100T + seems to be the magic numbers lately.
Funny you say that. I had noticed that not a single person who rented 1+ PH has ever found a block here. Not sure exactly what that means but as well as some very lucky people there have been some very unlucky people. There is really, however, no way to confirm the hardware you are hiring isn't configured in such a way as to never find you a block mind you so you're always taking a risk (they'd need to be very nasty operators and I seriously doubt they'd risk their reputation with so much hashrate at their disposal but you never know). Reading onward from here does not make me happy. yeah it is a bit discouraging but we now have 5 orders at 100th ready to start. and we have the bonus 5th fixed order I paid for. At least more then 5.49 btc is left of the 10 btc so I like to think the glass is more then ½ full. http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1CqbvmuJcLFDFzFewKmBVAaghXEtByzY9YJust kicked in: {"hashrate1m": "178T", "hashrate5m": "58.4T", "hashrate1hr": "10.4T", "hashrate1d": "80.3T", "hashrate7d": "50.3T", "lastupdate": 1431968973, "workers": 10, "bestshare": 511,201,189.7977441} |
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Hi, I would like to buy an s5 but I don't know if I will roi since there will be new miners around september. I'm not realy new in the Bitcoin world but currently I only have a usb miner just for experimenting. Thanks in advance!
as always your power cost is ? and do you have a good psu? if your power is 10 cents or less and you have the psu maybe you make a little money. If your power is 15 cents or more you will most likely lose money If you power is under 5 cents buy one as it is almost a certain profit. If you have a good psu on hand |
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For now I don't want fees. I am trying to get the idea of a pool within a pool or a club within a pool at no extra cost to help people with higher power still mine at home. I am not anti cloud services, but so far while not perfect the nice-west hash model appears best. Hey I am 18 cents a kwatt until OCT 1st renting at nice-west point it here point it at kano appears to be my only option for the next 120 days or so. I am not the only one in this boat the new orders are below 5 for 100th 1 is at westhash 4 are at nicehash  |
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It's a yes from me, I just can't reply to the pm group. Lol
two orders cancelled. I will start new ones  |
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about restructure I have 5 yes votes and 0 no votes. Since this is a certain tie at worst (10 in the club) and I would be the tie breaker I am going to cancel the 200th and 800th. get our 5.5 btc back and do 1x 100th = 100th at westhash and 4x 100th = 400th at nicehash. I will send pm's to all of us. the 800th is cancelled see below 4.59 + 0.142 fee  |
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so a home miner at 10 cents with 20 th and 10k makes 665 usd a month after power.
at 11 cents a kwatt 593
at 12 cents a kwatt 521
at 13 cents a kwatt 449
at 14 cents a kwatt 377
at 15 cents a kwatt 305
at 16 cents a kwatt 233
at 17 cents a kwatt 161
at 18 cents a kwatt 89
at 19 cents a kwatt 18
Averaging about 30c here how do you think I feel as a mining software developer that can't afford to mine? yeah has to kill you. I may ramp up in Oct when 1 drop to 13c - 3c for heating benefits = 10c So for now it is something to look forward to. but at 30c not going to happen. |
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This is just variance, we will finish oscilating +/- one percent in the end after 20 pages of this thread which will follow  would be nice.. no question variance has been the ruler for months but a small steady rise of just under 2% an adjustment is the real gain since Nov 2014 a 170 block day is a killer only if 3 or 4 in a row happen . |
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We are missing out on some lucky streak . Hopefully the prices drop on nice hash soon. Would we increase our chances of hitting a block possibly by having 5 different works at 100 TH each ?
Theoretically it shouldn't make any difference at all. However I cannot vouch for potential losses in a massive mining farm setup designed to channel PH hashrates through only a few workers. While I've personally written a proxy (and am still actively developing it to be something much bigger) I can't vouch for the proxies anyone else uses. This is nothing to do with whether it's rental or otherwise. My gut feeling is a massive farm (>1PH) is less likely to be as efficient and have the same amount of potential hash loss as a medium sized farm. It's hard to set up a good farm and the larger the farm, the harder it is - but it's not a given that whoever set it up won't have made it as efficient, it's only generic advice. As I've already said, no one with >1PH has ever found a block on this pool (except for the private Avalon farm that was mining here when I first opened the pool) whereas there have been heaps of blocks solved from 1->600TH miners. Thanks for the explanation. I was thinking along the same lines. And we have about 5.5 btc left sitting idle. I am also thinking to restructure from the 200th west 800th nice spilt . to 1x 100 west and 4x 100 nice. I will pm all members. |
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...
bad pool op = sometimes
bad seller = sometimes
bad rented hash = sometimes if you rent a shit ton of hash some is lost even if it is lost from latency.
