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3101  Economy / Economics / Re: (SSS) - A Sane and Simple bitcoin Savings plan on: September 19, 2015, 11:55:37 PM
A pretty simple plan is to invest only what you can lose 100% on.

If you can't lose 100% of what you think you want to invest...you probably should invest much much less.

It's your call and no one else's.

Proceed at your own risk.
3102  Economy / Economics / Re: Is bitcoin dead? on: September 19, 2015, 11:45:44 PM
there is an awful lot of FUD out there. Bitcoin will not go to die until a better technology comes out or a fatal vulnerability is discovered.

There is already a better technology out, yet it still hasnt died. It has a charm by being the first crypto. People wont abandon it so easily, it's like your firstborn child. Would you abandon it for another child?

what is this better technology? don't tell me ethereum or maidsafe, they are akin to a rehash of an old attempt to a decentralized internet, called freenet

I dont think those coins are really promising.

Monero has a great innovation in terms of anonymity.

Bytecoin has better security and faster and more efficient network than bitcoin in all terms.

NXT, BURST, NEM, HZ, COUNTERPARTY has a whole economy,stock market,marketplace & more integrated in a decentralized fashion.

all altcoin, monero also, only include a small feature that differentiate them from bitcoin, they are still clone and nothing more

every features they have can be integrated easily in bitcoin, i don't see innovation as it was with bitcoin

LOL wow really?

You do realize that the Monero code base is completely different than that of Bitcoin? Using ring signatures, stealth addresses producing untraceability and unlinkability.

Can't do that with Bitcoin as far as I am aware. Bitcoin has a public blockchain as well that you can trace.

And NO...those features can't be integrated EASILY into bitcoin.

The Bitcoin core developers can't even agree on a SINGLE line of code to change (i.e. the block size) and you think they can add cryptonote into the bitcoin source that would allow it to operate like Monero?

Wow seriously appears you a delusional. No offense.
3103  Economy / Economics / Re: Is bitcoin dead? on: September 19, 2015, 11:42:33 PM
there is an awful lot of FUD out there. Bitcoin will not go to die until a better technology comes out or a fatal vulnerability is discovered.

There is already a better technology out, yet it still hasnt died. It has a charm by being the first crypto. People wont abandon it so easily, it's like your firstborn child. Would you abandon it for another child?

what is this better technology? don't tell me ethereum or maidsafe, they are akin to a rehash of an old attempt to a decentralized internet, called freenet

I dont think those coins are really promising.

Monero has a great innovation in terms of anonymity.

Bytecoin has better security and faster and more efficient network than bitcoin in all terms.

NXT, BURST, NEM, HZ, COUNTERPARTY has a whole economy,stock market,marketplace & more integrated in a decentralized fashion.

Bytecoin also has a huge premise of coins 80% of all BCN to be in existence.

Monero at least appeared to have a fair launch.
3104  Economy / Speculation / Re: [Trading Simulator] A fun & free Speculation Game - SWITCH TO BPI ON JULY 15 !!! on: September 19, 2015, 11:23:06 PM
staying in USD
3105  Economy / Economics / Re: Cash will be abolished & negative interest rates via bank accounts enforced on: September 19, 2015, 11:20:48 PM
"Soon cryptocurrency will be the only 'free' money left" they probably won't let this happen for sure , it will become a threat for them definitly however if this happens for one reason or another , we will definitly go to the moon Grin

Is decentralized code not above law?

Define "above".

If you mean that it can't be stopped by law then yes.

But laws will come if the powers that be want the laws and see crypto as a threat to their existing financial power.
3106  Economy / Economics / Re: Cash will be abolished & negative interest rates via bank accounts enforced on: September 19, 2015, 11:19:30 PM
I don't believe that cash will be abolished this easily. First of all, there is still not a sustainable option in order to replace cash on mass level. Yes, you heard me right, Bitcoin is not ready yet. Our block sizes, infrastructure, security, etc..is just not ready for a masses. We are a niche payment system at the moment.

Negative interest rates are the biggest BS ever. Many countries in Europe have installed them. This is not yet a case in France. There is still about 1.25% interest rate in France, which is nothing anyways but at least I don't pay to them. If my bank is to start charging negative interest rates I would withdraw all of my money the very next morning.


IF you could beat the other 1000's or 10,000's or even millions of people rushing to the bank.

