I don't get what you mean by buying directly? You mean you there's a buy-it-now price that is separate? Or did they buy the PT and retract their bid? Because I thought I got outbid and moved my funds elsewhere. Don't worry, I'm not retracting my bid, I'll prepare additional funds.
By raising your price or the number of shares you want to buy, you can exit the auction early. Sorry, I might not have been clear enough with that post. The buy-it-now price is essentially the price you have already bid, if you are willing to up that by a bit and exit early, you can do that, because I consider the current prices good enough. what was the last dividend per share? Last dividend was, I believe, 0.0075 per share, weekly. However, 0.005 per share was reserved and reinvested by asicminer, which will provide future benefits for shareholders. That was with a lower TH/s online as well. |
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This ASICMINER project is unbelievably transparent in my opinoin. What else are you seriously looking for?
An actual contract ( such as), their listing on a reputable exchange (such as), actual monthly reports ( such as). Without these you are basically holding dust, like it or not. (No, the fact that "it paid already X dollah" is not necessarily an argument - so did pirate.) As opposed to holding dust on an exchange that is, equally, dust. |
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What else are you seriously looking for?
basically, to know ahead of time whether or not profits from this week will be included in next week's dividend. Based on the information we received last week, we were all expecting to receive a larger dividend, due to the auction and the increased hash rate. It would have been nice ahead of time to know that those profits were not going to be included in the dividend payment this week. I made the mistake of assuming that more profits = larger dividend, based on the information I had received. Again, this isn't the end of the world, and it certainly isn't cause for me to sell shares, but that kind of information would have been appreciated by shareholders like me. You are thinking far too short term. AM not paying that dividend does not mean AM is worth less. They still have the money, and even better than that, they are investing it for you. Now rather than having the money in your account, the company is worth a bit more. The only realistic way to evaluate a company is *not* dividends. Both Amazon and Berkshire pay no dividends, but have among the highest returns of any investment over the last 10 years. The way to evaluate a company is to look at what they are *earning,* not what their shareholders are getting. The companies earnings are all public knowledge. |
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More information is not a bad thing, guys.
That is not true. More information for you is also more information for competitors. To summarize what is known: 1. AM may have upwards of 200TH/s on order, although this is not confirmed. They also have agreements in place such that they could order substantially more. 2. AM has in their possession 62 TH/s of AM 10GH/s blades ready to deploy, minus what has been sold so far(0.6TH/s). 3. 13 TH/s is deployed, with 2 more TH/s estimated to be deployed tonight(by tomorrow morning for those of us in America). 4. Of the remaining 48 TH/s, at least 50% will be deployed for AM hashing. Some undetermined percentage of the remainder will be sold. 5. The company has a philosophy of around 50% reinvestment in the company, and 50% dividend payouts, which means AM likely has a lot more future ahead of it. 6. The order(?) or production of the USB miners has begun, and AM has reserved substantial funds to pay for it and integrated circuits as needed for deployment. That is what is known. I daresay you should be able to use that to evaluate AM's value yourself. Worst case, you can use prices from the most recent auctions to evaluate AM's true value, and estimate for yourself the future value based on the above & Friedcat's statements. |
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I enjoy reading this thread but last 5 or so pages have been a buncha jargon that needs to be sumed up in a nice and tiddy post Investor #1 wants a good company, complete with a brick and mortar establishment and marketing built for a growing company. Something that will stand out more with better transparency. #1 is probably thinking to himself does anyone even know what these guys real names are, what they look like anything? Investors #2, 3 enjoy the the lemonade stand style structure currently implemented and stand by good ol buddy systems of honesty and good neighborly business practices. Problem is where is the lemonade stand? In a basically anonymous series of internet forums... Now while the lemonade stand may have been good for a few funny monies here and there, i see this company as way overdue for a upgrade. just my 2 satoshi's  I think the problem here is patience. Everyone in the Bitcoin world is used to things moving at lightning speed. After all the rise from 15 to 266 took less than 90 days, and the crash took only hours. AM's first 3TH deployment happened ridiculously fast. The latest rise from 8.0TH/s to 13TH/s happened ridiculously fast. But the real world doesn't work that way. The reason there was such a delay at 6.5/7 TH/s is because the real world moves slowly- on the order of weeks, months, and years. 100 years ago, the world moved even slower- DECADES, not months. Expecting to go from lemonade stand to Microsoft in weeks is just not reasonable. The complaints raised are absolutely valid, the timelines they are expected under are not- a proper corporate structure takes months to years. These are all things that Friedcat is aware of as well. My opinion is this- I don't mean to come down so hard on furuknap because he simply represents a larger problem, a problem that consumes the vast majority of companies. This problem is shareholders wanting info, results, and profits, and wanting them *NOW*. This leads to executives who curtow to shareholder whims, delivering quarterly results at the expense of long term planning. Realistically speaking, AM is more open and communicative to shareholders than virtually any other company. Weekly updates? Details on internal workings and long term plans, often months ahead of time(200TH/s announcement, 50TH/s dates, blade sales info, USB miner info, etc)? And yet you want more? Moreover, because all shareholders have access to this information, *all* competitors have access to this information as well. And you want *more* information? The biggest and best companies out there all have made a habit- Ignoring shareholder short term wants. Amazon, Apple, Google... Do you think they give a crap about shareholder quarterly demands? Nope. They care about the customers' wants, and the long term planning of the company. Shareholders buy the company *because* they have do a good job, not because the CEO's convinced the shareholders he was going to do good. So all that said, we should come up with a list of our requests for Friedcat in a single place. That way it is easy for him to read, easy for us to track, and easy for him to respond. I have started a spreadsheet with three requests here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiOjtcD8SdisdEJ6MXcwZHdnZVV1YjhvQ1dNTnVwMUE&usp=sharingPlease keep reasonable timelines(months or years for large projects), and ensure that the request you are making is actually important- Friedcat's time as well as AM's time is on a premium right now due to the deployment and sales. |
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dont even mention that shit in connection to asicminer!! firedcat and his team are the most reputable and trustworthy people in bitcoin land. you probably have no idea whats going on here. asicminer has already paid back EVERYTHING from ipo and is just delivering massive profit after massive profit for their shareholders. share value in USD has appreciated by a factor greater than 100 since ipo. bitfountain is not selling any additional shares to the public. tell me, how the fuck can this be a scam?
