Where I live I can buy grocery using Bitcoins. So who needs banks? Let them close my account. Their loss, not mine  If your grocery is told to remove btc as a payment option, or risk account closure, what do you think they will do? You're at the end of the food chain, there are very many points until your food gets into your grocery bag. |
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I'm not buying at the number of the beast Academically it made sense to purchase btc at $666 over the past 24 hrs
Can you explain why it would academically make sense? My homework indicated that $700 would be the approx high and $650 would be the likely low, as it turned out the high was $702 and the low was $666. I did get some trades in just above $666, and I had opportuni ties to buy at $666 but none below that. So academically, I should have purchased some at $666 even though I was expecting the price to go lower. |
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You could place an order for $665.99 or $667
I got a bit at $667 and above, I saw 4 offers of $666, but none at $665 or below |
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Price seems very unnervingly flat, I bought $300 worth of coins at 670 yesterday, sure price dropped 4 dollars, but I have a bad feeling.
I bought from $687 down to $668 I'm trying to see some $650, my thought is $700 may arrive again on Friday, I know we saw it twice this week, and it may not come again for a while but I'm thinking Friday is good for another $700 apparance. |
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Academically it made sense to purchase btc at $666 over the past 24 hrs, but I refused to pull the trigger on that, I just don't want to see those consecutive 6s for any longer than necessary.
anyone grab up any $666 btc?
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I agree with this but some points will be hard to get audit.
I can compare an exchange as gaming platform. Example playtech software who is an author of casino software. So such software company make the exchange software and exchange operators buy licence. Software is created in profesional software firm where they gurantee bug free and hack proof software. It could be also usefull of prevention/detection if exchange operator doing inside trade with virtual coins/fiat.
you are right, however whatever can get done should be done, whatever cannot be done immediately should be placed on the 'things to do' list so that it is addressed at some future stage. until this whole Mt Gox matter is finally settled btc will fail to soar like it is designed to do. |
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You can add #0 to your list. Bitcoin Axiom #0 - If you do not have the private keys for your bitcoins, then you have no bitcoins.
If you deposit your bitcoins with an exchange then although their site may display an amount of bitcoins what you have is an IOU for a certain amount of bitcoins. An IOU is a form of debt, it only has value as long as it is honored. A significant portion of debt is never repaid. Bitcoin has no counterparty risk, a bitcoin IOU does have counterparty risk.
That argument is is both illogical and false. Saying it multiple times, louder, and with pretty colors only make it wrong on many different levels. Start with an exchanges terms of service to see what it is that they are contractually offering, align their terms and definitions with your understanding and how those square with actual law. Then you have the proper premises from which to argue one way or another. Use of terms like 'debt', 'iou', and 'repaid' all imply some sort of loan agreement, which is far from the case. |
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#11- never trust anyone with your BTC, if you cant control the address then you don't own the BTC, any non reputable, non regulated online service can go offline, and you will lose all your funds (the new term is Goxed)
The part in red is a growing and pervasive fallacy.
When you place your coins in the care of another, particularly for any specific purpose set forth by either of you and acknowledged by the other, you don't lose ownership to the coins. You don't need an account, or terms of service, to make a donation.
When you place your money in the care of an exchange, they have a responsibility for the care of those funds, the responsibility is actually higher than what they have for their own funds, nevertheless you don't lose ownership, just like you don't lose parental rights when you take your kids to school.