Can you run fast? Or better yet do you have a very fast car?
3107  Economy / Economics / Fed Implies Possible Negative Interest Rates on: September 19, 2015, 11:05:29 PM
Link:http://www.infowars.com/fed-opens-negative-interest-rate-pandoras-box/

Quote
But what may be missed between the lines is the Fed’s explicit observation that in a world of NIRP, cash will reign supreme, as everyone rushes to withdraw their “taxed” bank deposits and keep the funds in the form of paper cash, hidden safely somewhere where the bank has no access, and where no bank can collect an interest rate for the “privilege” of being funded with a negative rate liability.

Furthermore, as the Fed correctly observes, “the usual rejoinder to a proposal for negative interest rates is that negative rates are impossible; market participants will simply choose to hold cash. But cash is not a realistic alternative for corporations and state and local governments, or for wealthy individuals.”

Interesting take. If interest rates go below 0 and into NEGATIVE territory then that implies that if you put any cash into a bank account, over time they will eat away a portion of your deposit as a fee for holding your money.

LOL omg the fucked up world we live in.  Cheesy


BITCOIN throughout the article link above, also mentioned in the article at the bottom:

Quote
And, before you ask, will there be substantial – and violent – opposition to the Fed’s mandatory conversion of cash to bitcoin? Of course. But that too certainly not stop the Fed, which fighting for the survival of trillions in legacy “wealth” would simply steamroll over anyone and anything courtesy of the US government’s armed backing (which has conclusively proven in recent years its function has metastasized to serve only the wealthiest corporations and Wall Street interests) to preserve such wealth, if only for a little longer.
3108  Economy / Goods / Re: ❎►฿ FOR SALE: Smoothie's Hawaiian Property 1 Acre + 4 BR/3BATH on: September 19, 2015, 10:38:17 PM
Shame it's in the U.S. Otherwise I might be looking for exactly that kind of deal, since I am long on BTC, silver and perhaps other of the instruments as well, and seeking a property.

If an opportunity like this presents itself in non-EU Europe, India or SE Asia, contact me! Smiley

Is owning property in the U.S. not favorable for you?

Would be interesting to hear your logic and decision making based on that.

I've had assets seized without recourse a few times so I don't blame him.

What was the reasoning for your assets being seized?
3109  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - 0.8.8.6 on: September 19, 2015, 10:32:46 PM
LOL, it is not about innovation, nor features. In the long term you need the masses. Monero had a great team and well that's it. Newcomers can do much better.

So much time passed but no broad acceptance... just think..

Current price is a great price to sell, which I did.

No hate intented, just being honest.


Mass acceptance would be nice, but if the devs wanted that they would have released an official gui. Obviously they dont want this. Until they do its fair to think of this project as being in beta. Its a little unfair to call it on not achieving mass acceptance before anyone has even tried to push for that. Some other amazing crypto currency that hasn't been invented yet but will be in the future also hasnt achieved mass acceptance yet, should we call it dead too?

I don't think this is strictly correct.  The development of a GUI is on the road map, but it is much more necessary to make sure the mathematical fundamentals of Monero are sound.  This is no easy task, and I would dare say that most cryptocurrency enthusiasts do not understand or are capable of understanding the mathematics involved in Monero (ring sigs, etc).  The Monero development team is fairly small and most have other pursuits in addition to developing Monero.  I would still classify it is a type of hobby (for traders, developers, enthusiasts)--until wider adoption happens in which developers who hold Monero can maybe live off their new found wealth and concentrate on Monero full time.  This type of critical mass hasn't been achieved yet.

With the USD, the fed just prints them and distributes them.  Its not really complicated.  Cryptocurrencies on the other hand are a different type of beast, and require some very knowledgeable people to maintain and innovate on novel cryptocurrency platforms such as Monero.

Newcomers could possibly help, but the learning curve is rather steep for people who truly want to innovate and make the underlying mathematics bulletproof.

As far as mass acceptances goes:  This probably won't happen for a long time.  It hasn't even happened for Bitcoin really.  Cryptocurrency needs an "iPhone/iPod" type of success to really reach mass appeal--furthermore, large amounts of people have to want it in the first place...which I don't think is a stage we are at either.  A possible catalyst for wider acceptance would be a major world wide depression in which fiat fails dramatically...instead of the slow and inexorable failure we have seen in the past.  Its possible governments may not let this happen (by forcing the working masses to bail out banks, fear mongering through regulation, etc) and will thus force cryptocurrencies underground, and there they may stay.

