2. A good news for CIYAM Team, halibit is very interested in working with AT technology. I feel he is a very capable dev with dedication. So Ian, I'll send him your way?  If he is interested on helping integrating AT to qora, send him my way. |
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Nice to see CIYAM is progressing! What other packages you have in mind? I guess for proof of concept reasons, we can have a simple app using the already in place packages.
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ATDevelopmentFund AT was executed. What was the total fee consumed by the AT from its start? How many blocks it was spread through?
First of all, I would like to thank everyone for the support in funding the ATDevelopmentFund. The total fees consumed for the AT from its start is 4.3bursts. They were distributed amongst 2 blocks. The first 1.1 fees consumed when the AT had run for first time. When the CF AT runs for first time it goes for "sleep" until the block height which is going to decide if the project is funded or not. The rest 3.2 fees consumed when the AT "woke up" ( block height 74905) and was time to decide. |
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Thus writing a Virus Smart Contract is not feasible, but exploiting the underlying implementation somehow by founding a bug is a different story.
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I will speak on behalf the AT smart engine that is currently live on burst coin. No you cannot infect the host pc with virus using AT contracts. But for sure someone can create an AT contract that says it does x but it does y and you end up loosing money if you send coins to the AT, but at least anyone can check the code the AT is executing.
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My AT crowdfunding test was not funded.
How can I see that the pledges have been returned?
AT misses the account address, while it has Creator: BURST-X2MY-DV84-GB2J-HCXZE
The AT refunded correctly the participants. {
"requestProcessingTime": 38,
"transactions": [
{
"fullHash": "b23bb3b16b62726c281be597bd8652bcf8d2aadb0c648849390901dd57c4b9c5",
"confirmations": 1207,
"amountNQT": "9200000000",
"transaction": "7814416518123568050",
"ecBlockHeight": 0,
"block": "6429176542931182091",
"recipientRS": "BURST-5JCJ-RDFX-Q92E-HX48E",
"type": 22,
"feeNQT": "0",
"recipient": "17733026589904585040",
"version": 1,
"timestamp": 17198550,
"sender": "575775830774922757",
"ecBlockId": "0",
"height": 71017,
"subtype": 1,
"senderPublicKey": "0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000",
"deadline": 1440,
"blockTimestamp": 17198550,
"senderRS": "BURST-JHJ7-475T-9D3R-2KEZH"
},
{
"fullHash": "496df22ebc4bf2e952569eddffef08a51e877b0ba30cbff580b78ae4d23c6c7f",
"confirmations": 1207,
"amountNQT": "99300000000",
"transaction": "16857619626814762313",
"ecBlockHeight": 0,
"block": "6429176542931182091",
"recipientRS": "BURST-3U6P-VPFD-NPZ6-6QE2Z",
"type": 22,
"feeNQT": "0",
"recipient": "5729026078445463701",
"version": 1,
"timestamp": 17198550,
"sender": "575775830774922757",
"ecBlockId": "0",
"height": 71017,
"subtype": 1,
"senderPublicKey": "0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000",
"deadline": 1440,
"blockTimestamp": 17198550,
"senderRS": "BURST-JHJ7-475T-9D3R-2KEZH"
},
{
"fullHash": "131f096053ffa680d440ba0880e9dcc90bafd32afcaae4f6234169038d93de06",
"confirmations": 1207,
"amountNQT": "99300000000",
"transaction": "9270377616547323667",
"ecBlockHeight": 0,
"block": "6429176542931182091",
"recipientRS": "BURST-XU42-33T9-M89B-7TYQG",
"type": 22,
"feeNQT": "0",
"recipient": "6294863534484285504",
"version": 1,
"timestamp": 17198550,
"sender": "575775830774922757",
"ecBlockId": "0",
"height": 71017,
"subtype": 1,
"senderPublicKey": "0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000",
"deadline": 1440,
"blockTimestamp": 17198550,
"senderRS": "BURST-JHJ7-475T-9D3R-2KEZH"
},
Your CFs account id is: BURST-JHJ7-475T-9D3R-2KEZH or 575775830774922757 |
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Im trying to create a crowdsource through the AT interface. It just says 'error sending transaction' ... what could be wrong?
Also what is the password field used for? (error happens whether I put one or not)
To create a CF you need to have a burst account and have at least some bursts to cover the ATs creation fees (less than 10 bursts). Also name is not allowed to have spaces. |
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AT is a white label project, with MIT licence, and is not tied to any blockchain. Almost any coin (btc based or not) can integrate AT.