...
Yes indeed it is all 3. You need to trust who you use to mine (pool OPs) and who you use to supply miners (sellers and renters) ... and yep I fall under that heading also of who you have to trust if you mine at my pool  yeah it is why the game has become so hard for little guys. If you mine in house as a home owner 5 kwatts in the summer and 10 kwatts in the winter is a practical limit so with modern gear 10th to 20 th in a home setup is tops. best gear does .5 watts a gh. so a home miner at 10 cents with 20 th and 10k makes 665 usd a month after power. at 11 cents a kwatt 593 at 12 cents a kwatt 521 at 13 cents a kwatt 449 at 14 cents a kwatt 377 at 15 cents a kwatt 305 at 16 cents a kwatt 233 at 17 cents a kwatt 161 at 18 cents a kwatt 89 at 19 cents a kwatt 18 Now I have a point that relates to a solo pool and renting. 20 th = 18 or 19 s-5's psu's so to set this up you are near 8000 usd. with almost no hope of making a profit. maybe 33 or 34 btc out of pocket. I can rent 25th from nicehash 2 days cost 0.5 btc point it here. if I don't hit a block I am out 0.5 btc after 2 days. Basically it becomes a better chance for me in the summer to do that then to do the mining with s-5's or sp20's Oh I can point hash here or at kanp's pool which I have or mmpool.org or f2pool or antpool tried all of them. Money made with some pools and some rentals. My other option is no renting until Oct 1. services like nice/west hash will stick around for miners like me that can not mine at home for various reasons. |
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I wonder has anyone here ever found a block while renting from Nicehash?
i found a block on mm.pool.org with nicehash. we have had more then 1 person win with a nice or west hash rental win blocks here. However, there is an assumption there that is incorrect. What you want to be checking is the people providing the miners and if their history is as expected or bad at finding blocks. When a rental pool provides random hardware from random users, you need to be sure the users are doing the right thing - the rental pool has no control over that. I agree all you can prove is some miner renting to nice-west hash are doing it correctly. You can do this because rentals have found blocks. You can not prove every miner renting is honest. You can not prove 1% 2% 3% 4% even 10% are dishonest. More data helps pin things down some what. But you would need 1000 btc of rentals pointed here to have a decent sample size to even think luck is up or down a lot. the pool has made 50 blocks that is 1250 btc. So right now I doubt there is enough data to prove a thing. As for data being good bad or indifferent. I know lot of people have agenda's about BTC or any coin. I have 3 s-3's mining every thing else is a rental. I only know those 3 pieces are good. To date they have done 5.5 billion shares without a block. so they only have 1/9th of 48 billion shares. they have run for close to 1 year. this is part of risk a miner takes. bad pool op = sometimes bad seller = sometimes bad rented hash = sometimes if you rent a shit ton of hash some is lost even if it is lost from latency. |
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I wonder has anyone here ever found a block while renting from Nicehash?
i found a block on mm.pool.org with nicehash. we have had more then 1 person win with a nice or west hash rental win blocks here. |
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blocks for the day were 170-171 https://blockchain.info/blocks/1431826989443356747 to 356917 171 vs 144 is plus 27 have to hope for this to drop off about 60 of them were on the last adjustment and about 111 were on this adjustment I estimate real number as plus 15 blocks and about plus 12% on day 1. |
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The current pattern of increase is similar to the one after Mar 22 2015 adjustment ... signaling another decent diff increase ... yep, it is more than obvious that new mining hw is still being deployed despite summer and stagnating BTC/USD price.
well avalon has written software for a 80-120gh miner using 5 chips. it may be very efficient and they may be doing a burn in. wiki page has info. here is a quote comes from here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=140539.msg11382007#msg11382007if you go to wiki link https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Avalon4_mini and see this line of code I think the mini miner will drop to .4 watts per gh sudo ./cgminer --avalonm-freq 275:250:200 --avalonm-voltage 6250 the big miner at 420:390:370 volts 7625 does .55 - .57 watts so with avalon doing something and sfards doing something I believe we get 3-6% |
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...
Another effect is also blatantly obvious and that is the effect on the pool's luck.
If a smaller pool has regular bad luck, guess what (yeah I'm sure this level of thinking is beyond your pay grade) that will turn miners away from the pool.
...
