The Internet and the World Wide Web are two very different things. As someone who actually used the Internet before the World Wide Web existed I know, and yes the Internet was started by the US Federal Government.
Technically speaking the World Wide Web is currently 99% of the Internet so, your statement is quite misleading especially for the uneducated public! As already mentioned, everything was started not by the US Federal Government, but by Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. |
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TOR project ( AND THE FREAKING INTERNET BTW) was actually started by US Government. Actually everything was started by Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. However, the 'freaking' Internet BTW began in CERN Switzerland. There at CERN the browser, the web server and the html (the hypertext) were invented. I know that most of the brainwashed US citizens think that Al Gore invented Internet, but truth is quite different: The first proposal for the World Wide Web (WWW) was made at CERN by Tim Berners-Lee in 1989, and further refined by him and Robert Cailliau in 1990. http://public.web.cern.ch/public/en/about/Web-en.htmlhttp://public.web.cern.ch/public/en/about/WebStory-en.html |
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but in terms of strategy of presentation, we should always be playing the long game. It is amazing to read so many people here pretending they are good chess players playing 'the long game'. You are not a good player if you think your opponent is an idiot! Bitcoin is a way to circumvent government and escape from monetary slavery. Any government! You're an idiot if you think people working in the respective government agencies are idiots! |
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As for the bigger picture, it is important that readers review In short, if you care about bitcoin, if you want bitcoin to survive long term, you need to play a long game. In particular, big governments have committed billions of dollars and a small specops army to interdicting what they consider their major enemies. Just about the worst thing you can do is look at the targets of the Big Guys -- Iran, North Korea, Taliban, jihadi terrorists -- and put bitcoin squarely in their crosshairs. Right now bitcoin is weak; a few thousand listening nodes run by hobbyists are all that holds the network together. The switch from GPU/FPGA to ASIC will bring an increase in network strength -- but it also consolidates hash production power in a tiny handful of startup companies. If you think bitcoin can right now sustain a targeted cyber attack, you are dead wrong. On the legal front, it is also quite clear that law enforcement is taking an active look at bitcoin. There is an active SEC investigation into Pirate-related activities (good; clear out the swamp). The DEA is most certainly looking at Silk Road. The FBI produced an in-depth report on bitcoin, and talks actively about bitcoin at anti-money-laundering conferences. It is therefore logical to conclude that IRC, forum and other activities are being continually monitored for evidence that can be used in a court of law. That makes it all the more rich when anonymous forum trolls hurl charges of "cowardice!" and "treason!" when these trolls are neither (a) using their real name, nor (b) contributing in any meaningful way, nor (c) a High Value Target. Teenaged crypto-anarchists may love to mock the "sheeple" who follow the laws of their jurisdiction, but at the end of the day, they just move back into their parents' house if they run into trouble. Not that easy for me. Just like a great many of people I would like to introduce to bitcoin, I am a law-abiding US citizen, using my real name, in public, volunteering my time to work on multiple bitcoin implementations. Businesses like WordPress are law-abiding businesses. It is logical and normal to expect people to follow the laws of their country. That is the most revealing, the most saddening part about this thread. In a short-sighted attempt to be a morally pure crypto-anarchist, you could ruin the true monetary freedom bitcoin brings, for the billions on this planet. It is even worse than I thought. In short, if you care about bitcoin, if you want bitcoin to survive long term, you need to resign from core devs group. You just don't understand what bitcoin is and what would be the consequences for the state, politics, economy, and generally for the society if bitcoin succeeds! You don't understand that bitcoin success is incompatible with the laws of a police and militaristic state where personal freedom is just an empty word! I suggest you write an open (or not so open) letter to the government asking for their mercy and then try to deserve it by coding a back door in the bitcoin client to allow some agencies better monitor all bitcoin transfers from and to Iran? Because, face it, this is exactly what every 'law-abiding US citizen' is supposed to do these days! |
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jgarzik is intelligent, he looks long term, and wants bitcoin to succeed. Some people don't see the big picture.
Bitcoin is not going to succeed if core devs live in fear of being prosecuted for not adhering to US sanctions on any country. That IS the big picture! It's also not going to succeed in the long term if development of the official client and big economic players are shut down for sanction-busting. That is too bad. They can be shut down for many other reasons including dollar-busting, 'unique' form of terrorism, money laundering, tax evasion, drug trafficing, etc. How is sanction-busting different? |
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jgarzik is intelligent, he looks long term, and wants bitcoin to succeed. Some people don't see the big picture.
Bitcoin is not going to succeed if core devs live in fear of being prosecuted for not adhering to US sanctions on any country. That IS the big picture! |
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I can't believe my eyes when reading all this bs reasoning.  So, we should discourage Iranians using bitcoin because the US government says so? Are you crazy? |
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I am going to have to agree with jgarzik here.
We as a community are asking for swift trouble from US govt bullies if we are actively marketing Bitcoin to Iran. It has nothing to do with whether it's legal, moral, ethical or not. We are lucky they have left this project alone thus far. Doing anything that looks like marketing to Iran will change that quickly.
Also, bitcoin-dev is a publicly logged channel. If I am a Bitcoin developer on a publicly logged chat channel where my actions could be scrutinized by the media and the world and someone wants to discuss Iran, kicking and banning in a publicly visible manner would be prudent. That is truly not a good place to talk about that subject.