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Is it usefull that if the project is with 100% fundet, people could still fund this project over 100% and the project waits the whole time until it defind end, or would it be better, if the project is 100% funded, that its over and there is a imitiat paypout?
perhaps there could be both cases available when a cf project ist startet?
It comes down to whether you want to minimise the fees as much as possible (which is why it works as it does now). Currently it uses a clever "trick" to work super-efficiently by avoiding executing the machine code until the target block is reached (so although the % gets larger and larger no actual code is being executed while that is happening so it is tracking that progress "for free"). If we did change the behaviour (which of course could be done) then understand that it would cost everyone pledging or donating that little bit more (and waste more clock cycles for each node to verify the AT). This is due to a "min-fee" that is needed to cover any steps that are executed at each new block height. I'm not sure if the button changes from Pledge to Donate automatically at 100% but if not that of course should be changed (luckily as that has nothing to do with the actual machine code that can be changed by updating the UI for that AT). The fee for Bursts transactions is still low, but hopefully bursts will get more expensive, then the 1 Burst would count more. I think it is therefore OK to leave it that way. I made for exactly this purpose a Test CF. 1. I asked for 1000 and I paid 1000 and had then too less (99.8%) - although it said at the initial screen 100%. So I added another 10, which brought me to 100.8% 2. The Pledge button does not change to Donation. I guess it will do after the block is reached. 1. The first tx sent to CF is the tx that will wake up the AT and will start processing. When the AT runs it consumes fees. These fees are deducted from the ATs account. So if you send 1000 and the AT makes some processing the total amount the AT will have after is 1000 - fees . Lets say you send a tx at block 1000. The tx will be included at block 1001, at tha point you see 100%, cause the AT has not run yet. At block 1002 the AT will be activated and it will consume some fees, thus you saw less than 100%. 2. The pledge button is converted after the predefined time limit you have set and if the projects is fully funded. The project might have reach 100% or more and still you might want to pledge |
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Remember that the funds arent release until the stated block. Would you still want to pledge some money, it will be possible untill we reach that block. So more than 100% is possible (see the test AT)
That's a shame that it will take so long to release the funds. It seems like it should be possible to code up an AT so that the funds are released as soon as the target funding level is reached. We discussed that too, but what the outcome will be i'd know as it may required yet another fork. Now you are, however, able to influence how the form of our lottery LuckyAT (see above)! The voting take place at BurstForum.com - if you aren't a member, please join. No it does not require any fork to code up and deploy such AT. |
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Then you have done something wrong. If atcrowdfund.html in /[wallet]/html/ui/ it will show. Perhaps check a guide again...? I have not changed anything! I have reloaded the page and now ALL Projects are gone! However, it still does show "powered by Automated Transactions and Burst." It happens to me also sometimes. If you stop and start burst it will be ok. |
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Also, I have upload a new html version for the Lottery cases where the ATs are filtered properly and you only see the Lottery cases: https://mega.co.nz/#!ycpXCADa!BWzhEmkm0JzfWn2HZL7YTat4hg0Jwuz5gD34TJ9SmSY hi vbcs... page downloaded and tested.. i have a request... it is possible to add a column like this: CountDown simply put a timer indicating how far it is the conclusion of the current round in DAYS-HH-MM-SS I do not know if it is feasible but it would be helpful! thanx again! We could put normal timestamps, but they would be estimations. For example the average block time in burst is around 4 minutes. So when the page says ends in 5000 blocks that's about 1250min almost one day, but that figure is just an estimation based on the average block time. |
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Thank you, vbcs for doing such a great job in creating a ATcrowdfunding.
I got some questions and suggestions:
1. "Funding" is not a "Donation", so I expect to pay back a funded project. There is no terms set yet of how much interest, what time frame to pay back. Sure, an interest of -100% is a donation!
2. How can I see WHO has pledged so far? Which api can I use for that? So that I can follow up with these people by private messages.
3. Why would somebody fund a project, when they "hide" behind a Creator BURST account? We need a recommendation system.
4. There is no Withdraw or Edit function, e.g. if I want to change the description. Maybe we suggest to use a description link to be free of edit function and withdraw is the a normal expire.
5. I assume that this will pickup and more crowdfunding cases will emerge. Maybe a list of Funding cases and a click for more information would be better. E.g., ordered by highest % already funded and ordered by blocks to go, so that projects soon to be due and nearly reached project's target will be seen first to get easier funded.
6. How can we promote our funding case? Right now it is a title and a description. We would need a "link" to the promoted funding case, like we have an asset-id.
(I followed your asking, and pledged towards the development!)
