It's sad to realize that even this forum (which should be considered a bastion of freedom) is full of systemic/globalist trojan horses trying to hijack Bitcoin's blockchain for nefarious purposes. This is unfortunately nothing new. Here's a post I made two years ago: Even on here, a bitcoin forum which is supposed to be built on the principles of not trusting third parties, we frequently see people more than happy to send their private information to complete strangers to claim some scam airdrop, and we frequently see people (even some senior members) state something along the lines of anyone that is trying to mix or otherwise obfuscate their transaction history is obviously trying to hide something illegal and should instead just let the government stick their noses in and monitor their entire bitcoin history. These kinds of opinions aren't just attacks on privacy, but they are attacks on bitcoin itself. Bitcoin was not designed to become another mass surveillance tool for the government to wield against us, and anyone proposing as much should be viewed as a malicious actor. It makes plenty of sense now that the same guy who thinks "the state should be able to monitor everything" is also a BSV shill and CSW cult member. BSV is already completely centralized and CSW and his buddies can seize any coins they want out of any wallet in existence. Oh , so cryptosize writes about me ? He's ignored , i guess he's not saying the nicest things  . I think he is a descendant of Gauloises and he thinks that the sky is falling on his head . He is a fan of every conspiracy theory and thinks that he is a prophet that has come to earth to save the ignorants . It's common for half brain monkeys ( too many in our days ) .  As for you o-e-l-e-o , i have face many times from maxis ad hominem's , while they just try to avoid reality . You tried to not answer my questions many times , so i'll give the answers myself . You claim that surveillance doesn't help while many crimes have been solved thanks to it ( private surveillance or not ) . You say that it doesn't prevent them . If these criminals aren't arrested will they commit new crimes ? So , if a criminal is arrested after a crime aren't his not yet executed crimes prevented ? Of course to understand such things you have to leave your personal beliefs on the side and it's obvious you don't do that . You aren't interested about privacy , you want a society without rules ( especially if this benefits you ) . You can't understand the most important part about bitcoin which is a ledger that shows every transaction , auditable by anyone . It's the first electronic cash system that does that , isn't that strange for a creation of a cypherpunk ? You don't understand that when everything is build on bitcoin you will be able to audit governments and authorities . You don't understand that ( most ) crime exists because it's profitable . If you make it non profitable it will almost disappear . Bitcoin is here to help you in more ways than you can imagine . If you want to learn stuff about bsv you better start reading yourself and stop learning things from influencers . As what you say about coins seized is total nonsense . Courts can do that , not anyone . It's a more improved version of what satoshi said " Imagine if gold turned to lead when stolen. If the thief gives it back, it turns to gold again." . And i'm pro bsv because i'm a man that lives in my time . I don't use my pentium and my 56kbps modem . Times move on . I guess you too have at least some Mbps line and some TB pc . 1 MB blocks are just an excuse so bitcoin never becomes adopted . Keep supporting that and lightning , after 7 years still doesn't work properly ( and it won't ) . And PLEASE , don't ever let core or the community increase the blocksize and start rejecting blocks with your rapspi's if they do . Other chains will welcome your miners ( which will happen eventually either way ) . FWIW, Bitcoin sidechain also exist where you can store such data. And by using SegWit/Taproot witness data (similar with what Ordinal does), you can store hash of multiple file into single transaction which have far higher efficiency.
Totally agree , that's what i said , sidechains aren't btc . RSK is a nice try from Sergio based on satoshi's vision about sidechains but unfortunately didn't gain the traction it deserved . |
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It varies based on the jurisdiction and the specific regulatory framework. They are not illegal everywhere.
No need to be illegal everywhere . You might get extradited in a foreign country . You don't understand that things are getting more rough , forget the far west mentality and prepare . You might don't get it but i say this for your own good . https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/66147 |
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...yes? Did you miss the slogan "Big Brother is watching you"? Did you miss the Thought Police? How do you propose The Party manages to prohibit specific books, specific speech, and specific thought, if it isn't conducting mass surveillance? Your assertion that "the state should be able to monitor everything" is the first step on the road to 1984.
What you fail to understand is that big brother is loved by the masses . Did you wonder why ? The biggest weapon is not that there are cameras everywhere but that each one betrays each other . Your narratives don't let you see the most important slogan of the book which is "who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past." ( have you thought that bitcoin as a timestamp machine solves this ? ) . What about "ignorance is strength" ? We see that today in the bitcoin community , which was one of the brightest communities years back but it has become a pack of laser eyed maxis with no understanding of the philosophy behind the technology that they only interested to pump their bags and buy lambos . Because I've committed no crimes. Which is all the more reason the state has no right to surveil every aspect of my life.