LOL. I used those same arguments when defending pirate. He was highly trusted on -otc, was delivering on time every 3 days (and then every week), etc I'm not saying we shouldn't trust friedcat, AM or Bitfountain. They may be perfectly honest, but the business behind it is too murky to effectively evaluate the company. .b Then don't. The door is that way. Friedcat has been 100% honest, and every thing he has said has worked so far- Blades sold and shipped immediately, hashing power visible and going up, etc. You are demanding more transparency at the same time everyone else demands that he move faster and deploy the 50 TH/s tomorrow. Stop acting like a bunch of whiny children. There is a direct inverse correlation between the size of Friedcat's updates and the work that AM does for that week. For the last 6 weeks he gave lots of updates, and mostly not much was happening. Now everything is happening at once, and everyone who isn't whining here like you wants Friedcat to focus on deployment & manufacturing first, then communications and corporate structure. |
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Surely there has to be a way to use bitcoin itself, or the blockchain, to bid and avoid dummy bids? http://www.bitescrow.org/How about if to bid you need to get the auctioneer (one of several maybe) to set up an escrow transaction and send out a payment invite to the bidder. The bidder pays bitcoin to the escrow account, and then publishes the address and amount to the thread. The bid is deemed valid when the address hits the thread, and the bid amount can be verified by anyone. If someone is outbid, the auctioneer sends them the other half of the escrow key. For the winning bids, the escrow keys are sent to friedcat instead. No dummy bids, no welching on payments. Anyone buying to flip needs to front the bitcoin first. Sorry, wouldn't work. You overestimate the general public's willingness to learn. Also, most buyers I know do not have the coins on hand, and transfer them via Gox or otherwise after the auction. That's a shame. We have this incredible technology in our hands, and the best we can do to manage the auction is a python script that scrapes the auction page looking for something that looks like a bid, combined with a lot of manual effort by your good self and others. Welcome to the wild west days again, when people in civilized areas had cars and electricity, and people in the wild west had semi-functional guns and a wagon. (Before the railroads were completed) |
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There are 2 open polls for policy changes. Both polls have majority now. The policy changes are implemented now. - change automatic vote to "abstain" (goes into effect for the next poll)
- send 25% of donations to NASTY MINING (goes into effect for the next donation distribution)
Woohoo. Thanks for your work nonnakip! |
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Don't see it on btcguild anymore ..... not sure if it's a case of physical move, pool switching, solo mining, or ......
the blades don't support stratum (requires stratum proxy), maybe working on the firmware to support stratum natively will alleviate some of the network issue that ASICMINER faces
Yes, strange. Its back at 1.8TH. I hope no Asics are broken and only a fuse broke or something like that. Just guessing, but they were at 7.2 TH/s before the upgrade and just over 9 TH/s last I saw. 1.8TH or more is in the new location and is probably online. The old location is probably being migrated to a new pool, under maintenance, or some sort of power/internet outage. |
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Bidding is crazy. Unraveling these last moment bids is going to be hard. This should have been a 72 hour auction. Those who want to buy better bid high if they want to be sure to get one. Anything less than 51 is probably going to be a gamble.