You should be aware that one important property of the ATs is that they are trustless and decentralized. Beeing able to modify something on the code of the AT after you have deployed it, then automatically.you loose that property. Maybe beeing able to change just the description does not affect that, but I dont think is a very important feature at the moment to implement it. Also i dont understand the withdraw option? What you mean? If someone sends pledges to the project he cannot undo the pledges, the only way to get his money back is if the projevt is not fully funded. |
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You are correct. I edited my last post and updated the file with a new one that uses relative paths. If you can also edit your post that would be great.
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I have uploaded a new .html version for the Lotteries where the filtering works properly and displays only the lotteries. https://mega.co.nz/#!ycpXCADa!BWzhEmkm0JzfWn2HZL7YTat4hg0Jwuz5gD34TJ9SmSY |
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Also, I have upload a new html version for the Lottery cases where the ATs are filtered properly and you only see the Lottery cases: https://mega.co.nz/#!ycpXCADa!BWzhEmkm0JzfWn2HZL7YTat4hg0Jwuz5gD34TJ9SmSY |
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can you explain in a few words...
how AT could be use to implement a simple gambling like lottery or dice game??
Our very first "use case" was a Lottery (which runs on Burst with a new draw once per week) so the raw assembly code for it is as follows: 00000000* BNZ $00000000 :0000004c
00000006 SET @00000001 #0000002e90edd000
00000013 FUN @00000000 0x0301
0000001a SET @00000002 $00000000
00000023 SET @00000003 #0000000000000000
00000030 SET @00000004 #0000000000002760
0000003d FUN @00000000 0x0406 $00000000 $00000004
0000004c FUN 0x0304 $00000002
00000053 FUN @00000004 0x0125
0000005a BNZ $00000004 :00000061
00000060 FIN
00000061 FUN @00000005 0x0307
00000068 BLT $00000005 $00000000 :00000077
00000072 JMP :00000110
00000077 FUN @00000006 0x0306
0000007e FUN 0x030a
00000081 FUN @00000004 0x0104
00000088 FUN 0x030b
0000008b FUN @00000007 0x0104
00000092 BEQ $00000007 $00000004 :00000102
0000009c FUN @00000004 0x0305
000000a3 BNZ $00000004 :000000f4
000000a9 BEQ $00000006 $00000001 :000000b8
000000b3 JMP :00000156
000000b8 FUN @00000004 0x0308
000000bf FIZ $00000004
000000c4 FUN 0x030a
000000c7 FUN 0x0110 $00000004
000000ce FUN 0x0405
000000d1 ADD @00000003 $00000001
000000da BLE $00000004 $00000008 :000000f4
000000e4 SET @00000008 $00000004
000000ed FUN @00000009 0x0104
000000f4 SET @00000002 $00000005
000000fd JMP :0000004c
00000102 ADD @00000003 $00000006
0000010b JMP :000000f4
00000110 BZR $00000003 :00000148
00000116 BZR $00000008 :00000148
0000011c FUN 0x0116 $00000009
00000123 FUN @0000000a 0x0300
0000012a BEQ $0000000a $00000000 :00000140
00000134 FUN 0x0402 $00000003
0000013b JMP :00000184
00000140 FUN 0x0403
00000143 JMP :00000184
00000148 SET @00000002 $00000005
00000151 JMP :00000023
00000156 FUN 0x030a
00000159 BLE $00000006 $00000001 :00000178
00000163 SUB @00000006 $00000001
0000016c FUN 0x0402 $00000006
00000173 JMP :000000b8
00000178 FUN 0x0402 $00000006
0000017f JMP :000000f4
00000184 SET @00000002 $00000000
0000018d SET @00000008 #0000000000000000
0000019a SET @00000009 #0000000000000000
000001a7 JMP :00000023
Perhaps @vbcs might post a nicer version for you that was created using AT Assembler (which has variable *names* and *labels* rather than just addresses as yes I realise that the above is more than a little hard to decipher). We are working on the idea of some quicker random games of chance and will be sure to let people know when we have a simple example that they can study (we might perhaps make a simple "highest random value wins" for two consecutive players). One limitation that AT hosts do have is how quickly they can generate "random" data (on Burst that is currently set at 14 blocks from memory) so you could have a dice kind of game but it won't be "instant" (the same AT could work much faster on a blockchain that can produce entropy quicker). nice to hear about "AT" lottery game!!! CIYAM, can you post a link with some how-to play??? many thanks!!! To participate to the lottery you need to download and run burstcoin. Then follow the instructions which are published here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.msg10254497#msg10254497i just installed the html file to use lottery!!! can you explain what stand for: - Current best ticket - Total amount - Next draw thanks...  In this lottery use case the highest ticket wins the total amount gathered. So the total amount is the total amount the lottery has gathered till now. When you purchase a ticket, that ticket is compared to the current best ticket and if it is greater then your ticket becomes the best ticket. The payout will occur when the lottery runs after the block height defined in next draw. I am planning to deploy more Lottery cases, where you are not aware of the tickets until is time for drawing the winner or "heads up" cases (where the lottery waits for 2 participants and then decides the winner). |
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Hi CIYAM,
Congratulations on AT! You've obviously put a lot of effort into it and it's a wonderful project. Thank you.