But you said some posts above The fact is if this data is gathered, it will be used against you, regardless of whether you have committed any crimes.
You contradict yourself , seems that you do not have a settled opinion . So , with all the data they have so far about you and the assertion that the state is bad why are you not in jail ? Or me ? Is it because we have committed no crimes or they forgot us ? People taking out their phones to film a specific event is completely different to blanket mass surveillance at all times. And no, as I've shared previously in this thread, there is zero evidence that mass surveillance prevents crimes, and even the NSA admit that.
For once more , crimes are not only terrorist attacks (you still didn't answer if you think that boston marathon bombers would continue if they weren't identified ) . Rapes , burglaries , killings , traffic accidents and much much more have been solved due to camera surveillance , private or not . So i'll ask : Is camera surveillance ( without a label like private or state ) needed ? We don't. But either you accept that blockchain analysis is bullshit and therefore all their claims should be completely dismissed and ignored, or you believe they are completely accurate in which case you must also accept that the vast majority of mixer use is perfectly legitimate, as they themselves claim.
You propose Black&White but i prefer Jack Daniels  Mixers are propaganda. We've heard that; this board never stops entertaining me. I'm genuinely curious how you interpreted mixing coins as exploiting anything at all. Do you mind providing a little more context?
Mixers are propaganda ? Huh ? Are you on drugs dude ? Do you want to read again what i wrote ? Propaganda definition : information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote a political cause or point of view . You are promoting mixer services , which are not legal . If they were legal none of the mixers owners would be behind bars , right ? Do you explain somewhere that these services are based solely on trust and are targets of financial crime services and any use of those could potentially lead to loss of funds or even legal problems in the future ? I can't find any . So , you are using propaganda ( look at the definition again ) , as you are biased and have personal gain . Is it so hard to get it ? Pardon, but what the actual fuck? What the hell is your point? Do you actually think they don't have much data to put people behind the bars? And are you using my absence from jail as a basis to argue their lack of concern for me? What kind of twisted reasoning is this...
My reasoning is twisted , you are so funny . Didn't expect something different from you to be honest . Do you know what Occam's razor is ? Better start using it from time to time . That still won't work in massive scale with blocks of max 12k transactions ( if all of them are segwit ) per 10 minutes . I agree that other chains can and will create such services in the future . But for sure btc won't/can't do it . |
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That's a first step , but with blocksize of 1MB and such fees not much can be created on BTC in massive scale . I can't disagree more. This is a crazy position. Imaging wanting to live in 1984!?
Is that what you got from reading the book? Seems that i got different things from it . In 1984 Orwell talks about the power of propaganda (something like what we see in bitcointalk that mixers are a tool to enhance privacy ) and the power to change history at will . He talks about the power a party gained by prohibiting books and writings and how the corruption of language takes away from society the right thinking. He talks about the destruction of the family institution . If you haven't read it, I would recommend it , so that you can escape from the fairy tale of surveillance promoted by the leftist's camp. If you think of it he describes Stalin's state at that time perfectly . Right, because there has never once been a single case of data being leaked, hacked, or used inappropriately? The fact is if this data is gathered, it will be used against you, regardless of whether you have committed any crimes.
Why am i not in jail right now ? Why aren't you in too ? Haven't they got much of our data for some years/decades ? Videos from businesses and individuals, not from government surveillance cameras.
So , you are pro private surveillance and only against surveillance from gov's ? What's the difference , as authorities have access to that material ? I really don't understand your arguments . Do we agree that surveillance helps solving crimes or not ? And something i din't notice earlier . The final version of the internal Chainalysis study cited by Hanna Curtis in the webinar “Cryptocurrency Typologies: What You Should Know About Who’s Who on the Blockchains” which concluded that roughly 90% of the funds sent through mixers were done so for legal personal privacy reasons. So even Chainalysis admit that the vast majority of mixer user is entirely legitimate and from regular users who just want to protect their privacy. If chainanalysis is a scam service how do we know this is true ? Maybe they got the results totally wrong . |
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Then we fundamentally disagree. The state does not have the right to constantly monitor its entire population "just in case".
The state should be able to to monitor everything . These data should be encrypted and only be viewable in crime cases . Courts and no one else should provide the keys to be able to decrypt the data . These are things that we will see in the future if blockchains stop being used only as a economic instrument . Bitcoin is a timestamp machine and has many more uses than we have ever imagined . Because that is an impossible fantasy. Any and all data collected under already existing surveillance programs is used by the government for literally any purpose they want, including being sold to third parties and shared with foreign governments, and there is nothing you can do about it.
