If you have a bitcoin-otc rating from other bitcoin users is a better way to go. I dont care what they sell or promote only who vouches for them.
not everyone trades in the OTC |
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i don't leave my Bitcoin client open while i'm browsing and just to make sure
Don't keep Bitcoin (i.e. wallet.dat) in the same login account that you do your browsing from. thank you. |
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i don't leave my Bitcoin client open while i'm browsing and just to make sure, i offload the wallet.dat file after i encrypt off to my Blackberry with another copy in Dropbox. how do u guys feel about storing a Truecrypt file in Dropbox.
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Yes on firefox I've been able to cancel orders to adjust rates with no issues, i've actually mostly used my iphone to do this and it hasn't been an issue at all. Also Mark has been really quick to answer my couple of emails and each time he's been really helpful.
Mark responsiveness has been spotty for me. as a newbie, i don't know if i just caught him at a bad time with his Japan travels or what. one of his excuses was that he was asleep when i emailed him. well it took him 12 hrs to get back to me. if ur trading pennies or small dollars u might say this isn't a big deal. but in the instance i describe above, it involved thousands of dollars. i understand that this technology is early and that he doesn't have a support staff. my counter to that tho is look at all the money being traded daily. i refuse to believe that i am the only one experiencing these issues. if he wants his business to grow someone has to be immediately available for support. mtgox is the current std for pricing this mkt so its role is critical. professionals have or will enter this mkt and he has to be ready. they, we, or i are compulsive ppl unlike he might be used to dealing with. i have to give him credit tho in one instance he did exactly what i wanted but only after i brought my issue up here on the forum. |
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as far as mtgox is concerned, i can only say Thank God for all u guys who have explained the problems and the solutions more clearly and responsively than the owners of the site.
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i assume you're referring to the Depth Table? i can see that but there are no links or buttons that allow or even imply an ability to cancel an order. i'm using Mac OSX Snow Leopard. anyone else with same problem?
The only browser that is stable with MTGox is Firefox. i am using Firefox. heres some of the problems as i see it. u enter your order and click Buy. beneath the Buy Bitcoin button u see a line popup saying Buying Bitcoins. this lasts a second or two but then ur left with the same window with your order numbers still in place. in a professional trading program a separate window pops up listing out ur order and indicating clearly that the order went thru and is complete. in mtgox, ur left wondering what happened, so in my case i pushed it again and again and again. with the list of orders so far down the page on my laptop i didn't realize i was initiating multiple orders when i only wanted one. so then after multiple pushes i go over to the acct history button and i can see that i've purchased multiple times even tho i could have just scrolled down the page. in one order i set a limit price in USD and for some reason it bought me those btc at a slightly higher price. emailed Mag Tux for explanation but no reply. of course now i know to scroll down the Trade page after hitting the Buy button but a newbie, like i was, wouldn't know that necessarily. i can't believe i'm the only one this happened to. expensive lesson. on one of these inadvertent multiple orders it took my balance to zero. at that pt i didn't realize i had left a trail of limit bid orders on the Depth page. a few days later i wired more money and the instant it was posted to my acct the program initiated all those buys b/c the market price was below those limit orders. nasty surprise. the program should eliminate all those orders if ur balance has been zeroed out. this also creates a false impression of the depth of the market for all market participants b/c those bids would still be up if i hadn't sent more money. |
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i assume you're referring to the Depth Table? i can see that but there are no links or buttons that allow or even imply an ability to cancel an order. i'm using Mac OSX Snow Leopard. anyone else with same problem?
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another example today is i put in a buy limit order at a specific price for a certain #btc. somehow my order got filled at a higher price than the limit price.
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as a user of mtgox i can say they can barely handle this fx much to my chagrin. theres all sorts of bugs in their protocol as far as i'm concerned
Specific technical details, please. Otherwise, this is just FUD. today my wire hit their acct at 10:39 am and 6 separate buys were executed simultaneously at this time w/o me even entering in the order. i have an email out to the owner of the site asking for an explanation and no response and it is 12 h later. another thing is if you enter an order which is not completely filled you are stuck with that order. you can't take it down. i have alot of experience with stock trading on commercial programs and this mtgox is rudimentary in comparison. communication with the owners is difficult at best. i think they're trying their best but it seems to be run by just Magical Tux and he is a busy guy (i hear he's travelling in Japan and i wouldn't be so available either if i was doing that) and can't/won't answer all my questions or concerns. considering the amount of money and the volume of trades going on now he needs to consider some help to keep customers happy some of whom are trading big money. |
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theres also the problem with the owners of the exchange being tempted to allow naked shorting by their customers. in other words, they pretend to give you (generic) shares to short which they don't own simply for the fee involved in making that sale. this can create all sorts of problems as Overstock.com and Tazer experienced with thousands of shares sold (shorted) on the mkt way greater than the actual number of shares issued. at this stage of the game where BTC is such a nascent concept, i would avoid this complexity which could cause alot of harm.
