Well, I guess I could try to handle it... What do you mean by "filthy" rich? Define "Filthy." |
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Those funds are no more. They have has ceased to be. They have expired and gone to meet Satoshi. They are late funds. They are vapor. Bereft of existence, they rest in peace. If Karpeles hadn't left them on the balance sheet, they would've been written off ages ago. They've rung down the curtain and joined the choir invisible. They are ex-funds.
They are not gone, just pining for the blockchain... Beautiful funds, those bitcoins. This whole matter is far from being concluded... there is a lot of sorting that still NEEDS to be done. I am sure that we DO NOT know the half of the financial situation of Mt. Gox and the extent to which it may be feasible to either reopen or to reimburse customers.... these details are going to be worked out in the coming weeks.. and maybe months. Dude, Gox was run into the ground. It was hollowed out completely. Karpeles didn't stop burning money until there was no more left to burn. It may take time to know the details or we may never know the details, but that doesn't change the relevant fact that Gox was bled dry. Denial is one of the stages of grief so it's ok, but acceptance is the last. See you there. Why do YOU want to argue... ? You are speculating.. .and surely, I agree that there is a lot of inferential evidence pointing to bad conduct and/or fraud... however, it is far from certain, still. I am NOT in denial... I have NO stake in the outcome... except for the fact that I am invested in BTC.>>> but in either event, I will ake my investment decision based on facts.. rather than what continues to appear to be ambiguous speculation. It is also far from clear about the extent of the fall out... ONCE that is made a little more clear, we will have a further market reaction (yes we already had some market reaction to this news).... and surely, the markets are going to begin to react.. far from any point of my knowing.. b/c there also seems to be quite a bit of insider trading going on in this BTC market..... ... If BTC is NOT going to survive, then I am going to pull my investment; however, I tend to believe that the signs for the health of BTC, overall are positive. So, in that regard, I conclude that I do NOT have enough evidence to be in denial.. and you do not have enough either... hehehehehe  Good, anger- that's the next stage. You're making progress. NOW you are engaging in attacking the person and making labels rather than talking substance... Maybe you are just arguing for the sake of it b/c you have made NO point, yet.. except to make attempts at criticizing me in some kind of aloof way... what is your point, exactly? You are acting as if you has some high and mighty inside knowledge or what? If so, give me your sources. |
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The bull case is being shouted down, but not by quality arguments. Look at the chart. I'd like to get a TA analysis by someone like TERA or another respected chartist. It looks ready to break out to the upside to me.
We CANNOT go upside with all this GOX uncertainty still looming in the public eye... even if some people here believe that the evidence is unambiguously clear. The public information remains far from clear... at this point... so I predict the top that we can get would be below $700... absent some resolution regarding the GOX situation. |
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Those funds are no more. They have has ceased to be. They have expired and gone to meet Satoshi. They are late funds. They are vapor. Bereft of existence, they rest in peace. If Karpeles hadn't left them on the balance sheet, they would've been written off ages ago. They've rung down the curtain and joined the choir invisible. They are ex-funds.
They are not gone, just pining for the blockchain... Beautiful funds, those bitcoins. This whole matter is far from being concluded... there is a lot of sorting that still NEEDS to be done. I am sure that we DO NOT know the half of the financial situation of Mt. Gox and the extent to which it may be feasible to either reopen or to reimburse customers.... these details are going to be worked out in the coming weeks.. and maybe months. Dude, Gox was run into the ground. It was hollowed out completely. Karpeles didn't stop burning money until there was no more left to burn. It may take time to know the details or we may never know the details, but that doesn't change the relevant fact that Gox was bled dry. Denial is one of the stages of grief so it's ok, but acceptance is the last. See you there. Why do YOU want to argue... ? You are speculating.. .and surely, I agree that there is a lot of inferential evidence pointing to bad conduct and/or fraud... however, it is far from certain, still. I am NOT in denial... I have NO stake in the outcome... except for the fact that I am invested in BTC.>>> but in either event, I will ake my investment decision based on facts.. rather than what continues to appear to be ambiguous speculation. It is also far from clear about the extent of the fall out... ONCE that is made a little more clear, we will have a further market reaction (yes we already had some market reaction to this news).... and surely, the markets are going to begin to react.. far from any point of my knowing.. b/c there also seems to be quite a bit of insider trading going on in this BTC market..... ... If BTC is NOT going to survive, then I am going to pull my investment; however, I tend to believe that the signs for the health of BTC, overall are positive. So, in that regard, I conclude that I do NOT have enough evidence to be in denial.. and you do not have enough either... hehehehehe |
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^ bad news, but I don't think it will flash crash us back down to $400. Oh well.
What do you think, then? Maybe we may crash in the upper $400s... once again.. and then slowly move upwards... until we are over this GOX situation... actually the GOX situation is one that is still quite filled with speculation... there is NOT really a solid indication, yet b/c once there is a solid indications, the market is going to move either up or down... but ultimately it will be moving up... .. just may be stalled a little bit before getting there... depending on the travesty of the situation. |
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Those funds are no more. They have has ceased to be. They have expired and gone to meet Satoshi. They are late funds. They are vapor. Bereft of existence, they rest in peace. If Karpeles hadn't left them on the balance sheet, they would've been written off ages ago. They've rung down the curtain and joined the choir invisible. They are ex-funds.