I sure as hell would not want to discuss bringing Bitcoin to Iran in any place where my discussion was being logged and published.
I'm disappointed. I shall not purchase US government physical bitcoins anymore! |
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Stopping the issuer stopped the currency. How would you stop the Bitcoin issuer? |
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Spelled in Russian: биткоин
биткоин or биткойн? |
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You're absolutely correct, of course. That's why no one has ever been convicted of stealing cash. Bitcoin is quite different from fiat cash. I hope nobody would argue this. You might not be aware of but every time you use fiat cash either buying or selling stuff, you're actually entering into contractual obligation with the issuer of that currency (i.e., the central bank and government behind). The "serve and protect (rightful owner)" mantra is part of this contract. If I'm using bitcoins, who is the issuer I'm entering into contractual obligation with? |
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Guys, did I ask you to translate 'bit' and 'coin'?  My original question is: How is 'bitcoin' written in different languages? If there is a popular translation already in use, well, then use it but write it in the corresponding alphabets. Thanks for all relevant inputs so far. |
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I'm trying to compile a list of how is the word 'bitcoin' written in different languages used all over the world?
This is what we have so far:
Latin: bitcoin
Japanese: ビットコイン
Chinese: 比特币
Hebrew: ביטקוין
Cyrillic: биткойн
Hindi, Marathi: बिटकॉइन
Arabic: بتكوين
Greek: μπίτκοϊν
Your input as addition or correction is highly appreciated.
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I completely disagree. I own the bitcoins in my wallet just as much as I own my plot of land according to county records or the dollars in my bank account according to my bank. It doesn't matter that the blockchain is made public. If someone stole my password to my bank account, they might have access to my funds, but that doesn't give them a right to my funds. Neither would the theft of my private keys give them a right to my bitcoins.
You can disagree, of course, but in both your examples (land ownership and bank account) there is a third party keeping independent records about who is the rightful owner. There is no third party in bitcoin, If you have the private key you have the bitcoin. This is why in bitcoin the private key IS the right! |
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If you remove intangible property from its rightful owner without their consent, with the intent to permanently deprive them of that intangible property you have committed theft.
Stealing bicoins is a theft, no doubt. But it is not that simple, Nolo. The complexity comes from the public/private nature of bitcoin as digital asset. You can not 'remove' bitcoins from its owner because bitcoins do not move. They stay on the blockchain. The blockchain is a public property! Also, who is the 'rightful' owner? The complexity comes from the fact that the private key gives you this right and nothing else! There is no third party keeping records about rightful owners. Remember, the private key IS the right. If you have the private key you have the right! Another aspect is how the rightful owner will prove in court that they are deprived of their private key against their will? In fact, this would be the most difficult practical question to deal with. |
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This thread is, to my mind, the perfect example of the problems created by dogmatic belief in magical papers. Yeap, reminds of the scientific discussions in "The Name of the Rose" the movie. Although I would disagree about the real underlying questions being asked here! Where I'm from (Ireland), a very old law was uncovered recently that technically made it legal to steal bread, milk, sugar & tea, it basically says you can't be charged in court for stealing any of these. Actually this is a good point to start from. A man stealing a loaf of bread. Stealing of bread is also a self defense. The thief is defending his physical health and integrity of their body because without food he will die. Justification of the above leads to next. A woman stealing a pair of stockings. This is also a self defense as she is a kleptomaniac. She is defending her mental health, because without that she will go crazy. Justification of the above leads to next. A nation stealing other nation resources. This is also a self defense as this nation is trying to defend their way of life and standard of living. Hope, now you see where all that might go? Stealing bitcoins is not a crime.... but there is no way to 'steal' them without committing a crime.
IE you're not commiting theft when you take someone's bitcoins; you're commiting unauthorized computer access So, a crime is not a crime unless you get caught? Or even better... Stealing is not a crime if the thief is authorized to steal your bitcoins? Authorized by whom? By the secret court authority that authorizes authorizers to authorize the authorized thieves? |
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The quality of the comments are really going down hill.... Ah okay, sorry for bothering you. Enjoy your little world where stealing is not thieving. |
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The question is not illegal vs illegal the question is theft vs some other crime. The question is "Is stealing Bitcoins illegal?" Definition of theft
Overview of noun theft
The noun theft has 1 senses? (no senses from tagged texts)
1. larceny, theft, thievery, thieving, stealing
(the act of taking something from someone unlawfully; "the thieving is awful at Kennedy International") http://www.synonym.com/definition/theft/ |
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Bitcoins represent bitcoins... Bitcoins may be worth money but they represent nothing. No. Bicoin(s) represent contract(s). An agreement between the Bitcoin community and an individual who is part of this community. The rules of the community are written in the bitcoin protocol. Is that so complicated to understand? |
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Stealing bit coins while in New Jersey is illegal. Not from. Is that really different? Stealing bitcoins while in Mudville is illegal. Stealing bitcoins while in Langley is legal... How is that different from a double standard? -cough- And stealing bitcoins is always illegal because it likely violates the laws on unauthorized access. I can't really understand what position you're defending? Is stealing bitcoins illegal or not? You can't just say - depends who is the thief? Or, depends who is the owner? This is ridiculous! |
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