I suppose with ones less fork coin to look forward to, some are now putting more eggs into the Bitcoin Cash basket. Bitcoin Classic just became the latest casualty of Segwit2x's suspension: https://bitcoinclassic.com/news/closing.html. Not that I think many of the "next billion people" will rush to BCH and call it Bitcoin in the maximum time of six months Tom Zander feels it'll take. I will pity the folks using Bitcoin Classic wallets who'll suddenly fight out one day they're no longer in control of their Bitcoins. Interesting point that you make. I don't track BCH prices and just mine BTC blindly. But I'm not to concern about the drop in price since it's going to be huge! A 35% difficulty reduction even at $6800 will be mean I'm mining and making $9180 in today's value. We can go all the way back to $4500 before I would start to show any concern.
I've been psychologically at $4k for a long time now, so I won't be bothered either by any drop above that. |
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Don't bother trying to find out which exchange is the best, just find the one that works for you. The big names mentioned here have a peculiar notoriety for changing the rules when it suits them. In other words, your funds are not secure one way or other if you trust these centralised exchanges. I still use them for convenience and liquidity, but am moving farther and farther away as decentralised exchanges mature.
Their main challenge is still liquidity, Counterparty is horrible for example, but I see hope for dexs like Waves who are almost achieving 1% of volume for pairs like ETH/BTC and ZEC/BTC (and dare I say, even BCC/BTC). But once that is solved, and people get on board, you're going to wonder why people ever trusted centralised exchanges in the first place.
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I notice that the price at a localbitcoin sit is much higher than online price. Is it more expensive to buy bitcoin from localbitcoin sit than to buy bitcoin with credit card?
It depends on your jurisdiction, as that will affect which credit cards (if any) are accepted. For me, it costs 4% to buy via credit card, which I think is crazy, but for some people it's totally acceptable. In my locality, high volume cash sellers (the few that still exist) are charging 2-6%. But I generally wait for someone to take my offer at 0-2% profit. I also have some old contacts who often need liquidity and will pay spot price so they can keep charging a mark-up to the newbies. If you are in the US, I would ACH transfer to Coinbase (free) and transfer to GDAX and buy via limit order (free). If in Europe, I'd probably go with Bitstamp and use SEPA. You might consider putting up your own offers on LocalBitcoins, too. Also correct, in fact the rates I just mentioned are from online traders (who would then have to complete trades via escrow). They have much, much higher rates for other offline methods (cash deposits, face-to-face) but I prefer to stay away as I don't really want to take the risk of getting robbed or scammed - not that all of them there are scammers! There are also others I know of - high volume cash sellers like you mention - who operate via Telegram/IM but with these, you again have to trust that things will happen quickly and they always require you pay first. And, yes, if you want to buy big volume, put up your own trade at the rate you like. There's bound to be offers. |
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Good for Croatia, they have a sweet team and i would like to see Modric, Rakitic, and Mandzukic in the next world cup.
Switzerland scored a goal thanks to the unbelievable call from the ref, that was not a penalty. Yes, Switzerland deserved the win, but not like this. And poor performance from Northern Ireland, they didn't have a single shot on target.
And i'm looking forward to the Sweden-Italy match tomorrow. Italy are the big favorites, but the fact that they are playing in the playoff says a lot about the team, and let's not forget that Sweden beat France in the same stadium back in June.
There goes Greece's dream to qualify and progress in the World Cup the way they did in Euros before: defend like Spartans and reach penalties (I'm not sure I'm even joking anymore) but indeed, we would all welcome any team that has Modric weaving his wand. Reminds me of good old Tottenham Hotspurs days... Switzerland more or less deserved the win, but I think N Ireland just as equally deserved the draw. Going to be hard for them to score across the sea but let's see. I still think one of the Irish teams should go through. Italy had better go through tomorrow! No Zlatan, no excuse. |
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I'm a little surprised to read from the answers here that it's more expensive to buy Bitcoins using localbitcoins, since my own personal experience is very much different. I buy from one specific country (Malaysia) and effectively one region (EU, via SEPA, so traders are located all over Europe where SEPA applies). Both are bank transfer transactions, so it varies from instant (in Malaysia) to 0-2 days approx with SEPA, depending on bank.
For example, right now, I can get Bitcoin at EUR 6,277 at LBC ($7,302) or MYR 31, 435 ($7,500), so currently, traders in EU are selling it cheaper than Malaysians (it is always slightly different at times of day).
If I were to buy Bitcoin from Bitcoin.com with a credit card, it now costs $7,317. On top of that, 2.5% Bitcoin.com fees plus credit card fee 5%, that's $7,865.