They are not gone, just pining for the blockchain... Beautiful funds, those bitcoins. This whole matter is far from being concluded... there is a lot of sorting that still NEEDS to be done. I am sure that we DO NOT know the half of the financial situation of Mt. Gox and the extent to which it may be feasible to either reopen or to reimburse customers.... these details are going to be worked out in the coming weeks.. and maybe months. |
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Even if the legislation itself is NOT successful... the mere introduction of such could be a leveraging point to begin a dialogue concerning perceived threats and/or "problems" with bitcoin and/or other crypto currencies. |
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Meanwhile at the Goxbury...  This would look a lot better if there were a cat in there, somewhere... hehehehe I'm telling you.. we might just shoot straight to $700. I know it sounds crazy..  Seems like we gotta go down, to $520 or so before going up... ... then maybe $700 is possible maybe by the end of the week... .... well I know anything is possible.. but I am just saying.. all the gloomy news... we gotta go down a bit more first. |
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@ .2% comission that is still 1,600 dollars and for what? That is .2% for sell plus .2% for buying ... so would be .4% in fees... unless it is some kind of insider with a special no fee arrangement. In other words... I doubt it is the same person.... at least NOT in large proportions |
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...and me using bitcoin cannot possibly tell me anything relevant to the sources of my skepticism.
So wrong Jorge. With the best will in the world you should really know better. Would you expect the same from a student? Seriously. Download Bitcoin-QT. Sign up to an exchange. Buy yourself 0.1 BTC and spend some of it on junk. To continue to plough this much time and effort into researching cryptocurrencies without having gone through that simple step seems daft. WOW... I agree with this!!! I cannot see how anyone who is spending lots of time with BTC should at least have a little bit to play around with in order to see how it really works... to open up a few accounts... too...
People speculate on the BTC/USD pair (or BTC/crypto) just like they speculate on EUR/USD for instance. They all do it to make more money, because that's what speculators do. Now Bitcoin is a very young currency and still in its volatile growth phase, so it makes sense that more people are holding on to their coins for a longer period of time compared to Euros or Dollars for instance. This is going to change eventually as merchant adoption and the userbase grows. It won't be as easy to move the price around as much when BTC is a trillion dollar market.
Ok, I'll try to explain with more clarity. Maybe there is a language barrier that confuses you. Currencies at forex = attractive for tradingBTC = Attractive for investmentFiat currencies are unattractive as investments because they are inflationary and there is a good logic behind it. People are not making money on forex by investing into a currency, but they are making money by trading currencies with one another and make profit by value fluctuation. People at forex are not investing, but they are trading. I tried to be as clear as possible. GREAT explanation... |
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I think that these are the kinds of shenanigans that could keep BTC prices low and BTC in a state of slower growth and volatility... ... I think some lawmakers believe that they need to do something about BTC while it is still fairly small... ... but they do NOT realize that the cannot stop BTC ... but only to drive it underground.... Once we get past this stage and some of these shenanigans... then we are going to be looking at 10K+ BTCs |
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It is going down - 500 to be tested soon.
Reason: we are not that much below the long-term trend, so given the sentiment, we are "hanging in the air" when the solid ground is in 400-500, below that is a steal and above that is hopes.
Well, I hope you are right, I had a large deposit which hit today Bitstamp and I placed all my bids between $520 and $400. Doesn't look too good ATM to be honest, but patience is a virtue. There's $23m+ on stamp's order book. where did that come from? i find it hard to believe all the people that got goxed that want to buy coins again sent their fiat to stamp so quickly.
