Power consumption?
If a single chip absorbs 12 x 1.2A, about 15W x 4= 60W ? and remain all the components?
I think you got your numbers mixed up there its 1.2v @ 12A. 12A is just how much the power supply can feed to the FPGA.... How much the FPGA actually uses depends on a lot of factors such as clock speed, the bitstream, I/O's, and many more. |
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Spartan6 have a nice feature called chip DNA. It's unique 56 bit number. Device can read this, user thru JTAG also can read this. So, little program that read DNA thru JTAG and send this to server. Server makes personalized bitstream for that DNA and waits for payment. When payment is recived sends bitstream to buyer. That particular bitstream will only work with particular chip. And every one is happy, copying almost impossible.
No, the DNA register isn't useful for copy protection. I use it to keep track of which chips got which error rates at which frequency/voltage, but not much else. The DNA register is just a shift register, so if you can get the design into fpga_editor all you have to do is disconnect two wires and hook it up to an SRL32 instead; then you can make the design think the chip has any DNA code you like. I don't think Xilinx gives you a tool that turns .bit files into .ngc files that fpga_editor can load, but I also wouldn't be surprised if somebody else has written one. It's also worth noting that the Spartan 6 engineering sample versions of the chips don't have the DNA register. |
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Which pin are you using for a clock input?
Which clock input? the main clock for the FPGA? the jtag clock inputs? or the ARM clock input? wish list - 8x, 16x & 32x motheboards
- souce code used for your arm chip
- rj45 lan port connected to the arm cortex
- more screenshots
 - lower price
 (not complaining just wishing)
The arm chip you are using may be powerful enough to run a rtos, even if not Im sure there are plenty of people (myself included) that would love to attempt adding a webui, the miner/ a miner and a TCP/IP stack to the code so these devices could become stand alone network devices configured via web interface removing the need for a pc entirely. Just me thinking out loud, absolutely love the design. Bigger backplanes will be coming =] I will probably open source the arm chip code however IDK if I can release the whole thing.... I'm using the USB CDC stack from Keil for now which is open source but I think it has some stupid licensing that doesn't let anyone but Keil distribute the source I have to look into it.... Sorry, but no rj45 for this board =[ I'm using the LPC1343 on this board and it doesn't include ethernet. However, I planned on using a beefier 100 pin 120MHz LPC1769 that includes ethernet and all the goodies on the bigger backplanes =] More pictures in a couple days!!! (Sorry I've been really busy working on firmware.) nice, how soon would cgminer be able to mine using one of these?
Also, is the individual parts ready for purchase as well?
IE: might be interested in starting w/ just the backplane & 1 fpga and growing it over time.
I'd say we should have cgminer mining on this board in a couple weeks 1 month max. Yes you can get the board with 0-4 fpga cards. Check this page out: http://www.btcfpga.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=54 |
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Added. It just barely beats the BFL single, but doesn't beat BFL minirigs. you might also want to add that the price of that board will be double or $1280 from what I can tell, if its not ordered before June. Heh, if it is, then why are they bothering to produce it, no one will buy it. Why do you say that? Ztex's quad is $1359 and people are buying it..... |
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Added. It just barely beats the BFL single, but doesn't beat BFL minirigs. you might also want to add that the price of that board will be double or $1280 from what I can tell, if its not ordered before June. |
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Just wondering.... why didn't you include the X6500 in this? also Lancelot isnt released yet as far as I know so nobody knows what mh/s per watt its going to be. nzghang himself says their goal is over 500 mh/s but he doesnt know yet... Btw eldentyrell said something about releasing his new bitstream near the end of the month which would boost performance of all Spartan 6 boards that can handle the extra power and cooling requirements.... |
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How many watts will the new boards with fans use?
Each fan should add around 0.6 - 1.2 watt depending on what heatsink/fan combination we decide on using |
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Really loving the modular design, looks good. Makes I'm sure a lot of people feel at ease if a part needs to be replaced it doesn't mean getting the soldering gun out and potentially messing up it more  So these really run cool enough and efficient with no fan? Sorry if it sounds like a newbie question, but I don't often see FPGA without them. It's not a newbie question =] The pictures are a bit misleading.... The board in the pics is one of our prototype boards(REV 2). The boards that will be shipped are REV4 and have a lot of improvements. I've added 2 more fan headers for a total of 4. The FPGA cards are a bit bigger and will have holes at 54.8mm distance to allow for most aftermarket North bridge coolers and most aftermarket GPU coolers made for older GPU's. The FPGA cards will come stock with a GPU cooler that should dissipate around 25 watts of heat this is a lil overkill considering we only need to dissipate around 10 watts but everyones FPGAs will stay good and cool =] each GPU cooler includes a cylindrical heatsink and a 40-50mm fan. Heres a example http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835119079Another difference between the old REV2 and REV4 is the USB Interface chip. In REV2 we used the same one as the X6500 uses. In REV4 we've changed this to a ARM Cortex M3 72 MHz microcontroller that will allow firmware updating for the USB interface. I will post some new pictures in a few days.... I've just been really busy getting orders together and sourcing parts. |
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Is there no way to match BFL's 800Mhash @ $600 ?