On the other hand, maybe its enough that a small amount of people can transact with digital cash?  Do we really need mass appeal?  Maybe its enough that we can choose to go our own way, and choose cryptocurrency as the means for payment and store of value even if we are a small cadre of people?

People > Governments.

Just right now many of the people are distracted with football and other crap our society considers "important".

Once people wake up when they can't buy food and pay their bills on a mass scale due to government abuse of the monetary system, watch the people lash back.

It won't matter what governments want in the end people will rule.

The U.S. is in its end stages just like Rome was before its empire collapsed.
3110  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Speculation (Altcoins) / Re: [XMR] Monero Speculation on: September 19, 2015, 10:24:25 PM
with masternodes people keep their private keys in cold storage under their control, so is a form of trust-less investment

In theory, yes.  In practice, no.

Pooled masternodes are now a thing, as are masternode hosting services.

Those TTPs stack additional risk on that already incurred by using indubitably compromised VPS providers like Amazon and DigitalOcean.

Of course those practices are fated to inevitably end in tears and learning of valuable (ie expensive) lessons about the dangers of greed and security in obscurity.   Cheesy

The hole idea of master nodes is flawed, simply because you cant do mixing on your side, i.e. client side. Its similar to a secure email. People use and thrust secure email providers (e.g. tutanota or protonmail to name a few) because they do client-side encryption.  In other words, an encryption is done on your computer, without anyone else involved. Can you imagine a private and anonymous email provider doing encryption on server side or using some "master email client" on a strangers computer? Who would use such an email service? The same goes for masternodes. If you cant do mixing on a client side, forget it.

I presume you mean the "private and anonymous email provider" encrypting on a 3rd party's computer/server?

3111  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: ► ❎ ► LEALANA PHYSICAL LITECOINS FOR SALE - RESUMING SALES!!! on: September 19, 2015, 08:31:51 PM
next auction: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1184685.msg12468431#msg12468431
3112  Economy / Collectibles / Re: ❎฿ ► ฿ ►฿ LEALANA PHYSICAL BTC & LTC RESUMING SALES (UNFUNDED) on: September 19, 2015, 08:31:26 PM
next auction: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1184685.msg12468431#msg12468431
3113  Economy / Auctions / ❎~ FORTY (40) BRASS LEALANA BITCOINS (2 ROLLS) on: September 19, 2015, 08:30:33 PM
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Sept 19th, 2015: Auction for FORTY 2013 LEALANA 0.1 BTC Brass Coins





*****Carefully read this auction post in its entirety before bidding*****

Auction ends September 22nd, 2015 at 3:00 PM Hawaiian Standard Time

Minimum bid will start at 0.85BTC. Bidding will be done in 0.01BTC increments. Shipping will be $30 for US and $50 for International bidders. This will be added to the winning bid after the auction.(ID will be required upon delivery for pickup) for both domestic U.S. and international customers. Bitcoin is the only accepted form of payment for this auction. Coins for this auction will ship out by October 2nd, 2015.

You are bidding for the following unfunded/buyer funded coins:


FORTY 2013 LEALANA 0.1 BTC Brass Coins (Green Addresses)


By bidding on this auction you are agreeing to the terms listed at: http://lealana.com/tac.php

The winner can choose how many coins they want to pre fund. All coins not pre funded before it ships will be marked "BUYER FUNDED" with a laser mark to each coin's hologram.

THESE COINS ARE BUYER FUNDED. The winner by bidding on this auction will accept the risks involved with shipping funded coins through USPS registered mail. The coins will be valued at the price paid plus the bitcoin that is loaded on to them. Winner agrees to hold LEALANA, LLC. and myself innocent of any losses while in transit (in the small event the coin goes missing/stolen while in transit).

Any customs/VAT taxes or fees that are placed on the package while going through customs for international customers are the responsibility of the buyer/winner to pay.