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Welcome to Bitcoin. I don't think any of the exchanges currently offer such an option, but you can always simply find someone to lend you bitcoins in Forum/Marketplace or bitcoin-otc. You'll probably need either some reputation or collateral. (The generic you, I gather the personal you isn't interested in this. Thank you. This really doesn't provide the protection against a panic though. If I have borrowed some money and a panic ensues, the most likely scenario is that I just say screw the debt and cash in on whatever value I have left. It's the forced future buying that is the important part. The way this would work more or less is like this. Say mt gox would like to implent this and that I (the generic I) would like to short the market through them. There are two requirements. First mt gox needs a buffer of saved BTCs to allow shorting, and second I need to deposit some USD to mt gox. So I deposit 100 USD to my mt gox account and say I want to short the market for 50 USD. What happens then is that mt gox sells 25 BTC at the current market price ($50 for simplicity's sake), credits the money to my account and notes that I owe them 25 BTC. If I'm right on my bet and the BTC does indeed go down I will buy back 25 BTC at a lower price and keep the difference while returning my BTC debt to mt gox. If I am wrong however I will buy them back at a higher price and be netted a loss to my account. It is also neccesary with a stop limit where mt gox steps in and buys back their BTC with my money automatically since if those 25 BTC would increase above $150 it would become impossible. Obviously I will still stand for the loss. The stop limit in the above example should be somewhere below $150 (my $100 deposit + $50 from the BTC sale). Users should idealy also be able to set their own lower limits so that they can regulate the amount they stand to lose without monitoring the market 24/7. The important part here is really the forced buying back that will be monitored by the mt gox software. Since any shorter is a guaranteed future buyer, they will be stepping in if/when the value of the currency drops and provide liquidity in an unsafe market which would work kind of like a "safety net" for any hypotethical panic. as someone who has lots of experience shorting i can say you're only presenting half the story. shorters also can contribute to downside pressure prrecipitating a selling panic. you have to remember that mtgox is only a currency exchanger at this point. as a user of mtgox i can say they can barely handle this fx much to my chagrin. theres all sorts of bugs in their protocol as far as i'm concerned and introducing this further complexity would be impossible with their current staffing. |
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and the WH will obviously be hostile towards Bitcoin.
I don't agree that this is a given. You must be joking. Bitcoin is threatening them with bilions of dollars loss if not a total dissolution and you don't think it's a given? i'm afraid i have to agree with mewant. |
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I find this revelation to be supportive of Bitcoin's future. If they are openly asking a major representative of the Bitcoin community to speak, that means that they not only have looked at it fairly closely and have judged generally that it's not a threat or a crime (meaning they are not going to commit resources to destroy the network) it also means that someone has a use for Bitcoin.
Keep in mind, they have a use for Tor, and if every Tor node were owned by the feds, it woundn't be very useful to them either.
It might also explain some of the mystery money that has been flowing into MtGox and driving the price. If the CIA has a use for it, they are going to have to have some of it.
If this presentation goes well, and tells them what they really would like to verifiy (they don't ask questions that they don't already have strong opinions on, like lawyers never ask questions in court that they haven't already researched, the CIA has access to some truly high class programmers themselves) then just imagine the level of hashing power that the feds could bring to Bitcoin.
I know that most people think that the fact that the US FRN is the international reserve currency is a major boon for the US economy, but there are some very notable downsides. In some ways it's in the interests of the US to gently back away from that role. Bitcoin could help that endeavor.
can u explain the downsides of being the reserve currency? |
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Gavin - please be sure to emphasize the transparency of bitcoin - every transaction being logged publicly makes it slightly less attractive to the drug-smuggling terrorist child pornographers. A careful analysis of the network would yield a lot of information about who is paying who how much, even if it doesn't tell you their name and address. One easy thing they could do is to pay money to some illegal service, and watch where the money goes.
second that. Gavin pls emphasize also that btc was created by Satoshi b/c he and we are sick of FerBanke and central banks worldwide devaluing our money to enrich themselves and financial arsonists. it was not invented to facilitate drug pmts, money laundering, or assasinations. |
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CIA is filled with analysts. Crypto, math, infosys, they've got some of the best of the best.
Some of the people who listen to the talk will write internal memo's using some sort of US centric threat metric. These memo's will be circulated, socialized and further analysis (data gathering) may be ordered up (depending on possible risk/opportunity idea holds).
Finally an official memo will be circulated to upper level govt. staffers in house and senate. Maybe, and I mean maybe, Obama will get a 20 sec briefing on it in the next year.
my 00.02 btc
Gavin, you have to do this.
doesn't sound very encouraging to me. i'm not sure of any good of this for btc. |
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I think it's a great way for government to fund the development of Bitcoin, by paying speaker's fees to the developers.
Gavin ought to have charged 10x that. |
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Twitter was inundated as well with the news that Gavin was invited to speak to the CIA.
Hacker News like to drops twitter bombs with the number of HN aggregators on twitter. care to explain to us non hacker types? i got blocked as well. |
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Morally, and in principle: of course it should be on the list.
However, if we consider the argument from effect I think it's obvious that for the sake of bitcoin gaining popularity it should be left off the list.
But think two steps ahead. If we remove all illegal stuff, what kind of people are we going to encourage to adopt bitcoin. The answer is your average Joe. Bitcoin gets popular - all good and well. That's step one. Step two is when governments take action against bitcoin and I believe it's not a matter of if, but a matter of when. What do you think the average Joe is going to do then? The answer is simple - leave. If we lose big portion of adopters it will cause major problems. Not too long ago I argued the same argument, but now I realize I was wrong. We should firstly obtain a stable user base who realize the concepts and implications that bitcoins brings and not just think it's a cool new get rich quick scheme. Average Joe will have their chance to join when bitcoin is mainstream. heres a way to look at this dilemma for all the anarchists on this site. THINK LIKE A CRIMINAL. whats the best way to get your addicts hooked. tx them nice initially with nothing but good (money, dinners, parties, being nice). then once their hooked, tx them whatever way you like. same with BTC. be nice initially to get the masses hooked, then who cares what its used for later. by then, it'll be too late for gov't. |
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LOL!!!   |
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