Total time logged in: 5 days, 17 hours and 22 minutes. Far too long!  |
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Nice story!  I have sold bitcoins a few times on a face to face basis, and its always at McD! The issue of getting cash out of an ATM is a big problem which is just getting bigger - the most I think you can get out of a UK one is usually about £500 in the nicer parts of the country. Its great to hear a nice story about bitcoin which doesn't end badly! Maybe this could become a trend? |
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I find looking at the way words are spent gives me a good idea where they are from - so even without understanding the word, I have an idea where its from. Before finishing reading the post above, I thought it was Eastern European, but I couldn't have said which country it was from. I have learnt a little Polish, (hello goodbye etc) seeing that most of Poland has or is moving to the UK! I find it a very interesting language although I find the food even better! |
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you've got it wrong! Saying it doesn't make it true.. how apt then your reply. Guess humour isn't universal! I find a big problem with your thinking - its purely based on a very limited specification in a very small window. I agree that BTC and PPC are cool coins, however, LTC is also cool for the same reason. Even FTC has something to say and suddenly we are up to 4 coins! The problem is that you are looking for an ideal, and the world doesn't work like that. Different coins are focused on different problems, and each will be great at their speciality. Eventually, we will find some which are good at a number of different things, and they will become more popular, and eventually, we will have 7 or 10 or 35 different coins with enough of a user base to be considered mainstream. Maybe only BTC and PPC will be used by loads of people everywhere, but I very much doubt its going to be that clear cut! Its expecting that only 2 coins which have already been developed will make it all the way through to mainstream adoption, regardless of future developments, where you got it wrong! |
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I find that we often talk here as if bitcoin has already achieved mass adoption. It hasn't. We are a very long way from that. The new money coming in -- how long it will sustain we will see -- IMO is not from bitcoin users, but by and large from speculators. That is not sustainable.
This is the key to everything - bitcoin is not mainstream, and when I talk to 'plain folk' / muggles / real people etc nobody knows what a bitcoin is, or why they would want one! We are still looking at the internet circa 1993, but we don't have a friendly media helping us push a vision of Money 2.0 on to a apathetic public. Rather than talk about a bitcoin being worth billions per coin as a sign of success, its time to start spending to get the message out there. If you want to limit regulations, we need to demonstrate that bitcoins is more about pizza than paying for drugs and human traffic! Its far more difficult to limit people using their own currency if all they are doing is buying sensible stuff from people who are honest traders. Maybe its time to start finding bitcoin users in Africa and show the world what free trade actually looks like? |
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you've got it wrong! |
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Markets decide what something is worth - which is why so many of my alt coins are currently worth practically nothing!
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Liquidity and convertability are the largest part of Bitcoin's value. It's not a consumption good that people would need. Therefore, making Bitcoins harder to attain decreases their value. Do you really think that if MtGox went poof, prices would increase in the OTC market?  I would argue there are many markets around the world that do not have the economic infrastructure the US has, as corrupt as it is, which need a monetary system. Bitcoin, with all of its well-known capabilities, fits this niche nicely, and as such would increase in demand regardless of US intervention. As for the OP, I take from her post the following points: Labeling something illegal does not reduce demand, it only causes demand to mask itself. Government regulation has a history of harming, rather than benefitting, economic markets; and as such can be expected to act in kind regarding bitcoin. Revolutionary technologies have a way of proliferating regardless of oppression. That and the amazing amount of people on this forum who lack critical thinking skills. This is very much based on your list of illegal stuff. If you go down that list to the boring stuff, the rule that government intervention increases demand isn't true. 60w light bulbs were made illegal in the EU a few years ago - we must now use low energy light bulbs which cost 10 times as much. But there are no dodgy light bulb salesmen hiding in doorways trying to sell me illegal light bulbs. Leaded petrol (gasoline) was made illegal 20 years ago, yet, there was never a demand for this old fuel from hardcore drivers, not happy with the alternative. Even cigarettes which are being made more and more illegal through harder ways to buy them is also suffering from a lowering of demand. Latest usage figures are touching 20% of the population, down from 50% 40 years ago. Its only when the item being made illegal doesn't have an alternative which is good enough for the public that government's find that there is a black market formed. And in bitcoins case, I don't think that is going to happen. While its cool to be able to use bitcoins to cut out government, I don't know how big a market there is for that exclusive use - I don't think its so big that people are willing to go against big government to get their hit! Although I could be wrong |
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I read a comparison of bitcoin with online gambling, and how the US killed that market on its shores. I am finding it far more difficult to turn my fiat into bitcoins, and while that does mean I was protected from the last crash, its not the best way of trying to use a currency!
I have an idea that whatever you might read in documentation and press releases, the governments of the world have a different agenda for bitcoin until it finds a way to have control of this new technology.
My guess is that will will eventually get a visacoin and a mastercoin, all based on the works of Satoshi and this forum. That will only happen when the government are happy with whatever regulations they put in place.
But I seriously doubt they will be involving us in that discussion!