Please bid in the following format (no extra precision decimals):


CORRECT FORMAT
"I bid 1.07 BTC"


INCORRECT FORMAT
"I bid 1.074839282"


Should bids come in at the last minute I will allow for the auction to extended by 15 minute increments between bids. Once the 15 minutes is up and no bidding is done after the deadline specified ABOVE, the auction will end. To be clear on the precision of the auction times in 15 minute increments we are talking about the actual MINUTE and not the seconds that are posted on the forum timestamp.

Payment address:

1Fqoc3gPo9puCrAyAhiVqN9EGsNoWjcBiN

Please do not send payment to any winner address until the winner has been declared which I will post once the auction ends. If you would like a non-public payment address PM me and I will create a PGP signed address for you to send payment to.

Payment is due within 72 hours from the time the auction ends. Should the winner not honor their bid and not provide payment in that 72 period the next highest bidder will be required to honor their bid. By bidding in this auction thread you agree to this stipulation. In other words, please make sure you are able to honor your bid(s) in a timely manner before you bid.

I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO INVALIDATE A BID FROM NEWBIE USERS. USUALLY THIS WILL BE THE CASE IF I HAVE NEVER DONE BUSINESS WITH YOU BEFORE.

AUCTION WINNER INFORMATION SUBMISSION:

*If you win, please send me (IN ONE PRIVATE MESSAGE) immediately ALL of the following information as it is needed to ship you your coins correctly/promptly:

1. The # of coins you want to prefund. Which types and how many.

2. FULL Shipping information:

FIRST AND LAST NAME
STREET ADDRESS & BUILDING/SUITE #
CITY
STATE
COUNTRY
POSTAL CODE
PHONE NUMBER
EMAIL ADDRESS

3. If you are outside of the US and want to insure prefunded coins please send me PM for details.

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Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32)

iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJV/cXGAAoJEJqyV7+nZNgzfd4H/1lK/3CHx89yP2EnKzokNGRp
YXfFDWHyOXkTHM596V7zx38DiAVm/YAGalLYUOId7p/h5OMz4zgF14MkqC7xR4RP
J7neOVU8GwdvJSD/6OfvXE0BCfYiqF0eNN7JODYQWGA9+0JhGaY/2jWEuXIOLXra
cQF1w4Lb6MQVZXg6ncNq3GvgGxHuYxVEFISyOL2zs/0v+EqaQn5/0SWmHm9zlZP4
8zMS/V3jxICxXcLZ/GFJuOf8Iv2ZjbOXiD5De3mG5xP9LFxyUl398fMrRhI1t8NP
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3114  Other / Off-topic / Re: BIBINKA WORD GAME! on: September 19, 2015, 07:12:49 AM
Fat Tay Choon went to the Mining Academy in Brazil, east of Satoshi's yurt, where Gavin was kidnapped by the CIA's goons and forced to pretend fucking an anonymous decentralized biscuit—better than all the fish in the Pacific Ocean—but also to defray leeches intelligently with ECDSA fighting qubits for 16.8 dree12, or Phinnaeus must fling toilets towards psy‐ops, without potato smoothies mixed with fried chicken wings from BitMunchies.com, urbanchickennj.com, and Popeye's Bitcoin wallet, which deleted Satoshi's premine ability to cheer very victoriously, none like Butterfly Labs better enabled, but also Pirate crashing AIR applications without the express use of interest-free scams, conspiring with fraudulent sockpuppets and PPTs and..., you troll-herding piece of Shiitake mushroom, go lick Goat's horns until Theymos admits to having a quite erotic fetish involving honey badgers wearing thongs composed of soggy burlap waffles dangling from cosmic linoleum-based iphones running quantum chips explodes spewing deadly acid! b!z screamed out "Light is bright like...like... stars." When Markjamrobin opens the isolated window, he sees three pigs together in bed. Kouye and myself laugh when chinese food falls the impact kills Obama Bin ladin whoever thinks he may be terrorist, is correct but hates the bitcoin logo. Earth has snakes. Currently, the other species have decimated to tiny groups called "marko solo" whatever time it all comes and ends? However, Bitcoin's acidity level dipped causing catastrophic double-spends!

Meanwhile, AntiOps was confused by the awkward change to his penis melting uncontrollably. Vanilla Ice perfume spritzed onto cheese and greasy slime covered with babies boiled in a smelly old heatsink. But it tasted like shit therefore it poisoned his blood although he did survive. Reproductive organisms attacked the internal testicle which caused terrible congestion somehow. Evolution then terminated the smelly old business thank the inability of AntiOps to lock Satoshi's thread. In a transactional forum there was a debate about hacking unprotected accounts, however the debate shortly ended.