Coinbase price looks very attractive at $7,190 but after credit card fee: 3.99% = $7,476.
Big difference to me. P2P of course still want to make profit, but significantly less than cc fees.
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You'll need to provide a little more detail than that if you want assistance...
However, Bitcoin transactions are irreversible - the only way to get your coins back is if the receiver spends the coins back to you. In your case, if you've already sent deposits twice to the exchange (I'm assuming that's what you mean by resending money), you'll just have to request a withdrawal from the exchange for the amount you want back. It's highly unlikely any exchange returns funds to users. To my understanding, even if you send amounts below their minimum deposits, you won't get it back without intervention (with customer support).
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it just arrived while i strat the thread.. omg..
is it because, 0.10 is little ? this is why it is late?
No, it has nothing to do with the size of your transaction. Both of your transfer amounts were in the exact same bitcoin transaction, so they both confirmed at the same time. The issue is with the receiving Exchange system. It is quite possible that their system uses "one time" deposit addresses... so after one deposit is received, the deposit address for your account will change. Likely, the system detected the 0.303 amount, credited that to your account and then changed your deposit address. Then it found the 0.1 amount but did not know where to credit this as the deposit address for your account is now something else. No doubt that this likely occurs a LOT, so I would guess that what has happened, is that they probably have a team that go through "unassigned" deposits... get the address and then find the account that matches this "old" deposit address and then credit that account with the funds. This would be a slow and manual job, which would explain why it took so long... It also wouldn't surprise me that after telling you they didn't get the funds, the receiving exchange actually went looking for it and found it and credited your account  Yeah, this must be a somewhat outdated exchange too, since most have already "upgraded" to allow deposits to old addresses. In fact, even those that warn users not to deposit to old addresses still should credit accidents since it's just a simple lookup. What else is curious for me to know: 1. Maybe OP can clarify, is there a reason you chose to make 2 separate withdrawals to the same address? Not that it matters when depositing to Exchange B since input size won't matter when you withdraw from them. 2. The funds are still unspent! I don't know any exchange that doesn't immediately drain out the deposit addresses of customers, so I'm now very curious to know this exchange. In fact, all 4 txs to that address are still unspent! |
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Rollercoaster? No need to exaggerate things. If we look at the movements in terms of percentages, it was like 10% at worst, and that for a very brief moment. I am however more or less surprised that the market remained above the $7000 level, while the fork was quite an important event, and also the disappointment of people that were already counting profits. After all, it might be that this fork wasn't at all the reason for the market to go up to such levels, even though it was a major source of incentive for people to buy.
Any headline will do this time, but yeah after seeing even 25% in a day, 10% bursts really don't cut it as rollercoaster rides anymore. I'm also really, really, surprised at the price and can only wonder if perhaps the s2x supporters had already booked in profits. What really took me by surprise was the seemingly blanket effect on alts. I'm seeing still 20-30% increases well past 24 hours after the news broke and Bitcoin bounced. I have a feeling the real surprise is still in store. Isn't December traditionally the lull before a crypto event brewing in January? |
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Seriously, there's hardforks scheduled for December and January? At this rate splitting fork coins soon won't be worth the effort anymore. People already hardly cared about Bitcoin Gold, I don't think any of the other junk forks are going to get far either. BCH and B2X at least had some sort of community support, but now it's just getting silly.
Yeah, this post made me curious enough to try to search online for possible/planned Bitcoin forks. Didn't find any except these really crazy one: Bitcoin Silver at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2311582.0 ... gotta be a troll without a website and BTG rip off. I even found a plan to fork off Bitcoin Cash, which is not even funny as a joke anymore. Gotta say that some people felt these hard forks business would only embolden others to try the same, in search for a quick buck. As laughable as Bitcoin Gold ended up to be, a lot of Bitcoin holders still made money from future trading. Even a 5% instant sell-off profit is not something to laugh at. |
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I believe the lack of enmity in the email was a sign that they have conceded in as final a way possible. This doesn't mean there won't be a future call for a similar hard fork alternative, not at all. But it will mean that these guys have probably seen enough proof to show that their goals would never be achievable, no matter how much corporate sponsorship and political will went behind it. NYA signatories dropping out, shows also that so many were misled (not intentionally I would hope) about S2x.
So, not vanquished. But definitely a concession. I think we can look forward to a lot more open, less hostile, discussions from now on?
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OP, that's a crazy number of ATMs in one city... where are you located? London? NY? We had 2 Bitcoin ATMs in our capital (Kuala Lumpur) - located in trendy, really high-end areas where people would afford Bitcoin I guess. Think this was even in 2014 or so, but they closed down since and I'm not aware of any right now. Population of about 30 million and it wasn't successful then, and unlikely to happen again with the moves by our central bank.