Not with Spartan 6.... Wonder if they're giving people new chips or used? I don't suppose they would tell us. |
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I see this as both good a bad news. The bad news is that they probably only have a limited quantity of this chip available. Either they will have to raise the price, or redesign their product using a Spartan or something else more modern.
Well their mini rig is faster per chip and consumes less power, so they already have some new chip now ? Based on power quotes and speed the mini rig matches spartan 6 efficiency. I think they're using Spartan 6's Yes, is likely, I suppose 128 spartan6 Each spartan about 200MH/s, 128 x 200= 25.6GH/s Each spartan about 10Watt, 128 x 10= 1280W Theoretically is correct  The strange is the price... 15k$ for 128 spartan, about 120$ for each... the while cost for each chip in this moment is double Gimme some of what your smoking  Spartan 6's do not go for $240 even at retail more like $175 retail have you ever heard of getting things cheaper in bulk? I imagine you could get them $100 ea or cheaper in QTY How many chips would you have to buy? IDK I figure if your buying thousands you can get a pretty sweet deal though |
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I see this as both good a bad news. The bad news is that they probably only have a limited quantity of this chip available. Either they will have to raise the price, or redesign their product using a Spartan or something else more modern.
Well their mini rig is faster per chip and consumes less power, so they already have some new chip now ? Based on power quotes and speed the mini rig matches spartan 6 efficiency. I think they're using Spartan 6's |
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So which one is in the single ? the 2000-3000 or 200-300 USD chip ? $2k - $3k is the retail price for it however since its old and nobody uses them anymore you can get them for cheaper from companies that have leftovers just laying around collecting dust because theres such low demand for them. |
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You guys have any plans on making another backplane supporting more FPGAs? I like using those connectors for the FPGA boards and having the backplane power the FPGAs remotely.
There are plans on making larger backplanes. We also plan on making the FPGA cards compatible to use on all of our backplane models. As TheSeven stated power distribution on such a board isn't exactly trivial and a lot beefier microcontroller would be needed so you probably wont see a 16x backplane for awhile. You may see a 8x board by June or July though. |
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Also you ever think maybe the long wait times are because they mine on your guys units for a month after they build them to get some extra profit That might have been the cheekiest comment I've read on BCT.com Think about it though gigavps claims he ordered "a couple" rig boxes they could have them built in a week then hold on to them and mine on them for a couple months and make a extra $4500 per rig box per month before they send them to him. Not saying BFL is doing this but its possible. |
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Seems like we have all got off topic as well lol the question isnt What to buy with $15K? its What to buy with $10K?
I would say as long as you think bitcoin isn't going to totally collapse in the next couple years to go with FPGA's as they are more efficient and you will have a greater return in the long especially if you live in a area with high power costs. However, if your afraid bitcoin is going to anytime in the next couple years and dont mind less return then put your money into computer hardware and GPU's that will be a lot easier to resell if anything did happen.
Personally I would go with FPGA As others have said though there is a lot of things to consider when coming up with a payback period and profits and there is no way to precisely calculate it because all of the constantly changing variables. Such as price per BTC, Difficulty, changes in power costs, and cost of maintaining your hashing farm such as cooling, repairing fans, and anything else that could go wrong.
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what makes you think BFL's mini rigs will really get 1250watts? if theyre using the same FPGA's as the singles it would be more like 2500 watts.
25000 ÷ 800 = 31.25 * 80 = 2500
as i recall they didnt have correct power consumption quotes on the singles either
This may be difficult to believe, but a little more reading and a little less typing would point you towards the correct answer. The correct answer is that the mini rig uses more efficient chips. sorry about that I wasn't home and was on a tablet but even with these more efficient chips...... How do you know that they will actually use the amount of power BFL says they will? If I'm not mistaken they said their singles were going to use only 40 watts in the beginning? maybe it was 60? theres no way of knowing what the actual power consumption is going to be until they get one built and test it. Btw 1250 watts at 25 Gh/s sounds a whole lot like 125 spartan 6's =p but at 15k they would have to be getting them dirt cheap like $100 per spartan.... Also you ever think maybe the long wait times are because they mine on your guys units for a month after they build them to get some extra profit |
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what makes you think BFL's mini rigs will really get 1250watts? if theyre using the same FPGA's as the singles it would be more like 2500 watts.
25000 ÷ 800 = 31.25 * 80 = 2500
as i recall they didnt have correct power consumption quotes on the singles either
EDIT: has BFL actually built one of these and taken power measurements yet?
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You can actually do about 200MH/s on the LX150-N3, and if you order bulk quantities of that one (100pcs) you'll get it for as low as $115. That's almost 2 MH/$, so almost on par with GPUs. But you'll have to consider the cost of the board, other components, assembly, and time spent on it as well.
Where can you get them for $115 in 100 qty? |
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btw, my interest is for personal rigs, not commercial interests. just wanted to be clear on that in case there were any concerns, or if commercial use of the design would violate even the spirit of the project.
This is DIY if you had a manufacturer make this you would prob pay a extra 250 to have them put it together so it would be cheaper to just buy a foga miner already built |
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