Phinnaeus Gage, king pluto, duke of the people. Returned one of his loans that he fraudulently claimed without declaring intentionally. Although this was bullshit. Earth was hit by a meteor which cause catastrophic events which cause people to cause mass destruction by proxy voting it was documented recently on the news that oranges are disguised anti-gravity pockets which have giant bears attacked Zeus because bitcoin accidentally crashed to Mars which created spaceships and aliens who pretended being humans wearing hats on their toes.

Altcoin suck on apples and oranges too. Megacoin is the most shit sucker of apples and  melons ever. Most people love to troll others. Evolution is a slow process which created forks. It is beneficial to wash your feet because it distributes bacteria and oil, notwithstanding the beneficial attributes which are how chocolate arouses some of the miners brains. Today was an abysmal event which caused many abnormal but not smart bitcoiners because many of them are cute animals who were insane because of excessive oreo consumption. One watermelon is not love how people try me explotation Maybe Heisenberg Breaking bad control guy director or masturbation my time vampire drinks urine not lemon tek and water supernatural.

LEALANA is fat looking because pizza is sour with pickles which are sexy and never rot. So many people eat pizza it's unbelievable. The news said that pizza is bought mainly with anchovies which results in big wet weather which had massive gusts of wind with pouring milk down on everyones throat because it feels great! Although honey is very sweet taste it makes when it is served hot it melts softly but slowly.
The universe is populated with many planets which were destroyed by pirateat40. Cyborgs then warped to the zoo and ate mushroom with a aerospace technician. Bitcoin has used a lot resources from peoples although people smell like melons.

Ipods suck. Androids rule. Altcoins also suck peanuts. Bitcoin is the greatest idea that has ever been created by man although litecoin sucks? Once upon a time Gandalf went to wal-mart to dry her hair. Minecraft is the best game in universe because chickens cluck. 231134421 is one crazy big ass monkey. What is with people posting replies still. Terraria is a crazy game which requires extreme concentration. This can result in health cubes; Parentheses are a pain in the brain. This noodle is disgusting. Although spaceships cry waterfalls they are magical little elves. Golden towns is very annoying and smell like bacon. Celebrities are awesome and smart. But, evolution taught us that butterflys are ugly.

Vitamin D is important to scam Taras and raise taxes which would cause the world to go crazy but not insane. Obama is the president now. Alot of gamers will illustrate sony that nintendo is leading the infiltration of Iran. Microsoft Windows was salivating pedophiles of the coastal farts. Yet the banana shrank. What was doge poo doing under the bridge with bridge cleaner? He was just he's aren't because something something different like seems incorrect, because we fucked. Yet prunes prunes are very bad lad's yet unknown to fuckers SWEARING. Banana monkey is not virgin-horse. Corn.

This disappoints satan more than satoshi because he ate hydrochloric pools and he fucked whores who are sick shemales shemales shemales BANGCOCK! God smited non-believers with dicks on a stick. They shat together sitting upside-down flicking birdies. Baezl'bub slept with Hitler inside a bomb ticking furiously and hodling. That was awesome. Bitmit made belt so that walruses can shit on his dick and eat mushroom full of wonderful shit, he HODL'd BTCs and Dogecoin with a succubus sperm from first blowjob stories.

Nefarious words spoken shit at bitcointalk and destroyed uranus with a big-ass Spaceship mouth that eats goats flying shuttle that revolves expressly and quietly to hell. Gamma flux destroyed Litecoin with a barracks producing Atreides shit and Kadafi. Same Binladen puppet goxed clients sucking lollipops shaped like mixed frapuccino lids. Goku start this fight prematurely in Odessa Klondike's yard. Winter is not shitty. Gooches. Seven. Humanity sold pubes to Zeus. Nevertheless, Cinnamon was crying. Millennium breakdown caused diversification methheads cardinally. Hyper-inflation, epidemics with marshmallows made by government chodes and yeah. The End. No. Yes. Lies. Stop. Can. Do aliens have any bitcoins? No. Instead, PPC acts quickly like FTL shit, riffraff toys.

