Right just as I explained. Don't see where I'm going off course here.

Nope I follow just fine. The $400/$600 and PPD/power figures all came from you. Only the rig cost came from me.

Actually those were your figures. My figures were $550 and $800 CAD respectively (even though it's actually more like $510 vs. $780 for the cheapest dual or triple fan design but I was being conservative). I knew if I used my own figures you would nitpick everything.

@QuintLeo, the difference comes from the fact that you need an extra $400 for the rest of the components of each rig (One really good PSU like an EVGA 1300W G2 and then cheap/used everything else, milk crate or self-built wood/aluminum or whatever for case/chassis etc.). You only need one rig for 6 cards and two rigs for 8. I wanted to use his own example of the worst case for the 1070s where you need to pay for an extra rig and only get 7 or 8 cards to show that even in that worst case and with his overly optimistic 1080 PPD numbers, the 1070s still come out ahead. But of course it's still wrong because FLDC only pays out once a month lol.




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I think Vorksholk was waiting on some legal or copyright stuff or something like that but it was more or less finished...that was my understanding anyway.

Not 100% but I'm pretty sure the halvening is already taken into account with these stats. I don't know though cuz I stopped folding for about a month in early November after ZEC was released and then I spent another month not doing anything cuz I rearranged everything to do a crossfire setup and test out Star Citizen. Only just started folding again about a week ago and haven't gotten another payout yet.

EDIT:

Ahh in that case let me edit that post.

EDIT2: Fixed!

http://foldingcoin.xyz/?token=FLDC&total=250000&start=2017-01-28&end=2017-01-29

Click "show stats"

Ctrl+F and find your address (or any address that had more than 0 if you just want to figure out the PPD per FLDC ratio)
Your PPD for that day (28th in this case) will appear in the right-most column.
Find-next (F3) and you will see your FLDC "payout" for that day.
Divide to get the ratio.

In my case 511k PPD / 763 FLDC = 670 PPD / FLDC or 0.0015 FLDC / PPD (again, this is valid for the 28th only as "difficulty" can change)

EDIT: Edited to adjust for the recent halvening.

Only if I get a hug first

How long after the holidays?

Of course I'm stuck on the "more cards" concept as that is what any rational person would do. Of course a 6-card 1080 rig will beat a 6-card 1070 rig, because 1080s are faster. Even a 5 year old can figure that out. If that is all you are trying to convice me of, then don't bother. I agree 100%.

So let's explore the dumb idea of taking the cost of a 6-card 1080 rig and instead using the same money to build 1070 rigs (No one has an unlimited budget and if you did, why bother to mine? Even if the budget is much greater all the numbers here will just scale proportionally). Let's assume that the cost of the rest of the rig equals the cost of a 1070...or $400 USD:

$600 x 6 + $400 = $4000 (The cost of a 6-card 1080 rig)
Now, being the neanderthal that I am, I decide to take that same amount of money and buy 1070s instead, because "Oooh, I can has even more shinies!"
So I spend $800 on two barebones rigs and have $3200 left over and buy 8x 1070 cards. Well I must be dumb, because I have 33% more cards but they get 33% less PPD, but I'm also paying more for power!


So let's use your own numbers AND give the 1080s the benefit of the doubt and assume they draw the same amount of power per card as a 1070 rather than 20% more. I will be paying $21.03 whereas you are paying $15.77 (something tells me this number is wrong, but of course you did the math in every way shape and form), yet we are both making $4791.31 per year as you say.

Now we can stop here, and again it's easy to see that the 1080 system comes out ahead by almost $6/year. Wowza!

But, for some idiotic reason I decide I would rather have more income, so once I earn enough to add more cards I do that. At $4791.31 per year, I will earn that amount divided by 365.25 per day, or $13.12...minus the cost of power ($21.03 / 365.25 = 5.7­¢), so $13.06. After 30.6 days I will have enough to buy another 1070. Let's call it 31 days to simplify things and err on the side of the 1080 system. So one month in I am now earning [($4791.31 - $21.03) / 365.25] * 9/8 , or $14.69 per day with the power cost now factored in, whereas you are still earning ($4791.31 - $15.77) / 365.25 = 13.07 per day and have accumulated $405.32 in profits, and (thinking maybe there is something to this "more income" shenannigans) buy yourself a shiny new rig but which is devoid of GPUs (or don't. Whatever).

Shall I continue?

After 27.22 days (let's call it 28 just 'cuz) I buy myself another 1070, and am now earning $14.69 * 10/9...or $16.33...per day, and you will have accumulated $771.13 (or $13.07 x 59 days) and spent $400, leaving you with $377.13 and still only 6 1080s and an income of $13.07....

Do I really need to continue at this point? I can but I'll stop here. Clearly you know how this ends up as you have already done the math in every which way. I'm glad you don't have buyer's remorse and are happy with your purchases, but to imply that anyone that does different (and you DID imply this) is somehow not smart, is simply wrong. Good day!

But you're completely ignoring the fact that the guy with lower per-rig income would have 50% more of those rigs lol

No the fringe case is where you only buy a set number of cards regardless of cost and compare card for card. There may be a case where a person is more limited by space/pci-e slots than actual budget, but THAT would be the fringe case. Anyone else is going to buy more of the cheaper card with better price/performance. If you are space/slot limited for some reason then 1080s don't make sense either. You should get Titan X Pascal in that case. There is no situation where 1080 makes sense. You are grasping at straws for justifying your purchase. It's called buyer's remorse...look it up and stop insulting everyone for not making the same mistake.

