What if he wants to mine even if he thinks the price is going to drop? Why wouldn't he, if he can still make a profit on it (and a larger one if he gets the BTC today, but the price drops before the contract ends)?
If the price goes up, he looses. If the price stays the same, he looses. If the price goes down a little, he breaks even. If the price goes down a lot, then he wins. If the price is going to go down a lot, he'll make a much bigger profit by selling the hardware now. There's clearly enough interest in mining contracts, especially moderately priced ones. I don't see the point in selling them at a loss. He could easily sell them for a small profit. If the price goes down a lot, why would he make a much bigger profit by selling the hardware now, vs selling it in 7 days after the first contract is completed? Selling now: $5000 in hardware Selling in 7 days: $5000 in hardware + $246.22 in BTC. I would agree with you that I don't see the point in selling them at a loss, but that's his choice. He'll still make money on it, and that's all that is important to him. There is no way to know whether I am selling this contract at a loss until it is completed. My current contract was sold when BTC was $11.15/BTC.....today it is down to $8.9/BTC. If the price continues to plummet, I will be better off having traded 30 BTC of declining value for 26 BTC @ $11.15. (Yes, I sold them). I really hope this is the last time I have to explain this. Questioning why I am "selling at a loss" is not only the wrong question, it is somewhat ignorant. |
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No wonder you have a waiting list. You are selling contracts at a loss. Why??? For 30 BTC your farm will generate 33 BTC, since there's virtually zero chance of difficulty changing significantly in the coming week.
Ahhh, but what if the exchange rate is cut in half by next week? We discussed this earlier in the thread.....pretty straightforward. |
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I can see that I can expect to lose out on another oppourtunity cus :
a.I'm too late (for when bitcion first arrived to make serious $$$) as I'm unable to keep up plus no1 rly cared to tell me when it first opened in 2009.
b.Price for mining contracts keeps going up (from my experience despite numerous offers,no one but 3 suppliers care about them)
c.Profit margins are getting thinner with each 'upgrade' of a contract.I feel that mining contracts are taking the mick in pricing now.The person has very low elec rates yet the end price is high :-/ (I honestly think that hardware can easily be paid off with loads more lower priced users more quicker than a few high paying users)
d.Difficulty rises means I get less BTC for my efforts
e.BTC value either drops a lot in a day or rises but never stays there.Value is unstable
f.If you wish to make bitcoin more acceptable as a currency to every1 (not just us miners),then add hte fairness bit where things have either a 'stabiliser' where things are kept stable or introduce 'relief' periods where in times of really low BTc value,there is a chance for hte currency to recover and when it's too high (too expensive for hte buyers),lower it to a more reasonable level.(I can only propose solutions as I lack programming knowledge to create my own currency).in life currency fluctuates all the time but not to ridiculous extremes which seems to happen on a regular basis from all the time that I was involved in mining of btc since late May 2011.
I wish to profit without the artificially created barriers and expense I constantly face.Well I feel that's happened for me because:
a.I'm a investor that likes to spend a more modest amount of money (not $1000's like some people can with hardware or buying bitcoins via exchanges) but expect proportional returns instead of like £74 investment in BTC giving me £5 profit.People I know who are able can spend HUGE amounts of money and profit like overnight yet I can't spend much and still take ages to pay off hardware and elec bills
b.I have extra challenges like bugdet cutbacks,living in a place where people complain about the heat,noise and power use of my mining rigs even a little.I have no access to alternative energy which would otherwise make my elec bill free instead of like $0.40 per kwh now in UK.
I don't wish to sound like a hater or a complainer so plz don't flame me.I'm simply getting some opinions off my chest as things have been very difficult for me in the btc world recently.
The return on hardware investment (excluding electricity cost) is the same for someone who buys $500 worth of mining gear, or $50,000. I can understand how $.40 power would make BTC mining a monstrous pain. Just for the record, I don't think it is possible for people to "spend HUGE amounts on money and profit overnight". If that was the case, everyone and their mother would be spending every cent they had to reap instant profits. |
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I'm curious how much your electricity bill is lol. Also how big are you trying to make your farm? You seem to constantly be adding to it.
I live in the second cheapest state for power.....YA FOR HYDROELECTRIC DAMS! My last bill was just over $200 bucks.....my rate was .08 per KW/h...and that rate goes down in about a month. |
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Here is an update for all of you who are interested in my next contract:
I have had several PM's asking me to reserve this slot, but I feel it will be more fair to put it out there publicly for everyone.