Miracles happen like cannibals spitting sinew and elephants which innocent love and shit has never fucked up! Dank has killed bysexuals... wait, when did Karpeles said/say McDonald's sucks? Colonel Tom sex-machine The 3.14159265358th must fook anything that goes into a section. Beaware of spellcheckers. Fantômas portuguese are sobriquet of Fernão who called them Coads-nigs! They say we are azoth, biblical tittynopes who can't mine the janiceps'. He biblically took Rosenzweig and ended this game. And then wanked, wanked clitoris next door. This was done. Moreover, crack was rapidly dephosphorylated due to complications anhidrotically, metaphorically whores go mooooooooo and ahhhhhhhhhhhhh while jon snow watch has ended this thread for good.

Not... Actually, maybe futuristically, Vod (MIA) sailing CASASCIUS up Padma Lakshmi's waxed butt and... Nevermind, but acknowledging that Gavin held security. This marks, categorically, that will create scientific controvertist of global heliolatry problems indistinguishably noticeable filipino heritage, unbeknownst to Slenderman XT phenomena. GLEB sucked smoothie's brains using juicy zombies, dicks, Popsicles, and alien vaginas to rotten flesh of Vod. Meanwhile, giant marsupials are having suicidal sex appeal for four tentacles, watching child whoopee. Therefore, vegetables are unpretentiously super[...]docious. Fruits are rotten potatoes, avouchment vouched x10 malware because aliens kidnapped JarJar, mercilessly LeFodorliar and Gleb Gamow lived days along seashore, Theymos abused his Authoritah by forcing a purple pill To Fly! Serendipitously, awsome! Then I started UFOing on their ass, savagely. But, it is impeccable to realize I farted psychedelic asparagus smoothies. However, Mexico is shit and... Rephrase that, corporations syria declared terrorists irreproachable because malevolence misappropriates monetary suffrage suggesting termination.

Meanwhile, yogurt spill has begun to fall onto houses and cars, hawkishly attempting to grab two crayons, inserting phallic Popsicles® into Theymos' abysm until... POOP! The excruciating pain took aeons to appreciate plethoric folliculitis silvestris poop generator. Why nidificate the indigenous spirit called "erection"? Prepossessingly, pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis a discomfortable endoplasmic tumescent pineapple tree branch rectally QuickSeller escrow. Involution, presumptuously titin pop up inconsiderately - Tuesday - when pokemon (Pokémon)'s Pikachu flashbacked borders dementia caused horrendous pain inside Agumon's PocketPussy™.

Daft Punk punked Dank with a heavy hookah shot whilst levitating abroad oceans
3115  Economy / Goods / Re: ❎►฿ FOR SALE: Smoothie's Hawaiian Property 1 Acre + 4 BR/3BATH on: September 19, 2015, 06:30:48 AM
Shame it's in the U.S. Otherwise I might be looking for exactly that kind of deal, since I am long on BTC, silver and perhaps other of the instruments as well, and seeking a property.

If an opportunity like this presents itself in non-EU Europe, India or SE Asia, contact me! Smiley

Is owning property in the U.S. not favorable for you?

Would be interesting to hear your logic and decision making based on that.
3116  Economy / Speculation / Re: If there was no Mtgox ... ? on: September 19, 2015, 06:28:58 AM
If there was no Mtgox ... ?...


then there would be another exchange that would have done something similar.
3117  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin vs Internet early stage on: September 19, 2015, 02:52:14 AM
Due to Bitcoin has received more venture capital investment than internet in its early stage ($362 vs $250), do you think this could be significant to say bitcoin will be totally success?

not necessarily.

The amount of $ in circulation in 1990's is far smaller than what is in circulation today.

Do an inflation adjusted value system and compare it.
3118  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: BitPay's integrity. Can they be trusted? What's next? on: September 19, 2015, 02:50:44 AM
Just finnished reading this news, well, it sounds too good to be true. It seems as if BitPay's CFO and CEO are using 'a hacker,' as a scapegoat for the loss of over $1.8 million worth of BTC.

With BitPay following similar trails as the Mt. Gox scandal, can they and their integrity truly be trusted in the foreseeable future?