EDIT: Actually there is a case where it makes sense and that's if you bought one to game with but want to fold when you're not gaming...or decided later that you want to fold instead of gaming. In that case it makes PERFECT sense to have a single 1080 or two in SLI. I will concede that I didn't know it could pull 33% more PPD than a 1070. I thought it was more like 25% based on the limited info I have from the overclock.net database and adjusting that for what I've read in other places. Apparently I didn't adjust enough. Still though 50% more 1070 cards is better and a person would be far from stupid for getting 1070s over 1080s.

So the only way 1080s are more profitable is in the fringe case where you don't have an initial budget (ie. nobody), and don't use the money saved from buying 1070s over 1080s to buy 50% more 1070s. Gotcha.


Actually the guy saying that I don't think he actually did the math. When I explained it to him he changed his opinion.

What do you mean? Even with free electric 1080s are better It's too bad he's so lazy and won't tell us about his secret math. I guess the true extent of his genius will forever remain a mystery to us all...


I really hope they make a Hawaii-esque "490/590" with lots of cores and a 512-bit GDDR5(X) memory bus on the new node as opposed to just an evolution of the Fiji card with HBM. I think that would be a great all-around mining card and would almost certainly buy some of those.

Since I'm off on this tangent...is anyone else chomping at the bit too for the new Ryzen CPUs?

Anybody ever get this when you try to use counterwallet.io?

Sick burn!

And I, you Ignorance is bliss after all

Lol that's fine I know how it works and I have done the math. It would take almost two years for a 1080 system to pull ahead of a 1070 system in profitability with a budget of $2600 up front. That's assuming you keep dumping all of the coins you earn (and the price and difficulty of the coins remains either constant or directly proportional), and use the money to keep adding more cards until you get 6 of them in each rig. Of course there will be new Vega and Volta cards by then which means price and price/performance ratios of the cards will change (you would have bought all 6 1070s in May before Vega gets released but, you wouldn't get your 5th 1080 until end of July and your 6th until end of August...assuming you had your initial $2600 worth of hardware [roughly the cost in $CAD after tax/shipping of a barebones mining rig with 3x 1070s or 2x 1080s initially] in your hands today), so you have to make a lot of assumptions to even come up with numbers that far out.

I'm glad you're happy with your 1080 and you feel it was a good decision. In my case if I were to buy them and THEN do the math I would end up with buyer's remorse.

It might make sense for someone who has the money up front and plans on keeping them for a long time, or if you were building many many rigs and wanted to get more PPD per slot to save on motherboards/HDDs/CPUs, etc... but in my case it doesn't make sense at all. Actually even in that case even just getting one 1060 instead of a 1080 or two 1070s instead of two 1080s would be enough to pay for the rest of the rig. They are too cost prohibitive.

Power is included in my rent here anyway so I'm not too concerned about that. Even if I were it's Canada and most of the time it's cold and the more heat my hardware gives off the less the baseboards are running anyway.

I just want bang for buck for my hardware. 1080s are one of the worst things I could buy for that metric...but I'm not buying right now anyway. If I were to build a folding rig right now I would want 1060s, 1070s, or possibly (used) Fury cards. For any other type of rig I would want 470s/480s or more used Hawaii cards (or again maybe Furys).

1080 is greater, sure, but it also costs $800 CAD vs. $550 CAD for a 1070. Pretty sure there's almost no situation where it's 45% faster.

I really hope Vega is competitive in folding as I'm holding out for those before I buy any new cards. Worst case scenario the prices will come down on pascal and polaris cards.

From what I have been reading from rumours/leaks the Vega 10 should be higher than the GTX 1080 in compute power/TFLOPS and maybe around Titan X Pascal levels.
But who knows if that will be the case, or if that compute power will translate flop for flop into folding/hash power.

I had half a mind to get some 1070s but I just don't want to be pigeonholed into folding or the fewer algos where nvidia makes sense. I'd rather go with with AMD and have more flexibility with different algos. Then again the memory-hard algos like ZEC and ETH can't seem to take advantage of the huge 4096-bit memory bus of HBM (Fiji) and are bottlenecked by the lower mem clock, so I'm not holding my breath either.
We'll see anyway. I think they were targeting a May-ish release date.

He has pascal cards though not AMD. Merged folding is DEFINITELY more profitable than ZEC or ETH mining on nVidia cards.

600k PPD ~= 22 CURE and 1750 FLDC = 0.0033BTC / day / card
450Sol/s ~= 0.002 BTC / day / card

...and that's being generous on Sol rate and conservative on PPD.

I have AMD cards and I'm folding. It's not quite as profitable as ZEC but it's in the same ballpark. I get roughly 750k PPD vs. 1050Sol/s I would get mining ZEC. So about 0.0041 BTC/day for merge folding vs. 0.0046 BTC/day for ZEC mining. ZEC used to be significantly more profitable but only during the first month or so.

It's close enough...and if/when CURE 2.0 and SigmaX eventually get released I expect a rise. The low volume could be a problem for a large scale operation but for the average guy at home like myself with only a rig or two it's totally worth it (so that's a good thing for us). If/when the volume ever picks up it would be good for larger operations too and therefore the project as a whole (as that's the end goal and the whole idea of this coin).

Go, CURE!