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I've been playing http://coinbomb.com/ for the last few days - its a really cool mix of bitcoin trading, gambling and social media - and its a really clever way to introduce bitcoins to the general public. Before anyone starts thinking its just a piece of self publicity - it isn't - I had nothing to do with it, I've just been playing it. It just strikes me that games are the great way to introduce ideas to people in a way that isn't threatening - and that is exactly what bitcoin needs. What do you think? Is coinbomb.com the answer we have been looking for to take bitcoin to the next stage, or is it missing something? Would love your feedback! |
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I think the celebs to go after are the big environmental/climate change supporters.
Yeah, because we use a shitload of electricity to mine them, very environmental friendly  And a pet dog has a bigger carbon footprint than a 4x4! For celebrities, image is everything, leave the facts at home! |
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This has been one of the most thoughtful threads on here for a while and we do have a dilemma, which can't really be fixed. My opinion is that you don't want to put your head in the sand, because things will happen without us. However, as the regulations on the Internet has shown, its a never ending battle of not having too many rules, as regulators love to create new ones, rather than use the ones they have more creatively! In the long term, all the wonderful elements of bitcoin, the Rand ideal of total freedom, will disappear. It will be exactly how posting what you like on the Internet went from 'What copyright?' to 'Desist and remove notices' in only 10 years. We are in a wonderful position at the moment to be able to guide the direction of regulations, and I would agree that Bitcoin the protocol, should be left alone. If we help by creating a best practice approach to exchanges, and other areas where fiat and Bitcoin mix, then we will prevent a more hard nosed approach to the rest of what bitcoin is about for the forseeable future. Maybe the answer is to use bitcoin as the public face of crypto currency, and as the whole idea matures, the freedom element is taken by some new altcoin, much like TOR is the internet for the minority who demand privacy. But don't expect these coins to ever be worth a fraction of a bitcoin! |
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The way things are going for MTGox, its more likely that Litecoin is going to be better off elsewhere! There has been a lot of interesting movements with exchanges over the past few weeks, and if MTGox don't do something soon, they are going to just lose their privileged place in the bitcoin universe. I'm already using a collection of other exchanges and haven't visited MTGox for days Here is a tip, check out Bter.com - that is where the next growth is going to be, the Chinese market, and they not only support LTC, but FTC, FRC and PPC - the world keeps moving! |
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Welcome to development! All these alt coins are offering something new in one way or another.
It might just be a new name, or a new ay of doing everything, but the point is that the more new coins there are, the more likely it is that we hit magic, and find a coin that is ideal for main stream adoption!
I really do think that the best model to give some forecasting on what might happen is to look at how Linux developed. We started with a concept, then we got distributions, then we got new types of distros, and eventually, we end up with a distro that was supported by a company with a marketing department. Ubuntu introduced ease of use, and suddenly it really took off.
Google then developed Android, and a new platform, and even more ease of use. Now its the biggest market share for mobiles and tablets, and all this started in 1991!
Bitcoin brought us the blockchain, and a mining process. Litecoin brought us a different way to do mining as well as speeding up the process - all in less than 5 years. Imagine what we will have in another 15 years?
Its only going to be possible with new alt coins
Welcome to development!
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a POA is to prove that you live somewhere - and the 3 month time constraint is to prove you lived there recently.
In the UK, a Gypsy would have documentation addressed to their current site, such as council tax documentation so they would be able to provide a POA.
Mobile phone bills are available in paper form, even if you do have to pay for them, and would be suitable for most organisations.
Alternatively, a driving licence would also work.
Of course, if you are looking to buy bitcoins, you don't need to use any of the original services mentioned - just visit localbitcoins and pay with cash.
Problem solved!
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This is brilliant - a coin that is addressing a real problem and a sensible solution to one of the big problems that makes it difficult to get a coin adopted once its in the wild.
As for the name, how about looking at the best source of computer names in the known world, Monty Python?
In the Life of Brian, there was a market scene where Brian had to haggle with a market trader, and their currency was the Shekel.
Why not have a Metashekel for this new currency?
Meta being data, and Shekel being currency.
A single unit would therefore be a Shekelbit, and Shekelbyte for a quarter of a Metashekel?
I've not bought the domain name yet, because that would be unethical, however, I do think its a good name - Any feedback?
Edit: just spotted that the Shekel is the current currency of Israel, which I guess is a problem for a bunch of people on here! Oh well, back to the drawing board!
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Let me ask you a question.
What stops someone from putting a bullet in your head and stealing all your stuff?
The answer is regulations.