While I agree with you ... however you losing signing ability, which means it becomes very difficult to prove a transaction that originated from there is yours, especially with exchanges that don't put customer service very high on their to do list. I always withdraw from an exchange and send from my wallet if I'm "buying" something. M I'm 100% for your efforts to improve community standards and safety. I just don't want exchange responsibilities to shift to user responsibility, like teachers and schools blaming parents for their kids academic performance. The exchange is the fiduciary responsibility to care for the money placed in their care. That's the cased even if there is no terms of service. They are an exchange not a charity, they are supposed to get paid for their professionals service as detailed in their terms of service and fee schedule. My money ONLY becomes their money when they have earned it. BTC, as we have seen has tremendous price potential however we are where we are at because of the real and present insecurity of the whole marketplace, but mainly the exchanges. Once the exchanges step-up responsibly the btc rates will find those 4 digit heights yet again. |
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Quote from: nwtrades on Today at 02:33:54 AM
Due to the news of rampant thefts at Bitcoin exchanges this past week (Mt. Gox, Poloniex, Flexcoin) it is becoming apparent that there's a dire need for some security standards in the Bitcoin community to ensure compliance and build client trust. The media is jumping over every hack story that comes out and shouting that it's insecure. You can't blame people for thinking this way, because at this point it's a legitimate fear.
There is no question that we need a standard process for third party security experts to be able to review exchange processes and software from top to bottom. If you know of some sort of external security company that already does this, feel free to post.
Perhaps exchanges could be verified on a certain level of compliance and receive a letter or badge to post on their website for proof of audit. Maybe someone like Andreas Antonopoulos would be interested to open this discussion further.
Items to address in audit:
- Source code, deployment and version control procedures
- Bitcoin software and protocol implementation
- Server platform (software versions, port scanning, server logging, brute force protections, DDOS protection, backups, redundancy, etc)
- Emergency shutdown and startup procedures
- Physical security (security cameras, electronic facility monitoring, alarm systems, swipe-cards, etc)
- Use of AML / KYC procedures and encrypted offsite storage of client documents
- Offsite cold storage (multiple locations) and use of keys, with logs of all activity
- Onsite hot wallet and use of keys
- Minimum of email verification or 2-Factor Authentication mandatory for withdrawals on all client accounts
- Options for clients to set a withdrawal limit on their account (similar to a bank)
- Alerts available for unusual activity on client accounts, with additional verification option (email or phone call) in case of sudden large withdrawals
- Staff background checks
- Staff fraud prevention training
- On-site restrictions for staff electronics and storage devices
- Restricted access areas for developers and system-critical staff
- Procedures for reporting illegal or suspicious activity to law enforcement
I will add to this as more feedback comes in. PLEASE contribute! This is a great community and the development of this ecosystem is happening and will continue happening thanks to you!
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Due to the news of rampant thefts at Bitcoin exchanges this past week (Mt. Gox, Poloniex, Flexcoin) it is becoming apparent that there's a dire need for some security standards in the Bitcoin community to ensure compliance and build client trust. The media is jumping over every hack story that comes out and shouting that it's insecure. You can't blame people for thinking this way, because at this point it's a legitimate fear.
There is no question that we need a standard process for third party security experts to be able to review exchange processes and software from top to bottom. If you know of some sort of external security company that already does this, feel free to post.
Perhaps exchanges could be verified on a certain level of compliance and receive a letter or badge to post on their website for proof of audit. Maybe someone like Andreas Antonopoulos would be interested to open this discussion further.
Items to address in audit:
- Source code, deployment and version control procedures
- Bitcoin software and protocol implementation
- Server platform (software versions, port scanning, server logging, brute force protections, DDOS protection, backups, redundancy, etc)
- Emergency shutdown and startup procedures
- Physical security (security cameras, electronic facility monitoring, alarm systems, swipe-cards, etc)
- Use of AML / KYC procedures and encrypted offsite storage of client documents
- Offsite cold storage (multiple locations) and use of keys, with logs of all activity
- Onsite hot wallet and use of keys
- Minimum of email verification or 2-Factor Authentication mandatory for withdrawals on all client accounts
- Options for clients to set a withdrawal limit on their account (similar to a bank)
- Alerts available for unusual activity on client accounts, with additional verification option (email or phone call) in case of sudden large withdrawals
- Staff background checks
- Staff fraud prevention training
- On-site restrictions for staff electronics and storage devices
- Restricted access areas for developers and system-critical staff
- Procedures for reporting illegal or suspicious activity to law enforcement
I will add to this as more feedback comes in. PLEASE contribute! This is a great community and the development of this ecosystem is happening and will continue happening thanks to you!