I am convinced this also happen to bitminter more then once. back to back 99.5% blocks a 70% block then a 97% block this is when I started asking someone to run a solo pool. less then a year ago but with my 58 year old memory maybe 13 months ago.. I don't worry about renting pools like nicehash or westhash being used as a middle man as much as I do stealth miners with a proxy attacking pps pools. Scatter the orders a bit on nice-west hash and odds are you are fine as the risk of renting all from one evil dude lesson quite a bit. But Ban and f2pool as pps run risks. At ckpool solo club members we have more then 5.5btc left but price is high so we are frozen. order #393756 at westhash 0.89993128 btc left order #393760 at nicehash 4.62483203 btc left fixed 5th at least we have action order #394839 at westhash has 4 hours left (my gift to the club) http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1CqbvmuJcLFDFzFewKmBVAaghXEtByzY9Yhigh is still 9,717,111,133.176263 |
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Just opened thread.
same rules as last picks start at block 300---- and end at block 1000.
No picks honored till block 300.
we are at block 56 for this period this is block # 356888 18:57
we started with block # 356832 10:27
that is 8 ½ hours in x 6 = 51 blocks
so 51 = 0% 56 = 9.8%
bitcoinwisdom has a 5% pick
I am thinking some gear has been built and this will be a big jump adjustment.
Well picks do not start until 300 so we have 244 to go.
cakir won last week and has been paid.
Remember please wait until block 300.
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Guys not to defend anyone. Bitmaintech built pretty good
s-1's
s-3's
s-5's
they don't burn up often.
And while the psu in the photos looks bad on the inside no one else has done any photos of it unboxed then opened.
Frankly I am not interested in buying one to test it for everyone because
it is 188 usd to my house
I do not need it.
I know I do not want 18 gauge cables.------------biggest reason is this.
I AM CURIOUS does it do 92-93.8%.
I could hook a lot of lower power gear to it.
But I am only saying 188 shipped to the USA is high price.
I rather 16 gauge cables .
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just to clear things..
stealing blocks when renting rigs is not possible.
but blocking minergear to submit high shares to pool is possible,
or blocking rentalsite submitting high share from miner to pool is possible.
this will only gain waste of energy and leaving the possible blocks to other miners.
correct me if im wrong.
Yes you can't steal a block, but that is not what we've mentioned in any of this or at my link. You can't leave a block to someone else. You can simply stop a block by not submitting it and no pool can identify that you didn't submit it. If you are mining at 1,000 difficulty, a 1,000 difficulty share is worth the same as a 10,000,000,000 difficulty share, so stopping high shares is pretty much irrelevant. talking about the same thing. possible but irrelevant and stupid if done. only way to measure possible blocking attacks is to compare your bestshare at long period, or pools expected shares when block is found, (ck solo has no expected shares stats and shares does not matter..). and suchs attacks are really hard to identify, too many variables and the so much missed/called: "can vary greatly depending on your luck.." Best share isn't relevant at all since it's only a few lines of code to withhold blocks but always submit all shares that are not a block. ... and I know coz I wrote the original small bit of code in cgminer that identified the blocks and reported them in cgminer. ... and I've no idea what that guy from the hash place is going on about. It is as jonnybravo0311 said above and as I posted in my thread. Does the hash guy not understand how mining works? It's simple, if you rent mining power, you must trust the source of the mining power. There is no way for you to verify if they are withholding blocks from you without a VERY large amount of data. And just to make it worse, they could easily withhold 3 out of every 4 blocks they find and it would be next to impossible to show they are doing that. It is a clear and present risk. Ignore the hash guy further above with the vested interest in this. Well I have made 1 block with hash rented from nicehash . I made it on www.mmpool.organd to say we must trust the company renting hash to us to point to a pool in every case except a pool like f2pool is true. the real danger of renting bad hash is not at this pool.The real danger is sending 1 ph a day in 'bad' rentals to f2pool if f2pool fails to detect this they payout. 1 ph of dead hash to f2pool would cost them almost 9.4 coins a day So attacking f2pool with 5 ph of bad hash form 3 or 4 renting spots could cost f2pool a lot of coins. close to 50 coins a day. If any one needs to be on guard it is f2pool. If I rent 1 ph at 10 btc paying a 3% fee to do so I get 9.7 btc rental credit and f2pool pay me 96% I get back 9.312 coins so I lose .688 btc and I cost f2pool 9.312 btc a day this is with 1ph of rentals so in 10 days I spend 6.88 btc and f2pool pays 93.12 btc to me which is a loss. So of every pool in the world f2pool could lose more then any one. I think spending 0.688 btc per day to cost 9.312 btc in damage per day to f2pool might attract some people. I wouldn't talk about this publicly, because you just gave an idea to anyone to possibly rent SHA256 hashpower via own proxy (that witholds block shares) and send the rest to the pool. It is probably one of the methods how to destroy big PPS pools (with very little input). Well while some would say don't give anyone ideas. This idea has been around here and there my guess is this is why very few PPS pools are around as this risk is there and is very hard to stop. A year ago When the block withholding issues happened with two large pools. One was BTCguild I forget the other. I pushed for good well known people to do solo pools like this one since a solo pool is good protection from block withholding. Ck started his up and while I have not hit a block with him I always have a 'real' miner pointed to him. http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje When I rent from nice/west hash to mine: 1) here 2) kano's pool 3) f2pool 4) antpool. I always do 3 to 4 rentals to get the total. It does help with this 'dead' hash issue. I also use 2 workers at the pools. |
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just to clear things..