I've been coding for over 20 years and I still have difficulty writing actual code in AT machine code.. Sorry.. gave up machine code on my Spectrum 48k.. ;-p (ld hl 16384.. etc.. )
Is there any chance of converting a higher level language, say like java, into AT commands ?
Could we come up with a parser which converts a minimal java.lang subset into AT ?
I believe you mentioned this in some other thread but i can't find it..
You can also find a "tutorial" here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=949438.msg10408276#msg10408276 |
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You still have problem's deploying a CF or you managed to do it with that html version?
What are the fees to deploy a crowdfunding AT?
The fees for deploying CF are 10 burst coins and they are hardcoded in the html file. |
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can you explain in a few words...
how AT could be use to implement a simple gambling like lottery or dice game??
Our very first "use case" was a Lottery (which runs on Burst with a new draw once per week) so the raw assembly code for it is as follows: 00000000* BNZ $00000000 :0000004c
00000006 SET @00000001 #0000002e90edd000
00000013 FUN @00000000 0x0301
0000001a SET @00000002 $00000000
00000023 SET @00000003 #0000000000000000
00000030 SET @00000004 #0000000000002760
0000003d FUN @00000000 0x0406 $00000000 $00000004
0000004c FUN 0x0304 $00000002
00000053 FUN @00000004 0x0125
0000005a BNZ $00000004 :00000061
00000060 FIN
00000061 FUN @00000005 0x0307
00000068 BLT $00000005 $00000000 :00000077
00000072 JMP :00000110
00000077 FUN @00000006 0x0306
0000007e FUN 0x030a
00000081 FUN @00000004 0x0104
00000088 FUN 0x030b
0000008b FUN @00000007 0x0104
00000092 BEQ $00000007 $00000004 :00000102
0000009c FUN @00000004 0x0305
000000a3 BNZ $00000004 :000000f4
000000a9 BEQ $00000006 $00000001 :000000b8
000000b3 JMP :00000156
000000b8 FUN @00000004 0x0308
000000bf FIZ $00000004
000000c4 FUN 0x030a
000000c7 FUN 0x0110 $00000004
000000ce FUN 0x0405
000000d1 ADD @00000003 $00000001
000000da BLE $00000004 $00000008 :000000f4
000000e4 SET @00000008 $00000004
000000ed FUN @00000009 0x0104
000000f4 SET @00000002 $00000005
000000fd JMP :0000004c
00000102 ADD @00000003 $00000006
0000010b JMP :000000f4
00000110 BZR $00000003 :00000148
00000116 BZR $00000008 :00000148
0000011c FUN 0x0116 $00000009
00000123 FUN @0000000a 0x0300
0000012a BEQ $0000000a $00000000 :00000140
00000134 FUN 0x0402 $00000003
0000013b JMP :00000184
00000140 FUN 0x0403
00000143 JMP :00000184
00000148 SET @00000002 $00000005
00000151 JMP :00000023
00000156 FUN 0x030a
00000159 BLE $00000006 $00000001 :00000178
00000163 SUB @00000006 $00000001
0000016c FUN 0x0402 $00000006
00000173 JMP :000000b8
00000178 FUN 0x0402 $00000006
0000017f JMP :000000f4
00000184 SET @00000002 $00000000
0000018d SET @00000008 #0000000000000000
0000019a SET @00000009 #0000000000000000
000001a7 JMP :00000023
Perhaps @vbcs might post a nicer version for you that was created using AT Assembler (which has variable *names* and *labels* rather than just addresses as yes I realise that the above is more than a little hard to decipher). We are working on the idea of some quicker random games of chance and will be sure to let people know when we have a simple example that they can study (we might perhaps make a simple "highest random value wins" for two consecutive players). One limitation that AT hosts do have is how quickly they can generate "random" data (on Burst that is currently set at 14 blocks from memory) so you could have a dice kind of game but it won't be "instant" (the same AT could work much faster on a blockchain that can produce entropy quicker). nice to hear about "AT" lottery game!!! CIYAM, can you post a link with some how-to play??? many thanks!!! To participate to the lottery you need to download and run burstcoin. Then follow the instructions which are published here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.msg10254497#msg10254497 |
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