Well, a little bit of that is mine. I guess that many bitcoiners followed the same line of thought I did: they got all excited by Gox going down, they smelled blood on the streets and they rushed to send as much fiat as possible to the exchanges to buy as many cheap coins as possible... And they failed. At least for now It is quite possible that there was quite a bit of money in fiat waiting in the reserves on bitstamp... and that money was NOT newly deposited into bitstamp today. However, now that there seems to be some quasi-resolution to the GOX situation (which still remains quite unclear), some investors are putting in their buy orders with their fiat and so NOW all that reserve fiat, is suddenly showing up on the books. I would venture to bet that there is quite a bit more fiat in the reserves waiting for a clearer signal regarding a GOX resolution and to thereafter jump in. When that GOX resolution comes, we will truly have to da moon momentum.. UNLESS there is some new shenanigans (what could that be? government sabotage of sorts?) |
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"How early adopters feel right now after the price went from $400 to $600 in a matter of hours"  I sold some at $525 - thinking the price would go back into the upper $400s before going up.... mostly based on the lack of an announcement from GOX... and all those potential disappeared BTC... that are likely floating in the market... and also the other potential crap involved in the even that GOX customers are NOT made whole... financially...... I have been considering whether to cut my losses and to buy back in, or just to wait it out, hopefully, for the BTC prices to go below $520, again... ... I hate taking a loss on any of my trading...... but I do NOT want to get left in the dust, either, with a portion of my BTC portfolio... haven been converted to $$$ at $525... Why not hold. Look back at it in 2 months time. It's always sell sell sell. I realize that we are in uncertain times... but I would hate to be left in the dust.... even though it does look like currently the market is moving in the right direction for me to recover... |
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"How early adopters feel right now after the price went from $400 to $600 in a matter of hours" I sold some at $525 - thinking the price would go back into the upper $400s before going up.... mostly based on the lack of an announcement from GOX... and all those potential disappeared BTC... that are likely floating in the market... and also the other potential crap involved in the even that GOX customers are NOT made whole... financially...... I have been considering whether to cut my losses and to buy back in, or just to wait it out, hopefully, for the BTC prices to go below $520, again... ... I hate taking a loss on any of my trading...... but I do NOT want to get left in the dust, either, with a portion of my BTC portfolio... haven been converted to $$$ at $525... Truly, the BTC market is going to react negatively, if Mt. Gox customers got screwed out of this dealeo... |
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Bring regulation tomorrow as far as I'm concerned. I'll never have problems sleeping being full in bitcoins then as that means to the moon ladies and gentleman.
Those who thought we're going to be left free forever to make millions without being regulated live in cuckooland.
Depends on where you live. Bitcoin and its exchanges/services won't be regulated everywhere. I don't live in USA but USA is all that matters for Bitcoin to prosper. So, US regulation is coming and I am very happy for it. Surely bitcoin will take different and varying paths depending upon the USA govt regulations.... Yet, even if the US govt were against bitcoin, bitcoin could still prosper if there are other governments or people around the world who find value in the bitcoin network. Nonetheless, I believe that I agree that some regulation may be helpful... especially when it may come to the potential of the stealing of money of customers, which may have happened with the Mt. Gox situation. |
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BitcoinRain was a Brazilian "bitcoin investment fund" that operated from Oct/2011 to Apr/2013. It took the investor's BTC and promised a minimum 9% monthly return in BTC to them.
Any fund that promises those kinds of returns is going to be a scam. That's a no-brainer. Nobody who makes real returns like that needs new investors. Obviously so. But what about an investment that promises a 10,000% return in 3 years? What's the starting point for that 10,000% return? What was the return between October 2011 and April 2013? How about 2014? Are we still going up? |
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Meanwile bitcoinbuilder has gone tits up, darnit...
YEAH>>>>> Bitcoinbuilder seems to be totally dependent on GOX in order to operate, NO? WERE BitcoinBuilder customers able to actually liquidate some of their Gox coins and to get real BTC from Bitcoinbuilder? I bet its the Winklevi that just bought out Gox!
That would inspire confidence, no? |
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Bonjour,
I've flicked through the last 20 pages to see if I missed anything -- but apart from the fact Mat is from Scotland (which explains everything) -- I can't find any news.
Apart from the market moving down, what news from Bitcoinland?
Yeah right!!!! That's quite the summary... that is way too summary... |
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Well just woken up and as per usual missed a lot of the action and chance to make some easy money.
Great to see we're doing some wall observing!
Predictions for the day then?
Mine: No gox announcement, price to fall back to around $100 in gox and stamp to follow to about $550
I don't think them clearing up their twitter of bot automated responses is a bad thing. If they deleted their twitter then maybe but just getting rid of their tweets is just a chance to spread more FUD for the manipulators
It seems that if we are NOT getting any additional news from GOX, then likely we will go to a little below $100 on Gox and in the lower $500s on Stamp... maybe $510-ish.... |
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You all seem to forget that its very likely 90% of the coins were sold by one person.
That is crazy talk!!!! Who is this supposed one person that "very likely" sold 90% of the BTC? The only reason
Please see my thread "problems besides mtgox" to learn about the 20 other things going on besides mtgox. read it and agree with most of it. Bitcoins not finished, but people paying + $600, are just clinging on to their dream in my opinion.. I might come back when BTC is back around $100. feel very sorry for those that brought and held at + $900 regulation issues legal issues technical issues community trust issues where would serious new investment come from under these conditions? Lol. There's enough fiat sitting in exchanges today to take the price to >$1500. Really. Some of you simply astound me. WindJC: I agree with your overall suggestion that currently BTC is undervalued - however, the mere fact that there is a lot of cash on reserve in the exchanges does NOT necessarily translate to that fiat raising the BTC price... .and that is for a couple of reasons.... first, there is always going to be a certain percentage of fiat on the reserves in the exchanges (maybe 10% or more).. maybe currently, fiat is at an all time high level on the exchanges.. and that would be another story to compare percentage of fiat now as compared to the average... second, some of that fiat may be destined to be removed.. but just has NOT been removed yet. .. that may be a small percentage.. but it maybe that some waiting to remove is going on... |
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