That's an impossible fantasy because we only tell people that bitcoin is the quick rich vehicle . And everyone that says that bitcoin is much more than that is considered a looney . Show me evidence that mass surveillance has prevented a single terrorist attack. There is none.I can point you to thousands of crimes that solved with surveillance cameras . Murders , abductions , burglaries and much more . As for the terrorist attacks let's consider the Boston marathon bombers . These guys were caught by examination of the videos . Do you think they would continue to strike if weren't caught ? That's just an example , just to show that even in terrorist attacks surveillance is necessary and it might not prevent the first attack but gives a high chance there won't be another one by the same people . And there's a high chance that by recognizing them it's possible to find more persons that belong to that core and possibly prevent other attacks . And I, and many others, don't want random blockchain analysis companies, centralized exchanges, governments, and so forth, spying on all our bitcoin transactions, holdings, addresses, and wallets. And so we use privacy enhancing tools.
That's your right , just don't act as a cry baby in case things go the bad way . |
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Are new owners criminals now?
Criminals no , idiots for using a tumbler/mixer by providing exit liquidity to criminals yes . Why are you finding it so difficult to accept the fact that I may not want to reveal my financial activity to literally the public?
Because first of all the public gives a shit about your financial activity , same as mine . Because it's difficult (not impossible) for the public to connect me with all my accounts and aliases as i respect my privacy . Because i am not a target for the public ( probably you too ) . And many many other things .
It is quite clear they were using data from other sources to identify the server in question.
Data from the server was what led to the arrest of individuals, not blockchain analysis.
Were they customers of that "service" if they were paying ? Does blockchain provide a proof of economic activity ? Was that proof another nail in their coffin ? These individuals can rot in hell. However, that still doesn't give the state the right to constantly surveil all its citizens.
I'm glad we're on the same side about those scumbags . As for the constant surveillance , i'm on the side who believes that cameras should be anywhere . The problem is that there's still no framework for these data to be handled "only" by authorities just in cases that a crime is committed . Imagine a world where you would know that if you commit a crime you are almost 100% busted . Would you commit that crime ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlT5SdLeXtMNo offense meant, but "nothing to fear, nothing to hide" is a monumentally stupid argument. If you truly have nothing to hide, I'm sure you'll have no issue whatsoever sharing with me your real name, address, phone number, email address, bank statements, all your bitcoin addresses, all your WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal/etc. conversations, your internet browsing history, and the login details for all your social media accounts. I just want to have a good look around and publicly post anything I find interesting. After all, you've got nothing to hide, right!?
Not a stupid argument , just an argument that doesn't fit your narratives . Believe me , there are people that know many / most / all of the things you mention about me . You are not in my circle that has the right to know detailed info .That's what privacy is . You share things that you want with those you want . On the other hand anonymity tries to hide anything from anyone . I like privacy , i dislike anonymity . |
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Blockchain analysis is a scam.
If chain analysis is a scam how do you explain cases like https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/south-korean-national-and-hundreds-others-charged-worldwide-takedown-largest-darknet-child ? Those who got charged do you think were innocent and the deep bad state just decided to flip a coin and charge random people ? I agree that someone can't be 100% certain all the time but there were cases that chain analysis led to child porn rings , especially in cases where the users were ignorant about how blockchains work . As for the mixers , it's sad to see many people here claim that mixers is a tool to protect privacy , that kind of users that have nothing illegal to hide are just providing exit liquidity to criminals . As a proverb says "when you pee in the sea you will find it in the salt" . |
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Hey,
I read a tweet from someone that said, a BTC tail emmision could be done as soft fork. I have some technically experiance in blockchain so..... the main reward scheme could of course only be changed by hard fork.
But as after Segwit and so on some more things are possible with BTC Script. For example LN gets BTC to one place to another without trust of the main chain
So may there be the possibltly that some kind of extra reward can be send by the Algo to the miners by Scrypt or anything else with only a soft fork?
Please technical informative replies only!
Thanks
Peter Todd says it's possible to change almost anything even if difficult https://petertodd.org/2016/forced-soft-forks |
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Those promised dividends from the QORT mining have never made it to my wallet. Where are they? I have one of the original accounts from QORA and you promised everyone with an account who transferred over to QORT would get dividends for staying with the project. Are you running a node ? I've been running a node since the launch of qortal and getting my rewards so far , even if they are far less at some point than what was originally proposed . |
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What do you mean by that? Routing failures or something else? Routing failures is one of a kind. It's been 7 years and the failures in transaction finality are very apparent. From my experience, one channel is just not enough, even with the most reliant and well connected node. And I'm not talking about high-value transactions, barely the minimum ($1-$30). But if only that was the only problem. To retain self-custody, you still need to run a full node 24/7, or have an Electrum-like lightning wallet, with watchtowers. And then other problems like backing up in an easy, non-digital way. Ultimately, there isn't lots of development.  |
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My bad , by miners i mean mining nodes/pools .