My hash rate is climbing, and I am now closer to an average of 9,000 MH/s. (added 600MH/s last night alone).
The next available contract will begin August 30th at 7:00PM EST. It will run through September 6 at 7:00PM EST.
-I will garauntee an average of 8,500 MH/s for the 7 day run
-Buyer will be pro-rated a refund for any downtime or hashing deficiency
-As always, any increase in power over the contract term is yours
The price is 30 BTC.
If you would like to reserve this contract, reply with your address, and send 10 BTC to my address.
The balance of 20 BTC will be paid as follows:
10 BTC on August 30th, prior to commencement of the contract
10 BTC on September 2nd, no later than 7:00PM EST
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My next 3 contracts are spoken for. Price is firm, and will actually go up as I add more power.
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You say guaranteed 8000MH/s - how can the renter be assured of this guarantee? The way I calculate it, I would make just over 35 BTC in 7 days with 8000MH/s. So why only charge 26 BTC? Do you just need a short-term loan?
Just trying to figure out "what's the catch". What is your reason for doing this?
I have a few reasons for doing this: 1) I want to establish credibility amongst the BTC community. I think engaging in some short term mining contracts, and delivering exactly what I promise (or over-deliver) will be a good start. 2) I doubt anyone will buy a contract if it only pays back what you purchased it for. Selling it at a discount benefits the buyer (ie, higher expected payout than purchase price), and also benefits me (I know I have 26 BTC at todays price versus 35 BTC at an unknown future price). Business engage in this type of transaction constantly.....albeit perhaps not at this much of a discount. As for the 8,000 MH/s garauntee.....I will be sending the buyer my pool stats periodically so he can independently confirm the mining speed. I suppose I could fake these, but if I was not delivering the stated speed, surely it would be reflected in abnormally low pay-outs. I've been working on getting my own mining farm set up and I have come up with the same reasoning on deciding how mining contracts should be priced. The miner is able to hedge their exposure to the USD/BTC exchange rate by selling their production forward. The speculator (person buying the contract) is assuming the exchange rate risk and is therefore being compensated by being able to purchase the future production at a discount. There could be occasions where someone may actually pay more to take delivery a commodity at future date, such as when the cost of storing the commodity is fairly expensive and there is a cost associated with holding the commodity, but that is not the case with BTC. Perfect explanation.....Contango vs backwardation.....just like any commodity. |
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You say guaranteed 8000MH/s - how can the renter be assured of this guarantee? The way I calculate it, I would make just over 35 BTC in 7 days with 8000MH/s. So why only charge 26 BTC? Do you just need a short-term loan?
Just trying to figure out "what's the catch". What is your reason for doing this?
I have a few reasons for doing this: 1) I want to establish credibility amongst the BTC community. I think engaging in some short term mining contracts, and delivering exactly what I promise (or over-deliver) will be a good start. 2) I doubt anyone will buy a contract if it only pays back what you purchased it for. Selling it at a discount benefits the buyer (ie, higher expected payout than purchase price), and also benefits me (I know I have 26 BTC at todays price versus 35 BTC at an unknown future price). Business engage in this type of transaction constantly.....albeit perhaps not at this much of a discount. As for the 8,000 MH/s garauntee.....I will be sending the buyer my pool stats periodically so he can independently confirm the mining speed. I suppose I could fake these, but if I was not delivering the stated speed, surely it would be reflected in abnormally low pay-outs. |
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What cards are you using and how many systems do you have?
I have a tentative deal, but I will regale you with my stats anyway. 5 x 6970 10 x 6950 3 x 5830 3 x 5850 6 x 5770 These cards are spread over 20 workstations. |
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lol gl this time. Last thread was hilarious though  I noticed you were enjoying the show.....  perhaps you should buy the contract this time around?! |
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I am going to try this again.....my last offer led to confusion and bizarre counter-offers.
I own a mining operation that hashes at a minumum of 7,500 MH/s, and gets closer to 9,000 MH/s in the evening. Over the last week I have averaged just over 8,000 MH/s. I am willing to rent out this "farm" to interested parties.
Terms are as follows:
1) 7 day contract
2) Guaranteed 8,000 MH/s average over the contract term
3) MINING WILL BE DONE AT MY CURRENT POOL, you will merely recieve the pay-outs. I will set auto payment for every 2.5 BTC
4) Any increase in mining power over the contract is yours, gratis. (I am continually adding GPU's)
5) Payment is to be made half in advance, half at the midpoint of the contract.
