitcoin protocol and make it very difficult to use beyond the techie elite).
The repercussions of BTC are likely to reshape society/culture. The China is as China does, is only a product of this generation being unable to remember the ones just a few before. This to will pass. |
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