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There has to be a way of collectively voting for a change without giving absolutely every voting power to the miners, isn't there?
Nope , there isn't . Imagine voting in a country that has no electoral catalogues and anyone could vote as many times he want , could you ever have a valid election ? That's a problem that anonymity causes , to have a valid/honest result you would need known entities . That's why miners are the best choice . They are known and you can see if you agree or disagree with their choice . The economic incentive will drive them to decide the best for the network or they will lose clients and profit . |
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And to pose a question like the one you said about blocksize , what's the optimal amount for nodes to make a network decentralised ? Is it 10's , is it 100's , is it millions ? And i'd like to see the arguments on your thesis .
And a reply on this , so i can respond in summary later ? |
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Wonderful. Only pools can get to tell if an entry is fake or not. Completely decentralized and trustless, as envisioned.  At the beggining the vast majority was mining nodes . It was the only time that bitcoin was decentralised by your definition , thousands for nodes . The consensus is bitcoin is called proof of work , not proof of most nodes . And to pose a question like the one you said about blocksize , what's the optimal amount for nodes to make a network decentralised ? Is it 10's , is it 100's , is it millions ? And i'd like to see the arguments on your thesis . Pools are the only entities that add transactions into a block , so there can't be any fake entries into a solved block . How many blocks have you added to the chain with your node ? How many blocks with fake transactions have you find ? If it's at least one than yes , i'm wrong and you're right . So , by you logic , why the merkle tree is needed ? If i have all the blocks , merkle tree is almost useless , right ? if so , let's disable them , core is very good at disabling parts that thinks are useless . The creators thought of how things should be done isn't ideal , that's nice . As for the arguments of the post you shared , these are complete BS . Initial blocksize was 32 MB and there was a reason at the time that 1MB was imposed . Every participant of the Bitcoin network contributes to decision-making processes. Some with authority (miners), others with technical competence (developers) and the rest of the users through running software, doing governance proposals, expressing their preferences and concerns, and of course being stakeholders.
By decision making i mean what transactions will be added into a block and keep building the chain . It happened. Read about SPV mining, where mining pools started to mine blocks, without validating them, and how they lost their money, because there were enough full nodes to notice that they are building blocks on top of the invalid chain. And imagine that if we would have a lot of nodes blindly trusting the UTXO set, then it could stay unnoticed, and get deeply confirmed. Also, there are cases, where pools lost their reward, because of things like sigops limit. By having only UTXO set, you cannot check such things, because then you don't have access to all scripts, you only know that some UTXOs should be changed to some other UTXOs. What you mention only affects a mining pool that decided to lose their reward , otherwise we would be still following that fork . To achieve a consensus in pool level the majority of honest pools decide if a block is valid or invalid , following the rules . If someone decided to just waste energy to propagate an invalid block that was rejected from the start at pool level , than good for him . Anyone can decide in what way can spend his money . You have to understand that pools are interconnected , it is crucial for pools to have the new block as fast as possible to work on it for the next block . That block was rejected instantly from pools , even if it was still propagated to other non mining nodes who thought that they did find an invalid block . Think about it and you'll see that what "full nodes" saw had nothing to do with what pools decided from the begining . Pools are the entities that have the most economic interest to be honest . Pools that try to trick the system get their blocks rejected at pool level , so they are just burning money . |
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Then you can easily mine a block with fake commitment, for example: Dave 4.00 BTC
Elaine 5.00 BTC
Frank 6.00 BTC It is exactly the same problem as putting a fake sidechain commitment, and withdrawing coins from a sidechain to different addresses. you'll probably say "for verification". verfication of what? If you don't know the history, and you only know the UTXO set, then you don't know if "Dave 4.00 BTC" entry is fake or not. You have to locate that entry in some previous block, and validate it. Also, as you cannot trust the previous block either, you have to go to the previous block of the previous block. And by going recursively, you will end up in a situation, where to be 100% sure that all UTXOs are real, you have to verify everything from the Genesis Block. Easily mine , how easy to say and how hard to do . Each pool can check the hash and find out that the fake entry is invalid , and these transactions will get rejected instantly . If what you say could happen , bitcoin was broken since the start . That's why the merkle tree exists , so that you can confirm if a transaction is valid even without having the entire blockchain .