Great work, I applaud it, the initiative shows a genuine concern for the fundamentals of the system. I will add that to: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=492776.0;topicseen |
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We should open the Bitcoin Bank?
there are two in the world that I know of. Provide links. Where? do a search for 1st bitcoin bank in the world, you will see a listing then in the listing it will refer to an earlier bitcoin bank with a name like 'bitcom bank of islam' they do interest I'll try to find them again here is one: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=21732.0 |
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We should open the Bitcoin Bank?
there are two in the world that I know of. |
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Just wanna know what is the legal stand of Canada on Bitcoins..? because this incidents appears like RBC treats bitcoins as drugs, is it a problem with a particular bank..!
It's still quite a grey area, it's legal as far as I know but since we have an oligopoly of 6 banks here, they do whatever they want and that's a real problem. well now you have the opportunity to test the limits of bitcoin to the fullest instead of looking for another bank, look for ways to work around the banks only using btc, call it forced progress or you can spearhead a bitcoin foundation of canada and start talking to the banks, central banks, and any other national financial regulators to have btc respected if not codified I hate the very notion of a bank looking analyzing my account outside of the numbers. |
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Domain Name For Sale #23 ---> www.CRYPTOCURRENCYECONOMY.COM $100,000. I will consider all offers, including but not limited to: trade, a partnership arrangement with the domain being my equity contribution. or good old (or new) fashion currency Yes, I have other cryptocurrency domains available for sale and am willing to bundle, click above link to see other names. |
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to people who think that they do take security seriously, please it is time to do some revision, I am reading around and I see a shocking amount of hacks and fraud going on for the last couple of days.
so you may consider:
1- check if you have all security features that your exchange offers already activated.
2- make sure that you use one of the best antivirus programs on the computer you use to browse around and make sure it is up to date.
3- don't leave funds on exchanges, if you daily trade and you have leave any funds there, then make sure to use e-mail confirmations and that your e-mail also has 2FA.
4- make sure that you use only one phone/device which is not rooted, and do not install garbage bitcoin apps or any other app games/garbage.
5- use paper wallets for your long term investment and save them in a safe place.
6- keep the for-daily use coins on an offline computer, use Armory, sign offline transaction and broadcast them on an online pc.
7- use different passwords on all sites, make them complicated and long (capital letters small letters, numbers and special characters)
8- don't keep any track of your passwords, keys or anything else on your computer, do it the old fashion way, write on a paper and save it somewhere safe.
9- encrypt about anything, I would recommend you to encrypt your entire dist as well, if you use linux this option is offered when installing the system, if you use windows then try PGP whole disk encryption, I use it and I recommend it.
10- use avg anti virus on your phone/device, activate the relocation option, there is also an option to wipe-out the device by sending a SMS to your phone if lost or stolen.
11- never trust anyone with your BTC, if you cant control the address then you don't own the BTC, any non reputable, non regulated online service can go offline, and you will lose all your funds (the new term is Goxed)
12- dont click on links without being sure where they direct, you can simply put the mouse cursor on it without clicking and check the address bar if it is a legit link, deactivate automatic redirection in your browser so you cant be tricked.
13- don't open e-mails from unknown sources, especially don't open spam e-mail, if you have to do so, then make sure to not open any executable attachment or any .pif extension, judge any site asking you to install "java plugin" or a "flash player" if YouTube works for you than you don't need any flash player or additional extensions, you are being a victim of a phishing attempt.
14- don't install any opensource software if you don't know what the code does, if can review the code your self then don't install without verifying the signature, especially don't install wallets of the daily created scam coins, some might be created just to steal your coins.
these are just some of the safety practices I can think about now, any user is welcome to add anything I might have forgotten to this list.