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I pointed Jon Matonis to this thread and asked for comment, as he is a founding member of the Bitcoin Foundation Here's what he said: Satoshi was added as a courtesy It would have been more arrogant to exclude Satoshi as his designated heir to development was also a founding member. If requested to, I'm sure it wouldn't be a problem to remove. I don't think there's anything to get upset about here, just a symbolic move. Keep in mind The Bitcoin Foundation has no formal standing, it's just a joint effort by early pillars within the community to centralize some of the attention to better address it, and to help target development. They have no real power besides who their members are and what they voluntarily do (except Gavin, who is paid to develop) tl;dr: Much ado about nothing. |
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I apologize if this isn't the right place to ask, though it plays in to decision to bid. Have the first auction winners received their items (any, some or all)?
afaik all of them received it within 3-4 days All received within a week. The first of them was within 4 days. |
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Dividends... lets talk about them.
SO lets assume we mine at an average of 8th/s I think that is conservative all things considered. That gives us about 0.00706 per share. Now the auction will be done before dividends pay out, so I assume we will include that this week. John has yet to do an official tally but I am going to assume none of them will go for less then 25btc each. That's another .003125 per share.
That brings us to .010185 per share. BUT I imagine our average will be much higher then 8th, considering we are on the way to 15.. and I imagine the ASIC's will sell for much more then 25, considering previous auction at 75, BFL yet to significantly ship, and still well over half of the auction to go...
SO! Better buy up your shares before other people realize we are about to see a huge spike in dividends! If anyone has a fair number of shares they would like to sell because they think this stock is overvalued, contact me.
You are assuming of course that AM doesn't have expenses, or better yet, reinvestment like the 200Th to pay for. I'd love to see more reinvestment Friedcat! *psst* |
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I can understand all the bids; however, how are we to know if the people bidding are even able to afford them?
Meaning... I don't want to big out people that might not even have the coin to afford them. I don't want to be outbidding myself.
Also, is proof needed to show hat I have the coins available.
There were fears of this in the last thread. This has not become a problem thus far. John mentioned in the last thread that he may require a deposit from people bidding from very new accounts.
All that said; when are these units to ship? Any other information as to when payment is to be made vs ship dates, etc?
You can peruse the previous thread and watch the deliveries unfold. The first of them arrived within 4 days of the auction closing, and I believe they all arrived within a week. The delivery time on these is about as fast as it could possibly be, as every day matters for their value. |
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Trying to get the price down?
Yes I did sell my shares, and I would considering buying again at lower prices. However, I have no illusions that the rabid AM masses will let that happen at a sensible price any time soon. Mostly I'm asking the same thing I asked repeatedly before I sold: Where the f$@# is all the hashing they promised?This question should be MORE important to shareholders, so please quit trying to paint me as a manipulator. I am still an investor in bitcoin and watch many things I don't have stake in. I think at the rate AM is going, you'll be waiting for a long time for cheap shares. I'm not sure if AM will ever be cheap (0.65 BTC or less) again, once they are fully deployed, they will likely to keep mining at 30%-40% of BTC network hash rate perpetually, with re-investing of earnings into more hardware. Certainly you will not see cheap shares for this year, since AM will be 50TH in 1-2 months, no other competitor can even come close. Eventually the block halving will get it there, but that is several years out. I don't even think the next block halving will cut shares to 0.65 BTC or less, as AM will become a major hardware seller & miner by that time. So if he wants to wait 6+ years for two block halvings... sure.  |
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5@7
I think you'll find that bid is too low as the current low bid is 9 (although one is not taken at all) .b the actual purpose of this was to maybe get some clues as to how to work those babies. I'd love to buy some, actually. I believe these devices are pretty much plug-and-play. Just configure the blade with your pool name and password and that's it. No .conf files, no compiling, no tweaking (maybe just a little). For those in the last auction you had to purchase your own power supply (which isn't a PSU used in a pc). Since I had no clue what I needed to buy to get that running I never bid on those (not that I would have bid close to what they went for). I think Friedcat is limiting the price he can fetch because of the lack of technical supports as I believe much more people would bid if this was clear. And I counter that anyone bidding nearly $10,000 is going to do the legwork to understand the device. The easy miners for less-invested people are coming in the USB honeybee format. |
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IMO, until they ship, they don't exist. There are plenty of vaporware asics out there- BFL, 100TH/s mine shares, etc. |
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There's another Asicminer auction up, 5x as large as the last. While the prices last time ended up too high for Nasty to justify buying, AM might have made a mistake this time by starting the 48 hr auction on a Saturday morning.
If the prices end up lower, might be worth Nasty Mining picking up a few. Thoughts?
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The last auction is very successful, but I think starting a 48 hour auction on Sunday is a bit better. I speculate that business is a bit slow on a weekend.
Some propose splitting the shares (or the passthrough splitting the share) - in theory, it helps the liquidity; in practice, I've reservations. Just look at the bid-ask spread of Satoshi Dice, even though the stock price is "low" in absolute terms and there are gazillion shares out there. As a percent of the stock price, it's usually pretty bad even though the share price is a lot lower.
Hmm, good point. That might have been a mistake. Hopefully people will check Bitcoin news on Sunday night. |
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Could the countdown clock be added to the OP like the first auction?
Here's the countdown I believe: Timer removed. End time: 2013-04-29+14:25:32 |
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