I have been posed this question numerous times and have thus had much incentive to think about it a lot. And my answer(s) differ from your answer. Please consider: I came to the conclusion that what stops people from stealing from me/putting a bullet in my head can be summarized in 3 points: 1. people have little reason to randomly kill me. I admit that they can have reasons to steal from me, though. 2. What stops them from stealing my stuff even when they have reasons to do so is FEAR of retribution. This is the crucial point imo. Right now this fear of retribution manifests itself as fear of getting arrested, sentenced, fined and put into jail by the authorities. This is where we fail massively as a society I think, but I won't go into detail on why I think it's not a good idea to relegate responsibilities for the most crucial parts of your life (such as protection of your property, your education, health care, retirement etc.) to a monopolistic central authority. I'm certain you can find some arguments for why that might be the case. Fear of retribution can also take the form of the belief that if found stealing my stuff, he'll get shot in the face (by me) or found out and otherwise punished by my friends or some people/organization I paid for protecting my stuff. Ultimately we don't need regulation for this, but this is what we use as of now. 3. Finally please have some trust in people. Let me ask YOU a question: is regulation the only thing stopping you from stealing other peoples stuff and shooting them in the face? Or is it just there to protect YOU against those OTHER people, who might want to do that. Who told you people are like that? Oh yes, might have been the same people, who are regulating you to keep you safe But my question still stands. In the end I'm just allergic to central power, I heard it's a chronic condition, feel free to ignore me I like your thoughtful answer, so I will give you an alternative viewpoint. Please remember that while I also hate regulations, I am very aware that there is no way you can stop it happening, it would just be nice to be on the winning side for once! You notice that there is very little to stop someone from shooting you in the head except regulations! The FEAR of retributions is the other side of regulations. If you break them, either by laundering bitcoins, or by shooting someone dead, its the fear of of enforcement of regulations that make regulations work. You ask what stops me from shooting people in the head? This is where it gets difficult because you are asking someone, with a similar moral compass to you. I wouldn't go and do something like that because its morally wrong. For 70% of the population, this is the only answer you will get. However, that last 30% is the problem. We might like to think they are all the criminals in prisons, but its not actually true. Most of them are the psychopaths who have never been outed. They run companies, they are your managers, the people who would say anything to get ahead. Without regulations, there are no retributions, and without retributions, there are no reasons not to do what it takes to get what you want. Why do you think bitcoin keeps getting DDos'ed? Why do the coins keeps getting pumped and dumped? Because there are no rules saying you can't do it. It does feel infantile to have rules stating the obvious to stop us hurting ourselves, and that is when regulations are done badly. However, a few well written rules help everyone. The question is, who is the best people to write those rules? Us! |
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Let me ask you a question.
What stops someone from putting a bullet in your head and stealing all your stuff?
The answer is regulations.
This is not right. The answer is The Law. One depends on an immutable understanding between human beings. The other is political. And what is the law? Just a set of regulations that we all agree to live by as the cost of being a part of society. If you don't agree, you are kidnapped and held against your will until common opinion says you have learnt your lesson. Sometimes, in some places, they kidnap you and kill you. I think that may be Texas! |
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To nwbitcoin:
I'm not an ideological Bitcoin user but a logical Bitcoin user. My understanding of your argument is that we will lose if we don't follow laws and regulation. The only loss i see is that 1BTC won't go up in value as quickly as if we stayed legit and connected with big businesses. But then why would you want to use Bitcoin? You're still a part of the system that Bitcoin was made to counter. I understand that some people only entered Bitcoin to get rich quick but for me it goes much deeper than this. Bitcoin in it's current state is unstopable. We can make an alternative economy and compete with todays economy which would force, for example, banks to offer better service. People that are tired of the regulated world economy which is regulated just so rich can stay rich and poor are forced to keep being poor can just leave and enter the free market of Bitcoin. I don't hate todays economy but we are facing problems that naturally come with monopolies and we need competition. Something that todays technologies like the internet and p2p can offer. My thoughts about Bitcoin has always been that you shouldn't get rich by HOLDING bitcoins. You should USE this wonderful technology to make money because it makes it much easier without the regulations of the elite made by them for you so they can keep their power.
To proudhon:
This is what scares me. Just like you and me, they know that they can't regulate Bitcoin in its current state. That is why the talk about confiscating tainted bitcoins makes me believe that they are planning to either fork Bitcoin or start a central banking type service. They probably will do it with the excuse that it is required to invite big businesses and then everybody will become rich. And most will probably agree because they want their BTC to rise in value. It shocks me that people remain calm when head devs make suggestions like these. Soon Bitcoin will be the same as fiat or gold. Regulated and manipulated by the banks and the government will keep track of everything you do.
I totally agree with your ideological reasons for using bitcoin, and the sooner we can buy and sell stuff with it, the better - however reality is what actually happens, rather than what you'd like to happen! People always speculate with new stuff, its human nature - and the big problem for bitcoin at the moment is that there is very little else you can do with it! As for your argument for the regulations not increasing the value of bitcoin, you are missing the reality of the situation. What if the free market decide, after its got bored of speculating, that without regulation bitcoin becomes valueless? Of, more likely, the value of bitcoin drops to nothing as the alternative coins which are willing to play ball go up in value? Regulations don't mean centralisation, it means playing by the rules. It means more stabilisation, it means big business has a far lower risk to deal with, which means higher valuations. However, I don't really need to justify any of my thoughts because the final bit of this situation is that its going to happen anyway - regardless of what we think. You might as well be ready for it! |
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