One of these should be made for exchanges as well so that they know how to secure the btc in their care. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=492776.0;topicseen#11- never trust anyone with your BTC, if you cant control the address then you don't own the BTC, any non reputable, non regulated online service can go offline, and you will lose all your funds (the new term is Goxed)The part in red is a growing and pervasive fallacy. When you place your coins in the care of another, particularly for any specific purpose set forth by either of you and acknowledged by the other, you don't lose ownership to the coins. You don't need an account, or terms of service, to make a donation. When you place your money in the care of an exchange, they have a responsibility for the care of those funds, the responsibility is actually higher than what they have for their own funds, nevertheless you don't lose ownership, just like you don't lose parental rights when you take your kids to school. . |
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Truth or lie, doesn't matter the fact of the matter is the btc protocol needs more security Exchanges who used it should be more transparent such that their transactions are signed (verified) One weaknesses of the protocol has already been exposed: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=492776.0;topicseennow the community is fighting hard to uncover more weaknesses, not to exploit them, but to know what parts of the infrastructure needs replacement. When you find the flaws, when you fix the flaws, you create a more secure protocol, and you create a more secure environment for the community to thrive |
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the only way btc hits $1000 again is with some level of stability, it won't happen the way it happened the first or second time -- driven in the hypemobile. Hype is cool when you have something real but when it turns out that you have a major security flaw: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=492776.0;topicseenthat flaw must be address before the hypemobile can travel on it's merry way again. |
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bump for the morning crowd
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A valuation based on empirical evidence, critical thinking and logical reasoning makes sense.
And non of that was seen in your post. You are talking out of your ass you're a moron ... what was it that you didn't see? - you didn't see the valuation? - you don't understand what "based on" means? - you need someone to spoon feed you charts, and links to media and forum hype? - do you even know what 'critical thinking' and or 'logical reasoning' is? don't even bother to answer you're on ignore ... |
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Seriously, we are excited about $700 now? We were over $1000 just 3 months ago... we are aiming too low my brothers
BTC in all reality has an true market value of $400, it's unreasonable to appraise it any higher on practical grounds. Given that the gox matter is not finally resolved we are exremely lucky it isn't on a perpetual downward slide. The simple fact is most of btc's success is hype driven driven so hard it stuck (no one does it better than dodgecoin), if you remove the media hype and all other hype btc is worth $400. What do you think raised the market value from avg $565 to present avg $685? Certainly not the app, it was three things: 1) the market movement, 2) the hype ABOUT something new to come and 3) to a far less degree the app The market responded MOST to NOTHING -- was was actually people trading because the market was rising, and responded least to the actual app, what a shame that the news about 'something about to be announced' garnered more market appreciation than the actual news -- the very definition of anticlimactic. You could expect the market to shave off some %s in the coming days unless there is sustained hype until some meaningful changes is applied to the protocol or how exchanges are fundamentally doing business. Did you just pull $400 out of your rear or something? Why $400? Why not $380? Why not $182.25? Why not $5.75? Here's essentially what I did, I took the organic growth (meaningful development not influenced by gratuitous hype) of btc and projected it forward. . Last month that number was $500, now it's $400, next week it will be $380. It dropped from $500 to $400 because two of the vehicles I counted as meaningful developments for long-term sustainable btc growth proved less effective then what should reasonable be expected. The first was the Bitcoin Foundation - a major development for btc which lost significant credibility when TWO of its founding directors resigned under clouds. And the BitcoinTalk forum - a major development for btc (and the whole cryptocurrency community). However, the community came up short in 3 ways: 1) the petition to remove Mark from the board should have gotten at least 1% of the membership within a week, it didn't 2) After Gox stopped withdrawals, organized efforts should have resulted in substantially less financial loss for the community, 3) the ongoing inability of the community to get from the blockchain what it needs to be reasonable informed, and subsequently being unable to receive adequate accountability, transparency, and security from the exchanges. As of last week, everyone knows or should know that what occurred to Mt Gox could easily reoccur multiple times, yet there has been not meaningful upgrades to the btc infrastructure. Nor has the exchanges filled in that 'insecurity gap' with assurances, guarantees, bonding, insurance, certification, proof of solvency, etc ... as such the $400 will decrease to $380 next week. Follow that forward, without meaningful change in a month the true value of btc will be $100. A valuation based on empirical evidence, critical thinking and logical reasoning makes sense. |
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