But how the whole system is actually designed shows that it's not just a network for "peer to peer electronic cash" is it?
The system is designed to have electronic peer to peer cash into a visible ledger by using PoW consensus to prevent double spend . What other design do you think bitcoin has ? I'd really like to know what else do you see .
Have you truly tried to understand how the protocol works and what its implications are? It's not a decentralized PayPal, that I can tell you. It's much much more.
Maybe i haven't , can you point me of what the implications are ? I like socratic dialogues , but i have to warn you that to have such a dialogue we both need to have an open mind and a great understanding of how things work . Do you remember that ip to ip transactions were implemented in the original design that was later removed ? Mike Hearn makes a point , that things could be reinstated at some later point https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=9334.msg134801#msg134801 .
Define me the ideal block size, and tell me the reasoning behind it.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1347.msg15366#msg15366"It can be phased in, like: if (blocknumber > 115000) maxblocksize = largerlimit It can start being in versions way ahead, so by the time it reaches that block number and goes into effect, the older versions that don't have it are already obsolete. When we're near the cutoff block number, I can put an alert to old versions to make sure they know they have to upgrade." Except that I never argued we can reach global adoption with solely lightning. It's you who's complaining and proposing to increase the block size. And I'm telling you the obvious: we either go full-VISA-data-center, or we figure out something smarter, with more respect to decentralization, security and privacy. And as the Bitcoin development and history are concerned, we're heading towards the latter.
You might have a wrong impression of what decentralisation is . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decentralization"Decentralization or decentralisation is the process by which the activities of an organization, particularly those regarding planning and decision-making, are distributed or delegated away from a central, authoritative location or group and given to smaller factions within it." "Full nodes" have nothing to do with decision making . "Planning" in bitcoin is the dev team . "Decision making" is the mining nodes . So , not in any way your node plays a part in bitcoin decentralisation . It's like saying that apple is a decentralised structure because shares are distributed amongst investors . I see that the topic is derailed so i'll stop here . |
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I don't think everyone has the same definition, opinion or understanding of Bitcoin. Bitcoin for some people, and the way it's designed, is a kind of tool that can weaken and break down political strongholds, not a tool for personal finance like PayPal.
If i'm not mistaken the whitepaper mentions bitcoin as a peer to peer electronic cash . And how have you come up to the conclusion that bitcoin can weaken and breakdown political strongholds ? By buying senators like Max Keiser said ? That's what bitcoin has become ? A means to create another caste to rule the world ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Bh3ObPjcFE&t=52sI think that you are the one that have a different definition and understanding of what bitcoin is . Try read the whitepaper to understand why bitcoin was invented . I'd like you to point me to any post that satoshi makes such a political statement . |
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it's not free to make an inscription. they do have to pay Only if that transaction is broadcasted in P2P way to other nodes. In case of almost 4 MB transaction that started Ordinals, it was mined by Luxor. One pool with sufficient hashrate is enough to make the chain bigger. Attackers could reach 1% of the hashrate, and then they can put a lot of inscriptions for free every 100 blocks. 1% of total hashrate to acquire would cost close to 150 million $ ( i did some calculations in the past and at that time the infrastructure had a cost of 16 billion ) , not to mention the power cost which is a nice amount . So , these transactions will not be free for them , even if they push them with zero fee . |
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I don't think it's a lost wallet that was recovered because the address has been constantly receiving a monthly reward of 0.0000547BTC. If it were other tokens I would have probably thought that the owner staked it in a kind of staking program that generates reward and when the time has elapsed, he/she decided to withdraw it to a different address.
These transactions are not from staking ( coins are not on an exchange ) , they are dusting attacks https://coinloan.io/blog/how-dangerous-is-crypto-dusting-attack/ . That 547 satoshi is a common used amount for this kind of attack . And then we will speculated if it is Satoshi where in fact we know that he is not coming back?
How do you know that satoshi isn't coming back ? Do you have direct communication with him ? Do you know something that you should share with us ? Was there even a way to buy Bitcoin over the counter at that time?
There was always a way to buy OTC . Someone could have posted an offer for selling his mined btc and a buyer took it . The first transaction of the whole batch was made in 2013 , so it could be an otc buyer . As for the comments i saw about why investigating , bitcoin is pro anonymity etc . This is a public ledger , that's what makes bitcoin different and that's why it was invented . Anyone can see what's going on onchain . Your privacy is protected by the protocol , but you can't be anonymous . For me it's an important thing if satoshi comes back and move his coins . It would mean that a bag of 1M+ coins will flood the market . Such a move could send btc to low prices , if not close to zero . If you guys don't understand the value of having the information firsthand then i feel sorry for you . |
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