Price: 26 BTC
My terms are firm, please DO NOT ask for something different. If no one is interested, I am glad to keep hashing away and keeping the BTC myself.
If you would like to purchase this contract, reply with your BTC address and send your initial payment to my BTC address (which can be found below).
Thanks!
UPDATE: I have sold this contract. I am considering selling another 7 day contract upon completion of this one. If interested, feel free to respond or PM.
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not to put a damper on this party.. I'm just wondering why yall want to rent his farm for what pretty much amounts to the same predicted btc profit value? the only thing I can see where you would come out ahead is on another difficulty drop and then you get what 4% on your investment?(and yeah DavinciJ15 i know your on namecoin.. which just confuses me more ) If you are counting on rally then why not just buy the coins? You could have the coins today at todays price. not trying to bust up your business adventure yochdog, I'm just trying to get into the heads of the buyers. I imagine many people who buy contracts might not want to go through the hassle of funding an online exchange account. Let's face it, it is not the most seemless process in the world. I certainly cannot speak for the interested parties, but I know that is why I mine rather than buy BTC on an exchange. -Y |
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Alright, here's the deal:
First person to send me 11.5 BTC to my wallet (see signature) will secure my 7,000+ MH/s for 72 hours.
This will serve as a trial run for the buyer, as well as show the forum members that I am a trustworthy trade partner.
If you want to take this "trial" contract, simply reply with your BTC address and send the 11.5 BTC to me. Once the transaction is confirmed, I will begin the 72 hour run and post the start and end times on this thread.
As I stated before, the payout will be sent every 2.5 BTC mined. At the end of the 72 hours, I will send the remaining balance.
First person to respond with their address and make payment secures the contract.
GO!
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I appreciate the offer, but my terms are firm.
Absolutely will not accept Paypal.....too many horror stories that direction.
You can look up my ebay profile.....prefect feedback. Don't know if that helps. I am kind of stuck in a chicken/egg thing here.....I don't have a long trail of trusted transactions, so you are reticent to engage is a transaction that would help me build said trail.
Maybe we could work out a show of good faith? We could start with you paying me 3 days worth of the contract price, and I set the pool payout to your wallet? Then we could go from there.
Ok Lets start with 3 days in the mean time I will check you out and go from there... What is your ebay profile? Do yo have any other credits on the web? Post the bitcoin address and the amount you want me to send for the 3 days here in this forum. This way others can confirm it. Cheers 11.5 BTC for 3 days. My Ebay profile is "Yochdog". I do not have any other credits on the web. I will get you my address tonight when I am prepared to start the 72 hour run. I will need your address to direct the payments. Ok, You need to go to my pool and mine at nmcbit.com Just leave the address blank. FYI The other guy bidding film2240, he has a youtube page and his top favorite is a video of me where someone had spent a lot of time editing to make it seem that I think bitcoin is a scam. Not sure if it's the same guy. http://www.youtube.com/user/film2240Just a heads up. Take the time to check out my channel.... http://www.youtube.com/user/davincij15Cheers Dj I thought I made it clear that I am not reprogramming my miners.....If someone buys the contract, I will point the payouts to the address of their choice. |
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I appreciate the offer, but my terms are firm.
Absolutely will not accept Paypal.....too many horror stories that direction.
You can look up my ebay profile.....prefect feedback. Don't know if that helps. I am kind of stuck in a chicken/egg thing here.....I don't have a long trail of trusted transactions, so you are reticent to engage is a transaction that would help me build said trail.
Maybe we could work out a show of good faith? We could start with you paying me 3 days worth of the contract price, and I set the pool payout to your wallet? Then we could go from there.
Ok Lets start with 3 days in the mean time I will check you out and go from there... What is your ebay profile? Do yo have any other credits on the web? Post the bitcoin address and the amount you want me to send for the 3 days here in this forum. This way others can confirm it. Cheers 11.5 BTC for 3 days. My Ebay profile is "Yochdog". I do not have any other credits on the web. I will get you my address tonight when I am prepared to start the 72 hour run. I will need your address to direct the payments. |
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OK, first I apologize for the confusion over my offer. I was looking to gauge interest, and it certainly looks like there is a lot out there.
After entertaining offers, thinking I had a deal worked out, and now that has fallen through.....I will offer the following, and very specifically:
1) I own a farm that hashes at an average 7,000+ MH/s (rate goes up during the night when additional machines kick on)
2) I am willing to rent out this farm on a 30 day contract
3) I am not willing to reprogram my miners
4) Whoever buys the contract will recieve the payout from my current pool, directed to the wallet of your choice.