Source: Bizjournals

seeing how they been operating seemingly flawlessly since the loss for almost a year now... i think it safe to assume they will continue to provide good services.

it's not unimaginable that they could take such a loss and still be solvent, and i think it would be hard for them to practice fractional reserves banking since unlike MTGox they don't hold customer BTC very long and do next day cash settlements.

some info seguest they have patched this security hole.

everyone seems quick to call them stupid for walking into a phishing attack. I think this security hole ( trusting CEO emails ) was an oversight on a otherwise tight and secure system, being the largest in the space i can imagine there have been many hackers trying to hack it... bitpay has been around for a Long time, and this is the first hack they fell victim to.

i think their rep. has taken a hit, i trust their integrity, shit happens you live a learn..

hmm mtgox operated for months  before going belly up.

I suspect there is more than what meets the eye here with bitpay.

3119  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Could the lightning network solve the block size problem? on: September 19, 2015, 02:48:18 AM
True, LN seems to be very similar to how banks and institutions work in a closed loop. However, in legacy financial system, one weak link on the chain might trigger a systematic failure like Lehman brother's case, because the whole system have very little real money in circulation. If LN chains are widely applied, it will also have such kind of risk, and without central bank bailout
Not sure, what kind of systemic risk are you talking about? If a link fails, one simply has to wait until contract expiration. I might've missed something.


Not really sure, but I guess the LN nodes might be practicing FRB by then, and the failure of one nodes will trigger a large scale of withdraw to blockchain from every nodes customer, thus collapsing them all. How to make sure an exchange does not do FRB? I suppose most of them do today

If they are in fact using Fractional reserve then perhaps you do have a point.

Fractional reserve banking is the equivalent of not being solvent.

SO funny how banks are legally able to operate while being insolvent. Cheesy
3120  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Could the lightning network solve the block size problem? on: September 19, 2015, 02:45:19 AM
Just read that white paper another time, now I get a rough idea about how it might work in reality:

First two entities establish a common deposit by each sending certain amount of bitcoin into an address, similar to two banks each opening an account in counterpart bank and credit the counterpart same amount of money

Then all the transactions between these two entities will just change the ratio of each party's ownership of this common deposit. At the end of the clearing period, they settle the difference by a blockchain payment to make the ratio 50/50 again

This can help two large institutions, it is not very practical for single average user because the required deposit and one way payment nature. It seems single average user would still need to rely on large institutions, and existing large institutions might use lightning network or establish the clearing channel through other arrangements
I guess the most promising application of LN is where payments between entities are frequent and roughly predictable over the life of a channel. These might be BitPay<->Coinbase, but also it might be a man that routinely buys a cup of coffee somewhere in the morning, so setting up a channel between him and the cafe might make sense, especially because of near-instant 'confirmation'.

What you might be missing here is that all these channels can be chained together, forming a mesh-like network. In this case, you can have only one channel open, and send a payment to anyone in this network. This payment will be routed through intermediate hops right to the receiver.

The well-connected hops can be called hubs, and will receive a fee for their service. In theory, anyone can become a hub, it's only limited by how much BTC you have, i.e. how many channels can you fund with them.

True, LN seems to be very similar to how banks and institutions work in a closed loop. However, in legacy financial system, one weak link on the chain might trigger a systematic failure like Lehman brother's case, because the whole system have very little real money in circulation. If LN chains are widely applied, it will also have such kind of risk, and without central bank bailout

Most of the retail transactions are very sporadic and unpredictable. If you routinely buys a cup of coffee somewhere in the morning, then it is very likely the shop will sell you some batch discount coupon that give you 10 coffee for the price of 9, and you pay the whole package at once, reducing the transaction fee. This is also observed in mobile fee charge: Previously telephone company charge you based on how much and how frequent you use the service, now they are using a bulk model to charge you regardless of usage, to dramatically reduce the amount of transactions

I guess there will be VISA-like mechanism if the clearing based settlement is widely used. Consumers will periodically (when they receive the salary) charge their web wallet in mobile that they can pay at any location that accepts bitcoin payment. And the real payment happens between the web wallet company and Bitpay. But unless we have many payment processors and credit issuer, this seems like a single point of failure

Use blockchain to do large deposit/withdraw, use web wallet to do casual spending, this could be the trend for the coming years

How does a "weak" link on the chain have anything to do with systemic failure of Lehman brothers?

The fiat system is already fundamentally flawed given there is more digital fiat than actual paper redeemable fiat you can touch. that has nothing to do with a "weak" link of a network of banks (or transfer channels between banks).
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