stealing blocks when renting rigs is not possible.
but blocking minergear to submit high shares to pool is possible,
or blocking rentalsite submitting high share from miner to pool is possible.
this will only gain waste of energy and leaving the possible blocks to other miners.
correct me if im wrong.
Yes you can't steal a block, but that is not what we've mentioned in any of this or at my link. You can't leave a block to someone else. You can simply stop a block by not submitting it and no pool can identify that you didn't submit it. If you are mining at 1,000 difficulty, a 1,000 difficulty share is worth the same as a 10,000,000,000 difficulty share, so stopping high shares is pretty much irrelevant. talking about the same thing. possible but irrelevant and stupid if done. only way to measure possible blocking attacks is to compare your bestshare at long period, or pools expected shares when block is found, (ck solo has no expected shares stats and shares does not matter..). and suchs attacks are really hard to identify, too many variables and the so much missed/called: "can vary greatly depending on your luck.." Best share isn't relevant at all since it's only a few lines of code to withhold blocks but always submit all shares that are not a block. ... and I know coz I wrote the original small bit of code in cgminer that identified the blocks and reported them in cgminer. ... and I've no idea what that guy from the hash place is going on about. It is as jonnybravo0311 said above and as I posted in my thread. Does the hash guy not understand how mining works? It's simple, if you rent mining power, you must trust the source of the mining power. There is no way for you to verify if they are withholding blocks from you without a VERY large amount of data. And just to make it worse, they could easily withhold 3 out of every 4 blocks they find and it would be next to impossible to show they are doing that. It is a clear and present risk. Ignore the hash guy further above with the vested interest in this. Well I have made 1 block with hash rented from nicehash . I made it on www.mmpool.organd to say we must trust the company renting hash to us to point to a pool in every case except a pool like f2pool is true. the real danger of renting bad hash is not at this pool.The real danger is sending 1 ph a day in 'bad' rentals to f2pool if f2pool fails to detect this they payout. 1 ph of dead hash to f2pool would cost them almost 9.4 coins a day So attacking f2pool with 5 ph of bad hash form 3 or 4 renting spots could cost f2pool a lot of coins. close to 50 coins a day. If any one needs to be on guard it is f2pool. If I rent 1 ph at 10 btc paying a 3% fee to do so I get 9.7 btc rental credit and f2pool pay me 96% I get back 9.312 coins so I lose .688 btc and I cost f2pool 9.312 btc a day this is with 1ph of rentals so in 10 days I spend 6.88 btc and f2pool pays 93.12 btc to me which is a loss. So of every pool in the world f2pool could lose more then any one. I think spending 0.688 btc per day to cost 9.312 btc in damage per day to f2pool might attract some people. |
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Fixed it I had a long day yesterday.
cakir please put a btc addy up for suchmoon to pay the btc.
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we are in hold mode with only the bonus fixed rate hashing http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1CqbvmuJcLFDFzFewKmBVAaghXEtByzY9Y "bestshare": 9,717,111,133.1762638}the big orders of 200th and 800th at west and nice hash are in a frozen state #393676 Standard Alive 0.0098 0.01458511 ∞ 50.00 0 0.0000 #393756 Standard Alive 0.0098 0.99647398 ∞ 200.00 0 0.0000 us at west hash#394035 Standard Alive 0.0098 0.48487025 ∞ 10.00 0 0.0000 #382338 Standard Alive 0.0098 0.51807463 ∞ 50.00 0 0.0000 #393760 Standard Alive 0.0098 4.83884262 ∞ 800.00 0 0.0000 us at nicehash #386619 Standard Alive 0.0098 0.04788766 ∞ 5.00 0 0.0000 we have about 13 hours left |
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