5) payouts will be set to automatically be sent every 2.5 BTC
6) I have averaged 4.00 BTC per day over the last 2 weeks
The price for the contract is $1,300 or 115 BTC.
I will accept either a certified check or Money order as payment if you choose to pay with USD.
I will pay your price if... 1. you mine at my pool 2. you accept paypal for the upfront payment because I don't know you. 3. you agree to give me 30 actual days of 7,000+ MH/s within 45 days. I have a reputation a search on my name shows you who I am can you say that about your alias? If you can show me a history of good faith deals I may adjust my terms. I have similar feelling to Davinchi.I'll buy your service if: 1.You can accept USd by Moneybookers to prove to me that you are indeed reputable 2.Lower the price back to $1000 USD as I feel that's fair due to what created interest for your services in the first place. 3.Give me the justification for the price hike. 4.keep all machines running and enable all spare capacity at night as promised 5.Show me a WOT (Web of trust or equivalent way of showing that you are reputable) 6.If the reputation is particulary outstanding (to my standards-no blemish on reputation and absolutely no service incidents-e.g. downed miners or disputes with customers over terms of contract),I will meet you half way on paying the asking price but I still expect a discount. If you can match this criteria,sign me up asap :-) UPDATE:I'll take your service but I'll pay $71 from my moneybookers account to show good faith then we will go from there :-) 1) I will look into Moneybookers, but I am really not keen on opening yet ANOTHER online money-service account. 2) My price is firm 3) My MH/s rate is consistantly exceeding 7,000 over the last 2 days....that overage benefits the buyer. 4) Absolutely.....I will even pro-rate a refund for any deficiency. 5) My Ebay ID is Yochdog.....I have flawless feedback. 6) This is my first attempt to sell a mining contract UPDATE: are you saying you will pay the full $1,300 through Moneybookers? |
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OK, first I apologize for the confusion over my offer. I was looking to gauge interest, and it certainly looks like there is a lot out there.
After entertaining offers, thinking I had a deal worked out, and now that has fallen through.....I will offer the following, and very specifically:
1) I own a farm that hashes at an average 7,000+ MH/s (rate goes up during the night when additional machines kick on)
2) I am willing to rent out this farm on a 30 day contract
3) I am not willing to reprogram my miners
4) Whoever buys the contract will recieve the payout from my current pool, directed to the wallet of your choice.
5) payouts will be set to automatically be sent every 2.5 BTC
6) I have averaged 4.00 BTC per day over the last 2 weeks
The price for the contract is $1,300 or 115 BTC.
I will accept either a certified check or Money order as payment if you choose to pay with USD.
I will pay your price if... 1. you mine at my pool 2. you accept paypal for the upfront payment because I don't know you. 3. you agree to give me 30 actual days of 7,000+ MH/s within 45 days. I have a reputation a search on my name shows you who I am can you say that about your alias? If you can show me a history of good faith deals I may adjust my terms. I appreciate the offer, but my terms are firm. Absolutely will not accept Paypal.....too many horror stories that direction. You can look up my ebay profile.....prefect feedback. Don't know if that helps. I am kind of stuck in a chicken/egg thing here.....I don't have a long trail of trusted transactions, so you are reticent to engage is a transaction that would help me build said trail. Maybe we could work out a show of good faith? We could start with you paying me 3 days worth of the contract price, and I set the pool payout to your wallet? Then we could go from there. |
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I'm not interested but why is it that big of a deal to point the miners to the buyers choosing?
2 reasons: 1) I really don't want to spend the time to go reprogram 20 machines in 3 different locations. 2) I can better monitor the miners and fix problems quickly using my own pool account. |
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OK, first I apologize for the confusion over my offer. I was looking to gauge interest, and it certainly looks like there is a lot out there.
After entertaining offers, thinking I had a deal worked out, and now that has fallen through.....I will offer the following, and very specifically:
1) I own a farm that hashes at an average 7,000+ MH/s (rate goes up during the night when additional machines kick on)
2) I am willing to rent out this farm on a 30 day contract
3) I am not willing to reprogram my miners
4) Whoever buys the contract will recieve the payout from my current pool, directed to the wallet of your choice.
5) payouts will be set to automatically be sent every 2.5 BTC
6) I have averaged 4.00 BTC per day over the last 2 weeks
The price for the contract is $1,300 or 115 BTC.
I will accept either a certified check or Money order as payment if you choose to pay with USD.
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I have made arrangements....thanks for all the offers.
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