I get why the idea would appeal... but to me it's just as easy as going on localbitcoins to buy a bit of coin. I mean, if people have a hard time understanding how to buy and use wallets, imagine how tough they'd get around using an ATM, no? Never mind the exorbitant fees...
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I do agree that energy consumption for Bitcoin mining is unsustainable - but we shouldn't make the false comparison of how expensive it is per transaction. The direct energy cost/tx model, if used across various currency or payment methods, was recently used to compare Bitcoin to Visa. But the inherent benefits of Bitcoin far outweight those of Visa and others: the security and privacy to me are the most obvious. The amount of control you have. Swipe a card or enter it and you can never really be sure of what you're spending and to whom. You never know when its data could be stolen and misused (it's definitely seen, tracked and recorded!).
Plus, the overheads for Bitcoin are significantly lower. Sure, mining operations are costly, but nothing compared to the infrastructure and human resource of Visa or others.
But to the point at hand - algorithm changes may very well happen to help address this, but it may be a very long time before that happens. My thinking is that mining cartels fear its effects on price and may once again feel they have a huge say in the matter.
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I think we should all take this as good news. Indeed, common sense and impending logic prevail. Shame that it had to take public denouncements from Bitcoin.org and signatories to leave to mount the pressure on this decision, but in the end, the email sounds quite all right. No sensationalism, just a concession. United Bitcoin stands... for now.
P.S. The big block supporters are really taking out their hate on the signers of this email... Twitter, everywhere. I don't believe I've ever seen Jihan Wu called a traitor, by his own supporters too.
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Looking forward to the first game of Westham, under the guidance of a new coach. It will be interesting to see whether he was able, in a short time to fix something?
Yup me too. A club that replaces its manager usually gets rejuvinated in the next two or three matches. But playing Watford and away? I doubt they'll win even if they tried hard enough. But we'll see... It's the international break this weekend and that makes some league matches unpredictable the week after. Yeah, it's quite noticeable in the PL, teams generally do better (if not winning, at least halting a run of losses) under a new manager immediately. Perhaps some feel-good psychology at play, but probably dying to impress the new boss. I see quite a bit of chatter from skeptical Hammers online, plus the trolls are all out at play. Moyes's win rate at Everton keeps getting bandied around but if he can get 10 points before Christmas, that will be just enough to keep the hopers hoping. Anyone wanna take guesses at his winter transfer targets? I wonder if he'll lure any players from Merseyside. |
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I do not know where you got that infos my friend,
but if it's true then i will gladly welcome it,and of course everybody will happy with it.
also,what will happen with the price after the hardfork ?
indeed it has a possibility to reach that point,but we should understand that in the next 10 days or even less than that we will face Hardfork.
i believe a flash dump will happen and we will see Bitcoin price hit $4000 more or less in the future.
if we're correcting to that point,does that mean we need to double it to reach $10.000 ?
and we're only have 1 month time left to reliaze it all.
only time know about what will happen and what is goin on with it.
i trully hope we can see it in the future and a bit stable in that point for a year or around that.
Don't feed the trolls, mate, unless, like me, you actually do enjoy seeing them come out from under the rafters. Seems that a lot of people are happy being made rich by Bitcoin, they take the time to make new accounts and post from them  But let's pretend the discussion started seriously. A few months ago, when Bitcoin broke $4k and a few very staunch supporters were pleasantly surprised, we felt that that 5k was only around the corner, but that dread massive correction was bound to follow. Now in less than a third of the year, we're already approaching double that. Is it comprehensible to see Bitcoin do a little more than 30% by Christmas? I no longer think it's impossible. Best case scenario, the fork fails to do its damage, and then Bitcoin is just going to come off its wheels. Personally? That's still too soon for me, and will unfortunately usher in the Great Correction. |
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Yesterday, BlackRock Strategist Richard Turnill said there’s no inherent right or wrong Bitcoin price, no fair value.
This strategist's comment is so theoretical it's almost a joke. There is a right and wrong Bitcoin price. The test of that is whether anyone in the world would accept a bitcoin for any price above face (right now). Most people would accept bitcoin for a small premium because they'll have faith that the price would soon pass their buy price, but it's only a small amount of premium that would be accepted. Would you buy my 1 bitcoin for $10,000? No. You'd say "that's the wrong price!" This strategist just doesn't know how to value a currency that isn't backed by the GDP of a country. That's all it is. Says the BlackRock strategist who'll definitely say "yes, that's the right price" to anyone who would offer him Bitcoin at say $6,500 right now. Fair value should be a very basic concept for him to grasp. Bitcoin will cost Zimbabweans more than $10,000 right now if bought locally, but there's a lot of considerations priced into that: scarcity against demand being the most obvious, but also the risk that the seller takes (that Bitcoins will be even in more demand and that local currencies are likely to bend even more in a stale economy). When China's exchanges faced closure, similarly the extra risks for owning Bitcoin were priced in, and fair value there was 10% below global market average. Like you said, that's the simple test - will people accept the price? If yes, then that's the right price. Simple, isn't it? |
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Lots of people are going through with the altcoin strategy. Isn't it possible that Bitcoin will go up after a drop after the fork, just as how it happened with Bitcoin gold? It seems like we're running into a similar situation (a bubble right before the fork, a strong lack of information on what the fork entails, etc.) Seems like a lot of parallels can be formed between the Bitcoin gold fork and this upcoming one.
I'm ashamed to say you could count me in on being one of those "lots of people", going against even my own advice when dealing with these Bitcoin forks. BTG caught me by surprise, and I probably should have read some of the writing on the wall with regards to their (ongoing) incompetence. I dipped a little more into the altpool, beefed up some of my holdings and even added a new coin at what seemed to be value prices at the time. Even managed to see them appreciate a little while, but then Bitcoin never dipped properly as BTG got mired deeper into their mess. So a "double whammy" - lost BTC on current alt declines, and "lost" the BTG I'd have gained if I kept my coins pre-fork. But this Segwit2x fork is a whole different beast - I'm more confused the more I research. This time, I'm sticking to my guns and keeping my Bitcoin no matter the developments until 2017 ends. |
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Good points to note: past is not indicative of present or future movement. This is true in conventional trading, but holds even stronger in Bitcoin markets. This is why most of the technical anaylses and comparisons to bubbles of the past are only interesting at best.
What we also need to realise is that this upcoming fork is unlike the previous two we've already had. It is the most contentious of all, and is the one most likely to have far and long lasting implications, should it succeed in its aims. Bitcoin Cash is only slightly similar in its corporate sponsorship. It may have benefited from being the first fork this year, so there was a lot of attention that gained it more recognition than it deserved. I'm inclined to even leave Bitcoin Gold out of this comparison; pretty sure its devs are embarrassed at the mess it's come to be seen as.
This one will be tough to predict, extremely risky to trade on.
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You are absolutely right. That's because we going to make an ecosystem with wide functionality and couple of tightly integrated services with ability to make new.
About scaling - adding new items (nodes) to the data-cluster, yes, that is not a problem if basic architecture allows that. But we talking about consolidated and almost proprietary solution - in this case you have to believe to the ex mgmt. In our case (and as you mentioned above) we talking about truly distributed ecosystem, based on the cloud/fog computing. And scaling is not a problem at all. That is on the one hand. On the other - of course we are thinking about support unit, but we thinking in the AI-added way. So, first support line will be AI-enabled virtual support engineers, and may be second line too (later), but the third line - of course there will be real support engineers with strong problem solving skills.
Thanks for taking the time to address these issues of scaling - it's often dismissed as a natural and inevitable problem simply because it seems to be every business's issue, eventually, but outside of decentralised exchanges, even 5 years of history learning from the biggest hasn't taught exchanges to cope with it. They all start out with lightning-quick execution and then sputter as traffic increases, but as I said, even those aren't as important as Customer Support! Crypto is on the cusp of mainstream adoption, yet the majority of easily useable platforms are already overloaded. Let's hope your AI-aided solution will be good enough for an exchange... I've not been impressed by what I've seen so far. Good luck! |
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You got the people that are interested for it's technology and people who are mainly here for the fluctuations in price, investors.
I think the group of people that are using it for the technology is smaller than the group of investors.
Also tech people that have blockchain technology as work wouldn't be able to do it full time if it wasn't as popular as it is now.
So I think you can say that a lot of Bitcoins attention is due to it's extreme price fluctuation, it wouldn't be so popular if it didn't had that.
In fact, Bitcoin is probably one of only a handful of cryptocurrencies with a significant portion of its users interested in its technology and ideal. Before 2012 at least, probably the majority of them were simply working and experimenting with Bitcoin for that sole purpose. And they'll always be the ones using it, at whatever price. The fact that so many developers have left the scene without accumulating much is evidence of this, to me at least. If indeed the "bubble" bursts and it all comes crashing down, I'm sure the same ones plugging away at it in the beginning will be the ones still discussing and developing right here. I know it's a slight disservice to developers of other projects and alts, but even the best and most respected developers on alt projects must have some financial motivation. It was Bitcoin's rise to fame and promise of future wealth that led to the boom in alts this year. |
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